IRC log for #koha, 2020-10-15

All times shown according to UTC.

Time S Nick Message
00:00 dcook Not worth the effort of trying to fix it now
00:00 dcook Or even improve it really..
00:03 * dcook wishes he had infinite time >_>
00:04 cait pick your battles wisely
00:06 * oleonard waves
00:14 dcook heh
00:14 dcook hey oleonard
00:14 wahanui oleonard is seeing some buggy stuff though
00:15 oleonard Thanks wahanui that comment is perpetually accurate!
00:15 * dcook thinks every new bug report on Bugzilla might be from dcook..
00:17 cait hi oleonard
00:17 wahanui hi oleopard
00:17 cait unusual time to see you :)
00:17 dcook Still early!
00:18 oleonard Yeah, hopping on the computer to tie up some loose ends from work today
00:18 cait what timeis it for you?
00:18 dcook loose ends, eh..
00:18 * dcook pictures oleonard as an action movie hero now
00:19 dcook Wait..
00:19 dcook Usually the person tying up the loose ends is a bad guy..
00:21 oleonard Of course I'm the bad guy. We live in the evil mirror universe.
00:21 dcook Now how to test this bloody koha-z3950-responder...
00:21 dcook Ooooh. I wondered why I always liked the bad guys in movies
00:21 dcook I thought it was just because they had cooler outfits
00:23 dcook Hmm now to figure out whether my patch broke the z3950 or if it ever worked in this context..
00:24 dcook Yeah thinking it might just never work..
00:25 * oleonard melts back into the fog
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01:53 mtj hey #koha
01:53 mtj dcook: thanks for the package email to the list yesterday
01:54 dcook No worries
01:54 dcook I'm hacking up a storm about it right now lol
01:54 dcook Hungry for lunch though so maybe I'm just delusional
01:55 mtj there was an option 5 too... koha-core becomes a new package, thats basically koha-common without the 'extra' stuff
01:55 dcook Oooo
01:55 dcook That's basically what I'm doing right now
01:56 dcook Although the more I look at it, the more I see everything as extra stuff... heh
01:57 dcook I'm tempted to write replacements for pwgen, unzip, and xmlstarlet...
01:58 dcook We even overuse mysql-client imho..
01:59 dcook bug 26672
01:59 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=26672 normal, P5 - low, ---, dcook, NEW , Create metapackage to install Koha and all its dependencies
01:59 mtj as joubu sais, there are a few problems with option 4, as koha-core will inherit all the deps of koha-common
02:00 dcook Yeah, at first I thought that wasn't so bad, but now I see more things to pare away
02:00 dcook I don't think Koha even uses "at"
02:00 dcook And "yaz" looks like it's really more of a sysadmin tool than a tool Koha needs
02:01 dcook Also, libnet-stomp-perl shouldn't be in debian/, right?
02:01 dcook It should be handled by debian/list-deps?
02:01 dcook I'm going to open a new bug to move Starman into cpanfile as well
02:01 dcook no rest for the wicked O_O
02:01 dcook Although totally going to go eat lunch in like 5 minutes..
02:03 dcook bug 26685
02:03 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=26685 normal, P5 - low, ---, koha-bugs, NEW , Move Starman out of debian/ and into cpanfile
02:16 koha-jenkins Project Koha_Master_U16 build #86: SUCCESS in 43 min: https://jenkins.koha-community[…]ha_Master_U16/86/
02:19 koha-jenkins Yippee, build fixed!
02:19 wahanui Congratulations!
02:19 koha-jenkins Project Koha_Master_D10_Deps build #96: FIXED in 46 min: https://jenkins.koha-community[…]ster_D10_Deps/96/
02:21 koha-jenkins Yippee, build fixed!
02:21 wahanui Congratulations!
02:21 koha-jenkins Project Koha_Master_D11 build #111: FIXED in 48 min: https://jenkins.koha-community[…]a_Master_D11/111/
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05:08 mtj dcook: re: libnet-stomp-perl, i think you are correct
05:08 dcook Thanks :)
05:08 dcook Don't think I made a patch for that in the end..
05:09 mtj no probs, i can
05:11 mtj ..a bit offtopic, anyone used bolinda borrowbox with a kindle paperwhite-4 (asking for a friend)
05:15 mtj hmm, looks like only the kindle fire is supported, so a workaround is to use adode digital-editions to manually transfer to the device
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06:25 ashimema[m] Source files layout.. there's a bug to improve that great dcook.. I think rangi wrote it.. may be in the security area
06:25 ashimema[m] I've tried resurrecting it a few times.. wouldn't mind someone else having a go
06:26 TimothyAlexis Today when I do ku I get this:
06:26 TimothyAlexis koha_1       | Base class package "Email::Stuffer" is empty
06:27 TimothyAlexis ..
06:27 TimothyAlexis koha_1       | BEGIN failed--compilation aborted at /kohadevbox/koha/Koha/ line 29.
06:27 TimothyAlexis ..
06:27 ashimema[m] Bug 9949 dcook
06:27 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=9949 is not accessible.
06:27 TimothyAlexis koha_koha_1 exited with code 1
06:28 ashimema[m] Kohadevbox received some maintenance to fix a few bugs yesterday TimothyAlexis
06:28 ashimema[m] You may want to pull the latest and restart it
06:28 ashimema[m] Also.. have you considered koha-testing-docker... It's more widely used and thus well supported these days.
06:28 TimothyAlexis I've completely replaced koha-testing-docker and koha
06:29 TimothyAlexis And still get this
06:29 ashimema[m] Oh.. your in koha-testing-docker
06:29 ashimema[m] docket system prune -af
06:29 ashimema[m] Then ku again
06:30 ashimema[m] That should clean out all images and then pull fresh.. that one also had a bunch of fixes yesterday
06:31 TimothyAlexis :)
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06:37 TimothyAlexis ashimema++
06:37 TimothyAlexis Thank you
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06:41 reiveune hello
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06:45 severine_q Morning #Koha !
06:48 ashimema[m] It's a sledgehammer approach.. but as it's docker I tend to use it fairly often rather than digging more deeply.. for Dev a sledgehammer isn't too bad
06:48 ashimema[m] Good morning everyone
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06:51 alex_a Bonjour
06:51 wahanui hi, alex_a
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07:20 Joubu eythian: me again :) Could we get your opinion (as former pkg manager) on that move: https://lists.koha-community.o[…]tober/046061.html
07:21 Joubu tld; having a koha-lite, koha-full and koha-core package
07:21 Joubu and keep koha-common for compatibility
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07:46 magnuse \o/
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08:27 jonrog Hello! Recently we've started to get problems while trying to import ILL-requests. The error message says:
08:27 jonrog DBD::mysql::st execute failed: Cannot add or update a child row: a foreign key constraint fails (`koha_koha`.`biblio_metadata`, CONSTRAINT `record_metadata_fk_1` FOREIGN KEY (`biblionumber`) REFERENCES `biblio` (`biblionumber`) ON DELETE CASCADE ON UPDATE CASCADE) [for Statement "INSERT INTO `biblio_metadata` ( `format`, `marcflavour`, `metadata`) VALUES ( ?, ?, ? )"
08:27 jonrog Does anyone know what the problem might be and how to fix it?
08:28 jonrog Some items are getting imported but then that happens and the import-module crashes
08:29 Joubu Hi jonrog, technically it means that the an insert into biblio_metadata fails because there is no entry into the biblio table
08:29 Joubu so maybe there is another error before this one?
08:31 jonrog Joubu: It says before the error message "Use of uninitialized value in join or string at /usr/share/perl5/MARC/ line 696." and after "Broken FK constraint"
08:32 jonrog So i guess the script is handling the data wrong in some way?
08:38 Joubu and before?
08:38 Joubu :)
08:38 Joubu search for another DBD error
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08:56 * cait waves
09:07 * ashimema[m] tries to understand notices..
09:07 ashimema[m] morning cait
09:07 cait good morning
09:08 ashimema[m] silly question.. why can you currently add a new notice with any code you like...
09:08 ashimema[m] what would it be used for?
09:08 ashimema[m] I thought the codes were fixed as notices are all internal.. or am I missing a functionality somewhere?
09:09 cait odue
09:09 cait for example is not fixed
09:09 cait patron ontification on serials is not fixed
09:09 jonrog Joubu: Thats literally all i get from the error message
09:09 cait there are several notices that have no fixed codes but can be configured elsewhere
09:10 ashimema[m] ooh.. how does that work?
09:10 cait serial claims, acq claims
09:10 cait well for overdue letters you can have as many as you like, it only has to have the circulation module and you define what to use when in the ontice triggers
09:10 ashimema[m] interesting.. where do you set the relation between the thing that triggers the send and the notice code
09:10 ashimema[m] interseting
09:10 ashimema[m] cool
09:11 cait for subscriptions you can set the alert email in each subscription from a pull down, also the module is used to limit the list
09:11 ashimema[m] thanks
09:11 cait similar to the claim emails, you cna pick the one you want to use from a pull down created using the module when claiming
09:11 ashimema[m] that's very interesting
09:12 cait and i think there is also a patorn mailer plugin using notices somewhow that bywater uses
09:12 wahanui okay, cait.
09:12 ashimema[m] so I could easily enough setup a way to adding different notices for each credit/debit type code
09:12 cait oh wahanui
09:12 cait it might be nice to add a new module for them instad of having them all in circulation
09:12 cait also allows you to define which tables will show
09:12 cait to pick values from
09:13 ashimema[m] deffo
09:13 ashimema[m] I'm thinking 'accounts' as we have a precident now for various accounts things living in such an area
09:13 cait accounts would make sense to me
09:13 Joubu jonrog: sorry, I have no idea then. Maybe you could report the issue on our bug tracker?
09:13 ashimema[m] may alos move the Point of Sale on into it.. as they're so closely related really
09:14 cait but not sure libraries want to maintain too many notices - the debit/credit types can get a little confusing
09:14 ashimema[m] indeed
09:14 cait please not all on that one bug :)
09:14 ashimema[m] right now the notices are plain confusing for it
09:14 Joubu It's Friday, notices will haunt you the full weekend if you are starting digging this area :D
09:14 ashimema[m] that one bug is a bloody pain
09:14 cait Joubu: i think it's way too late for him by now
09:14 cait ashimema[m]: try to come back to a simple solution, odn't dig yourself in too much *sends cookies*
09:15 * cait also sends cookies to tcohen
09:16 Joubu lol
09:16 Joubu it's not Friday :D
09:17 ashimema[m] hehe
09:17 ashimema[m] wishful thinking there Joubu
09:18 Joubu I will be off tomorrow, so today is like a Friday to me :)
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09:22 ashimema[m] lucky
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09:35 Joubu @later tell oleonard what about bug 26534 comment 44?
09:35 huginn Joubu: The operation succeeded.
09:36 cait hm bug report on ill backend... invalid?
09:36 cait magnuse: around?
09:43 cait @seen kidclamp
09:43 huginn cait: kidclamp was last seen in #koha 1 week, 0 days, 17 hours, 31 minutes, and 49 seconds ago: <kidclamp> I did wonder which would be more efficient
09:43 cait @seen khall
09:43 huginn cait: khall was last seen in #koha 3 weeks, 1 day, 21 hours, 43 minutes, and 29 seconds ago: <khall> matts thanks!
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09:48 magnuse cait: i think that problem has to be solved in the backend (that i wrote), yes. but i have not looked properly at it yet
09:54 cait ok, thx!
09:56 Joubu ashimema[m]: see last comment on bug 26172 please
09:56 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=26172 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, martin.renvoize, Passed QA , Add a cashup summary view (with option to print)
09:56 Joubu penultimate actually
09:57 ashimema[m] the ON DELETE CASCADES
09:57 ashimema[m] hmm
09:57 * ashimema[m] reminds himself how all this works.. it sounds like your right
09:58 liliputech_asu joined #koha
09:58 ashimema[m] have a feeling my brain wasn't awake when I added that accessor
09:59 liliputech_asu hi koha :)
09:59 Joubu I don't know what's the expected behaviour, ashimema[m]. But it sounds wrong to remove the register's actions alongwith the patron
09:59 ashimema[m] I agree
09:59 ashimema[m] very good catch there mate
09:59 ashimema[m] thanks
10:00 ashimema[m] as you say.. it's not directly related to this bug.. but worthwhile fixing here whilst we spot it
10:00 ashimema[m] OK with me doing that and providing a followup now?
10:05 Joubu nope, on a separate bug report please
10:07 ashimema[m] okies
10:07 ashimema[m] now I look at it, I feel like there's a few issues with constraints on these
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10:22 tcohen morning
10:22 cait morning tcohen
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10:44 cait tcohen: running dbic right now and being happy
10:44 tcohen glad to hear that cait
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10:44 tcohen FYI I'll be doing QA today and tomorrow, once I finish this little thingy
10:44 cait reset_all probably after that... this one has some massive db changes
10:45 cait knock on wood... the little thingies are dangerous
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10:57 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 25460: DBRev <[…]b9299dd22be1ef35b>
10:57 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 26534: Compiled CSS <[…]b49edb1b6a5ce880a>
10:57 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 26643: Notify librarian of completed transfers <[…]4cd1eaf91635d22b7>
10:57 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 25898: (follow-up) POD <[…]bc3a350d811adc1a9>
10:57 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 26621: Adjust docs/contributors.yaml accordingly <[…]2554da111ca6b0efd>
10:57 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 26621: Adjust .mailmap to reduce the number of invalid authors <[…]ed01a6986fabaa7b0>
10:57 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 26617: Update INSTALL file to include koha-testing-docker and Gitlab links <[…]6301a0e08cef7d48f>
10:57 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 25460: (QA follow-up) Remove stray quote from system preference description <[…]23d3634db78ba0303>
10:57 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 25460: (QA follow-up) Readd ending punctuation to sys pref description <[…]e4b50edc2fe6f9ca6>
10:57 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 26643: (QA follow-up) Fix typo in message <[…]60ad44aec3a1ba71a>
10:57 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 18170: Use GetDescriptionByKohaField <[…]b10c5b65156920df1>
10:57 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 26534: Use IF ELSE directly on h5 opening tag <[…]bb34f0f0838cd82d3>
10:57 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 26534: Replace 'grade' by 'is-patron' and 'patron-type' <[…]57e8b798d1fd95ed2>
10:57 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 26534: (follow-up) Only center when using patronimages <[…]015a035a9d23cfcfa>
10:57 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 26534: (QA follow-up) Fix CSS declaration <[…]ee27a12604c8344b3>
10:57 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 26534: Add Font Awesome icon only for staff patrons <[…]6209bd29c18dbd3fe>
10:57 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 18170: Show damaged status in table of checkins <[…]c3291e0dc508665b6>
10:57 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 25460: Add unit test for change to C4::OAI::Sets->UpdateOAISetsBiblio() <[…]64c322c3754b1948a>
10:57 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 25898: Prohibit indirect object notation <[…]9b36f596d88f38eda>
10:57 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 25460: Update OAI sets when adding/editing/deleting item records <[…]c75daea98187c422b>
10:59 khall joined #koha
11:00 oleonard I guess I'm back a little late to comment on Bug 26534 :D
11:00 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=26534 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, fridolin.somers, Pushed to master , Add Font Awesome icon to help identify staff patrons
11:01 oleonard FWIW I think it looks good
11:01 cait :)
11:01 cait tcohen++ reset_all is working again too
11:09 cait hi khall
11:09 wahanui somebody said hi khall was my consciousness present in this realm?
11:10 khall mornin cait !
11:10 cait can i wrangle some QA out of you? :)
11:10 khall sure!
11:10 cait oh, now i am not prepared heh
11:11 khall lol ;)
11:12 cait see pm :)
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11:20 cait Joubu: any idea about how to move on with bug 18050?
11:20 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=18050 minor, P5 - low, ---, katrin.fischer, Signed Off , Missing constraint on aqbudgets.budget_period_id in aqbudgets
11:20 cait I think Augustin's approach won't work (have commented) as there is possible more data linked to an orphaned fund...
11:21 cait and it blocks bug 15329 that i'd really love to have in
11:21 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=15329 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, katrin.fischer, Needs Signoff , Show budget in addition to fund for late orders in acquisition
11:22 cait hm or maybe it does... but then we need to allow the aqbudgetperiod_id to be set to NULL and I dont think we should
11:24 * kidclamp waves
11:25 cait ... but we already do.
11:25 cait i might just give this a test run
11:25 cait hi kidclamp
11:27 kidclamp hi cait
11:27 cait you got summoned? :)
11:27 cait could you have another look at 11299
11:27 cait please?
11:30 magnuse bug 11299
11:30 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=11299 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, nick, Signed Off , Add a button to automatically link authority records in cataloguing (AJAX)
11:44 inlibro joined #koha
11:44 koha-jenkins Project Koha_Master_D9 build #1455: UNSTABLE in 45 min: https://jenkins.koha-community[…]a_Master_D9/1455/
11:46 koha-jenkins Project Koha_Master_D9_MDB_Latest build #411: UNSTABLE in 48 min: https://jenkins.koha-community[…]9_MDB_Latest/411/
11:47 koha-jenkins Project Koha_Master_U20 build #118: UNSTABLE in 48 min: https://jenkins.koha-community[…]a_Master_U20/118/
11:54 koha-jenkins Project Koha_Master_D10_Deps build #97: UNSTABLE in 54 min: https://jenkins.koha-community[…]ster_D10_Deps/97/
11:57 fridolin Joubu: howww master contains a temp file "installer/data/mysql/"
11:57 fridolin see Bug 25460: Update OAI sets when adding/editing/deleting item records commit
11:57 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=25460 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, alexbuckley, Pushed to master , Allow using item information in OAI set mappings and automatically update sets when items are added, edited or deleted
11:58 fridolin git show --oneline ac1a8adba2 --name-only
11:58 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 25898: Fix new occurrences <[…]422b240f24cbb9c30>
11:58 fridolin dirty ^^
11:59 Joubu fridolin: erk
12:06 fridolin maybe create a QA test searching for .swp files
12:07 fridolin ?
12:08 Joubu yes, I am on it already ;)
12:09 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 25460: Remove swp file <[…]ae190f96e8bbac8d1>
12:25 koha-jenkins Project Koha_Master_D10 build #373: STILL UNSTABLE in 40 min: https://jenkins.koha-community[…]a_Master_D10/373/
12:26 tcohen nobody uses vim anyway :-P
12:28 ashimema[m] hey.. I do :P
12:29 Joubu fridolin:[…]tools/-/issues/40 here you go
12:31 rhamby I use vim too :)
12:32 tuxayo Rise up vim gang!
12:32 tuxayo hi #koha BTW
12:33 cait hi tuxayo :)
12:33 tuxayo o/
12:33 tcohen \o
12:33 tcohen long life to Vim
12:33 * tcohen love sit
12:34 tcohen and also
12:34 * tcohen loves it
12:35 koha-jenkins Project Koha_Master_U18 build #918: UNSTABLE in 48 min: https://jenkins.koha-community[…]a_Master_U18/918/
12:35 * oleonard loves to sit
12:35 koha-jenkins Project Koha_Master_D11 build #112: UNSTABLE in 47 min: https://jenkins.koha-community[…]a_Master_D11/112/
12:36 * magnuse goes searching for that cool editor called sit
12:36 * cait is with oleonard
12:36 oleonard Joubu++ # Thanks for working on Bug 26445
12:36 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=26445 normal, P5 - low, ---, jonathan.druart, Needs Signoff , Search results browser in staff has broken link back to results
12:37 magnuse huh, i run koha-gitify on a site, restart apache and everything is 403?
12:38 fridolin Joubu++
12:39 fridolin VIM++
12:42 Joubu oleonard: happy to get feedback on this patch, no idea if it correctly fixes the problem
12:42 oleonard It sounds correct based on your description.
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12:45 simon_ hi everyone
12:46 * cait waves
12:46 simon_ i got a follow up question after switching to elastic search
12:46 simon_ i used https://wiki.koha-community.or[…]d_new_zebra_index to add a new index
12:46 simon_ in zebra
12:46 simon_ now i  am not quite sure how to replicate with elasticsearch
12:46 simon_ so far i did the following:
12:47 simon_ i added a new mapping to  /usr/share/koha/intranet/cgi-bin/admin/s​earchengine/elasticsearch/mappings.yaml
12:47 simon_ i ran the indexer again:
12:47 Joubu use the UI view instead
12:47 Joubu admin > search engine mapping something
12:47 Joubu /cgi-bin/koha/admin/searcheng​ine/elasticsearch/
12:48 Joubu (the DB is used, the yaml is only the default values used when you reset them from the UI)
12:49 simon_ ah
12:49 simon_ but i cannot add a new searchfield name there, right?
12:49 simon_ then i have to do it in the database?
12:50 simon_ i can only select searchfield names from a predefined list/dropdown
12:50 eythian Joubu: without thinking about it too deeply, I kinda like option 5, you could move the code into -core and allow -common to be all the standard package config stuff with deps. This makes transition fairly easy. The naming of -common then isn't quite right, but you could change that over time if desired.
12:51 koha-jenkins Project Koha_Master_U16 build #87: UNSTABLE in 56 min: https://jenkins.koha-community[…]ha_Master_U16/87/
12:52 Joubu eythian: yes, we basically keep -common to not break people's workflow/habits :)
12:52 Joubu thanks for the feedback
12:52 Joubu kidclamp: were not we able to created new ES search fields?
12:52 Joubu or is there a patch somewhere for that?
12:52 cait it doesn't look like we can now (just checked too)
12:52 cait bbiab
12:53 Joubu alex_a: maybe?
12:54 Joubu found it
12:54 Joubu bug 20388
12:54 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=20388 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, alex.arnaud, BLOCKED , Elasticsearch - Ability to add search fields from UI
12:54 alex_a Joubu ?
12:54 wahanui hmmm... Joubu is kidding, right ;)
12:54 Joubu simon_: so, no, you cannot
12:55 Joubu alex_a: I was searching for 20388 :)
12:55 Joubu simon_: I'd try to add the entry manually in the DB table
12:55 simon_ ok, will do :)
12:59 ashimema[m] can you not do it via the yaml files and then use the script to load them?
13:00 * ashimema[m] has a vague recollection of talking about that.. but can't remember the details
13:00 simon_ ok, now it is indexing once again after i configured it via the webinterface
13:00 simon_ do i have to adjust /etc/koha/searchengine/queryparser.yaml ?
13:01 Joubu nope, this file is not used by ES (and is actually removed in new versions)
13:03 Joubu tcohen: agree with that?
13:04 simon_ ok thx
13:04 tcohen Joubu well, that was my original implementation, but I decided to add the return value from safe_to_delete on the message payload
13:04 tcohen so we can provide better feedback
13:06 Joubu igual
13:06 Joubu
13:07 Joubu tcohen: we can still provide the return value
13:07 tcohen ah
13:07 tcohen yes, I agree hehe
13:08 Joubu tcohen: this is not tested!
13:08 tcohen I think I used as a sample
13:08 tcohen it is tested
13:08 tcohen the last test I add
13:08 tcohen covers this
13:08 tcohen its 12 tests I think
13:09 Joubu I was in t/db_dependent/Acquisition.t
13:09 tcohen Koha/Acquisition/Order.t
13:09 tcohen ok
13:09 Joubu hey tcohen, it's tested <3
13:10 tcohen :-D ❤
13:10 Joubu hey tcohen, it's failing! :D
13:10 tcohen WTF?
13:11 Joubu guess it's my change
13:11 tcohen you're breaking it haha
13:11 tcohen let me check
13:12 koha-jenkins Project Koha_Master_D9_My8 build #437: SUCCESS in 47 min: https://jenkins.koha-community[…]aster_D9_My8/437/
13:13 tcohen I love tests :-D
13:16 lukeG hi
13:16 wahanui hey, lukeG
13:16 tuxayo o/ lukeG
13:22 koha-jenkins Project Koha_Master_U20 build #119: STILL UNSTABLE in 47 min: https://jenkins.koha-community[…]a_Master_U20/119/
13:23 koha-jenkins Project Koha_Master_U2010 build #26: SUCCESS in 48 min: https://jenkins.koha-community[…]_Master_U2010/26/
13:25 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 26515: Don't need to call safe_to_delete <[…]a8f2a9432bf5847f4>
13:25 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 26515: (QA follow-up) Preserve original behaviour <[…]dfb14436f2685a1fe>
13:25 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 26555: (QA follow-up) Add a 'payload' attribute for carrying useful things <[…]3b6a01642c56f4eec>
13:25 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 26515: Better feedback on errors <[…]7e19aa1419a6ef84e>
13:25 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 26515: Remove branchcode from mock_userenv <[…]f9d709c546534434e>
13:25 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 26580: Remove unused C4::Acquisition::DelBasket function <[…]3852adda608efd3f7>
13:25 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 26579: Remove unused C4::Acquisition::DelOrder function <[…]41d31aff84177c389>
13:25 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 26577: Make and use ->cancel <[…]03fa64b4b89de3b41>
13:25 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 26515: (follow-up) Do not count self when checking orders <[…]8744fc670483db7ec>
13:25 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 26555: Make sure _messages is always initialized <[…]181a04a2e49b906cd>
13:25 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 26555: Add ->messages and ->add_message to Koha::Object <[…]a055f974916f011c7>
13:25 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 26555: Add Koha::Object::Message <[…]780b8f1ff68c32a9b>
13:25 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 26515: Add Koha::Acquisition::Order->cancel <[…]ca2de9aa49a248b77>
13:25 huginn News from kohagit: Bug 26515: Unit tests <[…]470f5a5d977d689d7>
13:26 Joubu oleonard: 26439 - seen the problem at the OPAC as well?
13:27 oleonard I haven't looked yet because I think it belongs on another bug
13:27 Joubu yes
13:27 Joubu I just wanted to know if you will deal with it :)
13:27 oleonard Yes
13:28 Joubu thx!
13:29 Joubu ashimema[m]: I don't think bug 26690 must depend on bug 26172
13:29 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=26690 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, koha-bugs, NEW , Constraints for cash management tables need reconsidering
13:29 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=26172 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, martin.renvoize, Passed QA , Add a cashup summary view (with option to print)
13:29 Joubu on bug 23355 instead
13:29 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=23355 new feature, P5 - low, ---, martin.renvoize, Pushed to master , Add a 'cashup' process to accounts
13:30 Joubu (will need to be backported)
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13:49 koha-jenkins Yippee, build fixed!
13:49 wahanui Congratulations!
13:49 koha-jenkins Project Koha_Master_D9 build #1456: FIXED in 58 min: https://jenkins.koha-community[…]a_Master_D9/1456/
13:50 tuxayo The UI of the CI changed :o
13:53 koha-jenkins Project Koha_Master_D10_Deps build #98: STILL UNSTABLE in 40 min: https://jenkins.koha-community[…]ster_D10_Deps/98/
14:00 cait khall++ kidclamp++
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14:12 koha-jenkins Project Koha_Master_D9_MDB_Latest build #412: STILL UNSTABLE in 49 min: https://jenkins.koha-community[…]9_MDB_Latest/412/
14:12 koha-jenkins Yippee, build fixed!
14:12 wahanui Congratulations!
14:12 koha-jenkins Project Koha_Master_D10 build #374: FIXED in 48 min: https://jenkins.koha-community[…]a_Master_D10/374/
14:14 koha-jenkins Project Koha_Master_U16 build #88: FAILURE in 2 min 35 sec: https://jenkins.koha-community[…]ha_Master_U16/88/
14:19 * cait reads the evergreen release notes and stumbles on 'hopeless holds' features
14:20 deb-CSPL joined #koha
14:21 tuxayo this? «holds on bibliographic records that no longer have any viable copies»
14:36 tcohen tuxayo you mean the jenkins upgrade?
14:36 koha-jenkins Yippee, build fixed!
14:36 wahanui Congratulations!
14:36 koha-jenkins Project Koha_Master_D11 build #113: FIXED in 42 min: https://jenkins.koha-community[…]a_Master_D11/113/
14:39 tuxayo tcohen: yep ^^
14:41 tuxayo liliputech_asu around?
14:42 cait tuxayo: i just liked the term of hopeless holds
14:42 tuxayo indeed
14:42 ashimema[m] mm
14:43 tuxayo So it's really that? A hold without an usable item? Sounds accurate.
14:44 cait ashimema[m]: don't kill me, but there is a little conflict on the session bug
14:44 cait
14:44 cait do you agree with the merge suggestion?
14:44 ashimema[m] yup
14:45 ashimema[m] correct
14:45 cait tuxayo: it would make sense, i didn#t dig that deep, only read the highlights
14:45 ashimema[m] I thought I uploaded that rebase..
14:45 ashimema[m] I've already done it once on my branch
14:45 inlibro joined #koha
14:45 cait do you want to check?
14:46 cait I am going outside for a bit :) will be back to continue later
14:48 ashimema[m] your solution was exactly what I did
14:49 koha-jenkins Yippee, build fixed!
14:49 wahanui Congratulations!
14:49 koha-jenkins Project Koha_Master_U18 build #919: FIXED in 59 min: https://jenkins.koha-community[…]a_Master_U18/919/
14:52 henryb joined #koha
14:53 tuxayo Does anyone know how use trigger the koha installer? I'm only using Koha in koha-testing-docker which by uses an already installed DB.
14:53 tuxayo (after 3 years it's about time to know that)
14:54 tcohen echo "DROP DATABASE koha_kohadev; CREATE DATABASE koha_kohadev;" | koha-mysql kohadev
14:54 caroline I usually delete my db
14:56 tuxayo Great, that's actually what I tried. Both the staff interface and OPAC homepages are in error now.
14:56 tcohen restart_all
14:56 tuxayo ahhh
14:57 tuxayo Thanks both for your help, now I'll finally get to try the installer! :D
14:58 caroline tcohen++
14:59 henryb tuxayo++ for asking this question. I also did not know how to do this!
14:59 koha-jenkins Project Koha_Master_U2010 build #27: SUCCESS in 46 min: https://jenkins.koha-community[…]_Master_U2010/27/
15:01 fridolin left #koha
15:05 reiveune bye
15:05 reiveune left #koha
15:10 koha-jenkins Project Koha_Master_D9_My8 build #438: SUCCESS in 55 min: https://jenkins.koha-community[…]aster_D9_My8/438/
15:12 liliputech_asu tuxayo: reset_all
15:13 liliputech_asu tuxayo: called me? :)
15:13 tuxayo liliputech_asu: thanks, it was indeed reset_all that was missing.
15:14 liliputech_asu ur welcome :)
15:15 liliputech_asu you sent me a ping a bit earlier? what was that4? same issue? (or just noticing i'm around, which i admit have been quite rare lately ><)
15:15 tuxayo liliputech_asu: do you have immediate plans and resources for the infamous bug 21507 ? Or can I try to dig it out of the
15:15 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=21507 major, P5 - low, ---,, ASSIGNED , Decimal separators issues in patrons payments/fines, simplified
15:16 liliputech_asu yeark
15:16 liliputech_asu no plan
15:16 tuxayo *grave
15:16 liliputech_asu ^^
15:16 tuxayo I would gladly let it rot but I can't forget that :P
15:17 tuxayo Anyway good to know I won't step on your tows. I'll tell you in the bug if I have something.
15:18 liliputech_asu tuxayo: sure, feel free to, not stepping on toes, definitly very VERY welcomed :)
15:18 koha-jenkins Project Koha_Master_U20 build #120: STILL UNSTABLE in 42 min: https://jenkins.koha-community[…]a_Master_U20/120/
15:19 liliputech_asu dropping off for tonight... :)
15:22 tuxayo o/
15:45 inlibro joined #koha
15:45 koha-jenkins Yippee, build fixed!
15:45 wahanui Congratulations!
15:45 koha-jenkins Project Koha_Master_D10_Deps build #99: FIXED in 46 min: https://jenkins.koha-community[…]ster_D10_Deps/99/
15:51 koha-jenkins Project Koha_Master_D9 build #1457: SUCCESS in 1 hr 1 min: https://jenkins.koha-community[…]a_Master_D9/1457/
15:59 koha-jenkins Yippee, build fixed!
15:59 wahanui Congratulations!
15:59 koha-jenkins Project Koha_Master_D9_MDB_Latest build #413: FIXED in 48 min: https://jenkins.koha-community[…]9_MDB_Latest/413/
15:59 koha-jenkins Project Koha_Master_D10 build #375: SUCCESS in 40 min: https://jenkins.koha-community[…]a_Master_D10/375/
16:28 caroline Does anyone else have complaints from libraries about the "cart"? I've had a couple of libraries ask me how to remove it because patrons were confused (they thought it was either to borrow ebooks, put it in the cart, borrow everything at the end; or to place holds)
16:29 caroline oleonard: my boss gave the idea to change the cart icon to something like https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic[…]RcBBTcmA&usqp=CAU
16:30 caroline I think it's a good idea, looks more like the baskets we use in libraries
16:30 oleonard caroline: When the feature was originally added to Koha it was called the "basket" and everyone was confused by that as well.
16:30 caroline it's called basket in French :)
16:31 caroline we don't have separate word for cart and basket
16:32 oleonard caroline do you know how to use css to change the icon?
16:33 caroline no, but My boss does
16:33 caroline I think some of our clients have a different icon
16:33 caroline Here's one that he did
16:35 oleonard Bug 26130
16:35 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=26130 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, NEW , opacbookbag 'Cart' confuses patrons - add optional name alternatives?
16:36 caroline he's also working on a "grid view" of the search results, it's going to be really pretty
16:37 caroline I'll try to have him propose it to the community
16:39 caroline oof, the cart seems controversial lol!
16:39 oleonard Imagine how controversial it was when you couldn't do any batch operations from the cart...
16:40 cait joined #koha
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16:42 caroline I don't know when the feature was added nor what was it's initial purpose, but I think with the internet evolving and people doing a lot more online (doing things online in general, and also shopping online) "cart" has come to mean something specific
16:44 koha-jenkins Project Koha_19.05_U16 build #3: STILL FAILING in 53 sec: https://jenkins.koha-community[…]Koha_19.05_U16/3/
16:45 inlibro joined #koha
16:47 oleonard I suspect the confusion about the cart is different whether your library offers self checkout or not.
16:55 cait hm in German we don't get asked to rename it often, but i think because German uses a slightly different term for the cart in e-commerce settings
16:56 cait would "book cart" work better?
16:56 * cait imagines cute cart icons :)
17:15 * cait was expecting to find the QA queue empty on returning...
17:17 cait Joubu: i got no update message from 50 to 51
17:19 cait hm, maybe it was me, the update statements look right
17:24 davidnind joined #koha
17:25 cait hm the payment table is off by one in the total line again
17:26 * cait can't count how often we broke that already
17:34 enkidu joined #koha
17:40 cait ah caroline - i put a manual keyword on 24603 because ashimema[m] wrote a nice explanation about the different credit types there
17:42 ashimema[m] The cart is confusing in the UK .. we nearly always rename it
17:43 cait you can use it to place holds...
17:43 cait what do people expect when seeing it?
17:45 inlibro joined #koha
17:45 cait ashimema[m]: are you still around?
17:45 ashimema[m] No idea
17:46 ashimema[m] But it does confuse people
17:46 ashimema[m] Thinking they can buy things from it
17:46 ashimema[m] Just about to cook tea Cait
17:46 cait ah ok
17:46 cait go ahead :) i am looking at the cancel charges feature, but just starting to get into it, go cook :)
17:59 oleonard wahanui: What is it you're always saying about me?
17:59 wahanui oleonard: bugger all, i dunno
18:07 enkidu joined #koha
18:08 caroline cait: re:cart: one of the reasons I was told is that because we integrate ebooks in the catalog, patrons think they can borrow from there
18:09 caroline That's one reason I remember, others just asked me during training to remove it because it would confuse patrons, but without having tried it, so it's an assumption on their part
18:09 henryb joined #koha
18:10 oleonard caroline is there supposed to be a documentation meeting now?
18:10 caroline crap yes
18:10 caroline I always think it's later than it really is
18:11 caroline is anyone here for the meeting?
18:11 oleonard I don't know if your docs crew is around, I was just curious because my calendar alerted me
18:11 davidnind I am here..
18:11 henryb I am late but here now
18:12 caroline ok i'll start the meeting then
18:12 davidnind sorry, I was working on something and didn't notice the time
18:12 henryb We call the cart 'folder' but that also confuses people
18:12 caroline me either just came back from lunch and was catching up on messages/emails
18:13 caroline #startmeeting Documentation IRC meeting 15 October 2020
18:13 huginn Meeting started Thu Oct 15 18:13:14 2020 UTC.  The chair is caroline. Information about MeetBot at
18:13 huginn Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.
18:13 Topic for #koha is now  (Meeting topic: Documentation IRC meeting 15 October 2020)
18:13 huginn The meeting name has been set to 'documentation_irc_meeting_15_october_2020'
18:13 caroline #link https://wiki.koha-community.or[…]g_15_October_2020
18:13 caroline #chair davidnind
18:13 huginn Current chairs: caroline davidnind
18:13 caroline #topic Introductions
18:13 Topic for #koha is now Introductions (Meeting topic: Documentation IRC meeting 15 October 2020)
18:13 caroline please use "#info" in front of your introduction to have it show up in the automatic minutes
18:14 caroline #info Caroline Cyr La Rose, inLibro
18:14 davidnind #info David Nind, Wellington, New Zealand
18:15 henryb #info Henry Bolshaw, House of Lords Library, UK
18:15 caroline cait around?
18:16 caroline #topic Updates
18:16 Topic for #koha is now Updates (Meeting topic: Documentation IRC meeting 15 October 2020)
18:16 caroline There were no action points from last meeting so I'll just skip that
18:16 caroline #topic  Project updates
18:16 Topic for #koha is now Project updates (Meeting topic: Documentation IRC meeting 15 October 2020)
18:16 marie-luce joined #koha
18:17 caroline Unfortunately, I'm not giving the best example, I haven't workd on anything manual-wise in the past month
18:17 caroline anyone has updates they'd like to share?
18:17 marie-luce sorry to be late
18:17 davidnind No updates from me either on my projects :-(
18:17 caroline no worries we just started
18:17 marie-luce #info Marie-Luce Laflamme, inLibro
18:18 davidnind hi marie-luce
18:18 henryb Me neither. To be honest I'm still trying to work out the documentation workflow
18:18 marie-luce hi David
18:18 marie-luce Henri, you are not alone. There are so many places to look at
18:19 caroline I started a section in the wiki https://wiki.koha-community.or[…]g_the_Koha_Manual#.3D.3E_New_writers.2C_start_here.21_.3C.3D
18:19 caroline #link https://wiki.koha-community.or[…]g_the_Koha_Manual#.3D.3E_New_writers.2C_start_here.21_.3C.3D
18:20 marie-luce great! Thanks Caroline
18:20 caroline Where are you stuck henryb? Maybe we can discuss it and it'll clear it up for more people too
18:21 henryb I'm not stuck exactly just not entirely sure how bugzilla, taigo and gitlab all fit together
18:21 caroline that's a good question
18:21 henryb But the link you've sent is really helpful!
18:22 marie-luce ++caroline
18:22 caroline This is how I see it : bugzilla is the source of everything
18:22 caroline That's where the developers work and create new features
18:22 ashimema[m] #info Martin Renvoize - PTFS-EUROPE
18:23 caroline it is very useful to get an idea of what a feature is, what it does, the steps of how to use it etc
18:23 caroline There are also Documentation "bugs" on bugzilla
18:23 ashimema[m] I used to just use a search in bugzilla to find the manual keyword.. work on it and then remove the keyword when done..
18:23 caroline That's where we point poeple to when they see a typo or notice that something is missing or not explained well
18:24 ashimema[m] But you guys do much more and have a bigger workflow to manage.. I've not kept up
18:24 caroline We ask anybody who sees somthing like that (typo, missing, etc.) to file a bug in bugzilla in the Documentation component
18:25 caroline that way, we can at least keep a record of things that need to be corrected and since a lot of people already know bugzilla, it's easy for them to file a new bug
18:25 caroline #link https://bugs.koha-community.or[…]=run&sharer_id=13
18:25 caroline ^ this is the list of such bugs
18:26 caroline From the main bugzilla page, you can click on Documentation To-Do to see this
18:26 ashimema[m] Dare I ask.. do you actually need tiaga?
18:26 ashimema[m] I always wonder why you didn't just do it all through BZ?
18:26 caroline I'm coming to that, but it could be a great discussion
18:27 caroline Taiga is where we write all the "new" things we need to add to the manual
18:27 caroline Not corrections, but new stuff
18:27 caroline Taiga is based on the release notes for each version
18:28 ashimema[m] Indeed... But those could be just bugs in BZ again.. for away with the keyword and instead add a linked bug in bz
18:28 caroline The reason I've been keeping it separate, and davidnind can interrupt me if im saying nonsense, is that devs have a workflow already established in bugzilla and we are nowhere in that workflow
18:29 caroline It's sign off, QA, push to master, push to stable, push to old stable, etc and then close
18:29 ashimema[m] Indeed..
18:29 caroline there is no step where we have a list of bugs that need to be added to the manual
18:29 davidnind have never heard caroline talking nonsense :)
18:29 caroline That's why I think it's a great discussion to have
18:29 ashimema[m] I'd be happy to help bridge the developer/docs divide
18:30 caroline Sure, we'd just need to squeeze in an extra step for us
18:30 marie-luce good points
18:30 davidnind we could do in the issues list in GitLab - easy to import from bugzilla
18:30 caroline It would certainly save me then step of copying everything in taiga
18:31 ashimema[m] I have the keys to the bugzilla configs.. happy to discus and impliment
18:31 caroline anyway, I just want to finish answering henryb before we diverge
18:31 davidnind I don't mind taiga, but it is one more thing...
18:32 ashimema[m] I don't want to push changes onto anyone.. but do feel free to reach out if there things that bug you and you think there could be a better way
18:32 caroline So that's taiga... when the bugs are done with their life with the devs in bugzilla, I copy everything in taiga so the docs team can look through
18:32 * ashimema[m] goes quite to let Caroline finish
18:33 caroline Then the final leg of the tripod, Gitlab is where the manual lives
18:33 caroline that's where you need to do the changes to the manual per se
18:34 caroline So look in bugzilla (Documentation To-Do) or taiga to find something to write about and write it in gitlab
18:34 caroline does that make sene?
18:34 caroline sense
18:34 henryb Yes it does! Thanks for the very patient explanation
18:34 henryb caroline++
18:34 caroline There is also the wiki... which is a whole nother thing...
18:34 caroline but it's not part of the docs workflow
18:34 davidnind caroline++
18:35 henryb No! just when I thought I understood
18:35 caroline lol!
18:35 marie-luce caroline++
18:36 caroline So do we want to simplify it and stay in bugzilla and ditch taiga?
18:36 caroline I agree that copying everything in taiga is an extra step that could be avoided
18:37 henryb Does taiga have any advantages over bugzilla - additional features etc?
18:37 davidnind thinking...
18:37 wahanui thinking is probably so much easier
18:37 ashimema[m] We could even broaden it and make it a requirement for enhancements and new features to have a corresponding manual merge request linked in the bug before QA
18:37 caroline it's prettier?
18:38 caroline ashimema[m]: oof... nothing will get past QA lol! Do you know how far behind we are?
18:38 davidnind LOL
18:38 ashimema[m] Tiaga is more modern and can handle lots of workflows.. I just wonder how much of it we actually make use of and need... I've tried to get into it on a few occasions and never fully got to grips
18:39 caroline maybe it's the way it's organized too...
18:39 ashimema[m] Well.. it would only require one is open.. not necessarily that it's fully finished..
18:39 enkidu joined #koha
18:39 ashimema[m] That would mean you have a record in girls of what to be done..
18:39 ashimema[m] s/girls/gitlab
18:40 caroline personally, when I write I like to pick a section and add all the new things in that section, rather than work bug by bug
18:40 ashimema[m] I also would love to see docs done by more people.. us Devs are terrible.. we should really give at least a skeleton of documentation for anything we add really.. if we can't then we should get someone in company to help us to
18:41 ashimema[m] Fair point
18:41 caroline at least a good test plan
18:41 caroline helps a lot when we try to figure out what something does
18:41 ashimema[m] Indeed
18:42 davidnind Options: use bugzilla, use GitLab, continue as currently
18:42 caroline ok so we need to actionize this
18:43 caroline I will write out neatly what I described here so that we have a trace of the current workflow
18:43 caroline #action caroline will write out the current worflow (from minutes)
18:43 ashimema[m] :)
18:43 davidnind bugzilla: no new tool to learn, either tag tasks or make a bugzilla doc tasks for topics for a release, link to bugs, non bug-related tasks have own bugzilla task
18:44 kathryn joined #koha
18:44 caroline davidnind: can you look into how it would work if we were to use gitlab issues?
18:44 caroline how to link with bugzilla etc
18:45 davidnind GitLab: use issues , import any bugzilla bugs (easier process than adding to taiga),  use boards
18:45 davidnind caroline: sure can!
18:45 caroline cool!
18:45 davidnind there is some intergration available with bugzilla, I looked at it a while ago and "seemed" relatively easy
18:45 caroline #action davidnind will check how we can use gitlab to simplify the workflow
18:45 inlibro joined #koha
18:46 caroline and when this is done, I'll check in with ashimema[m] on how to insert ourselves into the dev workflow
18:46 davidnind will write something up on the wiki, or in bugzilla and will send around the documentation and dev mailing lists
18:47 caroline #action caroline will check with ashimema on how to best insert the docs writing into the dev workflow
18:47 caroline woo, we'll be busy bees
18:47 davidnind #action davdnind to document options for docs tasks management including: using bugzilla, using GitLab issues, using Taiga, various other ideas discussed <- aim is to make as easy and as manageable as possible
18:48 caroline anything else to add to this?
18:48 davidnind (and less confusing for everyone...)
18:48 marie-luce great discussion, I can see the picture now!
18:49 caroline ok let's move on
18:49 caroline #topic  What's been done so far
18:49 Topic for #koha is now What's been done so far (Meeting topic: Documentation IRC meeting 15 October 2020)
18:49 caroline davidnind had a point here
18:50 caroline davidnind: tidied up the YouTube channel: added some sections and play lists, tracking down Kohacon videos, feedback welcome
18:50 caroline #link[…]1-kt84liiG5233BRQ
18:50 caroline very cool!
18:51 marie-luce davidnind++
18:51 caroline davidnind++
18:51 henryb davidnind++
18:52 caroline So please if you have any feedback, let davidnind know with an @later or other means of communcation
18:52 davidnind finally working on getting last year's Kohacon videos added - is easy to split, but have an audio issue I'm trying to fix (not a docs related task though...)
18:52 caroline I'm sure we'll have new content from kohacon next week
18:53 davidnind our channel is being used as part of the live streaming, so that will be good
18:53 caroline cool!
18:53 caroline #topic  Content development guidelines
18:53 Topic for #koha is now Content development guidelines (Meeting topic: Documentation IRC meeting 15 October 2020)
18:54 caroline I don't think there's anything new for this...
18:54 caroline We'll surely be adding to it with the workflow thing
18:55 caroline Feel free to interrupt me if you have something to add...
18:55 davidnind nothing to add
18:55 caroline #topic  Next steps
18:55 Topic for #koha is now Next steps (Meeting topic: Documentation IRC meeting 15 October 2020)
18:55 caroline #info the page for roles for 21.05 is up
18:55 caroline #link https://wiki.koha-community.or[…]i/Roles_for_21.05
18:55 caroline please add your name to the docs team!
18:56 caroline Also if anyone wants to have a go at docs manager, I'm happy to let someone else have a go!
18:57 marie-luce I would like to add my name in Doc team, but I don't have the rights to modify the page
18:57 caroline oh, you can request a login
18:57 caroline Click log in and click on "request"
18:57 marie-luce great, I will place my request
18:58 caroline +1
18:58 caroline same goes for anyone else
18:58 davidnind I can approve, so will keep an eye out
18:58 davidnind (approval is required to stop spam registrations)
18:59 caroline otherwise, priorities are on documenting new features for 20.11 as usual
18:59 caroline Check Taiga for new feature to document
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19:00 caroline davidnind: I think the docs workshops at kohacon are in-person only, is that right? do you know?
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19:00 davidnind it is, but I'm maybe going look at recording at least, and an online bit if there is any interest (either live streaming or using jitsi)
19:01 davidnind #info Kohacon20 documentation workshop - feel free to add your ideas to https://wiki.koha-community.or[…]orkshop_KohaCon20
19:01 marie-luce it would be nice if someone could record it, I would be happy to watch later
19:02 caroline there will also be two days of "DIY" where we can work together on docs
19:02 ashimema[m] +1
19:02 caroline #link
19:02 marie-luce +1
19:02 caroline From what I understood it will be here on IRC for remote ppl
19:03 davidnind I'll try my best to at least record, I will add a jitsi meeting but quality will depend a bit on the wifi...
19:03 davidnind cool
19:03 marie-luce cool
19:04 caroline anything else to add?
19:04 davidnind nothing from me
19:04 henryb nothing from me
19:04 caroline #topic Set time of next meeting
19:04 Topic for #koha is now Set time of next meeting (Meeting topic: Documentation IRC meeting 15 October 2020)
19:05 caroline is november 12 good?
19:05 caroline it's 4 weeks from now
19:05 davidnind +1
19:05 marie-luce +1
19:05 henryb +1
19:05 caroline same time good for everyone?
19:06 marie-luce +1
19:06 henryb +1
19:06 davidnind +1
19:06 caroline we might be in regular time here so it will be earlier or later... never sure how it goes
19:06 caroline I'm bad with numbers...
19:07 caroline #info Next meeting: 12 November 2020, 18 UTC
19:07 caroline #endmeeting
19:07 Topic for #koha is now Welcome to #koha this channel is for discussion of the Koha project and software
19:07 huginn Meeting ended Thu Oct 15 19:07:44 2020 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)
19:07 huginn Minutes:        https://meetings.koha-communit[…]-10-15-18.13.html
19:07 huginn Minutes (text): https://meetings.koha-communit[…]0-10-15-18.13.txt
19:07 huginn Log:            https://meetings.koha-communit[…]15-18.13.log.html
19:07 caroline thanks everyone!
19:08 henryb Thanks! Bye everyone!
19:08 marie-luce thanks caroline
19:08 caroline ashimema[m]: can you run the script?
19:08 kathryn kia ora koutou / hi everyone :)
19:08 caroline hi kathryn !
19:08 ashimema[m] I'm on my phone, can run it in the morning if no-one breasts me to it
19:08 davidnind caroline++
19:08 ashimema[m] Blooming phone.. autocomplete is on form today
19:09 kathryn LOL
19:17 davidnind Kohacon20 social page (+links to the chat):  https://wiki.koha-community.or[…]/KohaCon20/Social
19:21 caroline ashimema[m]: your autocorrect seems to have a one track mind lol!
19:33 cait oh i missed the meeting :(
19:37 caroline :( it was really interesting
19:37 caroline but read the minutes if you have time and let me know if you have comments on my explanation of the workflow
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19:44 cait just read back - i like the idea of gitlab issues
19:44 cait and having an automated process to move pushed bugs there... easy to close the ones that don't need doc changes maybe than to add htem all manually?
19:45 davidnind I like the idea as well
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19:46 cait davidnind: the DIY is not pretty clear at the moment apart from IRC - i will try to be there, but it owuld be good to flesh it out a bit more :)
19:48 caroline the DIY was just an idea I threw that we could work together if needed
19:48 caroline I guess we could try to have specific tasks or things that ppl can do
19:50 davidnind Would you like me to create a wiki page? Possibly the Kohacon20 team are already working on something...
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19:51 davidnind I've added a Kohacon20 programme page to the wiki with links to timeanddate - is this useful? If so will add other days when I get home from work.. https://wiki.koha-community.or[…]haCon20/Programme
19:52 cait it's all good - sorry :) Just keep us virtuals in mind
19:52 cait oh those time conversion links are really helpful!
19:52 hayley it's pretty unstructured, tagging more bugs for academy would be useful, go for it with the wiki page davidnind!
19:53 hayley our plan is to just host a bug squashing :)
19:53 davidnind hayley++
19:53 cait caroline: I don't know french but said things about french on bug 26130 - can you check? :)
19:53 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=26130 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, NEW , opacbookbag 'Cart' confuses patrons - add optional name alternatives?
19:53 caroline I saw
19:54 aleisha davidnind: that wiki page is amaze!
19:54 cait French does the genering, right?
19:54 caroline but words don't change gender
19:54 cait gendering...
19:54 caroline cart will always be male in all sentences
19:54 cait but articles?
19:54 cait yeah i meant the words referring to it
19:54 cait like your in german changes if the word is male/female/neutral
19:55 cait the word would change in german depending on the "case"... but I am really bad at expalining grammar :(
19:55 cait in the carts = in den Körben, the carts = die Körbe
19:55 caroline let me reread the sentences, but I think they's be ok
19:55 cait German is just asking for trouble really
19:55 caroline lol! French too
19:56 caroline I envy the gender-neutral of english
19:56 cait long works that can't be broken on multiple lines (Anschaffungsvorschläge regularly is too long for the tabs in OPAC = purchase suggeston just goes on 2 lines)
19:56 cait works = words
19:56 hayley caroline maybe we have it good in that respect, but english in general is kind of stupidly inconsistent hehe
19:56 cait I envy that it's so easy to use they/them too - there is not really a good way to express that in German
19:56 caroline yeah, well all languages are inconsistent!
19:57 cait well there is this rule... and here is the tons of exceptions for it
19:57 caroline I mean genders for things... who decides that a desk is male and a table female? .lol
19:58 caroline cait haha exactly!
19:58 caroline and here's a song for you to remember all the expections
19:58 cait both male in German heh
19:59 caroline I only remember that in German moon is male and sun is female because it's the exact opposite of french
19:59 cait lol was about to say tha ttoo
19:59 cait it's about the only thing i know about french grammar probably :)
20:00 caroline but you were right to say that articles and other words (adjectives) change according to the gender of the noun
20:00 cait you expressed it much better than me
20:01 caroline so if ppl were to enter "list" (female) instead of "cart" (male) then the sentences would be really weird
20:02 caroline LA liste, LE panier... Le liste sounds like a foreigner
20:03 cait davidnind++
20:04 caroline But funnily, I just looked through the cart sentences and I think French would be ok
20:04 caroline "empty" is an adjective that doesn't change gender, so yay! and polite "your" doesn't either
20:05 caroline Only "Add to cart" would cause a problem
20:06 caroline But if, like ashimema[m] said we have a set of predefined terms, we can translate the sentences according to those workds?
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20:07 caroline I mean, it would be a lot of trouble for something so trivial, but it could be possible
20:09 cait caroline: nope
20:10 cait it would look something like Add to %s
20:10 cait so if we want variations, we'd have to make every sentence for ever word we add... possible as they are not that many
20:10 cait add to cart... add to book bag
20:11 caroline that's what I thought ashimema[m] was proposing
20:11 cait so possible, but not with just a variable
20:11 caroline ok that's what you mean by variable
20:12 caroline I thought the "variable" was the syspref, si "if syspref = cart, then 'Add to cart', if syspref = book bag, then 'Add to book bag'" etc.
20:13 cait i might have misunderstood him
20:13 cait because i was thinking about the easier case of account types he mentioned
20:13 cait i just added another note to clarify
20:13 caroline that's why I said it would be a lot of work... for each place in the templates where the term appears, you can to multiply the number of if/thens by the number of predefined options...
20:13 cait i wonder if the translation system could help somehow - like we have the plural/singular now...
20:13 caroline can get heavy
20:14 caroline maybe, or the contextualization
20:14 cait hm yes
20:14 cait it's good to discuss, more brains, more ideas :)
20:14 caroline Like "Add to %s" (list) "Add to %s" (cart)
20:14 ashimema[m] OK, it was just an idea..
20:15 caroline ashimema[m]: come on in, one more brain :)
20:15 ashimema[m] I totally see where your coming from now
20:15 cait languages are evil?
20:15 caroline no!! languages are fun!
20:15 ashimema[m] That would be very evil
20:15 cait i am not sure
20:15 ashimema[m] Mmm
20:15 * caroline majored in linguistics
20:16 cait ok, i take it back, i want to stay on caroline's good side
20:16 caroline lol!
20:16 ashimema[m] Lol
20:17 caroline Maybe I can agree that languages are evil for the present case only
20:17 cait ashimema[m]: on yours too actually - I just wanted to explain that my language is crazy :)
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20:17 caroline I just love so much how our language shapes our way of thinking/our culture
20:17 ashimema[m] Lol
20:19 cait :)
20:19 cait i love how Koha brings us all together discussing such things
20:20 caroline yes <3
20:20 cait :)
20:24 ashimema[m] So do we need a tagfest for bugzilla before next week then
20:25 cait some rebasing checking might also be good
20:28 ashimema[m] Time for bed for me. Night night
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20:30 cait good night ashimema[m]
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