IRC log for #koha, 2012-05-31

All times shown according to UTC.

Time S Nick Message
00:09 Judit joined #koha
00:09 Judit morning
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01:26 eythian Judit: afternoon
01:27 Judit :)afternoon? you already left?
01:28 eythian nope, it's 1:26pm here
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01:49 jcamins_away y
01:49 jcamins_away u
01:50 jcamins_away Sorry.
01:50 jcamins_away Phone keyboard.
01:51 rangi heh
01:51 rangi yeah, they can be tricky to use
01:52 Judit joined #koha
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02:19 jcamins_away really slow for anyone else?
02:20 jcamins_away really slow/down?
02:22 chilts both the website and the git clone are fine for me
02:22 jcamins_away chilts: thanks.
02:24 rangi hmm slow for me
02:24 rangi but up
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04:41 cait morning #koha
04:50 Oak joined #koha
04:54 Oak kia ora #koha
04:55 cait hi Oak
04:55 Oak Ahoy cait
05:00 eythian hello
05:00 cait hello :)
05:01 Oak hello :)
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06:31 alex_a bonjour
06:41 cait hi alex_a
06:41 cait next week! :D
06:42 cait bbl
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06:49 julian_m hi #koha
06:53 Joubu joined #koha
06:53 Joubu hi all
07:04 marcelr joined #koha
07:04 marcelr hello koha
07:04 slef hello
07:04 wahanui what's up, slef
07:05 slef wahanui: up is the sky
07:05 wahanui OK, slef.
07:05 Oak joined #koha
07:06 Oak \o
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07:14 kf good morning #koha
07:17 Oak good morning kf :)
07:19 marcelr hi kf Oak
07:20 francharb joined #koha
07:20 francharb hi
07:23 * magnuse buries magnus_afk and waves at #koha
07:24 Oak joined #koha
07:25 magnuse Oak
07:25 Oak magnuse
07:25 magnuse yay! ;-)
07:25 Oak :-)
07:28 marcelr hi magnuse francharb
07:29 magnuse hiya marcelr
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07:30 Oak_ electricity playing hide and seek
07:31 magnuse sounds like fun... ;-)
07:31 Oak_ it is :)
07:33 paul_p joined #koha
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07:37 Oak_ how do i give myself credit for the Koha deployment and customization I did... in footer area of my opac? what words do I use?
07:39 Oak_ like, Deployed by --- or Implemented by --- ? or what? any ideas? or should I add a 'Credits' link in footer and add names of all the people who helped me. that sound better actually.
07:40 hdl oak there is an opaccredits sys pref iirc
07:41 hdl But you also could add something to the about page.
07:41 paul_p good morning #koha
07:41 Oak_ hmm
07:41 hdl it is not something we usually do.
07:42 Oak_ yes, probably because you all have jobs... and this is my MLIS project, and it would be better if people knew who did the work? no?
07:42 Oak_ i mean i don't have a library job at the moment
07:44 hdl Oak_: at the time Paul and I worked, we worked as consultants.
07:44 Oak_ hmm :)
07:44 Oak_ okay
07:47 rangi evening
07:48 Oak_ evening rangi
07:48 magnuse kia ora rangi
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07:57 stuartyeates rangi: thanks for the hints earlier today. we're having another crack at picking an LMS in October
07:57 rangi excellent
07:58 rangi happy to do a demo/presentation any time if that would be useful
07:59 stuartyeates last interation they decided that all the real offerings were vaporware, but everyone else seems to be heading in the alma direction
08:00 stuartyeates from what i can tell we'll looking for a 100% hosted outsourced solution
08:00 rangi ah yep
08:00 rangi totally doable :)
08:00 stuartyeates but i'm only seeing one part of the consortia, so that may not be an accurate description of the state of play
08:01 rangi right
08:01 rangi ill ask david up at waikato too
08:01 slef If Paypal do their worst, any ideas how we can collect the donations from the USA without them?  Wire transfers are very expensive, even US-US which I could set up.
08:02 rangi cheques work, they just take a long long time to clear
08:02 slef mailing cheques internationally? Yeah, that's true
08:02 slef We've done that from the far east in the past.
08:03 rangi yep, laurels parents have done that to us before too
08:04 slef What about NZ? Can you wire transfer to UK or use e-wallets or are we begging paper cheques from there too?
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08:04 * slef sulks at paypal
08:04 * magnuse thinks slef is too lenient
08:05 rangi naw we can do etransfers
08:06 rangi they do charge like a wounded bull for it
08:06 rangi however, i could talk to work, it might be that we can somehow use catalyst eu
08:07 rangi ie, get catalyst nz, to transfer to catalyst eu in the uk, and get it to you from there
08:07 rangi im assuming of course that we must have to do money transfers to them from time to time
08:13 slef rangi: if needed, do you think you or catalyst could collect the other NZ donations into it?  And any idea what ballpark the transfer charge is?
08:13 rangi probably, and no idea
08:15 rangi david from catalyst eu will be at the conference so we can have a chat and figure it out
08:16 slef just in case anyone cares, international transfers in the UK are under £10 and US is $20-$40... bizarrely, I'm pretty sure transfers from most of the EU to us cost nothing as long as they're sent in Euros, thanks to the EU
08:18 slef rangi: if you have free domestic transfers, I can probably get access to an NZ bank account pretty simply.
08:18 rangi wouldnt be free, but in the region of 20cents
08:18 stuartyeates slef: the NZ-EU situation has changed in the last month, we've been dropped from an approved list
08:19 stuartyeates apparently it's too easy to set up a company here electronically and so people have been using us as money laudering transit point
08:20 rangi yay us!
08:21 asaurat it's business time!
08:21 slef stuartyeates: Great. And the reaction is to make the banking system more secure by stopping everyone being able to use it for anything.
08:21 slef asaurat: lazy. I've been here 80mins already.
08:21 slef ;)
08:21 gaetan_B joined #koha
08:22 asaurat i was talking about the NZ ;)
08:23 slef stuartyeates: I've a nice sideline using the co-op to campaign for relaxing banking security... although I'm not doing that with paypal because I think I have too much money and not enough time there.
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09:53 slef every so often I get bored with writing perl and then I write something like map { $column->{$headings->[$_]} = $_ } (0..@{$headings}); and smile when it works.
10:00 drojf joined #koha
10:00 drojf good day #koha
10:00 slef hi
10:02 drojf hi slef. do you know if there is an acta demonstration in edinburgh on 9.6.? i think it's a global (european) action day
10:03 slef drojf: last I saw, the nearest was Glasgow about 1h away by train. There is a google map linked from their facebook page if you want to check it and let me know ;)
10:03 slef Glasgow is a bit far for a lunchtime trip
10:03 drojf just looking for something non-facebookish ;)
10:04 slef the facebook page was public-viewable
10:04 slef may have links too
10:05 drojf glasgow and london on the related google map
10:05 drojf what does it take to register a demonstration in uk? ;)
10:05 Oak joined #koha
10:09 drojf Glasgow 9. 6. 2012 12:00--20:00 in UTC+01
10:09 drojf i doubt there will really be people for 8 hours
10:10 slef I don't know what it takes to register a demonstration here. I've never registered one ;-)
10:10 slef I suspect whether there will be people for 8 hours depends on what the police do...
10:11 drojf 54 people going according to fb. if we have a public anti acta hackfest day we woudl be 38 already ;)
10:12 drojf 54. wow. either uk folks are really not interested in acta or don't use facebook for that.
10:25 slef yeah fb doesn't seem the natural place to organise against surveillance
10:25 slef or they're distracted by the monarchy going "ooh look at the pretty things, have some holiday, good peasants"
10:28 drojf heh. i never understood why they all use fb for that but it lead to 10000 people in berlin at -17° the last time i went so i try to accept it anyway
10:29 drojf found a different google map at edri which has 10 uk events. not all is lost ;)
10:31 slef any in Edinburgh?
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10:31 drojf unfortunately not[…].452056,67.631836
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10:37 * drojf tries to pull zioha out of the revolving door
10:56 slef drojf: shame. Any "how to do a UK demo" and any volunteers to organise it?
10:59 jcamins_away slef: are you doing something with authorities?
10:59 slef jcamins: no more than usual. In what way?
11:01 jcamins slef: your example of how to keep Perl interesting looked like it might be a modification of C4::Heading.
11:01 slef jcamins: ah no, I'm loading a CSV into the items table with a perl script and the C4 API
11:02 jcamins Ah.
11:03 slef $headings is the first line of the CSV of course
11:04 slef biab
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11:06 drojf slef:[…]rotest/index.html looks promising, i'll have a closer look later
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11:45 BobB hi slef
11:48 BobB @later tell slef BobB cannot organise the band for KohaCon - members are dispersed on relevant nights.  Sorry.
11:48 huginn` BobB: The operation succeeded.
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11:56 slef BobB: OK, thanks for trying. I'll make a note.
11:57 oleonard Hi #koha
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12:39 paul_p jcamins = sandbox2.sql.gz on contrib/global/sandbox has been upgraded to 3.8.0 and his size reduced to 5k biblio (instead of 20k)
12:45 jcamins paul_p: did you push the changes to add sign off?
12:45 paul_p jcamins yep
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12:47 jcamins :)
12:47 jcamins paul_p++
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12:58 paul_p jcamins = just in case= I just pushed another patch (with doc and a commented line that should not be=
12:58 paul_p )
12:58 umer Hi, every one. i am new to this channel and KOHA as well. i have understood many things regarding koha and still in the phase of learning.
12:58 umer i need a bit of ur help
13:00 umer how can we import data from some excel file into koha. i know how to import patrons, i do have idea how to import catalogs and items. but if my data is like (petron abc has item xyz issued from library)
13:00 umer a complete excel file of this data
13:00 umer any idea?
13:02 jcamins umer: you will have to convert the file into MARC.
13:04 umer no.. i have marc files, it has data related to records and items. i have imported the items and records into koha. this is working fine.
13:04 umer now what i want to do is, there was an old system, which has information like which book was issued to which patron and is still not checked in, which patron has how much fines etc
13:04 jcamins Oh, I see. You mean *just* circulation data.
13:05 umer yes yes you got it right
13:05 umer just circulation data
13:05 jcamins You'll probably need to write a script to read the data from the spreadsheet and insert it directly into the Koha database.
13:05 jcamins Koha migration toolbox?
13:06 jcamins Koha migration toolbox is
13:06 jcamins ^^ that might be useful. It has scripts for a lot of migration tasks.
13:06 umer ahhan.. okay.. i ll look into it. thanks a lot
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13:14 umer ok one more thing. by default koha provides the functionality of calculating fines base upon days. is there some way that we could calculate fines on hourly basis?
13:15 jcamins umer: that feature was added in version 3.8.
13:16 umer oh.. i am using 3.02. is there some way that i can update it to the latest one?
13:17 jcamins If you look in INSTALL.debian, it has instructions for upgrading.
13:17 umer ok.. thankyou
13:18 jcamins oleonard: do you know of a way to produce a box with a caption-y looking thing outside of a form?
13:18 jcamins I know about fieldset and legend, but the box in question contains only text.
13:19 oleonard What's the context?
13:19 jcamins Authority notes.
13:19 jcamins I want to set them off a little bit from the rest of the text.
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13:21 oleonard jcamins: I don't think there is an existing model for that yet, so you can do what you think works best
13:22 oleonard If it's instructions for a form we sometimes offset it on the right, like on the list add page
13:22 jcamins Actually, what might be better is to set up a tabbed bit, and then just have one tab.
13:22 oleonard Not that that looks great.
13:22 jcamins That makes it more like the bib details.
13:22 * oleonard doesn't understand
13:23 jcamins I am designing a details view for authorities.
13:23 oleonard But that reminds me to be grumpy about Bug 8170
13:23 huginn` Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=8170 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, NEW , 5XX fields get hidden under Title notes
13:23 oleonard 5XX fields aren't hidden there, they just GO THERE.
13:23 jcamins Why?
13:23 jcamins Ah.
13:24 oleonard You could just as easily argue that the MARC view is "hidden" because there's a separate link for it
13:24 * jcamins was going to file a bug saying that the MARC view is hidden.
13:24 umer couldnt find INSTALL.debian .. could u please guide me the path to this file
13:25 oleonard umer it's in the root directory of your Koha installation
13:25 jcamins umer: it should be in the root directory, but you can also find it online here:[…]32474469d;hb=HEAD
13:26 umer couldnt find it in root. thanks for the link
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13:42 jcamins Hm. the tabber is removing the <ul> and <li> elements, and not doing anything else.
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13:45 wizzyrea I think you said "root" and he thought "/"
13:45 wizzyrea and good morning
13:46 oleonard "You had me at root"
13:46 oleonard "In that I stopped reading after that"
13:47 jcamins Okay, it's no longer removing the <ul> and <li> tags.
13:47 jcamins That's progress.
13:47 oleonard jcamins: You're trying to do the tabs plugin?
13:47 jcamins Yes.
13:49 oleonard I'd be happy to check the markup if that would help
13:49 wizzyrea oh there's a new zebra version
13:49 jcamins Before I show it to you, I think I'd better check that I'm not making any embarrassing mistakes in it.
13:49 jcamins wizzyrea: yeah, I saw that.
13:49 oleonard jcamins: That's usually the problem ;)
13:50 jcamins ... like the one I just found.
13:50 wizzyrea 3 whole changes. They are ambitious.
13:50 jcamins lol
13:50 jcamins wizzyrea: presumably there are more differences?
13:50 jcamins I _did_ think that very thing, though.
13:51 wizzyrea um, thre are only 3 listed in the email
13:51 wizzyrea Increase max size of indexing term from 256 to 512.
13:51 wizzyrea Fix buffer overrun for terms using ICU normalization.
13:51 wizzyrea Fix problem in dictionary due to increase max size of term.
13:51 jcamins I know. I saw the e-mail.
13:51 wizzyrea that's it
13:51 wizzyrea oh that was for everyone else :P
13:51 jcamins And thought "is that really all they did?"
13:51 jcamins But then I decided they probably did more and just didn't feel like writing release notes.
13:51 wizzyrea or they didn't, and zebra is just that awesome
13:51 wizzyrea and bug free.
13:52 jcamins Heh.
13:53 jcamins Odd... the javascript doesn't seem to be showing up.
13:54 jcamins Mystery solved.
13:54 jcamins Misplaced IF.
13:55 jcamins It is now working. :)
13:56 Oak jcamins++
14:06 wizzyrea well here's your mad scheme of the day
14:06 wizzyrea "anybody ever tried to use SIP authentication with WordPress?"
14:06 * wizzyrea ducks
14:06 jcamins wizzyrea: why?
14:07 wizzyrea so that you can have patron only password protected areas of your website
14:07 wizzyrea for say, databases.
14:07 wizzyrea and keep only one username
14:07 jcamins Interesting.
14:07 wizzyrea actually, it would be cool if you could make Koha an OpenID endpoint
14:07 wizzyrea then you could just use OpenID
14:08 wizzyrea that solution would require no further work on WordPress.
14:08 jcamins That would make sense.
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14:30 magnuse openid++
14:35 * jcamins thinks Myshkin approves as well.
14:35 jcamins Especially if it openid is a code word for "tummy scratching."
14:40 magnuse isn't it?
14:41 jcamins Must be.
14:41 jcamins He's asleep in his box top (with a tissue paper mattress... what a spoiled cat), and every few minutes he wakes up enough to very theatrically roll around on his back and look at me accusingly before nodding off again.
14:50 Oak funny
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15:11 jcamins liw: around?
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15:20 clrh_ ?
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15:25 mtompset Hello?
15:25 oleonard Hi mtompset do you have a question?
15:26 mtompset I thought that perhaps an interactive community might have a better chance at pointing me to SAML 2.0 integration with Koha. :)
15:26 mtompset I found a thread on some mailing list from March.
15:27 mtompset But other than that, nothing seems to be out there.
15:28 jcamins mtompset: a quick wikipedia search on SAML suggests that any work there is on it would be in BibLibre's work on shibboleth, but I've certainly never heard of it before.
15:28 mtompset I also found Dobrica Pavlinušić's blog.
15:29 mtompset I suspect that is dpavlin_away right now.
15:29 kf I think jcamins is right, biblibre said there were working on shibboleth integration with Koha.
15:29 jcamins mtompset: dpavlin may know something about it, then.
15:29 kf they were...
15:29 mtompset Is there any ETAs?
15:29 kf ETA?
15:29 jcamins mtompset: no.
15:29 jcamins Estimated Time of Arrival.
15:30 jcamins clrh: you don't have a schedule for shibboleth integration, do you?
15:30 mtompset Well, dpavlin's blog[…]-perl-webapp.html
15:30 mtompset points at pieces, but I'm not sure I understand how the patchwork works.
15:32 jcamins Since I have no idea what SAML is (even after skimming Wikipedia), I can't really help you, sorry.
15:32 jcamins It might be worth sending an e-mail to koha-devel.
15:32 mtompset It's an protocol definition of how to authenticate and give access to services. At least that's my take on it.
15:32 jcamins That way when dpavlin isn't away he can respond. :)
15:34 mtompset Or I could leave a message on their blog. I just don't like signing in and subscribing to things left right and center. :)
15:34 kf mtompset: when you are working with Koha the mailing list is a must have :)
15:35 clrh jcamins: we did a first work and I am waiting for customer test installation to validate it
15:35 mtompset actually, the wiki was good enough for our base install.
15:36 clrh but I remmeber it was a really "hard thing" to setup architecture (sysop ionfrastructure !?) don't know the god work
15:36 clrh jcamins: will I see you at edimbourg?
15:36 jcamins mtompset: installing Koha is one thing. Doing development with it is something else.
15:36 jcamins clrh: unfortunately not. :(
15:36 jcamins I'll be presenting via the Internet.
15:36 mtompset tell me about it, jcamins. :)
15:37 clrh snif ok I will remember that I have to tell you when we will submit a patch
15:37 jcamins clrh: mtompset was wondering about it. I'll see the update to Bugzilla. :)
15:37 jcamins mtompset: actually, developing with Koha is pretty easy.
15:37 jcamins But you do need to subscribe to the mailing lists.
15:37 * kf joins clrh in sniffing
15:38 kf clrh: I wish too jcamins would be there
15:38 clrh for me snif is like "crying" / be sad
15:38 clrh ook kf you have the same meaning
15:38 mtompset okay... on main page... where is the "yes, bombard me with lots of mail that I'll mostly mark as read"?
15:39 jcamins Support.
15:39 wahanui i think support is found at
15:39 jcamins mailing lists?
15:39 wahanui mailing lists are at[…]ha-mailing-lists/
15:39 jcamins ^^ there we go. :)
15:39 mtompset At least one question got answered. ;)
15:40 kf mtompset: where are you located?
15:40 mtompset PH
15:40 mtompset And you?
15:41 kf Germany
15:41 * jcamins is from the US- New York.
15:41 kf which version did you install?
15:41 mtompset 3.6.3
15:41 mtompset Though I patched the login with 3.6.4
15:42 mtompset Tweaked a bunch of styling things.
15:42 jcamins mtompset: you know, you could just upgrade the entire system.
15:42 mtompset To make it "fit" our things.
15:42 jcamins version control with git?
15:42 jcamins koha version control?
15:42 jcamins git?
15:42 wahanui i guess git is[…]Control_Using_Git
15:42 jcamins There we go.
15:42 jcamins You might want to read that document if you haven't already.
15:42 kf mtompset: yes, updating to 3.6.5 would make sense
15:42 mtompset Nah, because that would bust the style things. :P
15:43 kf if it's already annoying with such a small update, you will run into major problems later
15:43 oleonard Actually using version control is for *not* busting style things
15:43 kf there are lots of options to style things without making updating a pain
15:43 mtompset I had to edit existing files.
15:43 kf not sure what you did, but it might be worth doing some research to save lot sof time and nerves later on
15:44 kf mtompset: I was afraid you woudl say that - but it's never a good idea
15:44 mtompset Though I did like the ability to add CSS'.
15:44 kf in my opinion
15:44 mtompset I documented my tweaks.
15:44 mtompset So if we do upgrade, it shouldn't be too hard.
15:45 oleonard With version control you have the possibility of having git automatically merge your customizations upon upgrade
15:46 mtompset Haven't used git before, nor koha, nor a lot of the technologies involved in this beautiful mess. :)
15:46 jcamins mtompset: never too late to learn.
15:47 mtompset I'd like to keep my learning curve less acute. :)
15:47 jcamins In that case, learn to use git.
15:47 jcamins You'll learn real fast how painful upgrades can be if you really want shibboleth.
15:48 kf mtompset: we really not try to make this hard for you - we try to tell you how it will be easier
15:48 mtompset I'm also looking at zxid
15:48 jcamins (the earliest release that could possibly have shibboleth would be 3.10... you'll have forgotten what tweaks you made, and the Koha files will have changed greatly in between 3.6.3 and 3.10)
15:49 kf I think you could perhaps use CAS
15:49 kf and it might be that you can get it indirectly working with shibboleth that way but not sure
15:50 mtompset No... CAS isn't an option.
15:50 kf[…]ntication_Service
15:50 mtompset I've been told that SAML 2.0 is it, and there is no discussion.
15:50 mtompset I won't forget the tweaks.
15:50 mtompset 1) /usr/share/koha/intranet/ht​docs/intranet-tmpl/prog/en/css/login.css 2) /usr/share/koha/intranet/htdocs/intranet-​tmpl/prog/en/includes/ 3) /usr/share/koha/intranet/htdocs/intra​net-tmpl/prog/en/includes/ 4) /usr/share/koha/intranet/htdocs/intranet​-tmpl/prog/en/lib/yui/reset-fonts-grids.css 5) /usr/share/koha/intranet/htdocs/intran
15:51 jcamins Well, all I can say is, good luck.
15:51 mtompset and I have the tweaks listed in detail in a file.
15:51 mtompset That's also why I'm in the midst of setting up 3.8.1 in a VM.
15:52 mtompset That will give me an idea of how much those particular files have changed.
15:55 mtompset losing blood sugar subscribing to all these lists... ;)
15:55 oleonard mtompset: Why change reset-fonts-grids.css when you can override it with a custom stylesheet?
15:56 mtompset I would... if I knew where to easily.
15:56 mtompset I wanted it done quickly. :P
15:57 oleonard intranetstylesheet system preference, or IntranetUserCSS system preference
15:57 oleonard Quickly now will turn into time-consuming later.
15:58 mtompset Perhaps... so you are saying that if I put my tweak from the reset-grids.css into the stylesheet that I set up with those system preferences, it will over-ride it?
15:58 oleonard yes
15:59 mtompset Because it seemed like some of those sheet were overriding what i was putting into my custom sheet.
15:59 mtompset I'll try cleaning that up...
15:59 mtompset See if it works... later.
16:00 alex_a left #koha
16:00 oleonard use the intranetcolorstylesheet if your stylesheet is on your Koha server. use intranetstylesheet if it's at another URL. use IntranetUserCSS if you want the CSS embedded on each page
16:01 mtompset Okay... this is useful info... now how to save it somewhere to look at.... today. :)
16:01 zioha joined #koha
16:01 gaetan_B bye !
16:02 mtompset Bye. :)
16:03 mtompset Okay... does anyone here know about the mess that is Zebra?
16:04 jcamins mtompset: "Know" is kind of a strong word.
16:04 mtompset I'm trying to figure out why certain options aren't behaving as expected... perhaps I don't understand the queue or something.
16:04 mtompset I add an item
16:04 mtompset -b -a... doesn't show up.
16:04 mtompset -b -a -r... does show up.
16:05 mtompset Delete an item...
16:05 mtompset -b -a -z doesn't remove
16:05 jcamins searching faq?
16:05 wahanui searching faq is probably at
16:05 melia joined #koha
16:05 mtompset -b -a -r does remove.
16:05 jcamins You should take a look in that document. It's probably a permissions issue.
16:05 mtompset I read the documentation... it is drastically lacking explanation.
16:06 kf patches to the documentation are welcome
16:06 jcamins You followed the troubleshooting steps that describe this exact problem?
16:06 mtompset give me the URL... I probably did.
16:06 jcamins I just did.
16:07 jcamins Third question from the end.
16:07 mtompset environment variables are fine.
16:08 mtompset it is running as the koha user
16:08 mtompset right there... what directory permissions?
16:09 jcamins Everything must be owned by your Koha user.
16:09 jcamins /var/lib/koha/*
16:10 mtompset yep, it is.
16:10 mtompset how do I know I'm not running the zebraqueue daemon?
16:10 jcamins Did you start it?
16:10 jcamins ps ax | grep zeb
16:11 jcamins If you see anything that looks like zebraqueue, you are.
16:11 mtompset 3224 ?        Ss     0:00 daemon --name=koha-zebra-ctl.kohadata --errlog=/var/log/koha/koha-zebradaemon.err --stdout=/var/log/koha/koha-zebradaemon.log --output=/var/log/koha/koha-zebradaemon-output.log --verbose=1 --respawn --delay=30 --user=koha koha -- /usr/bin/zebrasrv -v none,fatal,warn -f /etc/koha/koha-conf.xml  3226 ?        S      0:00 /usr/bin/zebr
16:11 mtompset nothing with a que in it.
16:12 jcamins Okay, that's correct.
16:13 jcamins How did you install Koha, out of curiosity?
16:13 mtompset[…]ki/Koha_on_Ubuntu
16:14 mtompset I read about the zebraqueue being flaky so chose the crontab way of doing it.
16:14 liw jcamins, you called?
16:14 mtompset sudo koha-rebuild-zebra -v –full `/usr/sbin/koha-list`
16:14 mtompset That's in the DEBIAN scripts.
16:15 mtompset the script remaps -full to -b -a -r
16:16 jcamins liw: yes, I'm trying to make a metapackage, and I was wondering if there was any way to have a metapackage with a changelog. It seems like when I add a changelog, it requires a rules file, and I don't want to install anything.
16:16 jcamins mtompset: so you used packages?
16:17 mtompset yep... wget the latest.
16:17 mtompset Which seems to be ancient now. :)
16:17 jcamins There are frequent updates.
16:17 liw jcamins, I've used empty packages as metapackages, which means there's no files in them, except /usr/share/doc/$PACKAGE/copyright and changelog.gz
16:17 jcamins So in order to rebuild Zebra you are running `sudo koha-rebuild-zebra koha`?
16:18 jcamins liw: do you have an example debian/rules file?
16:18 jcamins (for that)
16:18 mtompset No... I'm running UBUNTU. :)
16:19 mtompset -b -a -r
16:19 mtompset /usr
16:19 mtompset AH! I had to //
16:19 jcamins mtompset: okay, then why were you running koha-rebuild-zebra?
16:19 liw jcamins, "bzr branch env-liw.trunk" should give you something that works for me
16:19 mtompset /usr/share/koha/bin/migration_tools/
16:20 mtompset I'm not...
16:20 mtompset I'm saying the instructions in the FAQ are debian biased.
16:20 mtompset And that I read the script
16:20 jcamins mtompset: okay.
16:20 mtompset and that it remaps -full to ...
16:20 mtompset /usr/share/koha/bin/migrat​ion_tools/ -b -a -r
16:20 jcamins Right. -b -a -r is correct.
16:21 mtompset But -r is a FULL reindex.
16:21 jcamins liw: thanks!
16:21 mtompset Isn't -z supposed to be a partial reindex?
16:22 mtompset If I add something, shouldn't that get into the zebraqueue somehow, so that -z would pick it up?
16:22 jcamins Yes.
16:22 mtompset I'm not talking importing a batch, I'm talking manually adding.
16:23 jcamins Right.
16:23 mtompset Okay.... so it isn't.
16:23 mtompset How do I determine where the failure is?
16:23 jcamins You can check in the zebraqueue table, try and figure out when done is being set to 1.
16:24 mtompset Hmm... co-ordinate with the user an add entry... watch the zebraqueue table.
16:25 mtompset oh sucky!
16:25 mtompset I see some error logs.
16:26 mtompset Oops... should have included the referer part...
16:26 mtompset NOT.
16:27 jcamins You missed a few steps.
16:27 jcamins And, what version of Ubuntu?
16:27 jcamins mtompset: you are missing some dependencies.
16:27 jcamins Run -m
16:27 juan_sieira joined #koha
16:27 mtompset I don't think so...
16:27 mtompset I did a grep for use on the pl scripts and did a mass install.
16:28 mtompset I also did the dep check script.
16:28 jcamins And it said you had everything?
16:28 kf it looks like you are missing lingua snowball
16:28 kf or whatever that is called correctly
16:28 jcamins I think Lingua::Stem::Snowball is there, but one of its dependencies is missing.
16:29 mtompset Line 55 is part of the new() method.
16:32 jenkins_koha Starting build #739 for job Koha_master (previous build: SUCCESS)
16:33 mtompset C4::Search requires the snowball
16:37 mtompset I think I'll debug the problem later.
16:38 mtompset I think Snowball is being called with an undef parameter, and that causes things to get evil, because there are no undef checks.
16:41 wizzyrea weird, I run it on ubuntu and I don't have this problem
16:41 huginn` New commit(s) kohagit: Bug 8159: Fix error in kohastructure.sql <[…]3ca51cf9082ef4254> / Bug 7747 [FOLLOW-UP] Replace YUI autocomplete with jQueryUI <[…]50d71940d160b5819> / Bug 7747 - Replace YUI autocomplete with jQueryUI <[…]=koha.git;a=commi
16:41 wizzyrea but then again i have all of my dependencies.
16:42 slef I've been staring at this too long. When someone says classification number, is that items.fullcallnumber in Koha or something else?
16:42 wizzyrea did you check more -> about -> then click the "perl modules" tab
16:42 wizzyrea do you have anything missing?
16:42 jcamins slef: it depends, but *probably* something else.
16:43 slef jcamins: what would be your favourite bet?
16:44 jcamins I'd guess 082$a.
16:44 slef @marc 082 a
16:44 huginn` slef: Classification number  (Repeatable)
16:44 slef heh
16:44 jcamins Of course, it could be that they're using those as the fullcallnumber, too.
16:44 slef ok let me go look at what went in there before... thanks jcamins
16:44 jcamins You're welcome.
16:44 slef no they don't look like fullcallnumber to me... I'm trying to figure out what to put in fullcallnumber too
16:45 jcamins What do the number look like?
16:46 mtompset What's the difference between bold items and non-bold items, wizzyrea?
16:46 slef hehe. Examples include "371.9144 TOW" and "Reading age 6-9yrs. Interest level 7-10yrs"
16:46 mbalmer joined #koha
16:46 wizzyrea I think required for koha use, and required for specific function
16:46 wizzyrea for example
16:46 slef mbalmer?
16:46 wahanui mbalmer is DEVELOPERS DEVELOPERS DEVELOPERS!!!!!
16:46 slef mbalmer: was I talking to you about SIP a while ago?
16:47 mbalmer slef, yes?
16:47 mbalmer yes!
16:47 wizzyrea SMS::Send, you don't need for normal koha operation
16:47 mbalmer I will be in Edinburgh next week
16:47 wizzyrea it's not bold.
16:47 jcamins slef: okay, that's fullcallnumber.
16:47 mbalmer and wahanui is wrong.  that one is ballmer, with to l
16:48 slef mbalmer: do you want to take an hour or two out to do a sip3 teleconference with 3M?
16:48 mtompset Okay...
16:48 mtompset So what version of Lingua::Stem::Snowball do you have?
16:48 mbalmer sure.  in edinburgh of before?
16:48 wizzyrea .0952
16:48 jcamins slef: that's probably fullcallnumber, and you need to extract the numeric bit to stick in 082$a.
16:49 mtompset As do I... I noticed it uses Carp and Exporter.
16:49 mtompset Do you know what versions you have of those?
16:49 wizzyrea basically, if it's red and says "not installed"
16:49 wizzyrea then you have a problem.
16:49 mtompset All mine are black.
16:50 mtompset Most are bold.
16:50 mtompset Can you tell me your versions of Carp and Exporter?
16:51 mtompset Because line 55 has $self->_derive_stemmer
16:51 mtompset And I can't find the definition of _derive_stemmer in the snowball.
16:51 mtompset So, I figure it must be in Carp or Exporter
16:51 slef mbalmer: it'd be in edinburgh. I can forward you the invitation email. It's something silly like 3pm on the 5th June.
16:51 slef mbalmer: I can't do it for various reasons, but I didn't know if it would interest you. No worries if you would rather pay attention to conference.
16:51 slef mbalmer: message me your email address if you'd like me to forward it.
16:51 slef jcamins: yummy :-/
16:51 wizzyrea
16:52 slef jcamins: of course, the list of biblionumber and these classifications is yet another file...
16:52 mtompset Carp and Exporter aren't listed there.
16:52 mtompset You have to look manually.
16:53 jcamins slef: awesome!
16:53 mbalmer slef, I will only join the event on june 6, so june 5 3pm I think I could attend from .ch.  3pm which timezone?
16:53 wizzyrea CGI::Carp is
16:54 mtompset not CGI::Carp
16:54 wizzyrea then it's not listed
16:54 mtompset Snowball says Carp and Exporter.
16:54 wizzyrea sounds like you've got it all figured out.
16:54 slef mbalmer: 3pm UK I think.  The email gives it in US Eastern IIRC.
16:54 mtompset That's why i'm asking you what versions you have.
16:55 mtompset Perhaps newer versions break it.
16:55 mbalmer slef, that sounds like I could be available.  Thanks for letting me know about it, btw!
16:56 wizzyrea lingua probably has it's own dependencies that you are missing. they might not be listed in the koha dependencies.
16:57 mtompset Yes.... and they are Carp and Exporter.
16:57 mtompset I'm looking at the code.
16:57 mtompset I would like to know what versions you have.
17:00 Oak joined #koha
17:02 mtompset Well, I'm off.
17:02 mtompset Thanks for the help and suggestions.
17:02 mtompset Too bad it didn't solve everything, but it gave me some ideas.
17:05 oleonard mtompset: I have a standard install of Ubuntu 12.04 and a by-the-book installation of Koha and I don't have a problem with Snowball. This suggests a problem with dependencies on your machine.
17:08 mtompset I agree.
17:08 mtompset But finding them is going to be a pain.
17:08 zioha joined #koha
17:08 mtompset I don't want to reinstall from scratch.
17:09 mtompset Not when the system is being used to get the data current before going live.
17:09 mtompset Anyways... have a good day (24 hour period) everyone.
17:13 schuster joined #koha
17:13 slef "Your PayPal Account Access Has Been Restored"
17:13 schuster wizzyrea_away you back?
17:14 jcamins Woohoo!
17:14 * jcamins throws a Paypal party.
17:15 slef jcamins: TimeWorked: 262 minutes
17:17 * liw runs: gedit obnam-1.0-announcement.mdwn
17:17 liw egh, sorry, wrong channel
17:18 jcamins Ooh, obnam 1.0 is released? Cool!
17:18 liw jcamins, not until tomorrow, I just want to draft the announcement now
17:18 * Oak googles obnam
17:19 kf slef: yay!
17:19 Oak slef++
17:19 Oak stop sulking now
17:20 * Oak gives slef ice cream
17:20 slef Oak: when we get the money out...
17:21 Oak ah yes
17:21 slef I don't think that was a scam email but... ;)
17:21 Oak let's put the ice cream back in the fridge then
17:21 Oak :) hm
17:21 slef I'll do that in a mo
17:22 kf slef++ :)
17:23 Oak kf time to go home
17:24 kf I know, but still have to do some things
17:24 Oak things will never end, you know
17:25 jcamins kf: Oak is right about that.
17:25 kf 2 weeks vacation starting next week
17:25 Oak :)
17:25 Oak fine, you win
17:25 mbalmer woa
17:26 jenkins_koha Project Koha_master build #739: UNSTABLE in 53 min: http://jenkins.koha-community.[…]/Koha_master/739/
17:26 jenkins_koha * kyle: Bug 8140 - [SIGNED-OFF] Error when exporting label xml
17:26 jenkins_koha * oleonard: Bug 7747 - Replace YUI autocomplete with jQueryUI
17:26 jenkins_koha * oleonard: Bug 7747 [FOLLOW-UP] Replace YUI autocomplete with jQueryUI
17:26 jenkins_koha * jcamins: Bug 8159: Fix error in kohastructure.sql
17:26 huginn` Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=8140 blocker, P5 - low, ---, kyle.m.hall, Pushed to Master , Error when exporting label xml
17:26 mbalmer is that deserved, kf ;) ?
17:26 huginn` Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=7747 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, Pushed to Stable , Replace YUI autocomplete with jQueryUI
17:26 huginn` Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=8159 critical, P5 - low, ---, jcamins, Pushed to Master , Error in kohastructure.sql
17:27 jcamins What do you mean, Jenkins build became unstable?
17:28 kf mbalmer: deserved or not, I need one :)
17:28 mbalmer heh...;)
17:31 * magnuse discovers "prove -m -Q --formatter=TAP::Formatter::HTML"
17:35 francharb` joined #koha
17:40 kf magnuse: what does that do?
17:45 Oak kf it sends people home who work too much
17:45 magnuse kf: formatts the output of prove nicely as an html page
17:46 Oak and that too
17:46 Oak of course
17:48 kf lol
17:48 kf Oak++ .)
17:49 Oak :)
17:59 sekjal joined #koha
18:00 mtompset joined #koha
18:00 mtompset I couldn't sleep knowing there was a bug.
18:00 mtompset I found it!
18:00 mtompset There's a typo in
18:01 mtompset Hello?
18:01 mtompset Is there where I mail one of the lists and tell them about it?
18:02 jcamins Well, first you have to confirm that it hasn't already been fixed.
18:02 jwagner Check bugzilla to be sure it hasn't already been reported, and then create a bug report for it
18:02 jwagner
18:02 jcamins If it hasn't been, you report a bug for it.
18:05 mtompset I've got 3.8.1 -- 3.8.5 is the most current?
18:05 jcamins 3.8.1 is the most current on the 3.8.x line, and 3.6.5 is the most current on the 3.6.x line.
18:05 jcamins mtompset: weren't you on 3.6.3 about an hour ago?
18:05 wizzyrea_away schuster - back now
18:05 mtompset I have two versions.
18:05 mtompset 3.6.3 is the one being used.
18:06 mtompset I checked 3.8.1 which I'm tinkering with on the side.
18:06 mtompset They both have the same bug
18:07 mtompset To think a tiny \ can make a big difference!
18:07 mtompset If you go to Cataloguing.
18:07 mtompset Then do a search.
18:08 mtompset You will trigger the error in the error log.
18:08 mtompset But all the other searches don't trigger the error.
18:08 mtompset Only the search from Cataloguing.
18:08 wizzyrea wait what's the actual problem
18:09 wizzyrea the first question?
18:09 wahanui "What are you trying to do?"  "What is the goal?" or "What problem are you experiencing?"
18:09 mtompset No apparent problem.
18:09 mtompset My goal is to stop error messages from filling the error log.
18:09 wizzyrea oh, that's noble.
18:09 wizzyrea (seriously :))
18:09 mtompset Because the search appears to work for the end user.
18:10 mtompset buildQuery(\@operators,\@operands,\@in​dexes,@limits,\@sort_by,undef,undef);
18:10 mtompset See the @limits? There's no \ on it.
18:11 mtompset my @operands  = $operands  ? @$operands  : ();     my @limits    = $limits    ? @$limits    : ();     my @sort_by   = $sort_by   ? @$sort_by   : ();
18:11 * wizzyrea checks that on her 3.9 system… sec
18:11 mtompset Looks ugly, but as you can see the buildQuert code treats indexes, limits, and sort_by the same.
18:12 mtompset buildQuery...
18:12 jcamins mtompset: buildQuery is a rather horrifying routine, alas.
18:12 wizzyrea what was the error you were seeing
18:12 mtompset The snowball one.
18:12 * wizzyrea does not get that one
18:13 wizzyrea I do however get this one: [Thu May 31 13:25:02 2012] [error] [client] [Thu May 31 13:25:02 2012] Illegal date specified (year = 2007, month = 7, day = 00) at /home/liz/kohaclone/C4/ line 1656, referer: http://koha-staff.lan.nekls.or[…]guing/
18:13 wizzyrea but the search works.
18:13 wizzyrea that *could* be bad data.
18:14 mtompset Really? Maybe they fixed it in a later version.
18:14 wizzyrea well this is juuuuust beyond 3.8.1
18:14 wizzyrea I highly doubt it.
18:14 mtompset I'll bug report it.
18:14 wizzyrea probably the best plan
18:14 mtompset I did a search for
18:14 mtompset Saw only 7 bugs.
18:15 wizzyrea mm, try cataloging search
18:15 wizzyrea too.
18:16 mtompset Okay.... I guess the person might not have narrowed it down to
18:17 wizzyrea probably not - we get all levels of users reporting bugs.
18:17 wizzyrea (it is both glorious and occasionally frustrating)
18:17 wizzyrea but we deal :)
18:17 slef @query Illegal date specified
18:17 huginn` slef: No results for "Illegal date specified."
18:18 wizzyrea interestingly, i also get this one; [Thu May 31 13:31:15 2012] [error] [client] [Thu May 31 13:31:15 2012] Use of uninitialized value in numeric eq (==) at /home/liz/kohaclone/C4/ line 249., referer: http://koha-staff.lan.nekls.or[…].pl?
18:18 wizzyrea not even the same thing!
18:18 wizzyrea and the other error didn't recur.
18:19 mtompset Which probably ties to the same bug...
18:19 wizzyrea different query
18:19 slef @query Use of uninitialized value in numeric eq
18:19 huginn` slef: No results for "Use of uninitialized value in numeric eq."
18:19 slef huginn`: you're a bit useless today.
18:19 huginn` slef: downloading the Perl source
18:21 mtompset wizzyrea, could you take a look at /usr/share/koha/intranet/cgi​-bin/cataloguing/ and tell me if there is a \ on the @limits?
18:21 wizzyrea yep
18:21 mtompset line 75
18:22 wizzyrea no slash
18:22 jcamins Bah. I stuck the apt repo on an old VPS, and apparently a lot of people (including me) decided to hit it at the same time, bringing it down.
18:23 wizzyrea putting it in doesn't make the error go away
18:23 sekjal joined #koha
18:24 slef mtompset: line 1038 of /usr/share/koha/lib/C4/ does suggest it should have a \ I think
18:24 jcamins Oh, it certainly needs the \.
18:25 slef mtompset: without it, the rest of the parameters to buildQuery will be ignored IIRC
18:25 mtompset It will dereference incorrectly.
18:26 mtompset Perhaps...
18:26 mtompset Anyways...
18:26 mtompset It solves one thing, but not what I was hoping for yet.
18:28 Oak but still
18:28 Oak mtompset++
18:28 Oak jcamins, is it up now?
18:29 mtompset Oh sucky! I have to register for bugzilla too?!
18:29 kf yes
18:29 kf bye all :)
18:29 Oak finally
18:29 jcamins Oak: it was briefly.
18:29 Oak bye kf
18:29 jcamins Then I think it went back down.
18:29 wizzyrea later kf
18:29 kf Oak: :P
18:29 Oak hmm.
18:30 kf left #koha
18:30 wizzyrea I'm really wondering if these errors, at least the date one
18:30 wizzyrea I think it's bad data.
18:30 wizzyrea bc it only happens on one specific query.
18:31 wizzyrea yep, I found the offending record.
18:31 wizzyrea also - jcamins- this may interest you
18:31 wizzyrea [Thu May 31 13:42:11 2012] [error] [client] [Thu May 31 13:42:11 2012] Use of uninitialized value $countanalytics in numeric gt (>) at /home/liz/kohaclone/catalogue/ line 256., referer: http://koha-staff.lan.nekls.or[…]?biblionumber=915
18:32 jcamins wizzyrea: a patch was submitted for that.
18:32 wizzyrea k
18:32 wizzyrea just checking.
18:32 Oak me go now. sleep time.
18:32 Oak wizzyrea++
18:32 Oak jcamins++
18:34 wizzyrea pf I didn't do anything
18:34 slef wahanui: manual
18:34 wahanui manual is at
18:37 mtompset is wahanui a bot?
18:38 jcamins Yup.
18:38 mtompset Bug 8172 added. :)
18:38 wizzyrea a pretty clever one.
18:38 huginn` Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=8172 major, P5 - low, ---, gmcharlt, NEW , Missing dereference marker for buildQuery parameter in
18:41 mtompset Is huginn` a bot too?
18:41 sekjal yup
18:42 * sekjal is coding in a bar again… everyone watch out!
18:42 wizzyrea LOOKOUT
18:43 slef sekjal: | is a pipe, not a bar
18:43 slef wahanui: bots?
18:43 wahanui bots are listed at
18:43 slef wahanui: ta
18:43 wahanui slef: i'm not following you...
18:44 slef wahanui: thank you
18:44 wahanui slef: sure thing
18:44 slef wahanui: como Nicholas Cage en Leaving Las Vegas...
18:44 wahanui slef: what?
18:44 slef wahanui: idiot
18:44 wahanui slef: huh?
18:45 slef wahanui: die!
18:45 wahanui errrrgh arrrrgh stop it that tickles a bit!
18:48 magnuse lol
18:49 wizzyrea he's almost sentient.
18:50 jcamins #introduction
18:50 jcamins #introductions
18:50 jcamins #topic Introductions
18:50 wahanui #info wahanui, a bot that has become sentient
18:50 jcamins ^^ see.
18:50 wizzyrea oh, no almost about it. :)
18:52 sekjal does anyone recall the latest verdict on management of Lists belonging to deleted users?
18:52 sekjal I believe they can only be dealt with by the Koha root user… is that true?
18:53 jcamins sekjal: right now, yes.
18:53 sekjal great, thanks jcamins
18:53 jcamins sekjal: marcelr's been fixing the list permissions slowly but surely to fix that, though.
18:53 sekjal working on bug 8164, and that's one of the areas where testing will be needed
18:53 huginn` Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=8164 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, gmcharlt, NEW , Replace IFNULL() with COALESCE() in all database calls
18:59 cait joined #koha
18:59 mbalmer joined #koha
19:05 mtompset Goodbye, everyone. Talk with you later.
19:08 mbalmer joined #koha
19:09 sekjal argh!  Why is there a Unicode character for "pile of poo", but not for a shopping cart?!
19:10 jcamins lol
19:10 cait lobby?
19:10 mbalmer its the same.
19:22 sekjal … is "Save to your lists" broken on ?
19:22 sekjal I'm getting a 404
19:22 jcamins sekjal: it wasn't when I tested marcelr's patch yesterdayish.
19:22 sekjal hmmm… could just by my config, I suppose
19:22 sekjal I'm on a pretty stark test DB
19:25 sekjal hmmm… it's not the most recent change to
19:25 jcamins sekjal: I'm not sure if the patch was pushed.
19:25 jcamins (yet)
19:26 sekjal not yet
19:26 sekjal there was one circ March 22
19:26 sekjal that's not it
19:26 sekjal ah, well.  time to go
19:26 sekjal later, all!
19:26 sekjal left #koha
19:40 rangi Morning
19:40 cait morning rangi :)
19:41 wajasu joined #koha
19:43 wizzyrea peeps - please remember to check on your stuff in failed qa
19:43 wizzyrea there's lots of good stuff in there that needs to get in
19:44 rangi Can u mail koha-devel
19:45 rangi I suspect this is the choir in here :)
19:45 hdl joined #koha
19:46 wizzyrea yes. I will do that
19:48 talljoy1 joined #koha
19:48 rangi Thanks
19:48 wajasu i'm working on a script that builds a libvirt based vm (kvm in my case) for debiansqueeze. as long as you have a bridge already configured to the internet, it will build debiansqueeze(standard+mysql-s​erver+mysql-client+web-server) with no prompts using a preseed.cfg. I'm going to add koha's deb, and later git.  the image can be reused as a base image, or hopefully for one-off patch work.
19:49 wizzyrea oo, cool.
19:52 cait wizzyrea++ :)
19:53 wizzyrea what?!
19:53 wizzyrea what'd I do
19:56 cait write a good mail? :)
19:56 wajasu then maybe one could grab the image, boot it, sync with git master, make fix, test, make git commit, run a kohapatch script to prepare the patch and instruct on how to a) push to bug report, b) send to list serv,  etc,  also, a script could pull and patch the vm just like does.
19:56 cait having a lovely signature? "I geek koha"? being awesome?
19:56 wizzyrea hehe
19:56 wizzyrea well thank you :)
19:58 rangi wasaju++
20:01 rangi slef: around?
20:01 slef rangi: momentarily, bbi30 after that
20:04 rangi Get my email?
20:05 slef rangi: get my reply?
20:05 slef (oonly just sent)
20:05 rangi Cool will look
20:07 rangi Sweet ill email them back when I get to work thanks
20:27 mtate joined #koha
20:31 kathryn joined #koha
20:31 rangi morning kathryn
20:32 kathryn morning rangi :)
20:32 kathryn and morning all
20:33 Elay joined #koha
20:33 Elay Wow. I'm finally here. Sorry for the interruption.
20:34 rangi heya Elay :)
20:34 rangi Elay = lenora .. say hi everyone who is still awake :)
20:34 * rangi is chris c
20:34 Elay I'm at the StreamNet Library, Portland, Oregon, U.S.
20:34 jcamins Hi Elay.
20:34 rangi now you are on irc, you can join us for meetings and stuff in the future if you want too :)
20:35 Elay what, participate?
20:35 rangi hehe
20:35 rangi it's a crazy concept!
20:35 Elay Can I just say that I LOVE Koha?
20:36 cait hi Elay
20:36 rangi you can stay then :)
20:36 cait and morning kathryn
20:36 cait :)
20:36 Elay And now, I want to learn to code so I can play even more...
20:36 Elay Hi, cait & jcamins
20:37 rangi got your email Elay
20:37 Elay My family all code in various languages, except Perl.
20:37 Elay So, I'm really just giving in. Resistance is futile.
20:37 rangi so the file you want to look at is C4/
20:38 Elay Hm.
20:38 rangi now the trick is, you use windows eh?
20:38 rangi hmm darn owen has gone home
20:38 Elay I've got putty.
20:38 rangi ohh cool
20:38 Elay My tech support person is weaning me off Windows to linux
20:38 rangi good person
20:38 Elay Trick is to get to where I need to be
20:39 rangi friends don't let friends use proprietary software ;-)
20:39 Elay Love that. I'm putting that on my favorite quotes.
20:39 rangi so, do you know if on your linux box that you can connect to with putty, if there is a git checkout of koha?
20:40 * kathryn waves at cait :)
20:40 Elay I connect to my server via Putty
20:40 chris_n` joined #koha
20:40 rangi cool
20:40 Elay so, question is, I have command prompt, how to I get to directory (DOS days are so far gone)
20:41 Elay I know that ages me.
20:41 rangi so we could edit the patch in situ on the server, but then a plague of sysadmins would reign fire down on me for telling you to do that
20:41 rangi rain
20:41 rangi even
20:41 rangi Elay: cd
20:41 Elay so would my sysadmin
20:41 rangi cd /where/i/want/to/go
20:42 Elay ls gives me nothing, so I have no directories?
20:43 Elay dir gives me
20:43 rangi ls
20:43 Elay bin  dev etc initrd.img lost+found mnt proc sbin srv temp var
20:43 rangi not dir
20:43 Elay boot Docs home lib media opt root selinux sys usr vmlinuz
20:43 rangi well dir might work if someone has been nice to you, and aliased it :)
20:43 rangi what user to do you login as?
20:44 Elay whatever sysadmin gave me
20:44 rangi ahh
20:44 Elay damn, I'm lame
20:44 rangi type
20:44 rangi whoami
20:44 rangi then
20:44 rangi pwd
20:44 rangi pwd will tell where you are
20:45 chris_n` joined #koha
20:45 Elay oftl
20:45 Elay at /home/oftl
20:46 Elay Can I download the software to a local drive rather than trying to retrieve from server?
20:47 rangi yep
20:48 rangi thats why i was wanting to see if owen was around, he uses git in windows .. i don't know how to do that im afraid
20:48 jcamins rangi: he does?
20:48 jcamins He's a saint!
20:48 rangi well maybe not anymore, he did once tho
20:48 Elay can't I put in a partition and split my drive for a linux side or is that way too hard?
20:49 rangi oh, you could put a linux virtualmachine on
20:49 rangi thats what a lot of people do
20:49 rangi chris_n: do you do that?
20:50 rangi im pretty much useless for anything to do with windows im afraid
20:50 rangi actually cait does i think
20:50 cait I do what? :)
20:51 cait we are using windows at work, so I have a virtualbox with koha there
20:51 rangi have a linux virtual machine on linux
20:51 jcamins I'd recommend Virtualbox.
20:51 rangi that
20:51 jcamins That's how cait does it.
20:51 cait well... if cait is not messing it up... like she did yesterday :(
20:51 cait but that was my fault, it used to work pretty nicely
20:51 rangi
20:52 * jcamins successfully created a Koha test AMI for himself.
20:52 Elay Windows hosts?
20:53 cait windows is the host
20:53 cait and linux will be the guest :)
20:55 Elay Gotcha
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21:09 jcamins The problem is probably Ubuntu 12.04, not user error.
21:09 jcamins Unfortunately, that's the extent of my wisdom.
21:09 rangi annoying
21:10 jcamins Yeah. I can't really offer that as "advice" on the mailing list.
21:18 Brooke joined #koha
21:19 Elay joined #koha
21:20 Elay Whoops. VirtualMachine cut off some of my connections on install.
21:20 rangi helpful of it :)
21:20 cait ah sorry, I should have warned you
21:20 Elay eh, one of those things
21:21 cait next you should download your linux of choice
21:21 Elay
21:21 jcamins Yes.
21:22 jcamins Debian is a very good choice.
21:22 cait I was using ubuntu in the past, but I think debian would be a good choice
21:22 rangi debian squeeze would be mine
21:22 * jcamins is on an anti-Ubuntu kick.
21:22 cait as I have to start over again anyway... I might try debian too :)
21:22 Elay I think sysadmin prefers debian squeeze as welll
21:22 rangi squeeze is rock solid
21:23 * jcamins has been setting up Squeeze servers all day.
21:24 jcamins We're on number... six? Seven? I last cont.
21:24 jcamins *count
21:25 wizzyrea has anyone ever gotten the SIP tests to run?
21:25 wizzyrea I'm trying to get them to, but I am failing. Miserably.
21:25 Elay i386?
21:25 wizzyrea is the target computer 32 bit or 64?
21:25 jcamins wizzyrea: I have, but I don't remember what I did.
21:26 wizzyrea curses.
21:26 Elay xp
21:26 wizzyrea that means it's me.
21:26 jcamins wizzyrea: it took a lot of work.
21:26 Elay lame, argh, I have fallen so far behind the friggin' curve
21:26 jcamins Elay: how much memory does it have?
21:27 Elay RAM is 3072
21:28 Elay hard drive is 150 GB
21:28 jcamins Elay: in that case you might as well go with i386.
21:28 Elay oh, good. I guessed right!
21:28 * jcamins always uses amd64, but your computer is old enough that it might not be 64-bit.
21:29 Elay is 2 yo. But can't upgrade until 3.
21:29 jcamins And it's running XP? I thought XP was a 9yo OS.
21:29 jcamins Anyway, i386 will work just fine. :)
21:30 * jcamins hasn't used Windows in a very, very long time.
21:30 jcamins Probably got XP confused with something else.
21:30 rangi jcamins: vista sucked so much
21:30 rangi lots of ppl just stayed with xp
21:30 wizzyrea ^^
21:30 Elay I skipped right over Vista.
21:31 rangi yeah xp, until windows 7
21:31 Elay But got DH a computer with it, partially as revenge
21:31 Elay Was very cruel, I know
21:31 rangi pretty much every IT dept i know did that
21:31 Elay cuz I broke my home laptop and now have to share his computer.
21:31 rangi :)
21:31 * wizzyrea imagines elay rubbing his/her hands together evilly
21:31 Elay karma sucks
21:31 wahanui sucks has neutral karma
21:31 Elay her
21:32 rangi i install linux on every computer i touch, fair warning if we ever meet at kohacon again :)
21:32 wizzyrea excellent, we can practice our evil laughs together.
21:32 Elay will already be done on my new laptop
21:33 * jcamins restores a 2.8GB Koha database.
21:33 Elay so, while we're waiting for download...should I go large (17") or smaller for new laptop?
21:34 Elay Have an android tablet already. Yes, I have bought into the Don't Be Evil Empire.
21:34 wizzyrea what are you going to use it for?
21:34 Elay website development
21:34 Elay coding if I ever get to learn Perl...
21:34 wizzyrea get a middle sized one.
21:34 wizzyrea travel a lot/
21:34 wizzyrea ?
21:35 Elay yes, but generally won't be doing much web or code while traveling
21:35 Elay so have tablet for travel.
21:35 wizzyrea so this laptop, will it sit on your lap much?
21:35 Elay all the time, have a very comfy recliner
21:35 wizzyrea get a middle sized one.
21:35 wizzyrea :)
21:35 wizzyrea 14 or 15
21:35 wahanui 15
21:36 rangi get a one
21:36 rangi :)
21:36 ibeardslee oh, and they have an NZ company now
21:36 rangi they do :)
21:37 jcamins Ooh. They have 16GB laptops.
21:37 rangi eythian has one jcamins
21:38 rangi mine is only a paltry 8GB
21:38 rangi i really like it tho
21:38 * jcamins has 8GB in his laptop.
21:38 * wizzyrea too
21:38 jcamins Don't get me wrong, I'm very happy with the laptop.
21:38 jcamins But, there are days.
21:38 rangi i have
21:38 rangi with debian squeeze and 8 gig
21:38 jcamins Like today. When I have 67MB of RAM free.
21:38 rangi its very nice
21:39 * cait has 8 too
21:39 jcamins (and 3GB swapped out, darn it)
21:39 jcamins Okay, but do they sell to the US?
21:39 ibeardslee yes
21:39 jcamins (not that I'm buying a laptop, I'm just curious)
21:40 jcamins Their website is a bit too minimalistic for my taste.
21:40 ibeardslee rangi and I are just excited that they are setting up shop in NZ, so we can now buy linux laptops
21:40 jcamins Oh, they're based in Berkeley.
21:40 Elay ok, Debian is done downloading
21:41 jcamins Wow. Their prices are kind of remarkable.
21:44 Elay What kind of disk do I want to create?
21:44 Elay VDI, VMDK, VHD, HDD
21:45 cait I think I used what was suggested, but someone might have better advice
21:46 talljoy joined #koha
21:46 jcamins I just use the default.
21:49 * jcamins realizes that he should have put home on a different volume.
21:49 jcamins Too late, of course.
21:52 ago43 joined #koha
21:54 Elay ok. time for me to go for today
21:54 Elay will work on the virtual machine later
21:55 rangi cool
22:08 rangi oh hey
22:08 rangi david nind is editing the wiki
22:08 rangi so it must be working for new users again
22:08 rangi[…]ase_Announcements  <-- good idea
22:19 jcamins Hey, is there any reason that Plack couldn't be chrooted? It seems to me that the web server does not need access to any (Koha-specific) files other than koha-conf.xml and /usr/share/koha.
22:20 cjh it would also need access to all the perl modules, but otherwise I cant think of any reason why not
22:21 rangi yeah chrooted should work
22:23 jcamins Seems to me like that might be a good idea.
22:23 rangi its not a bad idea
22:27 slef yengh... what do I need to send speakers? File formats, screen size, a link to the programme and a see-you-soon?
22:29 rangi yeah sounds good
22:29 rangi slef: mine is just html/javascript so should work on anything
22:30 rangi ill have my laptop, but am happy to just transfer it to the presentation machine too
22:33 * jcamins will probably record a video, so that there's a handout of sorts.
22:34 cjh are the presentations being recorded?
22:37 slef cjh: yes but no promises yet on quality, sadly
22:37 cjh worst case having access to the slides would work as well
22:38 slef if we can get the wifi up and there's enough power, I may be able to stream live
22:39 cjh so I can watch the presentations in my sleep )
22:39 cjh that should
22:39 cjh sorry a bird is typing on my keyboard... that should've been a :)
22:39 slef
22:39 slef is where it would be
22:40 cjh thanks :)
22:40 slef hey, it may all be different
22:40 slef I may be misleading you, getting my lies in early
22:43 eythian I'll probably be plugging my laptop in, especially for the hackfest part.
22:43 eythian I assume we'll have wifi for that, otherwise things won't work so well.
22:44 * eythian needs to write the hackfest part still
22:44 rangi oh yeah i meant just the kohacon bit
22:44 rangi and yeah me too
22:44 eythian I think that'll be today and tomorrow.
22:47 rangi actually i need to rejig my main talk a bit
22:47 eythian Mine needs review, as it's been a few days since I finished it.
22:47 eythian So I need to look at it fresh
22:53 slef I'm worried that we'll be bugfixing the wifi but it wouldn't be the first conference that's happened at.
22:54 slef but that's just me looking on the dark side again.
22:54 rangi :) worst comes to worst I can tether
22:55 slef it irritates me when I have to tether because the wifi is so obnoxious
22:55 slef but it happens a lot
22:55 rangi *nod*
22:55 slef it's like where I'm sat now
22:56 rangi holy crap
22:56 rangi how long has the save bar floated in the marc editor?
22:56 slef I'm on 3G dongle because it's cheaper than the wifi :-/
22:56 rangi that's awesome!
22:56 slef since the blue 3.8 UI changes I think
22:56 * rangi likes
22:56 rangi having to scroll back to the top was a pet peeve
22:57 jcamins rangi: no, much longer.
22:58 slef page down pages down more than a page, though... not a big problem in the marc editor though, as most people don
22:58 slef t jump through that fast.
22:58 slef because the bit obscured by the floating bar isn't taken off of page-down distance by firefox
22:59 eythian definitely in 3.6
22:59 eythian slef: what sort of data plans will a prepay SIM card have there?
23:00 jcamins eythian: any chance I could persuade you to set up an oldstable dist during the hackfest? :)
23:00 eythian jcamins: it seems like a plausible thing for me to do :)
23:00 eythian also larsw will be there to help me :)
23:00 eythian liw rather
23:01 jcamins :)
23:02 rangi speaking of which, after i have had a refresher of his tutorial i plan to run one here
23:03 eythian cool
23:04 jcamins I _really_ want that one to be recorded.
23:04 rangi :)
23:04 eythian jcamins: you could just come to Edinburgh you know. It's not far from where you are.
23:04 eythian relatively speaking.
23:04 eythian It's the same hemisphere even
23:05 jcamins lol
23:10 rangi bug 8171 confuses me
23:10 huginn` Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=8171 normal, P5 - low, ---, gmcharlt, NEW , Improper escaping of quotes during z39.50 queries leads to potential malicious code execution
23:11 slef eythian: prepay for data only or in a phone?
23:12 eythian slef: phone
23:12 slef eythian: no clue, sorry. Have you tried the link on the wiki? If it doesn't help, I can ask around.
23:12 slef wahanui: kohacon12?
23:12 wahanui kohacon12 is[…]ategory:KohaCon12 or Conference Tue 5 June 2012 to Thu 7th, Hackfest Sat 9th June-Mon 11th June
23:12 Irma joined #koha
23:13 slef eythian: it's on the summary page
23:13 eythian slef: no, it's OK. I was just wondering if you knew off the top of your head
23:13 eythian rangi: that bug is totally wrong
23:13 eythian I think the person doesn't know perl.
23:13 eythian (well, the quotes not working thing may be correct, but the rest of it not so much)
23:13 rangi yeah
23:14 slef eythian: looks like £10/Gb if you do it right, similar to prepay data-only, actually.
23:14 rangi updating now
23:14 slef (o2 web bolt-on)
23:15 eythian slef: that sounds ideal
23:15 slef "The Works"
23:15 eythian more expensive than what I pay here, oddly enough :)
23:16 slef for prepay?
23:16 eythian but not terribly so
23:16 eythian not for prepay
23:16 eythian I have some bizarre non-stop promo plan
23:16 slef you get gouged on prepay
23:16 rangi yeah we sure do
23:16 eythian 3GB/mo for NZ$40
23:16 eythian near enough to £20
23:16 slef heh I meant in the UK but never mind
23:16 eythian but it's not supposed to exist
23:20 slef coo... looks like o2 and 3 are cheapest... interesting to know
23:21 slef I think for customer service vodafone = t-mobile > o2 > 3 > orange
23:22 slef hmmm  Tesco £7.50 for 1Gb for one month
23:22 slef but they're a bad company
23:23 slef - Every Little Hurts
23:24 slef bbl
23:26 melia left #koha
23:33 papa joined #koha
23:39 Oak joined #koha
23:52 * Oak goes back to sleep

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