| Time |
S |
Nick |
Message |
| 08:50 |
|
|
logbot_backup joined #koha |
| 08:55 |
|
magnus |
"Conditions: Smoke"? Sounds unpleasant? |
| 08:56 |
|
magnus |
the bots are back in #koha |
| 09:01 |
|
kmkale |
magnus: its always smokey in Mumbai. Way too many vehicles |
| 09:01 |
|
magnus |
kmkale: ouch. You should have some of our wind |
| 09:09 |
|
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kf joined #koha |
| 09:09 |
|
kf |
back |
| 09:11 |
|
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kmkale left #koha |
| 09:11 |
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kmkale joined #koha |
| 09:12 |
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francharb left #koha |
| 09:34 |
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Irinie joined #koha |
| 09:34 |
|
Irinie |
Hi |
| 09:34 |
|
kmkale |
@seen jdavidb |
| 09:34 |
|
munin |
kmkale: jdavidb was last seen in #koha 21 hours, 30 minutes, and 10 seconds ago: * jdavidb makes a note on the recipe card: "jwagner approves." |
| 09:35 |
|
Irinie |
I want to ask about the latest version of koha, chris told me about 3.0.5. but the I found only Version 3.0.2 - June 04, 2009 on the koha site?? |
| 09:36 |
|
kmkale |
koha-community.org |
| 09:37 |
|
hdl_laptop |
chris around ? |
| 09:37 |
|
hdl_laptop |
hi kmkale |
| 09:38 |
|
kmkale |
hi hdl_laptop |
| 09:38 |
|
kf |
Irinie: koha-community.org is the new community web site, you can download 3.0.5 there |
| 09:38 |
|
kf |
hi hdl_laptop |
| 09:38 |
|
hdl_laptop |
hi kf |
| 09:39 |
|
hdl_laptop |
how are you ? |
| 09:39 |
|
Amit_G |
heya hdl_laptop |
| 09:39 |
|
hdl_laptop |
hi Amit_G |
| 09:39 |
|
kf |
hdl_laptop: fine with a long todo list :) |
| 09:39 |
|
kf |
and you? |
| 09:39 |
|
hdl_laptop |
hehe same for me. |
| 09:40 |
|
Amit_G |
@seen chris |
| 09:40 |
|
munin |
Amit_G: chris was last seen in #koha 56 minutes and 42 seconds ago: <chris> evening |
| 09:40 |
|
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reed joined #koha |
| 09:40 |
|
hdl_laptop |
How was your presentation ? |
| 09:40 |
|
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reed left #koha |
| 09:40 |
|
hdl_laptop |
Have you had any feedback ? |
| 09:44 |
|
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francharb joined #koha |
| 09:44 |
|
chris |
yep hdl_laptop |
| 09:53 |
|
chris |
http://wiki.koha-community.org[…].php/IRC_Meetings |
| 09:53 |
|
chris |
ive been writing stuff on the new wiki |
| 09:57 |
|
kmkale |
I am getting a git error on git.koha-community.org |
| 09:57 |
|
kmkale |
git clone git://git.koha-community.org/pub/scm/koha.git kohaclone |
| 09:57 |
|
kmkale |
Initialized empty Git repository in /home/kalibindia/kohaclone/.git/ |
| 09:57 |
|
kmkale |
fatal: The remote end hung up unexpectedly |
| 09:57 |
|
kmkale |
fetch-pack from 'git://git.koha-community.org/pub/scm/koha.git' failed. |
| 09:57 |
|
chris |
yeah thts not the url to use |
| 09:58 |
|
kmkale |
but same command run against git.koha.org works |
| 09:58 |
|
chris |
http://wiki.koha-community.org[…]Public_Repository |
| 09:58 |
|
kmkale |
chris++ |
| 09:58 |
|
chris |
yes but its not in pub/scm on koha-community |
| 10:00 |
|
|
Irinie left #koha |
| 10:00 |
|
kmkale |
OK. getting stuff now |
| 10:02 |
|
chris |
cool |
| 10:11 |
|
hdl_laptop |
chris : I wanted to know why you had chosen to do so when you did FCGI |
| 10:12 |
|
hdl_laptop |
only to get a quick POC ? |
| 10:12 |
|
chris |
i didnt use FCGI |
| 10:12 |
|
chris |
i used FCGI::Async |
| 10:13 |
|
chris |
because i wanted to see how it performed |
| 10:14 |
|
hdl_laptop |
But you encapsulated CGI in FCGI, which is just relaying the problem. |
| 10:14 |
|
chris |
the problem is apache |
| 10:15 |
|
hdl_laptop |
problem is also CGI |
| 10:15 |
|
chris |
cgi encapsulated by fcgi outperforms apache2 by a huge amount |
| 10:16 |
|
chris |
plack is a lot faster still |
| 10:16 |
|
chris |
881 pages served in a minute |
| 10:21 |
|
chris_n |
g'morning |
| 10:23 |
|
chris_n |
nice wiki work chris |
| 10:24 |
|
chris |
morning chris_n |
| 10:29 |
|
chris |
hdl_laptop: i also fixed opac-detail.pl so it works with plack |
| 10:30 |
|
hdl_laptop |
have you sent the patch ? |
| 10:32 |
|
chris |
nope |
| 10:32 |
|
chris |
it was changing the case to an if |
| 10:39 |
|
chris_n |
@wunder 28334 |
| 10:39 |
|
munin |
chris_n: The current temperature in Erwin, North Carolina is -13.0�C (6:24 AM EDT on May 05, 2010). Conditions: Light Freezing Fog. Humidity: N/A%. Windchill: -13.0�C. Pressure: 29.98 in 1015 hPa (Rising). Dense fog advisory in effect until 9 am EDT this morning... |
| 10:45 |
|
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francharb left #koha |
| 10:51 |
|
braedon|home |
@wunder auckland |
| 10:51 |
|
munin |
braedon|home: The current temperature in Auckland, New Zealand is 9.0�C (10:00 PM NZST on May 05, 2010). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 82%. Dew Point: 6.0�C. Windchill: 9.0�C. Pressure: 30.48 in 1032 hPa (Steady). |
| 11:06 |
|
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laurence left #koha |
| 11:10 |
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genji joined #koha |
| 11:10 |
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genji1 left #koha |
| 11:14 |
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| 11:15 |
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| 11:16 |
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hdl_laptop left #koha |
| 11:16 |
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alex_a left #koha |
| 11:22 |
|
Amit_G |
@wunder New Delhi |
| 11:22 |
|
munin |
Amit_G: The current temperature in New Delhi, India is 41.0�C (4:30 PM IST on May 05, 2010). Conditions: Scattered Clouds. Humidity: 18%. Dew Point: 12.0�C. Pressure: 29.50 in 999 hPa (Falling). |
| 11:25 |
|
Elwell |
Hi Folks, Long time since I lurked here - Stupid Q - Would koha be complete and utter overkill for ~5000 items in a record club? - probably in th eorder of a hundred or so active members |
| 11:26 |
|
Elwell |
(cos the php script that is the database um, sucks :-) |
| 11:27 |
|
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genji1 joined #koha |
| 11:27 |
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genji left #koha |
| 11:30 |
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jwagner joined #koha |
| 11:32 |
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alex_a joined #koha |
| 11:33 |
|
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hdl_laptop joined #koha |
| 11:34 |
|
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Kivutar joined #koha |
| 11:37 |
|
gmcharlt |
morning |
| 11:39 |
|
Amit_G |
heya galen |
| 11:40 |
|
|
francharb joined #koha |
| 11:41 |
|
chris |
well i should go to sleep, next meeting in 7 hours |
| 11:41 |
|
chris |
night all |
| 11:42 |
|
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| 11:44 |
|
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Amit_G left #koha |
| 11:45 |
|
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genji joined #koha |
| 11:52 |
|
chris_n |
g'morning gmcharlt |
| 11:52 |
|
chris_n |
g'night chris |
| 11:53 |
|
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| 11:54 |
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genji left #koha |
| 11:54 |
|
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genji1 left #koha |
| 11:54 |
|
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jdavidb joined #koha |
| 11:55 |
|
jdavidb |
kmkale: you were looking for me earlier? |
| 12:10 |
|
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owen joined #koha |
| 12:18 |
|
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tomascohen joined #koha |
| 12:22 |
|
owen |
Hi all |
| 12:23 |
|
kf |
hi jdavidb |
| 12:23 |
|
jwagner |
morning |
| 12:23 |
|
kf |
hi owen and jwagner |
| 12:23 |
|
jdavidb |
Howdy. :) |
| 12:23 |
|
* jwagner |
is still ingesting caffiene |
| 12:23 |
|
* jdavidb |
waves to kf and owen. |
| 12:23 |
|
kf |
leaving ealry today and will miss the meeting |
| 12:23 |
|
kf |
bye all ! |
| 12:23 |
|
|
kf left #koha |
| 12:24 |
|
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collum joined #koha |
| 12:40 |
|
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schuster joined #koha |
| 12:42 |
|
schuster |
Howdy all! People I like to call friends.. and munnin... |
| 12:43 |
|
chris_n |
heya schuster |
| 12:43 |
|
chris_n |
and owen, jdavidb, and jwagner :) |
| 12:43 |
|
schuster |
I'll ask - has anyone here played/implemented the sopac? |
| 12:43 |
|
schuster |
question 2 - does anyone know any catalogs currently using it? |
| 12:44 |
|
jdavidb |
Howdy, schuster and chris_n! :) |
| 12:44 |
|
chris_n |
schuster: I think that biblibre might know answers to those questions iirc |
| 12:45 |
|
owen |
I don't know but some of my patrons could use a soap-pac! *ba-dum bum* |
| 12:50 |
|
schuster |
oh we are in rare form this morning... Someone must have taken that nap under their desk yesterday.... No wonder he disappeared for awhile...:) |
| 12:50 |
|
kmkale |
chris_n: about that unicode label printing can we not do the labels with css? |
| 12:52 |
|
chris_n |
kmkale: maybe, but I'm not css wizard ;-) |
| 12:53 |
|
chris_n |
and I wonder about rendering variations across browser platforms in that case |
| 12:53 |
|
kmkale |
chris_n: I know someone who used to work with the college earlier. He is good. I'l ask |
| 12:53 |
|
chris_n |
owen: any comment on that? |
| 12:54 |
|
chris_n |
kmkale: I'm for anything that improves the label/card capabilities in koha |
| 12:54 |
|
owen |
chris_n: I don't think I understand the question |
| 12:54 |
|
chris_n |
owen: if we went to formating labels for printing using css would there be issues with cross browser compatibility with the css? |
| 12:55 |
|
chris_n |
ie labels print ok from one browser, but are messed up from another |
| 12:55 |
|
owen |
Rather than through PDF generation? |
| 12:55 |
|
* chris_n |
thinks the quick spine label code uses css |
| 12:55 |
|
chris_n |
owen: right |
| 12:55 |
|
chris_n |
to address the font/unicode/etc issues |
| 12:56 |
|
owen |
There will *always* be cross-browser formatting issue, but I don't know to what extent we might expect it |
| 12:56 |
|
owen |
I've never done CSS-for-print testing |
| 12:56 |
|
kmkale |
chris_n it would atleast allow us to print in our languages. |
| 12:56 |
|
chris_n |
kmkale: yup |
| 12:57 |
|
kmkale |
I had done a college icard print job once with this friend i mentioned and it worked out well but of course we never did cross browser testing |
| 12:58 |
|
kmkale |
i would be happy if i get something usable with firefox |
| 12:58 |
|
chris_n |
kmkale: you might take a look at the quick spine label code |
| 12:58 |
|
chris_n |
I'm almost sure it uses css formatting to produce an html page which is then printed |
| 12:58 |
|
owen |
CSS allows you to specify measurements in points, so technically the spec is designed to handle print as well as screen |
| 13:00 |
|
chris_n |
in theory the screen and print should be the same (72ppi), but in reality screens now run more ppi than that |
| 13:01 |
|
chris_n |
kmkale: I'd be glad to help with that sort of thing if you conclude it is reasonably doable |
| 13:01 |
|
kmkale |
but its controlable as its from the staff interface. let me try.. now that I can read perl ;) and know there are ppl like you who tolerate my bugging |
| 13:01 |
|
chris_n |
I wrote the new labels/card modules so that it should be easy to add other export formats |
| 13:02 |
|
chris_n |
ie. the final print screen can have csv, xml, pdf, css, foo, foobar, <your_choice_here>, etc. |
| 13:03 |
|
chris_n |
we just have to write a module for css, foo, foobar, etc |
| 13:03 |
|
kmkale |
chris_n: gotta run now but will look at it and ask your help tomorrow. |
| 13:03 |
|
kmkale |
bye all |
| 13:05 |
|
|
kmkale left #koha |
| 13:08 |
|
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Kivutar left #koha |
| 13:08 |
|
schuster |
On the "NEW" wiki - on the main page I was wondering if we should have a statement about GPL and everything there is GPL... for newbies or community looking at the site. Just so it is stated? |
| 13:09 |
|
|
Kivutar joined #koha |
| 13:09 |
|
owen |
schuster: It does say so at the bottom in the fine print |
| 13:10 |
|
owen |
"Content is available under GNU General Public License 2.0 or later" |
| 13:10 |
|
owen |
It'd be nice if there was a more obvious statement on the "create account" page |
| 13:10 |
|
schuster |
own - well it must be my eyes... yes it does say that in the footer... Thank you - guess that's what happens on your b-day. |
| 13:12 |
|
chris_n |
ich!... python |
| 13:12 |
|
* chris_n |
wishes schuster a happy b-day :) |
| 13:13 |
|
schuster |
now if I could only figure out how to put a birthday hat on that emoticon... |
| 13:14 |
|
owen |
Happy birthday schuster! |
| 13:14 |
|
owen |
munin needs a plugin for wishing folks happy birthday |
| 13:14 |
|
munin |
owen: Error: "needs" is not a valid command. |
| 13:14 |
|
magnus |
"gratulerer med dagen", schuster |
| 13:16 |
|
jdavidb |
Happy 29th birthday, schuster! :) |
| 13:16 |
|
|
Nate joined #koha |
| 13:17 |
|
jwagner |
Happy birthday, schuster |
| 13:18 |
|
chris_n |
hi Nate |
| 13:18 |
|
Nate |
morning chris_n, jwagner |
| 13:19 |
|
* jdavidb |
waves to Nate. |
| 13:19 |
|
Nate |
hiya jdavidb! |
| 13:20 |
|
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jcamins joined #koha |
| 13:24 |
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Kivutar left #koha |
| 13:28 |
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| 13:35 |
|
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braedon|home left #koha |
| 13:36 |
|
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sekjal joined #koha |
| 13:36 |
|
jcamins |
Hello, #koha |
| 14:01 |
|
|
magnus is now known as magnus_dogwalki |
| 14:16 |
|
moodaepo |
@wunder Mankato. MN |
| 14:16 |
|
munin |
moodaepo: The current temperature in South on Monks, Mankato, Minnesota is 10.6�C (9:15 AM CDT on May 05, 2010). Conditions: Mostly Cloudy. Humidity: 42%. Dew Point: -2.0�C. Pressure: 29.67 in 1004.6 hPa (Steady). Wind Advisory in effect until 4 PM CDT this afternoon... |
| 14:17 |
|
jdavidb |
@wunder 20817 |
| 14:17 |
|
munin |
jdavidb: The current temperature in Langley Fork Park, McLean, Virginia is 25.5�C (10:16 AM EDT on May 05, 2010). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 41%. Dew Point: 11.0�C. Pressure: 30.00 in 1015.8 hPa (Steady). |
| 14:18 |
|
owen |
Whoa jdavidb, welcome to summer! |
| 14:18 |
|
owen |
@wunder 45701 |
| 14:18 |
|
munin |
owen: The current temperature in Ohio University, Athens, Ohio is 21.1�C (10:16 AM EDT on May 05, 2010). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 50%. Dew Point: 10.0�C. Pressure: 29.81 in 1009.4 hPa (Rising). |
| 14:19 |
|
jdavidb |
Definitely. We hit 90F over the weekend. Beastly hot and humid. |
| 14:22 |
|
|
wizzyrea joined #koha |
| 14:24 |
|
wizzyrea |
good morning |
| 14:25 |
|
owen |
Hi wizzyrea |
| 14:28 |
|
* owen |
is happy to see is number keypad works now after upgrading his Ubuntu VM |
| 14:31 |
|
collum |
@wunder 41011 |
| 14:31 |
|
munin |
collum: The current temperature in Newport Aquarium, Newport, Kentucky is 24.2�C (10:30 AM EDT on May 05, 2010). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 42%. Dew Point: 11.0�C. Pressure: 29.88 in 1011.7 hPa (Falling). |
| 14:42 |
|
|
greenmang0 left #koha |
| 14:44 |
|
chris_n |
@wunder 28334 |
| 14:44 |
|
munin |
chris_n: The current temperature in Erwin, North Carolina is -8.0�C (10:24 AM EDT on May 05, 2010). Conditions: Mostly Cloudy. Humidity: N/A%. Windchill: -11.0�C. Pressure: 30.02 in 1016 hPa (Steady). |
| 14:44 |
|
* chris_n |
thinks the weather station is a bit off this morning |
| 14:44 |
|
* owen |
is trying to decide on the fix for Bug 4416 |
| 14:44 |
|
munin |
Bug http://bugs.koha.org/cgi-bin/b[…]w_bug.cgi?id=4416 normal, P5, ---, oleonard myacpl.org, NEW, renew all and return all buttons too close together |
| 14:44 |
|
owen |
Remove both "return all" AND "renew all" or just "return all?" |
| 14:46 |
|
jwagner |
I think there's some value to having renew all, but no value to return all (so long as that bug exists that doesn't trigger holds etc.) |
| 14:47 |
|
owen |
jwagner: Does that bug have a good-n-high severity? |
| 14:48 |
|
jwagner |
Bug 3514 I think -- I did a workaround to turn off the returns column |
| 14:48 |
|
munin |
Bug http://bugs.koha.org/cgi-bin/b[…]w_bug.cgi?id=3514 enhancement, PATCH-Sent, ---, gmcharltgmail.com, NEW, Returning items through patron Details tab doesn't activate all circulation functions |
| 14:49 |
|
jwagner |
I sent the patch in August, but it doesn't seem to have gone anywhere. |
| 14:50 |
|
jwagner |
I've since updated that locally to turn off the returns column on both details and checkout tab (originally only did on details tab) |
| 14:56 |
|
owen |
Even if that patch is accepted it won't be a real fix for that bug. We need the function to actually work! |
| 14:57 |
|
owen |
...I can see how handling multiple on-hold returns would be difficult. Maybe any multiple-return function should skip those cases and ask the user to handle them individually |
| 14:57 |
|
jwagner |
owen, I know -- mine was a quick & dirty workaround, not a fix. |
| 15:04 |
|
|
sekjal left #koha |
| 15:11 |
|
wizzyrea |
yea, 3514 is on NEKLS' list as well |
| 15:13 |
|
wizzyrea |
what about adding a winnebago like function to returns |
| 15:14 |
|
wizzyrea |
where you can scan a list of items |
| 15:14 |
|
wizzyrea |
like, batch checkin |
| 15:14 |
|
wizzyrea |
and check them all in |
| 15:14 |
|
wizzyrea |
then print a list of exceptions |
| 15:14 |
|
owen |
What's the advantage? |
| 15:14 |
|
wizzyrea |
well the real problem, as we see it, of return all |
| 15:15 |
|
wizzyrea |
is that staff don't verify that the stack of books is the same as the stack in front of you (unless you're being very fastidious) |
| 15:15 |
|
wizzyrea |
normally, when you do this, you have an impatient patron waiting in front of you |
| 15:15 |
|
wizzyrea |
so being fastidious isn't good customer service |
| 15:15 |
|
wizzyrea |
because it makes them wait |
| 15:15 |
|
wizzyrea |
with the batch checkin |
| 15:16 |
|
wizzyrea |
you can scan scan scan |
| 15:16 |
|
wizzyrea |
check in items, then print out the exceptions for the staff member to go back to |
| 15:16 |
|
wizzyrea |
instead of making them process them with a line of impatient patrons waiting |
| 15:16 |
|
wizzyrea |
s/them/items |
| 15:17 |
|
wizzyrea |
it's just an idea |
| 15:18 |
|
jwagner |
And to add an extra wrinkle, one of my sites uses their self-check machine for checkins -- pile everything on the reader (RFID) and let it go. That doesn't handle holds too well either.... |
| 15:18 |
|
wizzyrea |
we have the same problem with our chutes |
| 15:18 |
|
wizzyrea |
though the sip stuff you should have now that we paid for should handle holds better |
| 15:19 |
|
wizzyrea |
it's not perfect (local holds + sip = yikes) but it's better than it was before we put some $$ in |
| 15:19 |
|
owen |
wizzyrea: I can maybe see the use case you describe. But I really don't see a reason for a "return all" function otherwise. |
| 15:19 |
|
wizzyrea |
I'm just as happy to get rid of it on that screen |
| 15:19 |
|
wizzyrea |
it makes more sense to renew all if you can |
| 15:19 |
|
wizzyrea |
since likely you won't have those items in front of you |
| 15:20 |
|
wizzyrea |
BUT an expedited batch checkin was a feature that was really good about winnebago |
| 15:20 |
|
owen |
wizzyrea: Tell me more about the transaction |
| 15:20 |
|
owen |
You scan them all in while the patron is standing there |
| 15:20 |
|
owen |
And then wait for the report of any problems while they wait? Or no? |
| 15:21 |
|
wizzyrea |
I was thinking that a "print exceptions" that outputs the exceptions to paper for later processing |
| 15:21 |
|
wizzyrea |
so the stack stays at the library, you don't check in any books that aren't existent on the desk |
| 15:22 |
|
wizzyrea |
(or that you haven't verified are existent in your stack) |
| 15:22 |
|
wizzyrea |
I would actually be curious to ask my librarians about this |
| 15:22 |
|
owen |
Why is there an issue with the patron having to wait? What are they waiting for? |
| 15:22 |
|
wizzyrea |
because I know a lot of them liked the winnebago function |
| 15:22 |
|
wizzyrea |
sometimes they want to watch you check in their items |
| 15:23 |
|
wizzyrea |
people are weird |
| 15:23 |
|
owen |
Maybe it just feels faster to scan,scan,scan and process? |
| 15:23 |
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| 15:23 |
|
wizzyrea |
I think that's true, to some extent. |
| 15:23 |
|
wizzyrea |
I used winnebago, and I have to admit, sending one request to checkin a bunch of items was more satisfying than checkin -> wait |
| 15:23 |
|
owen |
We have patrons who insist we check things in on the spot because we've missed checking in their items in the past |
| 15:24 |
|
wizzyrea |
^^ |
| 15:24 |
|
wizzyrea |
so if you were being fastidious with that stack of books, you would have to look at each one, verify that it was on their list, prior to hitting "return all" |
| 15:24 |
|
wizzyrea |
as it stands currently |
| 15:24 |
|
wizzyrea |
which takes time |
| 15:25 |
|
* jwagner |
has dumb moment |
| 15:25 |
|
jwagner |
Why not just use the existing Koha Circ, Checkin screen then? |
| 15:25 |
|
wizzyrea |
dunno, I'm actually in favor of getting rid of the return all completely |
| 15:25 |
|
owen |
I don't see how that fastidious process is any more efficient than checking them in one by one |
| 15:25 |
|
* wizzyrea |
could imagine a scenario where a librarian has *gasp* two tabs open |
| 15:25 |
|
owen |
...and the latter is more accurate. |
| 15:26 |
|
wizzyrea |
one with checkin and one with checkout |
| 15:26 |
|
* wizzyrea |
wonders why more people don't do that anyway |
| 15:27 |
|
gmcharlt |
owen: any chance I could sweettalk you into a doing a followup for 4208 - there are still a bunch of tmpl_ifs embedded in tags in various OPAC templates |
| 15:28 |
|
jwagner |
If the issue is wanting to see the patron screen, have a separate tab/window open on the checkin screen, check everything in, then refresh the patron screen. Wouldn't that do the same thing of assuring the patron everything's clear? |
| 15:28 |
|
gmcharlt |
mostly in syndetics contents links |
| 15:28 |
|
wizzyrea |
I thought there was some drama re: syndetics links |
| 15:30 |
|
owen |
gmcharlt: I'd be happy to |
| 15:30 |
|
gmcharlt |
owen: thanks |
| 15:30 |
|
owen |
Is there a way for me to test-run the translation script to detect the problems? |
| 15:31 |
|
wizzyrea |
jwagner: |
| 15:31 |
|
gmcharlt |
there is |
| 15:31 |
|
gmcharlt |
prove xt/author/translatable-templates.t |
| 15:31 |
|
wizzyrea |
what if you put in a library something like http://www.thinkgeek.com/compu[…]c609/?cpg=froogle |
| 15:31 |
|
wizzyrea |
and put the patron screen on that |
| 15:31 |
|
wizzyrea |
maybe an alternative patron screen that autorefreshed |
| 15:31 |
|
jwagner |
Now, let's not spoil the circ staff -- keep the cool gadgets for the systems people!!! |
| 15:31 |
|
wizzyrea |
or even showed the receipt |
| 15:32 |
|
* owen |
needs that for displaying his IRC window. Must maximize distraction. |
| 15:32 |
|
wizzyrea |
at end of transaction |
| 15:32 |
|
wizzyrea |
kind of like the grocery store |
| 15:32 |
|
wizzyrea |
>.> |
| 15:33 |
|
gmcharlt |
clearly we need a different default circ sound |
| 15:33 |
|
gmcharlt |
e.g., http://www.wavsource.com/sfx/sfx.htm |
| 15:33 |
|
gmcharlt |
rather, http://www.wavsource.com/snds_[…]sh_register_x.wav |
| 15:33 |
|
jwagner |
There is the item checkin message that can be emailed if the patron is configured. Maybe adapt that to a circ slip for checkins? |
| 15:33 |
|
wizzyrea |
gmcharlt: hahahaha |
| 15:34 |
|
jwagner |
gotta run, back online later. |
| 15:34 |
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| 15:34 |
|
wizzyrea |
I like this: http://www.wavsource.com/snds_[…]8/sfx/arrow_x.wav |
| 15:34 |
|
wizzyrea |
too long though |
| 15:36 |
|
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| 15:36 |
|
jcamins |
Has anyone ever encountered problems with Stage MARC Records for Import not working after 25 batches? |
| 15:36 |
|
gmcharlt |
... to use when the patron has overdues |
| 15:37 |
|
* wizzyrea |
sort of remembers something about that from a long time ago |
| 15:37 |
|
owen |
gmcharlt: Looks like most of the existing errors are similar to the ones I attempted to correct with the patch to opac-detail.tmpl. But jwagner reports that my patch broke syndetics content so I didn't plow on |
| 15:38 |
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| 15:40 |
|
DRUlm |
jcamins: nope not since Koha 3.0 Beta |
| 15:40 |
|
DRUlm |
jcamins: we have loaded hundreds of times a-OK |
| 15:41 |
|
brendan |
gmcharlt so are you doubling up all of your commits (one to git.koha and one to git.koha-c) ? |
| 15:41 |
|
owen |
Anyone have some Syndetics credentials they could loan me for testing purposes? |
| 15:41 |
|
gmcharlt |
brendan: yes |
| 15:41 |
|
gmcharlt |
owen: yes |
| 15:41 |
|
brendan |
thanks |
| 15:43 |
|
jcamins |
DRUlm: I wish I knew what the problem was with this. It's driving me batty. |
| 15:44 |
|
jcamins |
DRUlm: It's very odd... I can't import more than 6000 records at a time, and now it won't let me import another batch (problematic since I only go through 25/30). |
| 15:44 |
|
jcamins |
Oh well. I guess I will try again. Maybe a restart. |
| 15:45 |
|
jcamins |
DRUlm: Question: Are you using a Windows client? |
| 15:45 |
|
DRUlm |
jcamins: Hmmmmm. Could it be a timeout for 6000 records? I have only loaded about 1000 this way - Yes, using Firefox 3.x in Windows |
| 15:46 |
|
jcamins |
I hope I don't have to go down to batches of 1000. But I guess if that's the way it is, that's th eway it is. I'll give it a try. Just getting our data in would be a relief, at this point. |
| 15:48 |
|
owen |
On opac-detail? that's what jwagner reported had been broken by my bug 4208 cleanup |
| 15:48 |
|
munin |
Bug http://bugs.koha.org/cgi-bin/b[…]w_bug.cgi?id=4208 blocker, P1, ---, chrisbigballofwax.co.nz, NEW, Many submit buttons are not translatable in 3.2 |
| 15:49 |
|
owen |
sorry, wrong tab |
| 15:50 |
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| 16:01 |
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brendan joined #koha |
| 16:02 |
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| 16:04 |
|
jcamins |
DRUlm: You were right. Completely randomly all the files I had left exceeded the maximum file size that my computer can handle. |
| 16:05 |
|
wizzyrea |
nengard about? |
| 16:06 |
|
owen |
wizzyrea: She's traveling today, haven't seen her in here |
| 16:06 |
|
wizzyrea |
aha |
| 16:06 |
|
wizzyrea |
I was going to ahve her look at the preliminary changes to the sql report library. Wikimedia table structure is a PITA |
| 16:10 |
|
schuster |
jcamins - maybe your files are tooo large... use MARCEDIT to break them into smaller chuncks - or it could be that you have a record that it doesn't like because there are too many items attached to it pushing it beyond the 9999 limit. |
| 16:10 |
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| 16:11 |
|
jcamins |
schuster: It seems that the combination of my desktop and our server can't handle files above 4MB. |
| 16:11 |
|
jcamins |
So I am now uploading in batches of 3000, rather than 6000, records. |
| 16:11 |
|
schuster |
wizzyrea ++ report library... it needed a little tender loving care. |
| 16:12 |
|
schuster |
I saw on the liblime list that there was a Koha limitation... |
| 16:12 |
|
jcamins |
Okay, now it's just messing with me. |
| 16:12 |
|
schuster |
That was the first I had heard of it so thought I would throw it out to you as it sounded similar. |
| 16:13 |
|
wizzyrea |
maybe a LLEK limitation? due to cloud hosting? |
| 16:13 |
|
owen |
schuster: "It's not our fault, it's Koha's fault" ? |
| 16:13 |
|
jcamins |
Well, we're using Koha, so it's not LLEK per se. |
| 16:14 |
|
DRUlm |
An an unrelated topic how is the security w/ Clouds. I have heard some mixed info from the black-hat crowd |
| 16:14 |
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| 16:14 |
|
wizzyrea |
same as any server, imo: if you don't secure it, it isn't secure. |
| 16:14 |
|
jcamins |
However, we're using VirtualBox to host our catalog, and I'm convinced that's at the root of many of our problems. |
| 16:14 |
|
wizzyrea |
AH |
| 16:14 |
|
wizzyrea |
could be |
| 16:15 |
|
gmcharlt |
agreed, that's a broad question, and really impossible to answer w/o looking at the specificies of any particular cloud hosting provider |
| 16:15 |
|
schuster |
gmcharlt - is the content cafe done for us last year part of the community code? Just making sure I'm covered as we upgrade to 3.x in the near future. |
| 16:16 |
|
DRUlm |
I use VMware for my test machine, and there is some strangeness with the MySQL response time. Zebra seems better, but it is probably an issue with how the MySQL server software is optimized, and something does not translate for speed when running virtual |
| 16:16 |
|
gmcharlt |
schuster: no, doesn't look like it was submitted |
| 16:16 |
|
schuster |
AH! |
| 16:17 |
|
schuster |
hmmm guess I need to go back to PTFS on that. yikes glad I asked. |
| 16:17 |
|
DRUlm |
Right, but with the cloud there can be a whole network interface where everything is sitting and you can have all the VMs essentially on the same LAN with open access between them. Also once root is obtained on the VMware host, then all the machines are owned |
| 16:18 |
|
gmcharlt |
DRUlm: that is entirely dependent on how the provider manges their setup |
| 16:18 |
|
wizzyrea |
^^ |
| 16:18 |
|
wizzyrea |
so, the question is: do you trust your cloud provider to secure their boxen? |
| 16:19 |
|
wizzyrea |
(a question only they could answer) |
| 16:19 |
|
DRUlm |
Right, but with my understanding, security between the VMs is not cut and dry, there are certainly some new techniques that need to be used and not everybody is using them, and the rest can be a bit experimental - but given where you are coming from, OK, I will conceed that it is based on the provider |
| 16:20 |
|
schuster |
seen jdavidb |
| 16:20 |
|
wizzyrea |
@seen jdavidb |
| 16:20 |
|
munin |
wizzyrea: jdavidb was last seen in #koha 2 hours and 47 seconds ago: <jdavidb> Definitely. We hit 90F over the weekend. Beastly hot and humid. |
| 16:20 |
|
wizzyrea |
;) |
| 16:20 |
|
schuster |
thx |
| 16:21 |
|
jcamins |
@seen kmkale |
| 16:21 |
|
munin |
jcamins: kmkale was last seen in #koha 3 hours, 17 minutes, and 6 seconds ago: <kmkale> bye all |
| 16:21 |
|
DRUlm |
http://www.google.com/#hl=en&t[…]p=c50e4df695f60f3 |
| 16:21 |
|
DRUlm |
and also |
| 16:21 |
|
DRUlm |
http://datacenterjournal.com/i[…]=37&Itemid=100212 |
| 16:22 |
|
DRUlm |
But don't take my word for it! :) |
| 16:22 |
|
DRUlm |
Goot go! |
| 16:22 |
|
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DRUlm left #koha |
| 16:22 |
|
* gmcharlt |
doesn't tend to look to Gartner whitepapers for much of anything, I'm afraid |
| 16:23 |
|
wizzyrea |
...and it still comes back to "ask your provider" |
| 16:23 |
|
wizzyrea |
for true cloud stuff |
| 16:23 |
|
wizzyrea |
now, I can see this being relevant in a self hosted virtualization environs, which I think is really what he was getting at |
| 16:24 |
|
gmcharlt |
@later tell jwagner Syndetics support is now working in HEAD again |
| 16:24 |
|
munin |
gmcharlt: The operation succeeded. |
| 16:24 |
|
* wizzyrea |
cheers |
| 16:25 |
|
schuster |
@later tell jdavidb to contact David Schuster about content cafe |
| 16:25 |
|
munin |
schuster: The operation succeeded. |
| 16:26 |
|
schuster |
We just realized that we can use the news feature to Highlight and schedule those highlights for databases to the pac account! Even to use a database widget! WAY COOL! |
| 16:27 |
|
wizzyrea |
gmcharlt re: bug 4445, did chris ever send the patch to up the OCLC limits? and will that go into 3.2? |
| 16:27 |
|
munin |
Bug http://bugs.koha.org/cgi-bin/b[…]w_bug.cgi?id=4445 trivial, P5, ---, paul.poulainbiblibre.com, NEW, OCLCAffiliateID Needs to have preference text changed to reflect change in the service |
| 16:27 |
|
wizzyrea |
I was about to submit the pref text change |
| 16:28 |
|
schuster |
wizzyrea - are you all using the XISBN service from OCLC? |
| 16:28 |
|
wizzyrea |
they kind of go together |
| 16:28 |
|
gmcharlt |
wizzyrea: looks like not |
| 16:28 |
|
wizzyrea |
no, but the limit has been increased |
| 16:28 |
|
schuster |
I'm still trying to figure out how to make that work... :) |
| 16:29 |
|
rhcl_away |
schuster: was this your content cafe reference above? http://www.ebscohost.com/thisT[…]cID=64&marketID=6 |
| 16:29 |
|
|
rhcl_away is now known as rhcl |
| 16:29 |
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| 16:30 |
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| 16:30 |
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wizzyrea |
gmcharlt: not submitted or not in 3.2? |
| 16:30 |
|
gmcharlt |
not submitted |
| 16:30 |
|
wizzyrea |
okies |
| 16:30 |
|
gmcharlt |
@later tell chris git-daemon for git.workbuffer.org doesn't seem to be running |
| 16:30 |
|
munin |
gmcharlt: The operation succeeded. |
| 16:30 |
|
wizzyrea |
I'm going to go ahead and submit the text changes on the assumption that he's going to submit it |
| 16:31 |
|
wizzyrea |
or would that be wrong? |
| 16:31 |
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| 16:31 |
|
gmcharlt |
it's fine |
| 16:31 |
|
wizzyrea |
kool |
| 16:31 |
|
gmcharlt |
I would have cherry-picked it now, but ^^ |
| 16:33 |
|
schuster |
For 3.2 is there a recommended Firefox version? I know they have new ones all the time, but I have to start planning now to be ready 4 months from now... |
| 16:34 |
|
schuster |
because I'm on FF 3.01 currently and I am sure there have been many releases since... and it was a chore to get to this level. |
| 16:34 |
|
schuster |
3.011 sorry. |
| 16:35 |
|
wizzyrea |
sweet |
| 16:36 |
|
schuster |
for example circ sounds are really important and I have heard that is an HTML 5 version thing... Want to make sure my browsers work right. |
| 16:37 |
|
schuster |
hmmm looks like maybe FF 3.5 started to support html5. |
| 16:39 |
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| 16:39 |
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| 16:40 |
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thd-away` is now known as thd |
| 16:47 |
|
chris_n |
wb thc |
| 16:47 |
|
chris_n |
thd eve |
| 16:47 |
|
* chris_n |
cannot type atm :-P |
| 16:56 |
|
jcamins |
Just to check, I should still report bugs on bugs.koha.org, right? |
| 16:56 |
|
wizzyrea |
for now, yea |
| 17:30 |
|
jcamins |
Has anyone encountered issues with Stage MARC for Import on a heavily loaded system? |
| 17:31 |
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| 17:31 |
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| 17:31 |
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DRUlm |
What is the agenda of the meeting today? |
| 17:34 |
|
schuster |
Thanks for the reminder drulm! |
| 17:34 |
|
gmcharlt |
DRUlm: http://wiki.koha.org/doku.php?[…]etingnotes10may05 |
| 17:36 |
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alreadygone joined #koha |
| 17:36 |
|
thd |
chris_n: eve? |
| 17:36 |
|
jcamins |
For anyone wondering, the behavior of Stage MARC Records for Import is completely unpredictable when running the system under Virtual Box on a machine running on a heavily-loaded Mac mini. |
| 17:37 |
|
thd |
chris_n: what part of the world are you in? |
| 17:38 |
|
alreadygone |
hi, can anyone guide me through the process on installing Koha on Slackware 13? |
| 17:39 |
|
DRUlm |
Thank you. |
| 17:40 |
|
DRUlm |
Testing the 3.2 alpha 2 release now |
| 17:40 |
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chris_n |
thd: the part that cannot spell apparently ;) |
| 17:42 |
|
jcamins |
For anyone who comes across this log trying to understand why Stage MARC Records for Import is failing: please just assume that every single diagnosis I've come up with is wrong. |
| 17:42 |
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| 17:43 |
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alreadygone left #koha |
| 17:43 |
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gmcharlt |
Colin: when you have a moment, can you advise if the issue you found for bug 1532 is resolved? |
| 17:43 |
|
munin |
Bug http://bugs.koha.org/cgi-bin/b[…]w_bug.cgi?id=1532 blocker, PATCH-Sent, ---, gmcharltgmail.com, ASSIGNED, Port dev_week holds enhancements to 3.0 |
| 17:45 |
|
Colin |
taking a look |
| 17:48 |
|
Colin |
gmcharlt:Yes that fixes the holds removal |
| 17:50 |
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jwagner is now known as jwagner_meeting |
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| 17:54 |
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| 18:00 |
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| 18:01 |
|
hdl_laptop |
schuster: around ? |
| 18:02 |
|
hdl_laptop |
just to answer your question about sopac |
| 18:03 |
|
hdl_laptop |
schuster: yes, biblibre implemented sopac working with koha |
| 18:03 |
|
hdl_laptop |
we implemented ILS-DI at this occasion |
| 18:05 |
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hdl_laptop |
owen : i wrote a multiple onhold returns |
| 18:06 |
|
* hdl_laptop |
catching up the logs |
| 18:06 |
|
wizzyrea |
:D figured |
| 18:15 |
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hdl_laptop |
sorry guys |
| 18:20 |
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| 18:22 |
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chris |
gmcharlt: better url for the meeting http://wiki.koha-community.org[…]etingnotes10may05 |
| 18:23 |
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hdl_laptop |
strange to see the index.php |
| 18:24 |
|
chris |
and yesterday http://wiki.koha-community.org[…]etingnotes10may04 |
| 18:24 |
|
hdl_laptop |
But k |
| 18:25 |
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| 18:25 |
|
wizzyrea |
was anyone able to get kmkale's patch to apply? mine keeps saying invalid patch at line 30 |
| 18:25 |
|
wizzyrea |
(the fine receipt thing) |
| 18:26 |
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hdl_laptop |
chris: link to how to get listed is pointing to koha.org |
| 18:26 |
|
wizzyrea |
yes, those are the rules we want to discuss |
| 18:26 |
|
wizzyrea |
since they are the current rules |
| 18:26 |
|
wizzyrea |
do we want to change them? How? |
| 18:26 |
|
wizzyrea |
(it's my agenda item) |
| 18:27 |
|
hdl_laptop |
We're sorry, but that page doesn't exist |
| 18:27 |
|
wizzyrea |
oh cool |
| 18:27 |
|
wizzyrea |
lol |
| 18:27 |
|
hdl_laptop |
title is just.... misleading |
| 18:27 |
|
wizzyrea |
well it was there not 3 days ago |
| 18:27 |
|
wizzyrea |
http://koha.org/support/pay-fo[…]ow-to-get-listed/ |
| 18:27 |
|
hdl_laptop |
you have two pages |
| 18:28 |
|
hdl_laptop |
how to get listed |
| 18:29 |
|
hdl_laptop |
and koha-support-companies/how-to |
| 18:30 |
|
wizzyrea |
hdl_laptop: I guess I"m not understanding |
| 18:31 |
|
wizzyrea |
links? |
| 18:31 |
|
hdl_laptop |
there is a | at the end of the link |
| 18:31 |
|
* wizzyrea |
has a wicked headache and so may not be too smrt. |
| 18:31 |
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| 18:31 |
|
wizzyrea |
oh, refresh, |
| 18:31 |
|
wizzyrea |
I corrected the link on the wiki |
| 18:32 |
|
wizzyrea |
it should be right now |
| 18:32 |
|
hdl_laptop |
k |
| 18:32 |
|
hdl_laptop |
good |
| 18:32 |
|
wizzyrea |
I thought you meant k-c.org |
| 18:32 |
|
wizzyrea |
I made a "whaa?" face |
| 18:33 |
|
wizzyrea |
I think it was right on the old wiki, but when it got moved the URL wasn't corrected |
| 18:33 |
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| 18:33 |
|
wizzyrea |
doku -> mediawiki is not always graceful |
| 18:33 |
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hdl_laptop |
I thought the link was meant to point to koha-community.org |
| 18:33 |
|
wizzyrea |
nope |
| 18:33 |
|
hdl_laptop |
this was the purpose of my question |
| 18:34 |
|
liw |
lwn.net is going to have an article about Koha / PTFS in its next weekly issue; in a week or two it will be freely readable, right now it is behind a paywall |
| 18:34 |
|
wizzyrea |
I'm looking to make sure that we 1. agree on the rules 2. if these are the current rules, that they are what we want 3. if not, what should they be |
| 18:34 |
|
wizzyrea |
and then I will post them on k-c.org |
| 18:34 |
|
hdl_laptop |
k |
| 18:35 |
|
wizzyrea |
swap 1 and 2, lol |
| 18:35 |
|
wizzyrea |
rather, make that an unordered list |
| 18:35 |
|
hdl_laptop |
hehe |
| 18:35 |
|
* wizzyrea |
is all in a muddle |
| 18:36 |
|
* chris_n |
hands wizzyrea some advil |
| 18:36 |
|
wizzyrea |
thanks |
| 18:37 |
|
wizzyrea |
I think actually that the meds are starting to kick in. Stupid pollen. |
| 18:38 |
|
* chris_n |
gets terrible migraines and so can empathize :-( |
| 18:38 |
|
|
mbreeding joined #koha |
| 18:39 |
|
wizzyrea |
can I ask you all to apply a few of your considerable brain cycles to this question (and you don't have to answer now... you can PM me or whatever): I want to do a section for "Get Involved" on the website |
| 18:40 |
|
chris_n |
hello mbreeding |
| 18:40 |
|
wizzyrea |
and I want to have For Users, For Librarians, and For Developers |
| 18:40 |
|
wizzyrea |
For Developers is already in the works |
| 18:40 |
|
wizzyrea |
so I'm thinking about the For Users, and For Librarians |
| 18:41 |
|
liw |
http://www.producingoss.com/ would probably be good reading for Koha people, btw |
| 18:41 |
|
|
vokalr joined #koha |
| 18:41 |
|
wizzyrea |
How do we want to encourage those members of our community to get involved (assuming that users/librarians have separate methods of getting involved based on their skillsets) |
| 18:42 |
|
chris |
gmcharlt: can you try a fetch from git.workbuffer.org now please? |
| 18:42 |
|
wizzyrea |
(meaning, of course you can have user/developers and librarian/developers, and librarian/users, but they don't all participate in the same way) |
| 18:42 |
|
liw |
I suck at getting people involved but... would it help to have clear lists of tasks that need doing? |
| 18:42 |
|
hdl_laptop |
translations, xslts, reports, docs |
| 18:43 |
|
|
miguel joined #koha |
| 18:43 |
|
hdl_laptop |
specifications |
| 18:43 |
|
wizzyrea |
hdl_laptop: ooh good ideas |
| 18:43 |
|
liw |
bug reports! |
| 18:43 |
|
hdl_laptop |
discussing RFCs could also be nice |
| 18:43 |
|
hdl_laptop |
bugreports++++ |
| 18:43 |
|
mbreeding |
hello cris_n |
| 18:43 |
|
chris_n |
RFCs++ |
| 18:44 |
|
jcamins |
As a librarian (and speaking for my boss, another librarian), I think it would be really helpful to have advice on how to submit RFPs. |
| 18:45 |
|
liw |
is there a page somewhere explaining how the community has organized itself? how development is structured, how decisions are made, where discussions happen, etc? |
| 18:45 |
|
wizzyrea |
I suppose I should just combine users/librarians, since they are normally the same |
| 18:45 |
|
wizzyrea |
http://koha-community.org/koha[…]ect-organization/ |
| 18:45 |
|
gmcharlt |
chris: can fetch now |
| 18:45 |
|
liw |
wizzyrea, cool, thanks (I am such a newbie...) |
| 18:46 |
|
jcamins |
(i.e., we want to throw money at some problems, rather than try to deal with those problems ourselves, and it would be helpful if it were more clear what the procedure was for open RFPs) |
| 18:46 |
|
wizzyrea |
liw: np |
| 18:46 |
|
wizzyrea |
jcamins: http://koha-community.org/about/enhancing-koha/ |
| 18:46 |
|
wizzyrea |
that is still evolving |
| 18:47 |
|
* chris_n |
thinks the inertial is really building with the new community resources :) |
| 18:47 |
|
jcamins |
wizzyrea: Thanks. I don't know how I never ran into that page. |
| 18:48 |
|
wizzyrea |
i'ts new in the last few weeks |
| 18:48 |
|
wizzyrea |
:) |
| 18:48 |
|
chris |
gmcharlt: excellent :) |
| 18:48 |
|
jcamins |
Ah, that would be why. |
| 18:48 |
|
Sharon |
wizzyrea has been busy |
| 18:48 |
|
wizzyrea |
a good poke around koha-community.org is probably in order for most folks here ;) |
| 18:48 |
|
* wizzyrea |
*has* been busy |
| 18:49 |
|
wizzyrea |
afk 5 |
| 18:49 |
|
Sharon |
is always busy... |
| 18:51 |
|
|
robin-home joined #koha |
| 18:52 |
|
chris |
morning robin-home |
| 18:54 |
|
robin-home |
Hi Chris. Other good thing about IRC: when I fall asleep half watt through, no one will know. |
| 18:54 |
|
|
cait joined #koha |
| 18:54 |
|
* owen |
is getting a mysterious error from "prove xt/author/translatable-templates.t" regarding circulation.tmpl |
| 18:54 |
|
cait |
hi #koha |
| 18:54 |
|
cait |
:) |
| 18:54 |
|
chris |
hiya cait |
| 18:55 |
|
chris_n |
hi cait |
| 18:55 |
|
cait |
hi chris and chris_n |
| 18:56 |
|
brendan |
how long until meeting time? |
| 18:56 |
|
chris |
9 minutes |
| 18:56 |
|
chris |
actually 4 |
| 18:56 |
|
chris |
my clock is slow |
| 18:56 |
|
liw |
quick summary of the lwn article: Koha's history, Liblime's actions in mid-2009, PTFS's actions recently, some analysis, suggesting other projects get their trademarks and domains in order |
| 18:56 |
|
brendan |
that was a fast five minutes |
| 18:57 |
|
chris_n |
liw: lwn article? |
| 18:58 |
|
moodaepo |
liw++ # for the reading |
| 18:58 |
|
* chris_n |
had to look twice to recognize lars |
| 18:58 |
|
chris |
http://lwn.net/ |
| 18:58 |
|
liw |
chris_n, lwn.net has an article on Koha/PTFS, currently behind a paywall, free for all in a week (or two? I can never remember) |
| 18:58 |
|
liw |
oh, yeah |
| 18:58 |
|
|
liw is now known as larsw |
| 18:59 |
|
|
vickiteal joined #koha |
| 18:59 |
|
|
nengard joined #koha |
| 18:59 |
|
wizzyrea |
larsw: oh that's you |
| 18:59 |
|
chris_n |
hi nengard, vickiteal |
| 18:59 |
|
|
magnus_dogwalki is now known as magnus |
| 18:59 |
|
|
reed joined #koha |
| 18:59 |
|
nengard |
hi |
| 19:00 |
|
vickiteal |
Hi! |
| 19:00 |
|
gmcharlt |
how quickly 19:00 UTC+0 creeps up |
| 19:00 |
|
chris_n |
lol |
| 19:01 |
|
gmcharlt |
agenda for this meeting is http://wiki.koha-community.org[…]etingnotes10may05 |
| 19:01 |
|
gmcharlt |
let's get started with intros |
| 19:01 |
|
* gmcharlt |
= Galen Charlton, 3.2 RM, Equinox |
| 19:01 |
|
* wizzyrea |
= Liz Rea, Northeast Kansas Library System |
| 19:02 |
|
Sharon |
Sharon Moreland, Northeast Kansas Library System |
| 19:02 |
|
* reed |
Reed Wade, Catalyst IT, NZ |
| 19:02 |
|
* sekjal |
is Ian Walls, ByWater Solutions |
| 19:02 |
|
* magnus |
Magnus Enger, Libriotech, Norway |
| 19:02 |
|
* hdl_laptop |
Henri-Damien LAURENT, 3.0 release maintainer, BibLibre |
| 19:02 |
|
Colin |
= Colin Campbell, PTFS-Europe Ltd |
| 19:02 |
|
* larsw |
= Lars Wirzenius, Catalyst IT NZ, currently working on Koha Debian packages |
| 19:02 |
|
* nengard |
Nicole Engard, ByWater Solutions/Koha Doc Manager |
| 19:02 |
|
* owen |
Owen Leonard, Nelsonville Public Library |
| 19:02 |
|
* chris_n |
= Chris Nighswonger, 3.2 Release Maintainer, FBC |
| 19:02 |
|
brendan |
Brendan Gallagher ByWater Solutions |
| 19:02 |
|
vokalr |
vokalr = Richard Pritsky, vokal |
| 19:02 |
|
ccurry |
Christopher Curry, American Philosophical Society |
| 19:02 |
|
vickiteal |
Vicki Teal Lovely, South Central Library System, Madison, WI, US |
| 19:02 |
|
* jcamins |
= Jared Camins-Esakov, American Numismatic Society |
| 19:02 |
|
ebegin |
Eric Bégin, inLibro, CANADA |
| 19:02 |
|
tajoli |
tajoli = Zeno Tajoli - CILEA (Italy) |
| 19:02 |
|
* cait |
Katrin Fischer, Germany |
| 19:03 |
|
robin-home |
Robin Sheat, Catalyst IT |
| 19:03 |
|
johnindy |
John Long Independence Public Library member of SEKLS |
| 19:03 |
|
chris |
Chris Cormack, Catalyst IT |
| 19:04 |
|
thd |
Thomas Dukleth, Agogme, New York City |
| 19:04 |
|
fredericd |
Frédéric Demians, Tamil |
| 19:05 |
|
gmcharlt |
ok, first agenda item is |
| 19:05 |
|
gmcharlt |
Update on Roadmap to 3.2. |
| 19:06 |
|
gmcharlt |
3.2 alpha2 has been released |
| 19:06 |
|
chris |
yay!! |
| 19:06 |
|
gmcharlt |
goal for getting to beta is addressing the blockers |
| 19:06 |
|
* owen |
cheers |
| 19:06 |
|
chris_n |
gmcharlt++ |
| 19:06 |
|
gmcharlt |
a partial string freeze is in effect |
| 19:06 |
|
chris |
i will update the .po files and send a message to the translate list |
| 19:06 |
|
gmcharlt |
and chris and I will start pushing post-3.2 to topic branches |
| 19:06 |
|
rhcl |
Greg Lawson Rolling Hills Consolidated Library |
| 19:07 |
|
chris |
ill coordinate with Colin as well, he may like to start doing QA on the topic branches |
| 19:07 |
|
chris |
(thats more a 3.4 thing tho, so ignore me) |
| 19:08 |
|
gmcharlt |
goal at this point is to keep 3.2 in alpha2 no longer than necessary to get the blockers closed |
| 19:08 |
|
brendan |
how many current blockers are there ? |
| 19:08 |
|
gmcharlt |
22 |
| 19:09 |
|
DRUlm |
3.2 alpha is looking very good compared to 3.0 'alpha' |
| 19:09 |
|
DRUlm |
YuGo! |
| 19:10 |
|
gmcharlt |
questions? |
| 19:11 |
|
gmcharlt |
if not, we'll move on to 2. Update on Roadmap to 3.0. |
| 19:11 |
|
schuster |
david schuster plano isd |
| 19:11 |
|
magnus |
what's the correct bugzilla-link for seeing the current bugs? i never feel confident i've got the right one... |
| 19:11 |
|
brendan |
I think that sending the link to the koha-devel would be a good idea |
| 19:12 |
|
hdl_laptop |
3.0 bug fix haas been stalled for a while. |
| 19:12 |
|
nengard |
magnus i think we're still at bugs.koha.org |
| 19:12 |
|
hdl_laptop |
But next release should come quickly |
| 19:12 |
|
|
ebegin left #koha |
| 19:12 |
|
chilts |
Andrew Chilton, Catalyst IT (late again) :) |
| 19:12 |
|
chris |
magnus: if people all register, then we can shift to bugs.koha-community.org |
| 19:13 |
|
magnus |
nengard: yup, but is this the curent picture? |
| 19:13 |
|
magnus |
http://bugs.koha.org/cgi-bin/b[…]noop&value0-0-0=& |
| 19:13 |
|
magnus |
n=rel_3_2&votes=&x_axis_field=bug_severity&y_axis_field=bug_status&z_axis_field=&width=500&height=350&action=wrap&format=table |
| 19:13 |
|
magnus |
i only see 4 blockers there? |
| 19:13 |
|
chris |
yeah, you might want a tinyurl.com for that :) |
| 19:13 |
|
gmcharlt |
magnus: I count *all* active bugs that are blockers |
| 19:13 |
|
magnus |
oops, sorry |
| 19:13 |
|
wizzyrea |
http://tinyurl.com/2vbqnzy |
| 19:14 |
|
wizzyrea |
is what I usually go by |
| 19:14 |
|
schuster |
I always wonder what I should go stand by when it says that... |
| 19:14 |
|
wizzyrea |
which admittedly is a horrific list |
| 19:14 |
|
wizzyrea |
lol |
| 19:15 |
|
wizzyrea |
(and, fwiw, you can get to that link anytime by going to http://koha-community.org/support/search-bugs/) |
| 19:15 |
|
cait |
are we sure all blockers are marked as blockers? |
| 19:15 |
|
chris |
thats certainly something people can help with cait |
| 19:16 |
|
gmcharlt |
cait: reasonably sure |
| 19:16 |
|
cait |
Im struggling a bit with severity when reporting bugs |
| 19:16 |
|
wizzyrea |
^^ I have the same problem |
| 19:16 |
|
tomascohen |
magnus: blockers = NEW + ASSIGNED + VERIFIED |
| 19:16 |
|
cait |
what about bug 44 |
| 19:16 |
|
munin |
Bug http://bugs.koha.org/cgi-bin/b[…]how_bug.cgi?id=44 normal, P2, ---, tonnesencmsd.bc.ca, RESOLVED FIXED, scripts dir doesn't get installed to $kohadir |
| 19:16 |
|
cait |
bug 4400 |
| 19:16 |
|
cait |
sorry |
| 19:16 |
|
munin |
Bug http://bugs.koha.org/cgi-bin/b[…]w_bug.cgi?id=4400 normal, P5, ---, oleonardmyacpl.org, NEW, BIBTEX export from OPAC results in empty file |
| 19:17 |
|
magnus |
wizzyrea: ill just bookmark that page on k-c, thanks! ;-) |
| 19:17 |
|
chris |
yep, i wouldnt count that as a blocker |
| 19:17 |
|
gmcharlt |
cait: not a blocker - bibtex is not *that* important in the grand scheme of things |
| 19:17 |
|
tomascohen |
"Patron passwords saved in plain text" |
| 19:18 |
|
cait |
ok |
| 19:18 |
|
chris |
what? |
| 19:19 |
|
gmcharlt |
umm, I suggest that this is not the appropriate time to discuss specific bugs - if you think something ought to be a blocker, say so in the bugzilla |
| 19:19 |
|
gmcharlt |
we can also hold another bug squashing session if people want |
| 19:19 |
|
wizzyrea |
bug_squashing++ |
| 19:19 |
|
wizzyrea |
let's schedule it |
| 19:19 |
|
gmcharlt |
getting back to agenda, hdl_laptop, do you have a timefrmae for release of 3.0.6? |
| 19:19 |
|
hdl_laptop |
I think in the next 2 weeks |
| 19:20 |
|
gmcharlt |
cool, thanks |
| 19:20 |
|
gmcharlt |
next item - followup from action items from 4/7 meeting |
| 19:20 |
|
hdl_laptop |
Then I will try to add some bug fixes done for 3.2 back into 3.0 |
| 19:20 |
|
gmcharlt |
hdl_laptop: umm, are there any big issues that would necessitate a 3.0.7? |
| 19:21 |
|
hdl_laptop |
I donot think so. |
| 19:21 |
|
hdl_laptop |
not on 3.0 |
| 19:22 |
|
gmcharlt |
ok |
| 19:22 |
|
gmcharlt |
hopefully we can hold the line on that if no secrity bugs crop up in the 3.0.x line |
| 19:22 |
|
chris |
sounds good to me |
| 19:23 |
|
gmcharlt |
since I'm not hearing much clamor to discuss 4/7 meeting stuff |
| 19:23 |
|
gmcharlt |
let's move on to |
| 19:23 |
|
gmcharlt |
4. Discuss switching licensing for all new code submissions to Affero General Public License (AGPL) |
| 19:24 |
|
thd |
We have a dependency problem to resolve before we can discuss that properly. |
| 19:24 |
|
gmcharlt |
thd: namely? |
| 19:24 |
|
thd |
MySQL had switched its license to GPL 2 only during the GPLv3 drafting process. |
| 19:25 |
|
chris |
im not sure that matters |
| 19:25 |
|
thd |
My information is that it does matter unless we abstract the database. |
| 19:25 |
|
gmcharlt |
state your sources, then |
| 19:25 |
|
chris_n |
thd: why would it matter? |
| 19:26 |
|
thd |
I have not put the question formally. |
| 19:26 |
|
chris |
we don't interface with mysql at all, its done through DBI, and DBD |
| 19:26 |
|
larsw |
is this about the "shared linking versus static linking" controversy? |
| 19:26 |
|
thd |
chris_n GPL 2 only as opposed to GPL 2 or later is incompatible with AGPL 3. |
| 19:26 |
|
chris_n |
thd: I meant why would running over mysql have anything to do with koha's license? |
| 19:27 |
|
chris |
yes |
| 19:27 |
|
chris_n |
the two are independent at a code level |
| 19:27 |
|
thd |
larsw: this is about what constitutes a derived work. The type of linking should not matter. |
| 19:27 |
|
chris |
i dont think anyone in their right mind could say koha is a derived work of mysql |
| 19:27 |
|
robin-home |
I think it would only matter if you used libmysql or whatever it is. |
| 19:27 |
|
chris_n |
koha is not a derived work of mysql |
| 19:27 |
|
chris |
or vice versa |
| 19:27 |
|
larsw |
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G[…]and_derived_works |
| 19:28 |
|
thd |
chris_n: we have MySQL specific calls in the database and if you take MySQL away Koha does not function. |
| 19:28 |
|
chris |
i dispute that |
| 19:28 |
|
thd |
larsw I would not trust the wikipedia answer to a legal question |
| 19:28 |
|
larsw |
doesn't Koha have a postgresql binding, too? |
| 19:28 |
|
thd |
Please do not mistake me, I am all for AGPL 3. |
| 19:29 |
|
larsw |
thd, I meant the link as background information, for those who haven't heard of this issue before, not legal advice |
| 19:29 |
|
chris |
there are no mysql specific calls |
| 19:29 |
|
chris_n |
thd: I think we are straining to swallow a gnat here |
| 19:29 |
|
thd |
However, I think that we should pursue it in consultation with lawyers who understand the issue well. |
| 19:29 |
|
* chris_n |
thinks we rip out the mysql specific calls (if any exist) |
| 19:30 |
|
reed |
+1 |
| 19:30 |
|
thd |
We cannot have a proper discussion of the issue without slef who has some principled objections to which I have answers. |
| 19:30 |
|
chris_n |
most of the sql is ansi anywhat iirc |
| 19:30 |
|
chris_n |
anyway, even |
| 19:30 |
|
larsw |
personal opinion: if there is a tight linkage with MySQL in Koha, that's a bug and should be fixed; it is not a stumbling block for switching AGPLv3 |
| 19:30 |
|
chris |
using an api is not making something a dervied work |
| 19:30 |
|
chris |
in any uninverse |
| 19:30 |
|
thd |
chris_n: If we change most to all then we are safe. |
| 19:31 |
|
thd |
chris_n: The problem is that the MySQL issue is well known. |
| 19:31 |
|
chris_n |
thd: can you point out an example of a mysql specific call |
| 19:31 |
|
owen |
I would like to include slef in this discussion as well |
| 19:31 |
|
chris_n |
in koha that is |
| 19:31 |
|
gmcharlt |
is slef present at this meeting? |
| 19:31 |
|
thd |
chris_n: any reference to INNODB is MySQL specific. |
| 19:31 |
|
chris |
i think the first step would be to use the or later clause we have, to switch to gplv3 |
| 19:32 |
|
thd |
know and we need to here him out about this issue |
| 19:32 |
|
thd |
s/know/no/ |
| 19:32 |
|
chris_n |
so we probably need to take this discussion to the list |
| 19:32 |
|
larsw |
it's not all that late in the UK; can someone call slef up and invite him to the meeting? |
| 19:33 |
|
thd |
Precisely, because his objections are well known we should ensure that we have his participation. |
| 19:33 |
|
|
tomascohen left #koha |
| 19:33 |
|
larsw |
discussing this on the list(s) is probably a good idea anyway, but shouldn't prevent us from starting a discussion now |
| 19:34 |
|
chris |
larsw++ |
| 19:34 |
|
thd |
Answering his objections in his absence would be unfair to the attention to which slef has given to the matter. |
| 19:34 |
|
chris_n |
right, discussion today does not imply conclusion today |
| 19:34 |
|
chris |
i would like to reframe the discussion |
| 19:34 |
|
chris_n |
thd: answering an objection is not the only part of discussion, however |
| 19:34 |
|
chris |
to first should we move to gplv3 |
| 19:35 |
|
thd |
The problem for MySQL is the same. |
| 19:35 |
|
larsw |
as the newbie I ask: what is the current policy on copyright licensing in Koha? |
| 19:35 |
|
chris |
then we already have the problem thd |
| 19:35 |
|
chris |
as its gplv2 or later already |
| 19:35 |
|
larsw |
chris, I don't think that is correct: gplv2+ can link to gplv2-only without problems |
| 19:35 |
|
thd |
larsw: Currently, as chris said which was decided by Katipo at the outset. |
| 19:36 |
|
chris |
what? |
| 19:36 |
|
thd |
larsw: If you undermine the linking argument about derived works then you undermine the effect of the license. |
| 19:36 |
|
Colin |
MySQL allows gplv3 under the foss exception clause of the sun license |
| 19:37 |
|
chris |
thank you Colin |
| 19:37 |
|
thd |
Colin: what is your source for that? |
| 19:37 |
|
thd |
Colin: do you have a link? |
| 19:37 |
|
Colin |
http://www.mysql.com/about/leg[…]g/foss-exception/ |
| 19:38 |
|
thd |
Colin: that exception is for client libraries only |
| 19:38 |
|
thd |
Colin: I think that does not apply |
| 19:38 |
|
thd |
I had forgotten about that exception at the moment. |
| 19:39 |
|
thd |
The question should be put to the SFLC which understands the licenses well and would be in the best position to defend the license should we ever need that defence. |
| 19:40 |
|
larsw |
is the mysql issue relevant to a discussion whether we want to move from "GPLv2 or later" to "GPLv3 or later" or "AGPLv3 or later"? if we want to move, it's one of the things that may need to be fixed, but that's an implementation detail only, in my humble opinion |
| 19:40 |
|
chris |
larsw++ |
| 19:40 |
|
chris |
deciding intent is more important |
| 19:40 |
|
thd |
larsw: Want to is different from how to, yes. |
| 19:40 |
|
* chris_n |
nominates thd to check in with SFLC and report back |
| 19:40 |
|
thd |
larsw++ |
| 19:41 |
|
thd |
I have withheld public comment on this issue when it has come up to avoid an unnecessary argument with slef. |
| 19:41 |
|
chris |
does thd have time to do that? |
| 19:41 |
|
|
DRUlm left #koha |
| 19:41 |
|
thd |
Yes I do |
| 19:42 |
|
thd |
Asking is simple |
| 19:42 |
|
gmcharlt |
thanks |
| 19:42 |
|
thd |
I also have a thorough treatment of the issue waiting to post. |
| 19:42 |
|
gmcharlt |
I suggest that we resume this discussion on koha-devel |
| 19:42 |
|
thd |
s/issue/intent issue/ |
| 19:42 |
|
larsw |
before we switch topics... |
| 19:43 |
|
gmcharlt |
and (since he re-proposed it) ask chris_n to kick that off |
| 19:43 |
|
larsw |
I'd be interested in a quick show of hands for/against/neutral on the issue of intending a switch go agplv3 |
| 19:43 |
|
* chris_n |
will do that |
| 19:43 |
|
thd |
agplv3+ |
| 19:43 |
|
tajoli |
OK on affero |
| 19:43 |
|
robin-home |
For |
| 19:43 |
|
rhcl |
neutral |
| 19:43 |
|
nengard |
neutral |
| 19:43 |
|
* owen |
neutral for lack of info |
| 19:43 |
|
chris_n |
for |
| 19:43 |
|
magnus |
neutral |
| 19:43 |
|
wizzyrea |
neutral, same as owen |
| 19:43 |
|
Colin |
For |
| 19:44 |
|
chris |
for |
| 19:44 |
|
gmcharlt |
for |
| 19:44 |
|
hdl_laptop |
For |
| 19:44 |
|
chilts |
for |
| 19:44 |
|
reed |
for |
| 19:44 |
|
Sharon |
neutral |
| 19:44 |
|
larsw |
for agplv3+ |
| 19:44 |
|
vokalr |
neutral |
| 19:44 |
|
jcamins |
neutral |
| 19:44 |
|
brendan |
for |
| 19:44 |
|
vickiteal |
neutral, uninformed |
| 19:44 |
|
sekjal |
neutral |
| 19:45 |
|
gmcharlt |
ok, thanks - moving on (unless larsw had a comment to make as a result of the straw poll) |
| 19:45 |
|
gmcharlt |
5. Discuss currently listed rules for becoming listed as a support company on the website |
| 19:45 |
|
larsw |
10 for, 10 neutral, 0 against -- this was not a vote to decide, but it's clearly for a change; thanks, my curiosity is satisifed |
| 19:46 |
|
owen |
slef's got some convincing to do if he is indeed the lone dissenting voter |
| 19:46 |
|
cait |
neutral, dont know enough abot licences |
| 19:46 |
|
gmcharlt |
viz, http://koha.org/support/pay-fo[…]how-to-get-listed |
| 19:46 |
|
gmcharlt |
wizzyrea, I believe that that was your agenda item |
| 19:46 |
|
ccurry |
neutral |
| 19:46 |
|
wizzyrea |
indeed |
| 19:46 |
|
wizzyrea |
So we have these rules |
| 19:47 |
|
wizzyrea |
can someone enlighten me as to 1. who made them 2. do we still want them |
| 19:47 |
|
wizzyrea |
3. if not, what do we want? |
| 19:47 |
|
wizzyrea |
(or do we want any rules re: listing as support vendor on official site at all) |
| 19:47 |
|
brendan |
I think we make new ones for the new subdomains and new website |
| 19:48 |
|
wizzyrea |
I ask because I would like to know what I need to do to add companies to the list :) |
| 19:48 |
|
schuster |
foir |
| 19:48 |
|
brendan |
anyone who has a koha*.* domain is more that welcome to forward that to koha-community.org |
| 19:48 |
|
wizzyrea |
*koha*.* even :) |
| 19:48 |
|
|
jwagner_meeting is now known as jwagner |
| 19:48 |
|
chris |
i propose new support companies email the main koha list |
| 19:48 |
|
jwagner |
Sorry, been off in a meeting |
| 19:48 |
|
wizzyrea |
wb jwagner |
| 19:49 |
|
wizzyrea |
meeting time :) |
| 19:49 |
|
gmcharlt |
given the controversy that these rules have provoked, I suggest a very simple set of criteria |
| 19:49 |
|
chris |
and barring people objecting they get listed |
| 19:49 |
|
brendan |
+1 |
| 19:49 |
|
gmcharlt |
1. support company proposes via list (or perhaps form on the webiste) |
| 19:49 |
|
brendan |
objects should be public too |
| 19:49 |
|
brendan |
s/objects/objections |
| 19:49 |
|
gmcharlt |
2. they get accepted if it is a legitamate proffer of Koha services |
| 19:49 |
|
chris |
likng it so far |
| 19:49 |
|
chris_n |
+1 |
| 19:49 |
|
wizzyrea |
do you want to require at least one demonstrable instance of a running koha install? |
| 19:49 |
|
larsw |
chris, does everyone have a veto? if not, and there is controversy about someone, who gets final word in the decision? |
| 19:50 |
|
nengard |
the majority |
| 19:50 |
|
nengard |
makes the most sense |
| 19:50 |
|
gmcharlt |
3. entries can be removed or disallowed if they are spam, i.e., irrelevant to Koha services |
| 19:50 |
|
reed |
? require them to submit at least one patch |
| 19:50 |
|
chris_n |
interesting |
| 19:50 |
|
nengard |
reed i would like to see some sort of participation from them |
| 19:50 |
|
wizzyrea |
reed: I personally don't want to go there |
| 19:50 |
|
gmcharlt |
4. we keep issues of trademarks, copyrights, out of this |
| 19:50 |
|
wizzyrea |
but that's just me |
| 19:50 |
|
chris_n |
but what about some who may only support not develop |
| 19:51 |
|
chris |
i dont think thats a prerwq |
| 19:51 |
|
thd |
gmcharlt: do you have a 4 not that there should be one? |
| 19:51 |
|
chris |
yeah |
| 19:51 |
|
thd |
oops |
| 19:51 |
|
nengard |
not necessarily a patch, but some display of community and participation |
| 19:51 |
|
robin-home |
No, that makes it hard for eg training companies |
| 19:51 |
|
gmcharlt |
i.e., boil the list down to one question: does the vendor offer Koha services of any kind |
| 19:51 |
|
chris |
+1 |
| 19:51 |
|
magnus |
+1 |
| 19:51 |
|
Colin |
+1 |
| 19:51 |
|
vokalr |
+1 |
| 19:51 |
|
chris_n |
+1 |
| 19:51 |
|
reed |
+1 |
| 19:51 |
|
larsw |
gmcharlt, I propose that vendors no longer actively offering Koha services be dropped occasionally |
| 19:52 |
|
larsw |
but other than that, +1 |
| 19:52 |
|
wizzyrea |
larsw: that seems fair |
| 19:52 |
|
chris_n |
maybe a yearly polll |
| 19:52 |
|
gmcharlt |
larsw: yes, I think that is reasonable, and could be view as a logical consequence of point #2 (legit proffer of Koha services) |
| 19:52 |
|
wizzyrea |
so we are not going to require following the community guidelines? |
| 19:52 |
|
thd |
nengard: the trouble comes from how you measure participation which has been used in an unnecessarily exclusionary way in one unfortunate case. |
| 19:52 |
|
thd |
+1 |
| 19:52 |
|
wizzyrea |
(just to be clear) |
| 19:52 |
|
brendan |
maybe just clean the list right now and all resubmit ? |
| 19:52 |
|
hdl_laptop |
how could you know that the company is not offering koha services ? |
| 19:52 |
|
chris |
what community guidelines? |
| 19:52 |
|
wizzyrea |
http://koha.org/support/pay-fo[…]how-to-get-listed |
| 19:52 |
|
wizzyrea |
step 1 |
| 19:52 |
|
thd |
hdl_laptop++ |
| 19:53 |
|
gmcharlt |
hdl_laptop: well, somebody taking it upon themselves to check their website and/or ask |
| 19:53 |
|
reed |
so, its 'must offer koha services' but the 'you are cool' test is dropped |
| 19:53 |
|
chris_n |
lol |
| 19:53 |
|
chris |
oh yeah, naw, trash those and just go for 1 rule, must offer koha services |
| 19:53 |
|
Colin |
Check at the contact they give... that should deal with ones that cease to exist |
| 19:53 |
|
wizzyrea |
cool. I thought this would be more contentious. :) |
| 19:53 |
|
gmcharlt |
and I guess a point 5 - removal of vendors from list (excpet in the case of obvious spam) must be announced on the mailing list |
| 19:53 |
|
gmcharlt |
with a CC to the vendor's listed contact |
| 19:53 |
|
chris |
and put in nice big letters, no endorsement of any kind is implied by being listed |
| 19:54 |
|
owen |
So are we still saying email the list to initiate a listing? |
| 19:54 |
|
chris_n |
owen: I think yes |
| 19:54 |
|
magnus |
+1 |
| 19:54 |
|
wizzyrea |
It could be done several ways |
| 19:54 |
|
thd |
hdl_laptop: does gmcharlt advertisement of services test satisfy you as something spammers would not bother to do? |
| 19:54 |
|
gmcharlt |
owen: possibly yes, although actually I think a form on the website might be better |
| 19:54 |
|
|
miguel_xercode joined #koha |
| 19:54 |
|
chris_n |
introducing one's self to the community would be appropriate to being listed |
| 19:54 |
|
wizzyrea |
we could have a form that mails the list, for that matter |
| 19:55 |
|
wizzyrea |
though, that might be conducive to spam >.> |
| 19:55 |
|
owen |
Yeah |
| 19:55 |
|
hdl_laptop |
thd: spammers would ask to be listed as a koha support company ? |
| 19:55 |
|
tajoli |
Better a email to the list that a web form, IMHO |
| 19:55 |
|
reed |
+1 for must introduce yourself on the list add make the request there to get added |
| 19:55 |
|
hdl_laptop |
spammers bot are not that "lart" yet. |
| 19:55 |
|
hdl_laptop |
s/lart/smart/ |
| 19:55 |
|
vickiteal |
Which list, koha-l or developer list? |
| 19:55 |
|
wizzyrea |
okies, I'll work something up and send it out to the list |
| 19:55 |
|
chris |
main one |
| 19:55 |
|
gmcharlt |
I'm suggesting a form for a specific purpose, though - to not have the listigns be complete unconstrained in their form |
| 19:55 |
|
tajoli |
The main list |
| 19:55 |
|
wizzyrea |
right |
| 19:55 |
|
wizzyrea |
so |
| 19:56 |
|
vickiteal |
Sorry Chris, your main may not be my main list. ;) |
| 19:56 |
|
thd |
hdl_laptop: human spammers are that smart. gmcharlt's proposed rules are for human spammers |
| 19:56 |
|
chris |
koha list is the main list |
| 19:56 |
|
wizzyrea |
we |
| 19:56 |
|
wizzyrea |
well |
| 19:56 |
|
wizzyrea |
how about this |
| 19:56 |
|
vickiteal |
Thanks. |
| 19:56 |
|
wizzyrea |
a vendor introduces offering services |
| 19:56 |
|
chilts |
gmcharlt: that's ok, because a human will add it to the list (and make it nice and fit in with the rest of the page) |
| 19:56 |
|
wizzyrea |
we can mail them back a link to the form |
| 19:56 |
|
wizzyrea |
so we get uniform data |
| 19:56 |
|
schuster |
When they introduce themselves to the list should they do more than say Hi I'm David and I support Koha ad Schuters in? |
| 19:57 |
|
* reed |
to the train |
| 19:57 |
|
|
reed left #koha |
| 19:57 |
|
schuster |
wizzyrea you typed faster than me. |
| 19:57 |
|
wizzyrea |
or we can provide a template |
| 19:57 |
|
chilts |
yeah, I think it'll be obvious if someone who emails the list actually does something related to Koha |
| 19:57 |
|
wizzyrea |
for introducing your company to the list |
| 19:57 |
|
chilts |
their website would show that, for one |
| 19:57 |
|
wizzyrea |
OH |
| 19:57 |
|
wizzyrea |
one thing |
| 19:57 |
|
chris_n |
+1 # for wizzyrea's suggestion |
| 19:57 |
|
wizzyrea |
I think that a very simple requirement |
| 19:58 |
|
wizzyrea |
is a link back to koha-community.org |
| 19:58 |
|
wizzyrea |
from their website |
| 19:58 |
|
chris_n |
+1 |
| 19:58 |
|
owen |
Good one |
| 19:58 |
|
vokalr |
+1 |
| 19:58 |
|
tajoli |
OK |
| 19:58 |
|
schuster |
+1 |
| 19:58 |
|
hdl_laptop |
+1 |
| 19:58 |
|
schuster |
wizzyrea is on it today! |
| 19:58 |
|
wizzyrea |
ok this is good. |
| 19:58 |
|
thd |
While enforcing a rule against seeming more official than the community project now seems moot, it is certainly a good principle. |
| 19:59 |
|
gmcharlt |
-1 # I disagree - I would prefer that it stick with "does vendor offer Koha services" |
| 19:59 |
|
chris_n |
why? |
| 19:59 |
|
hdl_laptop |
because of context. |
| 19:59 |
|
schuster |
hmmm gmcharlt ... I see a point... |
| 19:59 |
|
brendan |
a link back would help SEO - wouldn't it ? |
| 19:59 |
|
thd |
gmcharlt: I am not proposing a rule |
| 20:00 |
|
chris_n |
hdl_laptop: context? |
| 20:00 |
|
larsw |
the "must link to k-c" sounds like a reaction to ptfs to me (I'm neither for nor against) |
| 20:00 |
|
wizzyrea |
it would, and would have the benefit of forcing them to admit we are official |
| 20:00 |
|
gmcharlt |
all things being equal, I would prefer link back to koha-community.org and following community guidelines |
| 20:00 |
|
* chilts |
gets up to go to work ... ttfn |
| 20:00 |
|
chris |
certainly i still expect ppl to hold support companies to task when they behave badly |
| 20:00 |
|
gmcharlt |
but the well has been poisoned |
| 20:00 |
|
chris |
but i dont think we need to make the website be the stick to hit them with |
| 20:00 |
|
thd |
We should be able to have recommendations of community spirited practises even where they are being ignored by organisations listed. |
| 20:00 |
|
wizzyrea |
larsw: did you see the old rules? Those were a reaction to PTFS, if I've been informed correctly |
| 20:01 |
|
chris |
their customers leaving should be that stick |
| 20:01 |
|
thd |
recommendations are not the same as rules. |
| 20:01 |
|
wizzyrea |
no, I want the official website to be inclusive to a fault, if necessary |
| 20:01 |
|
* chris_n |
thinks that is sometimes a very small stick |
| 20:01 |
|
wizzyrea |
me, personally |
| 20:01 |
|
schuster |
We are not telling them Where they have to put the link... but they should recognize where the software originalted from. |
| 20:01 |
|
larsw |
+1 for a "koha support company best practices checklist" that is not in the form of a cricket bat |
| 20:01 |
|
schuster |
(put the link on their website) |
| 20:01 |
|
thd |
wizzyrea: I am favouring maximum inclusiveness. |
| 20:02 |
|
wizzyrea |
thd: excellent, we are agreed :) |
| 20:02 |
|
thd |
wizzyrea: I merely wonder in some separate place we should list things that we encourage people to do without any stick if they do not do them. |
| 20:03 |
|
wizzyrea |
yes, I agree |
| 20:03 |
|
wizzyrea |
we should post the community guidelines |
| 20:03 |
|
thd |
wizzyrea: carrots all the way. |
| 20:03 |
|
chris |
how about "don't be a dick" |
| 20:03 |
|
gmcharlt |
I would be happy with language requesting link-back to koha-community.org, but not demanding it |
| 20:03 |
|
wizzyrea |
but separate from how to get listed |
| 20:03 |
|
chris |
i think that about covers it |
| 20:03 |
|
wizzyrea |
lol chris |
| 20:03 |
|
chris |
:) |
| 20:03 |
|
owen |
chris: How's that working out for Google? |
| 20:03 |
|
wizzyrea |
oh snap. |
| 20:03 |
|
chris_n |
so what are the procedures for determining if a company is behaving badly and de-listing them? |
| 20:04 |
|
chris |
oh, they have chosen the easier don;t be evil |
| 20:04 |
|
thd |
owen: Google? |
| 20:04 |
|
schuster |
I like that - you can indicate participate in Monthly chat discussions, work on patches, answer questisons on the listserves... |
| 20:04 |
|
larsw |
chris_n, public discussion on the koha@ list, with an invitation to the company to participate in the discussion? |
| 20:04 |
|
gmcharlt |
chris_n: none, if we stick with the principle that listing disclaims endorsement |
| 20:04 |
|
wizzyrea |
chris_n I think we decided that de-listing would only happen if the company no longer supported koha |
| 20:04 |
|
thd |
chris_n: The rules which have been proposed do not consider bad behaviour grounds for delisting |
| 20:05 |
|
owen |
Under what circumstances would a company request a listing and be rejected? |
| 20:05 |
|
wizzyrea |
it's obvious spam? |
| 20:05 |
|
wizzyrea |
that's the only thing I've seen |
| 20:05 |
|
larsw |
blatant intentional violation of the copyright license? |
| 20:05 |
|
wizzyrea |
(which is ok by me, fwiw) |
| 20:05 |
|
chris |
chris_n: this of course doesn't mean people can't point out the bad behaviour |
| 20:05 |
|
thd |
chris_n: endorsement actually may have legal ramifications which could create liabilities as an additional consideration |
| 20:05 |
|
schuster |
Make sure there is the header as Chris mentioned that none of the companies listed are santioned by the koha-community |
| 20:05 |
|
|
Mickey joined #koha |
| 20:06 |
|
* chris_n |
thinks it is unwise to not have the option to remove those who behave badly |
| 20:06 |
|
owen |
And would that rejection be discussed on the mailing list? |
| 20:06 |
|
chris |
badly is too subjective |
| 20:06 |
|
chris |
i do personally reserve the right to call people dicks when i think they are behaving like them though |
| 20:06 |
|
* larsw |
ponders the possibility to just have a pointer from www.koha-community.org to a page on the wiki where support companies can add themselves if they want to |
| 20:07 |
|
thd |
chris_n: under the carrots all the way theory. Good behaviour will be rewarded in other ways and will win out in most every case. |
| 20:07 |
|
chris_n |
so there is nothing I could do as a support company to cause you to have the desire to no longer want to be associated with me? |
| 20:07 |
|
gmcharlt |
owen: the new policies are decided by community vote here; if egregious behavior occurs, matter can be revisit |
| 20:07 |
|
wizzyrea |
the actual form of the list is somewhat in flux |
| 20:07 |
|
wizzyrea |
there is high desire to have it be sortable in many ways |
| 20:07 |
|
wizzyrea |
i am (will be) working with slef to do that |
| 20:07 |
|
|
vokalr left #koha |
| 20:07 |
|
thd |
chris_n: not associating with you would be different from not listing you. |
| 20:07 |
|
schuster |
wizzyrea sortable++ |
| 20:07 |
|
* chris_n |
hopes rather than believes that what thd says is true |
| 20:07 |
|
chris |
chris_n: plenty ...but you'd never do them, but only 2 of them would be worth removal from the list |
| 20:08 |
|
chris |
breach of lthe license |
| 20:08 |
|
chris |
and no longer offering services |
| 20:08 |
|
wizzyrea |
I'm also holding the rule that if you are not listed, you can't submit a news feed for inclusion |
| 20:08 |
|
thd |
chris_n: much of the present problems which the community has are because community endorsement had been used selectively as a weapon |
| 20:09 |
|
owen |
I'm not a support company... Can I submit a news feed? |
| 20:09 |
|
schuster |
Not to mention one company was running the website... |
| 20:09 |
|
thd |
chris_n: I am very confident that in the absence of a bad history with rules, we would have a better situation now as a community. |
| 20:09 |
|
Colin |
and that the procedure was not always done openly |
| 20:09 |
|
wizzyrea |
there is the koha planet aggregator for that kind of stuff |
| 20:09 |
|
chris |
thd: s/much/a tiny bit/ |
| 20:10 |
|
wizzyrea |
owen |
| 20:10 |
|
chris_n |
thd: chris speaks to the point; if a vendor violates the license, they should be delisted |
| 20:10 |
|
larsw |
I feel strongly that openness about inclusion/rejection/removal is essential |
| 20:10 |
|
schuster |
owen you are a support company - you are for hire under your outside consulting aren't you? |
| 20:10 |
|
schuster |
larsw ++ |
| 20:10 |
|
Colin |
larsw++ |
| 20:10 |
|
owen |
schuster: Not "formally" |
| 20:10 |
|
wizzyrea |
opennessP++ |
| 20:11 |
|
thd |
the license we favour actually includes a friendly cure clause |
| 20:11 |
|
wizzyrea |
openness++ even |
| 20:11 |
|
chris |
i vote yes for owen |
| 20:11 |
|
schuster |
Well could "koha libraries" push a newsfeed? |
| 20:11 |
|
wizzyrea |
of course |
| 20:11 |
|
wizzyrea |
easy to do, easily added |
| 20:11 |
|
wizzyrea |
nengard even has a pipe for that |
| 20:11 |
|
schuster |
Then owen would be covered. |
| 20:11 |
|
owen |
I'm just trying to play devil's advocate |
| 20:11 |
|
wizzyrea |
i kno :) |
| 20:11 |
|
nengard |
http://pipes.yahoo.com/nengard/kohablogs |
| 20:12 |
|
Colin |
devil's consultant surely |
| 20:12 |
|
wizzyrea |
I appreciate the discussion, your guidance is necessary |
| 20:12 |
|
nengard |
feel free to tell me of anything I'm missing - I only subscribe to Koha categories |
| 20:12 |
|
schuster |
schuster needs to learn about these pipes... |
| 20:12 |
|
wizzyrea |
ok so |
| 20:12 |
|
wizzyrea |
the rules as I've distilled them |
| 20:12 |
|
nengard |
schuster should read chapter 7 in this awesome book called 'Library Mashups' |
| 20:12 |
|
nengard |
:) |
| 20:12 |
|
|
joetho joined #koha |
| 20:13 |
|
wizzyrea |
Send your introductions to the list |
| 20:13 |
|
wizzyrea |
it would be nice if you linked back to the official website |
| 20:13 |
|
wizzyrea |
don't be a dick (wording to be smithed later) |
| 20:13 |
|
joetho |
Joe Tholen - Tech Coord - SEKLS - Kansas |
| 20:13 |
|
chris |
um no those arent the rules |
| 20:13 |
|
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bgkriegel left #koha |
| 20:14 |
|
chris |
i thought the rules were |
| 20:14 |
|
chris |
send your intro |
| 20:14 |
|
chris |
do you offer koha services |
| 20:14 |
|
chris |
? |
| 20:15 |
|
wizzyrea |
to be fair, I thought that 2 was included in 1 |
| 20:15 |
|
wizzyrea |
but yes, that was what I meant |
| 20:15 |
|
chris |
and thats all |
| 20:15 |
|
chris |
the rest are a separate thing |
| 20:15 |
|
chris |
on same page called |
| 20:15 |
|
wizzyrea |
fair enough. Community guidelines to be posted separately |
| 20:15 |
|
chris |
'being a decent human being' |
| 20:15 |
|
chris |
or something |
| 20:15 |
|
thd |
chris: would like to propose adding a requirement to follow the license and what would be the objective test of violation? |
| 20:16 |
|
vickiteal |
Being a decent company. |
| 20:16 |
|
chris |
companies are made up of humans |
| 20:16 |
|
chris |
who own the decisions they make |
| 20:16 |
|
* owen |
must leave |
| 20:16 |
|
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owen left #koha |
| 20:16 |
|
larsw |
if ($you_provide_koha_services) { send_email(to => "kohalists.koha-community.org"); } else { send_email(to => "yourself"; } |
| 20:16 |
|
chris |
there we go, done :-) |
| 20:16 |
|
chris_n |
lol larsw |
| 20:16 |
|
wizzyrea |
it's so subjective though, what's decent? In business it seems that even the worst behavior is tolerated simply because that's the nature of the free market |
| 20:17 |
|
wizzyrea |
do what you can to win |
| 20:17 |
|
chris |
thats why its nothing to do with the rules |
| 20:17 |
|
wizzyrea |
^^ is what I'm getting at |
| 20:17 |
|
chris |
wizzyrea: that boils back to ppl thinking its ok because they work for a company |
| 20:17 |
|
chris |
but yeah the rule is just do you offer koha services |
| 20:18 |
|
chris |
everything else is untestable |
| 20:18 |
|
vickiteal |
Um, I didn't really think it should say "decent company" or "decent anything." |
| 20:18 |
|
wizzyrea |
oki :) |
| 20:18 |
|
wizzyrea |
just sayin. |
| 20:18 |
|
chris |
if someone violates the license, we will cross that bridge when it happens |
| 20:18 |
|
wizzyrea |
I will fix the rule. |
| 20:19 |
|
vickiteal |
wizzyrea will you recap rules. I'm lost (not unusual). |
| 20:19 |
|
wizzyrea |
we can talk about the community guidelines another time |
| 20:19 |
|
chris |
im fairly sure we could reach a public consensus to remove a company if that happened |
| 20:19 |
|
wizzyrea |
if ($you_provide_koha_services) { send_email(to => "mailto:kohalists.koha-community.org"); } else { send_email(to => "yourself"; } |
| 20:19 |
|
joetho |
The Evergreen website doesn't emphasize support vendors the way we do. |
| 20:19 |
|
thd |
wizzyrea: actually the US Department of Justice is investigating illegal labour market collusion between Apple, Google, IBM, etc. for having the decency not to attempt to poach one another's employees. |
| 20:19 |
|
joetho |
I wonder if we are overthinking this. |
| 20:19 |
|
wizzyrea |
thd: lol. *sigh* |
| 20:19 |
|
chris |
joetho: i thnk we have just simplified it |
| 20:20 |
|
chris |
do you offer koha services |
| 20:20 |
|
chris |
done |
| 20:20 |
|
wizzyrea |
Introduce yourself, provide X info on the list |
| 20:20 |
|
vickiteal |
Thanks. |
| 20:20 |
|
wizzyrea |
info = name of company, contact information, less than 300 characters of company description |
| 20:21 |
|
wizzyrea |
give or take |
| 20:21 |
|
thd |
wizzyrea: The problem is an anti-competitive agreement. Mere politeness is not against anti-trust law. |
| 20:21 |
|
wizzyrea |
website |
| 20:21 |
|
chris_n |
so... alphabetical listings? |
| 20:21 |
|
wizzyrea |
sortable! |
| 20:21 |
|
wizzyrea |
we will get there! |
| 20:21 |
|
wizzyrea |
but alpha for now |
| 20:21 |
|
chris_n |
or a little js to present a random list each pageload? |
| 20:21 |
|
wizzyrea |
I know the order is a contentious issue |
| 20:21 |
|
thd |
wizzyrea: However, unusual politeness by big companies may prompt an investigation. |
| 20:21 |
|
joetho |
sortable by what? Alphabetical? Age of company? Age of CEO? |
| 20:21 |
|
* chris |
has to head to work |
| 20:21 |
|
wizzyrea |
all of the above |
| 20:22 |
|
sekjal |
it would be interesting if we could somehow work out a 'fair' karma system for support companies |
| 20:22 |
|
thd |
Alphabet please or multiple formats. |
| 20:22 |
|
sekjal |
interesting, and likely extremely difficult |
| 20:22 |
|
wizzyrea |
thd: that's the plan |
| 20:22 |
|
thd |
yes I know |
| 20:22 |
|
joetho |
oh my. Fair karma would put PTFS in ILS purgatory. |
| 20:22 |
|
larsw |
wizzyrea, default order being random so as not to favor anyone? :) |
| 20:22 |
|
wizzyrea |
lol that's one option for sure. The page is static at the moment |
| 20:23 |
|
Sharon |
It's a library ILS folks, it best be alphabetical |
| 20:23 |
|
gmcharlt |
specific wording to propose |
| 20:23 |
|
gmcharlt |
http://koha.pastebin.com/T1gPz2kP |
| 20:23 |
|
joetho |
Hmm. B comes before E which comes before both L and P |
| 20:23 |
|
thd |
joetho: We have some of our current problems because LibLime did put PTFS in ILS purgatory. |
| 20:23 |
|
joetho |
oh how I know. |
| 20:23 |
|
schuster |
could you do columns for the information and then use js table sorter to sort them at will? |
| 20:24 |
|
larsw |
gmcharlt++ (but add mailing list address?) |
| 20:24 |
|
chris_n |
+1 #gmcharlt's proposal |
| 20:24 |
|
wizzyrea |
oh for pity's sake, the format of the list is in flux. I will report on it another time |
| 20:24 |
|
wizzyrea |
:) |
| 20:24 |
|
wizzyrea |
I'm working with slef on it, and he holds all of the same concerns you all do |
| 20:24 |
|
gmcharlt |
revised per larsw http://koha.pastebin.com/aqeJTs4D |
| 20:25 |
|
gmcharlt |
I move to propose that wording above as the new vendor listing policy ^^ |
| 20:25 |
|
wizzyrea |
fwiw I'm for the revision |
| 20:25 |
|
wizzyrea |
2nd! |
| 20:25 |
|
chris_n |
+1 |
| 20:25 |
|
Colin |
if the list was random people would just makeup reasons for the order |
| 20:25 |
|
joetho |
I like the pastebin revision, but... |
| 20:25 |
|
schuster |
+12 |
| 20:26 |
|
joetho |
but it doesn't address the linkback issue. Talk about walking on eggshells! |
| 20:26 |
|
wizzyrea |
bah, we can drop it |
| 20:26 |
|
wizzyrea |
idc really, I just didn't want people passing themselves off as official |
| 20:26 |
|
schuster |
off to do a few things to get ready for tomorrow. Thanks all... Hope the 3.2alpha2 can be really short. |
| 20:27 |
|
wizzyrea |
ok, i will take this wording, we can change it later |
| 20:27 |
|
wizzyrea |
if we want/need to |
| 20:27 |
|
wizzyrea |
thank you, very good discussion |
| 20:27 |
|
joetho |
+1 for galen's latest pastebin revision |
| 20:27 |
|
wizzyrea |
I'll put the community guidelines on the next agenda :) |
| 20:28 |
|
vickiteal |
Thanks for all your work wizzyrea. |
| 20:28 |
|
thd |
nengard: before we go to far along on the new wiki there is a technical issue which would be good to correct |
| 20:28 |
|
* chris_n |
has to go, bbl |
| 20:28 |
|
nengard |
thd? |
| 20:29 |
|
gmcharlt |
thd: if you're referring to the database setup, I will revamp it over the weekend |
| 20:29 |
|
gmcharlt |
keeping the current en content, of course |
| 20:29 |
|
thd |
I raised it my last post on the mailing list and then I ran out of time to sleep |
| 20:29 |
|
thd |
gmcharlt: yes |
| 20:30 |
|
thd |
gmcharlt: I refer to the cool short URLs issue. |
| 20:31 |
|
gmcharlt |
k, I'll look into it on the weekend |
| 20:31 |
|
gmcharlt |
ok, since this has lasted an hour and a half |
| 20:31 |
|
wizzyrea |
wow, sorry about that |
| 20:31 |
|
gmcharlt |
I propose to not allow further agenda items |
| 20:31 |
|
nengard |
+1 |
| 20:31 |
|
gmcharlt |
and move on to setting the next meeting time |
| 20:32 |
|
gmcharlt |
I propose 10:00 UTC+0 on 2 June |
| 20:32 |
|
wizzyrea |
+1 |
| 20:32 |
|
thd |
+1 |
| 20:32 |
|
Colin |
+1 |
| 20:32 |
|
hdl_laptop |
+1 |
| 20:32 |
|
miguel_xercode |
1 |
| 20:32 |
|
larsw |
0 (I fine with anything, really) |
| 20:32 |
|
nengard |
+1 |
| 20:33 |
|
tajoli |
+1 |
| 20:33 |
|
gmcharlt |
ok, thanks all |
| 20:33 |
|
wizzyrea |
yay |
| 20:33 |
|
wizzyrea |
thanks everybody |
| 20:33 |
|
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Lee joined #koha |
| 20:34 |
|
nengard |
hi Lee |
| 20:34 |
|
Lee |
hey |
| 20:34 |
|
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larsw left #koha |
| 20:34 |
|
wizzyrea |
oh hey lee |
| 20:34 |
|
Lee |
guess I missed the meeting |
| 20:34 |
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miguelxercode joined #koha |
| 20:34 |
|
thd |
gmcharlt nengard: I also think that we should have English content at en.wiki.koha-community.org and that wiki.koha-community.org should be a static page pointing at en.wiki.koha-community.org for now with other languages added after testing how they work in some other test database to avoid breaking things. |
| 20:34 |
|
Lee |
hey liz |
| 20:34 |
|
wizzyrea |
probably en-wiki |
| 20:34 |
|
joetho |
+1 but isn't that pretty earlylate in NZ? |
| 20:35 |
|
nengard |
thd makes sense - and agree with wizzyrea about the URL |
| 20:35 |
|
thd |
Is wizzyrea administering DNS? |
| 20:35 |
|
wizzyrea |
(just easier re: DNS that way) |
| 20:36 |
|
wizzyrea |
no |
| 20:36 |
|
wizzyrea |
< does quite a bit of it in her job though |
| 20:37 |
|
thd |
nengard: Does agree with wizzyrea about the URL mean agree with her about which one points to the wiki? |
| 20:37 |
|
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tajoli left #koha |
| 20:37 |
|
thd |
at www.koha.org |
| 20:37 |
|
nengard |
i agree with en-wiki |
| 20:37 |
|
nengard |
and agree with you that we can have diff languages |
| 20:37 |
|
nengard |
now i'm logging off - was up at 3am for a flight - and too tired |
| 20:38 |
|
thd |
nengard: wait one moment please |
| 20:38 |
|
|
nengard left #koha |
| 20:38 |
|
thd |
nengard: do you prefer en-wiki.* to en.wiki.* |
| 20:38 |
|
gmcharlt |
thd: negard has gone to bed |
| 20:39 |
|
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jwagner left #koha |
| 20:39 |
|
thd |
gmcharlt: yes everyone deserves adequate sleep |
| 20:39 |
|
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sekjal left #koha |
| 20:40 |
|
Lee |
galen is anyone posting the minutes from the this IRC meeting? |
| 20:40 |
|
Lee |
I was late |
| 20:41 |
|
|
vickiteal left #koha |
| 20:41 |
|
thd |
We volunteer you Lee |
| 20:41 |
|
gmcharlt |
Lee: http://stats.workbuffer.org/ir[…]10-05-05#i_434509 |
| 20:42 |
|
Lee |
thanks I bow to your expert organizational skills.:) |
| 20:42 |
|
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miguel_xercode left #koha |
| 20:43 |
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Mickey left #koha |
| 20:43 |
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ccurry left #koha |
| 20:43 |
|
thd |
wizzyrea: one reference to wiki.koha.community.org should suffice and people can choose a language from their with English being the only localisation choice offered initially. |
| 20:44 |
|
thd |
I will pledge to move content created in other languages as a spur to make sure I test multi-lingual localisation very soon. |
| 20:44 |
|
wizzyrea |
any of these options are fine by me |
| 20:47 |
|
wizzyrea |
thd: thanks :) |
| 20:49 |
|
cait |
good night all |
| 20:50 |
|
|
cait left #koha |
| 20:50 |
|
thd |
gmcharlt: The primary issue to which I was referring is http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Short_URL for which there is a namespace conflict in the file system currently. Not of earhshattering importance but trivial to fix now rather than later where more knowledge would be needed to fix it. |
| 20:50 |
|
gmcharlt |
gotcha |
| 20:50 |
|
|
jcamins left #koha |
| 20:53 |
|
* magnus |
wishes everyone a good time of the day |
| 20:53 |
|
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magnus left #koha |
| 20:56 |
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reed joined #koha |
| 20:56 |
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mbreeding left #koha |
| 21:02 |
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Colin left #koha |
| 21:05 |
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schuster left #koha |
| 21:07 |
|
wizzyrea |
lots are gone, but http://koha-community.org/get-[…]d/for-librarians/ |
| 21:10 |
|
chris_n |
http://www.koha.biz/updates/issue-one.html |
| 21:10 |
|
chris_n |
now we have our own magazine :) |
| 21:11 |
|
chris_n |
http://www.kohaindia.org/ |
| 21:12 |
|
brendan |
sweet we should submit an article |
| 21:12 |
|
chris_n |
wizzyrea++ |
| 21:12 |
|
|
richard joined #koha |
| 21:12 |
|
chris_n |
chris may know something about that magazine |
| 21:12 |
|
chris_n |
it looks to be in NZ-land |
| 21:13 |
|
chris_n |
hey richard |
| 21:13 |
|
richard |
hi chris_n |
| 21:15 |
|
Nate |
gnight #koha! |
| 21:15 |
|
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Nate left #koha |
| 21:22 |
|
chris_n |
now available in php: http://www.findmysoft.com/scri[…]ows-download.html |
| 21:22 |
|
gmcharlt |
or not available in PHP, as the case may be :) |
| 21:22 |
|
|
Lee left #koha |
| 21:23 |
|
wizzyrea |
http://koha-community.org/supp[…]ow-to-get-listed/ |
| 21:23 |
|
chris_n |
gmcharlt: ;-) |
| 21:23 |
|
wizzyrea |
this makes me feel happy and zenlike inside. |
| 21:24 |
|
wizzyrea |
going to get your rules now |
| 21:27 |
|
wizzyrea |
refresh, that's actually proper per what we agreed upon |
| 21:27 |
|
wizzyrea |
about to add the link to the mailing list |
| 21:28 |
|
gmcharlt |
nice and simple |
| 21:29 |
|
gmcharlt |
wizzyrea: I do think you ought to post the new policy to the Koha ML |
| 21:29 |
|
wizzyrea |
I will do that... just copy/paste from the website |
| 21:29 |
|
wizzyrea |
I think i'll also add a link to the notes from the meeting saying it was agreed by community blah blah |
| 21:29 |
|
chris_n |
http://koha-plus.sourceforge.net/ |
| 21:29 |
|
chris_n |
http://www.intersearch.com.au/ |
| 21:29 |
|
|
brendan left #koha |
| 21:29 |
|
chris_n |
http://koha.unlp.edu.ar/ |
| 21:29 |
|
chris_n |
for your reading pleasure |
| 21:30 |
|
chris |
back |
| 21:30 |
|
chris |
didn't intersearch recently email, or post on the site? |
| 21:30 |
|
chris_n |
dunno |
| 21:30 |
|
chris |
would be lovely to encouage them to be more involved |
| 21:31 |
|
chris_n |
chris: do you know about the Koha magazine? |
| 21:32 |
|
chris |
yeah |
| 21:32 |
|
* chris_n |
really should find other things to do |
| 21:32 |
|
chris |
theres tons of things called koha in nz |
| 21:32 |
|
chris_n |
that would make it kinda hard to trademark the word I'd think |
| 21:32 |
|
wizzyrea |
it's a lovely word, lovely premise, why wouldn't you use it everywhere |
| 21:32 |
|
chris |
chris_n: you trademark in certain usage |
| 21:33 |
|
wizzyrea |
so you trademark for koha as defined as ILS |
| 21:33 |
|
|
brendan joined #koha |
| 21:33 |
|
chris |
so you can only tm it in terms of a specific usage ... and not the common usage |
| 21:33 |
|
chris |
yes |
| 21:33 |
|
chris_n |
ahh |
| 21:33 |
|
chris |
thats what liblime did |
| 21:33 |
|
chris |
applied for anyway |
| 21:34 |
|
chris |
ah yes intersearch did |
| 21:34 |
|
chris |
we should point them to the page |
| 21:34 |
|
chris |
they can be the test case |
| 21:34 |
|
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brendan left #koha |
| 21:40 |
|
|
thd is now known as thd-away |
| 21:40 |
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Sharon left #koha |
| 21:42 |
|
Elwell |
Hi folks - don't suppose any of you has a guest link to the LWN article do you? (my subs must have run out :-() |
| 21:43 |
|
chris |
it should pop out of the paywall in a day or so |
| 21:43 |
|
Elwell |
13th apparently |
| 21:43 |
|
chris |
ahh a week |
| 21:44 |
|
Elwell |
yeah - I'll prbably resub as I object to having to read last weeks news |
| 21:47 |
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brendan joined #koha |
| 21:50 |
|
Elwell |
OK - feel free to tell me to shut up if this touches a nerve - Just read the LWN article, got the impression from IRC logs that things were 'tense' with liblime before. who are all the catalyst NZ people here - is that just a local company who happens to have a lot of koha customers? |
| 21:52 |
|
* chris |
works for catalyst |
| 21:52 |
|
chris |
so yeah its an nz company that has one of the original koha developers, plus russel who also used to work at katipo and then liblime with me |
| 21:52 |
|
chris |
and a bunch of other developers |
| 21:53 |
|
Elwell |
aaah OK |
| 21:53 |
|
chris |
108ish staff at catalyst |
| 21:53 |
|
chris |
http://www.catalyst.net.nz/ |
| 21:53 |
|
Elwell |
(websites slow) - wellinton? |
| 21:53 |
|
chris |
yeah |
| 21:54 |
|
|
hdl_laptop left #koha |
| 21:54 |
|
chris |
international transit to/from NZ is stink |
| 21:54 |
|
Elwell |
yeah I know. I work in HEP / HPC and um yeah even melbourne has issues and thats miles closer :-) |
| 21:55 |
|
chris |
you do any php Elwell ? |
| 21:55 |
|
chris |
wanna move to nz? :-) |
| 21:55 |
|
Elwell |
of 'hello world' quality (and yes we considwered it before - my kids are kiwis) |
| 21:55 |
|
chris |
we are like the UN at catalyst, but our swiss guy just left ... we need a new one ;) |
| 21:55 |
|
chris |
http://www.catalyst.net.nz/vacancies |
| 21:56 |
|
chris |
we do lots of perl (obviously) too |
| 21:56 |
|
chris |
some python some ruby, reed and lars would like it to be more python im sure :) |
| 21:57 |
|
Elwell |
well my contracts just been extended (hopefully - I have till the end of the month otherwise) for 3 yrs so unlikely to move now till kids finish school |
| 21:57 |
|
chris |
catalyst have been really good to me wrt giving me time to work on koha stuff that is not directly billable |
| 21:58 |
|
Elwell |
I'm not ruling NZ out but I'd prefer south island (hey, I ski) |
| 21:59 |
|
reed |
cheap flights from wellington to down there |
| 22:00 |
|
chris |
yup, you can be on the mountain in a couple of hours (maybe more like 3) |
| 22:00 |
|
reed |
and yeah, Catalyst is a pretty sweet place to work for a lot of reasons |
| 22:01 |
|
Elwell |
right - fresh install of koha as I've not touched it for over a year - What OS do you folks develop on? ('s going in a VM for now) |
| 22:01 |
|
chris |
debian |
| 22:01 |
|
Elwell |
cool |
| 22:01 |
|
chris |
lenny for 3.2 |
| 22:01 |
|
chris |
squeeze for 3.4 |
| 22:01 |
|
Elwell |
stable's good enough for me |
| 22:02 |
|
chris |
squeeze has all the perl modules |
| 22:02 |
|
chris |
thanks to lars getting hte lsat missing ones in |
| 22:02 |
|
chris |
so less cpan involved |
| 22:02 |
|
chris |
and the koha package is being developed to work with squeez |
| 22:02 |
|
chris |
e |
| 22:02 |
|
reed |
you can take the train to Ruapehu, about 3-4hrs |
| 22:03 |
|
chris |
oh i lie, one left |
| 22:03 |
|
chris |
http://qa.debian.org/developer[…]et.nz&comaint=yes |
| 22:03 |
|
Elwell |
but I can locally chuck them in with dh-make-perl? |
| 22:04 |
|
Elwell |
(think thats what it was called - not had to do that for ages) |
| 22:04 |
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larsw joined #koha |
| 22:04 |
|
chris |
yup you can |
| 22:10 |
|
Elwell |
anyhow - up for work in ~6h. bed. |
| 22:10 |
|
chris |
sleep well |
| 22:14 |
|
chris_n |
gmcharlt: I'll try out colin's patch tomorrow |
| 22:25 |
|
chris_n |
is anyone successfully sending "Advance Notice of Item Due" notices? |
| 22:25 |
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robin-home left #koha |
| 22:44 |
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reed left #koha |
| 22:49 |
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mbreeding joined #koha |
| 22:51 |
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mbreeding left #koha |
| 22:56 |
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nengard joined #koha |
| 23:11 |
|
chris |
hi nengard |
| 23:11 |
|
nengard |
hi |
| 23:12 |
|
* chris |
wonders if mbreeding is planning to report on the meetings |
| 23:12 |
|
brendan |
hey nengard |
| 23:12 |
|
nengard |
chris yeah i was wondering about that too |
| 23:12 |
|
nengard |
and hi brendan |
| 23:12 |
|
brendan |
be interesting to read his opinion... kind of wish he'd announce himself so that we could add his name to the notes |
| 23:12 |
|
nengard |
trying very hard to read something very interesting ...but i keep letting myself get distracted |
| 23:12 |
|
chris |
not that i mind anyone turning up to the meetings |
| 23:12 |
|
chris |
but yeah, announcing would be nice |
| 23:13 |
|
nengard |
oh - he was in the meeting?? |
| 23:13 |
|
chris |
both |
| 23:13 |
|
chris |
the last 2 meetings |
| 23:13 |
|
nengard |
i thought you meant reporting in general |
| 23:13 |
|
nengard |
ahhh |
| 23:13 |
|
nengard |
got it |
| 23:13 |
|
brendan |
me too - I want everyone - because everyone got something good to say |
| 23:13 |
|
nengard |
okay - reading now - ignoring you all until i'm done :) hehe |
| 23:13 |
|
chris |
hehe |
| 23:13 |
|
brendan |
well I hope they do (but not totally true) |
| 23:17 |
|
slef |
drat |
| 23:17 |
|
slef |
just saw owen's tweet |
| 23:17 |
|
chris |
you didn't miss anything |
| 23:18 |
|
chris |
we decided to discuss on the mailing list anyway |
| 23:18 |
|
slef |
I'm sure when I looked last week there were no meetings this week? |
| 23:18 |
|
chris |
there were 2 meetings this week |
| 23:18 |
|
brendan |
not really - we where all waiting for you |
| 23:18 |
|
chris |
yesterday and today :) |
| 23:18 |
|
slef |
I hate May. All meetings are out of place. |
| 23:18 |
|
slef |
And this year, we have a general election adding even more confusion. |
| 23:19 |
|
larsw |
nengard, an announcement of Koha Debian packages is premature, but would an announcement that Debian should now have all Debian dependencies be appropriate for the newsletter? |
| 23:20 |
|
nengard |
larsw it would be very appropriate! send it along :) |
| 23:24 |
|
slef |
What's the copy deadline on the newsletter? |
| 23:26 |
|
nengard |
emailed to me by the end of the 13th your time |
| 23:26 |
|
nengard |
whatever time zone you're in |
| 23:26 |
|
chilts |
that makes it easier ... timezones make me want to cry sometimes :) |
| 23:41 |
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Sharon joined #koha |
| 23:48 |
|
brendan |
chris I'm not sure - I may have missed this - is there any planned freeze on bugs.koha.org or are we waiting for people to create usernames? |
| 23:53 |
|
chris |
the latter |
| 23:53 |
|
chris |
ill give it a week, then ill call a freeze |
| 23:53 |
|
chris |
for another weeks time |
| 23:55 |
|
chris |
sounds feasible? |
