IRC log for #koha, 2009-12-08

All times shown according to UTC.

Time S Nick Message
00:00 Genji just @attr 1=31 1983, unsupported use.
00:01 pianohacker Huh.
00:01 Genji @attr 1=31 4=109 , success.. no results.
00:01 munin Genji: Error: "attr" is not a valid command.
00:02 pianohacker Jesus christ, I loathe z39.50 and zebra's unhelpful error codes
00:03 Genji Yup.
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00:26 Genji Yahoo!!!!!
00:26 Genji it was being parsed by icuchain
00:27 owen Okay, here's a make test error if anyone's willing to interpret:
00:27 owen Error:  Can't locate C4/ in @INC (@INC contains: /home/oleonard/kohaclone/blib/PERL_MODULE_DIR /home/oleonard/kohaclone/blib/arch /etc/perl /usr/local/lib/perl/5.10.0 /usr/local/share/perl/5.10.0 /usr/lib/perl5 /usr/share/perl5 /usr/lib/perl/5.10 /usr/share/perl/5.10 /usr/local/lib/site_perl . /etc/perl /usr/local/lib/perl/5.10.0 /usr/local/share/perl/5.10.0 /usr/lib/perl5...
00:27 owen .../usr/share/perl5 /usr/lib/perl/5.10 /usr/share/perl/5.10 /usr/local/lib/site_perl .) at (eval 3) line 2
00:31 pianohacker owen: is this a dev install?
00:31 owen Yes
00:31 pianohacker would make sense, since PERL_MODULE_DIR hasn't been replaced with the correct location of the perl modules
00:32 pianohacker env PERL5LIB=/home/oleonard/kohaclone/ make test might work
00:33 owen I was curious about that. Did I miss a step during the preparation, or is that normal for a dev install, or what?
00:35 pianohacker I think that's normal for a dev install
00:35 pianohacker Yet another bug
00:35 chris i dont think thats normal
00:36 chris you have done the make install step?
00:37 chris thats certainly not what my koha-httpd.conf has set as it's PERL5LIB
00:37 chris mine says    SetEnv PERL5LIB "/home/chris/git/koha.git"
00:38 chris if there are any BLIB things in your koha-httpd.conf
00:38 pianohacker chris: in the same vein: should you disable the seemingly worthless blib copy step for a dev install, and can you?
00:38 chris you ahve either missed a step, or symlinked the wrong one
00:38 chris its not worthless
00:38 chris the install step copies your config files outside of your git dir
00:39 chris so and changes the values in them
00:39 chris so they dont get stomped over
00:39 chris if you do a git clean or something
00:39 pianohacker what about copying C4/ to blib/PERL_MODULE_DIR/ ?
00:39 chris that's harmless
00:39 pianohacker Also, I've duplicated owen's error exactly :/
00:39 chris did you do the make install step?
00:40 pianohacker Not recently, time to likely fubar my zebra config
00:40 chris and end up with a koha-httpd.conf file outside in something like /home/chris/koha-dev/etc/koha-httpd.conf ?
00:41 pianohacker still fails after a make install; though it's set correctly in koha-httpd.conf
00:43 chris and you have copied that to your apache2 and restarted apache etc?
00:44 chris so apache is using the right config file?
00:44 chris (the one with no BLIB stuff in it)
00:44 pianohacker Koha itself is, to the best of my knowledge, working fine
00:44 pianohacker It's make test that's broken
00:44 pianohacker Sorry
00:44 chris oh make test
00:44 chris yeah ignore it
00:45 chris make test is currently worthless
00:45 owen :) So ignore any warnings it gives me?
00:45 chris yes
00:45 pianohacker Again, sorry for the stress. Why the include for C4/Bookfund broken, anyway?
00:45 pianohacker (if you know)
00:46 pianohacker Just seems like the test suite is spitting out some very odd errors
00:46 chris C4/Bookfund doesnt exist
00:46 chris the problem is bad people have changed lots of code
00:46 chris and not changed the tests
00:46 chris :-)
00:46 chris there is no C4::Bookfund anymore
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00:47 chris but there is still a t/Bookfund.t
00:47 pianohacker ooh, can we add _another_ focus for 3.4?
00:47 chris I will reject patches for this reason
00:47 pianohacker Fix the test suite
00:47 pianohacker I was just about to ask
00:56 Genji chris, ive fixed my problem. the arabic coder put the numeric field into the icuchain.
00:57 chris cool
00:57 Genji So, i just removed the icuchain from numerics.. and it worked!
00:57 * brendan hands chris a judges mallet
00:57 pianohacker Zebra problem solving: poke poke poke *check* *sigh* poke poke p- Hey, it works!
00:58 * Genji nods... "Something like that. It was hdl who gave me the clue, by giving me the content of his default.idx, relevant to numeric.
00:59 Genji I would of never thought of htat.
00:59 Genji that.
01:03 Genji can icuchains slow down the zebra search?
01:04 pianohacker I have no idea. It's possible, but you'd have to measure
01:04 Genji any easy method of measuring koha speed bottlenecks?
01:04 pianohacker In koha's current design, there's so many other factors that the 0.1 seconds you'd probably save would pale in comparison to a 5-second page load
01:04 pianohacker *shrug* there's perl profilers
01:05 masonj the bottlenecks are pretty well understood, imho..
01:05 masonj circ has become quite slower, in koha3
01:06 masonj from the xml handling
01:06 pianohacker yup
01:06 pianohacker zebra's fast enough that most search bottlenecks are going to be on the koha side, most likely
01:06 masonj but the zebra searching is really fast, so win some/lose some ;)
01:08 masonj yeah, but the circ/xml stuff can get fixed in the future, i am sure
01:09 masonj ive been collecting munin stats, on a well-loaded koha3 prod-box for 6 months
01:10 masonj .. and using munin's mysql/innodb plugings to tune the mysql and apache settings
01:10 pianohacker what's your average system load like?
01:13 masonj around 1.0 during the day, with high/low values of 0.6/1.4
01:13 chris how many cores mason?
01:13 masonj on a intel 'core duo?' 1.8
01:13 masonj snap ;)
01:13 chris ahh so thats under 1
01:13 chris sweet
01:14 masonj $ cat /proc/cpuinfo
01:14 masonj vendor_id       : GenuineIntel
01:14 masonj model name      : Intel(R) Xeon(R) CPU            3040  @ 1.86GHz
01:15 masonj /me cant remember intel cpu models...
01:17 masonj koha3 prolly makes good use of a dual core system
01:17 masonj as mysql and zebra both get busy under load
01:23 Genji Okay, im off to a movie in celebration!
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03:18 Amit heya brendan, chris_n2, chris
03:19 brendan heya amit
03:20 brendan how was the commute to work today?
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03:38 CGI813 hey guys my name is josh!
03:38 pianohacker greetings
03:38 pianohacker Do you have a specific koha question?
03:38 CGI813 hey pianohacker
03:38 CGI813 no but you can ask me anything?
03:38 hdl_laptop @later tell Genji : When you are not using index w, since @attr 4=109 tells about structure  index :n and default is w, search without @attr 4=109 will definitely fail.
03:38 munin hdl_laptop: The operation succeeded.
03:39 CGI813 are u still there
03:40 pianohacker yes
03:41 pianohacker as you don't have a question
03:41 pianohacker I do not have an answer
03:41 CGI813 i do?
03:41 CGI813 why are you so inpatient for?
03:41 pianohacker not impatient
03:41 pianohacker just quiet
03:42 CGI813 what do you mean?
03:42 * SelfishMan mumbles about bots
03:42 chris i wonder if we should just kill the cgi::irc .. most ppl use mibbit now
03:42 SelfishMan chris: yes
03:42 chris oh wait, we can't
03:43 SelfishMan Also, I wrote a really nice addon for irssi that redacts people on your ignore list
03:43 pianohacker Oh, right
03:43 SelfishMan makes it rather entertaining at times
03:43 pianohacker SelfishMan: redacts?
03:43 CGI813 are you bots?
03:44 SelfishMan
03:44 SelfishMan Example:
03:44 SelfishMan 22:42 <CGI813> <redacted>
03:44 CGI813 are you bots?
03:44 pianohacker Oh my
03:44 CGI813 hello
03:45 CGI813 are you YES or NO?
03:45 CGI813 im talkin to you pianohacker
03:49 CGI813 pianohacker are you there
03:49 CGI813 who are you
03:50 CGI813 losers
03:50 CGI813 your such freaks i swear
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03:52 chris the annoying thing is, im not sure it always comes from a fixed ip, since the server is in amazon's cloud
03:53 chris but blocking is probably a good start
03:56 SelfishMan I can't remember, where are the logs for this channel?
03:57 chris
03:57 SelfishMan thank you
03:59 SelfishMan I would bet that it is prety static
04:01 SelfishMan changing an IP for a production website is pretty painful
04:01 chris yeah but it's ec2
04:01 SelfishMan and?
04:01 chris i dont know how their networking works
04:01 SelfishMan ec2 fully supports static IPs
04:01 chris yes on the front
04:03 SelfishMan I've worked with ec2 more than enough and can say that the cgi::irc client will keep coming from that IP unless LL restructures
04:04 SelfishMan and if they change things then it will be static again
04:04 chris cool
04:04 chris i know they do DNAT and SNAT
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04:07 SelfishMan yeah but public IPs are pretty constant.  An instance will send traffic out via the static IP.  Dynamic IPs are another story though
04:07 chris yup
04:08 SelfishMan I'm not a fan of EC2 because of all the tricks they do and hoops they make people jump through
04:10 CGI985 I have same problem yet...
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04:14 chris i dont think that was a bot, just a bored kid
04:14 chris either that or the worst bot ive seen
04:14 pianohacker ELIZA would be deeply ashamed
04:14 SelfishMan yeah, not likely to be a bot but it had all the same behavior
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04:20 CGI118 hi all
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04:22 CGI1985 when I try to run /etc/init.d/apache2 restart
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04:22 CGI1985 it show following error, which I cant solve yet
04:22 CGI1985 Restarting web server: apache2[Sun Dec 06 13:16:11 2009] [warn] NameVirtualHost *:80 has no VirtualHosts ... waiting .[Sun Dec 06 13:16:13 2009] [warn] NameVirtualHost *:80 has no VirtualHosts
04:22 CGI1985 can any body help me regarding this
04:23 pianohacker CGI1985: You can safely ignore that unless something else is broken
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04:33 masonj yep, thats exactly what i said last nite, too ;)
04:38 masonj it would be a nice mod to the current koha-irc page, to snarf ans display the clients ip address
04:38 masonj s/ans/and/
04:39 masonj that would def. make people a little more cautious about driveby irc-spamming
04:40 masonj and would allow me to ignore further chat from that ip, in future
04:43 pianohacker masonj: The username of the user is their IP in hex form
04:43 pianohacker masonj: see for an useful translator
04:44 masonj aaah, too easy!
04:44 pianohacker I'm pretty sure that's true, haven't seen it confirmed
04:44 pianohacker If so, the chanops could easily ban specific CGI::IRC IPs
04:45 pianohacker If, that is, we had any chanops
04:49 pianohacker (confirmed: , section "Access settings")
05:02 pianohacker Good night
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06:31 Genji Hiya.. whats YAML?
06:31 imp YAML Ain't Markup Language (tm) ;)
06:32 Genji Whats it doing in Koha?
06:33 imp Genji: guess it's this yaml: "Yet Another Multicolumn Layout"
06:36 Genji "YAML::Syck" is the longest running sub in a opac-search ive got.
06:36 Genji 10.4   0.270  0.270   3039   0.0001 0.0001  YAML::Syck::DumpYAML
06:37 Genji followed by
06:37 Genji 8.14   0.210  0.210   3039   0.0001 0.0001  YAML::Syck::LoadYAML
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06:43 CGI1985 this command is not working /etc/perl/CPAN/ initialized
06:44 CGI1985 bash: /etc/perl/CPAN/ Permission denied
06:44 CGI1985 sudo /etc/perl/CPAN/ initializedsudo: /etc/perl/CPAN/ command not found
06:45 Amit heya Genji
06:46 Genji hiya Amit.
06:46 CGI1985 left #koha
06:46 Genji Amit: i fixed my numeric index problem.
06:46 Amit ok
06:46 Amit what problem?
06:50 Genji Oh, you don't know. Okay, problem was 260$c, pubdate, was not being indexed correctly.
06:50 Genji This was a library that made koha work for Arabic, back in koha 3.0rc1.
06:52 Genji So, obviously, one of the developers thought a quick and easy way to transliterate utf8 was to use icuchain rules.
06:52 Genji That developer made the mistake of putting these icuchains everywhere in default.idx.
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07:04 CGI1985 this command is not working /etc/perl/CPAN/ initialized<CGI1985> bash: /etc/perl/CPAN/ Permission denied<CGI1985>  sudo /etc/perl/CPAN/ initializedsudo: /etc/perl/CPAN/ command not found
07:04 CGI1985 how can I solve this
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07:10 Ropuch Morning #koha
07:10 imp hi Ropuch
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07:54 chris Genji: yaml is a fantastic way to construct config files, and the systempreference editor uses it also
07:56 Ropuch Helllo chris
07:57 chris hiya Ropuch
08:03 Genji chris: an opac search spends 10% of its time, wrapped up in YAML calls.
08:04 chris yep, thats the config file, if it was xml it would be about 50% of its time
08:04 chris 3.2 caches those calls
08:05 chris
08:06 chris before cache
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08:06 chris after
08:06 chris
08:07 Genji would it be difficult to murge the cache calls from 3.2 into a 3.0 base?
08:07 chris yes
08:07 CGI1985 joined #koha
08:07 CGI1985 is any one there to solve my problem
08:07 chris but not impossible
08:07 chris C4::Languages is the slowest part of every page in the opac
08:08 CGI1985 hi masonj: r u there?
08:09 CGI1985 I have not solved this prob yet?
08:11 pastebot "chris" at pasted "caching the slow language queries" (16 lines) at
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08:11 chris genji, you will need memcached running
08:11 chris then you can try that out
08:12 chris on any modules you like, caching anything that is safe to do so
08:12 chris memcached running and the Memoize::Memcached perl module
08:13 paul_p hi chris, Genji & al
08:13 pastebot "chris" at pasted "caching the slow language queries - with hardcoded values" (16 lines) at
08:13 chris hiya paul_p
08:16 Ropuch Hi pastebot
08:16 Ropuch um
08:16 Ropuch hi paul_p ;>
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08:16 Genji what file is this from, Chris?
08:16 chris C4/
08:17 Genji How do i work out whats not good to cache?
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08:18 chris[…]=C4/;
08:18 kf good morning #koha
08:18 chris (i simplified it from here )
08:18 chris (took out the sysprefs)
08:18 imp moinen kf :)
08:18 imp +s
08:18 kf morning chris and imp
08:18 chris those three subroutines are fine to cache
08:19 chris the 2nd param is seconds
08:19 Genji Hmm... I could get the git, then find xarg grep the memcaches, then duplicate the changes accordingly, in 3.0?
08:19 chris you could, or you could just take that paste, and put it in the files you want caching whatever subroutines you want
08:20 chris its only in C4/Languages in 3.2 because it is bar far the slowest
08:20 chris and every single page uses it
08:20 chris by far even
08:20 Genji Ah.
08:20 chris hi kf
08:20 chris actually i think one other module
08:20 chris grep "memoize" in master
08:20 Genji What is not safe to cache?
08:21 chris anything that changes
08:21 chris ie, dont cache a borrowers issues
08:22 chris C4/        memoize_memcached( 'GetMarcStructure', memcached => $memcached, expire_time => 600 );
08:22 chris another one that is safe
08:23 chris (ie things that change very rarely)
08:24 chris caching the config is good too
08:25 chris id actually cache the config for hours
08:25 * Genji nods. "All these system pref calls, using dumpYAML and LoadYAML?
08:25 chris you pretty much never change the koha-conf.xml
08:25 chris and if you ever do, it will be at the command line
08:26 chris so you can just restart memcached at the same time to clear the cache
08:26 Genji Hmm... is there a method of forcing memcache to take a fresh version?
08:26 chris and parsing that xml is slow
08:26 chris it will take whatever version you give it
08:26 Genji YAML parses the koha-conf.xml?
08:26 chris no need to force it
08:27 chris but knowing it has changed from within koha .. pretty much impossible
08:27 chris in 3.0 sys pref calls are just db lookups, no point caching those
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08:28 Genji 5.81   0.150  0.150   9785   0.0000 0.0000  DBI::st::execute
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08:28 Genji Might be a good idea to take the call count down abit.
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08:29 CGI1985 plz solve my prob
08:29 chris well for most of those the overhead of the cache is slower than the lookup
08:30 chris caching slow queries is the win, caching fast ones (like the syspref ones) is actually slow
08:30 CGI1985 etc/
08:31 Genji CGI1985: okay, we can try.. but not promising miracles.
08:31 CGI1985 this is not working /etc/perl/CPAN/ initialized
08:31 chris that isnt a command
08:31 CGI1985 Genji: Thank you
08:31 chris what command are you actually running CGI1985 ?
08:31 Genji think you might be trying to configure CPAN?
08:31 CGI1985 Yeah
08:32 chris Genji: all that yaml stuff is actually C4::Auth the session management, it serialises the session using yaml
08:32 Genji chris: serializes the session?
08:32 CGI1985
08:32 chris Genji: you know what serialising objects is?
08:33 Genji Uh... no.
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08:33 CGI1985 Genji: above is taken from the documentation
08:34 chris
08:34 chris CGI1985: so you answer yes at the prompt?
08:34 chris ie you ran
08:34 chris sudo cpan Algorithm::CheckDigits SMS::Send HTTP::OAI
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08:39 Genji so, YAML is an unavoidable 'hotspot'? can't cache it?
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08:39 chris no
08:40 CGI1985 wht a hell! why is my IRC going offline after some time
08:40 CGI1985 chris: wht should I do?
08:40 Genji okay.... is there many method of seeing what calls st::execute 9000 odd times?
08:40 chris CGI1985: run
08:41 chris sudo cpan Algorithm::CheckDigits SMS::Send HTTP::OAI
08:41 chris thats all
08:41 CGI1985 I ran this
08:41 CGI1985 then?
08:41 chris thats it
08:41 chris if it installed the modules
08:42 CGI1985 yes it installed
08:42 chris then its done
08:42 CGI1985 ok so I dont need to initialize it?
08:42 chris not if it installed the modules no
08:43 CGI1985 ok couple of thanks
08:43 CGI1985 I still need u to finish the koha
08:44 CGI1985 It show that that -f is invalid
08:44 CGI1985 $ sudo -u ${KOHA_USER} zebrasrv -f /etc/koha/koha-conf.xml
08:45 Ropuch^ sudo -u koha zebrasrv -f /etc/koha/koha-conf.xml
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08:45 Susan-dev Good day everyone
08:46 Susan-dev I have a question that hopefully someone can answer.
08:46 Susan-dev I have Koha 3.0, and everything works fine before, when I import marc record/add items
08:46 Susan-dev It displays in the search, but I noticed THIS only works when I use the "DDC" classification,rather than LLC
08:46 Susan-dev If I pick the Library of congress classification, and the itemcallnumber points to the LLC call number
08:47 Susan-dev it no longer returns any results on the search
08:47 Susan-dev and I am unsure of where to go from here..or what to search for..
08:47 chris using zebra or nozebra?
08:47 Genji might be a zebra misconfig.
08:47 Susan-dev zebra
08:47 Susan-dev zebra
08:47 CGI1985 ropuch: sudo -u koha zebrasrv -f /etc/koha/koha-conf.xmlsudo: no passwd entry for koha!
08:47 * Genji has had alot of fun with zebra Voodoo.
08:48 chris and you reindexed after you changed it it LLC ?
08:48 Susan-dev it auto indexes
08:48 Susan-dev automaically I have it in a crontab
08:48 Susan-dev root crontab
08:49 Genji ahh
08:49 Genji theres the problem
08:49 Susan-dev and If i change it back to dewy and dewy call number, it works again
08:49 chris that only indexes changed things
08:49 chris it doesnt reindex everything
08:49 Genji never do rebuild as root
08:49 Genji always as the zebra user.
08:49 Genji and yes, it sounds like it might want a complete rebuild... -r
08:50 Susan-dev let me see if I have the -r in the crontab
08:50 Susan-dev give me a minute please
08:50 Genji uhh... still doing it with the wrong user...
08:50 chris you definitely dont want -r in the crontab
08:50 Susan-dev Iok Genji, but root should have access to everything..let me just check the crontab..I will change it to zebra user after thats done :)
08:50 Susan-dev please bear with me
08:51 chris dont change the crontab
08:51 chris you dont want to rebuild the index everytime
08:51 chris just after you make a change like that, something that effects every record
08:52 Susan-dev so what do I do then?
08:52 CGI1985 ?
08:52 CGI1985 wht is its meaning 'sudo: no password entry fo koha'
08:52 Genji Okay,... take zebra rebuild, out of the crontab.
08:52 chris or just leave it there
08:52 chris and run it from the commandline one time
08:53 * chris has to go now, good luck
08:53 * Genji hmms... "Night Chris"
08:53 Susan-dev good night chris
08:53 Genji Chris is right, Susan.. but i wonldn't leave it running in root crontab.
08:54 Genji Zebraidx and the zebra server won't have access to the exported records, if you run reindexing as root.
08:54 Susan-dev my stupid server stopped working
08:54 Susan-dev .....sorry for beign slow hehe
08:54 Susan-dev so how come it worked Genji
08:54 Susan-dev when I was doing Dewy
08:55 Genji You might of rebuilt when it was in the zebra user.
08:55 Genji Or entering it in, or marc importing, did it as the zebra user.
08:56 Susan-dev All I did was marc import
08:56 * Genji nods.
08:56 Susan-dev and it was automatically indexing it behind the scenes
08:56 * Genji nods. "And zebraqueue is running as the zebra user.
08:56 Susan-dev I think all run as root
08:57 Genji oh.... not good.
08:58 Susan-dev so what I have in my crontab
08:58 Susan-dev every five minutes
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08:58 * Genji nods. "Cut and paste that line.
08:58 Susan-dev zebraidx -c /etc/koha/zebradb/zebra-authorities-dom.cfg -g iso2709 -d authorities
08:58 Susan-dev init
08:58 Susan-dev and then similar one for zebra-biblios
08:59 Genji init, does a complete rebuild.
08:59 Genji definately not a good idea to do as root.
08:59 Susan-dev then rebuild)zebra -b -a
08:59 Susan-dev I guess without the -r
09:00 Susan-dev which chris said is needed.  I will try -r to see what happenes
09:00 Susan-dev but a question, it is ok to have the init for authorities and biblios on this crontab
09:00 Susan-dev or no
09:00 Susan-dev I understand the user issue, but as a process, is it ok?
09:01 Genji init is rebuilding.. its basically the same as -r in rebuild_zebra ... so not a good idea.
09:03 Genji Hmm....
09:03 Susan-dev sory
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09:03 Susan-dev it is taking me 1 minute to type each letter on my vmware server
09:03 Susan-dev -_-
09:03 Genji Eek.
09:04 Genji MAybe you have a task soaking up cpu time.
09:04 Genji Oh, your irc session is running on this VMWare server?
09:04 Susan-dev no no
09:04 Susan-dev my irc is outside
09:04 Susan-dev but i am trying to put commands on my vmware server
09:05 Susan-dev by the way what time is it wher eyou are? I don't want to keep you awake
09:05 Susan-dev though I would sure love the help
09:05 Genji Ah okay, run the command 'top' and tell me whats the top of the list.
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09:05 Genji meh, its only 10pm
09:05 imp 10am here ;)
09:05 Susan-dev it says xorg
09:05 Susan-dev perl
09:05 Susan-dev zebraqueue
09:06 Susan-dev stuff like that.. :)
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09:06 Genji hrm. how much % is perl and zebraqueue taking up?
09:07 Susan-dev by the way..I think the -r worked
09:07 Susan-dev so you are saying this -r only do it if I make a big change like this
09:08 * Genji nods. "Generally, -r isnt necessary every five minutes."
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09:08 Susan-dev how about the init one
09:08 Susan-dev when should I do them??
09:08 Susan-dev so I can change the time
09:09 Genji take out the init
09:09 Susan-dev completly??
09:09 Susan-dev *Scared* everything might not work again...
09:09 Genji just the 'init'
09:09 Susan-dev ok will do
09:10 Genji the word init, deletes the zebra db each time it indexs.
09:10 Susan-dev oh i see, just the init word
09:10 Susan-dev the rest of the command leave it
09:10 Genji which will take alot longer than updating.
09:11 Genji And you need to change the command from root user to the zebra user... which is inside the zebra config file.
09:11 Susan-dev zebra config file??
09:11 Susan-dev where do I find that
09:12 Genji oh.. maybe koha config file will give you what you want too.
09:12 Genji koha-conf.xml
09:13 Susan-dev ok I opened the file
09:13 Susan-dev the user under biblioserver is koha koha
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09:14 Genji right. okay. so, copy the necessary cron lines from the root cron to the koha cron (without the init) and then delete the cron entries you copied, from the root cron.
09:14 Susan-dev ok, thanks Genji :) I am just glad the -r is ok
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09:14 Susan-dev hehe
09:14 nicomo_ is now known as nicomo
09:16 Genji Let me know when youve done hte cron thing, your not done yet.
09:16 Susan-dev why am i not done? hehe
09:16 Susan-dev the problem is..the server is run as root
09:16 Susan-dev and the koha folder is owned by root
09:16 Susan-dev and zebra files are owned by root
09:17 Genji Need to repair the damage done due to reindexing as root
09:17 Susan-dev having it be owned by koha before was annoying me
09:17 Susan-dev :(
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09:17 Genji oh!
09:17 Susan-dev I can't change it on this machine Genji, because this is Production
09:17 Susan-dev Test is screwed up, I have to make a clone of prod and replace test
09:17 Susan-dev then I can reset the owners
09:17 Genji oh!
09:17 Susan-dev you know what I mean?
09:18 Susan-dev brb
09:18 Genji Not a good idea to run things on production machines as root... but oh well.
09:21 Genji doublechecking, do ' ps aux | grep 'zebra' '
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09:26 Susan-dev OK let me do that now
09:26 Susan-dev ok what shoudl I list?
09:27 Susan-dev there is koha-zebra-ctl.koha daemon runnig under koha user
09:27 Susan-dev koha-zebrauqueue-ctl-koha running under user koha
09:27 Susan-dev and perl -I /usr/share/koha/bin/zebraqueue_daemon under koha user
09:27 Susan-dev me is confused, I thought I am running from root cron
09:27 Susan-dev maybe there is another cron..
09:27 Genji nope.
09:28 Genji those are running as they should be.
09:28 Genji you definately need to move yor reindexing from the root cron to the koha cron.
09:28 nicomo left #koha
09:28 Genji and repair the permissions.
09:28 nicomo joined #koha
09:28 Genji and then do a complete rebuild.
09:28 Susan-dev ok, I will do my best..though I need a test machine to make those changes...finish them then move to prod
09:28 Susan-dev right now i am on PROD directly
09:29 Susan-dev hehe
09:29 Genji Ya.. not a good idea.
09:29 Susan-dev by the way, do you what differences exist between koha 3 and 3.02
09:29 Genji Unknown. I myself am working with a Saudi Arabian library, whos afraid to upgrade to newer versions.
09:30 Genji They're stuck on Koha 3.0rc1 .. or in other words, Koha 3.0 final.
09:30 Susan-dev I am in the UAE and on top of all this, I have to upgrade koha to that...which meanas I have to do svn vendor branches and compare our customizations with 3.02 code
09:30 Susan-dev aish hehe
09:30 Susan-dev anyways, thanks for you time. Appreciate it :D
09:31 Genji Wow, we have similar challenges.
09:31 Genji Sounds like you have more devel people than just you?
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09:32 Susan-dev nope
09:32 Susan-dev only me :)
09:32 Genji Yet your using svn internally, interesting..
09:33 Susan-dev I worked in Canada, and I am used to SVN, and I have to track my changes
09:33 Susan-dev 1 person can also make mistakes :)
09:33 Susan-dev but now in the UAE, probably not a lot of people use svn
09:33 Susan-dev hehe
09:33 * Genji is also developing solo. "Didn't do any versioning yet, because boss said the time spent, might not be worth it."
09:34 Susan-dev I actually have to make time out of nothing...I have many people breathing down my neck, and not on just koha
09:34 Susan-dev on opesis , open erp
09:35 Susan-dev and  internal joomla websites
09:35 Susan-dev I should be given a raise hehe
09:35 Genji so, you work X hours, but bill less than X hours?
09:36 Susan-dev no I am a full time employee here, I work in Abu dhabi
09:36 Susan-dev not internationally
09:36 Susan-dev its 1:30 PM here
09:37 Susan-dev I should do contracting work, probably better right?
09:37 Genji Eh, prehaps not. Then you'd have to deal with your own tax returns?
09:37 Susan-dev no taxes here :)
09:38 Genji No taxes in UAE?
09:38 Susan-dev no
09:38 Susan-dev none
09:38 Genji All your money? King gets nothing?
09:38 Susan-dev King has billions
09:39 Susan-dev why should he care for taxes?
09:39 Susan-dev Abu dhabi has oil
09:39 Genji Wow...
09:39 Genji Whens the next flight? :)
09:39 Susan-dev :)
09:39 Susan-dev hope the US doesn't try and make war again in hopes of finding weapons of massive destruction
09:40 Genji Anyway, hmm.... So, you have modded koha 3.0 for arabic?
09:40 Susan-dev no, english
09:41 Susan-dev In here, they speak mostly english to communicate between each other
09:41 Susan-dev all organizations , english is a must
09:41 Genji Ah. Interesting.
09:41 Susan-dev and also my apologies for saying this term, but there are more "white" people here, than offence intended!
09:41 Susan-dev but alot of caucasians come here for the money
09:41 Susan-dev because they get paid maybe 3x or 4x the typical arab here
09:42 Genji So, even though Saudi Arabia and UAE have common cultural base, sounds like the language frequency is different?
09:42 Susan-dev or indian or paki or philipino
09:42 Susan-dev Abu dhabi is racist hehehe
09:42 Susan-dev Saudi is different absolutly.  Its very radical
09:42 Genji The library im working for, most of the interface is Arabic.
09:43 Susan-dev From what I know...not many are educated to know english very well.  Most of the UAE nationals are sent internationally for studies
09:43 Susan-dev a western degree is valued more here than other degrees
09:44 Susan-dev sorry Genji, I have to go.  Thanks alot for your patience and help! :)
09:44 Susan-dev and hope you learned a bit more about the UAE :) hehe
09:44 Genji Of course, come back when you need to.
09:44 Susan-dev maybe you might come for work, but after the economy settles
09:44 Genji You will definately need to repair things.
09:45 Susan-dev I will do that
09:45 Susan-dev :)
09:45 Genji So, clone, and come back, eh?
09:46 Susan-dev Once our system administrator comes back from his long holiday
09:46 Susan-dev Dec 22 :)
09:46 Susan-dev so not today :(
09:47 Susan-dev Good night, I am off :)
09:47 Susan-dev Thanks again
09:47 Susan-dev left #koha
09:47 Genji Wow, that was interesting.
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10:20 Susan-dev Hi everyone, anyone familiar why I get duplicate marc records.  Even though Its just one marc record, but I clicked the "Save" button mutliple times
10:20 Susan-dev I even tried re-indexing and rebuilding zebra
10:20 Susan-dev still get 3 duplicate records, 2 of - items, and 1 with 1 item
10:20 Susan-dev but its the same marc record!
10:34 kf which version of koha do you use Susan-dev?
10:36 Susan-dev koha 3.0
10:38 Ropuch^ Hi kf [;
10:38 kf hi Ropuch^
10:39 kf 3.0.0? or 3.0.x?
10:39 Susan-dev no just 3.0
10:39 Susan-dev ummm I only know chown koha /directory
10:39 Susan-dev how do I make it owned by group
10:39 Susan-dev sorry wrong window :)
10:42 kf I think I saw someone reporting an error like this on the mailinglist some time ago
10:43 kf but (of course) cant find it right now
10:43 Susan-dev hehe..I will search the mailing list also,
10:43 Susan-dev Thanks kf :)
10:44 kf perhaps its just a problem with zebra? you could try rebuilding your index
10:45 kf
10:46 Genji does koha 3.2 suffer from the marc importer having no visual response when pressing 'Save'?
10:46 kf when staging files?
10:46 Genji Thats what Susan-dev's case is. Librarian, not computer savvy, clicked save multiple times.
10:46 Susan-dev no
10:46 Susan-dev its fine, save just stays on the same page
10:46 Susan-dev if I click it
10:47 Susan-dev I did a complete rebuild with -r option
10:47 Susan-dev and it still gives me duplicate records
10:47 Susan-dev and I don't know why
10:47 Genji As root user? or koha user?
10:47 Susan-dev if I look at the mysql db it has only 1 marc record representing the culprint
10:47 Susan-dev well honestly I really don't know..when we did ps -ex it says everything is owned by root
10:48 Susan-dev but the reality is the only crontab that has the rebuild functionality is under ROOT
10:48 Susan-dev its a root crontab
10:48 kf ah sorry
10:48 Susan-dev so right now I finished doing the /var/lib/koha to be owned by koha:koha
10:48 Susan-dev now I will do rebuild adn see what happens..pray for me :D
10:48 Genji wait!
10:48 Genji su koha
10:48 Genji first.
10:48 Genji then type this, exactly.
10:49 Susan-dev ok
10:49 Genji perl -I/usr/share/koha/lib /usr/share/koha/bin/migration_tools/rebuild_zebra -b -a -r
10:49 Susan-dev ok let me try
10:49 Genji doublecheck its being done under koha.
10:49 Susan-dev I am user koha
10:50 * Genji nods. "good."
10:51 Susan-dev cant find perl script
10:51 Susan-dev i think
10:51 Susan-dev right?
10:52 Genji woops.
10:52 Genji right.
10:52 Genji good catch.
10:52 * Genji usually relies on tab completion.
10:52 Susan-dev ok for biblios
10:52 Susan-dev it says 12 records
10:52 Susan-dev let me see mysql and how many records there are
10:53 Genji Oh, you just started the database?
10:53 Susan-dev It does not have a lot of data..
10:53 Susan-dev its still not used right now
10:54 * Genji nods.
10:54 Susan-dev but its stil the only machine thats working properly, thats why I am scared of screwing it up
10:54 Genji So, did it work?
10:54 Susan-dev now, let me just check the mysql to see how many actual records are there
10:54 Susan-dev give me a minute, gotta go to webmin
10:55 Susan-dev oko so now narrowed it even more
10:55 Susan-dev its not zebra
10:55 Susan-dev its mysql
10:55 Susan-dev it has 3 records of the MARC record instannce
10:55 Genji hmm?
10:55 Susan-dev why does save , STILL save eventhough it exists in the db
10:55 Susan-dev booooo
10:57 Susan-dev you know,  let me try with a new record
10:57 Genji I'd suggest causing save to lock the save button, until the page reloads for the next input, via javascript,,, and just start the db over, since you have only 12 records.
10:57 Susan-dev and click save on it multiple times
10:57 Susan-dev let me see if that happens or not
10:58 Genji or have the click cause some feedback to occur... like "Saving Marc record...."
10:58 Genji Via AJAX, or just plain javascript.
10:59 Susan-dev so I just created a marc record
11:00 Susan-dev clicked save
11:00 Susan-dev I will not create an item, RATHER i will click the BACK BUTTON
11:00 Susan-dev now click SAVE again
11:01 Genji why would you do that?
11:01 Susan-dev says Duplicate Record suspected
11:01 Susan-dev is this a duplicate ?
11:01 Susan-dev thats promising, I guess the librarian changed something on the record before and thats why it saved multiple instancnes
11:01 Susan-dev WEll genji, a user always clicks Back :)
11:01 Susan-dev you know never hehehe
11:02 Susan-dev you never nkow..
11:02 Susan-dev I am getting tired...
11:02 Genji Hmm.. okay, so the librarian has trouble learning the rules of data entry, don't click back..
11:02 Susan-dev oh genji, if you only knew
11:02 Susan-dev :)
11:03 Susan-dev yay! :) it works great
11:03 Genji We fixed it?
11:04 Susan-dev now the next time I go to the library for training, I will hear, "its useless, its buggy, I want millenium:"
11:04 Susan-dev -_-
11:04 Genji ....
11:04 Genji Just don't pick Liblime Koha.
11:04 Susan-dev .....wait actually
11:04 Susan-dev how did it index this new marc record
11:04 Genji Promise me, don't got to Liblime Enterprise Koha.
11:04 Susan-dev I commented out the root crontab
11:04 Susan-dev .....>-<!!
11:04 Genji zebra-queue indexed it.
11:05 Susan-dev I am confused genji..don't I have to do rebuild zebra????
11:05 Genji nope.
11:05 Susan-dev for something to be returned to be on the result page??
11:05 Genji hardly ever.
11:05 Susan-dev where is this zebra-queue running
11:05 Susan-dev and who is running it??
11:05 Genji type:
11:05 Genji ps aux | grep 'zebra'
11:06 Genji its run as a daemon, started in init.d
11:06 Susan-dev ...ummm....oh right I remember I did that step along time ago
11:06 Susan-dev when I first installed koha
11:06 Genji Its created to watch a table called zebraqueue, for updates.
11:07 Susan-dev ok, so now what do I need in my nice crontab
11:07 Susan-dev the fines? the overdues? and what else?
11:07 Genji I believe this stuff:
11:07 Genji[…]elopment:cronjobs
11:08 Susan-dev ok thats perfect
11:08 kf its recommended to use rebuild_zebra, not zebra_queue
11:08 Genji edit it to suit. And koha crons should be running as koha.
11:09 Susan-dev ok, koha it is :) Thanks genji
11:09 * Genji nods. "For big libraries that have more than 30 transactions a second... use zebra_rebuild, without the -r
11:09 kf ah sorry :)
11:09 Genji kf: its a second right?
11:09 Susan-dev we have close to 3000 books
11:09 Susan-dev so only -a -b
11:10 kf Genji: a second?
11:10 * Genji nods. "only -a -b"
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11:10 Genji Or is it -z.... one second.
11:10 greenmang0 can anybody tell me how to configure zebra for kete??
11:11 Susan-dev You have a pm Genji.  -z does not work for me..
11:11 kf only -a -b will index all records - -z will only index updated from zebra_queue table as far as I know
11:11 Genji ah Susan-dev.. you've tried -z before huh?
11:11 Susan-dev before yes
11:12 Susan-dev my zebra does not like it
11:12 Susan-dev hehe
11:12 Genji ... Like it, before or after the user change?
11:12 Susan-dev no I think it does not like the option..
11:12 Susan-dev can't remember..
11:12 Genji Try it now, as koha.
11:12 Genji rebuild_zebra -b -a -z
11:12 Susan-dev ok
11:12 greenmang0 anybody??? with kete???
11:13 Susan-dev sorry greenmang, for me I don't know about kete :)
11:13 greenmang0 Susan-dev: i am /me
11:13 greenmang0 greenmang0:
11:13 greenmang0 :D
11:15 Susan-dev - z works fine
11:15 Susan-dev it says 0 records exported on both
11:15 Susan-dev because there are no new recorsd
11:16 Susan-dev Thanks everyone :)
11:16 Genji yup. You haven't changed anything recently.
11:16 greenmang0 Genji: any experience with kete?
11:16 Genji so, put rebuild_zebra -b -a -z inside koha's crontab, maybe every 5 minutes.
11:16 Susan-dev I will..
11:17 Susan-dev I will follow that crontab example you sent.  Thanks for your help.
11:17 Susan-dev Appreciate it
11:17 Genji And, I think..... disable zebra-queue..
11:17 Genji since -b -a -z is doing its job.
11:17 Genji kf: what you think?
11:17 greenmang0 kf: ever tried kete?
11:18 Susan-dev Will do.  Ok I am off for now,  Thanks alot Genji.  Hvae a good night.  I hope you find someone to help you greenmang, try the koha dev mailing list
11:19 Susan-dev :) Best to everyone,
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11:22 greenmang0 anybody here who can help me with kete?
11:22 kf greenmang0: i have no experience with kete
11:23 kf Genji: I think it sounds right
11:23 greenmang0 kf: ok :(
11:23 kf greenmang0: I think its mainly used in nz
11:24 kf greenmang0: they are all sleeping now, so mailing list is a good suggestion, you will reach more people there too
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11:57 kf lunch
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12:34 Ropuch^ Hello nengard
12:34 nengard howdy Ropuch
12:34 Ropuch^ is now known as Ropuch
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13:13 Ropuch nengard: you still looking for authorities to import?
13:14 nengard yup
13:16 Ropuch nengard: how many do you want? ;>
13:17 Ropuch I can export some authorities for you (in polish only)
13:18 nengard Ropuch, it's for the English version of the manual - so I kind of need some English authorities - which is why I was using the LOC records - which you can export - but for some reason they wouldn't import
13:21 Ropuch nengard: I can import them with no problem
13:21 Ropuch (Loc auth)
13:21 nengard which file type did you export?
13:21 nengard I'll try again
13:21 Ropuch MARC(UNICODE/UTF8)
13:23 Ropuch ./ -file ~/Pobrane/
13:24 Ropuch ./ -file ~/Pobrane/Pwebrecon.cgi
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13:24 nengard nengard@debian:~/kohaclone/misc/migration_tools$ perl -file /Users/nengard/Desktop/Pwebrecon\(2\).cgi
13:24 Ropuch rebuild zebra and it's in
13:24 nengard 0 MARC record done in 0.000335931777954102 seconds
13:24 Genji left #koha
13:24 kf rename the file to mrc
13:24 nengard it says zero
13:24 Ropuch nengard: add -v 2 at the ond of command
13:25 Ropuch nengard: can you pint me to the authority you're trying to import?
13:25 Ropuch *point
13:25 nengard nengard@debian:~/kohaclone/misc/migration_tools$ perl -file /Users/nengard/Desktop/Pwebrecon\(2\).mrc -v
13:25 nengard 0 MARC record done in 3.09944152832031e-06 seconds
13:25 nengard I'm importing my own authority record :)
13:25 nengard search for Nicole Engard
13:26 kf thats cool
13:27 kf hm, it looks ok for me
13:27 kf we import auth-records into koha nightly
13:28 jwagner Has anyone written an interface from the staff client to authority import yet?
13:29 jwagner It's really needed, I think.
13:29 kf jwagner: we use command line tools, its an automated process, importing records from our union catalog every night
13:30 nengard jwagner - nope - but i'd love to see it
13:30 jwagner May have to do something about that...
13:33 nengard :)
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13:45 nengard owen - read the koha list - ata has a set of sample authorities you can import (you were asking for that right?)
13:46 owen Oh cool, hadn't made it through my mail yet
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13:52 hdl_laptop nengard: bulkmarcimport  in 3.2 has -a option to import authorities
13:52 nengard hdl you rock!! Thank you - off to give that a whirl
13:52 nengard wait - where does the -a go?
13:53 nengard misc/migration_tools/ -file /Users/nengard/Desktop/Samples/​authority/personalname/all.mrc -a
13:53 nengard ?
13:56 nengard I get Unknown option: a
13:58 magnusenger nengard: misc/migration_tools/bulk*MARC*, not misc/migration_tools/ ?
13:59 owen -a is now preferable to
13:59 nengard magnusenger - nope:
13:59 nengard nengard@debian:~/kohaclone$ misc/migration_tools/ -file /Users/nengard/Desktop/Samples/​authority/personalname/all.mrc -a
13:59 nengard 0 MARC records done in 0.000648975372314453 seconds
14:00 jdavidb Gee, can the script be any more precise on that time, please?  Imma file a bug report on that.
14:01 owen jdavidb: Someone traveling back in time to prevent themselves from importing authority records would need accurate records of the event
14:01 jdavidb Exactly!  Precision is very important!
14:02 magnusenger nengard: how about pastebin'ing the authority, perhaps there's something wrong with it?
14:02 nengard magnusenger - i can do that - but i've tried with several - one from LOC, one from someone else using Koha and then the batch from ata
14:02 magnusenger ok, that's probably not it then...
14:03 nengard here's one:
14:03 nengard one i need to figure out how to get them to update
14:04 magnusenger nengard: tried the "-v 2" option to
14:04 nengard will do now
14:05 nengard nengard@debian:~/kohaclone$ misc/migration_tools/ -file /Users/nengard/Desktop/Samples/​authority/personalname/all.mrc -v 2
14:05 nengard Characteristic MARC flavour: MARC21
14:05 nengard 0 MARC records done in 0.00573086738586426 seconds
14:05 jdavidb Took quite a bit longer to do nothing that time.
14:05 nengard so frustrating - i wish there was an error message of sorts - something that would help me
14:06 hdl_laptop owen: I think so.
14:06 jwagner nengard, do you have another system running a different (earlier) version of head?  And do the records import OK there?
14:07 nengard i don't have a diff system
14:07 nengard only the one :(
14:07 nengard anyone else have a problem with the current version of head?
14:07 nengard and marc21?
14:13 kf I know we can import authorities, using
14:14 kf but I have not test system for current head yet
14:18 magnusenger nengard: i have a current test (with some additions for normarc) where importing with works fine
14:19 magnusenger nengard: are you sure you are feeding it the right file? giving it a non-existing file seems to result in "0 MARC records done", not an error...
14:20 nengard i have no authorities loaded - and i have gotten that error everytime - so i'm not sure how i could be loading dups
14:20 Ropuch I have tested bulkauthimport on plain install of 3.2 head
14:21 veryinky_ is a bit out of date. version 2.2
14:22 magnusenger nengard: i have tried'ing the same file several times now and i get "1 MARC records done" each time, nothing about duplicates
14:23 magnusenger nengard: perl /usr/share/koha/bin/migrati​on_tools/ -file doesntexist -v 1 gives me "0 MARC records done in 0.0120010375976562 seconds"
14:25 nengard hmmmm
14:25 nengard hang on - i'll ftp file to the server and try again
14:27 nengard OH MY!!
14:27 nengard nengard@debian:~/kohaclone$ misc/migration_tools/ -file all.mrc -a
14:27 nengard ........
14:27 nengard 8 MARC records done in 0.115814924240112 seconds
14:27 veryinky_ I'm trying to add a new patron, version 3.0.4, in the staff client, I click on Patrons, then I'm in Koha > Patrons, but clicking on +New does nothing.
14:28 hdl_laptop nengard: cool.
14:28 hdl_laptop magnusenger: a simple deduplication can be done with latest bulkmarcimport.
14:28 hdl_laptop -match parameter
14:29 magnusenger hdl_laptop: nice!
14:29 hdl_laptop Should be improved and take C4::Matcher rule
14:29 hdl_laptop But better than nothing
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14:30 owen veryinky_: Yes, isn't current
14:31 nengard the manual on is a bit better -but also not up to date
14:31 veryinky_ Hrm. I can add vendors, I can add books, I can add marc files. But the (+New v) vendor button doesn't work.
14:31 veryinky_ er, patron button that is
14:31 nengard a working copy of the manual can be found here:[…]ohadocs;a=summary
14:32 veryinky_ I could add patrons back in 3.0.0 and 3.0.2
14:32 veryinky_ So this is frustrating.
14:33 kf verinky: have you defined borrower categories?
14:33 * veryinky_ nods. I was using
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14:33 kf ah, should scroll down first
14:34 veryinky_ I'm trying to create an admin acount for my boss, didn't think he would be a borrower, will make some categories now.
14:35 kf veryinky_: new button will give you a pull down of your categories - create a category for staff for another admin account
14:36 nengard okay all - can you please tell me what command to use to rebuild zebra - I have to be doing something wrong ... .
14:36 nengard i'm just not lucky today at all
14:36 jdavidb -r -w -a -b -v   is what I usually use.
14:36 veryinky_ kf, thanks. That was the problem. I hadn't created any borrower categories.
14:38 * veryinky_ had created some in the previous install. To be honest though, I hadn't associated staff with borrowers or patrons.
14:43 kf veryinky_: for staff patrons you must set permissions in the next step, so they can log into the staff interface
14:50 * veryinky_ nods. Did that. Was just annoyed at myself for skipping a step. I do that too often.
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14:59 nengard thanks jdavidb - seems to be working
14:59 jdavidb yabetcha. :)
15:00 rhcl_away is now known as rhcl
15:03 rhcl is now known as rhcl_in_an_out
15:05 brendan @wunder 93117
15:05 munin brendan: The current temperature in Northwest Goleta, Goleta, California is 1.6�C (7:00 AM PST on December 08, 2009). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 68%. Dew Point: -4.0�C. Windchill: 2.0�C. Pressure: 30.00 in 1015.8 hPa (Rising).
15:10 kf hi brendan
15:10 brendan hi kf
15:10 kf brendan: I offered paul_p (at least I think it was him) to work on a MARC21 xslt for intranet - but had no time yet :(
15:11 brendan kf great
15:11 brendan I haven't done anything yet either :)
15:12 kf brendan: not sure when I will have time to do it, so I would be happy if you want to work on it
15:12 brendan ok I may poke at it during the week and will send any work I get done
15:13 kf brendan: I wanted to start with opac xslt, jwagner sent some patches for this file, not sure what went into head yet
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15:21 jwagner kf, I don't know what might be in the latest head (haven't updated to it yet).  From my list, Bug 3750 and Bug 3877 are XSLT-related patches that hadn't made it into head as of a couple of weeks ago.  I think the rest of my XSLT stuff was already in head.
15:21 munin Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=3750 enhancement, P5, ---,, ASSIGNED, Modify XSLT to display subfield n of 111/711 and remove period after 110/710
15:21 munin Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=3877 was not found.
15:22 jwagner Sorry, Bug 3788 -- I'm dyslexic with numbers sometimes.
15:22 munin Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=3788 enhancement, PATCH-Sent, ---,, NEW, XSLT does not obey viewISBD syspref
15:23 jwagner There's another patch I may do -- for corporate authors, there appears to be no punctuation or separation between subfields in the same entry.  For example, 110 or 710 subfield a and subfield b run together.
15:30 jwagner is now known as jwagner_meeting
15:32 kf jwagner: thx :)
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15:46 owen Interesting... A new "delete all items" menu item on the staff client biblio view menu
15:46 owen Woe to he who deletes a biblio which is in his cart
15:50 kf can someone explain what keyword-to-marc-mapping does?
15:50 kf its a new 3.2 features, but not sure how this works
15:52 hdl_laptop kf it is also in 3.0
15:53 kf oh, never seen that - perhaps we skipped this feature? went from 3.0 to 3.1
15:53 hdl_laptop It fixed the way subtitles are managed
15:54 hdl_laptop and implements a kind of extended attribute type for records.
15:54 kf not sure I understand it
15:55 hdl_laptop If you need to display or name a particuliar set of tags/subfields, in UNIMARC 200$e for subtitles,
15:55 hdl_laptop and want to name it subtitle
15:55 hdl_laptop then you can use that so that it is desiplayed in detail view even though you are not using XSLT
15:55 kf only for UNIMARC?
15:57 kf thx hdl_laptop
15:57 hdl_laptop would also work for MARC21. you can add whatever you want
15:58 hdl_laptop owen++ for the Cart
15:58 kf yes, owen++ :)
16:02 jwagner_meeting is now known as jwagner
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16:27 wizzyrea anyone: objections to making transit slip open/print/close?
16:27 wizzyrea (i know, this really ought to be a syspref)
16:27 wizzyrea (the circ slip already does it
16:27 wizzyrea )
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16:39 * owen is neutral, not being a user of transit slips
16:40 jwagner wizzyrea, I think it would be great if all the slips had the option to print completely automatically -- no manual intervention (even a click) required.  Right now, you still have to click on the OK button to print.  Staff hate that.  But it should be an option, because some people will want to see the slip first.
16:41 Kivutar left #koha
16:41 kf bye #koha
16:41 wizzyrea jwagner: well, actually
16:41 kf left #koha
16:41 owen Librarians have a thing about not wanting to click stuff
16:41 wizzyrea the automatic print depends on the configuration of firefox
16:41 wizzyrea this just keeps you from having to close the window
16:41 wizzyrea yourself
16:42 owen Librarians also have a thing about not knowing how to use a keyboard
16:42 wizzyrea lol
16:42 wizzyrea has anybody had complaints about the method applied to the circ receipts?
16:42 wizzyrea (I'm thinking of doing the same for the transit slips)
16:56 owen Has someone already wished to be able to hook the results of a guided report to the new batch modification tool?
16:59 wizzyrea I wonder if anyone knows the answer to this question: I know the SIP server logic 1. Checks items in 2. notices and can print slips for holds but does it 3. confirm the holds?
16:59 wizzyrea or does a human still have to do step 3?
17:00 wizzyrea (it's snowing and I don't want to drive half an hour to test this theory)
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17:36 Topic for #koha is now Discussion channel for the Koha ILS | Next general IRC meeting at 19:00 UTC+0 on 13 January 2010 | Logged at
17:36 rhcl_in_an_out rpg was my very first programming class. Big mistake. All I remember is that you write it from right to left and it's very structured.
17:37 rhcl_in_an_out Wonder if you could port Koha to RPG?
17:38 Ropuch Maybe he was talking about some kind of role-playing?
17:39 rhcl_in_an_out Yea, I know. I just took off on the RPG part. :)
17:39 jdavidb now, there are heretics, and there is rhcl_in_an_out.
17:39 * veryinky_ hehs. Surprisingly enough, you're not the first to do a report program generator joke.
17:39 rhcl_in_an_out According to wikipedia, RPG is still "popular" on IBM mainframes.
17:40 jdavidb If you're gonna write it in a difficult language, use COBOL.  Or Fortran, even.
17:40 * veryinky_ did study RPG, COBOL, REXX, and some other stuff back in college.
17:40 rhcl_in_an_out I still think Ada would be the best alternative port.
17:40 jdavidb or Lisp, even:
17:41 jdavidb I started out with Pascal, and learned a half-dozen others in college--was the lab instructor for Fortran, COBOL, and Modula-2, one term--the *same* term.
17:42 nicomo left #koha
17:42 rhcl_in_an_out funy link
17:43 * jdavidb <3 XKCD.
17:43 veryinky_ I remember and hate pascal.
17:43 veryinky_ Once tried to port a pascal project into c++. Gave up half way.
17:43 rhcl_in_an_out My Pascal teacher was Armenian--first day he had just gotten back from a protest march at Washington DC - capitol. But he was a good teacher and Pascal didn't seem that hard.
17:44 rhcl_in_an_out first day of class, I mean
17:44 jdavidb Pascal is very good for teaching structure.  If you learn to do something in Pascal, you can eventually do it in almost any other language, and it'll be very maintainable.
17:45 jdavidb Modula-2 was a teaching language that added to Pascal in some useful ways, but it never caught on.
17:45 veryinky_ I learned how to program using turboC
17:45 veryinky_ 2.0
17:45 Ropuch atari basic & logo ;-P
17:45 rhcl_in_an_out Yea, I remember Modula-2 being highly regarded when it was introduced. Wonder why it never became more popular?
17:46 jdavidb I started out on the VIC-20, but I had programmed Atari 2600 BASIC a little before that.
17:46 rhcl_in_an_out Caldo de Pollo for lunch....
17:46 jdavidb rhcl:  It wasn't object-oriented, and that's just before OO programming came out.  By the time Modula-2 would have gotten a good foothold, OOP was more-important.
17:46 veryinky_ I think the first thing I wrote was a lemonaid stand game, from a magazine tutorial.
17:47 rhcl_in_an_out oh yes, typing in code published in magazines...
17:49 * jdavidb did that a lot.
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17:50 veryinky_ I was 8. :|
17:51 nicomo joined #koha
17:51 nengard whew - i'm soo tired now - just finished a 2 hour demo - first time speaking that much since getting the sinus infection .. now no more talking for the rest of today :)
17:51 nengard off to make something soothing for lunch :)
17:55 veryinky_ In any event, woke up this morning from a dream about a space based rpg which didn't exist. So I'm thinking about that instead of actual work.
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18:00 wizzyrea bleh, we were discussing CAS yesterday, I just updated and I apparently need it, which module do I install?
18:00 wizzyrea i can't find it in my transcripts. Suppose I could look at the online logs
18:03 owen It was in an email from Colin: There was an added dependency - Authen::CAS::Client
18:04 owen But you can turn off the CAS stuff in system preferences
18:10 wizzyrea owen: interestingly, I could not get it to even load it without that dependency
18:10 wizzyrea erroeur
18:10 wizzyrea that's a fancy way of saying it no worky.
18:10 wizzyrea installed it and now it's working again.
18:10 wizzyrea blerg.
18:15 nengard wizzyrea yeah I had that problem too
18:16 wizzyrea oh good. I disabled all of that CAS stuff
18:16 wizzyrea but I still had to install the dependency before I could do that
18:16 wizzyrea anyway
18:17 nengard yup
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18:31 brendan howdy gmcharlt
18:45 gmcharlt hi brendan
18:46 chris morning all
18:47 chris wizzyrea: ill send a patch so that it doesnt require the CAS unless you have the syspref on
18:47 chris the way the code is now, its going to require that module even if it doesn't use it
18:48 chris CAS is cool as hell tho
18:48 chris its LDAP done right
18:50 chris so you can have CAS server, that talks in the back to a RADIUS system over here, windows active directory over there, LDAP over somewhere else, maybe x509 too
18:50 jwagner Fines question for people -- if the circ rule specifies a one-day grace period, and the item is, say, four days overdue, does it charge four days' worth of fines or only three?
18:50 chris and provides a consistent api so instead of koha needing to understand all that, it just needs to understand CAS
18:52 chris i would expect 3
18:52 chris but id have to look at the code jwagner
18:56 chris ok bus time, bbl
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18:57 cait hi #koha
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19:13 Topic for #koha is now Discussion channel for the Koha ILS | Next general IRC meeting at 19:00 UTC+0 on 13 January 2010 | Logged at
19:13 schuster Every time I print it to show acq, date added, price etc. it shows me a blank form or only shows things that are drop downs.
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19:15 cait ah pootle is back :)
19:16 jwagner gmcharlt, I always have trouble counting up days for overdue, but I think the grace period is not being included in the total fines.  I made something due on the 1st, with a 1 day grace period and a $1/day fine.  Running the fines cron today came up with a total of $6 in fines.  If it were including the grace period day, shouldn't it be $7?
19:16 gmcharlt yep
19:17 jwagner So it's not including the grace period.  That's what I needed to check.  Thanks.
19:18 gmcharlt are you taking holidays into account, though?
19:18 jwagner No holidays in that time span, so it shouldn't matter.
19:18 joetho jwagner , that's where I have been getting my info, albfeit from the worldwide version, not the US version
19:19 joetho your link is US, mine was worldwide. Same info
19:19 jwagner joetho, the info on that page works for me -- I've always connected OK.
19:20 joetho hmmm. Maybe I misspelled something. Lord knows I know how to misspell stuff!
19:23 jwagner joetho, did you include the account ID/password in the z39.50 setup?  It's required.
19:25 joetho uh oh, I assumed it allowed anonymous
19:26 jwagner Nope.  Gotta pay for OCLC.
19:26 joetho yes, we get charged every time we use it for other stuff
19:27 joetho do they charge for z39 "hits"?
19:27 joetho wow, I am talkin street talk
19:28 gmcharlt joetho: ask the dealer^W source
19:29 jwagner My memory from several years ago (dunno what's current) is that the z39.50 connection is actually MORE costly than their client -- you're charged by the hitlist because they have no good way to track which record(s) you actually download.
19:29 joetho must be some good sh**
19:37 jwagner Speaking of z39.50, does anyone know the default database name for a Horizon catalog?
19:37 jwagner I tried HORIZON but it didn't work.
19:39 cait dont know if there is one, but in irspy there are many with db = horizon
19:39 cait
19:39 wizzyrea hey, where can a patron change their OPAC Privacy settings?
19:40 wizzyrea in current head
19:41 nengard privacy settings?
19:41 nengard patrons can't change those ...
19:42 nengard or do you mean messaging preferences?
19:42 cait I think there is a new feature for reading history
19:42 nengard oh yeah - i remember that ... is that is the current head?
19:42 chris back
19:43 nengard welcome back
19:43 cait hi chris
19:43 cait should be in opac I think, I only saw the patches (no test installation atm...)
19:44 nengard i would think there is a sys pref as well
19:44 nengard wizzyrea - OpacPrivacy system preference
19:44 nengard turn it on
19:45 chris lol
19:46 nengard and - there is a 'search history' link at the top of the OPAC on the right
19:46 nengard but I don't know howto change my privacy settings ... i turned it on but don't see naything in the opac
19:46 chris phasefx: you about? :)
19:46 Genji joined #koha
19:46 nengard naything = anything
19:46 wizzyrea hmm I 'm not seeing that
19:46 wizzyrea interesting
19:46 wizzyrea setting is on
19:46 nengard which - search history - or the preference?
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19:47 wizzyrea ohh, hm, that does not do what it says it does
19:47 wizzyrea or at least, not what I was expecting it to.
19:47 wizzyrea I thought it would clear your reading history
19:47 nengard me too
19:47 nengard that's what paul was developing it to do
19:47 nengard he started it at kohacon
19:48 wizzyrea if ON, allows patrons to define their privacy rules (reading history) *description, not clear. :(
19:48 nengard maybe we're just missing a template file
19:48 wizzyrea i was all excited ;)
19:49 wizzyrea seems likely
19:49 nengard wizzyrea - this is all i can find:[…]rep&s=OpacPrivacy
19:49 nengard a database update - but no template updates ...
19:50 nengard anyone else know any differently?
19:51 chris i think its best to just ask the people who wrote it
19:52 chris everyone else is just guessing
19:53 nengard yeah - was hoping one of them was here and would see what we were asking :) not sure who at biblibre is still on - and/or at work
19:54 chris its about 8pm there, unlikely to be anyone around
19:54 cait its late here - 9pm
19:54 wizzyrea eh will make a note and ask tomorrow maybe
19:54 nengard wizzyrea I'll send a message via the mailing list for them to  answer when they're awake tomorrow and we're sound asleep :)
19:54 wizzyrea also an excellent plan
19:56 nengard hehe
19:57 nengard notes are no good to me
19:57 nengard i'll forget to read the note :) hehe
19:57 wizzyrea lol
19:57 chris song of the day[…]+Trumpet/10794194
19:57 wizzyrea Yay song of the day!
20:00 joetho jwagner , try Horizon with a cap then lowercase.
20:01 |Lupin| joined #koha
20:01 joetho jwagner , try dynix  or dynixa  too.
20:02 chris pinepine te kura, hau te kura = the treasue is small, the treasue is famous
20:04 owen nengard: No luck with the batch item modifications for me either
20:05 jwagner joetho, no luck with any of those variations.
20:05 nengard hmm
20:05 |Lupin| hello there :)
20:06 cait hi |Lupin|
20:06 |Lupin| guten Abend cait :)
20:06 cait guten Abend :)
20:06 jwagner I'm testing the Smithsonian library -- I know it used to work but it doesn't now.  Their setup page has the same address & port number, but doesn't specify database name, and their tech person doesn't seem to know what it is.
20:07 Genji
20:07 Genji Reads like Liblime's website.
20:08 wizzyrea Global leader in open source solutions for libraries?
20:08 |Lupin| my librarian asks me hther it is possible to see all members of one given site... anybody knows, pls ?
20:08 * wizzyrea bonks herself with an iron frying pan: "oh, the marketingspeak has infiltrated my brain!"
20:09 * wizzyrea passes out
20:09 wizzyrea |Lupin| I'm sure you could run a custom report to get that info
20:10 |Lupin| wizzyrea: hmm... no easier way ?
20:10 |Lupin| It'b nice to be able to limit patron search to a site...
20:10 wizzyrea not that I am aware of, but I haven't gone looking either
20:10 cait I think this may be possible in 3.2
20:11 wizzyrea oh, actually, cait is right
20:11 wizzyrea that does appear to be possible in current head
20:11 |Lupin| cait: we are running master HEAD, or not too far from that...
20:11 wizzyrea you can filter by library
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20:11 |Lupin| wizzyrea: is this part of what has been committed recently, or is that older ?
20:12 cait |Lupin| its in a newer update to head,
20:12 Ropuch chris: so 'kura' means treasure?
20:12 chris it can
20:12 |Lupin| cait: hmm ?
20:12 chris it also means schools
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20:12 cait |Lupin| I think its in the big merge from biblibre galen did some days ago
20:14 |Lupin| cait: i see, thans. Will have to rebase our stuff on top of that,I'm sure it's gonna be big fun
20:16 owen Wow, Equinox raiding the Koha devel list for devs!
20:16 nengard left #koha
20:16 chris thats what the lol was for :)
20:16 owen Hands down everyone, you're not going anywhere!
20:16 jwagner Blame gmcharlt!  blame gmcharlt!
20:17 jwagner Although the "humane work environment" might be a draw....
20:18 gmcharlt heh - anyone should feel free to go the other direction, as well
20:18 cait lol
20:19 jwagner But, gmcharlt, it raises the question -- does "humane work environment" mean they don't test code on puppies and kittens?  Just on people???
20:20 gmcharlt jwagner: yes!  we're quite proud of the fact that we test only on people!!!!
20:20 gmcharlt (though if any A.I.s want to join the fun, I suppose we can make an exception)
20:20 jwagner I'm sure the ASPCA appreciates that.
20:20 gmcharlt ;)
20:21 owen gmcharlt: I'll mention that to CGI952 if he returns
20:21 |Lupin| hey galen ! nice to see you around, congras for all the commits !
20:23 wizzyrea |lupin| unfortunately, with the filter, you can restrict your search for something to a specific branch, but you can't show everybody from that branch, unless there's some magic search string that makes that work
20:23 wizzyrea something = patron
20:24 cait would an empty search and restriction work?
20:24 wizzyrea cait: I tried that, my test didn't work :(
20:24 cait oh, perhaps its a bug ;)
20:25 owen wizzyrea, cait, what about '%' ?
20:25 wizzyrea ooh, will check that
20:25 cait or *
20:25 wizzyrea no on %
20:25 wizzyrea no on *
20:25 |Lupin| * worked for me
20:25 wizzyrea hm
20:25 |Lupin| even before the filter patch
20:25 |Lupin| you can see a list of all users
20:26 wizzyrea yes, interestingly, you can't just put it in the little filter text entry box
20:26 wizzyrea you have to put it at the top
20:26 wizzyrea then add the filter
20:26 wizzyrea weird
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20:27 wizzyrea
20:28 wizzyrea
20:28 wizzyrea top one didn't work
20:28 wizzyrea bottom one did
20:28 cait funny
20:28 cait but you found out :)
20:29 wizzyrea yes, ty cait
20:29 wizzyrea wonder if regular searches work like that... there may be a bug ther
20:29 wizzyrea *there
20:29 cait |Lupin| the solutio is: put * in both search fields - top and filter
20:30 wizzyrea ooh, yea, the filter box doesn't work by itself
20:30 |Lupin| ah !
20:30 |Lupin| the filter box isnot a drop-down menu where you choose a branch ?
20:30 cait there is a drop down for branches and category codes and a search field
20:30 wizzyrea there is a text input box right above the Library and CategoryCode Dropdowns (terminology fix needed there too)
20:31 cait jinx?
20:31 wizzyrea the search field doesn't seem to work
20:31 wizzyrea triple padlock
20:31 wizzyrea ;)
20:31 wizzyrea j/k
20:31 cait ok, now im confused g
20:31 jransom morning all
20:31 cait good morning jransom
20:31 jransom about to start testing 3.2
20:31 wizzyrea mornin jransom
20:31 |Lupin| thanks anyway cait & wizzyrea
20:32 wizzyrea |Lupin| did you get what you needed?
20:32 veryinky_ left #koha
20:34 owen I don't get it...why doesn't a patron search work if you start from the "filter" form?
20:34 owen ...and why does it work *after* you search through the main "search patrons" form?
20:35 |Lupin| wizzyrea: I know it exists !
20:35 |Lupin| wizzyrea: I can't test for now because I'll have to merge our branch with the latest head to test...
20:35 |Lupin| I think this is not gonna e an obvious task so I'll keep it for the week-end
20:35 Genji is it safe to cache C4::Biblio::get_biblio_authorised_values?
20:36 cait |Lupin| perhaps wait a little longer, I think there are some bigger bugs to be fixed
20:36 wizzyrea no clue
20:36 |Lupin| cait: ohoh...
20:37 wizzyrea owen: in case you ever come across what I just did with your virtualbox (ssh -p 2222 localhost -> connection refused) just restart ssh on your guest machine (/etc/init.d/ssh restart)
20:37 |Lupin| cait: will in two weeks I'll be away in India for three weeks, so if it's not done before it will have to wait till I'm back... but it's true that if there are some bugs in head, it may not be wise either to merge now...
20:37 wizzyrea dk why it was bustid but that fixed it
20:38 owen Thanks wizzyrea. I shut down this machine every night so I don't suppose I'll run into it. (Makes it hard to maintain a screen session on it ;)
20:38 wizzyrea mine seemed to be broken after moving the vbox image to a new computer
20:38 cait 3 weeks in india, wow
20:39 owen wizzyrea: I wondered if I could carry my vbox image on a thumb drive between work and home
20:39 owen PC -> Mac, though
20:40 jwagner jdavidb, didn't you do a Koha install on a thumb drive?
20:40 jdavidb yup.  using a thumb as the filesystem for koha, and also on a virtual disk that was stored on a thumb drive.
20:41 owen jdavidb: What VM software?
20:41 jdavidb virtualbox.
20:41 jdavidb :)
20:42 jdavidb It was slower than molasses, but it *ran*.
20:43 jdavidb (I was running it on an Asus EEE with only 512MB of ram..possibly a contributing factor.  :P  )
20:43 * jdavidb waves
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20:50 wizzyrea owen: idk why not, as long as you duplicate your vbox settings on both machines. Though, the pc -> mac thing might be problematic
20:51 owen Koha already runs slow enough, may not be worth it. But it would solve my divergent git branches problem in a different way
21:00 |Lupin| good night all
21:00 |Lupin| left #koha
21:02 owen Hmmm... sample serials data. That would be nice too.
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21:20 Genji @quote search genji
21:20 munin Genji: No matching quotes were found.
21:20 Genji ah, im not quotable yet, oh well.
21:30 pie help /win 36
21:30 pie heh :)
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21:31 Ropuch hm- fatal: patch contains a line longer than 998 characters
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22:23 dreece Howdy!
22:23 Ropuch Hi
22:24 dreece Is there anyone that can help me figure out the process for moving from Infocentre to Koha?
22:27 cait left #koha
22:28 Ropuch I think some devs and experienced users will arrive soon
22:28 Ropuch They always do when I'm going to sleep ;>
22:28 dreece haha
22:28 dreece Thanks :)
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22:40 Ropuch I hope someone will show soon
22:40 Ropuch Have some trouble with patch sending
22:41 dreece Yeah.. me too.
22:41 dreece Having issues importing records/holdings.
22:41 rhcl_in_an_out @seen chris
22:41 munin rhcl_in_an_out: chris was last seen in #koha 2 hours, 25 minutes, and 5 seconds ago: <chris> thats what the lol was for :)
22:41 rhcl_in_an_out chris should be on chat
22:42 Ropuch It's about noon in NZ, isn't it?
22:43 imp right
22:43 rhcl_in_an_out 11:41:14 am NZST  |  Wednesday, December 9, 2009
22:43 rhcl_in_an_out I think that's right, anyway. I really like Wolfram Alpha
22:45 Ropuch I have fatal: patch contains a line longer than 998 characters while trying to git send-email, don't know if I should sent it in form of an attachement
22:45 rhcl_in_an_out Sorry, I don't know.
22:49 rhcl_in_an_out well, I'm out...
22:49 rhcl_in_an_out left #koha
23:04 pianohackr|work joined #koha
23:17 Genji left #koha
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23:36 joetho joined #koha
23:36 pianohackr|work hi mason, joetho
23:41 joetho left #koha
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23:57 masonj hiya jesse

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