IRC log for #koha, 2009-09-28

All times shown according to UTC.

Time S Nick Message
00:24 pianohacker ... and actually hit the funny little X
00:24 pianohacker left #koha
00:24 thd-away is now known as thd
01:03 brendan_ joined #koha
01:03 brendan left #koha
01:03 brendan_ is now known as brendan
02:00 chris_n^2 cool, PDF::Reuse maintainer says he'll include several enhancements I made in his next release latter next month
02:00 chris_n^2 hopefully in time for our 3.2 release
02:05 chris awesome
02:09 * chris_n^2 has been dragged kicking and screaming up the PDF standard learning curve :-P
02:10 thd chris: NZ still recognises software patents, does it not?
02:10 chris not explicitly, doesnt explicity reject them either
02:11 chris there is a bill going through parliament about patents now
02:11 chris so it may all change
02:11 thd There is a case before the US Supreme Court which may change things in the US.
02:12 chris_n^2 thd: which?
02:12 thd Bilski
02:13 thd
02:14 thd The hope is that the scope of patents over software in the US may be weakened by some possible ruling.
02:14 chris_n^2 interesting
02:15 chris or strengthened by another ruling?
02:19 thd The long term low but real possibility of a lawsuit over a software patents is the best reason not to have any long term Koha foundation in the US.
02:20 thd chris: does NZ have patent trolls?
02:20 chris_n^2 if the Supreme Court upholds that ruling it appears that it could work havoc in the software industry
02:21 chris yes, microsoft
02:21 chris_n^2 "...ew really expected just how far reaching the decision would be and that it would call into question thousands of software patents granted over the last 10 to 15 years.:
02:21 chris_n^2 s/ew/few/
02:21 chris they tried patenting story documents as xml here
02:21 chris nzoss and others have challenged it
02:21 chris particularly ironic given that m$ just lost a patent case over xml
02:21 thd We need some havoc in that domain but that is why the court will probably not make a broad ruling.
02:22 chris_n^2 it never ceases to amaze me how judges seem to know everything about everything
02:23 thd chris_n^2: We have special patent courts where 'expert' judges adjudicate patent cases.  Of course, such judges have an obvious bias.
02:24 * chris_n^2 wonders if those courts are akin to irs courts :-(
02:26 chris_n^2 heh: "What my firm has been seeing is that claims can be made allowable by inserting “computer implemented” into claims, sometimes even in the preamble.  It does not seem that is what the Federal Circuit intended, but it is what is happening at least in some cases."
02:26 thd chris_n^2: The presumption is in favour of the patent holder which is often against the defendant if that is how IRS courts work.
02:38 thd The weaker the software business has been in a country historically, the more likely that the country is to have opposition to software patents which are mostly supported by incumbent industries which have managed to use overly broad patents to.protect themselves from new competitors..
02:45 thd is now known as thd-away
02:46 chris_n^2 I was just reading an article on the difference between patent and copyright with regard to software
02:47 chris_n^2 I tend to agree with the thought that a copyright is more appropriate for software
02:47 chris definitely
02:47 chris_n^2 I think that the ability to patent a relatively abstract idea is not good
03:11 elpiddaketan joined #koha
03:11 elpiddaketan hi everyone
03:12 elpiddaketan i have problem in impoerting my data to koha, how will i do that, the records are from Readerware originally, i have the zip file of it
03:12 elpiddaketan i have problem in importing my data to koha, how will i do that, the records are from Readerware originally, i have the zip file of it
03:13 elpiddaketan i got some errors regarding encoding,, something
04:19 richard left #koha
04:29 elpiddaketan left #koha
06:00 magnusenger joined #koha
06:56 mason encoding - something, hmmmm....
06:59 hdl_laptop joined #koha
07:02 custard joined #koha
07:05 custard any body vaguely alert (and feeling up to some apache/koha interaction troubleshooting) ?
07:06 Kivutar joined #koha
07:07 mason ive got 5mins custard :)
07:10 custard <mason> Just doen a fairly major round of updating. Last night I had a Koha that worked. This morning the apache log tells me that "File does note exist: /htdocs".
07:10 custard left #koha
07:10 mason right...
07:11 mason so that probably means your 'DocumentRoot' line is wrong
07:11 mason in your apache config ( in case you read the irc.log )
07:13 custard joined #koha
07:16 kf joined #koha
07:16 kf good morning :)
07:18 nahuel joined #koha
07:19 custard sorry about that Mason, bit of a drop-out. I was about to say I can't see a reason for it wanting "/htdocs", and that /usr/share/koha/opac/htdocs definitely exits and is accessible.
07:23 mason i guess you've probably got another apache2 config file, thats overriding your koha one
07:23 mason or, as i said before....
07:24 mason "so that probably means your 'DocumentRoot' line is wrong"
07:24 mason check that line.
07:25 mason DocumentRoot /home/mason/git/kap-k3-3/koha-tmpl
07:25 mason should have your 'internet-tmpl' and 'opac-tmpl' dirs only
07:26 mason and index.html etc...
07:26 Ropuch hm
07:26 Ropuch /etc/apache2/sites-available/koha:   DocumentRoot /usr/share/koha/opac/htdocs
07:26 Ropuch /etc/apache2/sites-available/koha:   DocumentRoot /usr/share/koha/intranet/htdocs
07:26 Ropuch UGh
07:27 custard which currently says (and is what I'm sure I remember it saying) /usr/share/koha/opac/htdocs
07:28 Ropuch Do you have koha in sites-enabled?
07:28 custard Ropouch: yep.
07:28 mason and lots of other stuff?
07:28 custard nup. even disabled default.
07:29 custard index.html?
07:29 mason ok, good... :)
07:29 mason yep
07:29 custard this should be in DocumentRoot or one of the language localisations?
07:29 mason ls -l  /usr/share/koha/opac/htdocs
07:29 mason wot u get?
07:30 custard opac-tmpl (and that's it)
07:30 mason ok, so yr missing the internet-tmpl staff dirs :/
07:30 custard isn't that here: /usr/share/koha/intranet/htdocs/
07:31 custard ?
07:31 custard and they're both not working.
07:31 mason[…]76d1604b2;hb=HEAD
07:31 mason .
07:32 custard That's 3.2, yes?
07:32 mason yep, 3,2 - and yr versions is ?
07:33 mason 3 dot  something ?
07:33 custard 3.000.02 (just caught up with current stable)
07:33 mason ok, great
07:36 mason so , i cant confirm your dir layout  - i dont have a koha of that install-type to test with
07:36 mason and im too busy now to switch to an install
07:37 mason .
07:37 mason comment out one of your vhost enteries , in yr apche conf
07:38 mason or edit your koha conf down to a simple 5 line hello-world test
07:38 mason test with a index.html file in a dir
07:38 mason start simple, find the config goof
07:39 mason very probably in yr koha's apache.conf file ;)
07:39 mason as its the only live one
07:40 mason .
07:40 mason at least -  thats what i do with my apache conf bugs , when i get them  :)
08:00 chris evening
08:03 custard ok. functionally (but not elegantly) working koha again. And feeling sheepish about it too.
08:04 custard Yes, something wrong with koha-conf. The upgrade over wrote it, and it's one of the few files so far that I've acutally changed. So, naturally, things broke once apache realised.
08:04 custard Thanks mason.
08:13 custard I'll head off now and make some notes for next time I try and run an update :|
08:13 custard left #koha
08:53 CGI810 joined #koha
08:57 hdl_laptop chris ?
08:58 CGI810 left #koha
09:01 chris hi hdl_laptop
09:04 bibli0 joined #koha
09:06 bibli0 left #koha
09:09 |Lupin| joined #koha
09:09 |Lupin| hi
09:10 kf hi lupin
09:17 |Lupin| guten morgen kf
09:19 chris_n2 joined #koha
09:27 |Lupin| hmm just in ase there are git experts aroun..
09:27 |Lupin| I just did a git format-patch origin
09:27 chris_n left #koha
09:27 |Lupin| and git created 2 files
09:27 |Lupin| one of them is a patch I'd like to submit so that's fine
09:28 |Lupin| but the other is a patch I had already submitted and which was accepted
09:28 |Lupin| so I think it shold already bi in master
09:28 chris did you fetch and rebase before you created your patch?
09:28 |Lupin| I did a git pull before prepearing the patch..
09:28 |Lupin| is there something else I shold do ?
09:29 |Lupin| chris: I think I fetched (git pull?) but perhaps the second part is missing ?
09:30 chris a pull is a fetch + merge
09:30 chris a little bit different
09:31 |Lupin| chris: ok... so what should I do ?
09:31 chris but if the patch had been accepted, then it would have not been made
09:31 chris what number is it, both patches arent 0001 are they?
09:31 |Lupin| chris: no, the old one is 001 and the new one is 002
09:32 |Lupin| chris: the commit name for the old one is commit 2889603e0eb98980ed74d8ed678069ee823feed5
09:34 chris hmmm
09:35 chris[…]d678069ee823feed5
09:35 chris thats the last commit in the master branch
09:46 |Lupin| chris: yeah this one is displayed in git log
09:47 |Lupin| chris: ah, maybe the 0001 was un old file that shold have been deleted... after deleting 000* and re-runningdarcs format-patch origin, everything seems to be fine
09:50 chris s/darcs/git/ :)
09:53 |Lupin| chris: ooooops !
09:53 chris kf:[…]g2_serialNumber=1 <-- like the book on the right?
10:11 kf chris: dont know that one - does kahurangi learn German? :)
10:15 chris he has books in german, french, maori and english
10:16 chris my father did his degree in russian, with french and german minors, so he reads to him :) (He is a licensed translator and interpreter for Maori too)
10:20 kf cool
11:14 CGI245 joined #koha
11:19 CGI245 left #koha
11:28 CGI245 joined #koha
11:30 CGI245 left #koha
11:33 jwagner joined #koha
11:46 jdavidb joined #koha
11:49 nengard joined #koha
11:50 collum joined #koha
11:51 |Lupin| hi Nicole !
11:51 |Lupin| nice to see you online !
12:11 chris_n2 is now known as chris_n
12:16 |Lupin| left #koha
12:48 owen joined #koha
12:50 Colin joined #koha
12:51 jdavidb Hiya, owen and Colin.  :)
12:51 owen Hi
12:51 Colin Hi
12:54 chris_n g'morning
12:57 jwagner Morning, all
12:57 jwagner owen, Kyle Hall just sent a patch to allow superlibrarians to delete messages from any branch.
12:58 owen Awesome.
12:59 owen kyle++
13:00 jwagner Agreed :-)  I think you're working on patches for the display suggestions you made, correct?
13:00 owen I submitted some on Friday
13:01 owen I may not have submitted the one for the OPAC yet, merging the message lists, can't remember.
13:08 jwagner OK, I won't do anything along those lines myself then.
13:19 kf is there an easy way to not show marc and expanded marc view in opac? I found sys prefs for staff, but not for opac.
13:23 owen kf, you could add "#MARCview { display:none; }" to your stylesheet (or to your OpacUserCSS pref)
13:24 kf owen: thx! thats really easy and nothing I thought of!
13:24 owen For both: "#MARCview, #MARCviewPop { display: none; }"
13:25 owen I think it's worth filing a bug, though. There ought to be an OPAC version of the preferences you saw
13:26 kf will do :) your css worked like a charm - librarian will be happy
13:28 * owen did the same to hide ISBD in his catalog
13:29 kf librarian likes isbd - but found mistakes in it she wants me to correct.
13:30 owen I've forgotten what little I knew about the ISBD formatting syntax.
13:33 kf I have a lot of other tickets so that I can procrastinate this for a while ;)
13:41 magnusenger left #koha
13:48 rhcl joined #koha
14:05 * owen is happy to hear about Kyle doing work for PTFS. The more [paid] programmers the merrier!
14:09 jwagner Yes, he's done several nifty features for us.
14:11 valczir_work joined #koha
14:11 owen Hi valczir_work
14:11 valczir_work hey, owen
14:15 jwagner owen, just used that display: none trick for something completely different.  Thanks -- I can cross that mod off my list :-)
14:16 CGI414 joined #koha
14:16 owen Handy stuff. You just have to worry now about your users who surf the web with stylesheets turned off ;)
14:16 jwagner On Their Own Heads Be It!
14:17 owen Yeah, that's what I figure too.
14:19 wizzyrea ooh, harsh
14:19 wizzyrea ;)_
14:19 wizzyrea j/k
14:21 owen Hi wizzyrea, how's it going?
14:21 * jdavidb has no problem telling users, "Then Don't Do That."
14:24 kf jdavidb: the problem is you have to repeat it too often
14:26 jdavidb That's just one of the perils of being in the IT business, kf.  The most-common problem in most IT is the one that exists between the keyboard and the chair.
14:26 jdavidb I try to code around that problem; enforce things with the code, or make so the admin can.  But you can't do that for everything.
14:29 kf i think its the most-common problem in every business
14:31 jdavidb Seems likely.  Computers don't often *make* errors on their own; track back a couple of steps, and you find a programmer who goofed.  Human Error.
14:31 wizzyrea it's going ok :)
14:32 wizzyrea I think I had nightmares about vendor specific koha last night
14:32 * kf spent hours yesterday searching bug in my code to find out I forgot to update German templates
14:33 * kf gives wizzyrea some virtual chocolate
14:33 wizzyrea kf: thanks. :)
14:34 jdavidb That would be a nightmare!
14:34 kf I m an expert in koha nightmares - will be glad when our library is finally live
14:36 jdavidb I had one last week where a training trip to a customer site (which, I *do* have upcoming) turned into a permanent change of duty station.  They ponied the money to have me full-time on their stuff.
14:39 jwagner jdavidb, tired of us already?????
14:40 jdavidb Not even, jwagner.  You know where that upcoming trip is--can you *imagine* me moving there?
14:40 jwagner Probably not.....
14:41 jdavidb Sure it's probably a nice place and all, since one of my favorite people is *from* there...but...probably not for me.
14:41 jwagner Speaking of bad dreams, many years ago I was managing the migration from an old ILS to Unicorn.  That meant I had to learn a _lot_ about MARC and other data in a hurry.  By the end of that migration, I was dreaming in MARC record format.  That's REALLY traumatic for a non-librarian.....
14:42 kf cant top that
14:42 jwagner Still trying to forget that experience....
14:46 Colin I think over the years I've learnt more about various MARCs than is compatible with sanity
14:47 jwagner Colin, if you REALLY want to go crazy, try working with COSATI format.  Non-MARC, used primarily for U.S. govt research documents, and hideous in all regards.
14:47 * jdavidb would say that MARC has driven him insane, but that presumes he was sane in the first place.
14:48 jwagner jdavidb, I'm not gonna comment.  I'm not gonna comment.  I'm not gonna comment....
14:48 jdavidb Chicken.
14:48 jwagner Awk!
14:48 Colin yes formats in the hands of the government, that's really scary
14:49 jwagner It's not in the "hands" of the government, but it was government librarians who developed it.  Even Worse!
14:49 wizzyrea omg. have you guys seen the pics of chris's kid dressed up as a punk?
14:49 wizzyrea Hil. ar. i. ous.
14:49 jwagner And at some point I may have to do some development for COSATI with Koha.
14:49 Colin at which point we all hide
14:50 jwagner Including me.
14:56 valczir_work jwagner: I have a picture in my head of a mad scientist hiding behind a thick wall, eyes poking over the top, carefully reaching over the wall to drip some substance into another one
14:57 jdavidb valczir_work: How'd you get that picture of my office?    :P
14:59 valczir_work jdavidb: it's all over the 'net
15:03 jwagner I used to work with mad scientists....  At a safe distance, of course :-)
15:04 owen wizzyrea: I loved the one of yours crashed on the bedroom floor
15:43 wizzyrea oh yea that was hilarious
15:44 Kivutar left #koha
15:49 davi joined #koha
15:51 davi left #koha
15:51 davi joined #koha
15:51 brendan left #koha
15:52 brendan joined #koha
15:52 brendan left #koha
15:56 kf photoshop--
15:57 kf made a typo in logo, now photoshop tells me .psd-file is broken *wants to cry*
15:58 paul_p joined #koha
16:02 sekjal joined #koha
16:26 brendan joined #koha
16:38 kf bye #koha :)
16:38 kf left #koha
16:44 collum left #koha
16:48 moodaepo left #koha
16:48 moodaepo joined #koha
16:53 joetho joined #koha
16:55 owen left #koha
17:02 jwagner Does anyone know where to put a customized favicon.ico image?  I tried putting it in koha-tmpl (where there was an existing one), but it's not showing up.  I've cleared my browser cache and refreshed the page with no luck.  Do you have to do anything else to get it to work?
17:04 collum joined #koha
17:04 sekjal jwagner: I think koha-tmpl only occurs in the code as it's bundled, not as it's installed.
17:05 * chris_n actually gets a response to a question about unicode, diacriticals, and pdf from a pdf platform architect at Adobe.... wow!
17:05 jwagner sekjal, not sure what you mean there.
17:06 sekjal I think you need to put the favicon in /opac/htdocs/opac-tmpl/prog/en/includes
17:06 sekjal or run 'make upgrade'
17:06 chris_n adobe++ #for being helpful on a FOSS project
17:07 sekjal the code has two different directory structures: one for how it's distributed, and another when its installed
17:08 sekjal I don't think that the koha-tmpl directory exists anywhere in the installed tree
17:08 jwagner It's there in the git install, which is what I'm working from -- kohaclone/koha-tmpl/etc.
17:09 jwagner (Sorry -- etc. in the sense of et cetera, not a directory named etc)
17:09 sekjal right
17:10 sekjal but i think the 'live' version that the server recognizes is at /usr/share/koha/opac/htdocs/...../en/includes
17:10 sekjal at least, that's where it winds up when I installed it
17:11 sekjal its confusing
17:11 sekjal to me, at least
17:12 sekjal I've been trying to get my institutional development plan drafted up, and I think that this whole thing implies we'll have to reinstall/upgrade every time we want to test a newly coded feature
17:13 jwagner Are you a git install or a tarball install?
17:13 sekjal originally tarball, but I upgraded from git
17:14 nengard left #koha
17:21 jwagner Hmmm.  Following up on the favicon, for our git install, the image seems to need to go into koha-tmpl, koha-tmpl/intranet-tmpl/prog/en/includes, and koha-tmpl/opac-tmpl/prog/en/includes.  We have multiple instances on this machine, and the Koha install doesn't look at /usr/share at all.
17:22 sekjal jwagner: ok
17:23 jwagner I'm the lowliest novice on git, but for testing new features, shouldn't you be able to create a new branch for them?
17:25 cait_laptop joined #koha
17:25 sekjal yes, indeed.  but if the code is in one arrangement on git, and another when installed, then to get my server to recognize code, I'd have to install/upgrade each time
17:25 sekjal saying that, it really seems like I'm missing something
17:28 jwagner I'm going to have to let one of the pros answer that.  I would think that different branches should work except perhaps where it modifies the database, but I'm pretty fuzzy on specifics.
17:31 sekjal its just the two different directories that are throwing me.  should my server be looking at the directory I pulled from Git?
17:31 sekjal what about the Makefile?
17:33 owen joined #koha
17:34 cait_laptop sekjal: you want to make a dev install?
17:34 chris sekjal: the difference is, doing a dev install
17:34 chris_n sekjal: from the root of your git clone run a dev install
17:34 chris *snap*
17:35 * chris_n thinks not even *paid* support responds faster ;-)
17:35 chris_n g'morning chris
17:35 chris morning
17:35 sekjal wow
17:35 sekjal thank you all
17:35 sekjal that clears things up immensely
17:35 jdavidb Howdy, chris! :)
17:36 brendan morning #koha
17:36 cait_laptop morning chris
17:36 chris_n heya brendan
17:36 brendan :)
17:36 paul_p morning to everyone that is at morning time (for me, it's 7:35PM ;-) )
17:37 brendan well then -- good evening paul_p
17:37 sekjal good <localtime> to everyone
17:37 jdavidb Good evening, paul_p, and cait_laptop. :)
17:37 owen jwagner: Did you get your favicon sorted out?
17:37 cait_laptop good evening jdavidb
17:37 * owen has always found favicons difficult to test because of caching issues
17:38 chris paul_p: thanks for the linkedin recommendation :)
17:40 pianohacker joined #koha
17:45 cait_laptop chris: wrote to German translation mailing list that I will edit po-files locally till saturday. beda says its ok and I think he is the only other who can approve suggestions.
17:46 chris excellent
17:46 jwagner owen, yes favicon is now working (after severe Firefox armtwisting).
17:47 jwagner owen, another question for you, though.  Trying to use jquery to rename Add to Your Cart to Add to Your Bookbag.  I've done it before & it worked, but this time (latest Koha if that matters) it's replacing it one place but not on the box at upper right of an OPAC record display (Print, Add to Your Cart, More Searches).  The label looks the same.
17:48 jwagner Here's what I'm using -- can you see the problem?  $(document).ready(function(){
17:48 jwagner $("a.addtocart").html("Add to Your Bookbag");
17:48 jwagner });
17:48 owen Changing Cart to Bookbag is a huge can of worms. Cart of worms?
17:49 jwagner Bookworms?
17:49 owen There are too many places where the word "Cart" is used to be able to do this cleanly.
17:49 pianohacker *rimshot*
17:49 chris the best way to do it
17:49 joetho owen changes nickname to cartman
17:49 chris is to use the translation tools
17:49 owen joetho: Oh great, thanks :|
17:49 * jdavidb groans.  Gettin' deep in here.
17:49 chris eg, i have en_NZ
17:50 chris for both opac and intranet
17:50 chris changes catalog to catalogue, check out to issue etc
17:50 jwagner But it puzzles me why this same code works on another site & does replace that particular label.
17:50 * owen agrees with chris that this seems the logical way to do it
17:50 jdavidb chris:  That's where you have all your extra U and S characters, right?  ;-)
17:50 chris you only have to translate the words you want different
17:50 joetho I wonder about stuff like this (cart vs bookbag) and all the translations.
17:51 jwagner Both of the places I'm trying to change start with <a class=addtocart and one works/other doesn't.
17:52 jwagner For this particular site, since I have a lot of other customizations, I may just do it as a template change.  Not the best solution, but if I can't make the jquery work I might go for the easy solution :-)
17:53 owen jwagner: the "add to cart" link on the detail page is very different from the "add to cart" button in the search bar
17:53 owen Is that the other place you're referring to?
17:53 chris jwagner: the translation way is the most portable way
17:54 jwagner No, there's an add to cart link in the results list -- that one changed OK.
17:54 chris something like that
17:54 jwagner I'll have to look into translations at some point, but right now I'm trying for "quick and out of my hair"....
17:54 cait_laptop speaking of translation...
17:54 cait_laptop how to make this show up in po-file? <optgroup label="Dates">
17:55 chris quick and out of my hair now = omg what is stuck in my hair in 3 months time
17:55 chris :)
17:55 jwagner And I just started letting my hair grow out, too.  Maybe I should get it cut again....
17:55 chris cait_laptop: we will fix that for 3.2.0
17:55 owen jwagner: an add to cart link in the results list? That's a drop-down menu.
17:57 cait_laptop chris: so its more complicated? I hoped I could do it
17:57 jwagner Under each title in the results list, where it says Actions, there's an Add to Your Cart link, and the jquery changed that to Bookbag OK.  It just won't do it on the detail page in that box to the right-hand side.
17:58 owen Oh right, sorry
17:58 jwagner Gotta run to a meeting -- back in a bit.
17:59 chris cait_laptop: yeah i think its a little tricky to do
17:59 owen $("a.addtocart").html("Add to Book Bag");
17:59 owen That works for me in both places
18:02 cait_laptop chris: ok :) I will wait.
18:03 cait_laptop seeing owen using jquery for renaming things - would this work for optgroups in sort by pull down too?
18:04 owen As an interim solution while you're waiting for proper translation? I think so--at least for your javascript-enabled users
18:05 cait_laptop our librarian is a little unhappy about it
18:06 cait_laptop so an interim solution would be nice
18:06 owen give me a moment and I'll give it a try
18:07 paul_p chris: M. Bastareaud just sentenced to do 18 "general interest works for the amatteur rugby", before june 2010
18:07 cait_laptop owen: thx a lot!
18:07 chris paul_p: so he wont be playing with NZ play France in Marseille ?
18:08 owen cait_laptop: An example:
18:08 owen $("optgroup[label='EnglishLabel'​]").attr("label","Translation");
18:08 chris s/with/when/
18:08 paul_p chris: dunno, he can continue doing his job and to the GIW on spare time.
18:09 owen cait_laptop: Do you know where to plug that in?
18:09 chris paul_p: ahhh ok
18:09 cait_laptop I have used some of your tricks to kill some fields in memberentry before
18:09 cait_laptop give me 2 minutes to try :)
18:09 paul_p I think he could be selected, but, seeing the buzz in NZ, I wouldn't be surprised if the french federations decided not to call him...
18:10 chris yes, i think it would be a hard game for him if he played
18:13 cait_laptop owen: works great (as always :) )
18:14 cait_laptop thx!
18:14 ColinC joined #koha
18:15 jdavidb Two Colins?  Wow.  Maybe PTFS Europe has solved the degredation problem in cloning--bet both of them are wizards with the code!
18:17 owen Sure, that's how chris_n got the labels system upgraded
18:18 jdavidb I'm pleased as punch, if there are two.  The one we had already is a top-shelf colleague.  Writes good code, great to work with, and (apparently) never sleeps.
18:20 Colin left #koha
18:20 pianohacker hmm, I need to talk to him; I need one me for school, and one to work on the poor, neglected sysprefs editor
18:21 chris_n $alter_ego = $self->clone($number_needed)
18:22 chris_n on second thought: $alter_ego = $self->clone(number => $number_needed, improvements => @a_whole_array_of_them)
18:23 owen I'll take a clone if there's a way to sync our brains after we've been apart.
18:23 owen Maybe through iTunes?
18:23 * jdavidb shudders
18:24 jdavidb Need to make sure the protocol is not too lossy.
18:25 jdavidb I'd just let my clones each become subject-matter experts, and we could do trainings in relays.  :P
18:25 ColinC is now known as Colin
18:25 chris_n lol
18:25 Colin The cloning failed it was just my evil twin
18:25 jdavidb Ah.  Rats.
18:27 * jdavidb is the evil twin.
18:27 jwagner But we Knew That!
18:27 pianohacker jdavidb: I think you're missing the necessary goatee
18:27 * cait_laptop found another untranslatable string
18:27 cait_laptop $(".hold").text_("Place Hold"); ?
18:27 jwagner owen, out of my meeting.  I tried the  $("a.addtocart").html("Add to Book Bag"); but it's still refusing to change the wording on that one spot.  Sigh.
18:28 cait_laptop ok _ does not work
18:28 jdavidb I am missing it *now*, pianohacker; just recently shaved my face, after wearing a goatee for 20 years.  The whole-beard thing you saw in April was less than a year old.
18:28 owen cait_laptop: Where is that?
18:28 pianohacker ahh
18:28 cait_laptop opac-basket
18:28 cait_laptop in javascript part
18:28 pianohacker cait_laptop: embedded js or external file?
18:29 cait_laptop embedded
18:29 owen Yeah, it's a bug
18:29 cait_laptop yeah, I know ;)
18:29 owen There are a few untranslatable strings in there I see
18:29 cait_laptop Tag is also not translatable
18:30 owen Line 81 should more correctly read $(".hold").text(_("Place Hold"));
18:30 owen Line 87 should be $("#tagsel_tag").text(_("Tag"));
18:30 owen These look familiar though, like there was a patch recently for it. It may already be in line for 3.2
18:31 cait_laptop I did a patch for this text on list interface
18:32 owen Maybe that's what I'm thinking of
18:32 cait_laptop you helped me with it, so maybe :)
18:32 cait_laptop I will add a bug report later and correct it
18:32 cait_laptop have to catch my bus now - quiz night at local irish pub with colleagues
18:33 owen Hmmm... Why is there no delete button on Maybe because the page doesn't know whether there are items attached?
18:33 cait_laptop thx for your help and bye :)
18:34 cait_laptop left #koha
18:34 pianohacker Probably. also, it doesn't seem like a very typical workflow
18:34 owen Hey man you got a problem with my workflow?
18:34 * owen blusters
18:36 wizzyrea ooh, I love it when Owen gets all uppity.
18:36 pianohacker hehe
18:37 * jdavidb hands owen and pianohacker boxing gloves.  Just one, for pianohacker.
18:37 pianohacker Yeah I got a problem with your workflow bub
18:38 * jdavidb opens up the betting windows.
18:41 pianohacker The last time I got into a fight, it was far more ridiculous than threatening
18:41 pianohacker So keep your money :)
18:41 paul_p left #koha
18:41 * jdavidb put a horseshoe into *one* of the three boxing gloves.  Y'all figure out which.
18:43 joetho you? pianohacker, in a fight? I would pay money to have witnessed that. I hope you didn't actually get punched, though...
18:43 pianohacker Anyway. owen: it seems to me like you'd normally want to delete after looking at the normal or marc views, but I could be wrong
18:44 owen What I really want is the ability to delete a biblio with items attached from the normal view.
18:44 pianohacker joetho: hah, not at all, just some other geek that got angry at me and flailed at me for a bit
18:45 pianohacker owen: yes, that would be nice. The current restriction seems a bit much
18:45 joetho Geek Wars!  a new reality show idea.
18:45 pianohacker hahaha
18:50 nicomo_laptop joined #koha
18:52 chris hi nicomo_laptop
18:52 nicomo_laptop hi chris
18:53 nicomo_laptop up already?
18:53 nicomo_laptop What time is it?
18:53 nicomo_laptop 9pm here
18:53 chris nearly 8am
18:53 nicomo_laptop ok
18:53 chris daylight savings started on sunday
18:53 nicomo_laptop ah, yes
18:53 * nicomo_laptop never quite understood those
18:54 nicomo_laptop I have to say I had a wretched day
18:54 nicomo_laptop let's hope tomorrow's better
18:54 chris hehe, yeah just makes it harder to get the kid to go to bed "but the sun is shining"
18:54 * chris hopes so too
18:54 chris what went wrong?
18:54 nicomo_laptop anything that could did
18:54 nicomo_laptop basically :-)
18:54 * owen hates the DST bedtime issue as well
18:55 nicomo_laptop my daughter likes to sleep so much she doesn't care one way or the other
18:55 nicomo_laptop boy do I love her
18:56 nicomo_laptop sunday morning I had to wake her up at 9:30am because we were going to meet friends
18:56 chris heh that rules :)
18:57 chris of course once she is a teenager, it wont be fun anymore "GO TO SCHOOL!!!!"
18:57 chris :)
18:57 nicomo_laptop yeah
18:57 nicomo_laptop but at 5, taht rules
18:57 chris yup :)
18:57 nicomo_laptop I have time before she's a teenager
18:59 * chris goes to catch his bus
19:00 Colin left #koha
19:02 wizzyrea nerd fight, fighting nerds, they don't use fists, they use words!
19:09 * nicomo_laptop goes to bed, have a good day all
19:09 nicomo_laptop left #koha
19:10 owen I thought nerds fought with flashlights while making light saber noises.
19:11 * jdavidb pulls out his blue plastic light saber, and duels like the President.
19:12 pianohacker whoom
19:13 * jdavidb was about to say, "When did we last see a President doing something silly like that," then remembers Dubya holding the flag up *backwards* during the Beijing Olympics, and decides to say nothing...
19:14 owen To this nerd, there's a good silly and a not-so-good silly
19:15 * jdavidb nods.
19:15 pianohacker man should have a sense of humor; only thing that'll keep him from going insane
19:15 jdavidb There is silly, and there is clueless.
19:16 imp left #koha
19:20 hdl_laptop gmcharlt: around ?
19:20 gmcharlt hdl_laptop: yep
19:22 hdl_laptop I have pushed some more things on CodeRunBase you can see that on koha-biblibre.git
19:22 gmcharlt ok
19:23 hdl_laptop I wondered if you had any schedule for integration of this branch ?
19:23 gmcharlt at this point, before the Koha meeting next week
19:23 hdl_laptop I have pushed some more things on CodeRunBase you can see that on koha-biblibre.git (branch master
19:23 hdl_laptop )
19:25 hdl_laptop This branch is based on current master. So it should not be too much of a burden to take it.
19:26 hdl_laptop "atomic updates" should get into in order to have all the database updates for this branch
19:32 chris back
19:33 hdl_laptop hi chris
19:39 chris heya hdl_laptop, working late?
19:40 hdl_laptop yes.
19:43 richard joined #koha
19:43 richard hi
19:44 pianohacker hello
19:44 richard hiya pianohacker
19:44 chris morning richard
19:44 richard hey chris
19:45 jdavidb left #koha
19:56 jwagner left #koha
20:00 imp joined #koha
20:05 collum left #koha
20:28 sekjal left #koha
21:24 nengard joined #koha
21:32 nengard left #koha
21:38 owen Anyone have any numbers for highest-circ library using Koha?
21:39 chris not me
21:39 wizzyrea not it
21:39 chris im guessing NEU is still near the top
21:40 owen NPL's peak was almost 650K in '04
21:41 chris (im thinking NEU cos academic libraries do stupidly high amounts of circ)
21:41 owen I had someone ask me about performance, so I was curious.
21:41 chris but there might be a bigger academic now
21:44 cait_laptop joined #koha
21:45 hdl_laptop owen there is a serious perf issue because items are inside the marcxml
21:46 hdl_laptop Either we part item and biblios Or we throw marcxml away in order to use YAML.
21:46 chris yes circ is slower now than it was, we can fix that (and we will fix that)
21:46 hdl_laptop I prefer the first solution.
21:46 chris we should be just using the items table
21:46 chris thats what it is for
21:47 hdl_laptop yes But search can search for branch and onloan and all that stuff.
21:47 hdl_laptop (and those are items values.)
21:47 chris we are talking about circulation
21:47 chris not searching
21:48 chris there should be a process to update the xml, outside of the circ process, like updating zebra
21:48 chris waiting to parse the xml everytime you issue something is inefficient
21:48 hdl_laptop If you allow ppl to search for only onshelves items, then both are related.
21:49 chris yes, but they shouldnt be
21:49 hdl_laptop i agree.
21:49 hdl_laptop But in my opinion, we should definetely have a 'holding' database
21:50 hdl_laptop And not rely only on biblio
21:51 hdl_laptop then both would be really separated, and we would not have the problem of xml parsing and then regenerating.
21:51 chris *nod*
21:52 hdl_laptop Moreover, generating xml record for items would be much faster than a biblio which has 100 items
21:52 hdl_laptop And marcxml for biblios would be lighter
21:52 hdl_laptop It is also related to searching in authorities before searching biblios
21:53 chris yep
22:03 owen left #koha
22:03 nengard joined #koha
22:09 Jo joined #koha
22:09 Jo spot quizz: who are the big Koha consortias of public libraries throughout the world?
22:10 chris NEKLS
22:10 chris Masscat ??
22:10 chris SEKLS?
22:10 chris nengard probably knows more than me
22:11 nengard those sound about right
22:11 chris CKLS .. how big are they?
22:11 chris and incolsa?
22:11 nengard not sure
22:11 Jo ASCC
22:11 chris ASCC arent live afaik
22:12 Jo working on the outline of the prsebntation chris and i are doing at conference soon...
22:12 joetho left #koha
22:12 Jo (may not get a formalpaper written ... but should be able to wing it aye Chris!)
22:13 chris ive never written a full presentation yet
22:13 Jo goodo
22:13 nengard one of my old slide shows had a list of consortia in it
22:13 nengard hang on
22:13 Jo Nicole - go baby!
22:13 Jo have you got a list of the cool features 3.0 has over more usual LMS
22:14 Jo Chris: thinking is the ideal stage to promote Koha for the nz wide lynsync
22:15 chris yep
22:16 nengard Crawford County Federated Library System
22:16 nengard 9 member libraries; 246,616 items; 518,382 annual circulation
22:16 nengard Independently Cooperating Ashtabula Network (ICAN)
22:16 nengard 6 member libraries; 166,597 bibs
22:16 nengard Central Kansas Library System
22:16 nengard 31 member libraries
22:16 nengard Indiana Cooperative Library Services Authority (INCOLSA)
22:16 nengard 30 member libraries
22:16 nengard MassCat
22:16 nengard 100+ member libraries
22:16 nengard Northeast Kansas Library System
22:16 nengard 116 member libraries
22:17 chris NEKLS is the size of NZ  :)
22:17 nengard that data is out of date
22:17 Jo fantastic
22:17 nengard from an old presentation i did
22:17 Jo too out of date to use?
22:17 Jo in a presentation in NZ?
22:17 Jo or is it 'c2008"
22:17 chris well, they wont have gotten any smaller :)
22:18 Jo thanks Nicole
22:18 Jo thoise are all in the states
22:18 Jo are there others in Europe? India? Africa?
22:18 nengard it was dated 3/3/2009
22:18 Jo south america?
22:19 Jo ok cool - thats current enough to use.
22:19 nengard no clue about those
22:19 Jo Chris: we should've just got Nicole to do this for us you know ..
22:20 chris heh
22:20 Jo (she does these presentations in her sleep :)
22:21 nengard all my presentations are online
22:21 nengard on slideshare and on my website
22:21 nengard feel free to steal
22:22 nengard[…]ons-presentations
22:22 Jo oh cool - thanks Nicole. thats really generous.
22:22 nengard
22:22 nengard no prob at all
22:25 cait_laptop left #koha
22:27 nengard list list found on lib-web-cats:
22:27 nengard Automation System Consortia Colorado. ( United States) Display all the libraries participating in: Automation System Consortia Colorado [web site ]  [Koha -- LibLime] +
22:27 nengard Big Country Library System. ( Abilene, TX United States) Display all the libraries participating in: Big Country Library System [web site ]  [Koha -- LibLime] +
22:27 nengard Central Kansas Library System. ( Great Bend, KS United States) Display all the libraries participating in: Central Kansas Library System [web site ]  [Koha -- LibLime] +
22:27 nengard Crawford County Federated Library System. ( Meadville, PA United States) Display all the libraries participating in: Crawford County Federated Library System [web site ]  [online catalog] [Koha -- LibLime] +
22:27 nengard INCOLSA, Inc.. ( Indianapolis, IN United States) Display all the libraries participating in: Shared Catalog of Indiana Online [web site ]  [Koha -- LibLime] +
22:27 nengard Independently Cooperating Ashtabula Network. ( Jefferson, OH United States) Display all the libraries participating in: Independently Cooperating Ashtabula Network [web site ]  [Koha -- LibLime]
22:27 nengard MassCat. ( South Deerfield, MA United States) Display all the libraries participating in: MassCat [web site ]  [Koha -- LibLime]
22:27 nengard Metrowest Massachusetts Regional Library System. ( Waltham, MA United States) Display all the libraries participating in: MassCat [Koha -- LibLime]
22:27 nengard Northeast Kansas Library System. ( Lawrence, KS United States) Display all the libraries participating in: Northeast Kansas Library System [web site ]  [online catalog] [Koha -- LibLime] +
22:28 nengard Northeast Massachusetts Regional Library System. ( Danvers, MA United States) Display all the libraries participating in: MassCat [Koha -- LibLime]
22:28 nengard Saugeen Library Consortium. ( Hanover, ON Canada) Display all the libraries participating in: Saugeen Library Consortium [web site ]  [Koha -- Independent] +
22:28 nengard South Central Library System. ( Madison, WI United States) Display all the libraries participating in: South Central Library System [web site ]  [online catalog] [Koha -- LibLime] +
22:28 nengard Southeast Kansas Library System (SEKLS). ( Iola, KS United States) Display all the libraries participating in: Southeast Kansas Regional Library System [web site ]  [Koha -- LibLime]
22:28 nengard Southwest School Corporation . ( Sullivan, IN United States) Display all the libraries participating in: Shared Catalog of Indiana Online [web site ]  [Koha -- LibLime]
22:28 nengard Walla Walla Area Library Network. ( Walla Walla, WA United States) Display all the libraries participating in: Walla Walla Area Library Network [web site ]  [Koha -- LibLime] +
22:28 nengard West Texas Library System. ( Lubbock, TX United States) Display all the libraries participating in: West Texas Library System [web site ]  [Koha -- LibLime] +
22:28 nengard still mostly US ....
22:28 pianohacker Ahghhh pasteflood
22:28 nengard search here: http://www.librarytechnology.o[…]
22:28 nengard sorry
22:29 pianohacker Interesting info, though :) didn't know there were that many
22:29 nengard i'm sure there's more - not everyone puts their info on lib-web-cats
22:30 hdl_laptop SAN Ouest -Provence is sbout 300000 items
22:30 hdl_laptop in France
22:35 * chris shows nengard :-)
22:35 Jo thanks
22:35 Jo (can you teach me how to copy from irc too)
22:36 chris its all in the log jo
22:36 Jo cool :)
22:37 Jo there are gajillions in France
22:37 chris[…]09-09-28#i_311981
22:38 Jo ok its all toomuch - koha is just too prevalent around the world to talk about .. its like a virus :)
22:39 chris yeah we should just say. "Who is using koha? ... who isnt using koha"
22:39 Jo lol - ok
22:39 Jo WE've got USA, France, South America and India pretty much sewn up
22:39 Jo Africa coming onboard prettu quick and Europe next
22:40 pianohacker Time to log off for day, cya koha
22:40 Jo cya
22:40 chris cya pianohacker
22:40 pianohacker left #koha
22:40 Jo Chris:i need that visualization tool / map og koha installs
22:41 chris yeah, ill do something
22:58 chris_n^2 chris: can you configure the channel so that when someone pastes to a notice is posted to the channel?
22:58 * chris_n^2 saw something like this on #perl
22:58 chris probably some bot does it
22:58 chris but yeah, i probably could
22:59 rhcl is now known as rhcl_away
22:59 chris make either munin or the log bot do it
22:59 chris pastebot
22:59 chris
23:01 chris and its perl, sweet
23:01 chris_n^2 yeah, it would be a nice addition
23:01 chris ill give it a go
23:01 chris_n^2
23:01 chris_n^2 for example
23:03 chris yep thats it
23:08 chris_n^2 I actually got a positive response from an insider at Adobe concerning some of the unicode difficulties we've been having with the labels pdf code
23:08 pastebot joined #koha
23:08 * chris_n^2 greats pastebot
23:09 chris i have to set up the web side of it
23:10 pastebot left #koha
23:10 chris_n^2 greets even
23:10 pastebot joined #koha
23:13 chris which ill need to do at home when i can poke my firewall
23:13 pastebot left #koha
23:13 chris but yep, shouldnt be hard to do
23:19 chris_n^2 does anyone have a few unicode bibs with lots of diacriticals they could send my way?
23:27 pianohacker joined #koha
23:27 pianohacker chris_n++ # for working on labels unicode problems, tough and touchy problem
23:27 pianohacker left #koha

| Channels | #koha index | Today | | Search | Google Search | Plain-Text | plain, newest first | summary