IRC log for #koha, 2007-12-27

All times shown according to UTC.

Time S Nick Message
13:54 fbcit u around kados?
13:56 paul hi fbcit
13:56 fbcit hi paul
13:56 paul (kados told me in a pm that he should arrive quickly now)
13:56 fbcit great
14:07 fbcit brb
14:30 fbcit paul ?
14:30 paul yep.
14:30 paul seems you're back before kados ;-)
14:30 fbcit :)
14:30 fbcit I have moved my koha db to another machine using mysqldump
14:31 fbcit everything seems ok, but
14:31 fbcit the installer now says...
14:32 fbcit "We are upgrading from Koha to, you must update your database"
14:32 fbcit but
14:32 fbcit a select shows this
14:32 fbcit Version  | 3.0000035 on original machine
14:33 fbcit Version  | 3.0000035 on new machine
14:33 fbcit any thoughts?
14:33 paul maybe a diff in the code itself, not in the database ?
14:40 fbcit paul: that must have been it as rebasing corrected the problem... tnx.
14:53 kados morning all
14:53 kados fbcit: can you confirm this patch is correct:
14:53 kados[…]454d00aa3904f88af
14:53 paul hello kados
14:53 kados paul: mail for you in your inbox (just sent)
14:55 paul kados : about notforloan reintroduced, do you want the patch directly, or I send it to patches ?
14:55 paul I've discovered 2 other problems :
14:56 paul - searchhighlightblob that makes me having biblio description twice on screen.
14:56 kados paul: was notforloan originally visible somewhere?
14:56 paul (in the result lists)
14:56 paul kados: yep, as a status, in the result list
14:56 kados results page?
14:56 kados or detail page?
14:56 paul yep
14:56 paul both
14:56 kados ok
14:56 kados I can add it back in
14:57 paul i already did it
14:57 kados ahh, ok
14:57 kados you can send to then
14:57 paul (on the results page)
14:57 kados re: searchhighlightblob ...
14:57 kados perhaps it should be a syspref which to display?
14:57 paul mmm... what kind of display do you have ?
14:58 paul (go to http://i15.bureau.paulpoulain.[…]
14:58 paul (abel/abel)
14:58 kados k
14:58 paul you'll see what is strange on my side
14:58 fbcit kados: correct
14:58 kados paul: which title
14:58 kados fbcit: thanks
14:59 paul everyone.
14:59 paul 1.  From chaos to covenant modifié 3   ,uses of prophecy in the book of Jeremiah
14:59 paul img Robert P. Carroll - 1981 - S.C.M Description: - viii, 344 p. ; 22 cm Livre
14:59 paul From chaos to covenant modifié 3 uses of prophecy in the book of Jeremiah Robert P. Carroll MONO ...
14:59 fbcit it is now at installer/data/Pg/kohastructure.sql
14:59 paul you get twice "From chaos to covenant modifié 3"
14:59 paul line 1 and line 3)
14:59 kados really strange ... is that the title?
14:59 paul (line 3 being the searchhighlightblob)
14:59 paul yep.
14:59 kados ok, and it's not what you want?
14:59 paul title+author+itemtype
15:00 kados note: google does this too
15:00 paul ??? you get the info twice. Do you really want that ?
15:00 kados maybe we could just omit the title from searchhighlightblob?
15:01 kados woudl that fix it?
15:01 kados if so it's easy to do
15:01 paul could you give me a ggl sample ?
15:01 kados
15:01 kados :-)
15:01 kados Chaos (2008) - Movie Preview -
15:01 kados CHAOS (2008) Movie, synopsis, trailer, pictures, cast, director, release date,
15:02 paul I don't have that result from ggl.
15:02 paul I get, as 1st result :
15:02 paul Chaos theory - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
15:02 paul Free encyclopedia article describing the basics of the theory. Addresses mathematical, physical and historical aspects.
15:02 paul - 87k - Cached - Similar pages
15:02 kados but I agree it looks like google omits the title of the page from it's searchhighlight blob
15:02 kados so lets do that
15:02 paul i'm not sure that will be enough.
15:03 kados title + description then?
15:03 paul because the searchhighlight shows things that already are in the 1st line : title + author + itemtype
15:03 paul so what is the additional information ?
15:04 kados ahh, let me explain
15:04 paul (I have "chaos" highlighted in both, so I really don't see what's new on line 3
15:04 paul )
15:04 kados for instance, notes
15:04 kados often you can do a search and not understand why a result matched your search
15:04 paul right : result 4 in my search "chaos"
15:05 kados well, in that case it's in the title
15:05 kados #7 is a better example
15:05 kados well, even that is not perfect
15:05 kados 8.  Encountering evil   ,live options in theodicy
15:05 kados that one is good
15:05 paul #8 is good
15:05 paul "Encountering evil"
15:05 kados so, it's useful to see why it matched that hit
15:06 paul ok, then I agree it's interesting, but only if you display here something that is not displayed somewhere else (title, subtitle, author mainly)
15:06 kados *nod*
15:06 kados but subtitle is not displayed ;-)
15:06 paul #8 : ,live options in theodicy
15:06 paul it's the subtitle if I don't mind
15:07 kados impossible ...
15:07 kados subtitle mapping was lost
15:07 kados how does it work for you?
15:08 paul this field ("sub-title" in unimarc) is mapped to "biblioitems.volume"
15:09 paul I agree it's unproper.
15:09 paul but that's probably why IPT never told me anything about missing subtitles.
15:09 paul as they are not  missing !
15:09 kados :-)
15:09 paul "the truth is elsewhere"
15:10 paul another problem i just discovered : the "itemtypes.notforloan" feature is not handled
15:11 kados in circ?
15:11 paul itemtype="THEA" (Thèse ancienne) is "not for loan"
15:11 paul and in results page, I can't see that
15:11 paul http://i15.bureau.paulpoulain.[…]
15:12 paul mmm...
15:12 paul i'm wrong, sorry.
15:12 kados shudln't a notforloan be available?
15:12 paul not completly, but not completly right either...
15:12 kados and the 'Holds' link will go away if only notforloan ones are avaialble
15:12 paul let me explain
15:12 paul the "holds" link has disappeared, you're right.
15:12 paul but you have "1 available" on the right.
15:13 kados *nod*
15:13 paul so, one may think that he can issue the book
15:13 kados but it says no hold allowed :-)
15:13 paul (but not reserve it)
15:13 paul don't you have a case where you can't reserve a book but can issue it ?
15:13 kados no
15:13 kados but I agree it's a real case
15:13 paul a lot of our libraries here are doing that for new acqui
15:13 kados but how do you do that?
15:14 kados since we only have one notforloan field?
15:14 paul right.
15:14 kados we need a notforhold field
15:14 kados :)
15:14 kados (in general, are you pleased with the display options now, for staff and opac results? ...)
15:15 paul opac is ready now ?
15:15 kados (I know some of your librarians weren't happy with it)
15:15 kados there are two options for display ... the staff results demonstrates one, the opac the other
15:15 paul bad news : I can issue a THEA, even if the notforloan is set (just tested by issuing 2 THEA to olivier abel)
15:15 kados one is complex, and another is simple
15:16 paul http://i15.bureau.paulpoulain.[…]?borrowernumber=1
15:16 kados I have found many bugs related to reserves/holds too
15:16 kados *nod*
15:18 paul I like the display, on OPAC, with the green for copies available.
15:18 kados if you have zebraqueue running, you can watch the availability change in real time :-)
15:18 paul but why the hell don't you want to reintroduce location and itemcallnumber in that list ?
15:19 kados heh
15:19 kados because US libraries think it's too much info
15:19 kados *shrug*
15:19 kados the same template code from the staff client will work there
15:19 paul (fun to see that in france, we say "why the heaven don't ..."
15:19 paul )
15:19 kados so perhaps we need a syspref
15:19 kados to say which view to display on the opac
15:20 paul yep, because location & callnumber are VERY important for specialised libraries.
15:20 paul where public libraries could probably live without that information on result page.
15:20 paul what could be the name of that syspref ?
15:21 kados OPACResultsDisplay with two options
15:21 kados ?
15:21 paul OPACDisplayItem
15:21 paul ok for OPACResultsDisplay
15:21 paul "full" and "short" options ?
15:21 kados how about statuses and itemdetails
15:21 paul defaulted to "short" of course ;-)
15:22 paul OK.
15:22 paul I prefer "OPACDisplayItem" in fact, as this syspref is only for item displaying.
15:22 kados *nod*
15:22 kados OPACItemResultsDisplay :-)
15:23 kados or OPACItemsResultsDisplay ...
15:23 paul OK
15:23 kados now we're getting good :-
15:23 kados )
15:23 paul i'll do it if you want
15:23 kados OK
15:27 gmcharlt good morning #koha
15:28 fbcit g'morning gmcharlt
15:28 kados morning gmcharlt
15:28 fbcit gmcharlt: Question re
15:29 gmcharlt ok
15:29 fbcit have you tested data imports into mysql and Pg w/foreign key constraints left on?
15:30 gmcharlt fbcit: on mysql on Monday, actually :)
15:31 fbcit and no complaints from mysql?
15:31 gmcharlt fbcit: it works except for some cases where you pick and choose some of the optional ones
15:31 gmcharlt e.g., sample_patrons.sql complains if you don't also select the sample libraries and patron categories
15:31 gmcharlt but if you choose all or none of the optional ones, it works
15:31 fbcit hrmm
15:32 kados how else could it work?
15:32 fbcit I noticed in a mysqldump I did earlier today that mysql switches off FK checking during export/import
15:34 gmcharlt fbcit: mysql may need to do that for the general case of import
15:34 gmcharlt but the install scripts should be coded to work better than that
15:37 fbcit I think we need to prevent the user from getting into a scenario where FK constraints could be a problem at least.
15:37 fbcit during install, that is
15:38 gmcharlt fbcit: I agree; one part is that the sample data scripts needs to be designed that way
15:38 gmcharlt another part (to be added) to is create some sort of manifest or dependency tracking
15:38 gmcharlt so that user can only select a set of scripts that is consistent
15:39 gmcharlt e.g., if you select sample patrons, you automatically bring in sample libraries and patron categories
15:40 gmcharlt kados: does Makefile.PL need an option to build language-specific templates from an available language pack?
15:40 kados yes
15:40 fbcit FK was an afterthought for mysql and the sql scripts are based on older mysql versions I think
15:40 kados the available language packs are in ...
15:40 kados misc/translator/po/
15:40 kados and the naming convention follows RFC4646
15:41 kados with i-opac (interface) and t-prog (template) and v-3000000 (version)
15:41 gmcharlt so right now the only available one is fr-FR -- are there any others coming soon?
15:41 kados there is an arabic one in translation
15:41 kados and we can pretty quickly throw together an en-CA and fr-CA (debra)
15:42 kados I'm sure if we prodded we could get koha-translate people to get started on translating 3.0
15:42 kados but the problem thusfar has been that the templates haven't been stable enough
15:42 gmcharlt the default language is en, of course; but what region is the official default?  NZ, UK, US?
15:42 kados as in , too many changes
15:42 kados it was supposed to be en-UK
15:42 kados but I'm afraid some en-US stuff has crept in
15:43 kados we may have to switch to en-US as the default due to the dearth of en-UK programmers in the community
15:43 gmcharlt ok; besides slef, is there anybody else in the UK?
15:44 kados no, but the NZ guys speak the queen's english :-)
15:45 gmcharlt right, although I would imagine there are some differences between en-UK and en-NZ
15:45 gmcharlt although not necessarily any that matter in an OPAC :)
15:45 kados yea
15:46 gmcharlt en-AU: s/patrons/cobbers/g? :)
15:46 kados and some code to really improve the i18n support
15:46 kados hehe
15:46 gmcharlt kados: good
15:47 gmcharlt I think by default all available language packs should be copied in the installed tree, not just whatever is chosen during Makefile.PL
15:47 gmcharlt and provide instructions for building new templates
15:47 gmcharlt I figure there won't be a file space issue unless we end up with hundreds of translations
15:48 kados *nod* I agree
15:48 kados it's pretty easy to do that too
16:02 paul kados : do you have itemcallumber column in ? result list ?
16:02 paul because I don't have
16:02 paul (i just have branch & callnumber)
16:03 kados hmmm
16:03 kados what do you mean?
16:03 paul http://i15.bureau.paulpoulain.[…]
16:03 paul I don't see "magasin"  wich is location of most of the items
16:03 kados Fonds Paul Ricoeur [test b] (1)
16:03 paul IPT Paris, Magasin [33.652] for example
16:04 kados test b is itemcallnumber, no?
16:04 paul Fonds Paul ricoeur is the branch test b is the callnumber
16:04 paul but no location
16:04 kados location? ... you mean items.location ?
16:04 paul yep
16:04 kados ahh, items.locaion is a coded value, no?
16:04 paul authorised value, right
16:04 kados it's linked to authorized values SHELF_LOC, right?
16:04 paul nope.
16:05 paul it's linked to "LOCAL" here
16:05 kados ahh
16:05 kados that's the prob :-)
16:05 paul ok, so i'll remove the hardcoded link to SHELF_LOC, is it OK for you ?
16:05 kados ?
16:05 kados what do you mean?
16:05 paul (& get it from the marc_subfield_structure)
16:06 kados I think we should agree on the mapping
16:06 kados ie, we should pick either LOCAL or SHELF_LOC
16:06 kados and remove reference to the other
16:07 paul mmm... then I would prefer LOCAL from far, as I have 4 libraries in production already using LOCAL
16:07 kados[…]ment:kohastatuses
16:07 kados OK, no prob
16:07 paul & all 2.2 are using it as well
16:07 kados so we need to update in quite a few places
16:07 paul (it's "LOC" in fact, not "LOCAL")
16:08 kados ok, even better
16:08 paul ok, now it works better :
16:08 paul http://i15.bureau.paulpoulain.[…]
16:08 paul #3 for example
16:09 paul do you want me to fix that everywhere ?
16:09 kados auth_vals.sql, marc21 frameworks (all), the getLocations sub
16:09 kados anywhere else?
16:10 kados ahh, the wiki page:
16:10 kados[…]ment:kohastatuses
16:10 kados I think that's it
16:10 kados paul: yes, you can update
16:11 kados ahh, it's not on the wiki anyway
16:11 kados paul: in fact, i see some new auth values that I don't recognize
16:12 kados Asort1, etc.
16:12 kados paul: what are those?
16:15 CGI715 What is the name of the new cataloging module looks like an email format--Biblios?
16:15 kados CGI715: yes
16:15 kados CGI715: where did you hear about that? :-)
16:17 paul kados : Asort1 and Asort2 are acquisition values, attached to orders for stats purposes
16:17 paul same as Bsort1 and Bsort2 for patrons
16:17 kados paul: I think also that I should modif some of the auth values that are specifically related to the MARC holdings standard to prefix them with HOLDINGS_
16:17 paul like HOLDINGS_LOC for example ;-)
16:17 CGI715 I'm chatting with Mary Laffler from OPLIN  and she's describing this module?
16:17 kados no, not that one
16:18 kados CGI715: tell Mary Josh Ferrary says hi :-)
16:18 kados Ferraro I mean :-)
16:18 kados paul: not that one ...
16:18 kados paul: COMPLETENESS for instance
16:18 CGI715 just did Josh!
16:18 kados PHYS_FORMS, etc
16:19 CGI715 So what about that module?
16:19 kados CGI715: well, it hasn't been released yet
16:19 kados CGI715: it should be available early next year
16:19 CGI715 Can you tell us when it will?
16:19 kados CGI715: it's in beta testing right now
16:19 kados CGI715: send me an email if you'd like to be a beta tester
16:20 CGI715 Can I see the beta or is someone testing it?
16:20 kados CGI715: jmf AT LibLime DOT com
16:20 CGI715 I have your email address memorized.  Will do.  
16:20 kados CGI715: yes, you can see it, but I have to put you in touch with the development team, so they can send you the info
16:20 CGI715 We both say thanks.
16:20 kados no prob, have a great holiday week (sorta) :-)
16:20 CGI715 We still want to know the name of it--please respond
16:21 kados ‡biblios is the name
16:21 CGI715 I'm working this week.
16:21 kados yea, me too :/
16:21 CGI715 Thanks--that's what we thought.  I'll sign off now--oops one more question!
16:21 kados heh
16:21 CGI715 What do I need to do to be a beta tester?
16:22 kados is this Deb? :-)
16:22 paul CGI715: you just need to test ;-)
16:22 kados CGI715: I will put you in touch with the dev team and they will explain it to you
16:22 CGI715 of course it's Deb  I thought you knew--sorry--do you need more coffee?!
16:24 CGI715 ok I'll wait to hear from the dev team.  Do I need to provide my email address or give it to you, Josh?
16:24 kados CGI715: i've got it :-)
16:25 CGI715 ok I'll wait to hear from you or the dev team.  Mary and Deb signing off now so you can get back to real work.
16:32 kados paul: so ... Asort1, etc ... what should the default values be?
16:32 paul imho, there can't be any.
16:32 paul as it's really "free for stats"
16:33 kados do we have some help text explaining this somewhere?
16:33 paul for public libraries, in france, we usually set something to Bsort1, that is required by the gov for example
16:33 paul in the auth value, i've recently added a small description when the user select Asort1 or one of the hardcoded values
16:34 paul (just before the <table> with the list)
16:34 kados I see it now
16:34 kados ok, thanks
16:35 kados lets make a kohaauthvalues wiki page
16:36 kados authorised_value is varchar(10) ... is that large enough?
16:37 paul varchar(10) is quite standard size for Koha for codes.
16:37 paul and i think it's really better to have most codes with the same size
16:37 kados ok
16:48 kados paul: how about SUGGEST, what should be the default values?
16:48 paul we could have : - "No more budget"
16:48 paul - "pas dans notre politique documentaire" (sorry, don't know how to translate)
16:48 paul - already ordered
16:48 paul - already in the catalogue
16:49 kados values? +1 accept, -1 reject?
16:50 paul mmm... good idea
16:50 kados oh, it's not implemented?
16:50 kados ok, so it's just a list of 'reject' reasons, eh?
16:50 paul nope
16:50 paul it's just a list of "reason"
16:50 kados ok
16:50 paul accept & reject all together
16:51 kados k
16:54 kados[…]nt:kohaauthvalues
16:55 kados needs some more info, but I think i have them all listed now
16:55 kados oops, missing CCODE, STACK and LOC
17:07 kados paul:[…]nt:kohaauthvalues
17:07 kados paul: can you update and add any missing ones from fr-FR/UNIMARC ?
17:45 tim kados: this is what I was trying to get done a couple weeks ago.
17:45 tim[…]
17:46 tim The URLs section just above the center of the page.
17:50 kados hey tim
17:50 kados cool
17:50 kados looks good
17:50 tim I added a few lines to to get it to work.
17:51 tim I tried to show it to you last week, but a router had a seizure.
17:53 kados *nod*
18:46 [K] *** join #koha@FreeNode: rangi
04:40 [K] *** join #koha@FreeNode: rangi

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