IRC log for #koha, 2022-04-06

All times shown according to UTC.

Time S Nick Message
01:37 indradg joined #koha
06:16 reiveune joined #koha
06:17 reiveune hello
06:42 alex_ joined #koha
06:43 alex_ Bonjour
06:49 indradg joined #koha
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07:02 cait joined #koha
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08:04 severine_q joined #koha
08:04 severine_q Hello everyone !
08:37 tcohen hola #koha
08:37 tcohen bonjour severine_q alex_ reiveune ashimema
08:38 alex_ Salut tcohen
08:42 tcohen hi nugged
08:42 tcohen andrii
09:04 severine_q hola @tcohen and all :)
09:40 nlegrand Bonjour.
09:41 Joubu bug 30461 impacts 21.11
09:41 huginn Bug https://bugs.koha-community.or[…]_bug.cgi?id=30461 critical, P5 - low, ---, jonathan.druart+koha, Needs Signoff , Batch authority tool is broken
09:41 nlegrand Do people use Koha with docker in production?
10:07 udkoha joined #koha
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10:11 udkoha hi all - is there a place where we can get mor documentation for Bywaters NCIP server ?
10:13 udkoha at the moment it's running but even the LookupVersion requests fails and we don't understand everything in the config.yml ?
10:13 udkoha Concerning LookupVersion we get this error: v1/includes/ not found
10:14 udkoha ah, there is only this file /templates/v2/includes/ in the ncip-server directory
10:16 udkoha how can I choose between v1 and v2 ? is there a setting in the config.yml or do we have to set v1/v2 in our NCIP request?
10:21 udkoha ok, I've copied the from v2 to v1 but I don't know where I can change the behaviour of the NCIP server to use v2 instead of v1
10:29 oleonard joined #koha
10:30 oleonard Hi #koha
10:55 cait joined #koha
11:06 kidclamp khall_ ^^
11:21 udkoha sorry, I found the place where I can choose between v1 and v2 concerning NCIP server
11:21 udkoha I have to set version like this: <NCIPMessage version='[…]2/ncip_v2_02.xsd'>
11:46 cait1 kidclamp^
11:47 kidclamp that's all khall cait1
11:47 cait1 makes snse, but not sure if he watches us here :)
11:50 khall_ udkoha you are correct. If you need any more help let me know!
11:51 udkoha hello kyle, indeed I could need more help :-)
11:52 udkoha we are running NCIP since 2005 but none of our NCIP XML payloads works out of the box
11:53 udkoha I dont't know for example why I need to set userenv_borrowernumber: <id>
11:54 udkoha does this user must have superlibrarian permissions?
11:54 udkoha at the moment I try LookupItem but I got another error
11:54 udkoha h2>runtime error</h2><pre class="error">Can&#39;t call method &quot;textContent&quot; on an undefined value
11:55 udkoha But in the Request I use <ItemIdentifierValue datatype="string">6</ItemIdentifierValue>
11:55 marcelr joined #koha
11:55 marcelr o/
11:55 marcelr patron search without typing any search string normally gave me all patrons; now I get nothing ?
11:56 udkoha so either koha can find the item by id or not but why is the method textContent not working?
11:56 udkoha Handler/  : line 31:        $item_id = $item_id->textContent();
11:57 Joubu marcelr: empty table or no table at all?
11:58 marcelr no table at all
11:58 Joubu yes, there is a sticky CSS cache
11:58 Joubu try in a new browser's session
11:58 marcelr sure
11:58 Joubu or clear harder your cache
12:05 marcelr nothing changes Joubu except that I lost quite some cookies etc
12:05 marcelr together with JSON Validator stuff, this is a great time spender :)
12:08 Joubu marcelr: do you see the library on admin/
12:09 Joubu libraries*
12:25 marcelr yes all libraries
12:27 Joubu something in the JS console? do you see the GET /patrons query?
12:56 edveal joined #koha
12:59 marcelr Joubu: thats the point probably, when you type something I see a REST API call, when you dont, there is no call
12:59 marcelr its not very important but I guess that more people may expect a response since there always was
13:00 marcelr maybe add to release notes or something
13:08 Dyrcona joined #koha
13:11 Joubu marcelr: talking about the search in the header?
13:14 Joubu yes, it's a bug, please report it and link it with 30063
13:36 cait1 udkoha: a lot of irc clients light up when you use the nick in the message
13:43 edveal joined #koha
13:52 oleonard o/
13:53 cait1 hi oleonard
13:53 wahanui hi oleopard
13:59 lukeg joined #koha
14:46 AndrewFH joined #koha
15:19 reiveune bye
15:19 reiveune left #koha
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15:54 bag joined #koha
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17:04 khall joined #koha
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17:54 oleonard KohaCon22 web page announced:
18:52 michal joined #koha
20:08 tuxayo :D
20:15 michal joined #koha
21:10 aleisha joined #koha
21:13 aleisha hey all
21:15 alexbuckley joined #koha
21:15 hayley joined #koha
21:15 cait oleonard: the logo looks nice :)
21:15 cait it's different, I quite like it
21:15 * cait waves
21:43 rangi[m]  does that work for people?
21:48 cait it does
21:48 cait rangi[m]: ^
21:48 hayley joined #koha
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21:51 indradg_ joined #koha
21:51 mtj joined #koha
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21:54 fridolin joined #koha
21:54 fridolin yey
21:54 fridolin https://wiki.koha-community.or[…]ting_6_April_2022
21:54 fridolin dev meeting in 5
21:54 fridolin tuxayo: there ?
21:54 wahanui there is an icy hand resting on my shoulder
21:55 fridolin ^^
21:55 tuxayo oh right the meeting!!!
21:55 tuxayo fridolin++
21:55 tuxayo thanks :o
21:56 tuxayo _oftc_rangi[m]: yes it works for me
21:59 aleisha joined #koha
22:01 rangi[m] thanks tuxayo[m]
22:01 tuxayo #startmeeting Development IRC meeting 6 April 2022
22:01 huginn Meeting started Wed Apr  6 22:01:44 2022 UTC.  The chair is tuxayo. Information about MeetBot at
22:01 huginn Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.
22:01 Topic for #koha is now  (Meeting topic: Development IRC meeting 6 April 2022)
22:01 huginn The meeting name has been set to 'development_irc_meeting_6_april_2022'
22:02 rangi[m] #info Chris Cormack, Catalyst IT
22:02 tuxayo #link https://wiki.koha-community.or[…]ting_6_April_2022 Today's agenda
22:02 hayley #info Hayley Pelham, Catalyst IT
22:02 tuxayo #topic Introductions
22:02 Topic for #koha is now Introductions (Meeting topic: Development IRC meeting 6 April 2022)
22:02 alexbuckley #info Alex Buckley, Catalyst IT
22:02 aleisha #info Aleisha Amohia, Catalyst IT, Wellington NZ
22:02 fridolin joined #koha
22:02 cait #info Katrin Fischer, Germany
22:03 tuxayo #info Victor Grousset, Tuxayo & Co., France
22:03 alohalog` joined #koha
22:03 cait not sure I'll be around to the end, a little late here
22:03 fridolin #info Fridolin Somers, Biblibre, France
22:03 tuxayo woohoo, so much people :D
22:03 rangi[m] you're still in france fridolin ? travelling home soon?
22:04 hayley hello all!
22:04 fridolin yep, return in 10 days
22:04 * fridolin enjoys cheese and wine
22:05 tuxayo #topic Announcements
22:05 Topic for #koha is now Announcements (Meeting topic: Development IRC meeting 6 April 2022)
22:05 tuxayo #info KohaCon22 website live!
22:05 cait and with a nice logo too
22:05 cait koha_us++
22:05 rangi[m] wainui is recovering from eye surgery, so I am filling in as rmaint just for the april release
22:06 fridolin super
22:07 tuxayo thanks for the help, best wishes to Wainui for recovery
22:07 rangi[m] thanks tuxayo[m] , ill pass that on
22:07 tuxayo Anything else to announce that doesn't fit the other topics of the agenda?
22:07 tuxayo thanks rangi
22:08 tuxayo #topic Update from the Release manager (22.05)
22:08 Topic for #koha is now Update from the Release manager (22.05) (Meeting topic: Development IRC meeting 6 April 2022)
22:08 tuxayo fridolin, the mic is yours
22:08 fridolin yey
22:08 fridolin hackfest was great
22:09 rangi[m] the pictures looked great!
22:09 fridolin so lots of passed QA
22:09 cait it looked like you al lhad a good time for sure :)
22:09 tuxayo ^^
22:09 fridolin I've discussed about end of cycle => do as usual
22:09 rangi[m] ahh yep
22:10 fridolin and next release => i'm not presenting for it
22:10 fridolin i will send email on ML about milestones for 22.05 release soon
22:11 fridolin there is one action I need to do : synch between DBIC and kohastructure.sql
22:12 tuxayo + DBRevs? All this looks though
22:12 rangi[m] thanks fridolin
22:12 tuxayo *tough
22:12 fridolin yep DBRevs also
22:12 fridolin the Recalls dev has an impact there
22:13 fridolin i am good
22:13 aleisha :)
22:13 tuxayo #topic Updates from the Release Maintainers
22:13 Topic for #koha is now Updates from the Release Maintainers (Meeting topic: Development IRC meeting 6 April 2022)
22:13 tuxayo rmaints?
22:13 wahanui hmmm... rmaints is khall, AndrewFH, wainui and tuxayo
22:14 rangi[m] nothing from me
22:14 tuxayo So much happened during Hackfest, I forgot what's up about RMaint ^^ I guess all good, nothing special
22:15 tuxayo #topic Updates from the QA team
22:15 Topic for #koha is now Updates from the QA team (Meeting topic: Development IRC meeting 6 April 2022)
22:15 tuxayo qa_team?
22:15 wahanui i think qa_team is cait, joubu, tuxayo, marcelr, kidclamp, khall, tcohen, ashimema, nugged, kohaputti, petrova
22:15 cait I am happy that we have mostly caught up on the older bugs waiting in the queue now
22:15 cait still a lot to do and bottleneck is currenlty maybe in NSO
22:16 cait it's at almost 300 - so getting sign-offs up again would probably be good
22:16 cait and... QA team: do QA!
22:16 aleisha cool! can looking into doing more testing
22:17 fridolin same for me
22:17 cait lots of bugs waiting in there too, according to dashboard
22:17 tuxayo I still have a lot to review on recalls but I already have some notes to open potential followups. Maybe some DB indexes are needed for example.
22:17 fridolin yep priority to bugfixes
22:17 aleisha tuxayo: feel free to add me to cc list for any recalls bugs
22:18 tuxayo ok :)
22:18 tuxayo moving on?
22:18 cait yes please
22:19 tuxayo #topic Actions from last meeting
22:19 Topic for #koha is now Actions from last meeting (Meeting topic: Development IRC meeting 6 April 2022)
22:19 tuxayo « fridolin checking the GUI tool for alter on AnonymousPatron x
22:19 tuxayo *»
22:19 tuxayo « fridolin create bug report for skipping AnonymousPatron from »
22:19 tuxayo «     2 above actions are obsolete, there is already a test from Bug 14708: Skip AnonymousPatron in GetBorrowersToExpunge »
22:19 huginn Bug https://bugs.koha-community.or[…]_bug.cgi?id=14708 normal, P5 - low, ---, kyle.m.hall, RESOLVED FIXED, The patron set as the anonymous patron should not be deletable
22:19 fridolin all good
22:19 tuxayo #topic General development discussion (trends, ideas, ...)
22:19 Topic for #koha is now General development discussion (trends, ideas, ...) (Meeting topic: Development IRC meeting 6 April 2022)
22:20 rangi[m] nothing from me here too :)
22:21 fridolin at hackfest we have seen use of a replacement for Selenium
22:21 tuxayo Cypress
22:21 rangi[m] oh i would be interested in that
22:21 rangi[m] cool
22:22 tuxayo Joubu experience in writing the tests what better than with Selenium.
22:22 tuxayo experience as it how it felt. Not about existing knowledge
22:22 rangi[m] ah yep
22:23 fridolin In case you missed it : Great dev has been pushed Bug 30063
22:23 huginn Bug https://bugs.koha-community.or[…]_bug.cgi?id=30063 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, jonathan.druart+koha, Pushed to master , Make the main patron search use the /patrons REST API route
22:24 fridolin this needed ugrading some libs
22:24 tuxayo I was able to make Joubu's test on ERM run easily on my machine.
22:24 rangi[m] oh that is good news!
22:25 fridolin We start building CI for Ubuntu 22.04 Jammy
22:26 tuxayo great!
22:26 fridolin thats why we droppped Ubuntu 16.04 Xenial
22:26 fridolin Jammy is my actual OS :D
22:26 fridolin the beta is OK
22:27 tuxayo I did an attempt to run cypress via koha-testing-docker but didn't get far. I was trying to use the existing docker image for cypress&browsers the wrong way it seems. I have to ask stuff in Cypress's chat or forum about how to do it right
22:28 tuxayo It's the right meeting to see what can be learned from the recall submission. aleisha and all that followed recalls, what do you think could be done by submitters of larger patchsets such as this one and the rest of the community to make it easier?
22:29 tuxayo *all people that followed the recalls ticket
22:29 aleisha less scope creep :)
22:30 rangi[m] i think thats the main one, get in the MVP (as they say in the agile world) (minimum viable product) then add to it
22:30 aleisha it was a much smaller patchset years ago when i started, but it was being developed for the company that sponsored it
22:30 tuxayo How did that happen? The first ticket message what already warning against scope creep.
22:30 tuxayo *was already warning
22:30 aleisha i also could've created additional bug reports for the follow-ups, but it wouldve been too hard to rebase many separate bug reports
22:31 tuxayo yes, that would be a mess
22:31 aleisha tuxayo: people had different ideas of how recalls should look and couldnt agree, so the feature got blocked
22:31 cait I think tht was a part of it, managing different expectations
22:31 fridolin mmm some dev like patrons search via API are a large graph of bugs, it worked
22:32 cait which then scope creeps... I am not sue what can be done, breaking into smaller bits would make it easier to get the base in for sure, but that means we need to ensure it's not sitting for too long iwth a bigger tree to work through
22:32 aleisha exactly cait
22:32 cait i think that's waht helped with patron search
22:32 cait people sitting together working through it
22:33 cait we tried to organize something similar for Recalls - but it was hard to find time. I am really glad marcelr++ took it on
22:34 aleisha yes thanks marcel, it was good to not be the only person getting stuck in recalls land
22:34 fridolin ^^
22:34 cait we have other big patches still stuck
22:34 cait marc holding records comes to mind
22:35 tuxayo > could've created additional bug reports for the follow-ups
22:35 tuxayo Also the thing is that internally you have to develop the whole thing for your clients. In the case the MVP doesn't get merged quickly you end up with having the have a minimal version and a larger version for your customers. is that an actual issue or extracting part of a dev to submit it in various ticket (and handling the change feedback) is not that bad?
22:35 cait or the work on attempting to merge tables
22:36 aleisha tuxayo: that's exactly what happened - developing for clients while the upstream version was blocked by scope creep and differing expectations. extracting part of a dev is really hard and messy
22:36 fridolin we have the same pb for bundle of items, your libraries use it already
22:37 cait sometimes the solution is not easy
22:37 cait something htat is developed specifically for one library, might not be the best of doing things
22:37 cait the idea of QA is to get eyes on things... librarian eyes too
22:38 cait I don't have a solution for it
22:38 aleisha ive been maintaining different versions of recalls for 3 different libraries :)
22:38 cait ouch
22:38 aleisha because youre right, solutions differ between libraries
22:38 fridolin same here 3 versions of bundle of items ^^
22:38 tuxayo So you submit an MVP and then it gets scope creeped (and also needs rightfull changes to be able to be generalized) while your customer's version gets scope creeped too in a diverging way. Is that something like that?
22:38 fridolin but now in 20.11 there all use the one proposed in Bugzilla
22:39 aleisha they all have the ability to configure those things that make the way they use recalls different but it would be nice if upstream could be the base we branch off from
22:40 aleisha i think the issue is partly scope creep, partly the community being busy with other priorities
22:41 michal joined #koha
22:42 cait we have alot of projects going on
22:42 fridolin it is great to see the product is alive
22:42 cait we tried to get groups together for certain projects to put more focus on things, but it didn't quit ework out yet
22:43 cait yes :) just a lot of building sites it sometimes feels like!
22:43 tuxayo These kind of developments seem inherently deemed to be a mess to manage but we can certainly mitigate the thing.
22:43 tuxayo - resist scope creep to ask only for necessary changes for inclusion
22:43 tuxayo - bring the development as a topic in meetings and QA team discussion to focus on it (it seems to have helped)
22:43 tuxayo - anything else to try to do in the future?
22:44 aleisha i would add to that, when bringing different expectations, make suggestions for the developer
22:44 tuxayo I don't get it
22:44 cait same
22:44 cait blame the time
22:45 cait can you rephrase a little maybe?
22:45 aleisha sure!
22:46 rangi[m] i have to duck out for an in real life meeting, nice to see you all!
22:46 tuxayo Nice to have seen you rangi o/
22:46 fridolin _o/
22:46 aleisha i was just meaning that sometimes too much discussion blocks development
22:47 cait I guess it's always some way of finding the middle ground?
22:47 tuxayo So we could ask to focus discussions on concrete actions for the dev to reach an acceptable MVP?
22:48 cait so not something we can solve easily, just something to continously work on
22:48 aleisha yes i think that's it tuxayo
22:48 cait yeah, that makes sense
22:49 cait I have to duck out too - have a great day nz and good night!
22:49 tuxayo And note somewhere all the potential follow ups idea so that they don't get lost and it easier to move on knowing they are somewhere?
22:50 aleisha good idea tuxayo
22:50 aleisha night cait
22:50 tuxayo see ya cait
22:50 tuxayo any other guideline that could help?
22:50 aleisha thats it frome me
22:52 tuxayo #action tuxayo send ideas to have an easier time with big changes to koha-devel to get more of them and document them
22:53 tuxayo So we can build on experience
22:53 tuxayo Any other general discussion?
22:53 nugged oh... Nighty night )))
22:53 tuxayo hi nugged :)
22:54 nugged o/ tuxayo
22:54 tuxayo Moving on to next topic
22:54 tuxayo #topic Review of coding guidelines
22:54 Topic for #koha is now Review of coding guidelines (Meeting topic: Development IRC meeting 6 April 2022)
22:54 tuxayo «Terminology: use restriction, not debar/debarment, see Bug 5268 »
22:54 huginn Bug https://bugs.koha-community.or[…]w_bug.cgi?id=5268 minor, PATCH-Sent (DO NOT USE), ---, nengard, CLOSED FIXED, Language Issue: Debarred
22:55 tuxayo Is debarment still used in the UI?
22:56 tuxayo It doesn't seem to be in the strings
22:57 fridolin indeed
22:57 tuxayo Looks like in the past is was made and unofficial terminology change.
22:57 tuxayo *an unofficial
22:59 tuxayo Any objection on setting that in stone?
22:59 aleisha nope
22:59 tuxayo Should I also ask in koha-devel to be sure?
23:00 aleisha i don't think it's needed but up to you!
23:02 tuxayo #action tuxayo add to terminology "use restriction, not debar/debarment" and notify koha-devel in case that wasn't a good idea.
23:02 tuxayo #topic Set time of next meeting
23:02 Topic for #koha is now Set time of next meeting (Meeting topic: Development IRC meeting 6 April 2022)
23:03 fridolin at 15:00 UTC as usuall
23:03 fridolin ok ?
23:03 aleisha today's time was great for us
23:03 tuxayo Or 14:00 to compensate for daylight saving time?
23:03 aleisha 14:00 would be great too
23:04 fridolin ok
23:04 tuxayo fridolin: if you can attend from Tahiti, which one will be less terrible?
23:05 aleisha surely not much is terrible from Tahiti :)
23:05 fridolin equal, but dont worry
23:05 fridolin ^^
23:05 tuxayo aleisha: it's 14 UTC to alternate and aim for work hours for europe and the americas. So for NZ 14UTC should be in the middle of the night ^^"
23:06 nugged it's 2am here in Helsinki v;)
23:07 nugged you just summoned me by nick from my WC night trip ;))))
23:07 aleisha ohhh kidding tuxayo do whatever is usual
23:07 tuxayo LOL
23:07 tuxayo nugged: I though it was the same time as france, I need to add Finland to my command with zdump to display a lot of timezones ^^
23:08 tuxayo I double check, ok for 14 UTC
23:08 tuxayo And 20 april
23:08 fridolin just before release, great
23:09 nugged ... now I meat 2am ;)
23:09 tuxayo The release is in may right?
23:09 fridolin i mean stable releases
23:09 nugged but fir France we are just 1 hour ahead
23:09 nugged *for
23:09 tuxayo ok fridolin
23:09 wahanui fridolin is RM for 22.05
23:09 tuxayo LOL
23:10 tuxayo #info Next meeting: 20 April 2022, 14 UTC
23:10 tuxayo #endmeeting
23:10 Topic for #koha is now Welcome to #koha this channel is for discussion of the Koha project and software
23:10 huginn Meeting ended Wed Apr  6 23:10:27 2022 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)
23:10 huginn Minutes:        https://meetings.koha-communit[…]-04-06-22.01.html
23:10 huginn Minutes (text): https://meetings.koha-communit[…]2-04-06-22.01.txt
23:10 huginn Log:            https://meetings.koha-communit[…]06-22.01.log.html
23:10 fridolin have a good day/night
23:10 tuxayo thanks all for attending.
23:11 aleisha thanks tuxayo
23:12 tuxayo Good to have people from NZ. So it confirms it's useful to have meeting in NZ's workhours.
23:12 nugged 💪🤗👍
23:13 aleisha glad we could finally make it to a meeting!
23:13 tuxayo ^^
23:16 tuxayo Sorry that it's been a long time we didn't try again Oceania compatible hours
23:20 nugged once I'll come especially, not summoned by too to Oceania hours ;).
23:20 nugged g'night ;)
23:26 tuxayo good night :)
23:42 dcook_ Oh some awake people...

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