IRC log for #koha, 2014-07-02

All times shown according to UTC.

Time S Nick Message
00:00 dcook Ahh, nevermind. I think I gotcha.
00:00 dcook Rather than using the syspref as a switch, yeah?
00:01 eythian yeah.
00:01 eythian Though, that syspref isn't currently a very good switch
00:01 eythian I need to do something about that.
00:02 eythian I'm sorta faking it at the moment, but that's not ideal.
00:02 dcook Faking it?
00:02 eythian have a look near the top of
00:03 eythian I need to get it to the point where you don't even know what search engine you're using.
00:05 dcook (Huh, I didn't know for/when was a thing)
00:06 eythian yeah, pretend it's not
00:07 dcook Hmm, so do you mean about loading modules that you may or may not need?
00:07 eythian yeah
00:07 eythian so, you should just ask for Koha::SearchEngine::QueryBuilder and get the right thing
00:07 eythian there is stuff for that there now, but it's incomplete.
00:08 dcook Mmm, agreed
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00:11 dcook Hmm, I'm beginning to think CCL2RPN doesn't actually understand "*" or "?"
00:11 dcook[…]ee_8c_source.html
00:11 dcook Yay open source...
00:12 dcook And with reason...
00:12 dcook @truncation in looks like it's been totally made up as a thing
00:12 huginn dcook: downloading the Perl source
00:12 dcook Sorry, little rant there
00:12 dcook eythian: Yeah, Koha::SearchEngine::QueryBuilder would be great
00:13 * dcook did notice that removing * and ? didn't seem to have an effect when using rtrn anyway...
00:14 dcook I suppose it's still possible @truncation is a thing in a different file..
00:17 dcook Damn google and not being able to search special characters
00:20 * dcook should re-read the CCL syntax...
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00:21 dcook Ah, Indexdata's website says truncation is a CCL directive...
00:23 papa joined #koha
00:23 dcook Ah ha
00:23 dcook Wait..nvm..
00:31 * dcook has also been thinking about writing up Zebra search tips for Koha
00:31 dcook Something that is user accessible
00:31 dcook Or at least staff accessible
00:32 * dcook doesn't think the manual is necessarily 100% correct
00:32 dcook And I doubt many people use it when they're trying to remember how to do a search in Koha
00:50 dcook Hmm, tests say that adding "?" or "*" to a query doesn't do a damn thing when using Zebra
00:50 dcook Hmm, unless..
00:50 wahanui hmmm... unless is probably meant to give code that reads more like natural language? but i'm not a fan either
00:50 dcook Yep, not a damn thing I can see
00:51 dcook Have to have "rtrn"...
00:51 dcook wrdl,rtrn="profession?" will return the same as wrdl,rtrn="profession"
00:52 dcook I think truncation characters might only factor in when using special truncation attribute combos...
00:55 dcook Hmm maybe not enough testing to be sure though..
00:58 * wizzyrea is really grateful for her flat white right now
00:58 wizzyrea because it's cold as outside
00:58 eythian dcook: that's all very mysterious.
01:00 dcook eythian: Certainly badly documented
01:06 dcook In fact, I think the documentation might be plain wrong
01:06 dcook Mmm then again..
01:10 dcook[…]nd_8c_source.html
01:10 dcook suggests that there can be truncation aliases..
01:10 dcook Just like it says here:
01:14 dcook Ahhh
01:14 dcook There's a bug
01:14 dcook --- 4.2.21 2011/11/23
01:14 dcook Fix cql_sortby_to_sortkeys. Completely broken before.
01:14 dcook Make CCL's @truncation work again.
01:14 dcook I'm on 4.2.13...
01:15 dcook IE and Zebra
01:15 dcook Why do I do such things...:p
01:16 eythian wahanui: dcook is the designated masochist
01:16 wahanui ...but dcook is missing part of that original link due to a smiley face that comes up in dcook's IRC client|currently out of line....
01:16 eythian wahanui: dcook is also the designated masochist
01:16 wahanui okay, eythian.
01:19 dcook It looks like Wheezy's packaged version is 4.2.30, so people using packages should be OK
01:19 dcook Not in Squeeze though
01:20 dcook As Squeeze uses 4.0.11-1
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01:51 dcook Apparently you can't use truncation wildcards within double quotes
01:51 dcook Well, you can, but they apparently are treated as regular text and not wildcards...
01:52 eythian I would expect that
01:52 dcook yaz-client plus "querytype ccl2rpn" and "set_cclfile /koha/etc/zebradb/" = no Koha crap
01:53 dcook eythian: Naturally
01:53 dcook You can use them as truncation wildcards within parentheses though
01:53 eythian[…]tion-history?bffb
01:53 eythian I would also expect that.
01:56 dcook hehe
01:57 eythian <-- the weather took a turn around lunch time
02:01 dcook Oh my..
02:08 rangi next time someone asks me about NCIP
02:08 rangi they'll get this
02:08 rangi
02:09 dcook 'find rltrn="?fess?"' = expected result
02:10 dcook 'find rltrn=?fess?' = CCL ERROR: Both left - and right truncation not supported
02:10 dcook O_O
02:14 eythian it's probably a lot more expensive to do that
02:19 dcook Oh totally
02:19 dcook It takes ages
02:24 dcook Actually...not so much
02:24 dcook It did the first time I tried in Koha but that might've been unrelated
02:29 dcook Hmm, I think I'm getting an idea...
02:30 wizzyrea look out.
02:30 dcook :p
02:30 dcook Yeah, maybe
02:30 dcook It's just that buildQuery works really stupidly
02:30 dcook Ahh, wait, idea no good...damn
02:31 dcook Well...for a basic search it might work..
02:31 dcook Except stemming
02:31 dcook Mmm, maybe even stemming..
02:33 eythian dcook: just move to elasticsearch
02:35 wizzyrea be eythian
02:35 wahanui Sod it all, let's head to the pub!
02:35 wizzyrea be eythian is also <reply> just move to elasticsearch
02:35 wahanui okay, wizzyrea.
02:41 wizzyrea @wunder nzwn
02:41 huginn wizzyrea: The current temperature in Wellington, New Zealand is 9.0°C (2:30 PM NZST on July 02, 2014). Conditions: Overcast. Humidity: 71%. Dew Point: 4.0°C. Pressure: 29.18 in 988 hPa (Steady).
02:41 wizzyrea feels colder than that.
02:41 eythian you're inside.
02:41 wizzyrea when I was outside, it felt colder than that.
02:41 wizzyrea :P
02:42 rangi metservice says it feels like 3
02:42 rangi and is 6.7
02:45 wizzyrea that seems closer to what I experienced
02:46 dcook eythian: I suspect ElasticSearch will have problems with the query building as well
02:46 dcook But we'll see :)
02:46 eythian dcook: oh yeah?
02:47 eythian it's more or less a shim to allow compatibility with the existing code.
02:48 dcook Yeah, and the existing code sucks :p
02:48 dcook I wonder a bit about stemming and weight fields..
02:48 dcook Autotruncation
02:49 dcook As that will require parsing the query, modifying it, then stitching it back together again
02:49 eythian yeah, I havne't really implemented those yet.
02:49 dcook Don't know if weight fields is even possible with ES although I don't really mind that
02:49 * dcook doesn't care for weight fields all that much
02:50 eythian I'm pretty sure it is possible.
02:50 eythian there's definitely some facility for it.
02:50 dcook Cool :)
02:55 dcook Hmm, looks like .mailmap didn't merge my usernames together on GitStats :/
03:15 dcook Always nice when you need to change something on Gitolite but haven't used it in ages :p
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04:06 eythian If I have an 'edition' field, where would I put that in MARC?
04:07 eythian 250$a
04:08 dcook Yep
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05:20 * cait waves
05:37 * dcook waves to cait
05:51 cait hi dcook :)
05:52 cait looks like i missed this morning's search discussion? :)
05:52 * dcook shrugs
05:52 dcook I guess so
05:52 cait how is wednesday?
05:54 dcook Mmm, experimental
05:56 cait how can a day be experimental?
05:56 dcook I've been trying a lot of things with CCL and QueryParser
05:58 cait hm wonder how mine will turn out then :)
05:58 dcook Hopefully better than mine :p
05:59 dcook Well, I guess I've learned a lot...
06:07 cait shoudl i send a reminder about today's (for you tomorrow's) dev meeting?
06:08 dcook I thought that was already done?
06:08 dcook Or did I get my days screwed up?
06:09 cait the meeting?
06:09 wahanui hmmm... the meeting is on wednesday?
06:09 cait july 2nd
06:09 cait or the reminder?
06:10 cait[…]ting,_2_July_2014
06:10 dcook It is july 2nd today for me O_o
06:10 dcook Or is it supposed to be my july 3rd?
06:15 dcook Oh right... I guess it would be 8am for me tomorrow
06:15 dcook I might be there on my phone...
06:15 * dcook doesn't start work until 9, but might try to get in early..
06:16 cait i sent something
06:32 cait hm gah
06:32 cait found a bug i think
06:32 dcook Surprise! :D
06:33 cait hm yeah
06:33 cait the partial receive status is not properly given on updating an older database
06:33 cait i know i tested this and it worked at some point
06:33 cait bit frustrating
06:38 dcook :(
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06:40 reiveune hello
06:40 cait hi reiveune
06:41 cait dcook: it could be worse
06:41 cait :)
06:41 reiveune hi cait dcook
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06:59 cait Joubu: rollover is done :)
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07:05 gaetan_B hello
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07:15 dcook Hmm, I might actually have a bit of a plan for buildQuery now...
07:15 dcook Might just need to keep batting away at it until I find the right solution...
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07:16 dcook Need to run!
07:16 dcook au revoir, tous
07:22 Joubu hello
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07:35 cait mornign #koha
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07:45 cait good morning biblibre :)
07:48 cait Joubu: around?
07:48 Joubu cait: yep
07:49 cait could you maybe apply the new 2 patches from kyle to the sandbox?
07:49 cait the database still seems to have the test configuration from yesterday
07:49 cait it was number 7
07:51 Joubu cait: yep
07:51 Joubu cait: in 10min
07:51 cait cool
07:51 cait thx!
07:52 alex_a joined #koha
08:07 cait Joubu: ping me when it's done?
08:18 Joubu cait: done ;)
08:20 cait Joubu++
08:24 cait Joubu: my tests look good, letting the library know
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09:13 cait Joubu: library tested ok :) going to sign off the 2 patches in the name of the librarian
09:33 grharry joined #koha
10:29 khall cait++
10:33 cait library++ :)
10:33 cait i only helped
10:33 cait lunch bbl!
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11:46 Racoo Please help,  when I  create new catalogue entries, I often find I get a 'double' entry, so that I end up with a biblio record with holdings, and one without. I then have to go back and delete the extra entry, otherwise it shows up on catalogue searches as having 'no items' which is confusing for people using the catalogue. When I add an item it duplicates too. When the network slows this problem happens. How can I stop duplication
11:46 cait do you double click by chance?
11:46 cait i think it might happen because of your network issues
11:47 cait not sure that can be sovled within koha
11:48 Racoo no dont click double
11:48 Racoo when the system is busy it creates dublications
11:48 Racoo both in biblios and holdings
11:49 Racoo it may be beause of zebra
11:49 Racoo indexing
11:49 wahanui hmmm... indexing is done by Zebra.
11:49 Racoo how can we solve it??
11:50 Racoo it is a big problem
11:54 Racoo when the network is busy, it gives "Internal server error" but the biblio or the holding record is created, but sometimes 1 record sometimes 2 or more than 2 duplications are created. than we have to delete all the duplications, it is a huge lost time :(
11:57 csharp Racoo: sounds like you need a professional to come evaluate your network setup... there are ways to throttle bandwidth via free/open source programs like pfsense
11:58 csharp (but that's beyond the scope of #koha ;-))
11:59 Racoo cant it be solved programaticaly
11:59 Racoo ?
12:00 csharp Racoo: a web-based program like koha needs a healthy network connection - no way around that
12:01 cait do you hit refresh?
12:02 cait it could be it sends the request again - and then that might cause the duplicate
12:02 cait zebra is unlikely, if the duplicate only existed in the index, you couldn#t delete it
12:02 csharp we see similar behavior in Evergreen when the network is congested and/or insufficient
12:04 Racoo When we hit the refresh button or press f5 it creates duplications, but without refreshing the page by hitting refresh button or press f5 unfortunately it again creates duplications.
12:05 cait Racoo: you mean that if you don't refresh or use the browser back button, there are still duplicates being created?
12:06 Racoo yes
12:06 Racoo this duplications especialy occur when the network is slow.
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12:06 cait i am sorry, i think csharp is right then
12:06 cait there is not much you can do without fixing the network
12:07 francharb good morning!
12:07 cait hi francharb :)
12:07 francharb o/ cait
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12:18 tcohen @wunder cordoba, argentina
12:18 huginn tcohen: The current temperature in Cordoba, Argentina is 8.0°C (9:00 AM ART on July 02, 2014). Conditions: Partly Cloudy. Humidity: 93%. Dew Point: 7.0°C. Windchill: 6.0°C. Pressure: 29.86 in 1011 hPa (Steady).
12:18 tcohen buen día #koha
12:19 oleonard Hi everyone
12:31 tcohen_ joined #koha
12:32 oleonard MARC preview not working in the latest Manage staged MARC records interface
12:43 kmlussier joined #koha
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12:50 bgkriegel joined #koha
12:53 bgkriegel Hi
12:59 tcohen hi bgkriegel
13:02 bgkriegel Hi To+
13:07 cait hi bgkriegel and tcohen :)
13:07 bgkriegel hi cait :)
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13:38 Joubu cait: what are the shortcuts for tab navigation?
13:38 cait Joubu: for testing - click on the checkouts tab (to get the focus), then use arrow right keys
13:38 Joubu ok, right/left
13:38 Joubu yep, thanks
13:38 cait according to thelibrarian actually tab shoudl work and woudl work better, but this seems the way it works now
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14:20 tcohen oleonard: have you used Photobooth.js?
14:21 oleonard No
14:21 oleonard Interesting.
14:21 wahanui interesting is sometimes good and sometimes bad
14:22 tcohen I was thining of adding that to the patron details page
14:22 tcohen upload/take picture
14:23 tcohen it could be combined with
14:23 tcohen for a flash fallback if the browser doesn't provide the API
14:24 oleonard tcohen: On the staff side or OPAC?
14:24 tcohen I was thinking on both
14:25 oleonard If a library wanted accurate photos of their patrons I would think they would not want to trust photos received through the OPAC, but I guess that's a choice they could make.
14:26 oleonard If a system like that were added to the OPAC it ought to be combined with the pending patron modifications system
14:28 tcohen yes
14:28 tcohen A library asked me to implement that for the staff interface
14:28 tcohen and i thought of a syspref-driven feature for the OPAC too
14:29 oleonard There's even an existing bug for that: Bug 6815
14:29 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=6815 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, kohapatch, ASSIGNED , Capture member photo via webcam
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14:34 tcohen thanks oleonard for the pointer
14:50 druthb @seen talljoy
14:50 huginn druthb: talljoy was last seen in #koha 2 weeks, 4 days, 22 hours, 11 minutes, and 1 second ago: <talljoy> no problem!
14:50 druthb !
14:50 druthb @seen meliss
14:50 huginn druthb: meliss was last seen in #koha 7 weeks, 6 days, 23 hours, 44 minutes, and 18 seconds ago: <meliss> #info Melissa Lefebvre, ByWater Solutions
14:50 druthb whoa.
14:51 cait hm weird
14:54 cait meeting in 5!
14:58 newbie joined #koha
14:59 tcohen meeting in 1!
14:59 cait ok peeps
14:59 cait hehe exactly!
14:59 cait get ready, get coffee... but be fast!
15:00 cait ...
15:00 cait #startmeeting Koha IRC Developer Meeting, July 2nd, part 1
15:00 huginn Meeting started Wed Jul  2 15:00:47 2014 UTC.  The chair is cait. Information about MeetBot at
15:00 huginn Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.
15:00 Topic for #koha is now  (Meeting topic: Koha IRC Developer Meeting, July 2nd, part 1)
15:00 huginn The meeting name has been set to 'koha_irc_developer_meeting__july_2nd__part_1'
15:00 cait #topic Introductions
15:00 wahanui #info wahanui, a bot that has become sentient
15:00 Topic for #koha is now Introductions (Meeting topic: Koha IRC Developer Meeting, July 2nd, part 1)
15:01 cait please introduce yourself with #info
15:01 cait #info Katrin Fischer, BSZ, Germany, QAM
15:01 oleonard #info Owen Leonard, Athens County Public Libraries
15:01 Joubu #info Jonathan Druart, BibLibre
15:01 yohann1 #info Yohann Dufour, BibLibre
15:01 gmcharlt #info Galen Charlton, Equinox
15:01 tcohen #info Tomas Cohen Arazi, Universidad Nacional de Córdoba
15:01 jwagner #info Jane Wagner, LibLime/PTFS
15:01 oleonard Welcome back gmcharlt
15:01 bgkriegel #info Bernardo Gonzalez Kriegel, Córdoba Argentina
15:01 tcohen wb gmcharlt
15:01 tgoat joined #koha
15:01 gmcharlt thx
15:02 cait today's agenda
15:02 wahanui today's agenda is probably on the wiki
15:02 cait #link[…]ting,_2_July_2014
15:02 cait 3... 2....
15:02 cait 1... :)
15:02 cait #topic RM 3.18 comments
15:02 Topic for #koha is now RM 3.18 comments (Meeting topic: Koha IRC Developer Meeting, July 2nd, part 1)
15:02 cait handing over to tcohen
15:03 tcohen hi
15:03 tcohen some brief comments
15:03 tcohen Jenkins tasks for running unit tests have been changed/updated
15:04 tcohen they now test all maintained branches (/plus master) on ubuntu 12.4, 14.04 and debian 6 & 7
15:04 tcohen the launching scripts might need to be improved
15:04 tcohen and feedback will be welcome
15:04 cait #info Jenkins tasks have been changed/updated
15:04 ztajoli joined #koha
15:05 JesseM #info Jesse Maseto, ByWater
15:05 tcohen There are still pending issues with Perl 5.18
15:05 tcohen that jenkins shows
15:05 Joubu Where can we found launching scripts?
15:05 tcohen (on master)
15:05 talljoy joined #koha
15:05 tcohen Joubu: those scripts are in the task configuration form in jenkins
15:05 ztajoli #info Zeno Tajoli, CINECA
15:05 tcohen its a shell script, that is written inside the form
15:06 tcohen any ideas, please let me know
15:06 tcohen ok, next
15:06 barton #info barton, bywater
15:07 tcohen The "Koha Community" Trello organization is being used for openly establishing priorities and work that needs to be done
15:07 tcohen anyone that wants to take a look, please let me know
15:07 newbie #info Christopher - about to implement koha
15:07 tcohen we've set a board for having a list of pending dev meetings topics
15:07 cait welcome newbie
15:08 tcohen and I'm about to set a new one, for dcook to use in his effort to have better Zebra code
15:08 khall #info Kyle M Hall, ByWater Solutions
15:08 gmcharlt #info Koha Community org on Trello can be found at
15:09 tcohen heh, was about to post the same
15:09 cait #info Let tcohen know if you want to take a look at the Trello board for Koha Release Management
15:09 cait ah, now we overlapped gmcharlt :)
15:09 cait thx!
15:09 tcohen the QAM also set a QA board
15:09 tcohen ok
15:09 cait hm kind of - i am still testing trello mostly right now :)
15:10 cait so nothing official currently
15:10 tcohen don't be shy
15:10 tcohen :-P
15:10 cait :)
15:10 tcohen moving on, i wanted to mention
15:10 cait next topic?
15:10 tcohen that i'm about to push bug 9811
15:10 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=9811 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, jonathan.druart, Passed QA , Patrons search improvements
15:10 tcohen and now that bug 11703 is passed-qa, i'm considering it for pushing it soon
15:10 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=11703 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, kyle, Signed Off , Convert checkouts table to ajax datatable
15:11 tcohen any comments or concerns please let me know
15:11 cait khall++ for fixing some issues with IE and accessiblity f
15:11 tcohen ok next
15:11 cait #topic Additions to coding guidelines
15:11 Topic for #koha is now Additions to coding guidelines (Meeting topic: Koha IRC Developer Meeting, July 2nd, part 1)
15:12 cait #link http://lists.koha-community.or[…]April/040456.html
15:12 cait there has been a mailing list discussion a while ago about deprecating the non-XSLT views
15:12 tcohen is there a bug for removing that?
15:12 cait not yet
15:13 fridolin2 joined #koha
15:13 fridolin2 hie all
15:13 cait but the question has come up on a bug, if a new feature needs to be added to non-XSLT as well
15:13 oleonard gmcharlt: Any response to you from users on this issue?
15:13 cait i think maybe a first step could be to not maintain them officially
15:13 gmcharlt oleonard: none
15:14 cait hm ok
15:14 ztajoli Stefano Bargione tries to finda and XSLT to display ISBD (MARC21 format)
15:14 cait i think i spotted a possible problem:
15:15 cait HighlightOwnItemsOnOPAC HighlightOwnItemsOnOPACWhich says it's non-xslt only
15:15 ztajoli sorry Stefano Bargioni
15:15 gmcharlt we can deal with that as bugs
15:15 gmcharlt one to deprecate, and another with those two sysprefs as a blocker to the first
15:15 cait gmcharlt: with which?
15:15 cait not sure if there are more, just did a quick search in the pref editor
15:15 gmcharlt yeah, there could be otehrs
15:15 cait a lot of features seem to be xslt only
15:16 cait what about a deprecation warning? no longer maintain them, add new features only to XSLT?
15:16 gmcharlt +1
15:17 tcohen +1
15:17 ztajoli +1
15:17 cait gmcharlt: could you maybe write smething for the coding guidelines about that?
15:17 tcohen btw, do we have a test for not-used sysprefs?
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15:17 cait tcohen: not that i am aware of
15:17 wahanui i already had it that way, cait.
15:18 cait #idea add a deprecation warning - non-XSLT officially no longer maintained, new features will only be added to XSLT
15:18 tcohen ./t/db_dependent/check_sysprefs.t
15:18 khall +1
15:18 oleonard And non-XSLT is officially gone when?
15:18 tcohen 4.0?
15:18 wahanui 4.0 is pbly at least a year from now, if not more, so PostgreSQL support in it seem reasonable and doable.
15:19 cait #action identify XSLT-only features and file bugs for those
15:19 khall question: what kind of performance difference do we see between the two?
15:19 gmcharlt wahanui: forget 4.0
15:19 wahanui gmcharlt: I forgot 4.0
15:19 khall considering we only process the visible results, the difference is probably not too great
15:19 cait can i add an agreed on the idea?
15:19 gmcharlt khall: I think somebody tested recently
15:19 gmcharlt they're similar
15:19 cait without calling another vote?
15:19 khall agreed
15:19 tcohen agreed
15:20 ztajoli +1
15:20 gmcharlt cait: and others -
15:20 gmcharlt thoughts on the suggested wording?
15:20 cait #agreed add a deprecation warning to coding guidelines
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15:20 tcohen its fine gmcharlt
15:21 cait hm missing a don't I think?
15:21 cait in the first sentence of the second paragraph
15:21 gmcharlt cait: "need not"
15:21 cait oh
15:21 cait sorry :)
15:21 gmcharlt but I can change it to "don't need to be" if that's cleerer
15:22 tcohen its ok
15:22 cait let's make this quick as we have more topics - anyone wnats to veto? :)
15:23 cait #info suggested coding guideline
15:23 cait moving on to bugs?
15:23 tcohen +1
15:23 barton +1
15:23 cait and +1 for the wording from me :)
15:23 cait #topic Bugs
15:23 Topic for #koha is now Bugs (Meeting topic: Koha IRC Developer Meeting, July 2nd, part 1)
15:24 cait removal of C4/
15:24 cait bug 12456
15:24 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=12456 normal, P5 - low, ---, yohann.dufour, Passed QA , The file C4/ can be removed
15:24 tcohen start a vote?
15:24 cait as far as I understand it, it's quite an old part of the code, for features no longer present
15:24 cait sadly :)
15:24 gmcharlt from my POV, it can go
15:25 cait gmcharlt: how do i start the vote?
15:25 gmcharlt git keeps the history, in case somebody wants a reference to reimplement deletion-undo
15:25 cait #vote Remove of C4/Maintenance, yes = remove
15:25 gmcharlt cait:  #startvote -- although to be frank, I'm not sure that this is worth calling a vote for
15:25 tcohen yes
15:25 khall yes
15:26 gmcharlt but anyway, +1 to removing it
15:26 yohann1 yes
15:26 gaetan_B bye!
15:26 oleonard yes
15:26 ztajoli +1
15:26 cait gmcharlt: true, just vote quickly and let's move on
15:26 cait yes
15:26 cait ok
15:26 bgkriegel yes
15:26 reiveune bye
15:26 reiveune left #koha
15:26 cait #agreed C4/Maintanance will be removed (bug 12456)
15:26 cait next one is similar
15:26 cait Removal of misc/cronjobs/rss/ uses HTP - Bug 9000
15:26 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=9000 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, gmcharlt, Passed QA , misc/cronjobs/rss/ uses HTP
15:27 tcohen I didn't get any feedback on
15:27 tcohen besides mtompset's question
15:27 cait unlike is still somewhat functional when you have HTP installed
15:27 gmcharlt has it been asked on the general mailing list whether anybody is using it?
15:27 tcohen it seems that it could serve for having heavy-loading rss precalculated
15:27 cait but the rss xml files generated are not translated and thre are probably other problems as well
15:28 tcohen its been asked on the dev list
15:28 cait hm i think tcohen send something
15:28 gmcharlt I suggest that we ask again - i can tweet - and if we don't hear back in a couple weeks, assume nobody's using it and remove it
15:28 tcohen should we hold it back, and ask again?
15:28 tcohen that
15:29 cait ok
15:29 cait who asks?
15:29 tcohen i will
15:29 ashimema I asked the question to my collegues..
15:29 tcohen to the public list this time
15:29 * oleonard finds it hard to believe anyone is using it
15:29 paul_p joined #koha
15:29 cait #action tcohen will ask on the mailing list if someone still uses misc/cronjobs/rss/ (bug 9000)
15:29 ashimema many have still been using it recent;y.. but they're happy to switch to the search based rss if you can get the same functionailty out of it..
15:29 * ashimema has never played with it personally.
15:30 ashimema "we'll cope" was their general response.
15:30 cait next ist an update on the UTF-8 clean up
15:30 ashimema sorry for being late.. just catching up now
15:30 tcohen great ashimema
15:31 gmcharlt so, re UTF-8
15:31 tcohen Joubu worked hard on that
15:31 cait Joubu++ :)
15:31 ztajoli ++
15:31 gmcharlt by tomorrow I'll be calling a date in July for a GBSD focused on it
15:31 ashimema Joubu++
15:31 gmcharlt and completing my review some time over the weekend
15:31 tcohen Joubu++
15:31 fridolin2 left #koha
15:31 cait also gmcharlt++ for the review
15:32 cait #action gmcharlt to call a date in July for a GBSD focused on UTF-8 clean-up (bug 11944)
15:32 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=11944 major, P5 - low, ---, jonathan.druart, Needs Signoff , Cleanup Koha UTF-8
15:32 tcohen i'd like to say
15:32 cait #info gmcharlt is also currently reviewing the feature and remaining issues
15:32 tcohen that i'd like to push the important bits sooner than later
15:33 Joubu gmcharlt: did you manage to write some tests?
15:33 tcohen those that set the correct way to cope with data encoding/decoding
15:33 gmcharlt Joubu: still working on it; not much chance to code during the ALA conference
15:33 tcohen (e.g. CGI using -utf8)
15:33 Joubu k
15:34 cait we have a normal meeting next week i think
15:34 cait we can then talk again about the gbsd maybe?
15:34 tcohen hmm, this not anormal
15:34 gmcharlt :)
15:34 gmcharlt cait: sure
15:35 tcohen cait: agreed
15:35 ztajoli Ok, for CINECA july is a good month for 11944
15:35 cait #action cait to put UTF-8 GBSD on next weeks meeting agenda
15:35 cait next is removal of prog/CCSR themes
15:35 cait decision has been made, now we need to get it done :)
15:36 tcohen has anyone appointed to start sending patches on this?
15:36 tcohen cait: the topic
15:36 cait tcohen: we are still in bugs
15:36 tcohen :)
15:37 tcohen ok, volunteers? oleonard?
15:37 cait #info Removal of prog/CCSR themes (bug 11346) - looking for volunteers
15:37 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=11346 normal, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, NEW , Deprecate the PROG and CCSR themes
15:37 Joubu I am volunteer to SO on it :)
15:37 tcohen ok, I can delete that stuff
15:37 tcohen will be sending patches soon
15:37 oleonard Sorry, I was afk
15:38 tcohen if anyone wants to help, let me know
15:38 oleonard I have started submitting patches already, will continue.
15:38 tcohen oh, great!
15:38 cait :)
15:38 bgkriegel there are five patches from oleonard removing related sysprefs
15:38 cait oleonard++
15:38 tcohen oleonard++
15:38 gmcharlt oleonard++
15:38 cait #action oleonard is going to send patches for removing the deprecated prog/CCSR themes
15:38 ashimema oleonard++
15:39 oleonard I'm not sure how we should handle the upgrade process for users of prog
15:39 cait i think we might have to put in a database update
15:39 cait switching the pref
15:39 tcohen moving them to bootstrap
15:39 cait that will keep their opacs functional
15:40 gmcharlt yes
15:40 cait and also a big red note in the release notes?
15:40 khall why not remove the pref altogether?
15:40 cait khall: because you can create templates
15:40 tcohen khall: we agreed people might have their own templates
15:41 khall which is generally a terrible idea
15:41 cait khall: not necessarily
15:41 gmcharlt khall: who's to say that if the library is comfortable doing it?
15:41 oleonard We let people do all sorts of things which are terrible ideas :)
15:41 gmcharlt cait:  see also bug 12233
15:41 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=12233 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, tomascohen, REOPENED , remove prog and CCSR OPAC themes
15:41 cait khall: and look at ccsr - you can just have your own template file for one thing and fall back to standard theme for the rest
15:41 khall cait: yeah, I just thought of that.
15:42 cait i haven't used it yet... but it seems like something that might be useful for some
15:42 cait :)
15:42 * khall has dealt with custom templates and didn't enjoy the experience
15:42 cait ok, anything more?
15:43 cait next is the removal of C4/SQLHelper
15:43 cait yohann1 has send some patches to achieve that
15:43 cait yohann++
15:43 ashimema yohann++
15:44 Joubu Yes, the patches are interesting, but he needs some feedbacks to continue
15:44 Joubu see the mail on the list
15:44 cait #info some patches for removing SQLHelper from the code base are ready for testing/feedback, see http://lists.koha-community.or[…]-June/040594.html
15:44 Joubu There are at leats 4 others modules to update
15:44 ashimema I was about to say that Joubu.. do any dbic pros want to comment on the bug please.. i'm no pro so not in a position to ;)
15:44 cait also yohann++ for improving our test coverage :)
15:45 gmcharlt yohann++
15:45 khall yohann++ indeed
15:46 cait can someone give me something for an #action? :)
15:46 khall I'm am completely for increased use of dbic
15:46 ashimema me too ;)
15:47 cait hehe those are  nice but not #actions
15:47 ashimema though using it in the koha context is still baffling me a tad.
15:47 cait i guess that's the problem here
15:47 ashimema cait, someone needs to step up and give yohann some feedback..
15:47 khall I will
15:47 ashimema yeay.. action on khall ;)
15:47 cait yay
15:47 ashimema nice one khall++
15:47 cait #action khall to give yohann feedback on his patches
15:47 Joubu khall: thanks
15:48 yohann1 khall: thanks you :)
15:48 khall np!
15:48 cait ok
15:48 cait runing a bit low on time... next one :)
15:48 tcohen yohann1++
15:48 cait Better ways to manage MARC Frameworks - Bug 12477
15:48 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=12477 major, P5 - low, ---, gmcharlt, NEW , We need better ways to manage MARC Frameworks
15:48 tcohen bgkriegel?
15:48 wahanui bgkriegel is on a signoff spree
15:48 cait bgkriegel: do you want to take over?
15:48 yohann1 left #koha
15:49 bgkriegel what do you think on using xml for our data?
15:49 bgkriegel it will be easier to translate
15:49 * khall notices yohann uses HashRefInflator, excellent!
15:50 bgkriegel i have some code for frameworks, and most sql files
15:50 tcohen the idea is to have the sample data (for example) in XML format for easier translation tasks
15:50 cait bgkriegel++ his work on making the frameworks translatable has been a great help in updating the German frameworks
15:50 bgkriegel but dcook raised some questions on that bug, i think someone could comment
15:50 cait it was sooo easy compared to the horror of translating them the first time
15:51 gmcharlt one approach might be to change the structure so that there's a concept of a derived framework
15:52 cait gmcharlt: it hink we already have that now for authorities
15:52 cait well in sql
15:52 cait but it seems to work nicely
15:52 gmcharlt right, but user-facing
15:52 gmcharlt i.e., the standard frameworks wouldn't be changed, but could be upgraded to meet the standard
15:53 gmcharlt if somebody wants a customized one, they'd derive it from one of the standard ones
15:53 gmcharlt and the custom ones wouldn't be touched during ugprades
15:54 bgkriegel no need for actions right now, but some ideas to work with, could be comments on 12477
15:54 tcohen +1 for the idea of having the data in XML for translation purposes
15:54 cait #action all comment on bug 12477 with ideas about improving our MARC framework management
15:54 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=12477 major, P5 - low, ---, gmcharlt, NEW , We need better ways to manage MARC Frameworks
15:55 cait we are running out of time, so i will hurry up a big
15:55 cait a bit
15:55 cait #topic Testig of APIs, CAS...
15:55 Topic for #koha is now Testig of APIs, CAS... (Meeting topic: Koha IRC Developer Meeting, July 2nd, part 1)
15:55 cait api patches often seem to get stuck, because we have only very few testers for them
15:56 cait one reasn is that we don't have an LDAP or CAS to test against
15:56 cait for the CAS patch paul_p has provided a login to a test server, so that should be possible to test now
15:56 cait please, if you can test LDAP, SIP, CAS patches, do so, even if they are signed off already
15:56 ashimema it's not as easy as putting up a test ldap/cas/shibboleth server though unfortunately.
15:57 ashimema allot depends on the varying configurations..
15:57 tcohen Z39.50 also
15:57 cait i think a second sign off could help QA
15:58 cait #action all if you can, test LDAP, SIP and CAS patches or give them a second sign off! :)
15:58 cait ok, that's it from me on the topic
15:58 cait :)
15:59 cait yes, z39.50 - but I think nothing in the qa queue currently - maybe in needs sign off
15:59 cait #topic Big stuff we are working on
15:59 Topic for #koha is now Big stuff we are working on (Meeting topic: Koha IRC Developer Meeting, July 2nd, part 1)
16:00 cait any announcements??
16:00 cait sorry, that shoudl have been only one ?
16:00 Joubu nothing new planned here.
16:01 ashimema nadda here... to much other stuff on the plate
16:01 tcohen I plan to work on TemaTres integration soon
16:01 tcohen will have a videoconference with its creator tomorrow morning
16:01 cait #info tcohen working on TemaTres integration soon
16:01 Joubu Still waiting a signoff on batch moification records patches (bug 11395 and linked)
16:01 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=11395 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, jonathan.druart, Needs Signoff , Batch modifications for records
16:01 tcohen to complete the current RFC
16:02 cait #info Joubu still waiting for a signoff on batch modification records - bug 11395
16:02 cait khall? gmcharlt?
16:02 tcohen TemaTres author is willing to do whatever is needed to help integrating it to Koha
16:02 tcohen :-D
16:02 gmcharlt tcohen: TemaTest is what, briefly?
16:02 gmcharlt cait: yes, but not making promises yet as to when
16:02 tcohen TemaTres is a tool for managing thesaurus and controlled vocabularies
16:03 khall I'll take a look
16:03 tcohen it has a REST API
16:04 tcohen gmcharlt:
16:04 cait #link
16:04 gmcharlt tcohen: neat!
16:04 Joubu (have to go, bye)
16:05 tcohen it implements the SKOS model
16:05 tcohen and there are several ways to integrate it
16:05 tcohen that we will discuss soon :-D
16:05 cait :)
16:05 cait someone going to help me with finding a good time for the next meeting?
16:06 gmcharlt early August?
16:06 oleonard August 6 starts the Koha North America conference
16:06 cait i think tcohen had said something about 3 weeks
16:06 cait maybe 23rd?
16:07 bgkriegel July 23? 30?
16:07 tcohen yes
16:07 ztajoli fro me is better 23rd
16:07 tcohen July 23rd
16:07 cait #topic Set date of next meeting
16:07 Topic for #koha is now Set date of next meeting (Meeting topic: Koha IRC Developer Meeting, July 2nd, part 1)
16:08 gmcharlt +1 23rd July
16:08 oleonard +1 for July 23
16:08 ashimema +1
16:08 bgkriegel +1
16:08 cait #agreed next meeting, pending confirmation from second meeting today, will be 23rd July, 15 + 22 UTC
16:09 cait sorry for being a  bit fast in the end
16:09 tcohen +1
16:09 cait but we are over by 10 minutes! heh :)
16:09 cait #endmeeting
16:09 Topic for #koha is now Koha 3.16.1 is available! Next general meeting is 9 and 10 July 2014 at 22:00 and 15:00 UTC. Welcome to the IRC home of Koha Please use for pastes.
16:09 huginn Meeting ended Wed Jul  2 16:09:25 2014 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)
16:09 huginn Minutes:        http://meetings.koha-community[…]-07-02-15.00.html
16:09 huginn Minutes (text): http://meetings.koha-community[…]4-07-02-15.00.txt
16:09 huginn Log:            http://meetings.koha-community[…]02-15.00.log.html
16:09 cait thx everyone!
16:09 bgkriegel cait++
16:09 ztajoli bye
16:09 gmcharlt cait++
16:10 tcohen cait++
16:10 ztajoli cait ++
16:10 newbie It was great to watch :-)
16:11 newbie goodbye
16:25 kmlussier joined #koha
16:40 cdavis joined #koha
16:41 laurence left #koha
17:16 WNickC joined #koha
17:48 huginn New commit(s) kohagit: Bug 9811: Fix wording branch vs library <[…]9a94e71483950b4a0> / Bug 9811: Cardnumber could be alphanumeric <[…]93953390cc229a0a7> / Bug 9811: Various fixes <[…]f45634671bae0151b
18:00 tcohen #koha: what is "Term" used for in course reserves?
18:02 cait i think the term of the ... hm academic year?
18:03 cait but it's bad for translation
18:03 tcohen manual uses "Spring" as an example
18:03 cait spring semester... maybe
18:03 cait spring course
18:03 cait khall: ping?
18:03 wahanui Using deft allegory, the authors have provided an insightful and intuitive explanation of one of Unix's most venerable networking utilities.[…]oks/dp/0448421658
18:05 oleonard I think "term" is a less-specific word where "semester" and "quarter" imply a more specific duration, but all are basically the same thing
18:07 tcohen thanks oleonard, cait
18:10 cait oleonard: the problem with term is that it also means... something like word
18:11 cait so for translation... it's been a problem and it's wrong in our opac currently
18:11 * oleonard approaches the English Council of Terminology to petition a rule change
18:11 cait thx :)
18:12 cait well... we still have jquery :)
18:15 tcohen and Pottle!
18:22 huginn New commit(s) kohagit: BUG 12304: LDAP auto-provisioning set default messaging preferences <[…]9515ede2ebdaf7646> / Bug 12456: The file C4/, and by extension the file t/Maintainance... <[…]67fca39323d4cbe80> / Bug 9811 [QA Followup] - Enable bProcessing <http://git.k
18:38 cait left #koha
18:56 huginn New commit(s) kohagit: Bug 12386 - 'Days in advance' pull down in bootstrap OPAC is huge <[…]846b32d5bd2c01277> / Bug 8566: [SIGNED-OFF] Enable koha-foreach to insert the instancename into commands <[…]13654df0d7544695b> / ug 11857 - Number of patrons on a patron list not accurate
19:06 cait joined #koha
19:06 huginn New commit(s) kohagit: Bug 12463 - Capitalization: Calendar tool, headings for different types of holidays <[…]7dcee548480eb9d1f>
19:06 cait khall++ :)
19:08 tcohen can anyone sign 12151? i bothers me a lot :-P
19:11 tcohen bye #koha
19:23 WNickC joined #koha
19:53 oleonard[…]g.cgi?id=7021#c14
19:53 huginn Bug 7021: enhancement, P5 - low, ---, mathsabypro, ASSIGNED , patron category in the statistics table
19:53 oleonard "lol" ?
19:55 rangi morning
19:56 rangi super helpful comment
19:58 cait maybe a typo/accidentally hitting sent
20:07 edveal joined #koha
20:14 oleonard Bye #koha
20:17 kathryn joined #koha
20:31 kmlussier1 joined #koha
20:37 indradg joined #koha
20:48 huginn New commit(s) kohagit: Bug 12485 - Show OPAC search history when opacuserlogin is OFF <[…]25e518344e8f9aeda>
21:15 kmlussier1 left #koha
21:25 wizzyrea doh missed oleonard
21:26 wizzyrea bug 12151
21:26 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=12151 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, tomascohen, Needs Signoff , remove remaining uses of the Perl smartmatch operator
21:40 eythian_ joined #koha
21:42 tcohen joined #koha
21:49 tcohen hola #koha
21:50 cait hola tcohen
21:50 eythian_ hi
21:53 tcohen dev meeting in 6 minutes!
21:56 eythian_ all going well I may have to bail part way through.
21:56 Jason joined #koha
22:01 tcohen #startmeeting Koha IRC Developer Meeting, July 2nd, part 2
22:01 huginn Meeting started Wed Jul  2 22:01:07 2014 UTC.  The chair is tcohen. Information about MeetBot at
22:01 huginn Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.
22:01 Topic for #koha is now  (Meeting topic: Koha IRC Developer Meeting, July 2nd, part 2)
22:01 huginn The meeting name has been set to 'koha_irc_developer_meeting__july_2nd__part_2'
22:01 tcohen #topic Introductions
22:01 wahanui #info wahanui, a bot that has become sentient
22:01 Topic for #koha is now Introductions (Meeting topic: Koha IRC Developer Meeting, July 2nd, part 2)
22:01 tcohen #info Tomas Cohen Arazi, Universidad Nacional de Córdoba
22:01 cait #info Katrin Fischer, BSZ, Germany
22:01 eythian_ #info Robin Sheat, Catalyst IT, NZ
22:02 JesseM #info Jesse Maseto, ByWater
22:02 bag #info Brendan Gallagher, ByWater
22:02 rangi #info Chris Cormack, Catalyst
22:02 tcohen today we had a really long meeting
22:03 tcohen so, moving on :-D
22:03 tcohen agenda:
22:03 tcohen #link[…]ting,_2_July_2014
22:03 tcohen #topic RM 3.18 comments
22:03 Topic for #koha is now RM 3.18 comments (Meeting topic: Koha IRC Developer Meeting, July 2nd, part 2)
22:04 tcohen I mentioned today that the jenkins tasks have been set to build and run tests for all stable branches
22:04 tcohen on ubuntu 12.04 & 14.04, and Debian 6 & 7
22:04 tcohen each one has its own DB
22:04 tcohen tweaks might be needed to the launching scripts
22:04 tcohen I ask everyone interested (specially RMaints)
22:05 tcohen to take a look and let me know their suggestions or stuff that needs to be done
22:05 tcohen #info Jenkins tasks have been changed/updated, feedback from RMaints and anyone interested is expected
22:06 bgkriegel joined #koha
22:06 tcohen Also, we are exploring the use of Trello to coordinate more efforts on the development team
22:07 tcohen Katrin is experimenting for QA, I expect dcook to do it on for his Search code rethink/rewrite effort
22:07 tcohen #info Koha Community org on Trello can be found at
22:07 bgkriegel #info Bernardo Gonzalez Kriegel, Argentina & late
22:08 tcohen #info anyone that wants to take a look at the Trello boards for Koha Community, just let tcohen know
22:08 tcohen also, I pushed my first "big patchset" (bug 9811)
22:08 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=9811 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, jonathan.druart, Pushed to Master , Patrons search improvements
22:09 tcohen I'm excited, and expect to have feedback if something needs improvement
22:09 tcohen also, now bug 11703 is passed-qa, i'm considering it for pushing soon, tomorrow i'll be testing it too
22:09 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=11703 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, kyle, Passed QA , Convert checkouts table to ajax datatable
22:10 tcohen questions on RM 3.8 comments?
22:10 tcohen s/\.8/\.18/ :-P
22:11 tcohen ok, moving on?
22:12 cait yep
22:12 cait move on :)
22:13 tcohen Ah, I forgot to mention that the new jenkins setup made visible some problems, most notably Perl 5.18 related
22:13 tcohen anyone that wants to take a look is welcome
22:13 tcohen ok, moving on
22:13 tcohen #topic Additions to Coding Guidelines
22:13 Topic for #koha is now Additions to Coding Guidelines (Meeting topic: Koha IRC Developer Meeting, July 2nd, part 2)
22:14 tcohen it's been discussed that non-XSLT should be deprecated
22:14 tcohen #link http://lists.koha-community.or[…]April/040456.html
22:14 tcohen on the first part we discussed changing the coding guidelines to reflect that
22:15 eythian_ It'd be good to have a plan, like with prog->bootstrap
22:15 eythian_ e.g. start making XSLT default, then in a couple of releases remove it.
22:15 cait xslt is already default :)
22:15 eythian_ Just to ensure everyone has a heads up.
22:15 eythian_ oh good :)
22:15 cait the next step would be identify features that are non-xslt only
22:15 cait it appears there is at least one
22:16 tcohen and sysprefs
22:16 wahanui hmmm... sysprefs is one
22:16 cait HighlightOwnItemsOnOPAC HighlightOwnItemsOnOPACWhich
22:16 cait and gmcharlt has written up a suggested no coding guideline -
22:16 cait hm new coding guideline... not no
22:16 tcohen #info suggested coding guideline by gmcharlt
22:18 tcohen do we agree on that addition to the coding guidelines?
22:18 eythian_ +1
22:18 tcohen the plan is to freeze non-XSLT related code during 3.18
22:18 cait +1
22:19 cait adding no new features to non-xslt
22:19 tcohen +1
22:20 tcohen agreed?
22:20 tcohen #agreed add a deprecation warning to coding guidelines
22:20 tcohen #topic Bugs
22:20 Topic for #koha is now Bugs (Meeting topic: Koha IRC Developer Meeting, July 2nd, part 2)
22:20 tcohen I mentioned two bugs that remove stuff
22:21 tcohen which are passed QA
22:21 cait Removal of C4/ - Bug 12456
22:21 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=12456 normal, P5 - low, ---, yohann.dufour, Pushed to Master , The file C4/ can be removed
22:21 tcohen bug 12456 (already on master)
22:21 cait Removal of misc/cronjobs/rss/ uses HTP - Bug 9000
22:21 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=9000 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, gmcharlt, Passed QA , misc/cronjobs/rss/ uses HTP
22:22 tcohen does anyone have any concern on removing
22:22 tcohen it depends on HTML Template Pro which is not even a dependency for us
22:22 tcohen and we can always recover from git if needed
22:23 eythian_ yeah, if it's never used and won't even work, toss it.
22:24 tcohen with cait we agreed earlier
22:24 MasterOfAllThingsFluffy_away joined #koha
22:24 rangi there are some people around the world using it, it will work fine if you installed koha a while ago and jsut kept on upgrading
22:24 tcohen
22:25 rangi so we would need to make it nice and clear in the release notes its being removed
22:25 rangi yes
22:25 rangi asheima said so in the last meeting
22:25 rangi if you have html::template::pro installed, it works
22:25 cbrannon Is anyone aware of an item limit for bib records?
22:25 cait it does
22:25 rangi and if you installed koha pre 3.4.0 you will have
22:25 cait it's not nice, but i tried it, untranslatable tho
22:26 rangi so we will have to document its being removed and provide easy instructions for an alternative
22:27 cait ashimema said at the last meeting he had checked with his coworkers and they 'would cope'
22:27 tcohen ok, i'll send an email to the general list as we said in part 1
22:27 rangi yes, thats fine for those who have a support company
22:27 rangi i still think we need to make it very clear in the release notes (not just an email to the list)
22:27 cait yes, so far it's just the only feedback from users we have
22:27 tcohen maybe they are interested in improving it
22:27 rangi im not against removing it
22:27 cait gmcharlt has also asked again on twitter, we can do mailing list and release notes
22:28 rangi just that it doesnt do the same thing as a saved search, so you will need to tell people how they can do the same thing
22:28 bag hey cbrannon there is a meeting going on - but I think you are looking for this[…]_bug.cgi?id=11096
22:28 huginn Bug 11096: major, P5 - low, ---, gmcharlt, Pushed to Master , Koha cannot retrieve big records from Zebra
22:28 cbrannon sorry
22:28 cbrannon thanks
22:28 tcohen ok, we earlier agreed that there was no rush for it
22:29 tcohen and that a mail to the general list should be sent
22:29 tcohen (i'll do it)
22:29 tcohen asking people if they rely on that
22:29 tcohen #action tcohen will ask on the mailing list if someone still uses misc/cronjobs/rss/ (bug 9000)
22:29 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=9000 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, gmcharlt, Passed QA , misc/cronjobs/rss/ uses HTP
22:30 tcohen #info rangi asked that removal should imply a clear statement for the users to be aware of the removal
22:31 tcohen agreed on that path?
22:31 rangi yep
22:31 tcohen so, next is
22:32 tcohen UTF-8 cleanup - Bug 11944
22:32 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=11944 major, P5 - low, ---, jonathan.druart, Needs Signoff , Cleanup Koha UTF-8
22:32 tcohen Joubu worked hard on that. It is a tricky one
22:32 tcohen gmcharlt said he'll be reviewing that patch set
22:33 tcohen we need as many eyes as possible on that one
22:34 cait #info gmcharlt will set a date for a gbsd for the utf-8 clean up
22:35 tcohen #info cait will put the GBSD for UTF.8 cleanup in next general meeting's agenda
22:35 cait oh right.. there was that
22:35 cait :)
22:36 tcohen next is removal of prog/CCSR themes
22:36 tcohen #info oleonard said he'll be working on patches for that
22:36 cait oleonard++
22:37 tcohen defaults need to be changed, sysprefs deleted, and so on
22:37 tcohen #info Removal of prog/CCSR themes (bug 11346) - oleonard will be working on those patches
22:37 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=11346 normal, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, NEW , Deprecate the PROG and CCSR themes
22:38 rangi oleonard++
22:38 tcohen one thing worth mentioning is that in will imply changing the opactheme syspref
22:38 tcohen syspref == ccsr || prog -> bootstrap
22:39 rangi yep
22:39 tcohen next is the removal of C4/SQLHelper
22:40 tcohen #info yohann sent several patches to move C4::SQLHelper-dependent code to using DBIx
22:41 tcohen khall_away offered to help him with that
22:41 tcohen and they are talking on hte public list about that
22:41 indradg joined #koha
22:41 tcohen yohann++
22:42 tcohen ok, moving on
22:42 tcohen Better ways to manage MARC Frameworks - Bug 12477
22:42 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=12477 major, P5 - low, ---, gmcharlt, NEW , We need better ways to manage MARC Frameworks
22:42 tcohen bgkriegel?
22:42 wahanui bgkriegel is, like, on a signoff spree
22:42 bgkriegel well, as said earlier, need opinions/ideas
22:43 bgkriegel I'm for using xml, at last in frameworks
22:43 bgkriegel other files could be also
22:43 bgkriegel main reason is to ease translations
22:44 tcohen the idea is to use xml for generating the data
22:45 bgkriegel it will be useful if some want to comment on that bug
22:45 tcohen using XML has the advantage that the current translation tools like it
22:45 rangi id like to see it as a first step away from being MARC specific
22:45 rangi id like to move it to cataloguing frameworks
22:45 rangi which might be marc
22:46 rangi might be dc, might be whatever
22:46 tcohen interesting
22:46 wahanui hmmm... interesting is sometimes good and sometimes bad
22:46 rangi xml seems like a good step in that direction
22:46 wizzyrea ^^
22:47 wizzyrea cataloguing_frameworks++
22:47 rangi with that, plus elasticsearch .. we are moving away from 1968 :-)
22:47 tcohen rangi: if you have any idea on an XML model that should help going that direction, please step in :-D
22:47 tcohen hi wizzyrea
22:48 wizzyrea most of the metadata formats have dtds I thought...
22:49 tcohen the cataloguing interface needs to be rewritten to support that I guess
22:50 cait hm for the data i think yes, but not sure that's the same
22:50 cait we would have to add to it maybe, but use vor validation?
22:50 bgkriegel and what about rancor?
22:51 cait not sure what i say makes sense it's quite late here
22:51 rangi thats designed heavily for cataloguers (ie people who like MARC) i doubt we'd touch that
22:52 wizzyrea could probably take some cues from projects like greenstone
22:52 rangi just not locking us into only being able to represent marc fields would be the first step
22:54 tcohen rangi et al: do u plan to work on that regarding the ES integration efforts?
22:54 rangi not in this release cycle no
22:55 rangi well elasticsearch already lets us index anything, not just marc so nothing more needed there really
22:55 eythian_ Though a lot of the existing stuff it hooks into expects marc, but that's a solvable problem.
22:55 rangi just whatever we choose to represent our frameworks, it would be nice to not build in assumptions that it will always be MARC
22:55 rangi ie it doesnt have to support others yet, but just not make it harder to :)
22:56 tcohen DSpace uses an XML file to model the input form (cataloguing framework)
22:57 cait the change is also to make it easier translatable - i think maybe not try tomake it do everything now, but make afirst step?
22:57 wahanui okay, cait.
22:57 tcohen anyway, what bgkriegel want's to do for now, is abandoning the SQL files stored in the source tree, and move them to XML for better translation
22:57 rangi yep
22:58 tcohen we currently have one file for each language
22:58 tcohen ok, if anyone has any comment to do on that, approach bgkriegel
22:58 tcohen or comment on the bug (feedback is always welcome)
22:59 tcohen dcook for instance, proposed YAML instead
22:59 tcohen ok, moving on now, agreed?
22:59 tcohen #topic Testig of APIs, CAS, LDAP...
22:59 Topic for #koha is now Testig of APIs, CAS, LDAP... (Meeting topic: Koha IRC Developer Meeting, July 2nd, part 2)
23:00 tcohen the QA team has several bugs in their queue
23:00 tcohen due to the lack of a proper testing environment
23:00 tcohen not everyone has a CAS or LDAP server
23:01 tcohen SIP, etc
23:01 tcohen biblibre set a CAS server for testing purposes
23:01 tcohen biblibre++
23:01 tcohen we still don't have an LDAP server for testing LDAP patches
23:01 * bag is working on getting an LDAP server for testing
23:01 tcohen :-D :-D
23:02 bag just got back in office from being out for about 40 days (work travel and vacation)
23:02 * tcohen is amazed most of the sentences are even aligned
23:02 bag so LDAP will come just not too fast
23:02 bag :)
23:02 tcohen bywater++
23:03 tcohen #actions ByWater is working to provide an LDAP server for testing purposes
23:04 tcohen ok next topic
23:04 tcohen #topic Big stuff we are working on
23:04 Topic for #koha is now Big stuff we are working on (Meeting topic: Koha IRC Developer Meeting, July 2nd, part 2)
23:04 tcohen anyone?
23:04 wahanui Anyone? Anyone? Bueller? Bueller?
23:04 tcohen I mentioned earlier that I plan to work on a TemaTres<->Koha integration
23:05 rangi just the same as before
23:05 bag pianohacker just spent the last week working pretty heavily on[…]_bug.cgi?id=11559
23:05 huginn Bug 11559: enhancement, P5 - low, ---, jweaver, Needs Signoff , Professional cataloger's interface
23:05 rangi elastic search, plack, and cover images
23:05 bag he should have more patches coming in another 3~4 weeks
23:05 tcohen bag: what needs to be done for rancor?
23:05 tcohen (from the release team)
23:06 bag right now pazpar2 isn't reliable - so pianohacker needs to decide on how he wants the z3950 searching done
23:06 tcohen ok, let everyone know if feedback is needed
23:07 cait :)
23:07 bag like why even change what we already have versus being creative with something new :)
23:07 tcohen :)
23:07 cait there is also the opac patch using pazpar2
23:07 bag will do
23:08 bag yup cait there is...
23:08 cait not sure what we could use instead
23:08 bag once we can have pianohacker in the "office" for a consistent period we'll be looking at all those again
23:08 tcohen excellent
23:09 tcohen rangi: about plack support
23:10 tcohen is there big stuff needing sign-off or any kind of feedback?
23:10 eythian_ A few have been signed off, and one or two need a bit more work (of the ones I've done.)
23:10 * bag is working on getting 2 production sites up in the next two weeks for plack staff
23:11 bag see if we can't find some more bugs
23:12 eythian_ yay bugs! :)
23:12 tcohen ok, i mentioned TemaTres
23:12 eythian_ what is that?
23:12 wahanui well, that is the intended behavior?
23:13 tcohen is a tool for managing thesaurus and controled vocabularies
23:14 rocio joined #koha
23:14 bgkriegel TemaTres:
23:15 tcohen thanks bgkriegel
23:16 eythian_ That looks worthwhile.
23:16 tcohen we should move on, cait would fall asleep otherwise
23:17 cait huh?
23:17 * cait might already be half asleep
23:17 cait but it's the time
23:18 tcohen ok, moving on
23:18 tcohen #topic Dates of releases
23:18 Topic for #koha is now Dates of releases (Meeting topic: Koha IRC Developer Meeting, July 2nd, part 2)
23:18 tcohen we forgot to talk about that on part 1
23:19 rangi ah yeah
23:19 tcohen release dates are slippin
23:19 rangi ive notice we seem to be slipping from our release dates
23:19 rangi it used to be 15th was string freeze, and 22nd was release (for maintenance releases)
23:20 rangi but it kinda is all over the place now, which makes it harder for translators etc
23:20 rangi i just wanted to mention that, and see if people would like to try to get back to monthly regular releases
23:21 bag agreed - I think it should be back to 15th 22nd
23:21 tcohen yes, i'll talk to the guys about that
23:21 tcohen we can do it
23:21 bag I just don't want my calendar alerts to be wrong :P
23:21 rangi thanks
23:21 bag heh
23:21 tcohen ok
23:22 cait 22nd_releases++ :)
23:22 tcohen #topic Set time of next meeting
23:22 Topic for #koha is now Set time of next meeting (Meeting topic: Koha IRC Developer Meeting, July 2nd, part 2)
23:22 tcohen I proposed on koha-devel, trying a 3-week cycle for this meetings
23:23 tcohen thus, proposed July 23rd
23:23 tcohen same time
23:23 tcohen 15:00 UTC and 22:00 UTC
23:24 eythian_ same_bat_time++
23:24 rangi +1
23:24 bag works  +1
23:24 cait left #koha
23:24 tcohen
23:25 tcohen ^^^^^^ kohacon14
23:25 bag ok I need dinner now
23:25 tcohen #agreed next meeting date: July 23rd (part 1: 15:00 UTC) (part 2: 22:00 UTC)
23:26 tcohen done
23:26 tcohen what was the command?
23:26 tcohen #endmeeting
23:26 Topic for #koha is now Koha 3.16.1 is available! Next general meeting is 9 and 10 July 2014 at 22:00 and 15:00 UTC. Welcome to the IRC home of Koha Please use for pastes.
23:26 huginn Meeting ended Wed Jul  2 23:26:25 2014 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)
23:26 huginn Minutes:        http://meetings.koha-community[…]-07-02-22.01.html
23:26 huginn Minutes (text): http://meetings.koha-community[…]4-07-02-22.01.txt
23:26 huginn Log:            http://meetings.koha-community[…]02-22.01.log.html
23:26 tcohen thanks everyone
23:27 rangi thank you tcohen
23:27 * dcook looks forward to reading the minutes
23:27 tcohen hi dcook
23:27 bag thanks tcohen
23:28 bag tcohen++
23:28 dcook Dang, cait...1:30am?
23:28 tcohen night every1
23:28 dcook hey, tcohen
23:28 dcook and night :)
23:28 tcohen wife is waiting for me to cook!
23:29 dcook heh
23:39 dcook oleonard++
23:42 papa joined #koha

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