IRC log for #koha, 2014-03-21

All times shown according to UTC.

Time S Nick Message
00:00 maximep left #koha
00:06 jenkins_koha Starting build #464 for job Koha_Docs (previous build: STILL FAILING -- last SUCCESS #457 1 day 10 hr ago)
00:06 jenkins_koha Yippee, build fixed!
00:06 wahanui o/ '`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`
00:06 jenkins_koha Project Koha_Docs build #464: FIXED in 2 min 22 sec: http://jenkins.koha-community.[…]ob/Koha_Docs/464/
00:06 jenkins_koha * Nicole C. Engard: update local cover images info
00:06 jenkins_koha * Nicole C. Engard:  update patron holds info in opac
00:06 jenkins_koha * Nicole C. Engard: update images for opac patron record
00:10 wizzyrea hahaha it throws confetti when the build works. That's awesome
00:27 mtompset Why is MiJ?
00:27 mtompset ^Why^What^
00:28 eythian It means "me" in Dutch.
00:30 mtompset "MiJ is faster than Marcxml" -- What was jcamins talking about?
00:30 eythian[…]ARC/Record/
00:33 eythian probably
00:40 tcohen joined #koha
00:40 mtompset Greetings, tcohen
00:41 tcohen hi mtompset
00:47 tcohen there's an option, that it is not documented to control that
01:06 tcohen night #koha
01:20 rocio left #koha
01:53 dcook What are folks thoughts on
01:53 dcook Creating a temporary table then dropping it?
01:56 eythian dcook: is it actually using "create temporary table"?
01:56 eythian if so, I have less issue with it than if it was creating a real one.
01:56 dcook Yep
01:57 dcook Could use "DROP TEMPORARY TABLE" instead of "DROP TABLE" but I'm not sure how cross-database that is
01:58 eythian don't know.
01:58 eythian basically, I'd say if it's the best way to do whatever it's trying to do, then it's fine. If it's not, then it's not :)
01:58 dcook hehe
01:58 dcook Well said, eythian ;)
02:00 dcook Seems to me that it could be done a bit more elegantly although I'm not sure if that's relying on MySQLism or not *shrug*
02:00 dcook Does the trick anyway
02:31 mtompset I think I finally have a solid test plan. I wish people would write clear, mildly verbose, instructions for their test plans.
03:17 mtompset I hate putting failed QA, but that's the proper setting. :(
03:33 mtompset 11213 down... 11909 to start.
03:48 quyen joined #koha
03:49 quyen Hello
03:49 wahanui hi, quyen
03:49 quyen I try to start with koha 3.12
03:49 quyen I know it is a good ILS
03:50 quyen Now, I would like to setup plugins but I can't please guide me how to do it
03:50 quyen And I'm not sure to convert data from ISIS to koha
03:51 quyen Althoug I have read Mark Edit
03:51 quyen But my data is vietnamese code
03:54 quyen I'm sorry, maybe you are busy
03:54 quyen Please send me your guidance when you have free time.
03:55 quyen and 1 more, I'd like integrated dspace on e-resource of bibliographic framework
04:10 mtompset wahanui: Is a bot. It is not human.
04:11 mtompset You probably was to start with 3.14, if you are just starting using Koha.
04:11 mtompset You probably want to start with 3.14, if you are just starting using Koha.
04:11 mtompset Data conversion. I can't help you. I'm not familiar with ISIS.
04:12 mtompset And given that I should have gone to sleep 12 minutes ago (it is 12:12AM here), I can't quite understand your third request.
04:13 mtompset There are not many people here right now (lunch for a lot of people), midnight for others.
04:13 mtompset You may wish to ask on the mailing lists.
04:13 mtompset mailing lists?
04:13 wahanui mailing lists are[…]ha-mailing-lists/
04:13 mtompset Have a great day, #koha.
04:13 wajasu gnight
04:22 wajasu quyen: this may be helpful:[…]7858377/FrontPage
04:25 quyen Thank you very much! Best wishes to you!
04:28 quyen the third request, I mean that I have a file .kpz (koha plugins) but I can't install it into koha system. Please guide me when you can. Thank you very much.
04:42 wajasu quyen: might give guidance.
04:45 wajasu note sure, but you might also see if you need ICU for your vietnamese characters for searches.  but get some data loaded, and indexed so you can get searches going.
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05:11 huginn New commit(s) needsignoff: [Bug 7339] Help System in IE8 Does Not Load With 500 Error <[…]w_bug.cgi?id=7339> / [Bug 6875] de-nesting C4 packages <[…]w_bug.cgi?id=6875> / [Bug 6536] Z3950 Enhancements: SRU targets, MARC conversion, additional XSLT processing (umbrella report) <[…]w_bug.cgi?id=6536>
05:23 cait joined #koha
05:45 * dcook waves
05:45 dcook Oh, I forgot to eat lunch...
05:45 * dcook remedies that
05:48 indradg joined #koha
06:14 cait late lunch?
06:14 * cait waves back
06:15 dcook Late lunch/early supper?
06:15 dcook It's Friday and I'm down to 30 local issues in our bug tracker :D
06:15 dcook Hopefully I'll reduce that number quickly at the start of next week and get back into some community involvement (he says for the third time in three months)
06:19 cait woohoo
06:19 cait not sure when i last saw that :)
06:24 dcook Hehe. It wasn't that long ago, but hopefully it's for real this time. I've been working hard to get caught up. Hopefully I'll be putting up a few bug reports and testing...
06:24 paxed what do cataloguers use to catalogue? because i don't believe for a second they'd use koha's current system
06:24 dcook I think they usually use their brains and their fingers
06:24 dcook But I think I'm just being facetious :p
06:24 dcook You can do cataloguing in so many different ways
06:25 dcook In lots of different systems at lots of different experience levels
06:25 dcook As a fairly experienced cataloguer, I would ideally use "Rancor" that pianohacker is developing. It's old school and lots of pro cataloguers would probably love it.
06:25 paxed right, that's why i said "koha's _current_ system"
06:25 dcook Lots of non-pros don't necessarily mind Koha's current system.
06:25 dcook Aside from some of the scary MARC labels
06:26 paxed why would a non-pro be allowed to catalogue anyway?
06:26 dcook O_o
06:26 dcook "allowed to catalogue"?
06:26 paxed GIGO
06:26 * dcook facepalm
06:26 wahanui http://buikitty.files.wordpres[…]120202-094434.jpg
06:27 dcook Not every library can employ full-time cataloguers or library technicians
06:27 dcook Nor is cataloguing a required course in library schools
06:27 dcook "many" library schools*
06:27 dcook I would say 99% of the librarians I support have never taken a cataloguing course
06:27 paxed ours would kill us if we tried to get them to use koha's current system.
06:28 dcook Many of them don't know AACR2/RDA, MARC, etc
06:28 dcook I had the feeling you might have your own cataloguers, paxed ;)
06:28 dcook Are you at a public or academic institution?
06:28 paxed public library
06:28 dcook There you go
06:28 dcook And they'd be right to kill you
06:28 dcook Koha's current system isn't set up for a pro who is doing this 8 hours a day
06:29 paxed so what do they use?
06:29 dcook Well, I suspect that they do use it
06:29 dcook But there are alternatives
06:29 dcook If it's a wealthy public library, they could use OCLC and then import the records into Koha using a few different methods
06:29 cait paxed: did you ask them what especially they don't like?
06:30 paxed OCLC is not an option - we are not an american library
06:30 dcook OCLC is quite active outside America as well, but I take your point
06:30 dcook There are other cataloguing agencies out there. Lots of cataloguing is outsourced these days.
06:31 dcook But I guess the real question is...
06:31 dcook What's your question, paxed?
06:31 dcook Does your public library use Koha?
06:31 dcook Or do you want it to use Koha?
06:31 paxed ask kivilahtio when we will be using it.
06:32 paxed supposedly we'll start using it this summer.
06:33 dcook Mmm, so you're worried about what the cataloguers will think.
06:34 dcook What's your role in the migration?
06:34 paxed i'm one of the devs.
06:35 dcook Do you have a project manager who is managing the softer side of things?
06:35 paxed translation was a big part of my job, but that's now 99% done. now i've tackled some koha deficiencies our library needs, but there's still lots to do.
06:36 paxed yes
06:36 dcook In my experience, it's handy to have someone talk to everyone (especially in technical services) and figure out what they've been doing with the past system.
06:36 dcook That way, you can figure out what they will need to do in the current system, and address any gaps.
06:37 dcook (And of course create efficiencies wherever possible as older workflows almost always have redundant steps in them.)
06:37 dcook Perhaps they already use a third-party tool for cataloguing.
06:37 dcook If not, find out what they do currently use.
06:37 paxed closed-source ILS.
06:37 dcook That's not what I mean really
06:38 dcook How do they use that ILS
06:38 dcook What does the screen look like? How do they interact with it?
06:38 dcook Is it web-based?
06:38 paxed no, it's windows program.
06:39 dcook So does it use form fields or is it more like a text editor?
06:39 paxed for example, koha's system doesn't populate eg. LDR, 008, etc. correctly when changing frameworks.
06:40 dcook I think you might not understand the purpose of frameworks
06:40 paxed could be.
06:40 dcook Or maybe I don't understand them quite right ;)
06:40 dcook I'll look
06:41 dcook Ah, right.
06:41 dcook Yeah, frameworks are arbitrary.
06:41 dcook There's no reason why they would change values for the LDR, 008, or certain other fixed fields
06:41 dcook I suppose in theory that could be changed...
06:42 dcook It would probably even be a good idea
06:42 dcook It would reduce user error
06:42 dcook Cataloguing is a bit of a weakness with Koha, I think
06:43 dcook But, the joy of open source is that it can be changed :)
06:43 cait you can set a default value for the fixed fields i think
06:43 cait but probably only works when you first open the framework
06:43 dcook I didn't see any defaults for 008 or Leader as they use plugins
06:43 cait i do that for our FA
06:43 dcook Ah...although I suppose you could use a default value...
06:43 cait you can set the string in the normal configuration, but it's a bit fiddly with the plugins, i have only used it, when the plugins are not used
06:44 dcook Hmm, that would be interesting to try
06:45 paxed aösp bug 9093
06:45 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=9093 normal, P5 - low, ---, gmcharlt, NEW , 008 forgetting what material type was chosen
06:45 paxed also*
06:47 dcook Ah, I think that might not mean what people think it means
06:48 dcook I'd have to look at the code, but I think - as Bernardo points out - the values are probably fine
06:48 cait it could be a good thing to fix that bug
06:48 dcook It's just the label that is probably off
06:48 cait yeah i think that's it
06:49 dcook In any case, I need to head to the vet!
06:49 dcook Finally found out what is wrong with one of our cats \o/
06:49 dcook Debugging the cat!
06:49 dcook left #koha
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06:55 cait oh
07:07 * magnuse waves
07:11 laurence joined #koha
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07:35 reiveune joined #koha
07:35 reiveune hello
07:36 alex_a bonjour
07:39 markvandenborre buongiorno, goedemorgen
07:42 cait left #koha
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07:47 sophie_m hello #koha
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07:58 * magnuse waves again
08:14 cait joined #koha
08:20 magnuse kia ora cait!
08:20 cait hi Magnuse :)
08:22 magnuse :-)
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09:09 paxed OPAC doesn't show how many reserves a book has?
09:19 gaetan_B joined #koha
09:19 gaetan_B hello
09:21 ashimema joined #koha
09:25 ashimema Morning Koha...
09:34 magnuse hiya ashimema
09:42 mrenvoize joined #koha
09:57 * paxed goes ah-ha
09:57 paxed lovely, a FIXME in code clears up the situation.
10:18 paxed except when RoutingListAddReserves is set.
10:24 cait routinglistaddreserves doesn't work
10:24 paxed oh?
10:25 cait well in my experience it does not - but you can test it again
10:25 cait i filed a bug report with my findings
10:31 paxed the only place where AddReserve is called with constraint other than 'a' is ... and that piece of code looks a bit weird.
10:34 ashimema joined #koha
10:45 paxed the weirdness dates back to 2006, coming from katipo.
10:52 BTT joined #koha
10:59 cait paxed: it#s not weirdness, but holds worked differently back then
10:59 cait katipo wrote the first version of koha
11:00 paxed cait: well, unused variables. see $totalcount and $count
11:01 cait yeah, someone broke it
11:01 cait adding a new feature... not thinking about how an existing one worked
11:02 cait reasons why we have QA today - trying to make sure nothing gets broken
11:04 paxed was it broken when the changes from katipo were folded in 2006?
11:06 cait it wasn't broken then no
11:06 cait it used to work in the first koha I saw, which was past 2007
11:06 paxed because $count and $totalcount weren't used in katipo's code either. git show f408ead60b7d55eb9f6fde05097a4e99278c1d1f
11:06 cait git is sometimes hard to read
11:06 cait especially the real old commits
11:08 cait @later tell pianohacker - want to test the external targets bug with you next week - suggest a time? ideally my afternoon would be good if that's doable. I will have a Debian machine then to test with :)
11:08 huginn cait: The operation succeeded.
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12:02 slef @seen magnuse
12:02 huginn slef: magnuse was last seen in #koha 2 hours, 27 minutes, and 44 seconds ago: <magnuse> hiya ashimema
12:02 slef (hi all)
12:05 meliss joined #koha
12:05 cait hi slef
12:05 mtompset_away joined #koha
12:06 mtompset Greetings, #koha.
12:25 oleonard joined #koha
12:25 wajasu i built a fresh new debian VM with koha packages and non-ICU, and tried to get facets to respond in yaz-client  like dcook did in bug 11232, but just can't get it to work.
12:25 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=11232 new feature, P5 - low, ---, gmcharlt, NEW , Retrieve facets from Zebra
12:26 mtompset Sucky, wajasu. :(
12:27 wajasu thats what i was thinking
12:30 mtompset wajasu: Could you check that you can git bz apply 7567 on a new branch of master with minimal difficulty?
12:31 wajasu sure. one moment
12:35 wajasu yay! i got the facet behavior to work. like dcook did.
12:35 wajasu grabbing your bug now.
12:35 ashimema thats promising
12:35 oleonard Hi #koha
12:35 ashimema hi oleonard
12:35 mtompset ashimema, only slightly. There are ICU issues.
12:36 wajasu i will try to investigate ICU later.
12:37 ashimema less promising..
12:37 ashimema I played with it with dcook at kohacon.. but don't remember the details tbh
12:41 mtompset wajasu: There... confirmed the sha1 problem of Joubu. It should work no problems now.
12:42 wajasu 11 patches for that one. in progress.
12:42 mtompset Yes, tiny, incremental patches.
12:42 mtompset Easy to test each piece.
12:45 wajasu let me try again. :)
12:50 wajasu fatal: sha1 information is lacking or useless (C4/ on  patch id 25325  Use Display Filter,,  Cannot fall back to three-way merge
12:51 wajasu mtompset: i was doing git am -i -u -3 ...
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13:37 tcohen morning #koha
13:39 rhcl Morning tcohen
14:00 maximep joined #koha
14:03 magnuse any koha people going to ? (appart from anne-lena and asgeir from opl)
14:18 francharb hi!
14:20 magnuse hiya francharb
14:24 dbs magnuse: Do I count as a koha person? If so, yes
14:27 dpk joined #koha
14:31 magnuse dbs: sure! and: ah, yes :-)
14:32 magnuse dbs: make sure you have a good talk with Anne-Lena Westrum and Asgeir Rekkavik - they are going to replace marc with rdf in a year or two
14:32 magnuse (with the possibility to dumb rdf down to marc if there are no other options)
14:36 indradg joined #koha
14:37 dbs magnuse: cool! will do
14:39 magnuse marcmustdie!
14:41 nengard joined #koha
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14:55 magnuse friday?
14:55 wahanui friday is pizzaday!
14:55 magnuse w00t!
14:55 * magnuse calls it a week
14:55 JesseM Pizza Day!!!
15:04 rocio joined #koha
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15:19 Oak joined #koha
15:20 Oak kia ora #koha
15:20 Oak hello cait
15:20 Oak magnuse
15:20 Oak hello mtompset
15:21 druthb kia ora, Oak!
15:21 Oak @wunder Konstanz
15:21 huginn Oak: The current temperature in Konstanz, Germany is 20.0°C (4:00 PM CET on March 21, 2014). Conditions: Scattered Clouds. Humidity: 13%. Dew Point: -1.0°C. Pressure: 29.85 in 1011 hPa (Falling).
15:21 Oak hello druthb ! :)
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15:59 jenkins_koha Starting build #465 for job Koha_Docs (previous build: FIXED)
15:59 jenkins_koha Project Koha_Docs build #465: SUCCESS in 2 min 34 sec: http://jenkins.koha-community.[…]ob/Koha_Docs/465/
15:59 jenkins_koha Nicole C. Engard: update AcqItemSetSubfieldsWhenReceived
16:01 jwagner joined #koha
16:13 jenkins_koha Starting build #466 for job Koha_Docs (previous build: SUCCESS)
16:13 jenkins_koha Project Koha_Docs build #466: SUCCESS in 2 min 1 sec: http://jenkins.koha-community.[…]ob/Koha_Docs/466/
16:13 jenkins_koha Nicole C. Engard: add SelfCheckReceiptPrompt
16:16 jwagner joined #koha
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16:55 cait hi Oak!
16:55 cait left #koha
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17:19 francharb hey jcamins, if you still dont know what to do with the frogs you might buy one day at your local store :[…]nt-crusher-video/
17:19 francharb ;)
17:20 tcohen joined #koha
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17:21 jcamins francharb: I see a problem with that. After the frog is done playing on the iPad, it will attack the owner.
17:21 laurence left #koha
17:23 francharb well, you'll never know until you try it... ;)
17:38 indradg joined #koha
17:39 reiveune bye
17:39 reiveune left #koha
17:39 druthb ZOMGBRILLIANT:
17:45 paul_p joined #koha
17:48 cait joined #koha
17:50 * cait waves
17:51 tcohen hi cait
17:51 cait hi tcohen :)
17:51 cait looking at the schedule just this moment :)
17:51 cait asado? :)
17:52 tcohen
17:53 jcamins tcohen: asado doesn't seem very good for vegetarians.
17:53 cait oh food!
17:53 tcohen oh, we put several vegetables on the grill too!
17:54 * cait is persuaded ... just have to persuade some others now as well
17:56 tcohen jcamins: when I do an asado, I usually put half meat and half vegetables
17:57 francharb joined #koha
17:57 jcamins tcohen: oooh. I like grilled vegetables!
17:57 jcamins Though, alas, I probably won't be able to make KohaCon this year. :(
17:57 tcohen oh, that's sad!
17:58 jcamins Yeah. :(
17:59 jcamins No Argentine tango in Argentina for us.
18:01 tcohen :(
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18:34 tcohen is there a wiki page for the work on retrieving facets from Zebra?
18:37 cait hm ont sure, it hink most is on the bug
18:39 cait tcohen: is the last line on the schedule correct?
18:39 cait there is a gab between12 - 20
18:40 tcohen its very wrong :-D
18:42 mtompset @later tell Oak Sorry, I had my chauffeur hat on.
18:42 huginn mtompset: The operation succeeded.
18:48 tcohen cait: it is 10/12
18:48 tcohen dunno why get wrote that with bgkriegel
18:48 tcohen oh, i get it
18:48 tcohen by brain and my fingers haven't reached a consensus
18:49 francharb joined #koha
18:52 cait you want to keep us around :)
18:52 tcohen of course !
18:52 tcohen maybe until january then?
18:55 tcohen cait. icu?
19:01 cait hm?
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19:31 cait tcohen: did you just post the solution for facets with zebra AND ICU??!
19:31 cait tcohen++
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19:50 * mtompset is excited to hear about the facet progress. Combine that with something customizable, and we'll be awesome. :)
19:50 cait we'll totally be :)
19:54 oleonard Bye #koha, have a good weekend!
20:10 cait printer--
20:10 mtompset Why, cait?
20:10 cait because i wasted a lot of paper printing my train ticket for tomorrow
20:10 cait *sigh* printers hate me
20:18 mtompset It's probably not 100% your fault. Blame the application designers who provided it in a way that is difficult to print. ;)
20:20 rhcl yea, it's those layer 7 programmers...
20:38 mtompset maybe layer 6? ;)
20:39 rhcl well, if it applications then layer 7, but if it the device drivers that's layer 2
20:39 rhcl its
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22:24 wajasu i am getting results for facets for non-ICU now.  looking at ICU, I get results, but the displayed text is garbled, so I cam looking at the ICU transliteration rules for the phrases :p option
22:24 wajasu refereing to[…]rules#TOC-Context
22:25 cait wajasu: did you see the newest comments on the bug?
22:25 wajasu yes
22:26 wajasu it looks like tcohen got some results.  i haven't got there yet.
22:28 wajasu i get <term coccur="4" occur="2">&quot;1/I3OKCAK7A+=&apos;7I)</term>
22:29 cait that looks like a weird mix
22:29 wajasu i had success with non-ICU.  but am trying to ICU.   wasn't sure is tcohen did ICU.
22:30 wajasu well you can see xml escaped stuff in there.  and the count of chars i believe matches the correct result closely.  so i think its a transliteration icu-chain rule.
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23:54 jcamins wajasu: I can't help you with this now, but I think Tomas may have documented how he set up facets to work with ICU. The key point is that -- as pointed out way back at KohaCon  -- the :p indexes CANNOT BE USED FOR FACETS. You MUST use :0 indexes.

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