IRC log for #koha, 2011-06-13

All times shown according to UTC.

Time S Nick Message
00:02 sekjal left #koha
00:02 * druthb got sunburnt pretty badly today at Capital Pride festival.
00:02 Space_Librarian left #koha
00:02 rangi ouch, got any aloe vera?
00:02 druthb yes.  A nice thick goopy layer on my shoulders at the moment.
00:05 Agent_Dani druthb: Ouchie!
00:05 druthb yah.
00:05 Agent_Dani Remind me to slather you with my SPF 50 next time. ;)
00:10 BobB left #koha
00:22 bgallagher left #koha
00:40 jenkins_koha Project Koha_master build #295: SUCCESS in 43 mn: http://jenkins.koha-community.[…]/Koha_master/295/
00:40 jenkins_koha * fridolyn.somers: BUG4319 waiting items cannot be reserved
00:40 jenkins_koha * gmcharlt: bug 5653: use itemcallnumber in bib label layouts
00:40 jenkins_koha * Katrin.Fischer.83: Bug 5653: Follow-up, correction to nb-NO sample creator data
00:40 jenkins_koha * frederick.capovilla: Bug 5684 : Remove all items fields from a Z39.50 record imported for acquisition.
00:40 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=5653 normal, PATCH-Sent, ---, gmcharlt, ASSIGNED , default new label layout and sample data have broken call number placeholder
00:40 jenkins_koha * 5860 Fixing stocknumber index
00:40 jenkins_koha * Chris Cormack: Bumping database number
00:40 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=5684 normal, PATCH-Sent, ---, gmcharlt, NEW , Z3950 search on OCLC pulls in items (tag 952)
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02:24 rangi crap, if we felt that one
02:24 Ahmuck-Sr joined #koha
02:25 rangi chch is gonna be a mess
02:25 wizzyrea oh dear
02:25 wizzyrea another earthquake?
02:25 mtj hmm, i missed it :/
02:25 mtj just then ?
02:25 eythian wizzyrea: yeah
02:25 rangi bout 5 mins ago
02:25 eythian[…]ocks-Christchurch <-- wizzyrea
02:25 rangi following on from one earlier today
02:26 wizzyrea urg!
02:26 eythian it made our building sway
02:26 wizzyrea !!!!
02:26 eythian keeping in mind we're about 1,000km away
02:26 eythian (sway very slightly, but noticable)
02:26 rangi
02:26 wizzyrea oy
02:26 wizzyrea wowie, no lie
02:27 wizzyrea chch just very very unlucky this year
02:27 * druthb sees wizzyrea and goes (!)
02:27 rangi over 6
02:27 rangi they reckon
02:27 Space_Librarian_ Well, we felt it... that's not good at all
02:28 rangi[…]ums/mqz-drum.html
02:28 rangi shift-refresh
02:28 eythian oh, 300km, not 1,000, but still...
02:28 wizzyrea oof
02:28 rangi[…]ums/wel-drum.html  <-- thats us
02:29 wizzyrea that's about as far as kansas is top to bottom
02:29 wizzyrea like, here to joplin (where the recent tornado was)
02:31 wizzyrea so in my terms - that's not very far
02:31 * ibeardslee missed the sway .. but isn't complaining
02:32 eythian 7th floor tends to sway a bit.
02:33 pauln wow i hadn't heard about the earlier ones
02:34 pauln didnt' feel nothing here - maybe 1550km to here
02:34 druthb left #koha
02:35 ibeardslee that last was a 6
02:36 rangi and only 9km down Space_Librarian_ tells me
02:36 Space_Librarian_[…]kes/3528839g.html
02:37 rangi  <-- thats a pretty heart wrenching photo
02:37 wizzyrea :( yea
03:07 Schwitzd left #koha
03:46 eythian[…]65/in/photostream <-- an old photo I just re-found.
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05:54 oakivil Hi folks! And greetings from Finland. I am doing a research on koha and evergreen and after setting up Koha 3.4, I have some questions about "component parts".
05:54 oakivil How does one add them?
05:54 oakivil How are they implemented in the database level?
05:55 eythian where do you see that?
05:55 oakivil see what?
05:55 eythian component parts
05:55 oakivil I don´t
05:55 oakivil but they are really important for Finnish libraries, especially music cataloguing
05:56 oakivil but they are really important for Finnish libraries, especially for music cataloguing
05:56 eythian what do they do?
05:56 eythian are they perhaps the same as authorities?
05:56 eythian liw: you're also from strange remote lands, maybe you know :)
05:56 oakivil we catalog music cd's as a main biblio, then every piece of musc is catalogued as a child biblio
05:57 eythian oh
05:57 eythian that's new in 3.4
05:57 eythian it's called....
05:57 eythian hrm
05:57 eythian
05:57 eythian I think
05:57 oakivil analytics?
05:57 oakivil ok
05:57 oakivil I'll google on that
05:58 eythian Yeah. It's currently only set up so that you can have records for each article within a serial, but the infrastructure is there, it should be hard to extend it to more things (and I think that that's worthwhile, it's a bit limited the way it is now. But, perhaps there's some weird MARC rules or something.)
05:58 eythian *it shouldN'T be hard....
06:00 oakivil hmm
06:02 oakivil how about displays?
06:02 eythian displays of what?
06:02 oakivil prolly easy to change too
06:02 oakivil displays of the modified data
06:02 oakivil i mean the web page which shows a listing of music items
06:03 oakivil well it ofc needs to be made by hand
06:03 eythian Oh, no idea. It's all template driven, so if you don't like what it's doing, changing it isn't a big deal.
06:03 oakivil ok
06:04 oakivil do you have any idea how those serials are built inside the database?
06:04 oakivil and the serial subrecords? how are they connected?
06:04 oakivil well maybe ill tinker with the db
06:05 eythian off the top of my head, there's a record identifier value in the parent (MARC21 field 008 or thereabouts)
06:05 oakivil ok
06:05 oakivil i was tracing it to 7xx fields
06:05 eythian and then the child records include that value in their 7xx field, $w or similar
06:05 oakivil ah ok
06:05 eythian (I've never seriously done this, I just checked to see that it worked a few weeks ago)
06:06 oakivil i was wondering what was the connection in marc21
06:06 eythian (so I know bits about it, but not a lot of detail)
06:06 oakivil can you help me with data migration?
06:06 eythian what are you migrating from?
06:06 eythian sometimes it's easy, sometimes it's a nightmare :)
06:06 oakivil PallasPro (a Finnish custom closed source ILS) using Ingres database
06:06 oakivil no database documentation available
06:07 oakivil :D
06:07 oakivil its a pain
06:07 oakivil uses FinMARC-format
06:07 oakivil we already got conversion rules from FinMarc to MARC21
06:07 eythian the way I do it is with some scripts I made that will take the data from a CSV-like format, and produce MARC21. But these are not particularly easy to use as I've made them for myself.
06:07 oakivil but maintaining the database relations while doing the migration is the tricky part
06:07 eythian (although you're welcome to try)
06:08 oakivil we will ues USEMARCON
06:08 oakivil with a conversion packet
06:08 oakivil but the marc data needs to be normalized so the USEMARCON can use it
06:08 eythian OK. I know nothing about that. I'm usually coming from crazy systems that have pretty limited MARC knowledge.
06:09 oakivil but mainly myu interest is that, currently i am not importing any marc data to koha, but instead just fill out the necessary biblio and biblioitems tables records
06:09 oakivil to make a testing environment
06:10 eythian ah right.
06:10 oakivil with the same keys from the original database, so i can connect those biblios im importing with existing patron and loan data
06:10 eythian there's something you can run that'll convert that to MARC, I think.
06:10 oakivil now thats grand
06:10 oakivil something i was hoping for
06:10 * eythian looks for it
06:10 oakivil anyway FinMARC data needs to be converted
06:11 eythian oh bother, I think it just did items, and now item MARC fields have been removed, I think the script has gone too.
06:11 oakivil and imported but for the time being having testing material and a testing environment to convince people around Finland that THIS is a good thing is important
06:11 oakivil ok no prop
06:12 oakivil but how does the database handle those subrecord queries?
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06:12 oakivil if they are hidden inside the marcxml field
06:12 oakivil its sooooo slow
06:12 eythian If you're handy with Perl, you might be able to use the ModBiblio functions to do it, they should create the marc appropriately
06:12 eythian it uses zebra, which indexes them.
06:12 oakivil ok
06:13 eythian (zebra is a search engine that understands marc)
06:13 oakivil yeah i installed it and even did some research what it was about but kinda forgot :D
06:13 eythian heh
06:14 oakivil so i need to create a marcxml record which has the bare necessary fields to create subrecord links
06:14 oakivil when i add subrecords
06:15 oakivil ok
06:15 oakivil can do
06:15 eythian well, just to be awkward, I think the db stores both usmarc and marcxml.
06:15 oakivil tho it'll take days of work
06:15 oakivil yeah
06:15 oakivil but i think marcxml is easier
06:15 oakivil programmatically edited with groovy xml classes
06:15 eythian yeah, I'm just afraid it might get upset it one is missing.
06:15 eythian *if
06:16 oakivil what might be missing?
06:16 oakivil you mean i must fill both marc fields?
06:16 eythian Possibly. I'm not sure exactly how it uses them.
06:16 oakivil ok
06:16 oakivil well we'll see
06:17 eythian yeah
06:17 eythian it might also be that if you populate the marcxml, then you can run through with ModBiblio and have it magically tidy up each record.
06:17 oakivil ok, ill google for ModBiblio
06:18 eythian well, it's a function inside koha
06:18 eythian so, you'd have to write a script to talk to it.
06:18 oakivil ok
06:19 oakivil at what time do people hang around here?
06:19 oakivil like its 9:24 am here
06:19 eythian it varies. I'm surprised more Europeans aren't around yet.
06:19 oakivil ok
06:19 eythian I suppose it's only 8:24 for much of it.
06:20 eythian so perhaps in half an hour
06:20 oakivil yeah
06:20 oakivil prolly
06:20 oakivil are you from nz?
06:20 eythian yeah
06:20 oakivil so its pretty late
06:20 eythian 18:25, not too late
06:20 oakivil ok
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06:46 reiveune hello
06:46 wahanui hello, reiveune
06:47 oakivil hi all
06:47 reiveune hi
06:49 eythian ah, there we go. France is waking up ;)
06:51 alex_a hello #koha
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06:57 oakivil great, we were talking with eythian about subrecords and migration
06:59 Ropuch Morning #koha
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07:00 matts_away is now known as matts
07:01 sophie_m hi #koha
07:01 julian hello!
07:01 eythian hi y'all
07:01 rangi oakivil: cait is who you want to talk to about that
07:02 eythian or kf, who is the same person :)
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07:02 rangi but you can do linking with the control number and 773 w
07:02 oakivil ok
07:02 rangi @marc 773 w
07:02 huginn rangi: Record control number  (Repeatable)
07:02 oakivil eythian pointed that out too
07:02 rangi cool
07:02 matts hello !
07:02 eythian rangi: it's wanted for music, and currently it's only set up for serials, AIUI
07:02 oakivil and it seems zebra does the indexing of marcxml
07:03 rangi eythian: works for anything
07:03 oakivil which is kewl since i was wondering how is marcxml queried efficiently as it is a mysql field
07:03 eythian I thought when we looked at it it required the marc item type header thingy to be correct.
07:03 eythian (where "correct" is serials)
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07:04 oakivil Yeah the music people here in Finalnd are dying for those component parts
07:04 eythian rangi: also, openssl is a beast from another world.
07:04 juan-xercode left #koha
07:04 rangi yep, but thats a quick xslt change
07:04 eythian I think one of these command lines is going to summon something inhuman.
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07:04 eythian yeah
07:05 eythian especially as I have to repeat them multiple times...
07:05 rangi oakivil: yeah
07:05 oakivil hmm
07:05 oakivil It cant be that hard to make component parts available to other biblioitemtypes than SE?
07:05 oakivil It cant be that hard to make component parts available to other biblioitemtypes than SErials?
07:06 rangi no
07:06 rangi change the xslt files
07:06 wahanui rangi: that doesn't look right
07:06 eythian it won't be hard
07:06 eythian a couple of line changes
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07:06 oakivil trouble is the integration with the community
07:06 oakivil i mean I can't just go and change whatever i like :D
07:06 rangi no thats no trouble either
07:07 paul_p_ hello world
07:07 rangi just send a patch
07:07 eythian personally, I don't see the point of restricting it to serials only.
07:07 rangi brb putting kids to bed
07:07 oakivil me neither
07:07 oakivil why should it even be restricted?
07:07 oakivil maybe it is optimized for serials
07:07 oakivil or it is dictated in MARC-format to be used for serials only?`
07:08 eythian no, there's no real semantic difference between serials and anything else for things like this.
07:08 oakivil ok
07:08 eythian It could be. MARC is strange.
07:08 oakivil now that we got to MARC, is there any way to alter the MARC-fields of a biblioformat?
07:08 oakivil other than by creating a new format or modifying an existing one
07:08 eythian how do you mean?
07:09 oakivil i mean straight from the cataloguing section
07:09 oakivil when one adds a biblio, can he on the fly add some marc fields
07:09 eythian ah right
07:09 oakivil you can duplicate existing fiuelds
07:09 eythian well, you'll have to create a framework that allows you to do that.
07:09 oakivil but not add new ones?
07:09 oakivil ok
07:09 oakivil so its just a boolean
07:10 eythian there's a bunch of things, but it boils down to that yeah
07:10 oakivil yeah, theres always a bunch of things. I miss the times when all I knew was java and arrays :D
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07:10 eythian heh
07:11 eythian it's more a case that there's things like where to show, whether it's repeatable, and so forth.
07:11 oakivil ok
07:12 oakivil i like the administrative section, where you can modify so many system values
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07:12 eythian yeah, everyone needs something different, so it all goes in there.
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07:14 oakivil Anyone know anything about the off-line mode? or the library bus mode?
07:14 oakivil that is one of the key issues here in Finland as well
07:14 oakivil in addition to the importance of subracords
07:15 oakivil Mainly do they exists
07:15 eythian there is some form of offline mode, but I don't know anything about it.
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07:43 eythian yay, finally got apache working with a test client cert. Now to get the information from that into Koha...
07:44 eythian rangi: you about?
07:45 rangi yep
07:45 eythian oh, I think I worked it out, nm
07:46 eythian just trying to remember how to pass cert values into perl
07:46 rangi ahh i think i put that in the bug in bugzila
07:47 rangi yay kristina is signing her mail now
07:47 rangi gpg++
07:48 eythian rangi: you didn't, but that's OK :)
07:48 eythian see also: Bug 5576 :)
07:48 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=5576 enhancement, P5, ---, ian.walls, ASSIGNED , Access Koha via SSL
07:48 eythian > That's not to say that one couldn't envision scenarios where a library would want to use client certificates, but unless the library is a spooky three-letter-agency, a public-facing OPAC is not a likely use case for that.
07:49 eythian our three letter agency isn't all that spooky :)
07:49 rangi yeah :)
07:49 rangi 4 letter one is but
07:49 eythian (it's the four letter ones we've got to worry about ;)
07:49 eythian also, bags not setting up Koha for GCSB ;)
07:50 rangi heh
07:51 eythian SSLOptions +StdEnvVars is the magic I need I think
07:54 rangi sweet
07:55 eythian now just need to figure how to get the email address out...
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07:57 rangi the code in C4/Auth is set to use the cn and match that to the userid field in koha
07:57 eythian yep, I think we need to match it to the email.
07:57 eythian though, it's hard to tell
07:57 rangi if we use the email, it will have to do something more elaborate, like match the email, then find the userid and set that
07:58 rangi easiest thing to do do for now
07:58 rangi get C4/ to do a Data::Dumper of $ENV
07:58 rangi and then see what you get :)
07:59 eythian Unfortunately, I don't know how their certs are set up in that respect.
08:00 rangi probably need to get one of them to look at the opac tomorrow
08:00 rangi and check the log
08:00 eythian damn, with pki turned on, I have to log in for every page load.
08:00 rangi yep
08:00 eythian which I suppose makes sense
08:02 eythian > Welcome, Mr Robin Sheat
08:02 eythian it works with CN on my test cert :)
08:03 rangi sweet, the cn matches your username?
08:03 eythian yeah
08:03 rangi awesome
08:05 eythian oh crap, I'll lock myself out if I don't give myself super permissions...
08:06 rangi yes, you will :)
08:06 rangi worst comes to worst, cna change your userid in the db
08:07 eythian oh, I have the apache config open
08:07 rangi and login as another user
08:08 eythian hmm
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08:08 cait hi #koha
08:08 rangi hi cait
08:08 eythian I gave myself super librarian but I only have a couple of things.
08:08 eythian and it says "Insecure" at the top
08:08 rangi hm interesting, ill have to have a look tomorrow
08:09 eythian yeah, I'm going to turn it all off now and go.
08:09 eythian hi cait
08:09 cait another eq? :(
08:09 rangi yep
08:10 eythian Christchurch fell over again
08:10 Oak guten tag cait
08:10 eythian rangi: oddly, but helpfully, saving prefs seems to bypass the authentication.
08:13 rangi sounds like a bug
08:13 eythian yeah. I'm not going to fix it now, as it'd cause me more problems than it'd solve :)
08:15 eythian[…]atest-information <-- cait
08:15 eythian[…]ums/mqz-drum.html <-- also
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08:33 cait t
08:33 cait ah
08:33 cait eythian: you can do component parts
08:33 cait reading the logs
08:33 wahanui reading the logs is not the same as participating.
08:33 cait eythian: not mark them as a serial but as 'set' - that's already in there
08:33 rangi cait: it was oakivil asking but that is good information :)
08:34 cait ah, he is still here
08:34 rangi i knew you would know the answer
08:34 cait not hard - I programmed it
08:34 cait we do that for multivolume things
08:34 cait have a set record and one for each volume
08:35 cait or have a record for a traced series and one for each item in the traced series
08:35 cait oakivil?
08:36 rangi yep that makes sense
08:38 cait not sure it makes sense - but our data is structured that way
08:38 cait ;)
08:39 cait ouch, reading back the logs I found your links :(
08:39 rangi hmmm
08:39 rangi
08:43 cait hm?
08:43 rangi still havent heard back, and now the site appears to be down
08:47 Irma left #koha
08:48 cait ah, I could access the main page, but I see now what you mean
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09:10 oakivil ping!
09:10 oakivil had a nap
09:10 oakivil :D
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09:12 cait hi oakivil
09:13 oakivil so
09:13 oakivil a set record you say
09:13 cait yes
09:13 oakivil you mean a framework type?
09:14 cait and the control number from 001 from the set record links to the $w
09:14 cait no
09:15 oakivil so you mean marc fields?
09:15 cait yes
09:15 oakivil ok
09:15 oakivil then zebra indexes them
09:15 cait you would want to have a marc framework with the needed subfields configured perhaps
09:15 oakivil yeah
09:15 cait yes, it indexes the $w fields, in the set record a link "show volumes" is shown
09:16 cait and when you click on it you get a list of the linked records
09:16 oakivil so if i create a framework with those fields, then zebra indexes the relations between parent and subrecord
09:16 oakivil then when in OPAC i look for a music item, it creates the item and subrecords
09:16 oakivil well I gotta try that
09:17 oakivil I'm not at the office now because IRC doesn't work there. Crappy public sector intranets
09:17 cait ah
09:18 cait I should really provide some documentation for that :(
09:18 oakivil having a remote work day to IRC with you guys and browse university library e-publications
09:18 oakivil yeah
09:18 oakivil i couldnt find it from the documentation
09:18 cait I have a few test records that you could load and take a look at
09:18 oakivil that would be great
09:18 cait can you pm me your email?
09:19 julian left #koha
09:20 cait I will send it a little later - it's family breakfast time now. :)
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10:12 rangi hi druthb
10:12 druthb hi, rangi.
10:13 cait hi druthb :)
10:13 druthb :D
10:13 jcamins_away is now known as jcamins
10:13 cait hm peter lorimer again on patches
10:13 jcamins Hello, everyone.
10:14 cait hi jcamins
10:17 rangi yeah, unfortunately not any of them are in a form that is usable
10:22 matts is now known as matts_away
10:22 oakivil Koha has been in development for over 10 years right? The technologies at the very core must be ancient, like CGI-scripts. How have you managed to keep Koha modifiable as there are lots of developers working on it constantly? The trend with old systems (developed in Agile manner) is that the older they get, the harder it is to maintain the codebase.
10:23 rangi agile smagile, when koha was started that was called rapid prototyping
10:24 rangi inline documentation, the same way you make any code maintainable
10:24 oakivil we can call it rapid prototyping if it makes you feel better :D
10:24 oakivil ok
10:25 rangi its all just fads, whatever you call it :) strict adherence to any of them is a bad idea
10:25 rangi
10:25 rangi plus unit tests
10:26 rangi http://jenkins.koha-community.[…]ter/HTML_Report/?
10:26 rangi and continuous integration testing
10:26 rangi http://jenkins.koha-community.[…]/job/Koha_master/
10:29 rangi (the linux kernel is older btw :))
10:29 oakivil damn, you've really got everything set up in a textbook manner
10:29 oakivil now that explains why I have trouble with it all the time :D
10:30 oakivil <3 Lucid Lynx
10:31 oakivil *<3 Natty Narwhal
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11:21 mib_cait hmpf
11:21 mib_cait pidgin refuses to reconnect
11:22 mib_cait magnus_away: ping
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11:32 jcamins Anyone running latest Master?
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11:41 Oak Hello druthb :)
11:46 druthb hi, Oak! :)
11:46 Oak :)
11:46 oakivil Do you have any idea where to look for documentation about setting up multi-library koha installation?
11:47 oakivil how is it done in practice?
11:47 oakivil if we had say six libraries and every one had their separate installation
11:47 oakivil they could adminster their own fines and loan dates
11:47 oakivil but how can they loan from other libraries catalogs?
11:49 jcamins oakivil: use separate branches.
11:49 oakivil hmm
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11:50 oakivil so then I had 6 branches running on the same server?
11:50 oakivil on the same database
11:50 oakivil and every branch could have their libraries
11:52 jcamins You have a separate branch for each library.
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12:10 oleonard Happy Monday #koha
12:10 druthb HI, owen. :)
12:11 jcamins Alas, look what we have come to!
12:11 jcamins Not only does my cat drink from my glass of water, my wife's plants get water from my glass, too!
12:14 oleonard Hey, wb jcamins
12:14 jcamins Thanks.
12:15 jcamins Also, we come home to find that Shari's desktop is screwed up.
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12:23 gmcharlt @quote random
12:23 huginn gmcharlt: Quote #134: "<cait> birthday wishes go over crazy bugs :)" (added by gmcharlt at 06:49 PM, May 20, 2011)
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12:38 mib_cait @quote random
12:38 huginn mib_cait: Quote #97: "chris_n shakes his fist (again) in the direction of Redmond" (added by wizzyrea at 03:21 PM, October 08, 2010)
12:38 mib_cait hi gmcharlt
12:39 sekjal joined #koha
12:39 kivilahtio can somebody kick oakivil and me because my mIRC crahsed and now my first nick (oakivil) wont autoexit
12:39 chris_n joined #koha
12:40 kivilahtio hmm, not necessary. The process is still running ?
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13:21 tcohen hi
13:22 Oak hello tcohen :
13:22 Oak :)
13:22 tcohen anyone has added 863 subfields to their serials frameworks?
13:29 mib_cait @marc 863
13:29 huginn mib_cait: [Described in full under field 863 in the MARC 21 Concise Format for Holdings Data.] (Repeatable) []
13:32 sekjal mfhd?
13:32 wahanui mfhd is MARC Format for Holdings Data
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13:32 sekjal tcohen:  nothing added to the frameworks yet, but that's going to need to happen soon... especially if we want to enable MFHD importing into serials
13:34 tcohen thanks sekjal, one question on that
13:35 tcohen the structure is very similar to that in 853 right?
13:35 tcohen or which is the difference
13:36 sekjal there is one 853 for many 863s
13:36 sekjal 853 defines the captions and patterns
13:36 sekjal 863s are the instances of those patterns (individual serials issues)
13:37 sekjal that structure is repeated between 854/864 and 855/865 for supplementary material and indexes, respectively
13:40 tomascohen joined #koha
13:40 tomascohen sorry sekjal, internet failed here
13:40 tcohen if i'm not wrong, the problem would be defining that fields semantics
13:40 tcohen ?
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13:43 rhcl There is no life before 9:00am on Monday.
13:44 sekjal tcohen: right, there is not quite enough info in the 853 to completely fill in the Koha subscription record, and not necessarily enough in the 863 add a serial entry for that subscription
13:45 tomascohen is this topic on an RFC? or bugzilla?
13:45 tomascohen If I undesrtood it better I might spend some days working on it
13:45 tomascohen is now known as tcohen
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13:46 raosoma hi
13:46 sekjal tcohen:  should be an RFC
13:46 sekjal we've also got to think of some kind of UNIMARC equivalent, if there isn't one already
13:46 raosoma means..
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13:47 raosoma i have a question about circulation rules..
13:47 raosoma can anyone help me out?
13:47 oleonard We won't know until you ask raosoma
13:48 raosoma :-)
13:48 raosoma this is for a private circulation lib
13:48 raosoma and want to restrict users take only two books...
13:48 raosoma and one magaizne....
13:49 raosoma I was able to restrict the checkouts for two books but how to do that for periodicals..
13:49 oleonard You have to have a separate item type for periodicals
13:49 tcohen raosoma: you can set a limit for books, another for serials and a global one
13:50 raosoma Three Books Plan   Books   3  10  0.00  0  0  0  0  0  0.000000   Delete
13:51 raosoma Well let me explain...
13:51 raosoma I have defined one patron category as "3 books one magazine" plan
13:52 raosoma and defined two rules against this category...
13:52 raosoma first rule: number of books (item types) allowed as 3
13:53 raosoma 2nd rule against the same category: number of continuing resources checkout allowed as 1...
13:53 raosoma is it the way to do?
13:53 mib_cait yes
13:54 mib_cait but you must make sure that your periodicals and books all hve items with the correct itypes of course
13:54 raosoma and i have another patron category called three books...
13:55 raosoma and i defined a rule saying the checkouts to be allowed only 3...
13:55 raosoma and it works...
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13:55 raosoma but it allows to checkout the periodicals also...
13:55 raosoma how to restrict that...
13:55 mib_cait ah
13:55 mib_cait add a rule saying 0 allowed
13:55 raosoma will it work...
13:56 mib_cait it should
13:56 raosoma may be not defining will allow to checkout...
13:56 mib_cait I do it that way for our libraries
13:56 raosoma o great...
13:56 raosoma ok i will try...
13:56 raosoma and i have one more question about serials...
13:56 mib_cait not sure what happens when you don't define anything, would have to test that
13:56 raosoma ok..
13:56 mib_cait but if you also add default rules, you might get unintended results
13:57 mib_cait with the 0 rule you are on the save side
13:57 raosoma ok got it..
13:57 raosoma :-) yes true...
13:57 raosoma a question about serials...
13:58 raosoma when i receive from subscription to add corresponding item?
13:58 mib_cait you have to activate add items in the subscription
13:58 raosoma how to tag example a volume 4, number 5 to a particular periodical...
13:58 mib_cait you can have both - subscriptions without addings items (I think this is the default) and subscriptions adding items
13:59 raosoma or it just becomes an item of that particular biblio
13:59 mib_cait when you have it activated the item will be generated when you add the issue
13:59 mib_cait yes, it's added tothe biblio of the serial
13:59 raosoma but how to map it to a particular issue or number...
14:00 raosoma example: there is a monthly magazine of volume 100, number 4 representing april..
14:00 mib_cait there is a subscription tab showing all issues and holding information for your library, it's always only one record that can have items
14:00 mib_cait I am not sure I understand your question
14:00 raosoma i received vol 100, no 4...then i add item after receiving...
14:00 mib_cait if you are using the serials module the information will be in the holdings information or visible in the itmes
14:01 raosoma but i don't get a mapping of that later...
14:01 mib_cait and the item didn't show up?
14:01 mib_cait mapping?
14:01 mib_cait there are some bugs in serials in the current version - which version are you using?
14:02 raosoma 3.2.9
14:02 mib_cait ok
14:02 raosoma i meant creating an item for serials is like creating an item for any biblio record...
14:02 raosoma i didn
14:02 mib_cait can you explain about the mapping you expected?
14:03 raosoma have to read with patience :-)
14:03 mib_cait you can create items in the serials module too - but basically it's the same
14:03 mib_cait the information about the issue is kept in an item field - serials enumeration/chronology I think
14:03 raosoma i have added one monthly subscription and it is now ready to receive...
14:03 raosoma it allows me to add item...
14:04 raosoma example i received vol 100, num 4
14:04 mib_cait when you received it, did you get a form to add an item?
14:05 raosoma it asks for it"click here to add item"
14:05 mib_cait ok
14:05 mib_cait what you normally do is, change the status of the issue to 'arrived' and the form will open
14:05 mib_cait you can also use the link
14:05 raosoma yes...
14:06 mib_cait and when you fill that out it should create an item attached to the record of your serial
14:06 raosoma and then i set home lib etc., give a barcode and select "continuing resources"..and create it...
14:06 raosoma am i correct?
14:07 raosoma let's assume vol 100, issue 4 has barcode MAG10004
14:07 mib_cait yes
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14:08 raosoma now i get another month book...and i receive it for vol 100, number 5
14:08 raosoma and i create item with another barcode MAG10005...
14:08 rhcl ping wizzyrea
14:09 raosoma if i don't follow the above way barcoding, i cannot make out which barcode is against which number...
14:09 raosoma means MAG10004 is against vol 100, number 4 or vol 100, number 5?
14:09 mib_cait momphone
14:09 raosoma sorry?
14:10 raosoma hope you got what i mean?
14:10 mib_cait not sure I really get it
14:10 mib_cait and have a phone call, one moment
14:10 raosoma ok...
14:11 raosoma let me type while you answer your phone call..
14:11 raosoma there are two magazines say of apr and may...for which items are created against a subscription...
14:11 raosoma now how to differentiate the item created whether is of apr or may?
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14:14 Brooke kia ora
14:16 rhcl hi brooke
14:16 Brooke homie g!
14:16 Brooke how's it?
14:16 raosoma hi mib_cait: are you there...
14:17 rhcl it is
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14:22 mib_cait raosoma: ther eis a field that should have the information
14:22 mib_cait 952 h
14:22 mib_cait it's not kept in the barcode field, barcode is just a number
14:23 mib_cait 952 h - I tink it's labelled serial enumeration or chronology
14:23 mib_cait it should be auto filled from your subscription
14:23 mib_cait it's shown in opac detail and on the holds screen
14:23 mib_cait s
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14:25 raosoma 952h? nothing is autofilled while i create an item. am i missing?
14:26 raosoma yes there is something like that...
14:26 raosoma but how to get it filled automatically...
14:27 mib_cait if it doesn't fill right now that might be a bug
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14:27 mib_cait bug 6305
14:27 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=6305 critical, PATCH-Sent, ---, colin.campbell, NEW , The serials are not working properly
14:27 mib_cait I fixed it for 3.4
14:27 raosoma ok...
14:27 tcohen sekjal: 853 defines a pattern and 863 should present subfields accordingly?
14:27 raosoma can i have patch in 3.2.9
14:28 mib_cait until it fills you can copy the information from the line above the item form
14:28 raosoma is it available?
14:28 raosoma i didn
14:28 mib_cait the patch is available - but only for a later version
14:28 raosoma i didn't understand...
14:28 mib_cait not sure it's really what you see
14:28 raosoma what to copy?
14:28 mib_cait above the item form
14:28 mib_cait the line where you change to 'arrived'
14:28 sekjal tcohen:  yes, the subfields in 863 correspond to the subfields in 853
14:28 mib_cait the first field
14:29 mib_cait of that line
14:29 mib_cait I would copy that in the item field
14:29 mib_cait so if the autofill works later, it will just work and your other items will look all the same
14:29 raosoma what to copy?
14:30 raosoma something like vol 100, num 4?
14:31 mib_cait yes
14:31 mib_cait but that in the serial enumeration field
14:32 raosoma means 952h?
14:32 mib_cait yes
14:32 raosoma ok...
14:32 raosoma let me check...
14:32 raosoma 3.4 it fiils auto?
14:34 raosoma thanks a lot...
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14:35 raosoma time to go home...
14:35 raosoma thank you very much mib_cait..
14:35 mib_cait ok
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14:35 mib_cait have a nice evening
14:36 mib_cait :)
14:36 raosoma where are you from?
14:36 mib_cait Germany
14:36 raosoma me from india...
14:36 raosoma have a great day...
14:36 mib_cait you too :)
14:36 raosoma bye
14:37 atz_ joined #koha
14:38 oleonard Hi two atzes
14:40 rhcl atz^2  :)
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15:00 rhcl @seen rangi
15:00 huginn rhcl: rangi was last seen in #koha 4 hours, 30 minutes, and 50 seconds ago: <rangi> (the linux kernel is older btw :))
15:02 reiveune bye
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15:32 Oak \o
15:32 cait hi Oak :)
15:32 Oak hello cait
15:32 Oak guten abend :)
15:33 mib_cait left #koha
15:33 * cait looks for druthb
15:34 cait :)
15:34 Agent_Dani Hi cait
15:35 Oak her   name,   is   neo!!!
15:37 cait huh?
15:37 sophie_m left #koha
15:37 Oak never mind cait ... that was stupid joke
15:37 Oak obviously
15:38 schuster left #koha
15:38 oleonard cait: Matrix movie reference
15:38 Oak seen Matrix?
15:38 wahanui I haven't seen 'Matrix', Oak
15:39 oleonard You should, wahanui. But stop after the first one.
15:40 matts is now known as matts_away
15:42 sekjal the Animatrix is kind of fun...
15:42 sekjal good soundtrack, at the very least
15:43 Oak yup, sekjal Death In Vegas- Hands Around My Throat
15:43 cait yep, I kno matrix
15:43 Oak show us
15:43 talljoy is now known as talljoy_phone
15:44 cait but didn't get the reference :(
15:44 Oak another matrix reference cait.. ignore
15:44 Oak cait, did you watch it in English>
15:45 Oak uh oh. that may sound like a bad question
15:56 bigbrovar left #koha
15:57 cait no, only in german so far
15:59 Oak tch tch
15:59 Oak why, your english is awesome
16:01 Oak or were you being sarcastic?
16:05 cait no, but when the movie came out my english was not so good :)
16:05 Oak ah
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17:04 Oak night
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17:14 slef @seen gmcharlt
17:14 huginn slef: gmcharlt was last seen in #koha 4 hours, 51 minutes, and 23 seconds ago: <gmcharlt> @quote random
17:15 slef gmcharlt: can we do anything to help fix email on the wiki server?
17:15 slef or thd-away if you're around?
17:15 slef @seen thd
17:15 huginn slef: thd was last seen in #koha 9 weeks, 3 days, 9 hours, 31 minutes, and 53 seconds ago: * thd sleeps
17:15 slef that's one heck of a sleep
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17:48 gmcharlt slef: as far as I know email from the wiki is now passing through, and it's blocking the pattern of addresses that most of the spam accounts were using
17:51 slef gmcharlt: oh right. bug 6326 wasn't updated. Can anyone here test it for us by signing up on[…]ecial:OpenIDLogin or[…]Special:UserLogin please?
17:51 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=6326 enhancement, P5, ---, gmcharlt, NEW , Mail not going out from Wiki
17:55 talljoy is now known as talljoy_lunch
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18:02 raosoma hi
18:02 raosoma can any one help me in configuring email in 3.2.9 koh
18:02 raosoma a
18:03 oleonard raosoma: If you're talking about configuring the server to send email you may be better off in a forum for your particular server software
18:06 raosoma Mail::Sendmail 0.79
18:06 raosoma is the perl module that got installed..
18:07 raosoma oleonard: sorry, i didn't understand..
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18:34 sekjal has anyone else noticed that 856s are not showing up in the OPAC details page with XSLT turned off (on current HEAD)
18:35 oleonard sekjal: I believe someone was asking about that on the list the other day
18:35 talljoy_lunch is now known as talljoy
18:35 sekjal looks like a TT issue
18:36 sekjal MARCURLS in the perl, MARCurlS in the template
18:36 tcohen left #koha
18:39 sekjal reporting bug...
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19:44 rangi morning
19:44 oleonard Hi rangi
19:45 * cait waves
19:48 skushner left #koha
19:49 talljoy morning
19:49 jwagner rangi, are your family members OK in Christchurch? I heard there was another quake.
19:49 LBA joined #koha
19:50 rangi yep, no deaths or serious injuries this time, lots more damage tho
19:50 jwagner Good news/bad news....
19:50 rangi my aunt and uncle and grandma are fine
19:50 oleonard Christchurch can't get a break
19:51 jwagner Good night, all
19:51 jwagner left #koha
19:51 rangi its got months/years more of aftershocks
19:54 rangi the problem of a country that straddles two plates
19:55 wizzyrea they're not creeping their way north are they?
19:55 wizzyrea the earthquakes
19:56 rangi wizzyrea: wellington lies on a bunch of major fault lines
19:56 rangi its due an 8
19:56 wizzyrea scary
19:56 rangi but course no one can predict when
19:56 rangi with an 8 its not worth worrying about
19:57 wizzyrea yea, stuff's gonna be messed up, just be prepared to survive it
19:57 rangi just make sure you have your emergency stuff stocked and hope u are in the right place
20:00 rangi on to happier news, its the wellington perl mongers quiz night tonight
20:00 talljoy party on!
20:02 oleonard left #koha
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20:04 rangi its nz, so there will of course be beer
20:06 cait no surprise :)
20:06 cait have fun
20:06 rangi My stop be back after coffee
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20:17 rangi back
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20:24 rhcl_away wizzyrea et al: there was an email on 9 June from Catherine Chambers@Mzuzu University asking about fines notices. I don't see that anybody replied to it. I could tell her about the scripts themselves, but probably better that someone else explain how to set them up in the staff interface.
20:24 rhcl_away is now known as rhcl
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20:26 Brooke kia ora
20:26 rangi rhcl: you were after me earlier?
20:26 rangi ata marie Brooke
20:26 Brooke morena, rangi
20:29 rhcl forgot why :)
20:29 rangi :)
20:32 rhcl actually, I've been off IRC for a few days, and I think I was going to ask about the situation there in NZ with the earthquakes, but I see that subject was discussed above.
20:32 library_systems_guy joined #koha
20:33 rangi[…]oric-earthquakes/  <-- we get some big ones
20:33 library_systems_guy is anybody else having problems with list not saving?
20:36 rhcl Is there anything or anybody on Chatham Island? (tsunami danger?)
20:37 Brooke yes
20:37 Brooke on two of them
20:39 cait hi Brooke
20:39 Brooke :D
20:39 Brooke Wie geht's?
20:40 rangi rhcl: no tsunami danger, but ppl live there
20:40 Guillaume1 left #koha
20:40 rangi rhcl: my suburb has lines painted on the road, get above this line if you want to live
20:41 rhcl well
20:47 Brooke Who wants to chair tomorrow's meeting?
20:53 sekjal I may be late, or even miss the meeting... got to catch a bus right then, and I don't know about it's wifi situation
21:02 sekjal left #koha
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21:05 Brooke 0/
21:07 ashimema Is the translate site down.. or is it just me?
21:07 rangi just you i think
21:07 rangi
21:07 ashimema ooh. patients is a virtue... works agian now :p
21:10 Brooke up but slow as from over hyah
21:14 ashimema fiar enough
21:15 ashimema (i think maybe i should stop now with the typos creeping in anyway :P)
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21:38 huginn New commit(s) kohagit: Bug 6497: MARC URLs not showing up in OPAC detail page with XSLT off <[…]bdaa5a8bb44726cbd>
21:42 jenkins_koha Starting build 296 for job Koha_master (previous build: SUCCESS)
21:44 huginn New commit(s) needsignoff: [Bug 6483] Paging in opac-detail when coming from a search <[…]w_bug.cgi?id=6483>
21:53 library_systems_guy has there been any other talks of integrating shiboleth?
21:57 rangi not that i can recall
22:03 library_systems_guy dang...i remember sekjal talking about it being a rumor
22:03 rangi wouldnt be that hard to do
22:04 library_systems_guy maybe i can start that.  I just don't really have a lot of experience with it
22:04 rangi having a crack is a good way to get experience :)
22:04 library_systems_guy thats true
22:05 library_systems_guy so if i wanted to start coding for it...where would I start
22:05 library_systems_guy its not a bug
22:05 rangi make a bug, but mark it enhancement
22:05 library_systems_guy but i guess i can submit features...ok :)
22:05 library_systems_guy do i need to do a wiki for it?
22:05 rangi then look at C4/Auth/pm and C4/
22:06 library_systems_guy ahh yes i know C4/ well
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22:25 jenkins_koha Project Koha_master build #296: SUCCESS in 43 mn: http://jenkins.koha-community.[…]/Koha_master/296/
22:25 jenkins_koha ian.walls: Bug 6497: MARC URLs not showing up in OPAC detail page with XSLT off
22:25 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=6497 major, PATCH-Sent, ---, ian.walls, ASSIGNED , MARC URLs not showing up in OPAC Detail page with XSLT turned off
22:31 slef library_systems_guy: one of my colleagues wants to do that. I think we've other fish to fry first, sadly (and I don't know who to use to test it but that's a minor problem)
22:31 slef @query shibboleth
22:31 huginn slef: No results for "shibboleth."
22:31 slef bleah
22:31 rhcl is now known as rhcl_away
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23:36 mtj slef: still about?
23:37 Ropuch left #koha
23:37 mtj have u setup 3m self-check units with koha before?
23:38 mtj ... or am i getting that confused with the 3m RFID kit
23:38 bgallagher joined #koha
23:46 rangi[…]i-bin/
23:47 rangi in prep for global sign off day
23:48 mtj sweet :)
23:48 samerrill left #koha
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23:49 mtj would be a nice stat to automate a graph for
23:49 rangi i can give you an api to grab the raw data, if you want to graph it
23:51 mtj yeah - ill have a wack, if you do :)
23:51 rangi 2 secs
23:51 slef mtj: yeah, I shouldn't be.
23:52 slef mtj: yes, 3m self-check units are most of our head-banging in that line.
23:52 samerrill joined #koha
23:52 slef rangi: I don't understand it. :)
23:53 rangi its just a count of status changed per day
23:53 mtj slef: quick Q? raw sockets or telnet connections for the self-check?
23:53 rangi so 30/11/2010 7 bugs changed status to pushed
23:54 rangi 1/12/2010 15 went to needs signf off, and 9 got pushed
23:54 rangi etc
23:54 slef rangi: ok, it's the "to" bit that was missing
23:54 rangi yep
23:54 rangi sorry ill write some more words
23:54 rangi mtj:[…]
23:54 slef "Bugs changing to each status"?
23:54 rangi yeah that works
23:55 rangi done
23:55 mtj too quick :)
23:56 slef mtj: looks like telnet BICBW
23:57 mtj oooh, new acronym
23:57 slef But I Could Be Wrong
23:57 slef it's 1am here
23:57 slef BICBW is But I Could Be Wrong
23:57 mtj yep, gotcha
23:57 slef do you really trust my reading of XML :)
23:57 slef mtj: I was teaching wahanui
23:57 slef BICBW?
23:57 wahanui BICBW is But I Could Be Wrong
23:57 mtj thanks, im testing with telnet here
23:58 mtj its going ok-ish....
23:59 mtj the sipserver output files make it a little tricky to debug, initially
23:59 slef Glad it's going OK. I'll be back in some hours.
23:59 slef I must signoff now before I get qwertyitis

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