IRC log for #koha, 2010-08-19

All times shown according to UTC.

Time S Nick Message
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03:19 wajasu sweet! 3.2 has a script so now I can drive my distribution package builder from it!
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03:22 Amit heya chris, brendan
03:22 brendan hi Amit
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06:32 chris I think I have answered every email with send a patch today
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06:37 chris I might make a template
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07:10 kf good morning #koha
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07:12 magnus hiya kf and #koha
07:12 kf morning magnus and paul_p
07:12 kf marc-must-die? :)
07:13 magnus kf: yup! it's about time
07:13 kf I am really looking forward to meet you :)
07:14 magnus and the same to you!
07:14 magnus my trip starts in exactly 2 months! ;-)
07:15 kf mine too :)
07:15 kf @wunder Konstanz
07:15 munin kf: The current temperature in Taegerwilen, Taegerwilen, Germany is 14.5�C (9:24 AM CEST on August 19, 2010). Conditions: Mostly Cloudy. Humidity: 94%. Dew Point: 14.0�C. Pressure: 30.04 in 1017.2 hPa (Steady).
07:15 kf ah Jacob Voss contributed to your wiki
07:17 magnus yup. hope he is not the only one, or i will loose my faith in a better future for library data... ;-)
07:17 magnus @wunder bodo, norway
07:17 munin magnus: The current temperature in Bodo, Norway is 14.0�C (9:20 AM CEST on August 19, 2010). Conditions: Scattered Clouds. Humidity: 72%. Dew Point: 9.0�C. Pressure: 29.74 in 1007 hPa (Steady).
07:18 paul_p hi Europe (magnus & kf)
07:19 paul_p my trip start in less than 2 months, as we do a stop-and-go of 1 day in Kuala-Lumpur
07:19 magnus hiya paul_p
07:19 paul_p ;-)
07:19 magnus paul_p: sounds good!
07:20 kf :)
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08:39 jt hi, is there any hardware requirement for a decent koha installation with about 250 simultaneous users?
08:41 pastebot "jt" at pasted "koha goes to crawl/ without current users" (14 lines) at
08:47 chris magnus: i wish you had killed marc before i started working on koha
08:47 kf jt: I don't know, our libraries are quite small and I am not sure what hardware we are using
08:47 kf evening chris :)
08:47 chris jt: simultaneous librarian users, or people using the opac
08:48 magnus chris: sorry about that, but i guess i have been a librarian about as long as you have worked on koha... ;-)
08:48 jt chris: the current nopaste is a koha server without users using it, but somehow it bring the server to crawl
08:49 jt what is the use of by the way?
08:50 kf it normally appears when you make a reserve in the opac
08:50 kf or at least it did when I worked on that some time ago
08:50 kf reserve = hold
08:50 chris jt: theres no way they should be running that long
08:51 chris 55:34.02
08:51 jt is this a bug or server hacked?
08:51 chris not a bug
08:51 chris but unlikely its been hacked
08:52 kf I had problems with that when my perl code was not right - had to kill the processes
08:52 chris well if you put an infinite loop in it yeah, but if you havent edited its unlikely to be that
08:52 chris more likely mysql is jammed
08:52 jt the usual approvch to resolve is to restart the server orweb server
08:53 jt but I don't think it will be the cure on the long run
08:53 chris yeah, thats not so much resolving as postponing :)
08:53 kf chris: I see... you know me ... I always manage to make infinite loops
08:53 kf :)
08:54 magnus kf: and you still think of yourself as a non-developer? ;-)
08:55 kf magnus: I think this is a good reason to think of me as a non-developer! :)
08:56 dagentoob joined #koha
08:56 kf magnus: it took me about a week to get the code right - and all I wanted to do was to show serial enumeration in the item list for item level holds!
08:56 magnus kf: nah, it shows you try. the name does not say anything about how successfull you are :-)
08:57 kf hmpf. :)
08:57 chris jt:
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08:58 jt chris: thanks, I'll try this out
08:59 DaGentooB I am looking at and on my installation if there is more then 1 page of results it lists the first 20 and then the rows for the rest and no data. If I try to go to the next page it lists the first 20 and that is it.
09:00 DaGentooB I was trying to download the latest from GIT but I clicked on the instructions link on the website and my dns said it couldn't find wiki.koha
09:02 chris which website?
09:02 wasabi[…]Control_Using_Git
09:02 chris is the official koha website, and what wasabi just pasted is the wiki :)
09:02 DaGentooB
09:02 wasabi heh, heya chris
09:02 Amit heya wasabi
09:02 chris yeah, dont believe
09:03 wasabi dagentoob: thats the *old* koha website ;)
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09:03 chris its not under the control of the community, but one company, (it used to be community controlled)
09:03 chris_n` joined #koha
09:03 chris so only that one company can update it, and they don't
09:03 DaGentooB oh ok
09:04 DaGentooB ok that makes more sense.
09:04 chris we keep hoping they will return the domain to the community, but they seem more interested in sowing confusion and being hostile instead
09:04 wasabi yes, lots of links on the old website dont work anymore :(
09:04 DaGentooB now... about
09:05 DaGentooB any idea why it would be doing that?
09:05 wasabi and people go there, like you dagentoob, and get confused :(
09:05 kf chris: my coworker has pootle permission problems and I dont see the language list when logged in - something wrong there again?
09:05 DaGentooB I am thinking that the for loop is putting in a row for every result
09:06 DaGentooB does anyone else have this problem?
09:06 chris_n left #koha
09:06 kf chris: ok, correction, I can not login at all and German is empty?
09:07 chris DaGentooB: ive never used the label maker sorry
09:07 wasabi dagentoob:  do you have more than 20 labels?
09:07 chris kf: i hope not, but ill look
09:07 DaGentooB yeah I do
09:07 kf chris: I hope it too, but what I see does not look good
09:07 DaGentooB I am hoping to print about 2000
09:08 chris
09:08 chris seems fine to me
09:08 wasabi dagentoob:  check your log file, while generating your pdf...
09:08 kf can you check my user?
09:08 kf I can't login and resetting the password always tells me my email address does not exist
09:08 DaGentooB it isn't the pdf process that is hanging up... it is the search to add them to the batch
09:09 chris first does that look ok? ie is the german all there?
09:09 kf it does
09:09 kf give me a moment
09:09 chris i can login fine as me
09:09 chris looking at your user now
09:09 wasabi dagentoob you may have UTF characters that dont map to PDF char, in your label-data
09:09 kf I think I am stupid and my browsers autocomplete landed me on
09:09 chris yeah, that wont work :)
09:09 DaGentooB wasabi: the error is No item numbers retrieved for biblio number:
09:10 wasabi is there an item?
09:10 DaGentooB it looks like anything after 20 isn't getting retrieved
09:10 DaGentooB yes I am searching by barcode
09:10 kf ok, now I only have to find out why my coworker can't edit
09:11 wasabi pass, i cant look right now...
09:12 wasabi ... just got back from werk
09:13 DaGentooB $biblioitemnumber isn't getting populated after the first 20
09:13 DaGentooB I get the same 3 errors for each item after 20
09:14 DaGentooB Use of uninitialized value $biblionumber in hash element, Use of uninitialized value $biblionumber in sprintf, and No item numbers retrieved for biblio number:
09:14 wasabi yr bibdata is bad?
09:14 kf chris: sorry! It's all working now, I gave her the permissons for German
09:15 DaGentooB no... for some reason the for loop keeps going through results after the first 20 even though the results for that page have been reduced to 20 at a time
09:15 DaGentooB wonder what would happen if I just set the for loop to 20.... let me try it
09:17 DaGentooB ok that did work.... it now only displays 20 per page....
09:18 DaGentooB but it still won't advance to the next page
09:18 wasabi the form isnt sending a page=2 arg to the script?
09:19 DaGentooB well at the top it lists "Results 61 through 80 of 213"
09:19 DaGentooB so at least that part is going through
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09:20 DaGentooB forgive my perl ignorance but does $iii have something to do with th $i that the for loop is using?
09:21 DaGentooB wait I see
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09:21 DaGentooB ok so $marcresults->[$i]
09:22 DaGentooB is pulling the result number from the for loop
09:22 wasabi theres no current bug for your problem..
09:22 DaGentooB but the for loop is reset to 0 every time you change a page
09:22 wasabi[…]ng&resolution=---
09:23 DaGentooB yeah.... I searched before I came here
09:23 wasabi dagentoob  if  you are keen, you can try to log your problem as a bug...
09:23 wasabi with good screenshots!
09:23 DaGentooB k. I will do it once I get it fixed.
09:23 DaGentooB I think I am on to something here
09:24 wasabi i need to return some late DVD's now... :/
09:24 DaGentooB ok
09:24 wasabi late fees, oww!
09:28 jt I find this very insteresting
09:28 pastebot "jt" at pasted "curious" (9 lines) at
09:29 jt is that mean that wis possible to participate in development iwth very basic programming skill on koha?
09:34 paul_p jt: the koha community is welcoming anyone that want to send a patch ! Of course, your first patches will be examined very carefully & you'll probably have to send them more than once because there will be some changes to do to respect the coding guidelines. But we have 110+ devs, so, feel free to become another one ;-)
09:34 kf jt: it is open source everybody is welcome to help fix bugs and improve koha
09:35 paul_p but we have some librarians that now send patches (about templates or things like that), so it's possible for anyone !
09:35 kf paul_p: I think this sentence is not so nice about librarians ;)
09:36 kf and I am a librarian...
09:36 paul_p oups... right ! I wasn't implying librarians are dummies...
09:36 kf you better not ;)
09:36 paul_p or you'll kick my ass in NZ ? :D
09:37 kf something like that yes :)
09:37 paul_p s/it's possible for anyone/you don't need to be a IT guy/
09:38 kf :)
09:39 paul_p (note that anyone understanding s// immediatly get respect from most developers. Could we consider that as a test ? ;-) )
09:39 paul_p more complex test : s/\/\//\/\/\// :D
09:41 kf regex?
09:45 kf why not test the IT folks for basic library knowledge? :)
09:45 jt lol
09:45 magnus paul_p: if you are not nice to us librarians we will force you to do bungy jumping on the road trip ;-)
09:46 kf magnus: I like how your mind works :)
09:46 magnus hehe
09:47 paul_p wow... /me start to think about cancelling my trip. too dangerous... :D
09:48 kf so hard to be nice to us?
09:48 chris you make it hard by keeping making us deal with MARC :)
09:49 paul_p chris++ !!!!!
09:49 paul_p, I fully agree !!!
09:50 kf marc was not my idea...
09:50 magnus chris: good point. let's come up with a better alternative! ;-)
09:50 chris thats what every librarian says, then they say, but everyone else is using it, so we have too
09:50 chris :)
09:51 * paul_p feel that oneone will move until either LoC, BL or BNF moves.
09:51 paul_p and those 3 old ladies are very slow to move...
09:52 magnus chris, pail_p: sad but true
09:52 paul_p big boats
09:52 magnus paul_p: and they seem to be preoccupied with RDA...
09:52 kf Germany had MAB and is moving to MARC
09:52 kf ...
09:53 magnus a working prototype of an alternative approach would be sooo good
09:53 kf lunch time - bbl
09:53 * magnus wishes someone would try ripping marc out of e.g. koha and replacing it with e.g. RDF, as a research project
09:54 magnus kf: MAB?
09:54 kf German bibliographic format
09:54 kf MAB2 to be more correct
09:54 kf it's still widely used around here
09:54 chris yeah, step backwards to go from MAB to MARC
09:55 kf the problem you have to solve is import - map the new format to marc and all others so you can get data from everywhere
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09:55 chris and then a step into UTTER MADNESS to wedge RDA into MARC
09:55 kf they managed to get a lot of the mab things into marc21
09:55 chris i mean AARC2 was complicated enough
09:55 chris RDA is just mental
09:55 kf does not make my life easier
09:55 kf ok, coworkers waiting - see you later
09:55 magnus and RD is closed
09:55 chris seriously, i think ppl forget the entire point of a library system
09:55 magnus have a nice lunch, kf
09:56 magnus s/RD/RDA/
09:56 chris adding more unused data to the record isnt going to make the opac work better
09:59 magnus chris: sounds logical to me!
10:05 * magnus is off for lunch
10:27 kf back
10:49 kf is it ok to change the text under the koha logo? want to change Open-Source integrated library system to the german translation (without integrated) Open-Source-Bibliothekssystem
10:49 kf found the .psd file in git :)
10:54 Oak joined #koha
11:03 magnus kf: i did the same thing for some koha posters i made earlier this year. i don't think nicomo saw any problems with it, at least
11:04 magnus @las seen nicomo
11:04 munin magnus: Error: "las" is not a valid command.
11:05 magnus @last seen nicomo
11:05 munin magnus: (last [--{from,in,on,with,without,regexp} <value>] [--nolimit]) -- Returns the last message matching the given criteria. --from requires a nick from whom the message came; --in requires a channel the message was sent to; --on requires a network the message was sent on; --with requires some string that had to be in the message; --regexp requires a regular expression the message must match; --nolimit (1 more message)
11:05 magnus @lastseen nicomo
11:05 munin magnus: Error: "lastseen" is not a valid command.
11:05 magnus @seen nicomo
11:05 munin magnus: nicomo was last seen in #koha 13 weeks, 6 days, 4 hours, 50 minutes, and 13 seconds ago: <nicomo> hi Amit_G
11:06 Amit hi nicomo
11:06 Amit @seen chris
11:06 munin Amit: chris was last seen in #koha 1 hour, 9 minutes, and 44 seconds ago: <chris> adding more unused data to the record isnt going to make the opac work better
11:07 Amit @seen brendan
11:07 munin Amit: brendan was last seen in #koha 7 hours, 44 minutes, and 25 seconds ago: <brendan> hi Amit
11:07 Amit @seen amit
11:07 munin Amit: amit was last seen in #koha 5 seconds ago: <Amit> @seen brendan
11:07 Amit @seen chris
11:07 munin Amit: chris was last seen in #koha 1 hour, 10 minutes, and 53 seconds ago: <chris> adding more unused data to the record isnt going to make the opac work better
11:07 Amit @seen amit
11:07 munin Amit: amit was last seen in #koha 4 seconds ago: <Amit> @seen chris
11:20 kf magnus: I think nicomo is no longer at biblibre
11:20 magnus kf: i know, i was just curious about how long he has been away... ;-)
11:20 kf ah
11:21 kf Integriertes Open-Source-Bibliothekssystem is too long
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11:38 magnus kf: i used something like "der freie Bibliothekssystem" (in norwegian)
11:39 kf das :)
11:39 kf magnus: I think open-source-bibliotheksystem has the important points :)
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11:48 greenmang hello friends... can anybody suggest me an api or z3950 server which can make available Major Journals?
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12:19 kf hi owen
12:19 owen Hi kf
12:22 magnus greenmang: how about LOC?
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12:57 * magnus tries to remember if there are more tables than sessions and zebraqueue that does not usually need to be in a mysqldump
13:01 * owen wonders about the labels* and creator* tables ending with _tmp
13:03 * kf wonders if she will ever finish the text for the new Koha flyer
13:05 * owen wonders if everything in #koha today will be in interior monologue
13:05 * jwagner thinks it probably will be....
13:06 * magnus agrees
13:07 * magnus cant't see any *_tmp tables, just tmp_holdsqueue
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13:08 tcohen hi, should we refactor rebuild_(no)zebra as a library?
13:10 tcohen that way we could avoid the spawning of a new perl process
13:10 tcohen when implementing a service that substitutes
13:11 tcohen the reindexing process previously feaured by the (flawed) zebraqueue
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13:17 tcohen hi, should we refactor rebuild_(no)zebra as a library?
13:17 tcohen that way we could avoid the spawning of a new perl process
13:17 tcohen when implementing a service that substitutes
13:17 tcohen the reindexing process previously feaured by the (flawed)
13:17 tcohen zebraqueue
13:17 owen We heard you the first time tcohen :)
13:18 tcohen oewn: oh, sorry I had a hard lock of my computer and was not sure
13:18 owen Perhaps an email to the developers list would be better?
13:18 owen There doesn't seem to be anyone here with an opinion :)
13:18 tcohen too much perl processes reindexing here, hehe
13:18 tcohen ok!
13:19 * magnus gotta run
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13:24 jcamins_a is now known as jcamins
13:25 jcamins Good morning, #koha
13:27 tcohen jcamins: hi
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13:54 kf jcamins: hi :)
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13:57 * jcamins doesn't understand what's special about question marks in authority records. :(
13:57 * kf whispers: fudge...
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13:57 chris_n` owen: I just commented on your comment on bug 3523, but bugzilla informed me that it did not send you an email
13:57 munin Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=3523 normal, P5, ---, cnighswonger, NEW, Menu of existing lists limited to 10
13:57 chris_n` is now known as chris_n
13:57 chris_n fwiw
13:59 owen Thanks chris_n, I'm still a little confused about how Bugzilla decides when to send me a message
13:59 owen I don't understand your idea about a list of lists
13:59 chris_n maybe its a bug... :-Z
13:59 profmathe hi all
14:00 chris_n I 'm thinking of some sort of drop-down which would have a scroll bar on one side
14:01 chris_n allowing all lists to be available but only 10 or so viewable in the dropdown at once... make sense?
14:01 * chris_n recalls seeing such a creature once, but can't remember where
14:01 owen And then a link or control to load the next set of lists?
14:02 chris_n probably so, to avoid the use of js
14:02 pastebot "jcamins" at pasted "Jared's fudge recipe" (13 lines) at
14:03 chris_n owen: but since we can't use ajax stuff in opac, it might not be doable in a nice and clean way
14:04 jcamins kf: unfortunately I use both metric and Imperial measurements. :(
14:04 owen Can't use ajax stuff in the opac?
14:04 jcamins chris_n: why can't we use ajax in the OPAC?
14:04 chris_n I thought we wanted to avoid things that had the potential to cause accessibility problems?
14:05 owen Sure, but it shouldn't keep us from adding features which are useful
14:05 owen We just need to back them up with accessible fallbacks
14:08 owen The trouble is the accessible fallbacks aren't as fun to develop
14:09 owen What about keeping the 10 item limit in the popup, but offer a link to "show all" ?
14:09 owen Or am I underestimating the number of lists some patrons might have?
14:10 owen For the "show all" view we could use a list of items with radio buttons instead of a <select>
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14:11 profmathe if anyone has time for 2 quick new user questions that i promise i researched first, i'd really appreciate it...
14:11 wizzyrea jcamins: that is made of win
14:11 wizzyrea we always have time :)
14:11 profmathe sweet
14:11 profmathe first one's easy: is my dns borked or is down?
14:12 owen
14:12 profmathe ah
14:12 profmathe broken link!
14:12 profmathe thx on that one
14:12 owen PTFS/Liblime uses for their own purposes
14:12 kf jcamins: I can improvise
14:12 jcamins wizzyrea: I'm glad you like it.
14:13 profmathe second one i hope will be easy: in a fresh install, what would call nullmailer once a minute and how do i configure it?  i don't see any MTA options in the admin console
14:13 profmathe i've killed my forwards in nullmailer so my mail admin doesn't shoot me but i'd actually like it to work
14:14 wizzyrea probably the holds notices?
14:14 profmathe nothing in catalog, no patrons, brand new install...
14:15 wizzyrea i'm not sure, sorry
14:15 profmathe no prob
14:15 wizzyrea we always have time, not always the answer :/
14:15 profmathe i might try just installing postfix and forwarding to that
14:15 profmathe bad form to run home to the product i'm most familiar with, but hey
14:16 briceSanc hi koha !
14:16 profmathe just odd that there seems to be no mail option config in the console
14:16 jcamins Can someone confirm that bug 5155 isn't just me doing something dumb?
14:16 munin Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=5155 major, P5, ---, gmcharlt, NEW, Question marks cause problems for BiblioAddsAuthorities
14:16 wizzyrea nah, most people would probably say that postfix is the mailer of choice
14:16 profmathe well anyway thank you all very much
14:16 wizzyrea no, special characters bork lots of stuff :(
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14:16 chris_n owen: we could do that; along the ajax lines I was thinking of a call back function tied to a "Next 10" sort of link to refresh just the list
14:16 kf jcamins: thx for the recipe!
14:17 profmathe i'll go search the real wiki and get back if i learn anything useful :)
14:17 chris_n I think that we could reasonably count on some patrons having 20-30 lists
14:18 chris_n or at least the accumulation of that many between private/public/open lists
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14:18 jcamins kf: you're welcome.
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14:22 kf wb druthb
14:22 druthb thanx!
14:22 jcamins My bug list keeps growing. :(
14:23 kf jcamins: I know that feeling... some days are like everything you touch is falling apart
14:28 nengard morning all
14:28 nengard i got to start my day by having a tooth drilled!! everything is up hill from there
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14:40 kf1 hi cfouts and brendan
14:41 brendan hi kf1
14:41 kf1 1?
14:41 kf1 hm
14:42 kf1 I have a clone
14:42 kf left #koha
14:42 cfouts good morning
14:45 kf1 is now known as kf
14:45 kf better
14:46 * druthb thinks two kfs, or even a kf and a cait, would be fun to have around!
14:46 kf :)
14:49 jwagner Don't we already have a kf and a cait?  The more the better, of course....
14:49 owen It strange, though, we never see them together in the same room... Hmmm....
14:50 brendan it's like clark kent and superman
14:50 kf and who is who? :)
14:50 jcamins Only both have super powers.
14:50 * kf blushes
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14:56 cfouts_ is now known as cfouts
15:05 chris_n heya cfouts
15:08 cfouts howdy
15:09 brendan hey there chris_n
15:11 chris_n hey brendan
15:11 * chris_n is shuffling server hardware today
15:12 * kf hides under her desk again
15:13 * jwagner proposes a new Koha module -- the official Sysadmin/Developer Desk under which we can all hide when needed.
15:13 * chris_n feels like tossing some of it into the big pond ;-)
15:14 * brendan according to jwagner and owen - it's inner-monolog day :)
15:15 * kf thinks this new module would lead to much progress on different other projects
15:15 kf like the koha cookie flavor :)
15:17 * jcamins thinks all successful open source projects need their own cookie and fudge flavors
15:18 jwagner jcamins, don't forget the ice cream!
15:18 jcamins jwagner: I live in NYC, so I don't have space for an ice cream maker. ;)
15:18 owen Wait--there's an official koha cookie flavor?
15:18 jcamins We're working on it.
15:19 owen Is there a git repo for it? :)
15:19 jcamins Hm, good point.
15:20 jwagner Is there an RFC or bugzilla entry for it?
15:27 jcamins What component should it be filed under?
15:28 wizzyrea definitely enhancement
15:28 wizzyrea I am always enhanced by cookies.
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15:29 jwagner Many of us are.  Maybe we also need an official Koha diet....
15:29 rhcl Double hamburger with cheese
15:29 rhcl lettuce, tomato pickle onion heavy on the spicy mustard
15:29 jcamins Yeah, that's definitely the severity, but should it be "Architecture," "Developer documentation," "Holidays," "Tools," "Websites," or something else?
15:32 jwagner I'd say Developer Documentation, myself.  At least it might inspire me to _do_ some documentation....
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15:36 jcamins Bug 5158
15:36 munin Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=5158 enhancement, P5, ---, camins, ASSIGNED, Koha needs its own cookie, ice cream, and fudge flavors
15:36 kf or developer motivation
15:44 owen How's this for motivation? Anyone want to guess how many "FIXME's" there are in the Koha code?
15:44 brendan 1,250 ?
15:45 kf 2364
15:45 owen Luckily you're both too high
15:45 owen My search found 818
15:46 owen (excluding JS)
15:47 owen 251 of those are "#use warnings; FIXME - Bug 2505"
15:47 munin Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=2505 major, P3, ---, gmcharlt, NEW, enable Perl warnings in all modules and scripts
15:48 jwagner is now known as jwag_mtg
15:49 owen I like "FIXME: No Such thing."
15:49 owen and "FIXME - this is cheating on two levels"
15:49 wizzyrea ok, is it the circulation history
15:49 wizzyrea or the reading history
15:49 * wizzyrea likes consistency in labels
15:50 owen I vote "checkout history"
15:50 wizzyrea it's reading history in the opac and in the header in the staff client
15:50 wizzyrea but the tab says "circulation history"
15:52 kf we use Ausleihhistorie in German, that would be checkout history
15:53 wizzyrea I can go with that, I just want them to all be the same
15:54 wizzyrea reading history is more patron friendly
15:54 wizzyrea circulation history is a little librarianish
15:54 wizzyrea checkout history probably would make sense to both
15:54 owen checkout history is materials-agnostic
15:54 wizzyrea yes, and I think that makes it the winning choice
15:54 wizzyrea ok, so tell me
15:54 wizzyrea I have a workflow problem
15:54 wizzyrea (git workflow)
15:55 wizzyrea am I supposed to make one change then commit, or make several related changes then commit?
15:55 wizzyrea < has had this burning question for a while
15:55 owen The real question is when should you submit the patch
15:56 owen Because you can commit as many times as you want and then squash all the commits together for one patch
15:56 owen The key is to limit your changes to one very specific feature or bug fix
15:56 owen But within that scope you can commit many times
15:57 wizzyrea oh oh
15:57 wizzyrea I need to know how to do that
15:57 wizzyrea squashing
15:57 wizzyrea owen you'll be pleased to know that I'm using your workflow :P
15:57 owen git rebase -i origin
15:58 wizzyrea ah ok that's what that does
15:58 owen That will show you a list of your commits
15:58 owen Keep the first one as "pick" and the rest as "s" (for squash)
15:58 owen You'll be given the opportunity to edit the commit message for the resulting squashed commit
15:58 wizzyrea omg that would have saved me yesterday
15:59 wizzyrea >.<
15:59 owen It took me too long to learn that one myself. It makes life much easier.
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16:03 cfouts in my topic branches I commit after even relatively tiny changes, then squash, just as owen describes.
16:03 cfouts hard to over-commit using that technique
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16:04 owen We defy stereotypes: We're not afraid of commitment!
16:04 wizzyrea lol
16:04 * wizzyrea totally is, in this one case.
16:05 wizzyrea but I will learn
16:07 kf will try to squash my next patch :)
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16:21 wizzyrea ok
16:22 wizzyrea another question
16:22 wizzyrea do you like this change?
16:22 wizzyrea
16:22 wizzyrea is it helpful to have both current and holding on the detail page?
16:22 wizzyrea (our libraries think it is)
16:22 wizzyrea (and they prefer the shortcodes)
16:22 jwag_mtg is now known as jwagner
16:23 jwagner @quote add <owen> We defy stereotypes: We're not afraid of commitment!
16:23 munin jwagner: The operation succeeded.  Quote #89 added.
16:24 owen +1 wizzyrea
16:24 wizzyrea I was thinking about it
16:24 jwagner wizzyrea, the earlier discussion on Bug 3262 was mixed, and leaned toward having a syspref control which appeared.
16:24 owen I don't really have an opinion about the code vs. full name question though
16:24 munin Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=3262 enhancement, P5, ---, gmcharlt, NEW, OPAC needs syspref to show homebranch instead of current location on detail page
16:25 jwagner I think it could be reframed so that the syspref(s) controlled whether the separate columns appeared so you could have both if you wanted.
16:25 owen I'd rather show both than have a syspref at all
16:25 wizzyrea ^^ and he was the main detractor
16:25 wizzyrea in that discussion
16:25 jwagner code vs full name I think should be a syspref, though -- a lot of sites won't recognize their codes
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16:26 jwagner I'm fine with having both show by default so long as the template is set up properly so you could hide one or the other with jquery
16:26 wizzyrea cool beans. I think it's a better solution than a single column
16:26 wizzyrea and, I would need help with the syspref part for the short vs. long codes
16:26 jwagner And are you talking the same solution for both staff and OPAC view?
16:27 wizzyrea no, I think the OPAC only needs to show one column
16:27 wizzyrea because patrons don't need to know where it is
16:27 wizzyrea that one probably should be a syspref
16:27 wizzyrea but I think it should default to home branch
16:27 wizzyrea owen I think disagrees with that, at least according to the bug
16:27 jwagner wizzyrea, I was looking at this one last week & had some ideas on it, but I wanted to talk to our developers.  We could continue that discussion on the codes/description part
16:28 jwagner When I looked at the code, the same part of controls & feeds item data to both staff & OPAC search, so doing different settings would get a little involved.
16:28 kf I vote for description - we use isil as branch code, it's really ugly :)
16:28 kf ok, time to go home for me - my alter ego will be back later :)
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16:29 owen Our patrons want to know where the book *is*, not where it should be.
16:29 owen So if you're going to show only one column in the OPAC and we disagree about which one it is, then it should be a syspref
16:30 wizzyrea so yea that should be a pref
16:30 wizzyrea so in your library, a book can be shelved in any library?
16:30 wizzyrea libraries
16:30 jwagner And that's where it got complicated -- you'd have to separate out the code in depending on whether the search was for staff or OPAC.
16:31 jwagner (always assuming I'm reading that section of code right)
16:31 owen wizzyrea: Theoretically
16:32 owen wizzyrea: It's complicated by the fact that automatic transfers don't work properly (i.e. checking in something at the wrong branch and having it be transferred automatically)
16:32 wizzyrea it shouldn't matter to the search what you show on the detail page
16:33 jwagner During that part of is where it's building the item data, though -- filling in the fields for location, itype, etc.
16:33 wizzyrea gotya
16:33 jwagner So to change what gets filled in for branch, you need to specify there
16:34 wizzyrea our most immediate problem re: locations would be solved by the dual columns
16:34 wizzyrea incidentally
16:34 wizzyrea re: shortcode
16:34 wizzyrea vs. longcode
16:34 wizzyrea owen maybe you can answer this
16:35 wizzyrea how do you tell the code which to grab?
16:35 wizzyrea I looked at it and couldn't figure it out
16:35 wizzyrea mental map failure.
16:36 wizzyrea dual columns in the intranet, I mean
16:36 wizzyrea the opac problem is one we've lived with for a long time
16:38 owen I don't understand the question wizzyrea
16:40 jwagner I think I'm back at the same place I was looking at last week, in -- current head, line 1541 -- it's doing a check for HomeOrHoldingBranch
16:40 * owen has to run. bbl
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16:40 * jwagner should keep questionable code snippets for future reference instead of having to look for them again :-(
16:41 wizzyrea I couldn't find where those template variables were defined
16:41 wizzyrea to compare how they are being generated
16:42 jwagner which variable(s)?
16:42 wizzyrea homebranch vs holdingbranch
16:42 wizzyrea is there a good tool to help with that kind of thing?
16:42 * wizzyrea pulls out all of the nub questions
16:43 jwagner from, # set item's branch name, use HomeOrHoldingBranch syspref first, fall back to the other one -- whatever is defined in the syspref is going to get set as the homebranch for search results/display
16:43 jwagner If I'm reading it correctly
16:45 jwagner Which brings up another question I was troubleshooting last night.  The old syspref description for HomeOrHoldingBranch implies it's only used with Independent Branches:
16:45 jwagner Used by Circulation to determine which branch of an item to check with independent branches on, and by search to determine which branch to choose for availability
16:45 wizzyrea mm no
16:45 wizzyrea it has applications for multibranch non independent too
16:45 wizzyrea we are non-indy
16:45 jwagner But it affects transfers when Independent Branches isn't on, and is affecting branch display in searching as above
16:46 jwagner Syspref description probably needs to be amplified/clarified, then.
16:46 wizzyrea well that's probably wrong behavior :/
16:46 wizzyrea as it reads, it should only affect using the circ/fines rules
16:46 wizzyrea if it does more than that either needs to be documented, or the purpose of the syspref changed.
16:47 wizzyrea *it either
16:47 wizzyrea but yea, it's apparently a big mess
16:47 jwagner I think I'll open a bugzilla on that problem
16:48 wizzyrea the 3.2 text is as follows: Use the checkout and fines rules of
16:48 wizzyrea NOTE: This is older than CircControl, but used by some parts of Koha. It will be removed soon.
16:49 wizzyrea so there may be plans to kill it off.
16:51 jwagner I saw that too.  Am much puzzled.
16:51 wizzyrea in regards to where the template variables are generated...
16:52 wizzyrea you think it's in C4:Search?
16:52 wizzyrea (which seems TOTALLY far out to me, but I will accept it)
16:53 jwagner Bug 5159
16:53 munin Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=5159 normal, P5, ---, kyle.m.hall, NEW, HomeOrHoldingBranch syspref description misleading
16:53 jwagner wizzyrea, both the opac & staff search scripts call the same C4:Search routine
16:54 * jwagner is drooling -- lunch just got delivered, so I'm off to eat it :-)
16:54 jwagner is now known as jwag_lunc
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17:25 CGI194 helo?
17:26 wizzyrea <tap tap tap> is this thing on?
17:26 wizzyrea oh hai
17:26 CGI194 how are u?
17:26 wizzyrea well enough, and you?
17:26 CGI194 fine!
17:27 CGI194 i'am new to this room
17:28 wizzyrea everybody starts somewhere
17:28 CGI194 yap!
17:28 CGI194 u'r from?
17:29 wizzyrea did you have a question about Koha?
17:29 CGI194 ya
17:30 CGI194 i'am on the way to integrate koha with ldap so do u have an idea if so pls help?
17:30 wizzyrea I don't, sorry. There might be others that can help
17:30 CGI194 ok thank u!
17:31 reva hi all, I am looking for answers to a couple of questions: how do you set up where you can tell who worked on a bib record in koha? and what is the command line phrase (with exact syntax) for bulkimporting marc authority files? jcamins: (FYI)-You may recall I had an issue with publisher name (260 $b) showing as links. On the OPAC side it does not show as links, only on the staff side. It is so even in the liblime demo (which makes m
17:32 jcamins reva: the end of your message got cut off.
17:33 jcamins In answer to your first question, take a look at the Logs tab under sysprefs.
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17:34 reva Oh I was just saying that the publisher's name showing as a link only on the staff side, not in OPAC; so I guess it is alright. But the place of publication is not showing in the OPAC (remember you said it was your customization; well it seems to be mine too; only I did not do the customizing:)
17:34 reva Ok, I will look in the logs now.
17:35 jcamins reva: it's possible that the location has never shown up, and I just never noticed, because that matched my desired behavior.
17:35 jcamins I've never imported authority records, but perhaps someone else can advise you.
17:35 reva jcamins: that is okay then. I mean it may not be strict AACR2, but that is ok.
17:36 Amanu can any body help me on how to integrate koha with openldap ?
17:36 * wizzyrea tries to raise chris_n for that question
17:37 jcamins Amanu: I believe some people have done this... did you check the mailing list archives?
17:37 reva ok, maybe chris: or chirs_n or wizzyrea?: how do I import into Koha an authority record I have saved from LC?
17:38 wizzyrea i'm sorry I don't know
17:38 Amanu jcamins: no ihaven't!
17:39 wizzyrea also
17:39 wizzyrea you may be interested to know that isn't the official webpage
17:39 wizzyrea the official website is at
17:40 reva wizzyrea: I thought that is what the bulkimportauthority command was for? (I have never had to deal with authorities and technology before.)
17:42 jcamins reva: I gather the instructions in the script didn't work?
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17:43 jcamins I've never tried because you can only download authority records one at a time from LC. Much less trouble to just enter authorities myself.
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17:45 reva jcamins: I am sorry I did not get what script you are referring to. Also, cataloguing log is turned to ON under sys preferences. So would the Log file be in the directory and I can simply read it as a text file?
17:45 jcamins reva: under Tools (in the staff client) is the log viewer.
17:46 jcamins There is a script called misc/migration_tools/
17:46 jcamins I have never used it, but I think it is for importing authorities. Isn't that what you're trying to use?
17:47 reva jcamins: that is what I have also been doing, creating my own? But I thought you could save all the LC authority files (which we got one at a time) together and stage and import it into Koha, no?
17:47 jcamins reva: no, you can only download one authority record at a time.
17:47 jcamins It's very painful.
17:48 jcamins Or did you find a way to download multiple authority records from LC?
17:49 reva jcamins: I knew that limitation with LC authority files. But can you not append them all in a single file and import them into Koha?
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17:49 jcamins I have no idea.
17:49 wizzyrea is now known as wizzy_awa
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17:49 jcamins Maybe. But you'd still have to manually download each one.
17:50 reva jecamins: I agree, LC is below par with this end of their catalog.
17:51 zen am doing koha bulk import everything is fine except  it can't display copy number! is there anyone who can help me?
17:52 reva jcamins: I do not that for a fact either; I was just asking because in Unix you can append files. But I do not know if in the .mrc (is that the extension for a MARC file?) can be handled the same way.
17:53 reva oh zen: can you tell me how you do bulk import? have you done it with authority files? or only bib records?
17:53 jcamins I think probably it would be possible, because the MARC format is stream-oriented, but I have never tried.
17:53 jcamins reva: try running the script without any arguments.
17:53 jcamins It will give you instructions.
17:54 zen only bib records!
17:54 jcamins You can also try using with a -a argument.
17:54 reva jcamins: I will give it a go. Also is the Log file a txt file?
17:54 jcamins (instead of -b)
17:54 jcamins I don't think so. I think maybe it's stored in the database.
17:54 reva jcamins: I meant I will give the script a go.
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17:56 reva So where exactly would I look for the operator id (id of staff who created/edited) in a record?
17:57 cait hi #koha
17:59 reva what is the -b parameter for? (I kind of guess the -a is for all.)
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18:00 jcamins reva: I think -b is bibliographic and -a is authority
18:00 jcamins Hi cait
18:00 jcamins It's the same as the patron id.
18:00 cait hi jcamins
18:01 reva ok jcamins: -a is for authority, dah:0
18:02 reva ok, so that is helpful in the training drills so that I address remarks to the correct staff-student.
18:02 cait jcamins: i think we have a patch somewhere to show place of publicaton in opac
18:02 cait not sure I send it, but I am sure it was done for our library
18:04 reva cait: how would I patch (I mean download and inject it into Koha)? Maybe you can find out from your library and let me know, please.
18:05 cait reva: I can not find out before tomorrow - I am at home now and have limited access to our installations and my files
18:05 cait but its quite easy
18:06 reva cait: I was not meaning immediately; but may be even next week.
18:06 cait you only need to add a subfield to the xslt
18:06 cait will check for the patch
18:07 reva oh, I think I understand. is it the xsltdisplay found in the OPAC?
18:08 reva cait: I will check back with you next week. Thanks.
18:08 wizzy_awa is now known as wizzyrea
18:08 jcamins It will be in MARC21slim2OPACDetails.xsl.
18:08 cait ok :) I have some xslt things scheduled for next week
18:09 cait dinner time
18:10 reva Thanks jcamins: and cait: for your help; bye for now.
18:14 wizzyrea hmm do we need to add a "browser" field in our bugzilla
18:14 wizzyrea now that we have at least 3 very popular browsers in use with koha?
18:15 jcamins Hm, that would make sense.
18:15 jcamins I'm surprised Bugzilla doesn't provide that automatically.
18:15 wizzyrea we have an "OS" dropdown
18:16 tcohen how'd you call a rebuild_zebra library?
18:16 tcohen C4::Catalog::Rebuild?
18:16 owen There's a browser compatibility component
18:18 jcamins owen: yeah, but if how can you tell if you're encountering a browser compatibility problem or a problem in, e.g., the cataloging interface?
18:18 jcamins Errr... please disregard the extra "if".
18:18 owen True
18:18 wizzyrea it would help you replicate too
18:18 wizzyrea to know what they were using
18:19 wizzyrea er
18:19 wizzyrea you = one
18:19 wizzyrea not just you of course
18:19 jcamins I can no longer access my catalog from Firefox, so I could easily misidentify a compatibility bug as a functionality bug.
18:20 wizzyrea even if it's something like "I'm using IE and I can't..." and the answer is "use firefox," at least we'll have that as a diagnostic tool.
18:21 wizzyrea gmcharlt? master of the bugzilla?
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18:26 jcamins Would other libraries find it useful if Koha optionally checked that each item had a unique location/call#/copy#?
18:29 ebegin jcamins, it's my understanding that call# doesn't have to be unique... but i may be wrong, i'm not a librarian :)
18:29 wizzyrea yea, we don't have unique call numbers
18:31 jcamins ebegin: you are completely correct. However, I would like to know when I'm assigning a duplicate call number.
18:31 jcamins I was thinking of something that added a message after you created an item "this call number is a duplicate."
18:31 wizzyrea something like that would almost certainly have to be optional
18:31 jcamins Controlled by a syspref, obviously.
18:34 jcamins It's not a feature so urgent that I'm going to do anything about it right now, I was just wondering if anyone else would find it useful.
18:36 ebegin jcamins, meanwhile, you could create an SQL report stating your duplicate call numbers...
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18:37 jcamins ebegin: ooh, I guess I could do that, couldn't I?
18:37 jcamins Thanks!
18:39 ebegin np :)
18:46 ebegin FROM `items`
18:46 ebegin GROUP BY itemcallnumber
18:46 ebegin HAVING COUNT( biblionumber ) >1
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18:59 chris morning
18:59 wizzyrea mornin
19:00 cait hi chris
19:04 jcamins ebegin++
19:04 jcamins # for pointing out that Koha already provided a solution to my problem
19:10 wizzyrea is there some trick to modifying the template includes? I made a change and it's not being reflected and It's quite flummoxing to me
19:10 owen Are you sure you're modifying the right template? You haven't switched languages by mistake have you?
19:11 wizzyrea well I will double check that
19:11 wizzyrea but I don't think so
19:11 owen It wouldn't happen unless you'd installed translations for testing
19:11 wizzyrea no, it's not the language
19:11 wizzyrea it's in
19:11 wizzyrea I can't change the text from "Circulation history" to Checkout History
19:11 wizzyrea or
19:11 wizzyrea rather
19:12 wizzyrea it's changed, but it's not reflected
19:12 wizzyrea I've cleared my cache
19:12 wizzyrea idk what's left to do
19:12 owen Are you sure there's not also a
19:12 wizzyrea well
19:12 * owen is away from his VM
19:12 wizzyrea that is a very good point
19:13 wizzyrea no, I don't think there is
19:13 wizzyrea patron-search-box, patron-search, patron-toolbar
19:13 wizzyrea but is what's being included in the tmpl I'm looking at (readingrec.tmpl)
19:13 ebegin wizzyrea, make sure you are modifying the right version.  Installed dir vs source dir (depending of your install type)
19:14 wizzyrea maybe circ-menu?
19:14 wizzyrea ebegin: also a good idea, i'm pretty sure I'm working in the live dir
19:14 wizzyrea it's a dev install
19:14 wizzyrea since changes I made to other templates have been reflected
19:14 owen Yeah,
19:14 ebegin ok, so it's the live dir then ;)
19:15 wizzyrea let me look at circ-menu
19:16 wizzyrea owen++ I think that's it
19:16 wizzyrea thank you, whew, that was it
19:16 wizzyrea I thought I was losing my mind
19:16 wizzyrea aside, I also can't read properly
19:16 wizzyrea lol
19:17 owen At one time there were good reasons for having the two includes. I'm not sure if there still are.
19:18 wizzyrea hmm
19:18 wizzyrea why do we have both messaging and notices?
19:18 * wizzyrea is picking up lots of rocks today
19:18 wizzyrea ooh! worms!
19:19 cait wizzyra: does notices still show all borrower's messages instead only those of the borrower account open?
19:19 wizzyrea no, it shows only the ones sent to me
19:19 wizzyrea or the active patron
19:19 cait ah cool
19:19 owen Bug 3941
19:19 munin Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=3941 major, P5, ---, gmcharlt, NEW, Notices Tab on Patron Records Showing All Msgs
19:20 wizzyrea perhaps we should close that bug, but the original question stands: why both tabs?
19:21 wizzyrea notices shows everything messaging does, and more
19:22 * owen saw that bug today but has no notices or messages in his test system
19:22 wizzyrea notices:
19:23 wizzyrea er, messaging
19:24 cait wizzyrea: I am ot sure it shows all
19:24 wizzyrea notices:
19:24 wizzyrea gah
19:24 wizzyrea
19:25 cait hm, you are right, but messaging is a bit better to look at
19:25 wizzyrea well, it depends on what you define as better
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19:25 cait I would like the text to show in a sepaarate window and formatted
19:25 wizzyrea you mean the content
19:26 cait ah sorry, yes
19:26 wizzyrea no need to apologize, I was just clarifying
19:26 wizzyrea I must have been too tired to remember to return the no cry sleep solution lol
19:27 cait witout formatting it's hard to tell which items were in the notice
19:27 cait and with formatting the table gets too big
19:27 wizzyrea tis true
19:27 owen So both tabs show basically the same info?
19:27 wizzyrea I don't have a preference really, I'm just wondering why ^^
19:27 wizzyrea yea
19:27 wizzyrea they appear to
19:27 wizzyrea just one more succinctly than the other
19:28 wizzyrea I rather like the messaging view
19:28 owen weird
19:28 wizzyrea I mean (dangit) the notices view
19:28 cait it would be better if there was just another column in link in the messaging view to show the content
19:28 cait ah, now you are confusing me :)
19:28 wizzyrea I like the verbosity of the notices view
19:29 wizzyrea it's not like you're going to use that to know what they had checked out, that's what checkout history is for
19:29 wizzyrea but you would use it to see what notice they got when they claim to have returned an item
19:29 wizzyrea and got a notice anyway
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19:30 wizzyrea (we have seen that happen when a person returns an item after library hours, then gets the overdue message because their item is in the book drop when the overdues are generated. Boy are they irate.)
19:31 wizzyrea idk, I'd like to get rid of one of them because they are redundant
19:31 wizzyrea but I'm not sure which
19:31 owen We don't even charge fines and patrons are still irate about it.
19:31 wizzyrea and if they serve separate purposes
19:31 wizzyrea yea, not many of our libraries charge fines either
19:31 wizzyrea it just turns out people really don't like getting email
19:32 nengard joined #koha
19:32 wizzyrea I think I'll send something to the dev list about it
19:32 wizzyrea "uh, what's this about?"
19:32 cait our libraries all charge fines
19:32 cait notices are important
19:33 jwagner left #koha
19:33 cait I have to link the fine to the notice (I know, only we want that...) so i like messaging but stilll think the display would look better with a way to see the formatted notice :)
19:33 owen wizzyrea: I'd be curious what git-blame says about those tabs. It might indicate the right hand not knowing what the left is doing
19:33 wizzyrea ah, true
19:35 wizzyrea ...hdl last touched both tabs
19:35 wizzyrea august last year
19:36 cait it's been like that for a long time
19:36 wizzyrea in the same commit, no less
19:36 cait I think there is bug somewhere
19:45 wizzyrea ok well I"m not going to touch them :P
19:48 owen This is interesting. Git says that at one point someone made a commit to remove one of them
19:48 owen "members/ and members/ are doing the same thing"
19:49 cait wizzy: meant bug report, sorry, getting late
19:49 owen The commit was reverted, "Should remove members/ instead"
19:49 wizzyrea weird
19:49 owen ...but obviously no one went back and actually removed
19:49 wizzyrea so, whoever it was never got back to removing
19:49 wizzyrea jinx
19:50 wizzyrea either way, the various names for reading history have all been changed to "checkout history"
19:50 wizzyrea :P
19:53 owen hdl's comment "should remove members/ instead" refers to the more verbose version right?
19:53 wizzyrea un moment
19:53 wizzyrea yes
19:53 wizzyrea I had to double check.
19:54 wizzyrea dk what's better, seeing the text of the notice or only being able to say that it was sent
19:54 owen Isn't more information usually better?
19:54 wizzyrea well that's what I thought
19:55 wizzyrea spose we could improve it
19:55 wizzyrea a little of that js trickery that makes a link to "show contents of this notice"
19:55 wizzyrea and expands it
19:55 wizzyrea might be nice
19:56 owen So *is* Bug 3941 fixed?
19:56 munin Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=3941 major, P5, ---, gmcharlt, NEW, Notices Tab on Patron Records Showing All Msgs
19:56 chris And then I had to translate it to circulation history
19:56 wizzyrea we took a vote earlier >.>
19:56 chris Checkout is what you do at hotels
19:57 * chris was reminded of this onsite in christchurch yesterday
19:57 wizzyrea so does your Check Out tab say "circulate"
19:57 chris When 2 of the librarians commented
19:58 chris Issue
19:58 wizzyrea or "Issue"
19:58 chris And return
19:58 wizzyrea aha, so it should be "Issuing History"
19:58 chris Circulation works fine too
19:58 owen Chris, when you're release manager you can decree that we change them all back! ;)
19:58 wizzyrea ^^
19:58 * cait imagines books as visitors in the library hotel
19:59 wizzyrea that was very poetic, cait
19:59 cait ;)
19:59 wizzyrea really, they'd rather be traveling
19:59 wizzyrea travelling
19:59 owen travellling
19:59 chris Translating works fine
20:00 chris As long as people don't keep changing their minds
20:00 chris Its re re re translating that gets old
20:00 wizzyrea well, these 3 places are now all the same
20:01 wizzyrea 3 places, and 3 different names
20:01 chris And quit it with the z :)
20:01 chris Luckily I can regex those out
20:02 chris If its not zo or ze its an s :)
20:03 wizzyrea haha
20:04 chris Wizzyrea: circulation history works for borrowers, issuing history for items
20:04 chris That's how my librarians like it anyway :)
20:05 paul_p left #koha
20:05 chris I wonder what the en_gb one uses
20:05 wizzyrea I'm trying to think about how our librarians refer to it
20:05 wizzyrea when they refer to an item
20:05 wizzyrea they often refer to "circ history
20:06 reva joined #koha
20:06 owen Our librarians refer to it as "Oh god you mean it remembers everything they've had checked out?!"
20:06 wizzyrea well they would refer to both as circ history
20:06 wizzyrea hehe
20:07 chris Yeah u need to fix your govt so that's a feature not a bug :)
20:07 wizzyrea I need to fix lots of stuff.
20:07 wizzyrea not all of it is attainable.
20:07 wizzyrea lol
20:07 owen I'm sure it's more worrisome to librarians than it is to our users
20:07 chris The anonymise job does erase the history
20:08 owen ...considering what people put on Facebook
20:08 wizzyrea oh for sure
20:08 wizzyrea I was just thinking about how our librarians consider it a feature that they can tell a patron what book they checked out 3 years ogo
20:08 wizzyrea ago
20:08 wizzyrea I can't even see my amazon orders that far back
20:08 wizzyrea which potentially has more relevance than my effing library reading history
20:09 * wizzyrea fumes a little.
20:09 larsw me, I think it's creepy if libraries keep track of what patrons read
20:09 wizzyrea ^^ agreed
20:10 larsw outstanding books, sure, but once a book is returned, the library should forget about it, imho
20:10 jcamins Amazon keeps track of every page you look at.
20:10 wizzyrea ^^ I don't like that either
20:10 owen A lot of patrons would like to be able to check to see if they've read something before
20:10 owen ...because some of them read so much they can't remember
20:10 wizzyrea yea, that's our librarians' big argument for keeping the data
20:11 jcamins I can understand that.
20:11 larsw owen, they can opt-in to do that, that's fine of course
20:11 wizzyrea we're all like "but the FBI... blah blah... take your records without telling you.... blah blah"
20:11 owen Maybe someday we'll find that missing opac-privacy page
20:11 wizzyrea which is what it sounds like to them
20:11 jcamins Goodness knows I could never remember everything I've read in the last year.
20:11 owen (bug 3881)
20:11 munin Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=3881 blocker, P5, ---, paul.poulain, NEW, No Page for Opac Privacy
20:11 larsw if I cared about that, I'd keep the list myself, though, since I get reading materials from so many sources that a library's system would be insufficient
20:12 larsw but I'll shut up now (hit-and-run commenting, that's me)
20:12 * wizzyrea gets whiplash watching larsw come and go
20:13 wizzyrea zoom
20:14 wizzyrea chris do you have a feeling about the vs. thing we were talking about (that they both show on the member menu, and show the same thing)
20:14 wizzyrea (or nearly the same thing)
20:14 jcamins Important philosophical question for the members of #koha: is open source free like a kitten or free like a puppy?
20:15 * wizzyrea ducks
20:15 * brendan lions
20:16 owen Free like a handful of ball bearings
20:16 * brendan read that too fast :)
20:17 collum left #koha
20:20 * cait comes back from washing a mountain of dishes
20:20 reva left #koha
20:24 richard joined #koha
20:24 richard hi
20:24 jcamins So, the concensus is "no one cares"?
20:26 owen jcamins: ?
20:27 jcamins Apparently puppies win.
20:27 chris sorry was my bus stop
20:27 jcamins Thanks.
20:28 chris wizzyrea: pick the one that shows more
20:28 chris jcamins: i answered this question already
20:28 chris "Free as in kittens is a silly phrase that should die, if FOSS is free as in kittens, proprietary software is free as in an inbred purebreed cat. That costs thousands of dollars in vet bills every year and is slightly retarded."
20:29 chris[…]e/#comment-133362
20:29 jcamins chris++
20:30 cait lol
20:30 wizzyrea @quote add <chris> "Free as in kittens is a silly phrase that should die, if FOSS is free as in kittens, proprietary software is free as in an inbred purebreed cat. That costs thousands of dollars in vet bills every year and is slightly retarded."
20:30 munin wizzyrea: Error: You must be registered to use this command. If you are already registered, you must either identify (using the identify command) or add a hostmask matching your current hostmask (using the "hostmask add" command).
20:30 wizzyrea @quote get 23
20:30 munin wizzyrea: Quote #23: "<gmcharlt> /msg munin register nick password" (added by wizzyrea_ at 12:25 PM, August 06, 2009)
20:32 wizzyrea @quote add <member:chris> "Free as in kittens is a silly phrase that should die, if FOSS is free as in kittens, proprietary software is free as in an inbred purebreed cat. That costs thousands of dollars in vet bills every year and is slightly retarded."
20:32 munin wizzyrea: The operation succeeded.  Quote #90 added.
20:32 wizzyrea woot
20:33 wizzyrea @quote remove 90
20:33 munin wizzyrea: The operation succeeded.
20:33 wizzyrea @quote add <chris> "Free as in kittens is a silly phrase that should die, if FOSS is free as in kittens, proprietary software is free as in an inbred purebreed cat. That costs thousands of dollars in vet bills every year and is slightly retarded."
20:33 munin wizzyrea: The operation succeeded.  Quote #91 added.
20:33 wizzyrea there we go.
20:33 wizzyrea @quote get 90
20:33 munin wizzyrea: Error: There is no Quote with id #90 in my database for #koha.
20:33 wizzyrea @quote random
20:33 munin wizzyrea: Quote #5: "<jwagner> Why is it every Koha rock I turn over produces a zillion (metaphorical) ants, each with a new question????" (added by kf at 09:13 AM, June 12, 2009)
20:34 wizzyrea hehe
20:34 jcamins Have a good night, everyone.
20:34 jcamins is now known as jcamins_a
20:34 brendan @wunder 93117
20:34 munin brendan: The current temperature in Northwest Goleta, Goleta, California is 24.8�C (1:42 PM PDT on August 19, 2010). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 57%. Dew Point: 16.0�C. Pressure: 29.85 in 1010.7 hPa (Falling).
20:36 * owen is still waiting for someone to hook munin's quote database to Bugzilla's quips list
20:37 nengard left #koha
20:37 nengard joined #koha
20:41 chris yeah that would be good owen
20:41 druthb @quote random
20:41 munin druthb: Quote #52: "<wizzyrea> Ahh, it's like putting on your slippers" (added by gmcharlt at 03:50 PM, January 28, 2010)
20:43 chris @quote stats
20:43 munin chris: There are 83 quotes in my database.
20:46 darling joined #koha
20:51 richard left #koha
20:57 nengard left #koha
21:12 richard joined #koha
21:15 cait good night all
21:15 cait left #koha
21:17 briceSanc left #koha
21:17 wizzyrea @quote random
21:17 munin wizzyrea: Quote #16: "< wizzyrea> i mean, the point of american bacon is to erm, use the belly of the hog (I think)" (added by chris at 05:37 PM, July 17, 2009)
21:18 chris oh yeah that was the bacon day
21:18 chris @quote random
21:18 munin chris: Quote #1: "<pianohacker> resolve, rather, I doubt it needs lotion" (added by gmcharlt at 11:05 PM, May 30, 2009)
21:19 druthb @quote random
21:19 munin druthb: Quote #6: "gmcharlt: kf: hold requests are a plot to sell more aspirin ;)" (added by wizzyrea at 12:13 PM, June 16, 2009)
21:20 druthb left #koha
21:27 wajasu joined #koha
21:29 wajasu i'm progressing through installing perl module prerequisites for 3.2beta on archlinux but with perl5.12.
21:29 wajasu it seems Time::localtime is builtin core
21:30 chris oh, i hadnt seen this before
21:31 chris wasaju: cool
21:36 wajasu though i've installed Date:ICal the -m  still shows it as missing.  Also that HTTP::OAI has a dependency on XML::SAX::Base that conflict with the earlier installed Sax parser. I've just comment out the HTTP::OAI from the makefile.
21:47 owen left #koha
21:48 wajasu Unix::Syslog is used by     Maybe that should be a perl required module?
21:48 chris no, because that script is deprecated
21:48 wajasu ahhh
22:13 wajasu no more   ak.a.[…]ncodingscratchpad   (INSTALL.ubuntu and INSTALL.fedora7  refer to this for an install)
22:16 chris are you installing from git?
22:17 wajasu i grabbed the beta
22:18 chris right
22:18 chris if you have time, you could clone the repo, and send a patch fixing those links
22:19 chris if not, then report a bug (cos it will scroll out of my scroll buffer here, and never get fixed otherwise)
22:19 wajasu i'm also installing into an lxc-container, so my distribution is minimal.  then I can run a script to build koha lxc-containers and run/test installs
22:19 chris cool
22:19 wajasu ok. i'll write bug.  maybe a patch when I have time.
22:20 chris cool
22:20 wajasu no LC_???? thing needs locale set to UTF-8 now?
22:20 wajasu as its not mentioned in INSTALL.debian
22:32 wajasu ok. i set my LC_???? environ vars correctly now for my lxc-container.  just need to config mysql apache, then run the webinstaller.
22:39 rhcl "chris> oh, i hadnt seen this before"
22:40 rhcl OK, I looked up an item in the catalog and then looked at the source code for that page, and saw it was using Koha.
22:40 rhcl but chris, was there something more obvious to you that indicated they were using koha?
22:43 wasabi rhcl:  yes, their URL ;)
22:43 wasabi[…]
22:45 rhcl harumph
22:46 wasabi i think chris has a daily automated 'koha' google-search running.
22:47 rhcl Yea, frankly I don't peruse the world's library catalogs doing searches to see which ones run Koha.
22:47 wasabi and it often returns surprising results, like this one :)
22:48 wasabi yep, but google does
22:49 rhcl Yea, but that's like doing the easy sudoku's--the hard sudoku's are like doing the work yourself, and looking at the code, and are much more rewarding.
22:49 rhcl like this: <meta name="generator" content="Koha 3.0006010"
22:58 brendan @wunder 93117
22:58 munin brendan: The current temperature in Northwest Goleta, Goleta, California is 23.6�C (4:02 PM PDT on August 19, 2010). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 57%. Dew Point: 15.0�C. Pressure: 29.81 in 1009.4 hPa (Falling).
22:58 brendan @wunder wellington, nz
22:58 munin brendan: The current temperature in Wellington, New Zealand is 9.0�C (10:00 AM NZST on August 20, 2010). Conditions: Mostly Cloudy. Humidity: 82%. Dew Point: 6.0�C. Pressure: 29.83 in 1010 hPa (Steady).
23:00 robin that doesn't tell you the wind, which isn't so bad today but is usually quite relevant.
23:08 rhcl is now known as rhcl_away
23:15 brendan_ joined #koha
23:15 brendan_ left #koha
23:19 brendan left #koha
23:20 chris[…]k-safety-briefing
23:22 Johnindy_ left #koha
23:44 wajasu maybe we need the  all black  koha edition
23:45 davi left #koha
23:50 wajasu i've compiled a distribution package for Date::Ical just as for many other perl modules, but after my distribution install, the reports its not installed. Hmmm.
23:54 robin wajasu: $ perl -MData::ICal
23:54 robin that'll tell you for sure
23:55 robin (if you get an error it's not installed. If it just sits there its OK and you can ctrl-C out)
23:56 brendan joined #koha

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