IRC log for #koha, 2010-02-02

All times shown according to UTC.

Time S Nick Message
00:12 brendan wizzyrea you figure out your problem?
00:13 brendan you need to edit the first two lines of your installer/data/mysql/ file
00:14 brendan I saw that in my update and that did the trick for me (something happened during the merge or something)
00:31 * chris_n is glad he was not the only one with those two random lines
00:45 brendan yeah those two lines have got to be from a bad merge right?
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01:03 chris_n yup
01:04 * chris_n tried out a vim irc plugin today
01:05 chris_n sadly it did not work too well
01:05 braedon_ :)
01:06 braedon_ i'm on empathy
01:06 braedon_ sadly it does not work too well
01:06 braedon_ but it is getting better
01:06 braedon_ yay for PPAs
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01:18 chris_n wizzyrea must be very mobile atm
01:20 braedon_ chris_n: do you know what version first broke the biblio view search links?
01:20 chris_n braedon_: no, but the fix is a one-liner... hold on
01:24 chris_n braedon_: in C4/
01:24 chris_n find this line: #    $query =~ s/:/=/g;
01:24 braedon_ yipyip
01:24 chris_n and add just after it this line: $query =~ s/(?<=(ti|au|pb|su|an|kw|mc)):/=/g;
01:24 chris_n do *not* uncomment the line referred to above which is commented out
01:25 braedon_ ok
01:25 braedon_ thanks
01:25 chris_n np... and I have not yet submitted the patch to do that, but will tonight or tomorrow
01:26 braedon_ how long does it usually take for patches to be applied to the repos, out of interest
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01:37 chris_n that depends on gmcharlt's schedule, but this will be in the alpha of 3.2 so not too long from now
01:37 chris_n you can also grab the patch once it posts to the list and apply it to your repo
01:38 chris_n git should work out the merge when it does show up in the main repo and you rebase
01:38 chris_n bbiab
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01:40 braedon_ grr, damn empathy crashing
01:40 braedon_ ok, thanks chris_n.
01:41 braedon_ is now known as braedon
01:43 Drew need some help I am new to koha and I followed the instructions from the wiki but I am getting nothing when I go to port 8080 any ideas?
01:44 braedon are you on the machine koha is on? or are you on another?
01:44 Drew another
01:44 braedon apache may not be set up correctly
01:45 braedon check your site config for koha
01:45 braedon probably something like /etc/apache2/sites-enabled/koha
01:45 braedon (that is what it is on ubuntu/debian at least)
01:46 Drew yeah that is where it is I am using that myself what am I looking for?
01:46 braedon if the hosts in that file are set up for, you will need to change them to the IP address of the server
01:47 Drew let me check
01:48 braedon eg, <VirtualHost>
01:48 braedon there will be one lower down for 8080 as well
01:48 Drew yes I changed them before do I need to take out VirtualHost from the title?
01:49 braedon what are they set to now?
01:49 braedon did you restart apache after changing them?
01:49 Drew <VirtualHost 192.168.1123:8080>
01:50 Drew yes, I have even restart the pc
01:50 braedon you need a extra .
01:50 braedon i presume between the two 1's
01:50 Drew thats just a typo it is there
01:50 braedon lol, ok
01:51 braedon hmm, not sure then sorry
01:51 braedon does port 80 work?
01:52 Drew no if I go to the ip it gives me the koha screen but tells me it is down for maitience
01:52 Drew so I know that apache is working
01:52 braedon yip
01:52 braedon so it is jsut the port 8080 virtualhost that isn't working
01:52 Drew or port 80
01:53 braedon the port 80 should give you a maintenance message until you set it up through 8080
01:55 braedon can you paste your whole apache koha file in pastebin or something?
01:55 Drew do I need to change anything else other than ports.conf to listen 8080
01:58 braedon as far as i am aware, no
01:58 Drew ok give me a sec
01:58 braedon but i haven't done a fresh install, so there may be something tricksy elsewhere that i am unaware of
02:05 Drew whats the best way to send it?
02:06 braedon
02:06 braedon then send the link
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02:07 Drew
02:13 braedon hmm, looks alright to me
02:13 braedon sorry. anyone else have any ideas?
02:14 Drew you think it is an apache problem or a koha
02:15 braedon what is it giving you on 8080 exactly?
02:16 Drew The webpage cannot be displayed
02:17 braedon i would say it is an apache config issue
02:17 Drew ok then I will look in that dirction for answers thanks for the help.
02:19 braedon no probs. sorry i couldn't be more help
02:19 braedon and don't restrict the search to apache too strictly. that is only my guess :P
02:22 chris_n Drew: is your apache configured to listen on port 8080?
02:24 braedon "- Drew, 14:52 - do I need to change anything else other than ports.conf to listen 8080"
02:29 chris_n missed that
02:32 chris_n Drew: what do the apache logs say? ie. /var/log/apache2/error.log and access.log
02:37 braedon chris_n: where abouts should that line "#    $query =~ s/:/=/g;" be? The only one I an find isn't commented
02:37 braedon s/I an/I can/
02:37 chris_n in that case, comment it and add the one I gave below it
02:38 braedon i tried that, and it doesn't seem to work
02:41 braedon what exactly is it supposed to fix(in case i am getting the wrong end of the stick here)
02:45 chris_n normalizing the query by removing all : results in the inability to search on anything containing a :
02:45 chris_n the new regexp normalizes by removing only query limit pragma
02:46 chris_n ie. ti: au: etc
02:47 chris_n but if the original line was not commented out, your search links should have worked
02:47 chris_n so maybe there is something else wronge there
02:47 chris_n what version are you using?
02:48 chris_n s/wronge/wrong/
02:48 Drew the log says file not found
02:52 chris_n Drew: which file?
02:52 Drew error.log
02:56 chris_n which file does the log say is not found?
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03:07 braedon chris_n: sorry, was afk
03:07 braedon using 3.0.5 currently
03:08 braedon have used, and is broken in, 3.0.4, and git head
03:08 braedon and git 3.0.x actually
03:08 braedon works in 3.0.1
03:08 Drew this is the line [error] [client] File does not exist: /var/www/:8080
03:09 chris ahh you are putting the :8080 in the wrong place
03:10 chris it needs to before the slash
03:10 chris http://your.ip.number:8080/
03:10 chris or
03:10 Drew thats what i did
03:11 chris can you paste exactly what you did?
03:11 Drew might have messed it up once but thats the only error i found
03:11 Drew
03:11 chris right, well that error must have occured the one time you messed it up
03:12 chris whats in the access log?
03:15 Drew nothing that i can see thats an error
03:18 chris what does it list when you hit that url above?
03:18 Drew The webpage cannot be displayed
03:18 chris no, what does the access log say
03:19 chris does it get an entry at all?
03:19 chris and if you go
03:19 chris telnet 8080
03:19 chris do you get a connection?
03:21 Drew - - [02/Feb/2010:11:38:52 +0900] "OPTIONS * HTTP/1.0" 200 - "-" "Apache/2.2.8 (Ubuntu) PHP/5.2.4-2ubuntu5.10 with Suhosin-Patch (internal dummy connection)"
03:24 Drew if i telnet i get nothing it does connect
03:25 chris ok so its definitely listening on port 8080
03:25 Drew it would seem so it just won't respond
03:26 chris whats the virtualhost line of your intranet section of the httpd.conf file?
03:27 Jo left #koha
03:27 Drew the file is blank
03:35 chris_n I think on ubuntu that is apache2.conf
03:38 Drew there is no virtualhost line in that file
03:41 chris_n braedon: add '$query =~ s/(?<=rtrn):/=/g;' immediately after the line I had you add a moment ago and see if that fixes things up
03:41 chris_n both lines I had you add should be there and uncommented
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03:46 Amit heya brendan, chris
03:46 Amit morning #koha
03:47 chris_n howdy Amit
03:47 Amit heya chris_n2
03:47 chris_n actually I'm just one now :-)
03:48 chris_n I got an irc proxy up and running thanks to several who pointed me in the right direction
03:52 Jo pop quizz: koha consortia serving populations over 4 million, or 'all of country or state"
03:52 Jo virtula lolly pop for the first 5 answers :)
03:57 brendan hey amit
03:57 Amit heya JO
03:58 brendan Jo "all of country"
04:00 chris has 3.6 million volumes does 11262790 circ transactions per year
04:03 Jo Amit: as in all of NZ, or an entire state in US or India
04:03 Jo Hands lollypop to Chris .. :)
04:04 brendan oh I get it now
04:04 chris its hard to know masscat has a lot of libraries mostly small though
04:04 brendan howard county
04:05 brendan whoops off by a month
04:05 brendan errr..  year
04:05 Jo scls - what state is that?
04:05 chris wisconsin
04:05 chris vicki
04:06 Jo cool.
04:06 Jo thanks - needed a very cool example
04:06 Amit Delhi public library completed 60 years
04:06 Amit i think oldest library in india
04:06 chris there must be 4 million ppl in delhi easy
04:06 Jo Kerala state : whats the story with that one again?
04:07 Jo delhi is a g ood one
04:07 Jo Hands lollypop to Amit :)
04:07 Amit
04:08 Jo delhi: how many branches or sites would you think?
04:08 Amit 45 branches
04:09 Jo amit: thank you.
04:09 Amit np
04:10 Jo Masscat: any idea how many partner libraries or service sites
04:11 chris no idea, you could email nora
04:11 chris nblake at
04:12 chris ok hometime
04:12 chris bbl
04:13 Jo thanks everyone
04:13 Amit heya chris
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04:32 chris_n @later tell hdl_laptop I resubmitted a corrected patch for bug 4074; the 3.0.x version is here:[…]75edfb1a4ebf6b47f and can be pulled from there if you like
04:32 munin chris_n: The operation succeeded.
04:33 chris_n g'night #koha
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07:24 Ropuch Morning #koha
07:51 imp moin :)
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08:25 kf joined #koha
08:25 kf hi #koha
08:29 imp heyho kf :)
08:29 kf heyho imp ;)
08:30 Ropuch Hello kf, imp :)
08:31 kf good morning Ropuch
08:44 Amit heya kf, Ropuch
08:45 magnus good time-of-the-day-or-night #koha
08:45 kf morning Amit and magnus
08:45 Amit heya magnus
08:46 magnus hi, kf and Amit
08:51 hdl_laptop hi magnus
08:51 magnus hi hdl_laptop
08:52 hdl_laptop thx chris_n.
09:43 * chris reads magnus blog
09:43 magnus chris: and understands everything? ;-)
09:44 chris mostly, google translate does a good job
09:44 chris it seems the swedish report was very complimentary toward koha
09:47 magnus oh, yes - the title says it all really
09:47 magnus they point out some things that are particular to sweden + translations, but otherwise they really like it
09:48 chris very cool
09:50 magnus yup
09:50 magnus i'm using it for all it's worth to make norwegian librarians aware of the benefits of koha too...
09:51 chris good idea
09:51 chris be nice to get a good koha presence in scandanavia
09:51 magnus i'm doing my best...
09:51 chris :)
09:52 magnus in the middle of march there will be the annual norwegian library conference, where i will have a stand to promote koha and myself. and nicomo will be there to help too :-)
09:53 magnus i'm very anxious to hear and feel what the response will be there
09:54 chris i feel that 2010 is going to be a good year for koha
09:55 magnus me too
10:00 magnus and i would love to "round it out" by going to kohacon, but i'll need some more customers first i think...
10:04 Ropuch Heh
10:06 kf German library conference is in march too
10:06 Ropuch I'm still considering sightseeing trip to NZ with Kohacon as a bonus
10:06 Ropuch But it would cost all of my savings
10:06 kf Ropuch: I know your problem
10:07 kf I would really like to go too.. but I will be really expensive
10:07 kf I = it
10:08 Ropuch Althought I'm years past my student times, I thinking about just getting there and try get some part time job to cover my expenses, just as I did in NOrway back then ;>
10:08 magnus Ropuch: sounds like a good idea!
10:08 Ropuch Librarian on the road ;-)
10:09 Ropuch The flight cost alone is a killer
10:10 kf yes :(
10:10 Ropuch And hitchhiking the plane is not an option ;>
10:13 Ropuch chris: can I assemble a tent on your yard? ;-)
10:13 Ropuch I mean: in
10:14 Ropuch Is "pitching a tent" used in realtion to a tent?
10:15 Ropuch[…]term=pitch+a+tent
10:15 kf I ll bring mine too :)
10:15 kf hm playing with dates, not flying on weekends gets cheaper
10:15 kf still enough to buy a real nice new laptop :(
10:16 Ropuch Still it's 1300-1500 euro
10:17 kf yes
10:17 Ropuch I'm a big fan of cheap laptops ;>
10:17 kf hm I have one for 1209.00 EUR here
10:18 kf flight, not laptop
10:18 Ropuch I must geto to Germany first
10:20 kf ah ok
10:21 Ropuch Oh, +/- 50 eoros is nothing compraed to final  amount ;>
10:21 kf hm?
10:23 Ropuch I was thinking about cost of trip to Berlin/Hannover
10:23 kf because it might be cheaper to fly from here?
10:24 magnus what sites are you guys using to look for tickets? any recomendations?
10:25 kf I think there are several sites for finding cheap flights - but I have no recommendation
10:25 kf flying too seldom
10:27 magnus me to...
10:29 kf perhaps chris has some tips
10:29 kf or nengard
10:31 chris i usually use travelocity
10:31 kf ah, hi chris
10:32 chris then book direct with the airline
10:32 chris lufthansa is part of the star alliance
10:32 chris same as air nz
10:33 kf star alliance?
10:33 chris means they often code share flights
10:33 chris i flew lufthansa to vienna, and also to munich
10:33 kf thx!
10:33 * Ropuch making notes
10:33 Ropuch ;>
10:33 chris they stop in singapore or thailand usually
10:33 kf me too
10:35 chris whats the nearest big airport to you kf?
10:35 kf stuttgart
10:35 kf or perhaps zürich (switzerland)
10:37 chris looks like lufthansa's main hub is frankfurt
10:37 chris so they all fly through there
10:38 kf stuttgart london seems to work too
10:38 kf and 1/2 days +- are making a difference too - will need more time for this :)
10:39 chris yeah
10:40 chris yeah stuttgart -> london -> hong kong -> nz
10:41 chris seems to be cheapest so far
10:42 chris
10:46 chris ok time for sleep for me
10:46 chris night all
10:47 kf good night chris
10:48 magnus sleep tight
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10:58 CGI693 hi All! I installed koha-3.004_fixed  on debian-lenny,
10:58 CGI693 I read documents properly, but Im still in cofusion, that how koha function
10:59 CGI693 how can I place books in different shelving locations
10:59 CGI693 can any body help me?
11:01 Amit hi CGI693
11:01 Amit what problem
11:04 CGI693 Im new user of KOHA
11:05 CGI693 and I review the documentation but still Im in cofusion, that wht is different b/w item types and lists
11:05 CGI693 and how can I add books in different shelves
11:07 hdl_laptop item types are the type of items and rules for check-in and out.
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11:08 hdl_laptop lists were named virtualshelves : they are just there to store some records for more visibility and work
11:10 hdl_laptop CGI693: for shelving locations, in koha, and in libraries, you can use  itemcallnumber.
11:11 CGI693 how can I use callnumber
11:13 CGI693 I add some books but when I want to search these from OPAC search catalogue, they dont show there
11:15 hdl_laptop CGI693: have you launched indexation ?
11:15 hdl_laptop are you using zebra or no zebra mode ?
11:16 CGI693 Im using zebra mode
11:16 CGI693 I did not get " launched indexation" ...??
11:20 CGI693 ??
11:25 CGI693 Im not able to search opac catalgue from reserviours data
11:25 CGI693 while books are present but it do not show in catalogue from opac
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13:27 hilongo good morning to all  :)
13:27 jwagner G'morning.
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13:33 jwagner Oh, by the way...
13:33 jwagner kf++ for yesterday's patron attribute help :-)
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13:35 hilongo I have updated my Koha to 3.0.5 and I'm having a 'dia'critial problem ...
13:36 hilongo is there someone who can lend me a hand on that matter around? :)
13:39 kf karma yay :)
13:39 jwagner Meant to do that yesterday, but I was too excited about getting it to work!
13:40 kf jwagner++ # for discussing fines and notices with me :)
13:40 kf @karma kf
13:40 munin kf: Karma for "kf" has been increased 6 times and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 6.
13:41 jwagner Awwww, getting karma back :-)
13:42 jwagner hilongo, you can ask, don't know whether anyone is online that has an answer....
13:42 kf @karma cait
13:42 munin kf: cait has neutral karma.
13:45 gmcharlt cait++
13:46 gmcharlt kf: happy now? :)
13:47 gmcharlt hilongo: what's your question?
13:47 jwagner Hey, kf/cait can accumulate karma under two identities!  That's not fair.  I need to start logging in with an alternate persona!!!
13:48 kf gmcharlt: not sure this is fair
13:48 gmcharlt sockpuppets FTW!
13:49 jwagner Harrumph.
13:49 hilongo the thing is ... that I seem to have two sets of diacritics in my database.. back in v3.0.1 I fixed this adding some equivalences in word-phrase-utf.chr and sort-string-utf.chr
13:49 jdavidb is now known as that_other_jdav
13:49 hilongo under /etc/koha...
13:49 that_other_jdav is now known as jdavidb
13:50 owen jdavidb: Not enough time to score some karma
13:50 * jdavidb hasn't done much karma-worthy lately, anyway.
13:51 hilongo after the upgrade to v3.0.5 same problem presented, because of new word-phrase and sort-string files
13:52 hdl_laptop hi gmcharlt
13:52 gmcharlt hi hdl_laptop
13:53 hilongo but now I can't add the equivalences to the sort-string-utf.chr file, cause it complains on saving with a 'CONVERSION ERROR' from vim ...
13:53 owen jdavidb: Toiling away for clients is toiling away in obscurity
13:53 gmcharlt news for you - this evening I'll be bringing in the last of the patches for 3.2 and tarring up the alpha
13:53 jdavidb Indeed, owen.
13:54 jwagner gmcharlt++ yippeee!
13:54 gmcharlt hilongo: do you get this conversion error if you open the file in vi and try saving it without making any changes?
13:56 jdavidb gmcharlt++
13:57 nengard gmcharlt++  woo hoo
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14:03 magnus gmcharlt++
14:03 hdl_laptop gmcharlt++
14:04 kf gmcharlt++
14:05 imp \o/
14:06 * imp will try the alpha version :D
14:06 imp gmcharlt++
14:26 Colin joined #koha
14:30 Colin is hdl_laptop about?
14:30 hdl_laptop hi Colin
14:31 magnus i think there was talk a while back about making available test-installations for people to try and hunt for bugs, without requiring everyone to set up their own installations. anyone thought any more about that?
14:31 Colin Hi a question on enddate in serials. You can add a subscription without one
14:31 Colin but not receive a copy until you renew
14:32 magnus i have one at username = password = demo that i will share with anyone
14:32 magnus and i'll make sure it's updated to alpha as soon as i can after it's out
14:33 Colin Was the logic to force the renew or should you require the enddate on add
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14:42 jdavidb Hm...anyone seen anything useful that might help with Bug 2629 ?  I've got a couple of sites that are fussing about this
14:42 munin Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=2629 major, P1, ---,, NEW, Diacritics not being ignored when searching
14:43 hdl_laptop Colin: maybe we could require the enddate or try and process that from subscription data
14:43 hdl_laptop jdavidb: I guess you should try to setup yaz-icu
14:44 kf jdavidb: icu indexinb
14:44 nengard csv profiles question ... why are the seperators listed 2 times each? Is this a bug or is there a reason I need it twice?
14:45 kf jdavidb: you can test in our library catalog if you want to, it works fine there
14:46 jdavidb okay..  gonna go do some searching, and figure out how to do that...
14:48 nengard hdl_laptop any ideas why the seperator fields are duplicated on the CSV profiles tool?
14:49 hdl_laptop jdavidb: I posted some icu files and you have some on Univ_Lyon3  branch on
14:49 hdl_laptop nengard: bad conflict merge ?
14:49 hdl_laptop I guess.
14:49 nengard okay - so it's a bug :)
14:49 jdavidb hdl_laptop++
14:49 nengard will report and try to fix
14:49 owen nengard: I'm working on that template now
14:49 jdavidb Thanks!  Is it just a matter of installing the package, and reconfiguring/reindexing zebra?
14:50 nengard owen can you remove the dup fields then too?
14:50 owen Yes
14:50 nengard thanks :)(
14:50 nengard or :)
14:50 hdl_laptop installing the package, + tweak zebra configuration
14:51 jdavidb I see etc/zebra/etc/icu.xml; I gather that's the config that tells icu how to do stuff?
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14:54 nengard okay - documentation question re: csv profiles - what does each seperator mean? what's the diff between a csv sperator, field seperator and subfield seperator?
14:55 jdavidb hdl_laptop:[…]nuary/022269.html ?  This what I need?
14:56 hdl_laptop yep
14:57 jdavidb hdl_laptop++ again, just because!  Gonna spin this up on a test instance, make sure I get it right before I subject my customers to my fumblin'.
14:59 jwagner Gee, lots of karma floating around this morning :-)
15:11 wizzyrea brendan: thanks for the tip, will do :)
15:11 brendan ah sure thing wizzyrea :)
15:12 hdl_laptop nengard: csv separator is for the csv "fields" in your excel file
15:12 hdl_laptop nengard: But you can have multiple tags and subfields answering your question
15:12 hdl_laptop imagine 700$a
15:12 hdl_laptop and you have 10 700 tags...
15:13 nengard OH!!! that makes sense
15:13 hdl_laptop There comes the field separator
15:13 nengard and then the $ is the subfield separator?
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15:13 hdl_laptop And had you had multiple $a in your 700 then you would use the subfield separator
15:13 hdl_laptop for instance ; as csv
15:14 hdl_laptop for instance / as field separator
15:14 hdl_laptop for instance -- as subfield separator
15:14 wizzyrea brilliant, it worked
15:14 wizzyrea thanks again
15:15 hdl_laptop my;field;is;great;Ratzinger**Be​nedito/Wojtila**john-Paul;....
15:16 nengard thanks hdl_laptop!!
15:20 nengard owen just saw the work you did on subscriptions display in the OPAC - nice work!! Thanks :)
15:21 jdavidb hdl_laptop: after setting icu up, is it necessary to reindex?  I've got the modified default.idx and icu.xml in place, and restarted zebra, but no change to results.
15:21 gmcharlt yes, you need to reindex
15:21 hdl_laptop sure you have to.
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15:22 jdavidb figured probably so.  Thanks!
15:28 Colin hdl_laptop: thanks I'll take a look at ensuring enddate gets set
15:29 hdl_laptop thanks Colin
15:30 jwagner is now known as jwagner_meeting
15:32 Colin left #koha
15:39 owen hdl_laptop: Can you look at Bug 4090?
15:39 munin Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=4090 minor, P5, ---,, NEW, subscription ID showing in OPAC - confusing
15:39 owen Is there a reason why a librarian would need to filter by a subscription ID?
15:40 owen The ID number doesn't mean much to the librarian, let alone a patron
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15:42 hdl_laptop mmm maybe... I think it was asked.
15:43 hdl_laptop But if we could use a pretty jqueryfilter so that user can filter branchcode or even serialseq.... Then i think it would do the job
15:43 owen serialseq?
15:43 hdl_laptop serial name
15:46 owen Isn't a filter by branchcode all you would need? Unless you expect one library branch to have duplicate subscriptions to the same title
15:47 nengard owen, i would expect one library to have multiple subscriptions with the same name
15:47 nengard name/title
15:47 owen One library branch?
15:48 nengard the way it works now if you have 2 copies of Computers in Libraries  at your branch you need two subscriptions
15:48 nengard yes
15:48 owen But there is no way, other than with subscription ID, to distinguish the two
15:48 nengard but as I'm the bug reporter - I still see no reason for the patron to know how many subscriptions the library has set up or their IDs
15:48 nengard owen - not that I know of ...
15:51 owen So nengard you think all we need is the library filter?
15:51 nengard On the OPAC - I see no reason why the patron would need anything else ... but if hdl_laptop was asked to put it there - maybe we need find out why
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16:04 ccurry Hello everyone.  A few questions about serials:
16:04 ccurry I'm working on getting the serials module working correctly (or at least limping along).  When receiving a new item from within a subscription record, some data is automatically generated in the item record.  The call number is applied (as defined in system preferences "itemcallnumber") and "serialseq" ( from serial items table) is inserted into subfield v  Cost, replacement price.  The...
16:04 ccurry ...latter is obviously a mistake, and is easy enough to fix by editing line 73 of /usr/share/koha/intranet/htdocs/intranet-tmp​l/prog/en/modules/serials/serials-edit.tmpl, replacing "v" with "h" to populate h -  Serial Enumeration / chronology with "serialseq" instead.
16:04 ccurry
16:05 owen Bug 3899
16:05 munin Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=3899 normal, PATCH-Sent, ---,, NEW, Receive Serial Item Has Copy Info in Wrong Field
16:06 ccurry I'm trying to do a more involved customization to populate $h with "publisheddate" from the serialitems table and append "serialseq" to the call number in $o.  Any tips on how I can achieve this?
16:06 ccurry munin: thanks.  good to know.
16:06 munin ccurry: Error: "thanks." is not a valid command.
16:07 ccurry interesting.  I never know when I'm talking to a robot on IRC...that's a smart one.
16:08 owen munin spits out details of bugs if you give a bug number
16:08 munin owen: Error: "spits" is not a valid command.
16:08 ccurry duh
16:08 ccurry owen: thanks
16:09 ccurry I tried copying the js from the pastebin above and changing the subfield to o and replacing serialseq with publisheddate, but this doesn't output the publisheddate field...and overwrites the call number generated by system preferences, so I guess something more sophisticated is necessary?
16:15 ccurry In addition, $c, shelving location is missing from this form...I checked the MARC Bibliographic Framework and the code for the hidden field of 952$c is correct & it displays correctly when creating a non-serial item.
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16:27 chris_n g'morning
16:34 schuster hey all - owen have a minute to look at something dealing with printing?
16:34 owen Sure
16:35 Kivutar left #koha
16:35 schuster If we pull up an item in the edit mode - and do file print we get 3 pages - title, grid, and then the Edit item #XXXX
16:36 schuster on the Edit item page all cells/fields are filled in on the printout.
16:36 schuster If we do file print and say print ONLY page 3 to 3 which is the edit item page all the fields are blank except #2, 8, a, b, c, y
16:37 schuster Thoughts?
16:38 owen schuster: This isn't a new issue is it? I seem to recall you asking about this before.
16:39 wizzyrea you know
16:39 wizzyrea what a great feature it would be to have a print friendly items view
16:40 * wizzyrea puts that on her list
16:40 schuster You are correct not a new item, but it bubbled to the top of my stack of papers again.
16:40 * chris_n wonders if wizzyrea can see the bottom of her list
16:41 wizzyrea heh, no
16:41 wizzyrea sok though
16:41 owen schuster: I get the same thing.
16:41 wizzyrea really it's more like an idea bucket
16:45 schuster Ok idea bucket tip over and let the ideas flow to completion!!  wizzyrea has all the answers right?
16:46 wizzyrea no, no I don't
16:46 wizzyrea hmm
16:46 wizzyrea perhaps I should post my idea bucket somewhere online :/
16:46 schuster I think we need to put all those ideas into bugzilla as enhancements so that others can chime in and possible help...
16:46 wizzyrea yea, but most of my ideas are half baked and kind of dum
16:46 wizzyrea b
16:46 wizzyrea ;)
16:47 schuster Hey doesn't hurt, I half baked one and I think it is almost complete!!  URL checker...
16:47 schuster Timer hasn't dinged, but it is getting close.
16:47 schuster So owen any suggestions on how to fix that so the data comes all the way through?
16:48 wizzyrea you are looking at the edit items screen?
16:48 owen schuster: The print stylesheet needs to be modified
16:48 wizzyrea file a bug I'd guess
16:48 schuster yes wizzyrea - if you print all 3 pages it comes out ok, if you print page 3 of 3 most of the fields are blank.
16:49 owen[…]326d066c6;hb=HEAD
16:49 owen Line 205 says to hide <input> when printing
16:49 owen ...but I don't see why it wouldn't do that whether or not you're printing page 3 of 3
16:51 ColinC joined #koha
16:54 schuster smm still a mystery...
16:55 owen schuster: Were you able to tweak that file?
16:55 tirabo left #koha
16:56 schuster head looks different than mine at the moment.  So I'm investigating.  Since I'm on like .36...
16:56 kf left #koha
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17:02 jwagner_meeting is now known as jwagner
17:03 owen schuster: True. Yours probably doesn't have that line, and therefore my hypothesis is incorrect.
17:04 brendan @wunder 93117
17:04 munin brendan: The current temperature in Northwest Goleta, Goleta, California is 12.4�C (9:00 AM PST on February 02, 2010). Conditions: Scattered Clouds. Humidity: 85%. Dew Point: 10.0�C. Pressure: 29.85 in 1010.7 hPa (Steady).
17:08 chris_n @wunder 28334
17:08 munin chris_n: The current temperature in Dunn, North Carolina is 2.0�C (12:02 PM EST on February 02, 2010). Conditions: Light Rain. Humidity: 66%. Dew Point: -4.0�C. Windchill: 0.0�C. Pressure: 29.74 in 1007.0 hPa (Falling).
17:11 wizzyrea schuster: i'm trying to understand your issue. You have a problem with
17:11 owen schuster: ...and yet the fix worked for me :|
17:11 wizzyrea that view?
17:11 owen wizzyrea: Do you have the Web Developer Firefox addon?
17:12 wizzyrea I have firebug
17:12 wizzyrea i will get it
17:12 wizzyrea if it will help
17:13 wizzyrea hmm, 3/3 looks like
17:13 owen It has a nice option for viewing pages using the CSS files for alternate media types. Good for testing your print CSS
17:13 wizzyrea oooh
17:13 chris_n neat
17:13 owen wizzyrea: That's 3/3 of a printout?
17:13 wizzyrea yea
17:15 chris_n owen: is this it?[…]/addon/60?src=api
17:15 schuster 3/3 on the screen looks ok - its when it actually goes to the printer that it is missing the data.
17:15 owen wizzyrea: Yes
17:15 wizzyrea that's the print preview
17:15 wizzyrea PDF
17:15 wizzyrea <- on a mac though
17:16 wizzyrea so, if i were to print that, it would come out the same
17:16 schuster print preview looks ok that's what is strange - no probably would be missing the data.
17:16 wizzyrea not on mine
17:17 * owen highly recommends the Web Developer addon. It pre-dates Firebug and does some things Firebug doesn't
17:17 wizzyrea i just printed it L.
17:17 wizzyrea :/
17:18 wizzyrea owen: will def check it out
17:20 schuster I downloaded it, but I need to "restart" firefox
17:20 wizzyrea
17:20 wizzyrea that's what my two prints look like :/
17:20 owen Sorry chris_n: that "Yes" was meant for you :)
17:21 chris_n got it and installed :-)
17:21 owen Sounds like this may be a PC problem.
17:21 * chris_n loves tools that make life easier... especially with web developing
17:21 schuster can't get to that one - my network proxy blocks it...  So are you missing barcode or does yours display.
17:21 * wizzyrea too
17:21 wizzyrea mine display on both
17:21 Ropuch Web Developer plugin is must ;>
17:21 schuster phewey
17:22 wizzyrea ooh look at all of the new shiny buttons
17:22 Ropuch ;>
17:22 Ropuch Evening #koha
17:22 schuster bblb
17:22 schuster left #koha
17:22 wizzyrea owen: you are on a PC?
17:22 * wizzyrea is also using FF 3.6
17:22 owen At work I am, at home I'm on a Mac.
17:23 wizzyrea you are presumably at work right now :)
17:24 * owen checks for pants
17:24 owen Yup, work.
17:24 owen
17:25 schuster joined #koha
17:25 owen schuster, is this what you see?
17:26 schuster my *()^)*&^)&*( filter doesn't let me get to some of those sites.  Are you showing me code or printout?
17:26 schuster I can share either with you...
17:27 owen[…]em-print-view.png
17:28 owen schuster: Your filter is protecting you. We've been trying to trick you into looking at naughty pictures at work.
17:28 tirabo joined #koha
17:29 schuster yes that is what I see when I look at css media type
17:29 Ropuch ..and i fell for it ;>
17:29 schuster print
17:30 owen schuster: I mean is that what you get when you print it
17:30 collum joined #koha
17:30 schuster oh yes that is what I get when I print it - but things are lined up nicely.
17:31 tomascohen left #koha
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17:34 moodaepo @wunder 56001
17:34 munin moodaepo: The current temperature in South on Monks, Mankato, Minnesota is -8.7�C (11:30 AM CST on February 02, 2010). Conditions: Overcast. Humidity: 79%. Dew Point: -11.0�C. Windchill: -16.0�C. Pressure: 30.06 in 1017.8 hPa (Rising).
17:37 brendan hi moodaepo
17:38 moodaepo Hey brendan seems like we are back to being polar-opposites with ze weather : )
17:38 brendan heh ;)
17:38 owen polar is right
17:38 ColinC left #koha
17:38 schuster schuster is killing trees... sorry...
17:39 moodaepo Well the Canucks got me beat most of the time so I feel warmer when I do this...
17:39 moodaepo @wunder montreal
17:39 munin moodaepo: Error: No such location could be found.
17:39 brendan my favorite is
17:39 moodaepo @wunder Montreal, QC Canada
17:39 brendan @wunder north pole, alaska
17:39 munin moodaepo: Error: No such location could be found.
17:39 munin brendan: The current temperature in Speedway, North Pole, Alaska is -31.1�C (8:32 AM AKST on February 02, 2010). Conditions: Partly Cloudy. Humidity: -999%. Dew Point: -70.0�C. Windchill: -31.0�C. Pressure: 30.02 in 1016.5 hPa (Steady).
17:39 moodaepo brendan++
17:40 owen "Humidity: -999%" ?!
17:40 * moodaepo tries it one last time
17:40 moodaepo @wunder Montreal, Canada
17:40 munin moodaepo: The current temperature in Montreal, Quebec is -12.0�C (12:00 PM EST on February 02, 2010). Conditions: Scattered Clouds. Humidity: 48%. Dew Point: -21.0�C. Windchill: -18.0�C. Pressure: 30.26 in 1025 hPa (Falling).
17:40 brendan yay!
17:42 moodaepo It was -30s in Montreal a couple of weeks back when we were in the -20s, wonder how el norte pole was doing. @wunder should be able to do past weather!
17:46 francharb left #koha
17:51 indradg joined #koha
17:52 indradg @wunder kolkata
17:52 munin indradg: The current temperature in Kolkata, India is 17.0�C (10:50 PM IST on February 02, 2010). Conditions: Mist. Humidity: 77%. Dew Point: 13.0�C. Pressure: 29.95 in 1014 hPa (Rising).
17:53 jdavidb @wunder 20817
17:53 munin jdavidb: The current temperature in Potomac, Maryland is 3.2�C (12:44 PM EST on February 02, 2010). Conditions: Mostly Cloudy. Humidity: 74%. Dew Point: -1.0�C. Windchill: 3.0�C. Pressure: 29.97 in 1014.8 hPa (Falling). Winter Storm Warning in effect from 4 PM this afternoon to 7 am EST Wednesday...
17:53 schuster owen - so we have decided this print problem is a local issue correct?
17:53 * jdavidb goes "eep!"
17:54 owen schuster: Were you able to confirm or deny the existence of a declaration in your print stylesheet that hides inputs?
17:55 owen /intranet-tmpl/prog/en/css/print.css
17:55 ccurry left #koha
17:55 schuster hmmm - what would that declaration look like?  sorry still learning.
17:56 schuster .print {         display : inline;
17:56 owen input, fieldset.action, .list-actions { display: none; }
17:57 schuster I do not have that line in my code.  So when you changed yours to??? it worked? or comment it out?
17:58 owen schuster: I took out the "input, " part of that line and it worked for me. Since you don't even have that I'm not sure what's going on.
17:59 schuster OK - I'll bang a little on this with some of the other stylesheets that are referenced to see if that makes a difference.
18:10 owen is now known as owen-away
18:16 rhcl is now known as rhcl_inclass
18:19 nengard chris_n do i need a perl module for the patron card tool to work? cause i keep getting errorswhen clicking different links
18:19 chris_n nengard: you must install Graphics::Magick
18:20 nengard k that needs to be added to the about page
18:20 nengard installing now
18:21 nengard chris_n that wasn't it :)
18:21 nengard still getting errors when clicking links - off to bug report them for you
18:21 chris_n use the package maintainer's version as there is no cpan version
18:22 chris_n beware that Image::Magick will not work
18:24 chris_n nengard: that link works on two different installations here
18:25 chris_n does the error log say anything else?
18:25 nengard chris_n that was all another language for me .... what command do I type?
18:25 jdavidb left #koha
18:25 chris_n what kind of install are you running?
18:25 chris_n and do you have command line access?
18:26 nengard yes
18:26 nengard and i'm about to get you the log file as well
18:27 nengard is it possible that the errors are because I don't have templates/layouts/etc set up already
18:27 nengard and if so then we need to disable those links if you don't have things set up yet
18:27 nengard cause the new user will find nothing but errors :)
18:27 chris_n ?
18:27 chris_n nope
18:27 nengard oh oka :( darn - then hang on - getting error log now
18:28 chris_n all links are good regardless
18:28 * chris_n imagines something broke during your upgrade
18:28 chris_n if you are on dev install over git
18:29 nengard updated bug 4096 with error log
18:29 munin Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=4096 blocker, P5, ---,, NEW, Patron Card Tool throwing many errors
18:30 Colin joined #koha
18:30 chris_n nengard: I'm looking at bug 4094
18:30 munin Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=4094 critical, P5, ---,, NEW, link to manage images broken
18:31 nengard chris_n there were 2 bugs - one was 500 error the others were scripting errors
18:31 nengard so I split them up
18:31 chris_n nengard: your upgrade did not work
18:31 nengard heh
18:31 nengard lovely
18:31 chris_n and you are missing db tables
18:31 nengard hmm
18:31 nengard k - so will checking out a new branch work?
18:31 chris_n there have been a number of issue with over the past few months
18:31 nengard oh
18:32 nengard yeah - i did fix some of them
18:32 chris_n I would suggest starting over with a clean db
18:32 chris_n and run the webinstaller from scratch
18:32 chris_n then see if there are still errors
18:32 Colin if you use the current updatedatebase you need to delete the first two lines
18:32 nengard :( doing that loses my patron and catalog data - which means starting all over with subscriptions and stuff - which makes documenting hard -
18:33 schuster BACKUP!
18:33 wizzyrea afk
18:33 wizzyrea is now known as wizzy_lunch
18:34 schuster owen - what about intranet-print.css does that come into play?
18:34 nengard okay - brain is really tired - need to feed it - lunch time
18:34 nengard closed the bugs
18:37 chris_n nengard: you don't have to drop your current db, just create another and adjust koha-conf.xml accordingly
18:38 chris_n test what you like in patron cards and then switch back to your previous db
18:38 chris ok, off to catch my bus, might be a bit late to the meeting, my apologies if so
18:39 schuster LUNCH quick!
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18:47 cait joined #koha
18:48 cait hi koha
18:48 brendan heya cait
18:49 cait hi brendan
18:49 cait the meeting is in a few minutes, right?
18:50 brendan yes in about 10 minutes
18:50 brendan if I've done the time conversions correctly ;)
18:51 Colin I'll confirm it from the no-conversions timezone
18:52 brendan thanks Colin
18:52 cait :)
18:53 Vickiteal joined #koha
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18:59 thd-away is now known as thd
19:00 nengard dog decided to get sick all over the carpet - i'm here but cleaning
19:01 tim joined #koha
19:02 imp :(
19:02 slef Hi all.
19:02 gmcharlt it's time, I believe
19:03 Lee Sorry off to another meeting but I will read transcript
19:03 Sharon joined #koha
19:03 davi hi
19:03 wizzy_lunch hey peps
19:03 slef wizzy_lunch: YO!
19:03 wizzy_lunch is now known as wizzyrea
19:04 rosa joined #koha
19:04 slef gmcharlt: are you in the chair, or is someone with no LL/PTFS links better?
19:05 gmcharlt I'll chair if nobody else steps up, but would agree that somebody else should do it
19:05 thd slef: what are gmcharlt's LibLime / PTFS links anymore?
19:05 slef OK.  Any volunteers to chair?
19:05 slef thd: ex-worker.  Purely history, but even so.
19:06 thd slef: I nominate you
19:06 slef thd: swine ;-)  Anyone else? (please?)
19:06 gmcharlt thd: none currently, but I did sign an NDA with LL and not personally likely to inspire much cooperation from kados on this matter
19:06 Vickiteal Galen is RM
19:07 Vickiteal I think he is trustworthy.
19:07 gmcharlt Vickiteal: right, but I'm purposely trying to keep my RM role separate from the foundation-forming issue
19:07 gmcharlt but thanks
19:07 owen-away is now known as owen
19:07 * chris_n seconds slef
19:07 thd I would volunteer but I am in great pain and will go see a doctor some time after the meeting
19:07 slef okay so - I call this meeting to order
19:07 slef and we should all start with introductions
19:07 slef MJ Ray, member of
19:07 chris_n Chris Nighswonger, FBC
19:07 * gmcharlt = Galen Charlton, 3.2 RM, Equinox
19:08 * cait = Katrin Fischer, BSZ
19:08 * wizzyrea = Liz Rea, NEKLS
19:08 Jo joined #koha
19:08 owen Owen Leonard, Nelsonville Public Library
19:08 tajoli Zeno Tajoli, CILEA, Italy
19:08 * nengard Nicole C. Engard - Doc Manager & ByWater Solutions
19:08 davi Davi Diaz, worker for
19:08 thd Thomas Dukleth, Agogme, New York City
19:08 Nate Nate Curulla ByWater Solutions
19:08 jwagner Jane Wagner, PTFS
19:08 Jo Joann Ransom, Horowhenua Library Trust, NZ
19:08 rosa Rosalie Blake formerly HLT
19:08 schuster schuster = David Schuster Plano ISD/KUDOS
19:08 brendan Brendan Gallagher, ByWater Solutions
19:08 Jo apologies from George Sue (travelling)
19:08 sekjal-away Ian Walls, NYU Health Sciences Libraries
19:08 magnus Magnus Enger, Libriotech, Norway
19:08 Vickiteal Vicki Teal Lovely, South Central Library System, Madison, WI, US
19:08 Colin Colin Campbell, PTFS Europe
19:08 Sharon Sharon Moreland, NEKLS
19:09 sekjal-away is now known as sekjal
19:09 imp Martin Janitschke, CCC Hannover
19:09 wizzyrea apologies from Lee Philips, Butte Montana (another meeting)
19:09 indradg Indranil Das Gupta, L2C2 Technologies, Kolkata, India
19:09 slef OK - any further attendees, please announce yourself when you wish.
19:10 slef Report on DRAFT Horowhenua Library Trust KOHA Committee RULES.  Who wants to report on this?  Jo?
19:10 Jo sure.
19:10 slef please go ahead
19:10 Jo The trustees meeting for Januray was postponed - well cancelled really - and I will be submitting the draft rules to the next Trust meeting being held on 25th Feb.
19:11 Jo so any last minute suggestions before I take the draft should be done this week.
19:11 * Ropuch Piotr Wejman, Biblioteka CSNE, Poland
19:11 Jo I do want to clarify that the only task the community requests of HLT is to use best endeavours to secure the domain name and trademarks.
19:12 slef OK, I point out that there are a number of FIXMEs still in those draft rules.
19:13 slef Any other comments, or any questions?
19:13 owen Should we be discussing those FIXMEs now?
19:14 thd I hope that Bob would give attention to the FIXMEs
19:14 wizzyrea[…]ation:hlt:rules&s[]=committee&s[]=rules
19:14 slef Any opinion?  I'm minded to suggest that they should be taken up on the wiki.
19:15 chris_n I agree with slef; most of them are pretty straight forward
19:15 slef If the FIXMEs remain when they are submitted to the Trust, I think it's up to Bob or HLT
19:15 Jo +1
19:15 gmcharlt slef: wiki commentary is fine, but I think that a discussion on the Koha mailing list will ensure that everybody who is interested is aware of it
19:16 Jo the Trust may want to suggest tweaks as well
19:16 gmcharlt or at least a reminder sent to the lists to look at it
19:16 slef If it degenerates into wiki war, then we'll deal with that.
19:16 davi Will that committee be dissolved if we end turning to be an democratic Association
19:16 davi ?
19:16 chris_n I also agree with gmcharlt that a reminder to the list is in order
19:16 slef Yes, shall we take the FIXME topics to the mailing list in a reminder?
19:16 Jo Dai: That is my understanding
19:16 wizzyrea +!
19:16 wizzyrea +1 even
19:16 slef Who will post it?
19:17 * imp likes slef idea :)
19:17 davi +as a reminder to mailing list
19:17 chris_n slef: maybe not so much the fixmes, but a reminder to look
19:17 Jo I will
19:17 slef Thank you.
19:17 davi Will that committee be dissolved if we end turning to be an democratic Association?
19:17 slef OK, any further comments or questions?  Particularly from anyone who hasn't opined yet.
19:17 slef davi: "<Jo> Dai: That is my understanding"
19:18 davi ack
19:18 slef I think that was an ytpo.
19:18 hdl_laptop hi
19:18 Jo yep- my fingers are dyslexic :)
19:18 thd davi: That is actually covered in some language in the draft
19:18 slef ok, moving on
19:18 slef 3. Report on status of negotiations over assignment of trademarks and domains.
19:18 * hdl_laptop Henri-Damien LAURENT, BibLibre SARL
19:18 slef Is this Jo again?
19:18 Jo yep :)
19:19 slef sorry - please fill us in
19:19 chris back
19:19 Jo Biblibre and HLT have signed and submitted the documentation for tranferfring the EU trademark over to HLT.
19:19 * wizzyrea cheers
19:19 slef note: trademark application
19:19 cabillman joined #koha
19:19 brendan biblibre++
19:20 Jo unasked and at no cost :)
19:20 chris_n Biblibre++
19:20 slef I have a conflict of interest, but that is only a point of information.
19:20 Jo actually they carfrying all the costs
19:20 thd biblibre++
19:20 sekjal biblibre++, indeed
19:20 Lee left #koha
19:20 chris_n slef: surely you support this move
19:20 wizzyrea biblibre++
19:20 davi biblibre++
19:20 slef chris_n: it depends.  Let us discuss that another time.
19:20 chris_n right
19:20 magnus biblibre++
19:21 nengard biblibre++
19:21 slef nengard: you cannot modify your own karma!
19:21 Jo HLT has also written to John Yokley twice reminding him about the community wishes for the koha domain and trademark and that we look forwarding to working with him
19:21 nengard ??
19:21 Jo Maybe someone from PTFS might like to comment?
19:21 slef nengard: ;-)
19:21 thd chris_n: slef should speak for himself but his conflict is not really opposed as far as I know.
19:21 cait biblibre++
19:21 jwagner To forestall this and other questions, I'll repeat what I said the day the sale was announced.
19:21 chris Jo: i dont think that is fair to anyone from PTFS present, they dont have any authority to speak
19:22 Jo sure... it was a suggestion
19:22 chris all doing so woudl do, would be to get themselves in trouble
19:22 Jo fair enough.
19:22 jwagner (1) No decisions can be made until the sale is final (which it isn't yet).  (2) These decisions will be made above our pay grade. (3) We are not authorized to speak for the company, and are still under an NDA.
19:22 Jo John basically said said wait and see
19:22 schuster The sale is not final yet between LibLime and PTFS - probably another 2 weeks.
19:22 owen Thanks jwagner
19:23 Jo Cheers Jane.
19:23 hdl_laptop thanks jwagner
19:23 slef I bow to others' knowledge of PTFS structure, but I'm always saddened by non-autonomous workers.
19:23 schuster boy she had that statement typed up and ready to go!
19:23 thd I attended the PTFS press conference at ALA Midwinter
19:23 wizzyrea jwagner++ for clearing that up :)
19:23 slef Do we expect that anything will happen before the sale completes?
19:23 Jo so the upshot is that we need to wait for the Americans to ghet their act together :)
19:23 chris i certainly don't
19:24 gmcharlt agreed
19:24 chris_n +1
19:24 indradg ok
19:24 thd I could report from the public statements at the press conference that PTFS has not decided many questions
19:24 wizzyrea NEKLS has not had any particular inkling of what they plan to do with the domain names/trademarks
19:24 * chris_n imagines its hard to make decisions before a sale is final at any rate
19:24 braedon_ joined #koha
19:24 Jo and that is certainly the message I have been given: no decisions made
19:24 wizzyrea I know that we have expressed to the leadership our desire that the assets be returned to the community
19:25 slef Is there any more to report on the status of negotiations or shall we move on?
19:25 Jo +1
19:25 braedon_ is now known as braedon
19:25 Jo I think that it is vcritical for LL / PTFS to express their opinions to PTFS
19:25 Jo I have nothing more
19:26 slef 4. Possible suggestions on unresolved negotiations.
19:26 slef I guess we're now opening it to the floor.  What do we do?  Keep waiting how long after the sale completes, do you think?
19:26 thd Jo did you mean customers?
19:26 Jo yep
19:26 * chris_n moves that we wait for the transaction to complete/fail
19:26 Jo sorry - ll / ptfs clients
19:27 slef exyliadics of het wordl, untie!
19:27 owen NPL has voted with our feet :)
19:27 Jo The lack of access to the domain name is a real bummer
19:27 Jo NPL ++++
19:27 chris_n owen++
19:27 chris_n NPL++
19:27 magnus owen++
19:27 slef chris_n++
19:27 cait NPL++
19:27 indradg N
19:27 indradg NPL++
19:27 nengard NPL++
19:27 owen We were lucky to be in a position to do so. I know others might if their situation was different.
19:28 hdl_laptop NPL++
19:28 wizzyrea NPL++
19:28 chris lee from montana voted with her feet also
19:28 nengard chris - she did??
19:28 slef No-one has anything to add about unresolved negotiations?
19:28 Jo I think HLT should contact PTFS again in a month - no point any sooner,
19:28 wizzyrea well, she's voting with her payout
19:28 chris yeah
19:28 nengard that i knew
19:29 wizzyrea i.e. she hasn't paid for the next 10 months of support
19:29 chris shes going it alone rather than stick with the crud
19:29 slef OK, so "Next issues if negotiations have concluded." - they haven't.
19:29 Jo I suspect its going to be a long drawn out affair
19:29 gbengaadara joined #koha
19:29 slef So let's wrap up so you can all gossip about who is hosting who in a mo:
19:29 slef 6. Agree time of next meeting.
19:29 Jo 1 moment
19:30 slef ok, go on
19:30 Jo what can we do / should we do in the interim.
19:30 Jo this could easily go on for 3 months
19:30 Jo regarding access to thedomain
19:30 Jo listing for paid support etc
19:30 slef and remains pickled until then
19:30 chris yeah and the website sitll points to 3.0.4 .. and we cant list zeno etc
19:30 Jo that seems to be a poblem for the community, or am i overstating this?
19:30 nengard It's a big problem
19:30 owen Definitely a problem.
19:30 nengard I have the manual to publish
19:30 gmcharlt Jo: it's an ongoing problem, yes
19:30 slef some of it we can update (wiki), some of it we have limited updates (bugs) and others are stuck
19:30 hdl_laptop it surely is
19:30 nengard and the newsletter
19:31 Jo so do we have options to consider?
19:31 thd from the press conference: PTFS will not change LLEK while evaluating it for 3 months.  Does not say anything about trademarks and domains but calls for patience.
19:31 chris i dont care 2 cents about LLEK
19:31 nengard i would say we could register a new domain or use someone elses' for a while - but that's silly because all links go to
19:31 chris if ppl wanna let themselves be locked in, so be it
19:31 slef Difficult, not silly.
19:31 wizzyrea I think there needs to be at least a secondary hosting spot. The further out of date gets the more likely people are to look for more up to date info
19:31 Jo we can get the word out between us
19:31 chris all i want is the website back in community control
19:31 chris so its not full of lies
19:32 nengard slef - silly if we do eventaully get back
19:32 Jo agreed
19:32 slef chris: I think thd is taking that as a signal that PTFS won't change things.
19:32 schuster Jo - when you make your next contact you may want to point out those specifics to John Y and Patrick J - so they are aware how heavily the community used to rely on LibLime - they may not be aware that they are holding us up.
19:32 slef nengard: not really.  We just Redirect permanent one site to the other.
19:32 thd no slef
19:32 wizzyrea I would say that PTFS is asking LL clients lots of questions
19:32 slef chris: well, not in the immediate.
19:32 nengard so then chris don't you have a koha domain - can we start using that?
19:32 nengard and then set up redirects if things change?
19:32 chris i dont
19:32 thd I am stating that we should give PTFS a chanc to consider their position
19:32 wizzyrea thd++
19:33 Jo I would suggest that we can't wait another 3 months
19:33 slef nengard: then we keep all the search engine juice.
19:33 wizzyrea they do have an awful lot to consider.
19:33 chris they could at least let someone edit the website while they consider
19:33 thd At this point, the deal is not yet even closed.
19:33 chris i hardly think that is asking much
19:33 chris for crying out loud
19:33 magnus but LL aren't going to give up anything now, are they? and PTFS isn't really in a position to hand anything over as long as the deal is not finalized, i would think?
19:33 Jo so is that an option: we ask PTFS for editing rights to the wiki
19:33 Ropuch chris++
19:33 wizzyrea when it is legally theirs then we can ask
19:33 nengard chris++
19:33 slef Jo: we have the wiki.  We don't have www.
19:33 Jo ok.
19:33 sekjal just did a quick Google search on 'koha'.  Second relevant hit is Wikipedia
19:33 Vickiteal PTFS does not own LL yet. They cannot give you access to the web site.
19:33 slef well, most of the wiki
19:34 sekjal could we make it a point to update Wikipedia to the most correct info?
19:34 hdl_laptop Jo++
19:34 wizzyrea 2nd vickiteal
19:34 imp how about a (second) domain, which can be used later for user based stuff (manual, ...) and maybe use it for everything / as second domain for specific stuff if we get the othre one back?
19:34 Jo well lets ask LL and PTFS jointly
19:34 tajoli As CILEA we have
19:34 chris Vickiteal: they surely have some influence, im sure they could say, joshua stop being a dick
19:34 chris i mean cmon
19:34 chris_n Jo++
19:34 imp .oO(whois -> not found)
19:34 Jo my thoughts exactly
19:34 chris this is freaking retarded
19:34 slef Vickiteal: you may know US law more than most of us. If both PTFS and LL agree, can't we get access?
19:34 slef imp: too long, contains a -
19:34 Jo it would forestall a rename / rebrand / relaunch
19:34 gmcharlt slef: it would boil down to LL alone agreeing, until they are bought
19:35 nengard slef it's not a law thing - it's a who owns the server thing
19:35 Vickiteal This conversation is rapidly degrading.
19:35 chris ppl are installing old versions of software because thats what the website points to
19:35 Jo I'd say they would probably accept it as an interim soluition
19:35 chris my patience with this situation is rapidly wearing thin
19:35 thd slef: you can get access if access is granted or control is transferred
19:35 nengard Vickiteal - i think that we're asking for something necessary - not degrading the conversation
19:35 nengard we're problem solving
19:35 richard joined #koha
19:35 chris seriously, the US is causing a big mess for the rest of the world, and its getting old
19:35 nengard trying ot come up with a way to fix things
19:35 Jo yep.
19:35 Vickiteal All I'm saying is PTFS has no control over the web site and they have other things they are worrying about now.
19:36 nengard chris - HEY! Don't blame the whole country!!
19:36 Jo yep. and the koha community is bigger than PTFS
19:36 nengard Okay - so I think we need to set up a home for an up to date koha site
19:36 slef So we've asked LL for access before and not got it.
19:36 chris_n PTFS *could* exercise a deal of force on LL to give us access, however
19:36 Jo and we need a way to function effectively
19:36 slef Who has what nice koha domain?
19:36 Jo what do we lose by asking ?
19:36 thd We should at least wait until PTFS has effective control when the deal is completed
19:36 slef PTFS has still
19:36 wizzyrea more disappointment
19:36 nengard Jo nothing - i think we should ask - but we need an alternative option as well
19:36 Jo wizzyrea: we can handle that
19:37 Jo absolutely agree
19:37 thd The announcement had been that the deal would be completed by the beginning of February
19:37 hdl_laptop is for kohala
19:37 slef Anyone here got a nice koha domain already, or shall we go searching/buying?
19:37 wizzyrea we just got word that it will be an extra 2 weeks
19:37 wizzyrea last friday
19:37 chris thomas brevik has openkoha
19:37 slef is good but probably should remain in French?
19:37 Jo i like openkoha
19:37 magnus is on friendly hands
19:37 imp chris: sounds fine
19:37 thd I expect that we would not have long to wait for the deal to be completed
19:37 slef I hate openkoha.
19:37 cait i have - not used
19:38 chris yeah im not super partial to it either
19:38 Jo its an interim name
19:38 nengard freekoha is avail
19:38 slef koha.something or kohaSomething.gtld would be better
19:38 nengard no one owns it
19:38 gmcharlt we could keep it limited for now, perhaps do to substitute for
19:38 Jo i like freekoha too
19:38 Jo (it sounds like a call to arms thouggh ... a Braveheart thing)
19:38 chris_n
19:38 * wizzyrea roars with bestial vigor
19:38 indradg Jo++
19:38 slef chris_n: is that available?
19:38 chris heh
19:39 slef blimey... I must have typod it earlier
19:39 owen seems to be available
19:39 wizzyrea ooh, I like that
19:39 wizzyrea owen
19:39 slef owen: too
19:39 imp owen: why .com and not .org?
19:39 tajoli is used
19:39 nengard chris_n is not avail
19:39 nengard is
19:39 owen too imp
19:39 wizzyrea ooh, nengard also with a good one
19:40 wizzyrea i do like
19:40 chris yeah .org would be my preference
19:40 nengard me too
19:40 gmcharlt there a lot of potential domains containing the word koha that we could - I suggest we go back to the bigger question
19:40 Jo +1
19:40 wizzyrea
19:40 slef gmcharlt: which is?
19:40 gmcharlt do we set up a whole alternative website now?
19:40 Sharon
19:40 imp owen: i know it's free ;)
19:40 thd gmcharlt++
19:40 gmcharlt just pieces of it (e.g., download)
19:40 nengard gmcharlt i htink that's what we have to do - an entire site - there is way too much out of date and unreliable info
19:40 gmcharlt or wait until we know the final disposition of the LL/PTFS sale
19:40 wizzyrea I think you probably want the download, and the pay for support
19:40 nengard in my opinion
19:40 Sharon I think be hopeful and work on the assumption that will come back to us eventually
19:40 wizzyrea the things we can't fiddle with
19:41 slef I think we should keep it simple for now: download, links, manual.  What do others think?
19:41 magnus slef++
19:41 indradg slef: ++
19:41 nengard okay - tell me if i'm going off track - but if we don't do the whole site how the heck do we let people who know nohtng about koha koha that there is a diff site for downloads and support?
19:41 Ropuch slef++
19:41 cait will we keep the website when we get the domain or will we need a new site anyway?
19:41 thd slef: I understand that we could easily reproduce the old pre-plone website
19:42 schuster slef++
19:42 collum slef++
19:42 chris_n slef++
19:42 gmcharlt nengard: I think a homepage to explain what's going on would suffice
19:42 slef nengard: we market it. is not actively marketed at the moment, as far as I understand it.
19:42 hdl_laptop cait++
19:42 sekjal I'm inclined to be patient while PTFS figures things out.  We of course request whatever action is possible, but moving to rebrand is a lot of work to undertake if we're just going to get back again later.
19:42 gmcharlt we can rely on marketing to educate Google
19:42 slef nengard: for example, we all link it from our library mailing list sigs, which will appear on
19:42 wizzyrea not to mention that a homepage that explains what's going on and what has happened could be an effective leverage tool :P
19:42 slef we put link it from the listinfo pages
19:42 chris_n sekjal: this would not be rebranding atm
19:42 slef and so on
19:42 Jo we don't have to rebrand as such, buyt we will need a whole new website regardless
19:42 nengard okay
19:43 gmcharlt I favor slef's suggestion of a limited-purpose website for now
19:43 Jo so why not get the new site up and ruinning on whatever new domian we settle on
19:43 chris ditto
19:43 chris limited purpose for now
19:43 chris_n we install a redirect when/if we get the main domain back
19:43 Jo then shift it over to the if / when we get the domain back
19:43 wizzyrea limited-purpose_website++
19:43 davi
19:43 sekjal alright, sounds good
19:43 slef Thinking back, one problem with is will people look there for downloads and vendors, or only for support/chat?
19:43 cait Jo++
19:43 davi also good
19:44 thd I worry that actually making a new website live might be interpreted as a message of aggression by PTFS when they have not had an opportunity to respond from a position of control
19:44 slef
19:44 chris slef: i just want a place that has accurate information about the latest version
19:44 Jo i think we need to show that the koha community is a 'together' thing who knows what its doing.
19:44 davi
19:44 imp davi: belongs to ptfs
19:44 davi :P
19:44 chris_n thd: he who hesitates is lost....
19:44 Sharon I agree with Jo
19:44 Jo having info spread over a number of sites isn't especially organised or 'together'
19:44 davi imp: When they got it? !
19:44 davi I proposed it some week ago?
19:44 davi here
19:44 Jo we don't ned to be held to ransom here by PTFS.
19:45 imp davi: Created On:31-Mar-2009 03:07:26 UTC
19:45 davi ah
19:45 thd chris_n: I would not hesitate except for the prospect of a change of control
19:45 Jo lets get on with a new site, host oit on a new domian and shift it back when'if we can
19:45 wizzyrea davi: there was a big kerfuffle about it
19:45 slef thd: I think as long as we're clear that we're putting a minimal site live because there is stale info on a site we have no access too, they shouldn't see it as agression.
19:45 Vickiteal PTFS is not holding you ransom. It is LL.
19:45 slef thd: if they do, then that would speak volumes.
19:45 Jo thank you Vicki
19:45 imp jo++
19:45 chris_n thd: a clear explanation on the main page should do to defuse concern
19:46 chris if PTFS said, as soon as the deal is concluded, you can edit the website again
19:46 wizzyrea I know of at least 4 customers of LL that have told PTFS that they want the assets transferred back to the community
19:46 chris problem solved
19:46 thd slef: thank you, I like that answer
19:46 Jo and that it is ideally a temporary measure until we get back
19:46 chris as long as they are silent, they are in effect dangling a sword over us
19:46 imp i would try to avoid using domainnames just differing by a "-" in the middle
19:46 thd chris_n++
19:46 gmcharlt I move that however the substitue domain is acquired, that it be held or transferred to HLT
19:46 davi Is taken?
19:46 wizzyrea +!
19:46 thd chris: I agree
19:46 Sharon as long as we're transparent with the intent of the new site, I see no problem
19:46 wizzyrea +1
19:46 slef gmcharlt++
19:47 chris_n gmcharlt++
19:47 tajoli +1
19:47 owen +1
19:47 slef davi: yes, PTFS. Use whois to check them.
19:47 imp +1
19:47 thd gmcharlt: that is essential
19:47 davi :P
19:47 chris_n would HLT handle the setup of the new site?
19:47 gmcharlt Jo: will HLT accept it - particular given that this is something that I think that we'll want to set up quickly?
19:47 Jo can someone please clarify exactly what is it we are all in agreement to :)
19:47 chris so if we could get PTFS to say "After the deal is concluded we will restore access rights to the community to the website"
19:47 chris then none of this has to happen
19:48 wizzyrea chris: i'm not sure that it has been decided by them :(
19:48 Jo gmcharlt: yes. HLT will absolutely accept it. Committed to supporting the kopha community
19:48 slef Jo: "the substitue domain be held by or transferred to HLT"
19:48 chris but i dont think that without a promise, we can delay even longer
19:48 owen If I were PTFS I'd rather transfer ownership of the domain than deal with the practicalities of granting outsiders access.
19:48 davi What about get and or ?
19:48 wizzyrea chris: then we are doing the right thing getting a new domain
19:48 davi They are free
19:48 wizzyrea and when we know for sure, we can work out the logistics of it then
19:48 thd As Vickiteal stated, PTFS is concentrating attention on other issues
19:49 slef So, this is my understanding: a limited website with a clear explanation of why it exists, on a domain with HLT as the registrant and admin contact?
19:49 Sharon +1
19:49 Jo my preference is a near full subsitute website
19:49 gmcharlt chris: is there a suitable maori expression for "Koha For All" or the like that might make a suitable domain?
19:49 owen Is HLT in a position right now to register a domain?
19:49 Jo yes.
19:49 davi I like  libKoha,org     It is free yet
19:49 Jo have my creditcard in hand :)
19:49 cait Jo++
19:49 slef owen: we can register it for them if not.  These are details.
19:49 richard left #koha
19:50 Jo can we vote on whether a partial or full website please
19:50 slef is also free, but maybe that is UKish
19:50 slef ok, votes! partial or full?
19:50 Jo and also settle on a domian name
19:50 slef partial IMO
19:50 davi full
19:50 nengard i'm had US libraries call it a LMS
19:50 Jo full
19:50 gmcharlt LMS works for USians too, although it's not as common
19:50 nengard full
19:50 Sharon I think partial leaves the door open to getting back
19:50 sekjal partial
19:50 gmcharlt partial
19:51 owen partial
19:51 chris_n partial
19:51 imp partial
19:51 hdl_laptop partial
19:51 collum partial
19:51 wizzyrea partial
19:51 schuster partial
19:51 magnus partial
19:51 brendan partial - downloads and community information
19:51 Jo lol
19:51 Jo ok - i'll lie down now an dbe quiet
19:51 slef The partials have it?
19:51 thd partial for now
19:51 cait full
19:51 wizzyrea no no we like it when you talk Jo
19:51 wizzyrea ;)
19:51 davi would add confusion to lib-koha for PTFS, and so would be good for us
19:51 slef davi: Machiavelli.
19:51 rosa full
19:51 davi :)
19:51 Jo davi: i likke it
19:52 slef another silly idea:
19:52 chris heh
19:52 Sharon
19:52 chris_n lol
19:52 thd whatever domain we choose we could have other good choices point at the one being used
19:52 hdl_laptop davi: it is a tough idea
19:52 slef anyway, I'm sure that one sucks... do we have a clear domain leader yet?
19:52 davi Jo; Do you want I buy now?  Else who would buy it?
19:52 wizzyrea is available
19:52 davi hdl_laptop,   Do you want I buy now?  Else who would buy it?
19:53 Jo lets settle on the name now.
19:53 gmcharlt actually, I would prefer that it not  be - there is one one Koha
19:53 owen I prefer because I think "community koha" is a derogatory term invented by LibLime
19:53 Jo then i;ll buy to save transferring it
19:53 gmcharlt *only one Koha
19:53 richard joined #koha
19:53 magnus i think or some varient thereof would emphasise nicely the fact that this is the community taking control
19:53 Jo can someone please list the serious contenders for a domain name
19:53 slef yes, please don't all go buying domain names for HLT
19:53 Ropuch ;>
19:53 gmcharlt Jo: is one
19:53 * owen puts away his wallet
19:53 gmcharlt
19:53 thd wizzyrea: think about length and the difficulty of typing accurately also
19:54 davi magnus, We can add a subtible at with "Community" word
19:54 wizzyrea well you can't beat for that
19:54 gmcharlt
19:54 Sharon
19:54 rosa because it starts with koha (important) and is straightforward
19:54 slef,, and what else?  We're keen on being in .org I think.
19:54 magnus one koha to rule them all!
19:54 davi
19:54 Jo (sit down Magnus)
19:54 imp magnus: :D
19:54 thd wizzyrea: :)
19:54 wizzyrea thd :D
19:54 slef davi: already wrote that...
19:54 slef 3 options... any other good ones?
19:54 schuster The teacher in Jo comes out I see...
19:55 tirabo is available
19:55 cait magnus: lol
19:55 gmcharlt I move that we vote between,, and
19:55 chris_n seconded
19:55 Ropuch gmcharlt++
19:55 Jo +1
19:55 davi gmcharlt++
19:55 wizzyrea +1
19:55 imp +1
19:55 Sharon kohalms  sounds like 'alms for the poor'
19:55 nengard
19:55 cait +1
19:55 hdl_laptop
19:55 Jo I hate kohalms
19:55 thd I think that we should consider one issue first
19:55 slef ok, votes!, or
19:55 cait
19:56 gmcharlt
19:56 * owen votes
19:56 chris_n
19:56 imp
19:56 Jo
19:56 slef
19:56 chris +1
19:56 Sharon
19:56 wizzyrea
19:56 hdl_laptop
19:56 rosa
19:56 collum
19:56 chris to
19:56 Ropuch
19:56 schuster
19:56 brendan
19:56 sekjal
19:56 wizzyrea thd: you had an issue?
19:56 magnus
19:56 davi looks better
19:56 slef ok, I'm a minority of 1.
19:56 slef go for it
19:56 thd Remember that a .org domain could always be at risk  of being captured by the US trademark holder
19:57 Jo[…]
19:57 Jo is not available
19:57 slef heh
19:57 thd I do not think that is a present concern but we should not forget about that risk long term
19:57 davi Who have it?
19:57 slef ; whois
19:57 slef NOT FOUND
19:57 slef
19:57 imp slef: right, same here
19:57 Jo i can grab .net
19:57 chris_n
19:57 owen It says available to me
19:57 gmcharlt ok, if somebody just bought it for the benefit of HLT, please speak up NOW
19:57 chris_n says it is
19:58 thd davi:  LibLime hold the US trademark at  the moment
19:58 Jo Owen: can you buy it please
19:58 Jo for us
19:58 davi thd, noted, but it would not clash with
19:58 schuster I'm actually shocked that the IRC and discussion lists are still running with Katipo personally...
19:58 chris_n owen: doing it?
19:59 owen Yes
19:59 chris schuster: why?
19:59 wizzyrea owen++
19:59 Jo trust until people prove to be untrustworthy
19:59 chris jo: has it available
19:59 chris they are better than domainz too
19:59 chris so you can grab it there
19:59 * owen stops clicking
19:59 thd davi: *koha*.org would always be at risk as long as the community does not hold the trademark .
19:59 slef owen: got it?
20:00 wizzyrea Ack
20:00 owen Jo, are you looking now at
20:00 Jo ok - I have it
20:00 chris_n have what?
20:00 schuster chris - that's owned by LL too technically isn't it?
20:00 davi thd, ah, I see
20:00 slef thd: as long as we do not sell off the back of it, it is honest use
20:00 chris schuster: what????
20:00 chris hell no
20:00 slef thd: sorry, descriptive use.
20:01 chris schuster: pretty much dont believe anything you read on the LL website
20:01 * richard tunes in
20:01 chris ll never bought katipo
20:01 slef thd: are there particular rules for .org which put it at risk?
20:01 thd slef: yes but not as safe as *koha*.fr
20:01 richard schuster, liblime have never bought or have any financial interest in katipo
20:02 slef ok, so we have a domain - who wants to organise the development?
20:02 davi thd, As I understand tradermarsk, prefix *koha is allowed, but not koha* postfix
20:02 wizzyrea and who wants to hoste it
20:02 davi so libKoha would be ok
20:02 nengard i have room on my server for another site
20:02 * chris_n nominates owen
20:03 brendan we can host it too
20:03 davi For example, we have to ask to user GNU Herds, but not to use  Herds of GNUs
20:03 Jo all done.
20:03 thd can we not just easily use or adapt the old pre-Plone website?
20:03 slef we have one offer of hosting
20:03 chris_n Jo++
20:03 Jo
20:03 owen Jo++
20:03 chris the old site still exists in kea
20:03 magnus Jo++
20:03 slef thd: personally, it would be nice not to have to use Kea, but it is up to those doing the work IMO.
20:03 hdl_laptop Jo++
20:03 nengard my problem is that the old site is a static html site
20:03 nengard why not throw wordpress on a server and put up the pages necessary  then we can easily give everyone rights to edit things
20:03 thd slef: I was merely referring to expedience
20:03 slef (is Kea FOSS?)
20:03 wizzyrea NEKLS could host it
20:04 chris no
20:04 chris_n brendan++
20:04 davi Jo, thd,  I think  would clash with trademark, not not libKoha,org    What do you think thd?
20:04 chris i wasnt suggesting we use kea, we can just trigger it somewhere and have a full site in 15 mins
20:04 Jo should hlt host it
20:04 nengard hlt makes sense to me
20:04 wizzyrea if you have the server space and can, HLT would be best imo
20:04 Jo impartial / non-inflammatory etc
20:04 chris_n Jo: makes sense
20:04 gmcharlt agreed
20:04 slef ok, so we have two suggestions so far... I'll throw in my own suggestion of hosting with and/or using django-blocks.
20:04 Jo Chris: is there a cost we will have to carry?
20:05 thd davi: koha anything or anything koha could be an issue but I do not think that it is a real problem at the present time
20:05 gmcharlt main thing that anybody offering to host shoudl keep in mind that with release of 3.2 alpha and 3.0.6, there will be a fair amount of bulk download traffic
20:05 Jo I'm open to
20:05 wizzyrea bandwidth is always a cost
20:05 slef five offers of hosting, three offers of platforms
20:05 davi ack thd.  I thought only postfix would be a problem, not prefix
20:05 gmcharlt so in particular, if anybody is willing to participate by running mirrors of the downlaods, that might be great
20:05 imp erm, afaik, it's ok to use a trademark, as long as you are using it /right/. so you can use cola-critic, if write critical stuff on it, but not just for "fun"
20:05 wizzyrea We are in EC2 with our server
20:05 Jo we happy to but can't carry a financial burden
20:05 khall why not use sourceforge for hosting downloads?
20:05 cait cant we make something like differnt mirrors for download?
20:05 chris_n gmcharlt took my words :-)
20:06 thd davi: The bad publicity of trying to stop the community would be a strong caution against any unfortunate action
20:06 gmcharlt (also, mirrors in east asia, europe, and north america would be desirable anyway)
20:06 Jo mirrors +1
20:06 slef can we organise a bittorrent to make downloads lighter on the hoster?
20:06 * wizzyrea volunteers to mirror
20:06 hdl_laptop we could host mirrors here at biblibre
20:06 * braedon chimes in that he has some bandwidth going to waste if it is needed
20:06 davi ack thd
20:06 chris_n why don't we appoint someone to head this up?
20:06 davi bittorrent++
20:06 slef yes, who wants to organise... I saw someone try to put owen's hand up
20:06 chris_n then offers could be vetted by that person
20:07 owen Sorry folks, it's not a good time for me to take that job :(
20:07 Jo I quite like the idea of having a temp site up in half an hour using kea
20:07 slef ok, anyone else?
20:07 Jo and then we replace it over the next few weeks
20:08 magnus Jo++
20:08 thd Jo++
20:08 davi After having it, announce it
20:08 Jo not Chris or me (we are trying to go live with 3.)
20:08 Ropuch Jp++
20:08 Ropuch Jo__
20:08 Ropuch damn ;>
20:08 chris yeah i have about a trillion things to do
20:08 Jo does anyone want to volunteer to organise this
20:08 slef OK, I volunteer, but davi and mjkaye may flame me for that because I also have 1001 tasks backed up.
20:08 wizzyrea <- is willing
20:08 slef wizzyrea!
20:08 * wizzyrea ducks
20:08 chris_n wizzyrea++
20:08 * slef withdraws, quickly
20:08 owen wizzyrea++
20:08 gmcharlt I am willing to help organize as well, but my priority is going to be getting the alpha out
20:08 Jo wizzyrea+
20:08 thd wizzyrea++
20:09 chris_n wordpress wizard
20:09 Jo (slef: that was a hasty retreat :)
20:09 hdl_laptop wizzyrea++
20:09 gmcharlt wizzyrea++
20:09 sekjal wizzyrea++
20:09 Ropuch wizzyrea++
20:09 chris wordpress would work fine, with the widgets and stuff
20:09 magnus wizzyrea++
20:09 imp wizzyrea++
20:09 owen slef++ # for offering too
20:09 schuster wizzyrea++ - gmcharlt - aplpha, beta, final!
20:09 schuster wordpress++
20:09 wizzyrea I can do that super fast, and you all are wizards so if I need help you know who I'll be asking
20:09 schuster (a Texas favorite...:))
20:09 Jo so we have a domain, a partial wwebsite going up, what else?
20:09 slef wizzyrea: if you're using something I know (like wordpress, django, static html, or whatever), I'll do my damnedest to help, now I've opened my mouth.
20:10 wizzyrea I can do wp super ez
20:10 Jo slef +1
20:10 cait wizzyrea++
20:10 slef but everyone who wants to help, contact wizzyrea!
20:10 gmcharlt I think the main thing left is to organize download mirrors
20:10 wizzyrea yes
20:10 cait wordpress++
20:10 gmcharlt wordpress++
20:10 Jo a mirror on each continent would be good
20:10 nengard wordpress++
20:10 chris_n maybe those willing to host mirrors should contact wizzyrea directly?
20:10 richard wordpress would be nice and quick
20:10 gmcharlt I think anybody who wants to run a mirror and who can do so should be allowed to
20:11 slef ok, mirrorers? I think has some problem with mirroring just now, but biblibre is in the same country as us.
20:11 slef Are releases GPG-signed?  And there should be an md5sum on the www download page.
20:11 cait I have to ask about it
20:11 nengard wizzyrea - may I recommend wordpressmu ... then we can have a blog for the newsletter and one for koha news and one for ... etc etc etc
20:11 gmcharlt slef: releases are supposed to be signed with checksums
20:11 hdl_laptop releases are gpg signed
20:11 imp some stats around, how many downloads / traffic it causes per month?
20:11 hdl_laptop and there are md5summ also
20:11 slef gmcharlt: ok, thanks. Git does this stuff for me automatically now.
20:12 slef imp: we don't have access to stats to know, I think.
20:12 wizzyrea nengard: that would take longer but I'm open to that
20:12 slef wizzyrea: I have a wordpress mu git tree which I could upload to the host
20:12 wizzyrea longer = 15 minutes :P
20:13 wizzyrea instead of 5
20:13 wizzyrea I"m already to the point of configuring the DNS so...
20:13 nengard hehe
20:13 nengard awesome
20:13 magnus could we encourage people to get the alpha from git, to ease load on download servers?
20:13 wizzyrea whoever bought it and wants to put in the server info PM me plz
20:13 slef can hdl_laptop tell us any download stats for the release hosted on
20:14 indradg left #koha
20:14 wizzyrea brb, afk one min
20:14 nengard with MU we can easily create sites with subdomains - like etc
20:14 nengard so exciting
20:14 wizzyrea yes, but this is temp, nengard, remember ;)
20:14 hdl_laptop slef: would not be accurate since competed with that
20:14 thd please also ensure that domain control is transferred to HLT
20:14 slef magnus: on a related note, can gmcharlt or hdl_laptop run git pack on to make a tarball there?
20:14 gmcharlt slef: alas, no
20:14 nengard wizzyrea - temp yes - but i see it as us moving it to when we have that domain
20:14 slef hdl_laptop: no, but better than no info.
20:15 chris_n thd: Jo purchased it
20:15 gmcharlt at least, not on directly - we no longer have shell access
20:15 Jo I did.
20:15 gbengaadara left #koha
20:15 thd I thought so but was not certain it happened that way
20:16 slef ok, so we'll let everyone mirror, link them all and put verification instructions on the download page?
20:16 davi yep
20:16 wizzyrea nengard fair enough
20:16 davi checked via GPGsign
20:16 chris sounds good to me
20:16 imp slef: can we make a continent based round robin?
20:16 davi bittorrent advised too
20:17 slef imp: let's walk for the alpha/beta, run for the release?
20:17 Sharon who is best at wordsmithing?  The tone of the explanation for the creation of this site will be very important, so as not to piss off anyone
20:17 davi or we want to track downloads?
20:17 * wizzyrea is going to use wpmu, but it will take a few minutes longer, and require some DNS configuration
20:17 davi Sharon++
20:17 Jo wizzyrea: can you flick me an email please
20:18 imp slef: ok, technical stuff later :)
20:18 wizzyrea jo: yep, sec
20:18 Jo Rosalie
20:18 gbengaadara joined #koha
20:18 Vickiteal Not that it matters, but just for the record I'm starting to warm up to this idea.
20:18 Jo Rosalie is good at wordsmithing
20:18 Jo yippi!
20:19 slef OK, is there anything else left to decide right now?
20:19 Jo how about Rosalie (who has probably sloped off into the garden)
20:19 schuster Vickiteal is good with political goo and saying the right thing.
20:19 thd Rosalie++
20:19 slef (except the date of next meeting?)
20:19 Vickiteal Hah, hah schuster.
20:19 chris_n March 2?
20:19 rosa yes I'm happy to help with stuff I know about
20:20 collum Oh.  Is this still the meeting. - Garry Collum, Kenton County Public Library :)
20:20 slef 6. Agree time of next meeting.
20:20 gmcharlt +1 to March 2
20:20 nengard +!
20:20 davi +1
20:20 slef We have Tue 2 March suggested.  19:00?
20:20 chris_n +1
20:20 davi 19:00 ++
20:20 hdl_laptop +1 to March,2
20:20 imp +1
20:21 tajoli +1
20:21 thd ++
20:21 sekjal +1
20:21 Jo same time?
20:21 collum ++
20:21 slef Jo: yes
20:21 magnus +1
20:21 Jo someone will post notes for this meeting?
20:21 gmcharlt +1
20:21 slef OK, meeting adjourned until 19:00 Tuesday 2 March 2010 and congratulations to collum sneaking on the attendee list!
20:22 steven_tw joined #koha
20:22 Jo thanks everyone
20:22 slef Jo: yes. Do you need them before 25 Feb?
20:22 nengard left #koha
20:22 richard left #koha
20:23 slef Thanks all for participating and all the ideas shared freely.
20:23 davi Will be it a communitee meeting or and 'general' one?
20:23 chris hiya steven_tw :)
20:23 davi What is the difference?
20:23 chris_n community
20:23 slef davi: that will be community handover.
20:23 chris_n the general is a developer meeting in reality
20:24 davi ok, thanks
20:24 slef davi: CH meetings are about gathering materials with HLT
20:24 chris_n or maybe I should say development related
20:24 slef chris_n: USERS AND DEVELOPERS... I keep telling everyone ;-)
20:24 * slef runs
20:24 * chris_n knew that was coming as soon as he hit <enter>
20:24 chris_n ;-)
20:24 steven_tw hi chris
20:24 slef damn, predictability
20:24 wizzyrea jo: what's your email
20:25 wizzyrea lol I can't find it >.<
20:25 Topic for #koha is now Discussion channel for the Koha ILS | Next general IRC meeting at 19:00 on 9 Feb 2010
20:25 brendan awesomeness@hlt
20:25 owen Is that correct?
20:25 gmcharlt owen: yes
20:25 chris_n time is wrong maybe?
20:25 slef wizzyrea: I'll msg it you
20:25 wizzyrea ty slef
20:25 chris_n 1100 UTC according to wiki
20:25 chris_n gmcharlt: ?
20:26 richard joined #koha
20:26 MartinBrenner left #koha
20:26 tajoli for wiki: Tuesday, 09 February 2010 at 11:00 UTC+0
20:27 rosa is now known as rosagardening
20:27 gmcharlt chris_n: you're right, it's 11:00 UTC+0
20:27 Topic for #koha is now Discussion channel for the Koha ILS | Next general IRC meeting at 11:00 UTC on 9 Feb 2010
20:27 owen Thanks chris_n
20:28 schuster wizzyrea - I'm waiting to be wowed... ;)
20:28 wizzyrea they wanted MU, it takes a little longer ;)
20:28 jwagner I thought the meeting next week was on Wednesday.  It's Tuesday?
20:29 tajoli left #koha
20:29 * owen gives schuster a "Moo!" in the meantime
20:30 schuster Now if I could only get that stuff to print...  Guess I'll have to give up until I can get to a higher release.
20:31 Jo sorry - was on phone
20:31 braedon chris_n: now that the meeting is over, apologies for not getting back to you yesterday. I will give the patch a try today, and see what happens
20:32 owen Can someone "select suggestedon from suggestions" and tell me if they're getting an dates? Looks to me like suggestion dates aren't stored
20:34 magnus is now known as magnus_away
20:35 collum owen: suggestedon is not a column in my table.  I have a date which is defined by a timestamp.
20:35 hdl_laptop owen should be suggesteddate
20:36 owen Well, I'm glad I asked :)
20:36 * owen wonders how he got into this predicament
20:37 schuster schuster still mooing...  people in the office looking at him funny...
20:38 cait why does schuster moo?
20:38 hdl_laptop owen: ancient code was with suggestedon and not suggesteddate, I thought I had fixed any occurence of suggestedon.
20:39 owen hdl_laptop: Database updates seem to be a weak point in the upgrade process. I must have skipped something by mistake.
20:40 indradg joined #koha
20:40 * owen still doesn't see data in suggesteddate after adding a new suggestion
20:41 hdl_laptop hi indradg
20:41 tirabo left #koha
20:43 wizzyrea way early, but (working on the DNS now)
20:43 cabillman left #koha
20:43 chris_n wizzyrea++ # nice :-)
20:43 wizzyrea could have been even faster but you wanted MU. PF.
20:44 wizzyrea pff, that is ;)
20:44 Ropuch ;>
20:44 hdl_laptop owen: seen the bug
20:44 hdl_laptop owen: in opac/
20:44 hdl_laptop replace suggestioncreateddate by suggesteddate
20:44 joetho joined #koha
20:47 Colin left #koha
20:47 gbengaadara left #koha
20:48 joetho @karma wizzyrea
20:48 munin joetho: Karma for "wizzyrea" has been increased 47 times and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 47.
20:49 wizzyrea now that is just scary
20:49 chris she deserves it
20:49 cait :)
20:49 wizzyrea heh, we'll see soon enough >.>
20:49 brendan @karma chris
20:49 munin brendan: Karma for "chris" has been increased 103 times and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 103.
20:49 brendan nice nothing negative about chris
20:49 jwagner @karma jwagner
20:49 munin jwagner: Karma for "jwagner" has been increased 16 times and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 16.
20:49 joetho @karma vickiteal
20:49 munin joetho: Karma for "vickiteal" has been increased 2 times and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 2.
20:50 wizzyrea because you're awesome like that
20:50 chris probably deserve a -- for my crack about the US today tho
20:50 cait @karma cait kf
20:50 munin cait: cait kf has neutral karma.
20:50 wizzyrea @karma kf
20:50 munin wizzyrea: Karma for "kf" has been increased 6 times and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 6.
20:50 wizzyrea @karma cait
20:50 munin wizzyrea: Karma for "cait" has been increased 2 times and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 2.
20:50 cait ok, I need to decide who I am
20:50 wizzyrea def
20:50 wizzyrea I'm always getting confused
20:50 joetho @karma joetho
20:50 wizzyrea (and that sounds like a very existential statement)
20:50 munin joetho: joetho has neutral karma.
20:50 wizzyrea joetho++ for being awesome
20:50 wizzyrea @karma joetho
20:50 munin wizzyrea: Karma for "joetho" has been increased 1 time and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 1.
20:50 cait started koha in my free time mostly - so it was cait , kf is my work self
20:52 jwagner left #koha
20:53 brendan joetho++
20:53 Vickiteal I stepped away from desk for a few minutes and there is all this stuff about mooing and karma. You guys are funny.
20:53 Vickiteal I agree with my Karma at 2 and Chris at 103. I'm grateful for the 2.
20:54 Jo wow - playing hardball. with hotels is resulting iun some quite good accom discounts for KohaCon 2010
20:54 cait chris probably deserves more... I forget about the karma thing most of the times when he helps me with something
20:54 schuster @karma schuster
20:54 munin schuster: Karma for "schuster" has been increased 12 times and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 12.
20:54 gmcharlt Jo: not surprising - for the upcoming Evergreen conference, the committee practically had hotels begging to host it
20:54 khall left #koha
20:54 schuster Wow wonder how that happened!
20:57 * owen had a suggestions.managedon column instead of suggestions.manageddate too
20:57 Ropuch gmcharlt: I wish some airlines would beg me for allowe them to take me to NZ ;>
20:58 owen Me too Ropuch
20:58 gmcharlt heh
20:58 Vickiteal left #koha
20:59 cait Ropuch: tell me if you find one :)
20:59 Ropuch hehe
21:00 imp same here :D
21:01 * Ropuch has just finished writing 'Installing Koha for my mom' ;>
21:02 chris :-)
21:03 Ropuch Now I;'m working on part 1 - "Installing Ubuntu on VirtualBox for my mom"
21:03 Ropuch I plan to do some tutorials with "My mom can do this" certificate
21:05 braedon haha
21:05 braedon link?
21:06 chris_n owen: is the left menu in messed up in your development install?
21:06 Ropuch braedon:
21:06 Ropuch But it's in polish
21:07 owen chris_n: I just submitted a patch for it today
21:07 chris_n ahh... cool
21:08 braedon Ropuch: ...oh. To google translate!
21:08 Ropuch Looking through translation atm ;>
21:09 braedon i'l have a read through on my lunch break. (two hours or so:( )
21:22 magnus_away it works!
21:22 magnus_away is now known as magnus
21:22 chilts sweet! :)
21:22 * chilts still needs to read the meeting logs this morning
21:22 chris wizzyrea++
21:23 magnus wizzyrea++
21:23 chilts can we go and signup a new blog?
21:24 wizzyrea not quite yet
21:24 wizzyrea still setting it up
21:24 wizzyrea :)
21:24 * chilts holds back
21:24 wizzyrea thks :)
21:24 chilts :)
21:24 imp wizzyrea++
21:24 chilts wizzyrea++
21:24 chris chilts: its more a replacement partial site for
21:24 chilts ah, ok
21:24 owen chilts: Read the meeting log for all the gory details
21:24 chilts righto ... :)
21:24 chilts sorry
21:24 chilts just got excited there
21:24 chris including me slandering an entire nation
21:24 chris chris--
21:24 munin chris: Error: You're not allowed to adjust your own karma.
21:24 chilts lol
21:24 chilts yeah, saw that
21:25 chilts slapped down :)
21:25 wizzyrea chris__
21:25 wizzyrea chris--
21:25 wizzyrea there, just because
21:25 chris hehe
21:25 magnus hehe, someone had to do it... ;-)
21:25 owen Now everyone will wonder what the negative karma was for
21:25 owen chris, you can spread rumors about a violent outburst, many tears shed all around.
21:27 owen I wonder if we should not be allowing patrons to delete suggestions which have been accepted?
21:27 magnus good night, all - can't wait to see what the site will look like in the morning ;-)
21:27 magnus left #koha
21:30 sekjal left #koha
21:32 cait imp++ # for being a nice person ;)
21:32 chris_n bbl
21:33 wizzyrea bah, no nengard
21:33 owen quitting_time++ # for being now
21:33 owen left #koha
21:33 cait time to sleep here :)
21:35 Nate left #koha
21:41 cait left #koha
21:43 chris brendan: got a sec?
21:43 brendan yes
21:43 chris do you guys have a 3.0.5 demo running?
21:44 brendan no - just HEAD
21:44 brendan I could get one up
21:44 chris i have one but i break it daily
21:44 chris playing with translations
21:44 wizzyrea
21:44 wizzyrea i r a thief
21:44 chris :)
21:45 chris is the old site, still up
21:45 wizzyrea ohhh good call
21:45 chris if there is anythign there you want
21:45 mib_tkfbis joined #koha
21:45 brendan I could switch one of my demo's to 3.0.5 for you if you want it
21:45 wizzyrea that is up to you
21:46 mib_tkfbis left #koha
21:46 chilts the old site is better than the Plone one :)
21:46 chris plone is a bit stink
21:46 * wizzyrea is not a plone fan
21:57 schuster wizzyrea is a wizz...  looking good...
21:57 schuster I'll stop mooing now.
21:57 Jo chilts: are you doing the kohacon 2010 website?
21:58 Jo I have updates for the accommodation which I'd like to email you.
21:59 chris you can edit that page yourself Jo
21:59 chris if you want
21:59 chilts Jo: yep ... but I can always give you access to update it yourself (if you have a Google Account)?
21:59 chilts so either/or .... andychilton -at- gmail -dot- com
22:00 Jo I have a google account
22:00 chilts message me your email and I'll add you, or chris can do it too
22:02 Jo wizzyrea: you are soooo clever :)
22:03 wizzyrea we'll see, jo ;)
22:04 braedon wizzyrea: missing a <p> block around the Library Standards Compliant paragraph of the about page
22:04 wizzyrea ah ty, will look, tis just copy/paste
22:05 wizzyrea better?
22:05 braedon yip :)
22:11 collum left #koha
22:12 schuster left #koha
22:14 gmcharlt wizzyrea++
22:18 pmlozeau joined #koha
22:18 chris hi pmlozeau
22:18 pmlozeau hi chris
22:19 collum joined #koha
22:20 chris richard: you about?
22:20 richard hey chris
22:21 chris katipo wanna be on here ?
22:21 richard sure do
22:21 chris braedon: ditto you guys
22:21 chris richard: wanna drop me an email with what you want it to say, and ill make it so
22:21 richard cool
22:21 richard thanks chris
22:22 richard oooh it's alphabetical ;)
22:22 chris yup, no judgement implied at all :)
22:22 chilts wow, that site is going up pretty fast :)
22:22 chilts well done guys :)
22:22 joetho make vendors ASK to be listed
22:22 joetho ha ha ha ha
22:23 chris what you do joe is make them ask, then ignore them for months
22:23 brendan hmm... can't add a patron category on -   (for current
22:23 chris oh wait, we wanted to do it different
22:23 pmlozeau Could we update our entry on the list? (I work for inLibro)
22:23 braedon chris: i shall ask steven
22:23 chris thanks braedon
22:23 wizzyrea gmcharlt++ for using the event calendar function j^.^
22:23 chris pmlozeau: you sure can
22:23 wizzyrea fyi, this is very much like how KLOW works
22:23 chris what would you like instead?
22:23 wizzyrea you can see why we like it
22:24 pmlozeau can I send it to you by email? I'll double check with Eric Begin
22:24 chris sure can
22:24 pmlozeau perfect
22:25 brendan yup I need to update my phone number too -- (888) 900-8944
22:29 chris hows that now brendan
22:29 brendan thanks chris
22:30 brendan just missing the part where it says "bywater has programmed %XX of koha"
22:30 brendan I know bad joke
22:30 * brendan goes back into hiding
22:30 chris hehe
22:41 gmcharlt @later tell nengard is there a rendered HTML view of the Koha 3.2 docbook anywhere?  might be something for you, BibLibre and/or brendan to set up quickly
22:41 munin gmcharlt: The operation succeeded.
22:43 brendan gmcharlt there is one
22:43 brendan I think chris has got it on his site
22:43 chris yeah i have a couple
22:43 chris
22:43 chris pmlozeau: updated the address
22:44 gmcharlt cool - does it get updated automatically / periodically?
22:44 chris yeah, but thats my homeserver so id rather it doesnt get linked to, but that we put it somewhere else :)
22:46 pmlozeau chris: thanks!
23:01 thd is now known as thd-away
23:02 Jo left #koha
23:11 pianohackr|work joined #koha
23:12 gmcharlt for those who missed the meeting - has been set up as a temporary home away from home - domain is held by HLT, hosting of the Wordpress site by wizzyrea
23:17 chris[…]=10623790&ref=rss
23:20 gmcharlt chris: oops, sorry, I redid my retweet to not put words in your mouth
23:20 chris no worries :-)
23:22 Jo joined #koha
23:26 pmlozeau left #koha
23:29 brendan gmcharlt++
23:29 brendan I like the picture you have for twitter
23:33 chris hey Jo, see the new site?
23:33 gmcharlt brendan: thanks
23:35 Jo yep - and it is beautiful
23:41 rhcl_inclass gee, is the IRC meeting still going on?
23:41 rhcl_inclass is now known as rhcl
23:41 chris hehe no
23:41 chris finished hours ago, irc is like this most days
23:42 rhcl I was reading the log just now, looked like it continued for a couple of hours at least
23:42 chris bout 1.5 hours ... tis pretty standard
23:42 gmcharlt we know not the the meaning of "short meeting" :)
23:43 joetho whoa chris I'm glad I checked here, I just changed my dox link to the link you gave me
23:43 chris yeah dont be doing that please :-)
23:43 chris the will end up probably at docs.koha-community or something
23:43 joetho I will fix it tomorrow. I am quite sure NEKLS will host that
23:43 joetho or wherever.
23:43 chris i only have 40gig a month bandwidth
23:44 chris before i have to pay extra
23:44 joetho whoa
23:44 joetho I will fix it now
23:44 rhcl can anybody recommend a domain registrar?
23:44 chris godaddy is annoying, but cheap
23:44 chris i use them for my domain
23:45 rhcl yea, that's who I usually use, and agree with you 100%
23:45 joetho man oh man. goddady gets to make their own rules.
23:46 chris i see more commits going in
23:46 chris gmcharlt++
23:52 gmcharlt chris: is the translations branch in a pullable state for 3.2 at the moment?
23:57 rhcl is now known as rhcl_away

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