IRC log for #koha, 2009-10-20

All times shown according to UTC.

Time S Nick Message
00:00 ricardo chris: I have to remember to do that... I have already some SQL files ready, but I'm not "secure" to have them ready for 3.0.4
00:00 pianohacker you just have to install both of them at the same time!
00:00 * chris_n2 is much harder to insult than that pianohacker ;-)
00:00 ricardo pianohacker: Eheh... I know, hence the smiley  :)  I was just "teasing" you
00:01 ricardo chris_n2: Nothing is wrong
00:01 pianohacker like my sister says, the internet needs a sarcasm font
00:01 ricardo "DatA != DatE"
00:01 chris_n2 oppps
00:01 chris_n2 been at this too long
00:01 ricardo chris_n2: Yeah... That fooled me once as well  :)
00:02 ricardo pianohacker: Would that be called "Sarcastica" ?  ;-)
00:02 pianohacker sarcastic sans
00:02 pianohacker "yeah, YOU would think this is a sarcastic font"
00:03 ricardo pianohacker: "Sans"? That would be ironic, eheh  ("Sarcastic Without")
00:03 ricardo Sarcastic AND Ironic
00:03 ricardo pianohacker++
00:03 ricardo :D
00:08 ricardo chris: How long do "pastebot" pastes last?
00:09 chris few weeks
00:09 ricardo chris: OK, thanks
00:10 ricardo chris: I found it strange that we were only in "paste #19"... I was thinking that it was deleting them daily or so
00:13 * ricardo is thinking of organizing a parade to shout "We want munin!"  ;-)
00:16 pastebot "ricardo" at pasted "Some (minor) "Labels" errors when doing "make test" for Koha 3.0.x" (114 lines) at
00:17 mason ooooh, pastebot?!?!
00:17 pianohacker mason: yep, chris is running it
00:17 ricardo mason: Yep  :)  It's one of chris' toys
00:18 ricardo mason:
00:18 mason intriguing .... :)
00:18 ricardo Eheh
00:18 mason heya jesse, ricardo
00:18 mason hows the hand jesse?
00:19 pianohacker better, get it off for oct 31st
00:19 chris_n2 ricardo: looks like a bad merge
00:19 pianohacker the splint, that is
00:19 ricardo chris_n2: Why do you say that?
00:19 mason a mtn-bike fall?
00:20 mason offroad or on-road?
00:20 pianohacker road bike, actually; had the tires a bit too inflated and it slipped out from under me on the asphalt
00:20 mason bah , shakes fish at road!!
00:20 pianohacker if it were off road, would probably have been a less damaging fall
00:21 pianohacker the asphalt = the bane of bicyclists
00:21 chris_n2 ricardo: maybe not
00:21 mason i have recently started wearing heavy-duty leather gloves when road-cycling
00:22 ricardo chris_n2: I must warn you that, since yesterday, I officially granted myself the title of "3 steps above git newbie"!  ;-)
00:22 chris_n2 ricardo: what version is this
00:22 mason im a cycle 'enthusiast'
00:22 ricardo chris_n2: Koha 3.0.x from git (current)
00:22 pianohacker weirdly for road rash, the worst scrapes were on my shoulder and knee
00:23 pianohacker heh, if you're an enthusiast, you probably don't have to worry about  making the same stupid mistake i did
00:23 mason i havent ever had a really bad bike-crash... :/
00:23 chris_n2 ricardo: on first glance it looks like leftovers from a bad merge or patch... git uses < and > to indicate the source and direction of content when a merge fails
00:24 chris_n2 ricardo: can you post lines 8 and 13 and some context?
00:24 mason anyhoo, we can chat bikes later ;)
00:24 pianohacker yes :)
00:24 pianohacker once I can get back on the dang thing
00:24 chris_n2 ricardo: aamof I'm nearly sure it is a failed merge
00:25 ricardo chris_n2: wait please
00:26 chris_n2 ricardo: btw, I don't see those tests in 3.0.3... or have I missed something?
00:27 ricardo chris_n2:[…]6e9aa439;hb=3.0.x
00:27 ricardo Labels_split_ddcn.t
00:27 ricardo[…]f871b7dc;hb=3.0.x
00:27 ricardo Labels_split_lccn.t
00:27 ricardo[…]be66c273;hb=3.0.x
00:28 pastebot "chris_n2" at pasted "use warnings; <<<<<<< HEAD:t/L" (15 lines) at
00:28 ricardo chris_n2: *nod*
00:28 chris_n2 ricardo: weird... but there should be the fix
00:29 ricardo chris_n2++
00:29 ricardo chris_n2:  I believe you're right
00:29 ricardo ... although I don't usually see / touch these test files
00:30 chris_n2 I wonder how that got into there...
00:30 chris_n2 oppps...
00:30 chris_n2 your's truly is to blame
00:30 ricardo chris_n2: LOL!
00:31 ricardo Too bad munin isn't here to record that quote  ;-)
00:31 chris_n2 ricardo: if you could fix it and submit a patch I'd appreciate it
00:31 ricardo (... says ricardo, the guy that pasted hundreds of lines of a "make test" to the channel... ahem)
00:31 * chris_n2 does not have a repo of 3.0.x handy
00:32 ricardo chris_n2: OK. Let me try it  :)
00:36 chris_n2 bbiab
00:45 ricardo chris_n2: still here?
00:54 ricardo chris_n2: Submitted the patch. See if it looks good to you:
00:55 ricardo Koha-patches] [PATCH] Fix spurious merge lines in "Labels_split_ddcn.t"
00:55 ricardo[…]tober/004743.html
01:02 chris_n2 ricardo: looks great, tnx!
01:07 ricardo chris_n2: You're welcome  :)
01:14 ricardo I really have to catch some sleep now.
01:15 ricardo pianohacker: Talking about bicycles, here's an article that I like (seriously):
01:15 ricardo
01:27 ricardo Bye ppl!  :)
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01:41 chris_n2 wow... Makefile.PL is massively broken on Win32 :'(
01:41 pianohacker not surprising
01:42 chris_n2 I had it fixed up awhile back, but did not keep it up
01:43 chris_n2 december 2007...
01:44 chris_n2 the main problem appears to be the bazillion char line created in the Makefile
01:45 chris_n2 the shell chokes on it
01:45 chris_n2 time for bed... g'night
01:45 pianohacker chris_n2: which line is that?
01:45 * chris_n2 looks
01:46 chris_n2 where we set the TO_INST_PM var at about line 443
01:46 pianohacker ah, cool
01:46 pianohacker sleep well :)
01:50 pianohacker I'd better log off for the night myself
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03:00 chris[…]=CA6700348#450805
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03:18 schuster Howdy everyone - I've been out a few days with work conflicts so havn't been watching closely.  Are the release dates still in the air somewhat for 3.0x, and 3.2? or are there firmer dates coming?
03:18 chris there is one bug left for 3.0.x
03:18 chris and then it will be released, id expect within the next couple of days for it
03:19 chris and galen has said an alpha release of 3.2.0 before november
03:19 chris and then a full release when all the critical bugs found in that are fixed
03:20 schuster Ok thanks - I'm still dancing with how LibLime is going to handle me as a self hosted site etc...  kinda glad this comes about before the end of the year as my support contract starts again in January.
03:20 chris 3.2.0 will def be out by then
03:21 chris i suspect you will be running standard koha, since if they distributed the LEK code, the license would allow you to redistribute .. and they won't want that
03:22 chris ill probably get threatened with a lawyer for saying that
03:22 chris but meh
03:24 schuster That's what I have been told is that I will have "community Koha" and will get "upgraded" when community Koha has a release.
03:25 chris so you no longer have bugfixes applied as they become available?
03:25 chris have to wait for a release?
03:26 schuster Also if i do Development with LibLime they indicated that I will be able to play with it on a hosted "test" site, but until the community accepts the code from liblime(however they put it out) I won't have it until the next community release.
03:26 chris if so, im happy to do a release after every bugfix
03:26 chris :)
03:27 schuster That is one point I am waiting on...  Bugs...  "patches" I've been getting emails saying when this is fixed in community the "patch" will be applied.  Right now I havn't seen any "update/patches" since August - except for one that they applied, but I see is still a "bug" in community.
03:27 chris yeah and there have been a lot of fixes since august
03:28 chris i guess they are waiting for a release
03:28 schuster many of the LL hosted sites "test" environments were down today - so I suspect LL is trying to get everyone on the same version and then roll out LEK.
03:28 chris sounds likely
03:29 schuster My biggest fear is that 3.2 will be released and then we will see how LibLime reacts to it if they throw a bunch of enhancements/developments over the wall or what.  We know there are a few out there.... or should I say in there.
03:30 chris yeah
03:30 chris i did a list of the new features in 3.2
03:30 schuster on the wiki?
03:30 chris[…]g-for-koha-3-2-0/
03:31 schuster Anybody know about url checker and the cron job?  I see how to activate it, but what does it do or where does the report go etc...  I think there are some enhancements to it in 3.2, but the 3.0.x isn't well documented.  Nicole doesn't know much about it...
03:31 chris nicole is rewriting the manual for 3.2.x so it should get better documented for that
03:32 chris but no, ive never played with the url checker
03:35 schuster yeah there is a LOT of stuff coming out with 3.2 - ISBN13 support, enhancements to self checkout, are two items Galen checked to make sure made it before he left LibLime.
03:35 schuster My sponsorships...;)
03:35 chris yep
03:36 schuster I have 3 in the works right now at LibLime which I've been told will be coded by the end of the year - but again who knows how this is going to play out if I will get them into production by the end of the year.
03:36 chris yeah depends entirely on when and how they release them, and how they plan to keep you up to date i guess
03:40 schuster Any further developments for KohaCon10?
03:42 chris definitely november
03:42 chris and ill firm up the dates when i confirm the venue
03:42 chris probably the middle of november, thats when all the university students are on break
03:43 chris so empty lecture theatres we can use
03:43 schuster Ah ok good to watch.  I was looking at airline stuff today just poking around...  I really want to try to attend, but we will see what my wife says about that since it will be mostly on our nickle.
03:43 chris *nod*
03:44 chris im trying to get the dates nice and early to give people lots of time to plan/save
03:45 schuster I've been kicking around the idea of user driven webinars - so with the new release around the corner we could schedule some 20-30 minute sessions and have different people present what they had developed and why.  Gives someone who hasn't upgraded/implemented things to think about and how they work.
03:45 chris ohh good idea
03:46 schuster Mainly me - and it gives people the opportunity to explain why they had it done and people in the community another resource to ask questions of someone who has it up and running.
03:47 schuster If we use software that I'm familiar with here in Plano ISD - we can record it and upload it for others to watch at a later date.
03:50 schuster Well off to bed night koha community friends.
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05:02 brendan evening #koha
05:02 brendan wondering if anybody is awake or watching along
05:02 brendan wondering if anyone is awake and watching along :)
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05:18 brendan evening #koha
05:18 brendan alright - time for bed -- night all
05:59 Ropuch Morning #koha
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06:58 chris morning europe
07:00 magnusenger morning chris!
07:04 paul_p hello kiwis !
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07:36 hdl_laptop hi chris
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08:50 |Lupin| good morning all
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10:20 kernel_2 hello...does koha run under mod_perl in apache?
10:21 chris not safely
10:24 kernel_2 checkouts seems to be slow..i have configured my my.cnf decently....
10:25 kernel_2 is there anything else do i need to tune?
10:25 chris what version of koha are you running?
10:26 chris one thing that will help is set expires headers for all the js/css/images
10:27 magnusenger and memcached, perhaps?
10:28 chris yep if you are running from master
10:30 kernel_2 i am running koha-3.00.03
10:30 chris in that case for now the best bet is making sure your browser is caching all the images/css/js and not refetching them
10:32 chris master (and 3.2.0 when its released) has some performance improvements using memoize and memcached
10:33 chris its actually reading the config file (which is xml) that is the bottleneck for circ
10:34 chris
10:34 chris vs
10:34 chris[…]ion-config-cache/
10:35 chris by caching the config into memcached we shave 200ms off each run
10:35 chris parsing xml is slow
10:35 Amit hi chris
10:36 chris i plan to do more work on performance, im fairly sure i can get that under 500ms
10:36 chris hi Amit
10:36 |Lupin| quick perl question pls
10:37 |Lupin| how to sort numerically rather than alphabetically ?
10:37 chris <=>
10:37 chris rather than cmp
10:39 kernel_2 chris: nice to know the works in the pipeline...
10:44 |Lupin| ok, <=> was my friend
10:44 |Lupin| chris: thanks
10:44 |Lupin| lunch
10:44 chris np, if its lunchtime, it must be time for me to sleep
10:53 kernel_2 chris: thanks for the info regarding caching. I also turned off circulation logging for test...marginally better
10:59 kernel_2 chris: but still need to improve as we have around 50k books and a few thousand students..and during rush-hours it does become difficult to manage...
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11:18 paul_p back with my laptop repaired ! thx dell for the efficient support (D+1)
11:36 nengard Reminder time for a final decision regarding the #koha foundation - vote here by the 25th of Oct
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11:39 chris_n g'morning #koha
11:41 paul_p g'morning usa
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11:49 hdl_laptop hi
11:52 magnusenger nengard: is it possible to see the results of the survey so far anywhere?
11:52 nengard it shows them to you when you finish it ... hmmm
11:53 nengard still looking to see if I can figure it out
11:54 magnusenger yeah, i finnished mine a looong time ago, so i'm just curious... ;-)
11:54 nengard yeah :) me too!!
11:55 nengard can't find a way to do it - guess we're supposed to save the link after we answer the survey -- here are some stats:
11:55 nengard ranked #1 in options for right now:
11:55 nengard Horowhenua Library Trust (HLT) (HLT)  59 63.44%
11:55 nengard Software in the Public Interest (SPI) (SPI) 11 11.83%
11:56 nengard sorry  -ranked #1 and #2
11:56 magnusenger 59 and 11 is the number of votes?
11:56 nengard right - the number of votes for those 2
11:57 nengard and then for the long term it looks like the majority want a koha foundation
11:57 nengard wihtout exporting all the data at this point I can't do much more than that -- if someone fills out hte survey can they share theirc ompleted link so we can see the results
11:58 magnusenger that's enough for me and my idle curiosity, thanks! ;-)
12:03 nengard as usual I'll share the complete raw results and the charts with you on the 26th.
12:03 |Lupin| hello nengard
12:03 nengard now - i must run out - i'll be back soon
12:03 nengard hello and goodby nengard :)
12:03 nengard or Lupin :) hehe
12:03 nengard sorry
12:03 nengard still early
12:03 nengard ttyl
12:03 |Lupin| np :)
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12:04 chris_n hdl_laptop: this patch ([…]ober/004743.html) should be applied to 3.0.x before your release as it fixes a bad bug I introduced into the call number splitting tests
12:04 chris_n note: it only affects 3.0.x
12:05 chris_n nengard, magnusenger: http://opensource.web2learning[…]ser.php?sid=88794
12:05 magnusenger chris_n++
12:06 hdl_laptop chris_n :already applied
12:07 chris_n tnx hdl_laptop
12:07 hdl_laptop (this morning)
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12:13 jwagner Good morning all.
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12:18 jdavidb Good morning #koha!
12:18 |Lupin| greetings jdavidb
12:18 jwagner Question on authorities -- I do not see any way for library staff to do a regular authority load within the staff interface.  How do libraries who download authorities when they download bibs load authority records?
12:18 jwagner It would seem to be too cumbersome to always have to load authorities at the system level via the migration scripts.
12:19 |Lupin| jwagner: perhaps through a cron job ?
12:19 |Lupin| jwagner: hello, btw
12:20 chris_n g'morning jwagner, jdavidb
12:20 Topic for #koha is now discussion channel for the Koha ILS | Please vote in the final foundation vote by 25/10/2009 http://opensource.web2learning[…]sid=88794&lang=en | View real-time results: http://opensource.web2learning[…]ser.php?sid=88794
12:20 jwagner Good morning |Lupin| and chris_n.  No, I don't think a cron job would work by itself -- there's no mechanism for library staff to upload a file of authority records.  I think there needs to be the equivalent of the Tools, Stage & Load MARC Records functions.
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12:22 * chris_n greets wizzyrea
12:23 jdavidb Hi, wizzyrea! :)
12:24 |Lupin| hello wizzyrea
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12:35 jwagner So nobody is doing regular authority loads now (she asked plaintively)?  I keep hoping I'm missing the obvious.
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12:42 owen Hello all.
12:42 schuster Howdy!
12:42 Nate morning!
12:43 schuster Authority loads have to be done manually not fun.
12:43 jdavidb Hi, owen and schuster and Nate! :)
12:43 Nate Hi jdavidb!
12:43 schuster I've exported my Marc data once, but it had the authority numbers at the end of the headings not nice.
12:43 schuster Got busy and didn't get back to playing with it.
12:44 * owen added his two cents to[…]ticleid=CA6700348
12:47 jdavidb owen++
12:48 * owen has to do his muckraking where he can now that he's off the LibLime users' list ;)
12:49 jwagner Dare I ask why you're off the LL list?
12:49 owen For muckraking.
12:49 chris_n owen++
12:49 owen I guess.
12:50 jwagner muckraking++
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12:50 reiko hi
12:50 owen Hi reiko
12:51 reiko i've been around with an issue for 2 weeks now
12:51 jdavidb owen, I don't suppose you've heard back anything at all as to why you got booted?
12:51 jwagner schuster, so your site doesn't do regular authority loads?  I'm not concerned with the initial data migration, but rather with ongoing cataloging.  As catalogers add bib records, they should be able to add authority records for that batch.
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12:51 owen jdavidb: I didn't try to contact anyone directly about it.
12:52 wizzyrea joined #koha
12:53 owen jdavidb: I was going to give them 24 hrs to approve the post I made yesterday, but wizzyrea went ahead and submitted the same question I asked
12:53 schuster Right now there isn't an interface to load MARC authorities unless you've written one!
12:53 owen So it's probably time to send an official inquiry
12:54 jwagner schuster, that's what I was afraid of.  Just hoping I'd overlooked something.  Darn.
12:55 reiko can i ask a question?
12:56 owen Go ahead reiko
12:56 * owen sends his official inquiry
12:56 reiko I've upgraded my database from 2.2.8 to 3.0 and i've been following the wiki site about it, koha works except the searching, so i assumed it was zebra, the log says: [request] Search biblios ERROR 109 1 1+0 RPN @attrset Bib-1 @or...
12:57 reiko i've read almost every thread i found, even some irc logs about it and all the sugestions didn't fix my problem
12:58 reiko i know that 109 means database is unavailable
12:59 reiko i've set rebuild_Zebra script -v to see if any errors came up but it seems to be exporting things well
13:00 jdavidb reiko:  restarted Zebra?  Just checkin', but it's a good idea.
13:00 reiko several times.
13:01 reiko where does zebra keeps that index data it makes ?
13:02 jdavidb For a dev install, in the <install_dir>/var/lib/zebradb/ and its subdirs.  Not sure for standard installs.
13:02 reiko all empty
13:03 reiko although my rebuild_Zebra is exporting biblio somewhere
13:03 reiko could it be the issue ? the destination folder of the rebuild zebra isnt the expected one by the zebrasrv ?
13:04 jdavidb Hrm.  No, normally it's getting that from KOHA_CONF, in both cases.
13:05 jdavidb It's exporting, but is it doing the merge that follows okay?
13:05 reiko right now its still exporting
13:06 reiko it's a big database
13:06 jdavidb Ah.  Well, that's part of it, yah.  Won't be searchable until it's all the way done.  How many bibs?
13:07 reiko records exported: 113949
13:07 chris_n reiko: sounds like a permissions issue
13:07 chris_n what kind of install did you do?
13:07 reiko didnt do any merge im affraid jdavidb
13:08 reiko hi chris_n
13:08 reiko hum i don't know
13:08 reiko the koha instalation was made by someone else
13:08 jdavidb yah...beginning to sound like a permissions issue.  Can't write to the zebradb directories, maybe.
13:08 reiko its possible
13:09 reiko zebradb directories are empty
13:09 chris_n reiko: we'll need to know what kind of install (standard, dev, etc)
13:09 reiko it might be dev
13:09 chris_n the installer does not set permissions correctly for the zebra files as a rule
13:09 reiko ah
13:09 chris_n there could also be the issue of the username/password for zebra
13:09 chris_n but most likely it is permissions
13:10 chris_n all zebra dirs and files should be owned by the koha user
13:10 reiko even if i sudo the script ?
13:11 chris_n reiko: sudo ing the script does not seem to work in my experience
13:11 reiko okay
13:11 chris_n su koha and then start it
13:11 reiko ah you're right
13:11 chris_n but still only if the permissions are correct
13:11 reiko theres a kohaadmin and a koha user
13:12 reiko and the folders all belong to koha
13:12 chris_n what flavor of *nix are you running?
13:12 reiko some kind of redhat/ fedora i think
13:12 chris_n ouch... ok
13:13 reiko so i should log as koha and try to run the scripts
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13:13 chris_n koha is developed on debian
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13:14 chris_n reiko: yes or reboot if you have installed the startup scripts
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13:14 ricardo Hi all
13:14 reiko well its a production machine so i cant reboot it neither have permissions to it
13:15 chris_n hello ricardo
13:15 reiko ill try to su as koha
13:15 reiko thanks for the help
13:15 ricardo chris_n: Hi Chris!  :)
13:15 chris_n reiko: np
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13:15 ricardo Another "dependencies complaint"... this time from running "./ pt-PT" in a machine that has been upgraded from SLES 10 SP2 (SuSE Linux Enterprise Server ) to SLES 11.
13:16 chris_n reiko: there are also the koha-zebradaemon.err and koha-zebradaemon.log logs you can consult
13:16 ricardo The dependency is "Locale/". Should it be added to Makefile.PL ("Locale::Language" is there)
13:17 chris_n reiko: 'ps -ef | grep zebra' should show if zebra is actually running or not
13:17 chris_n reiko: if zebra is running you can also test using the yaz cli client
13:18 reiko yes zebra is running
13:22 pastebot "ricardo" at pasted "Apparent missing "Locale::PO" dependency in Makefile.PL (for Koha 3.0.x)" (17 lines) at
13:23 ricardo That strange smiley is "Locale :: PO"
13:23 ricardo (Spaces added here, so that I don't get the smiley)
13:29 chris_n reiko: default zebra username/password is kohauser/zebrastripes
13:29 chris_n reiko: if this was changed during the install process that may be the issue
13:30 chris_n you can verify by trying to connect with yaz-client
13:31 reiko how do i connect with yaz-client ?
13:31 reiko username has been changed
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13:35 chris_n reiko: you'll need to make sure the username  is correct in these places:
13:35 chris_n explain-authorities.xml:22:      <user>kohauser</user>
13:35 chris_n explain-biblios.xml:22:      <user>kohauser</user>
13:35 chris_n zebra-authorities.cfg:47:perm.kohauser:rw
13:35 chris_n zebra-authorities-dom.cfg:37:perm.kohauser:rw
13:35 chris_n zebra-biblios.cfg:45:perm.kohauser:rw
13:36 reiko ok, ill check if all are the same
13:36 chris_n they should be in etc/zebradb
13:39 reiko chris_n: everything matches except for explain-authorities.xml and explain-biblios.xml, they are both commented
13:40 reiko <!--<authentication>
13:40 reiko <user>kohauser</user>
13:40 reiko <group>kohagroup</group>
13:40 reiko <password>zebrastripes</password>
13:40 reiko </authentication>-->
13:40 jdavidb_ joined #koha
13:41 chris_n that's ok
13:43 chris_n reiko: check also etc/zebradb/etc/passwd
13:45 reiko it's the same there aswell
13:46 reiko chris_n: the zebrasrv and the daemon must belong to the same user as the zebra folders ?
13:46 pastebot "chris_n" at pasted "yaz-client example" (13 lines) at
13:46 chris_n reiko: yes
13:46 chris_n reiko: see the paste for an example of how to use the yaz-client
13:47 chris_n to test connection
13:47 reiko okay
13:47 reiko thank you
13:47 chris_n np... let us know what you turn up
13:47 jdavidb left #koha
13:48 reiko chris_n: tested the connection and it was OK
13:48 chris_n hrmm....
13:48 reiko i think it's the permissions, but i couldnt test it out yet
13:49 reiko i need that koha account pw first to start the processes there and run the scripts
13:52 chris_n reiko: I believe also that the script will have to be run as a user with permission to access the zebra db files
13:52 chris_n basically all zebra operations should be under the same user account as owns the zebra files
13:53 reiko yes, it makes sense, still waiting for the password :|
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13:58 owen Hi nicomo_laptop
14:02 chris_n another innocent, unsuspecting entity waylaid
14:04 nicomo_laptop hi owen
14:08 wizzyrea you guys are rabble rousers
14:08 wizzyrea get yer torches and pitchforks!
14:08 wizzyrea :)
14:09 jdavidb_ rabble-rousing++
14:11 * chris_n thinks installing the catalyst framework should not be this hard ;-P
14:12 owen What is the catalyst framework?
14:12 chris_n
14:14 chris_n basically its an MVC framework for perl
14:17 owen Kids these days and their MVC frameworks.
14:18 Colin chris_n: it took about three or so attempts before I figured out how I wanted to do it
14:18 chris_n actually this is the first time I have messed with an MVC framework or the concept of MVC period... we'll see how it goes
14:23 jdavidb_ is now known as jdavidb
14:30 owen MVC is something I keep thinking, Is that what I should be doing? But have never jumped in.
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14:47 reiko chris_n: still not working
14:47 reiko i'm in the right user now and the rebuild_zebra still doesn't write
14:48 chris_n reiko: nothing unusual in the verbose output?
14:48 reiko i've started and checked that all folders in var/lock/koha belong to koha, aswell as the var/lib
14:48 reiko yeah
14:48 reiko ###### ReIndexing authorities ######
14:48 reiko and does nothing
14:49 reiko while the others , the exports, take a while and we can see the progress, it seems like it skips the reindexing
14:50 kernel_2 left #koha
14:51 reiko and another thing, i can't find that koha-zebradaemon.log or .err file
14:52 hdl_laptop gmcharlt: around ?
14:52 chris_n reiko: maybe an SELinux issue?
14:53 * chris_n is taking long shots now
14:53 chris_n hrmm
14:53 reiko well i've read about that aswell
14:53 chris_n reiko: if SELinux is in other than 'audit' mode it could be the cause of many problems
14:56 jwagner Any French speakers online for a syspref translation?
14:56 chris_n reiko: maybe a post on the zebra mailing list will turn up something
14:56 reiko i'll work on that
14:57 chris_n reiko: I suspect something with fedora && zebra not wanting to play together
14:57 nicomo_laptop jwagner: yep
14:57 chris_n but I'm not a zebra guru either
14:57 jwagner nicomo, thanks.  See Bug 3719.  The text I want is Allows sites to define a different name for the OPAC Cart feature, such as Bookbag or Personal Shelf. Make sure there is some name in the field, or it won't display properly in the OPAC.
14:58 wizzyrea jwagner: could you do it in such a way that if left blank it defaults to "cart"
14:58 reiko chris_n: SELINUX=disabled
14:59 jwagner wizzyrea, I think I could add a check for that -- let me try.
14:59 wizzyrea seems it would be easier/better than breaking it if the syspref is blank
15:00 nicomo_laptop jwagner: when you say it allows "sites" you mean each library branch/site? Or is it system wide?
15:02 jwagner Sorry, I mean the system as a whole.
15:02 jwagner munin doesn't seem to be running -- anyone know how to restart?
15:02 chris_n reiko: I'm at the bottom of my very shallow knowledge of zebra so maybe a post to either the koha or zebra list or both might turn up something
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15:05 owen jwagner: Someone said munin was gmcharlt's bot
15:05 reiko i'll do that, at least we've narrowed the problem to a couple of options. thank you for your time and patience chris_n
15:05 owen wizzyrea: Good idea about the default value
15:05 chris_n reiko: np, glad to help
15:05 owen jwagner: I know lots of folks will be glad to see this syspref working
15:06 paul_p @seen gmcharlt
15:06 chris_n hdl_laptop: iirc gmcharlt is in chicago doing classes or presentation or something
15:06 chris_n paul_p: munin's been delinquent for some days now... :-(
15:07 jwagner owen, after the second/third request I got to change the name from Cart, and looking at all the files to modify, I figured I'd save myself (and possibly other folks) a lot of grief by doing it this way....
15:08 owen Downside: opening the floodgates of other similar requests!
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15:08 reiko chris_n !
15:09 reiko i think i found the problem
15:09 * chris_n is all ears
15:10 reiko maybe the re-indexing isn't done because my zebraidx is called zebraidx-2.0
15:10 reiko could it be the problem ?
15:10 * chris_n takes a look
15:10 reiko ill check the script
15:10 wizzyrea munin is in fact gmcharlt's bot
15:11 chris_n reiko: it appears that there is both zebraidx and zebraidx-2.0 in the /usr/bin dir on my dev install
15:11 jwagner nicomo, per wizzyrea's suggestion, I figured out how to use Cart as a default.  Change the syspref writeup to: Allows libraries to define a different name for the OPAC Cart feature, such as Bookbag or Personal Shelf. If no name is defined, it will default to Cart.
15:11 reiko let me check mine
15:12 reiko not in mine
15:12 reiko i'm not sure yet but
15:12 reiko if is looking for zebraidx
15:12 reiko it won't find my 2.0
15:12 reiko i mena
15:12 reiko *i mean
15:13 chris_n true
15:17 reiko foreach (qw(/usr/local/bin/zebraidx
15:17 reiko /opt/bin/zebraidx
15:17 reiko /usr/bin/zebraidx
15:22 nicomo_laptop jwagner: that'd be: "Permet de renommer la fonctionnalité de Panier à l'OPAC, par exemple en Etagère Personnelle. Si vous n'utilisez par cette préférence système, le terme de Panier sera utilisé par défaut"
15:22 nicomo_laptop jwagner: see any diacritics here?
15:22 nicomo_laptop cause there should be a few
15:23 jwagner nicomo, I see them here.  The question (as always) is if they'll survive a cut/paste into the system files.  Merci beaucoup!
15:23 reiko chris_n weee !
15:24 wizzyrea jwagner++ :)
15:24 reiko var/lib/koha/zebradb is beeing filled
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15:27 nicomo_laptop jwagner: you're welcome
15:28 chris_n reiko: great!
15:28 reiko thank you so much
15:28 chris_n glad to be of help
15:31 * paul_p not very fond of having zillions of sysprefs...
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15:37 jwagner paul_p, I know, the sysprefs are adding up.  But we need some way to give local sites more control over their display and setup. Not everyone will have the ability to make system-level template changes.  Is there a better approach than using a syspref for everything?  Maybe some separate table with display settings?
15:37 wizzyrea left #koha
15:37 paul_p some specific po /language ?
15:38 paul_p (because there are many strings like this : members/borrowers/patrons. US/UK/NZ are quite different on the term they prefer to use)
15:38 nicomo_laptop paul_p: the .po solution is a possibility
15:38 nicomo_laptop but not the way forward I think
15:39 wizzyrea joined #koha
15:44 jdavidb nengard++ #comments on LJ's article
15:44 nengard jdavidb - I thought I was quite eloquent :) if I do say so myself :)
15:45 nengard not sure if I spelled eloquent right though :) hehe
15:45 jdavidb you did.  :)
15:45 nicomo_laptop jdavidb: have a link? Which article?
15:46 jdavidb[…]ticleid=CA6700348
15:46 paul_p the question is: is it enough to be eloquent?
15:47 paul_p in PRs, it's sometimes not the one who is right who wins. It's the one who appears as "the good man"
15:48 jdavidb True enough, paul_p.
15:48 * owen is annoyed that the comment form implies you can use HTML, but posted comments show the HTML tags
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16:17 * chris_n is annoyed at FF proclivity to crash after being run for multiple weeks with multiple tabs
16:20 owen chris_n: And I suppose you get mad at Windows for crashing after more than 8 hours of use too!
16:21 chris_n owen: this FF is on Ubuntu Laptop remix.... I cheer if Windows lasts through 8 hours of use... ;-)
16:21 chris_n FF is a memory hog in general, and I suspect maybe a small memory leak
16:22 |Lupin| good evening all
16:22 |Lupin| bye*
16:22 |Lupin| left #koha
16:24 owen FF will have to get pretty crashy before I'll give up Firebug and the Web Developer Toolbar.
16:24 * chris_n agrees with that
16:29 chris_n lunch, bbiab
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17:29 brendan morning #koha
17:30 sekjal morning, brendan
17:30 brendan hey good morning sekjal
17:31 wizzyrea new imacs new imacs new imacs new imacs
17:31 wizzyrea i've been waiting <3
17:31 * wizzyrea is excited
17:31 sekjal wizzyrea:  nice!
17:31 wizzyrea i've been waiting to replace my work imac for the refresh
17:31 wizzyrea so next week I may have a new one so excited
17:33 sekjal anyone know what the values in accounttype.accountlines in the Koha DB mean?
17:34 nengard does anyone know if LabelMARCView works?
17:34 nengard and what it does?
17:35 nengard I just tested it and saw no difference - but maybe I'm looking in the wrong place - or read the description wrong
17:36 sekjal found this:
17:36 sekjal 337 # FIXME: In Koha 3.0 , the only account adjustment 'types' passed to this function
17:36 sekjal 339 #               'C' = CREDIT
17:36 sekjal 340 #               'FOR' = FORGIVEN  (Formerly 'F', but 'F' is taken to mean 'FINE' elsewhere)
17:36 jwagner sekjal, on the account types, I was working on this a week or so ago, & got pointed to this page:
17:36 jwagner[…]searchterm=f%20fu
17:36 sekjal thanks, jwagner!
17:37 nengard figured mine out :)
17:40 sekjal alright, so I want 'M', most likely
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18:10 owen Anyone else *not* getting transfer messages when checking in items that belong in other branches?
18:12 brendan owen -- are you using the "check-in" module
18:12 owen Yes
18:12 owen (referring to the problem with checking in items from the circ/moremember screens I assume)
18:12 brendan ok -- I've seen that when you use check-in from the patrons records -- "you don't get the message"
18:21 jwagner brendan, I opened a bug on that a while back -- Bug 3514
18:21 brendan I was just looking for that thanks jwagner
18:22 brendan missing munin
18:22 * owen likes that Chatzilla has built-in Bugzilla linking
18:22 jwagner munin, come back!  We didn't mean to hurt your feelings!!!
18:25 pianohacker owen: It took me the better part of a month, but your patches are finally in
18:25 owen Thanks pianohacker!
18:26 * owen has his share of projects that have drawn out too long
18:27 owen I've tried this on two different up-to-date systems: checking in an item at branch A which belongs at branch B does *not* trigger a prompt to send the item to branch B.
18:27 owen Can anyone else confirm?
18:28 pianohacker owen: from or
18:28 owen
18:28 jwagner owen, I have hardly any experience with it, but when I was testing a few things with in-transit, I got myself in trouble with the user ID.  To check the obvious, the user ID that you're logged in with belongs to branch A?
18:29 owen jwagner: Doesn't it only matter what branch I'm logged in to?
18:29 owen Why should it matter what the user's home branch is?
18:29 jwagner The staff user ID, I meant.
18:30 owen Right--why should it matter what branch the logged-in staff user belongs to?
18:31 jwagner It seemed to when I was doing some testing -- had to be logged in with the proper staff ID.
18:34 pianohacker owen: one very minor thing: the css for the new h3's in the editor refers to collapsed.png and expanded.png, but I couldn't find those files in koha
18:35 owen pianohacker: Uh oh. That's gotta be my bad.
18:35 pianohacker not a major problem, just wanted to point it out
18:37 wizzyrea owen: we were not getting transfer messages
18:37 wizzyrea I think ryan put a patch on our system for it I'll have to ask around here
18:39 owen Could it be? A patch that didn't get committed?
18:40 owen Although, wizzyrea, this problem isn't happening in our production system.
18:40 owen Not sure what to make of that--did you finally get an update?
18:42 wizzyrea no, let me go back and check my notes on it
18:42 wizzyrea we have definitely not gotten an update
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19:04 wizzyrea owen: no, it doesn't look like we've had that one addressed
19:04 wizzyrea it's still broken for us
19:06 owen Hm, I didn't think it was broken in our production system.
19:06 owen So for you guys any time you check something in from another branch Koha doesn't tell you?
19:13 nengard Go Nate:[…]=CA6700348#450805
19:17 Nate Thanks nengard! Glad u like it!
19:21 paul_p joined #koha
19:21 wizzyrea well... it's not quite that bad
19:21 wizzyrea think it won't transfer home
19:22 pianohacker nengard: http://bullrunnings.wordpress.[…]09/#comment-10560 (re your new manual)
19:24 nengard pianohacker very cute :)
19:24 pianohacker peer review is never very much fun
19:25 chris_n Nate++
19:25 sekjal Nate++ indeed
19:26 nengard pianohacker I don't mind it at all - in terms to the manual - because I'm hoping that it will end up being easier to read - just like that sign :)
19:30 Nate calling now
19:30 richard joined #koha
19:30 richard hi
19:30 pianohacker hello richard
19:31 richard hi pianohacker
19:41 chris morning
19:42 pianohacker good morning chris
19:42 sekjal hello ricard; morning, chris
19:42 sekjal ~hello richard
19:42 nicomo_laptop Nate's karma going way up today
19:44 nicomo_laptop interestingly, I have not publicly heard yet the argument that the fork cuts both ways, i.e. that LEK won't have the community enhancements to the community version down the road
19:46 schuster Owen and wizzyrea - I just checked something in from the wrong location and it sent it to the home library - it hadn't been doing that for awhile so either someone has applied a patch or it suddenly started working again on regular cki.
19:46 schuster left #koha
19:47 owen nicomo_laptop: It's an important question for LibLime customers who want to sponsor development to be shared with the community. How will LibLime develop an enhancement based on LEK if it is also to be contributed to the official version?
19:48 owen In this case when I say "based on" I mean "for a library running LEK"
19:48 nicomo_laptop *nod*
19:49 chris nicomo_laptop: it's because it doesnt have to
19:49 sekjal well, the customer would just pay LibLime, they'd develop the enhancement, and release it next time they release as promised.
19:49 chris we certainly are not stopping anyone taking community enhancements
19:50 nicomo_laptop chris: agreed, but LL will have trouble/expenses following the developments of the community and integrating in LEK
19:50 chris and since we publish our repo's publicly, it is much much easier to take from community koha than vice versa
19:51 nicomo_laptop sure, but it's a cost nevertheless, and it's going to be more of a cost as versions go by
19:51 chris yup
19:52 chris but not actually that bad, if they are smart
19:52 sekjal I think the fork is most visible in Acquisitions.  How will LL reconcile GetIt! with BibLibre's Acq 3.2, and all the subsequent work derived from it?
19:52 chris git makes doing that easy, which is why they should publish their damn repo and stop being morons
19:53 chris sekjal: getit is a standalone thing, so i dont think they will
19:53 chris of course they also think everyone in the community is a moron and cant write good code
19:53 nicomo_laptop but it has to plugin to koha somehow
19:53 chris and have been telling people that
19:53 sekjal the data structures will be different
19:53 nicomo_laptop so true
19:54 nicomo_laptop skejal: good point
19:54 chris nate++
19:54 nicomo_laptop I'm actually processing the data from committers back from 2002
19:54 nicomo_laptop who committed how many patches
19:54 nicomo_laptop each year
19:55 nicomo_laptop very interesting
19:55 chris yep
19:55 chris mine goes back to 2000 if you want that too
19:55 chris
19:55 nicomo_laptop I have it back to dec. 20th 2000
19:55 chris[…]1012/authors.html
19:55 chris october 1999
19:55 owen nicomo_laptop: Joshua would say, "Don't forget to credit LibLime with any commits that chris did"
19:56 chris[…]220-now/tags.html
19:56 chris is a good way to look at it
19:56 chris how many per release
19:56 nicomo_laptop yes, but chris was smart enough to use different email addresses
19:56 chris :)
19:56 nicomo_laptop so i can track what he did for Katipo, liblime, on his own, etc
19:56 nicomo_laptop same for you owen
19:56 nicomo_laptop :-)
19:57 pianohacker my work for liblime and personal work will be under different emails, though that wasn't consciously planned
19:57 ricardo joined #koha
19:57 chris its a little trickier than that, i didnt always use nonwork emails for nonwork commits
19:57 * sekjal makes a note to use his gmail when working on personal projects
19:57 ricardo Hi all
19:57 nicomo_laptop hi ricardo
19:58 nicomo_laptop chris yes, but that gives own a good picture of it all
19:58 ricardo I'll be here just for a short while (I want to go home so I can eat, eheh)
19:58 nicomo_laptop it's not 100% accurate but still
19:58 nicomo_laptop s/own/one
19:58 chris when i worked at katipo they just all went under that, course my bosses were nice so it wasnt a worry :)
19:58 ricardo If I want to add a dependency in Makefile.PL, how do I choose a version of the new module dependency?
19:58 nicomo_laptop and at the beginning I only have the usernames
19:59 nicomo_laptop not the email addresses
19:59 pianohacker hey ricardo
19:59 chris yup, cvs didnt do addresses
19:59 nicomo_laptop but I bugged paul to identify everyone
19:59 ricardo pianohacker: Hi Jesse!  :)
19:59 ricardo Case in point:
19:59 ricardo "ricardo" at pasted "Apparent missing "Locale::PO" dependency in Makefile.PL (for Koha 3.0.x)" (17 lines) at
19:59 ricardo (that's "Locale :: PO", if you get a strange smiley here)
20:00 wizzyrea schuster was talking with me about this very topic yesterday
20:00 nengard I unfortunatly didn't submit under diff emails based on when I was working - but oh well - you all know the truth
20:01 nicomo_laptop nengard: yes, but in that case I've been "generous" and attributed all you did to LL
20:01 nengard if you so choose - but just for the record I did most of my patches on my vaca time
20:03 wizzyrea didn't they yell at you for continuing to be a community participant?
20:03 wizzyrea they = the LL upper echelon
20:03 nicomo_laptop nengard: but even in that case LL seems to have represented over 50% of the patches in only 1 year: 2008
20:04 nicomo_laptop and in that year it was about 60%
20:04 wizzyrea or was that someone else... I can't keep anything straight anymore
20:07 * chris_n finally gets catalyst to say "Hello World!"... :-P
20:08 ricardo chris_n: Ah... that's progress. X hours to put a framework to say "Hello World" or X seconds to write, in plain Perl,  print "Hello World!\n";   ;-)
20:08 ricardo (only kidding!)
20:11 ricardo Well... Gotta go home. I'll be back in 2 hours or so (probably)
20:11 pianohacker cya later
20:11 ricardo left #koha
20:15 chris_n hehe
20:15 brendan gotta do it too
20:15 brendan Nate++
20:15 chris_n the things we do in the name of progress
20:16 jdavidb Nate++
20:18 Nate Thanks for all of the positive feedback everyone
20:20 sekjal Nate: I got the days off to come up to Hartford this Friday and the other date in Nov.
20:21 Nate thats great!
20:21 Nate I cant wait to see you there
20:21 Nate should be interesting to say the least
20:21 sekjal very
20:21 sekjal I'll get to meet Ben Ide at last
20:22 nengard Gonna miss you all at those events
20:22 nengard I'll be in CA at IL and then meeting brendan and then at CLA
20:22 Nate you will be missed nicole
20:22 nengard busy busy busy
20:23 sekjal I'll tweet vigorously
20:23 brendan excellent news sekjal
20:23 brendan ok -- off to find some food :)
20:24 owen I'm curious about something I'm seeing in admin/ "default("MESSAGE2",$template);"
20:24 owen I understand that this is setting the MESSAGE2 variable, but I don't understand why it's doing it in a different way than other template variables
20:25 pianohacker owen: urghh, is very strange
20:30 owen I'll take that as a sign it's time to go home!
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20:31 soul9 heh
20:32 soul9 g'day
20:40 sekjal hello, soul9
20:40 pianohacker hi, soul9
20:41 soul9 hey all
20:42 chris hey soul9
20:48 magnusenger left #koha
20:49 soul9 hey guys, how goes it in koha world?
20:50 soul9 haven't been around for a while ☺
20:51 paul_p left #koha
20:52 wizzyrea it's been the best of times... and the worst of times ;)
20:53 wizzyrea but mostly good
20:53 soul9 :-D
20:56 chris hehe
20:56 soul9 good to hear
20:58 chris_n wizzyrea: let's hope none of us has to stand-in for someone else's appointment at the guillotine
21:02 wizzyrea ooh, true
21:02 wizzyrea though I'm sure *certain* people's PR wouldn't mind that at all
21:02 chris_n hehe
21:02 pianohacker chris_n: ?
21:03 wizzyrea dickens :P
21:03 chris_n pianohacker: you work in a library and have note read "
21:03 chris_n The Tale of Two Cities
21:04 chris_n "?
21:04 pianohacker I must admit I have not
21:04 chris_n maybe just watch the movie then... ;-)
21:04 * chris_n heads out for supper
21:04 pianohacker Gradually making my way through david copperfield
21:04 pianohacker bah
21:04 pianohacker movie_adaptations--
21:04 chris_n hehe
21:04 nengard left #koha
21:05 * chris_n agrees that there is no match for the book
21:05 chris_n bbl
21:05 pianohacker see ya
21:13 sekjal off to the train.  later, #koha
21:13 sekjal left #koha
21:22 pianohacker brb, headed to work
21:22 pianohacker left #koha
21:40 ricardo joined #koha
21:40 ricardo Hi again
21:42 soul9 aye
21:45 nengard joined #koha
21:48 chris hey nengard
21:48 ricardo Hi Nichole / Hi Chris
21:48 ricardo I'll resume a question I posted here about 2 hours ago... Looking for the log
21:49 nengard hello
21:50 chris_n2_ joined #koha
21:50 ricardo ricardo: Another "dependencies complaint"... this time from running "./ pt-PT" in a machine that has been upgraded from SLES 10 SP2 (SuSE Linux Enterprise Server ) to SLES 11.
21:50 chris k
21:51 ricardo ricardo: The dependency is "Locale/". Should it be added to Makefile.PL ("Locale::Language" is there)?  [And what version should I add?]
21:51 ricardo pastebot: "ricardo" at pasted "Apparent missing "Locale::PO" dependency in Makefile.PL (for Koha 3.0.x)" (17 lines) at
21:51 nengard there is a patch in 3.2 that removes item from the reservoir right?
21:52 nengard I thought I remembered documenting that
21:52 chris who knows
21:53 ricardo chris: Are you answering me? Nichole? Both?  ;-)
21:53 chris nicole
21:53 ricardo s/Nichole/Nicole  (sorry!)
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21:55 chris_n2_ is now known as chris_n2
21:56 chris its in the list of packages
21:56 chris liblocale-po-perl       install
21:56 chris so needs to be added to the is my guess
21:56 ricardo chris: Right
21:56 ricardo chris: Any way to know what version should one use for a patch?
21:57 chris use the latest stable
21:58 ricardo chris: That's safe, to be sure... Although it could be annoying for people that have the package from their distribution, but when that one doesn't include the latest version (speaking from experience, as you might guess)
21:58 chris yep, it wont stop you installing though
21:59 ricardo chris: True. Grumble... OK, I'll have to think this
22:00 chris i dont think its worth using an old version unless there is a valid reason to, usually miss out on a bunch of fixes that way
22:00 ricardo Another one I believe is YAML (already including YAML::Syck, but I believe YAML is also necessary, and may not be installed because, AFAIK, "YAML::Syck" does NOT depend on "YAML")
22:01 chris right
22:01 ricardo chris: Agreed... But I was "aiming" for easing the installation for the greatest Universe possible... and that would mean less dependencies and older versions  :)
22:01 chris yeah, but then we might get owned
22:02 chris which would be a bad look
22:02 ricardo chris: If the changes are security related, then yes, you're right
22:03 ricardo chris: But, like you said (or might say), there's no problem in requiring a lower version and the person installing a more recent version
22:03 nengard in case you all care - yes there is a feature in 3.2 that lets you clean the reservoir
22:04 chris i think a good rule of thumb, require the latest stable version, unless there is a compelling feature/bug reason to need an older one
22:05 ricardo chris: OK... I understand and, for the reasons stated above, agree that we... disagree  ;-)  But no problem. Let me focus in the changes in this particular module
22:06 chris ricardo: if we require an old one, and there is a bug that has been fixed then people wont get it and will complain that koha is broken
22:06 chris (happened with MARC::File)
22:06 chris but now i have to go to a meeting
22:06 ricardo chris: OK
22:07 pianohackr|work joined #koha
22:08 ricardo chris: And thanks for the explanations  :)
22:15 nengard left #koha
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22:47 Nate Dinner time Goodnight #koha
22:47 Nate left #koha
23:08 ricardo (Debian 5.0.3 1st DVD downloaded in under an hour. Not bad at all!  :)
23:19 * ricardo is recording Debian 5.0.3 to a DVD+R
23:38 brendan ok time to head home -- catch some playoff baseball (maybe "I'll be back" - like my governator arnold says)
23:42 ricardo brendan: LOL! OK  :)
23:48 brendan left #koha
23:59 chris back

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