IRC log for #koha, 2009-09-21

All times shown according to UTC.

Time S Nick Message
01:11 * chris_n^2 goes crosseyed
01:11 chris_n^2 @define crazy
01:11 chris heh
01:11 munin` chris_n^2: I suck
01:18 * chris_n^2 quits (for the evening that is...) 8-P
01:18 chris_n^2 is now known as chris_n2-away
01:22 chris_n2-away for the record: there is something addictive about coding for Koha :-)
01:22 chris hehe
01:22 chris tell me about it
04:12 Amit joined #koha
04:13 Amit hi chris, richard, brendan
04:13 chris hi Amit
04:14 richard amit, hi
04:25 Jo joined #koha
04:25 Jo Hi all
04:26 chris hiya Jo :)
04:28 Amit hi jo
04:32 Jo hey AMit
04:33 Jo I never used to even hear the word 'cricket' but since watching Amit and Chris talk Cricket on here I heard this morning that NZ won a cricket game - and I thought of you Amit!
04:33 chris hehe
04:33 Jo obviously being absobing something subliminally :)
04:33 hdl_laptop left #koha
04:33 Amit yes NZ win warmup match by 103 runs
04:33 Jo only a warm up ... so it doesn't count?
04:34 Amit Chris, Jo: Big match is coming on 26 sep india  vs pakistan
04:34 Amit it is not count Jo it is only warm up match
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04:37 Jo oh well - at least we won sopmething
04:40 Amit Jo: heee
04:41 richard chris: whereabouts is yr hq?
04:42 chris 150 Willis St
04:42 richard thanks
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05:05 * richard heads south
05:05 richard cyas
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06:56 chris evening
06:58 Ropuch Morning
07:01 hdl_laptop hi chris
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07:35 chris hi Kivutar and paul_p
07:39 Kivutar hi chris and all
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07:50 |Lupin| good morning, everybody
07:52 chris hi |Lupin|
07:52 |Lupin| good evening chris
07:54 Amit hi lupin, nicomo, hdl
07:55 paul_p hello chris & everybody
07:55 paul_p chris++ for blog "Reflections on a fork"
07:58 chris thanks
08:01 magnusenger hi all! Very good blog post chris!
08:02 paul_p hi magnusenger
08:02 magnusenger hi paul_p
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08:12 Willem Hi, can anyone tell me wbout the difference between a normal item type that can be created by the user and shows in the staff pages, and the ones used in the OPAC serach page? The latter seems to depend on 000 and 008 fields and it would be nice to see the same as the normal set of itemtypes.
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08:31 chris hmm i didn't understand that question at all
08:33 Ropuch Neither did I
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09:09 chris hi nahuel
09:10 nahuel hi chris !
09:10 nahuel what'su p ?
09:10 |Lupin| hello nahuel
09:10 chris not much, whats up with you?
09:10 nahuel hi |Lupin|
09:10 nahuel I'm trying to have my car licence
09:11 nahuel hehe
09:13 |Lupin| nahuel: good luck :)
09:15 nahuel hehe thx
09:15 nahuel I'm at the quasi-end
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09:37 Amit hi nahuel
09:37 nahuel hi Amit
09:38 Amit i m going to home not feeling well bye all
09:38 nahuel ++
09:38 nahuel feel well :)
09:38 chris feel better soon
09:39 Amit some back problem
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12:04 |Lupin| hi jane
12:06 |Lupin| I'm wondering what to use in a script and associate template to generate a series of <option> tags for one set au authorised values
12:06 |Lupin| can someone help, pls ?
12:12 nicomo_laptop magnusenger: around?
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12:21 |Lupin| hi Galen
12:21 gmcharlt hi |Lupin|
12:22 magnusenger nicomo_laptop: am now!
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12:39 hdl_laptop hi gmcharlt
12:39 gmcharlt hi hdl_laptop
12:39 gmcharlt how are you doing today?
12:43 * |Lupin| is doing well, thanks. HOw about you gmcharlt ?
12:45 ebegin joined #koha
12:47 |Lupin| hi ebegin
12:47 |Lupin| nice to see you again
12:47 ebegin Hey!  Back from vacation :)
12:50 |Lupin| ebegin: great. How was it ?
12:50 ebegin Nice but as any vacation, too short
12:53 chris_n2 g'morning koha
12:53 |Lupin| yeah...
12:54 ebegin monging chris_n2
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12:59 |Lupin| gmcharlt: round ?
12:59 gmcharlt no, I think I'm more angular
12:59 gmcharlt what's up/
13:00 |Lupin| gmcharlt: I'm wondering how to generate a form that let's one choose a value from an authorised value set ?
13:00 |Lupin| gmcharlt: both in scripts and templates... I guess it's rather simple ?
13:01 gmcharlt yes - GetBranchesLoop would be an example of how to construct it
13:01 gmcharlt as well as the classification source and item type dropdowns in the item editor
13:02 |Lupin| gmcharlt: thanks a lot !
13:02 |Lupin| gmcharlt: is it as simple to determine user ategory ?
13:02 * jdavidb is round.  gmcharlt is all sharp corners, by comparison.
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13:03 gmcharlt |Lupin|: yes
13:03 slef hi all.  Is there an obvious reason not to default_escape => "HTML" in C4::Output's calls to HTML::Template::Pro->new()?
13:05 gmcharlt slef: no, though there are some places in the templates that would have to override that default
13:05 slef chris_n2: thanks for the notice. Let me know if we can help test.
13:05 slef gmcharlt: ESCAPE="0" on some of the includes right?
13:05 gmcharlt right
13:05 slef anywhere else?
13:06 gmcharlt basically anything where HTML is still being constructed inside code
13:06 gmcharlt some of the cataloging and item editor code, f'rinstance
13:10 slef most of the URLs already have ESCAPE="URL" on them
13:10 slef this seems like it would massive reduce XSS attack opportunities
13:10 slef which I've just had a heavy report about
13:10 slef s/massive/&ly
13:10 slef so shall we do it only on opac for 3.2?
13:10 slef (and 3.0 I hope)
13:11 gmcharlt slef: do a patch and see how much tweaking of escapes at the template level have to be done
13:12 gmcharlt I'm generally agreeable to trying it for 3.2
13:12 slef Bug 3652 has been added to the database
13:12 munin` Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=3652 critical, P5, ---,, NEW, XSS vulnerabilities
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13:13 chris_n2 tnx slef, I'll keep you posted and let you know as soon as things assume a semi-functional state
13:14 chris_n2 of course all my work is available daily 0600 GMT in my public repo
13:14 chris_n2 chris++ ## reflections on a fork
13:16 slef gmcharlt: seems to me that we'll need to tweak something at the template level anyway... I think default_escape = "HTML" seems more failsafe than not, though.
13:16 gmcharlt slef: indeed
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13:44 hdl_laptop gmcharlt: I think I have not sent the Auth_with_ldap fixed as I should have. do you confirm ?
13:44 gmcharlt hdl_laptop: right, I don't believe I've received the latest version
13:45 hdl_laptop Will send that right away
13:47 hdl_laptop sent
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14:22 Willem Hi all, can anyone explain to me the difference between the filetypes in the staff window and the ones in OPAC search results? The latter seem to depend on 000 and 008 fields. It would be nice to see the normal item type.
14:22 Willem I asked this earlier today but no response
14:23 jdavidb Willem:  OPAC search results (and staff hitlists) are working off of the MARC record, and don't--at that point--have the item types from the item record.
14:24 Willem But the item type in the MARC record (942 or so I seem to remember) shows nicely to staff members but not to OPAC. There you get things depending on 000 and 008 digits.
14:25 jdavidb At the detail level, yes.   But by then, it's accessed the item record.
14:25 jdavidb In the OPAC, it doesn't access the item records for that until the details screen.  Zebra doesn't have that, so it can't give it in search.
14:26 jdavidb gmcharlt, feel free to pounce if I'm wrong on this;  it's all still very much black magic to me.
14:28 Willem But the OPAC search produces several details about a biblio. Can't it look for the item type in 942 and produce the correct icon?
14:28 magnusenger i think you are able to *display* pretty much what you want in the OPAC result lists by going the XSLT route
14:29 jdavidb How much do you want to slow it down?   You can do some of that with XSLT, though how it would handle if you had multiple items is pretty murky to me.
14:29 owen Willem: The search results screen assumes your item types and collection codes are being set at the item level
14:29 magnusenger the default XSLTs use 000 and 008, but you could rewrite them to use 942
14:30 jdavidb The nice thing about 000/008 is that it only appears once.  You can have zero or more 942s, which might cause some confusion.  Have to hack around that some, I'd think.
14:30 magnusenger if you know all items have the same values you could just use the first one...
14:31 magnusenger if there are several items, that is
14:31 jdavidb No way to guarantee that.
14:31 magnusenger no, but it could be a policy, or something
14:32 * jdavidb has met way too many catalogers who do not think that house policies apply to them.
14:33 jdavidb Not knocking policies, per se, but the only person I'm going to assume will follow my rules, is me.
14:34 Willem SorryMy immediate problem is that we have an item type called "Article", which is a bunch of paper, ofthen just A4 prints in a sleeve. When an OPAC search says "Book" that's very confusing. We've created a nice item type with icon, but the OPAC ignores it. Can I create my own things for 000 / 008?
14:35 owen Willem: the "book" icon is based on MARC's default material types
14:35 owen So it is not connected to item types or collection codes
14:35 Willem And can I create more material types than the ones you can choose in 000/008?
14:36 owen Technically no, there is a specific set of options defined by the MARC standard
14:37 magnusenger come to think of it, i don't think 942 is repeatable, the way 952 is...
14:39 Willem So could I change the OPAC search template to display something based on the 942 field (if available)? I guess there is a routine in the Biblio module that reads 942?
14:41 jdavidb magnusenger: Sure enough, it's not.  Could use that, then.
14:41 magnusenger i think you could use 000/008 to say that something is a printed monograph, then use 942c to say that is an article, and then use XSLT to display the icon you want
14:41 magnusenger and set up XSLT to override the default "book" icon, if 942c says it's an article
14:44 Willem I'm afraid I have no idea (yet) what XSLT is about. Just discovered perl and managed to change items with one of those modules. What would be my entry point to try and work with XSLT?
14:44 magnusenger Willem: Good question! ;-)
14:46 magnusenger Willem: Have a look at the XSLT files and try to understand what is happening in there
14:54 Willem Great, I've already found a place where 008 23 is checked and an icon is chosen. I'll see what I can fiddle here.
14:55 Willem Thanks a lot.
14:55 magnusenger Willem: off the top of my head, i think the XSLT could look something like the highlighted section in the middle here: i have *not* tested this, though!
15:02 |Lupin| end of working day here
15:02 |Lupin| bye all !
15:02 |Lupin| left #koha
15:04 Willem magnusenger: Wow, that's big help. I'll see how I can fit this in. Thanks very much.
15:05 magnusenger Willem: you're welcome! Off to make dinner , now...
15:28 * chris_n2 chuckles at jdavidb 's rules enforcement philosophy ;-)
15:28 chris_n2 is now known as chris_n
15:28 jdavidb chris_n:  If you can't make the software enforce it, then it's not a rule; it's a suggestion.
15:29 jdavidb ...and some cataloger who started back about the time Gutenberg was working will decide it doesn't apply to them, and ignore it.
15:29 chris_n lol
15:29 * jdavidb is a cynical old coot sometimes.
15:35 magnusenger jdavidb: probably not a bad idea! ;-)
15:37 jdavidb magnusenger: Having worked in library IT for 18 years now, my trust mechanism is completely broken.  "Policies" are for the naive, who think that all their users are really bright, group-minded people who never make mistakes.
15:38 jdavidb The reality, sadly, is often very different.
15:43 wizzyrea ok, maybe something like would help with the interactivity of our #koha meetings
15:44 wizzyrea webcams + chat
15:52 sh left #koha
15:53 jdavidb wizzyrea++
15:55 wizzyrea check out
15:57 chris_n wizzyrea: how was the ride?
15:58 wizzyrea faboo!
15:58 wizzyrea my pace car wouldn't let me get over 130MPH, but it was still flippin fantabulous
15:59 chris_n neat-o
16:00 slef I don't want to think about how much my legs would hurt pedalling up to 130mph
16:01 gmcharlt slef++
16:03 wizzyrea someone told me that I "didn't get the car out of 2nd gear" which is not true!! I was in 4th (where I was supposed to be)!
16:03 wizzyrea but yea, it was great
16:04 jdavidb Any
16:04 wizzyrea[…]f1a&id=1078323327
16:04 Ropuch If I want to translate MARC fields&subfields do i need to do this via staff interface?
16:04 * chris_n feels like he is pedaling at 130MHP at times
16:05 Ropuch Is there something like .po file for this?
16:06 gmcharlt Ropuch: no PO file, but it may be easier to start from the SQL scripts that load the MARC frameworks
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16:18 magnusenger wizzyrea et al: could be an option too?
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16:21 wizzyrea ohhh true!
16:21 wizzyrea I just saw the comment that IRC meetings weren't optimal for less geeky librarians
16:21 wizzyrea too much to process I guess
16:21 wizzyrea wasn't really looking for a solution to that, stumbled across tinychat
16:21 wizzyrea but dimdim looks good too
16:23 wizzyrea only bad thing about that is you have to have an account
16:23 wizzyrea tinychat is literally click and you're in
16:24 wizzyrea of course, slef probably wouldn't like either because they're not open :( and less than accessible
16:24 slef I thought dimdim was, but maybe I misremember
16:25 slef open... not sure about accessibility
16:25 slef still not tried that from the machine with gnash installed
16:27 wizzyrea it would be helpful, if you have a minute, to determine which is better. I think some audio/video would be helpful for less geeky librarians
16:29 slef I have too few minutes at the moment :-(
16:31 * jdavidb is having way more fun than the law allows, watching wizzyrea's antics on tinychat.
16:36 wizzyrea and sharon!
16:36 wizzyrea it's not just mee
16:37 wizzyrea slef: understood
16:37 wizzyrea (if i'm going to propose one, I'd rather propose the better solution)
16:38 slef no FOSS-based machines there?
16:42 wizzyrea yep, we do have some... what would you want me to check
16:42 wizzyrea (just not sure what your criteria are)
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16:54 jhaig I have downloaded the vmware image but I do not know what the password is.  Where can I find it?  Thanks
16:55 jhaig I got the unconfigured official release from[…]-tools/files/Koha Virtual Appliance/
17:01 slef wizzyrea: try accessing from a machine which has only free software installed, like epiphany with gnash or some such
17:01 jhaig Found it (eventually) in the "New Koha Virtual Appliances Available" thread on the mailing list.
17:01 slef jhaig: I think searching the email list
17:01 slef heh
17:01 wizzyrea slef: okies, will do that :)
17:02 slef wizzyrea: thanks
17:02 jhaig Next step - find out how to configure it.  Perhaps I should have gone with the configured version as a first attempt.  :-/
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17:06 jhaig Is there any documentation for the vmware image?  I have found the main documentation, but it doesn't say what to do to get past the 'System maintenance ...", which is the only thing I can get to.  I am guessing that if I install manually (ie, not use the vmware image) I would get automatically taken to the configuration when I first visit the web page.
17:06 slef jhaig: Sorry, I think you need to ask the koha-tools developers.  I'm not sure who they are.
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17:08 jhaig Oh, I didn't realise it was separate from the main project.
17:10 slef well, not all developers work on all parts
17:10 slef it's its own sourceforge project... so maybe that lists particular nicknames to try?
17:11 slef kyle: are you there?
17:11 slef (just got his name off )
17:11 slef @seen kyle
17:11 munin` slef: kyle was last seen in #koha 4 days, 2 hours, 30 minutes, and 55 seconds ago: <kyle> no problem. I'll have to roll some new ones as soon as 3.2 is out the door.
17:12 jhaig I have found that there is a version that includes a README, which probably has all the information I need.  The only thing is, now have I have already downloaded one 600+Mb tarball, I don't really want to have to download another, just for the sake of a single text file.  :-(
17:13 slef might have it
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17:13 slef but it looks fairly unrelated and unupdated to me
17:13 jhaig[…]n_view.php?eid=14 <= Has it - use port http://<host>:8080
17:14 slef oic - should have guessed that
17:15 jhaig Not entirely guessable.  I would normally associate 8080 with a proxy server.
17:27 Nate joined #koha
17:28 wizzyrea interesting, I would normally associate 3128 with a proxy server
17:28 Nate Hello everyone
17:28 wizzyrea hi Nate :)
17:29 Nate i am officially an old geezer as of yeterday
17:29 jdavidb Oh?
17:29 Nate hit the ripe age of 30
17:29 * jdavidb snorts.
17:29 Nate im already getting out of bed twice a night to pee
17:31 jdavidb um...TMI?   But back in ten years, youngster.
17:32 chris_n what very obvious thing am I missing here:
17:32 chris_n given:
17:32 chris_n my $HoH = {H1 =>{H2 =>{H3 =>{H4 => 'data'}}}};
17:32 chris_n why does:
17:32 chris_n if ($$HoH{H1}{H2}{H3}{H4} eq 'data') {foobar};
17:32 chris_n throw: "Not a SCALAR reference at foo line bar."
17:32 chris_n while:
17:32 chris_n warn $$HoH{H1}{H2}{H3}{H4};
17:32 chris_n returns: "data"
17:34 jhaig wizzyrea: Both 3128 and 8080 are used for proxy servers.
17:35 * jdavidb is stumped by your problem, chris_n..   It *looks* all right..
17:36 chris_n jdavidb: works ok as a one liner as well...
17:44 Ropuch Anybody familiar with gettext? I want to generate .po for file with "$variable=something" and want the $variable name to be extracted as comments
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17:48 chris_n here the problem is in a bit of context:
18:30 chris morning
18:30 jdavidb Hi, chris!
18:30 owen Hi chris
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18:30 chris_n heya chris
18:31 chris_n jdavidb: worse yet, the code that throw error in the script works fine as a one-liner :-P
18:31 * chris_n runs out of the room screaming
18:31 * jdavidb scratches his head.
18:37 eric_b is now known as ebegin
18:37 chris chris_n: can you paste the whole bit
18:37 chris_n sure
18:38 chris again, including what is in the if
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18:41 chris_n chris:
18:41 chris_n I think that covers it
18:41 chris_n if in question is line 61
18:42 chris ta
18:43 chris so the warn just before it is fine, but the next line errors?
18:43 chris_n right
18:45 chris_n running the pertinent parts on cli seems to work fine, to boot... :-S
18:47 chris elsif ($$layout->{'images'}->{$_​}->{'data_source'}->{'db'} eq 'pcards_images') {
18:47 chris that is wrong
18:48 chris_n right
18:48 chris (double deferencing)
18:48 chris_n errr... right that's wrong
18:48 chris and perl may be in fact griping about that
18:48 chris sometimes in if blocks it gets the line number wrong
18:49 chris_n ahh
18:49 chris_n lemme correct that
18:52 chris_n chris: went through and corrected all of the double deref errors and things work fine now
18:52 chris_n tnx a whole lot
18:52 chris np
18:52 chris basically its all one line as far as perl is concerned
18:52 * chris_n gets stuck in deref foo with deep hashes sometimes :-P
18:56 chris the other thing i would do, is not use the implicit variable .. simply because i hate it, but thats just a personal thing :)
18:56 chris (i hate having to scroll up to go .. "whats that again?")
19:00 * chris will bbiab
19:02 chris_n yeah, I plan on changing that in my final code... this is a hack script to test module methods, etc
19:03 chris_n I'm for maximum readability in code... less for me to remember when I have to debug some obscure issue after having forgotten why I wrote it that way to begin with ;-)
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19:19 chris :)
19:20 gmcharlt "who is that idiot who wrote that code?"
19:20 gmcharlt "oops, it's me"
19:20 chris git dont-blame-me
19:20 chris only shows the lines you didnt write
19:20 chris :-)
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19:30 chris_n hehe
19:34 saorge left #koha
19:35 * chris_n hates accidentally dumping jpeg data to the terminal window...
19:36 Ropuch Harmles ;>
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19:39 pianohacker hello
19:41 wizzyrea are you feeling a bet wet down there in Atlanta, gmcharlt?
19:41 wizzyrea s/bet/bit
19:42 pianohacker hi wizzyrea, gmcharlt
19:42 gmcharlt wizzyrea: nope, since I'm Gainesville; however, by all accounts I should expect the Atlanta office to start floating my direction any minute now
19:42 Ropuch hello, pianohacker
19:42 gmcharlt hi pianohacker
19:43 pianohacker hi Ropuch
19:43 chris ok bus time
19:44 chris_n Ropuch: yes, but it wrecks the scroll-back buffer :-)
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20:24 chris_n bbl
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20:26 richard hi
20:27 pianohacker hello
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20:36 chris bacl
20:37 chris back even
20:41 Ropuch [;
20:41 Ropuch chris: are you familiar with a gettext?
20:43 chris a little
20:44 Ropuch I can't figure out how to get extarcted comments in .po file
20:46 chris ahh, i have never tried im afraid
20:46 Ropuch ;>
20:47 Ropuch Another reason to live for: solve the xgettext -k mystery [;
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21:30 hdl_laptop chris : I just sent a tmpl_process update on 3.2 and pushed that on 3.0.x
21:31 hdl_laptop chris : this update also takes into account xsl files
21:31 chris ohh excellent
21:31 chris i will regen the .po files for 3.0.x
21:31 hdl_laptop chris : + fixes a bug in input type=submit
21:31 chris and when its pushed on master, will do the 3.2.x ones too
21:32 chris  i did the 3.2 ones over the weekend
21:32 chris kf has already finished german !!! so speedy
21:32 hdl_laptop gmcharlt: I know I should have waited for you to sign it and test that.
21:32 hdl_laptop It was in biblibre-integration
21:35 chris hmmm
21:35 chris lots of errors
21:35 chris ERROR: Text extraction failed: ./ Inappropriate ioctl for device
21:35 chris ERROR: Will not run msgmerge
21:36 chris have you seen them before?
21:36 gmcharlt hdl_laptop: now I know what to test next :)
21:37 hdl_laptop gmcharlt: if you are interested, biblibre-newacq and biblibre-integration are joined on CodeRunBase branch
21:37 gmcharlt cool
21:37 hdl_laptop But still some work in progess on that.
21:37 gmcharlt ETA on your end?
21:37 hdl_laptop And then rebase on master
21:38 hdl_laptop I thought it would be published last week.
21:38 hdl_laptop But I think we will need some more work on that.
21:38 gmcharlt k
21:38 gmcharlt bbiab
21:39 chris hdl_laptop: i cant get it to work
21:39 chris ./ update -i ../../koha-tmpl/opac-tmpl/prog/en/ -s po/fr-FR-i-opac-t-prog-v-3000000.po -r
21:39 chris ERROR: Text extraction failed: ./ Inappropriate ioctl for device
21:39 chris ERROR: Will not run msgmerge
21:39 chris Update FAILED.
21:40 hdl_laptop shoot.
21:40 hdl_laptop I wanted to include also js.
21:40 hdl_laptop And failed
21:40 hdl_laptop I can get that bug fixed
21:40 chris yep its trying to jquery.js just before that error
21:41 hdl_laptop In you have |js|
21:41 hdl_laptop I think it is the culprit
21:41 chris lemme take that out
21:42 chris yes, that was it
21:42 hdl_laptop You can remove |def too.
21:43 chris cool, ill let you patch it and push
21:43 chris and then ill regen the .po files tonight
21:43 hdl_laptop Since it was because In a moment of enthousiasm, I thought columns.def would become translatable
21:44 hdl_laptop And unfortunately, tmpl_process is only meant for ..... tmpl files or at least xhtml files
21:44 chris *nod*
21:44 chris we can write a new one for .def and .js
21:44 chris and then can call both
21:44 chris another thing to put on the list
21:45 hdl_laptop we would HAVE to since translations seems to be a neverending task if we donot
21:45 chris yep
21:45 hdl_laptop But maybe we could/should make .def a yaml file
21:46 hdl_laptop so that pianohacker work on system preferences could get translated too
21:48 chris we should have a talk with him about that
21:49 hdl_laptop ok.
21:49 chris ok meeting time
21:49 hdl_laptop good nite
21:49 chris back later
21:49 pianohacker though they'd be different kinds of files, even just the infrastructure to deal with things besides .tmpl's would help
21:49 pianohacker hibye
21:53 Richard2k10 joined #koha
21:54 Richard2k10 for koha 3, what is the best way to clear out all the materials you have imported but still retain settings and such?
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22:46 ecorrado is now known as edc_away
22:59 rhcl is now known as rhcl_away
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23:41 chris back

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