IRC log for #koha, 2009-03-18

All times shown according to UTC.

Time S Nick Message
11:29 Amit hi jwagner
11:43 jwagner Hi Amit.  Good morning or afternoon or whatever :-)
11:43 Amit good evening
11:43 Amit jwagner
11:43 Amit 5:13 pm in india
11:43 jwagner One of these years I'll wrap my mind around time zones.  I can barely keep up with continental U.S.  Sigh.
11:44 SelfishMan I love the half hour time zones.  They really mess with things
11:44 Amit hi selfishMan
11:44 SelfishMan mornin'
11:45 kf near lunch time here :) 12:44 (germany)
11:45 SelfishMan 5:45am here in Montana
11:45 jwagner And 7:45 in Maryland
11:45 Amit hmm 11:30 behind
11:46 Amit 11:30 hr
11:46 Amit hi kf
11:46 kf hi Amit
11:46 Amit so how r  u
11:46 Amit kf
11:47 Amit ;)
11:47 kf near lunch time - so im fine, need a break now
11:47 Amit hmm
11:52 kf bbl
11:53 Amit means
12:01 Amit hi chris
12:14 jwagner Is anyone around who knows anything about bug 2655, Items waiting on the hold shelf display as "Available" in OPAC?  Owen?
12:43 owen jwagner, you were asking about big 2655?
12:43 owen I mean bug 2655
12:49 jwagner Yes, the one where items on the hold shelf still show as available in the OPAC.  Bugzilla says that's still outstanding, correct?
12:51 owen Yeah, I haven't heard anything about it
12:51 owen Do you have folks on staff who are looking at bugs?
12:52 jwagner Not yet, but it's a problem for us.  I saw you were one of the people reporting/discussing it -- didn't know if you knew about any fix in the works.
12:52 jwagner (We're working on other bugs, but not this one, to clarify.)
12:53 owen That's great to hear
12:53 owen It's a severe enough bug that I would think someone would be working on it, but I haven't heard anything
12:54 jwagner I had hoped so, too.  I'll keep my ears open, and we'll think about working on a fix -- no promises yet....
12:55 owen I'm surprised I haven't heard more complaints about this bug from my staff
12:57 jwagner That's OK, I'm making up for it on the "hearing complaints" level :-(
12:58 jwagner Thanks, Owen.  Gotta run to a meeting now -- back later.
13:07 owen I'm trying to see in where it checks whether something is waiting, and I'm not seeing it.
13:07 owen Not that that means anything necessarily.
13:46 jwagner Owen, are you rearranging deck chairs???
13:46 owen Just noticing how many people are timing out
13:46 jwagner OK, I was a bit worried :-)
14:19 liz_nekls_ jwagner: NEKLS sees that too
14:19 liz_nekls_ the items on the hold shelf displaying as available
14:19 liz_nekls_ definitely one of our pet peeves
14:24 liz_nekls_ atz: you'll be around later for this envisionware deal? (1pm central)
14:25 jwagner Liz, let us know if you hear anything about a possible fix.
14:25 jwagner Off to another meeting, back later....
14:25 liz_nekls_ yea, I definitely will... we're waiting with bated breath for sure
14:27 atz liz_nekls_: yep, looking forward to figuring out what the deal is there...
15:05 liz_nekls_ cool ttyl  then (dang work kept me away for 30 mins, sheesh)
15:08 atz stupid job always getting in the way of... my job
16:39 owen Twitter's tagline should be "What are you facepalming about today?"
16:40 owen My current gripe: search result RSS feed lists title and...number of pages? How about subtitle? author?
17:56 atz liz_nekls: who's calling who?
17:56 atz *whom...
17:57 atz hello
21:24 [k3rn3l] hi.. why perl and not something else?
21:24 SelfishMan perl is stable and works
21:26 [k3rn3l] i would say very stable :)
21:27 [k3rn3l] thanks
21:27 chris plus in 1999
21:27 chris CPAN pretty much ruled the roost
21:28 chris we would have had to write a lot more code if we used another language, also we had 3 people at katipo who knew perl ;)
21:29 richard hi
21:29 chris speaking of katipo, heya richard :)
21:30 richard hi chris
21:30 SelfishMan perl is nice
21:31 SelfishMan I can't believe that nobody has created a module to handle web archives (.warc)
21:31 [k3rn3l] i believe that koha is the most used open source in this kind of software! right?
21:32 SelfishMan I think here in the US Evergreen is dominant but I could be wrong
21:32 chris nope there are far more koha installs than evergreen ones
21:32 chris even in the US
21:33 SelfishMan well that is good to hear
21:33 chris it's not really a competition :)
21:33 [k3rn3l] i've seen evergreen, and it is also perl!
21:33 [k3rn3l] and both seem really cool
21:33 SelfishMan chris: I know it's not but I do like to know that there is a larger community around the one I use!
21:34 chris makes sense
21:34 [k3rn3l] well, community makes open source better
21:35 [k3rn3l] you guys are also responsible for instalations in libaries?
21:35 chris im not
21:35 chris and sometimes i send in some patches
21:36 [k3rn3l] i work in a city hall and the spent some money acquiring this commercial solution!! desktop based
21:37 chris but i was paid to work on koha from 1999, to 2007 .. and hopefully will be again in the future
21:38 chris SelfishMan: have i asked if you are going to Kohacon?
21:38 chris [k3rn3l]: commercial isnt bad ... proprietary i dont like
21:38 SelfishMan I was hoping to make it but I have a security job at that time and I can't reschedule it
21:39 chris people open confuse commercial and proprietary .. you can be commercial and opensource
21:39 chris SelfishMan: bummer :(
21:39 [k3rn3l] chris: commercial and proprietary
21:40 chris yeah, those usually are annoying :)
21:40 SelfishMan I know.  There will be a few people going from in the state and even one person working for the state shared catalog
21:40 [k3rn3l] there is a lot of commercial open source
21:40 [k3rn3l] pentahoo is a good example
21:40 chris koha even
21:40 chris if you go with a paid support company
21:41 [k3rn3l] drupal itself offers paid support
21:41 chris *nod*
21:41 [k3rn3l] and lots of other well know CMSs
21:41 chris SelfishMan: i will try to blog all the sessions
21:42 [k3rn3l] what I don't like to see is when a company makes all kinds of money with OSS and never give something back to the community
21:42 SelfishMan cool.  Any thoughts on posting some video or audio?
21:42 chris if i had the ability to record some i would, ill ask around
21:43 chris [k3rn3l]: sometimes even that helps the community indirectly
21:43 chris by making the product seem more 'real'
21:44 chris but yes, id rather they gave back directly
21:44 SelfishMan We are hitting critical mass in my state where many libraries are ready to adopt koha but they have a handful of concerns Lee and I are trying to address
21:44 chris SelfishMan: im sure we can figure something out, someone in the US has gotta have a dvd camera
21:44 chris am i remembering right, you are in montana?
21:44 SelfishMan yep
21:45 [k3rn3l] here in portugal the national informatics institute is using koha
21:46 chris at butte silver bow?
21:46 chris [k3rn3l]: thats excellent news :)
21:46 SelfishMan I was shocked to hear that somone from the state's shared catalog was going to attend kohacon considering the hate they initially showed towards it
21:46 chris [k3rn3l]:
21:47 chris i wonder if you know people who can help translate Koha into portuguese ?
21:47 chris SelfishMan: oh yeah? informed hate, or just plain old prejudice? :-)
21:48 [k3rn3l] well, I know a lot of people... I'll see if they are willing to make part of such a cool project
21:48 SelfishMan Well, not really hate as much as an instinctive fear response
21:48 chris ahh yeah, thats fairly common SelfishMan
21:48 chris [k3rn3l]: excellent :-)
21:49 SelfishMan Yeah, I know.  It's unfortunate and doesn't help the patrons in the state.  We're willing to work with them and be patient while they realize we aren't trying to attack them.
21:49 chris *nod*
22:03 [k3rn3l] one thing i've noticed.. those that use evergreen simple love it... those who use koha simple love it!! hehe
22:04 SelfishMan It's amazing the response I see from people that switch to koha and are actually able to have the changes made that they want.  I guess they are all used to being told to deal with it as is.
22:05 chris yeah, software vendors have had it way to easy for too long
22:07 SelfishMan I love the look on their faces when I tell them "Sure, give me a minute and I'll fix that"
22:07 chris hehe
22:08 [k3rn3l] that or wait for the next major update!! man... i don't like proprietary. most of the time the just want to build new features instead of fixing the ones the already have
22:08 SelfishMan That's one thing I've always loved about open source.  It's built around the people instead of trying to mold the people around the software
22:10 [k3rn3l] i will give you an example: this module to send e-cards... all it does it send an image via email! wtf :S:S. when i asked for improvements they said that e-card was just a core module and that there was no more support!
22:10 [k3rn3l] so, what the point of making something (and paying for it) if you just can't use it the right way ?!
22:11 SelfishMan If it's all you have then it is better than nothing.
22:11 [k3rn3l] that's the tipical "deal with it as it is"
22:13 SelfishMan It's kind of the same thing with my grandfather and broadband.  He was happy with a 14.4K modem when 33.6K was dominant then I upgraded him.  He was happy with that until I upgraded him to 56K.  Finally I kicked him up to broadband and when the provider went under I told him we could switch him back to dialup or double his access charge with someone else and he very clearly said in a dead serious voice "I will never go back to dialup"
22:13 SelfishMan Until you have better you really don't know what you are missing
22:16 [k3rn3l] so true... but mentalities are so hard to change!! people have this ideia of comercial  / propertary: "i'm paying, so if I have problems they will handle it" and this one with open source: "it's free, but what if I have problems... what's going to happen?"
22:16 chris yeah
22:18 SelfishMan The last time I called Follet for support on Athena (formerly from Sagebrush) they told me that I needed to buy the latest product despite us paying for a support contract.  That was the point that we decided FOSS was the way to go for the next ILS
22:18 brendan *nods* - free open-source education for the masses, is what is needed
22:19 [k3rn3l] well, with porbase (what we have here) it's the same! it uses a ms access database, if you want webaccess then you have to accquire sql server + more licenses for their software
22:19 SelfishMan I'm curious what concerns and resistance you all have run up against when trying to transition to koha
22:21 [k3rn3l] + windows server + license + a computer to run it!
22:23 [k3rn3l] i think people is scared of open source!! and also a matter of having the right people (read knowledge) in the right places
22:24 [k3rn3l] everytime i talk about open source the question people make are: "what about support? it means more work? linux... yeahhh cooll.. but windows is windows!!" and so on!
22:25 SelfishMan I've heard that a lot
22:27 [k3rn3l] i don't know there in the us: bu here in pt informatics is still lead by "non specialized" people
22:27 [k3rn3l] if you can assemble a pc and install a printer then you are the computers guy!!
22:27 [k3rn3l] that's the sad truth we have to deal here :s
22:28 SelfishMan I see that a lot as well.  That works as long as the people admit they don't know and are willing to learn.
22:36 chris sorry got sucked into work
22:36 chris yeah, thats a really common thing
22:36 chris often people secretly like the fact they cant fix something .. then they dont have to
22:37 chris its much easier to moan your software sux, than to do something abut it
22:37 [k3rn3l] chris: now you've said it all!
23:11 SelfishMan Gnewt: From #linode as well?
23:25 [k3rn3l] so, is koha your only projects?
23:25 [k3rn3l] one of the problems i face is that i want to do a bit of everything...
23:26 [k3rn3l] and sometimes i end up doing very little :S
23:26 SelfishMan koha is one of the many projects I'm tied up in
23:27 [k3rn3l] all in software?
23:27 SelfishMan several open source software projects, several proprietary, some hardware projects and a bunch of other random stuff
23:28 [k3rn3l] how do you manage all that?
23:28 SelfishMan I'm a bit of a universal contractor
23:28 [k3rn3l] and you background in computer science?
23:29 SelfishMan Mostly I work fast and efficient and try to avoid making mistakes! ;-P
23:30 [k3rn3l] so... myy problem it to select the technologie / framwork / somethng else that best suites my needs!!
23:30 SelfishMan When people ask what I do my general answer is that I fix people's problems.  I've actually spent a few years managing bars and restaurants because I was bored and it was something new
23:30 [k3rn3l] that's a big jump hehe
23:31 [k3rn3l] i have once head that software helps fixing the problems that software creates!
23:38 [k3rn3l] well, i'm leaving
23:38 [k3rn3l] take care
23:38 [k3rn3l] keep up the good work... just added koha to my favoutite channels lol
02:58 Gnewt SelfishMan_, yep, I'm the Gnewt from #linode :)
03:00 SelfishMan_ Thought so
03:00 SelfishMan_ Are you running koha on a Linode?
03:02 Gnewt Nope, on a server at Hackerbot Labs
03:02 Gnewt For the HBL library
03:02 SelfishMan_ ah
03:02 Gnewt It's a hackerspace in Seattle
03:02 Gnewt we have a lot of books we need to keep track of
03:03 Gnewt So I volunteered and then found Koha :D
03:04 SelfishMan_ That's awesome
03:05 Gnewt :)
03:06 Gnewt It's not done yet, I have it installed but we're not actively using it... we need to get the new barcode scanner first.
03:06 Gnewt
03:06 Gnewt Doesn't get updated much, it's new, but that's our blog.
03:06 Gnewt I did the post about the laser box
03:22 Amit hi mason, chris, brendan
03:22 brendan heya amit
03:22 Amit chris: what about first test match between NZ vs India
03:22 Amit r u watching match brendan
03:22 Amit First test
03:43 brendan ok -- will turn it on.. Thanks amit
03:44 chris vettori is 2 runs away from his century
03:44 chris indian started very well, but nz are slowly clawing their way back
03:44 chris 1 run now
03:45 mason ohhh, you boys.. ..
03:45 Amit good
03:45 Amit but NZ 60/6
03:45 Amit good recovery
03:46 Amit hi mason
03:46 chris yep, 213/6 now .. still you shouldnt leave it to your number 8 batsman to score all the runs :)
03:46 Amit hmm
03:47 Amit good partnership between vettori & Ryder
03:47 Amit now india to break this partnership
04:04 Amit this is highest 7th wicket partnership against india
04:04 Amit chris ;)
04:06 brendan chris what is the 213/6
04:07 chris its now 237/6 6 people out, for 237 runs scored
04:07 brendan ahh.. thanks
04:08 Amit 213 Runs
04:08 Amit 6 wicket
04:27 richard gah, forget the cricket was on
04:28 Amit hi richard
04:31 richard hi Amit
04:47 si ohh man, there's a test on, and I'm in san francisco
04:47 si there's no justice
04:49 si otoh, the kiwis aren't doing so well
04:50 Amit hi si
04:52 si hi amit
05:08 brendan hi si
05:10 si hi brendan
05:10 si hows the cricket education going?
05:11 brendan coming along nicely...
05:11 brendan so in San fran...  not to far away
05:11 brendan I'm down the coast from you
05:11 si ohh really?
05:11 si whereabouts?
05:11 brendan yup in Santa Barbara
05:12 brendan about 300 miles (US) south
05:21 Amit chris NZ all out 279
05:21 brendan si if you like beer, try different kinds of rogue -- there is a brew pub in downtown san fran...
05:30 si brendan: sadly, I'm only in town for two days before fling backhome
05:30 si and mos of that  time will be spent in colo rooms in south sanfrancisco and paloalto
06:51 brendan good night all --
06:56 ryan_ bad for my beer belly :/
06:58 brendan ryan_ I'm a big fan of there beer - i used to live near there newport OR brewhouse
07:02 ryan_ brendan: yeah, lots of good brewpubs here in portland.  rogue and deschuttes are my favorites.
07:05 chris you are in portland ryan_ ????
07:07 ryan_ chris: yeah, made the move about 4 weeks ago now.
07:08 chris nice
07:09 chris have you been for a drive along the coast?
07:12 chris watch out for the goonies near astoria :)
07:13 ryan_ heh -- no, i haven't gotten a car yet.  I did enroll in the local car sharing program, and took my first 'zipcar' out earlier today.
07:14 ryan_ pretty cool, really.  thus far i've gotten around quite well without a car.
07:17 chris nice, yeah ive heard portland has good public transport
07:31 ryan_ it's excellent, actually.  the streetcars are all free in the downtown area, which is darn convenient.
07:31 chris ohh that is cool, i hadnt realised that
08:32 fredericd hi
08:32 chris hi fredericd
08:32 fredericd hello chris
08:32 fredericd time to sleep?
08:33 chris in an hour or 2 yep
10:44 Amit hi kf
10:45 kf hi Amit
10:53 ron chris: sorry mate, I've lost the URL to the deb wiki page. do you have it handy?
10:53 hdl_laptop hi kf
10:54 ron chris: argh. found it.
10:55 kf hi hdl

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