IRC log for #koha, 2007-10-24

All times shown according to UTC.

Time S Nick Message
11:08 Irma hi all
11:09 Irma Is Paul around?
11:10 Irma Just needing to check the meaning of a few French words...
11:11 Irma Is HdL perhaps able to help?
12:24 kados morning all
12:24 kados paul_: you around?
12:24 paul kados : yes
12:24 kados paul: if you rebase, you'll find a script called
12:25 kados it was written by chris to check for missing systempreferences referenced in the code but not in the database
12:25 kados I find several missing ones on a en MARC21 install
12:26 kados language, SearchMyLibraryFirst,dontmerge,ManageZebra,Routing​Serials,Z3950authortemplate,BiblioAddsAuthorities
12:26 kados I'd be curious to find out if there are ones missing from UNIMARC fr too
12:30 kados wow, ModAuthority looks to me to be busted
12:31 kados :-)
12:32 kados also AddAuthority uses hard-coded tags
12:32 paul which ones ? the 152 ?
12:33 kados 001, 152, 100
12:33 paul 100 if only in UNIMARC I think/hope
12:33 paul 001 and 152 are for both UNIMARC 1 MARC21
12:33 kados doesnt' look like it
12:33 kados there's no 'if UNIMARC' for the 100 stuff
12:34 kados note: i'm just looking at code, I haven't actually tested authorities, so maybe it's fine :-)
12:37 kados paul: can you explain the RoutingSerials syspref?
12:37 paul nope
12:38 kados hdl: ?
12:40 hdl imported from kiwis code.
12:40 kados ok I'll ask chris
12:40 hdl It allows people to route serials or not.
12:59 kados hdl: how about SearchMyLibraryFirst and 'dontmerge' ... are you familiar with those?
12:59 hdl SearchMyLibraryFirst is used at OPAC
13:00 hdl in order to search by default in user branch rather than all branches
13:00 paul (when a user is logged, of course)
13:00 kados I see
13:02 kados and dontmerge?
13:02 kados looks like an authorities feature
13:02 kados something to do with updating or not updating biblios maybe?
13:02 kados when you edit an auth?
13:03 paul yes, that should be that. hdl, yo uconfirm ?
13:03 hdl If a library thinks that updating all biblios is a long process and wishes to leave that to a cron job to use merge_authotities.p
13:03 hdl ### they should have a system preference "dontmerge=1" otherwise by default biblios will be updated
13:03 hdl ### the $merge flag is now depreceated and will be removed at code cleaning
13:04 hdl in
13:04 kados so is it deprecated or not? :-)
13:10 kados hdl: ?
13:10 kados ahh, ok
13:10 kados hdl: while you're looking, I noticed that ModAuthorities has some hard-coded values
13:11 kados 001, 100, 152
13:11 kados why aren't we just using the framework for those?
13:11 hdl 001 : authid
13:11 hdl 152 : authtypecode.
13:12 hdl Because authid and authtypecode is not selectable in framework.
13:12 hdl 100 stands for UNIMARC leader.
13:12 hdl There seems to be a problem with him.
13:12 hdl (it)
13:13 kados *nod*
13:13 kados thx
13:13 kados paul: can you confirm that z3950authortemplate is fully deprecated? I see it in a code comment but nowhere else
13:13 kados (in addbiblio
13:14 paul z3950authortemplate ??? /me don't know what it is
13:14 hdl Should be deprecated.
13:14 hdl Was introduced in 2.2.9
13:14 kados ok
13:14 kados there is one last one: BiblioAddsAuthorities
13:14 paul ah, this one is VERY interesting !
13:15 paul if you activate it, it will automatically add authorities if needed (= it doesn't exist)
13:15 kados how does it know if one exists?
13:15 paul to see if it already exists, it search on authid vs $3 (unimarc specific)
13:15 paul or authority main entry excatly the same
13:16 kados k
13:16 paul if : poulain, paul, 1968-09-01 will fit my authority entry, but not poulain, paul, 1964-01-03 or poulain, Jean paul, 1968-01-09
13:17 paul hdl : do you think this feature is production ready ?
13:17 hdl No.
13:18 hdl require testing
13:18 kados I think it's a good start, but I know US libraries will want a lot more functionality, and they will want to be able to run reports on what these 'fake' authorities are, and overlay they later
13:18 kados overlay them later
13:18 paul users always want more ;-)
13:18 kados hehe
13:18 kados I'll add it to the sysprefs
13:19 kados SearchMyLibraryFirst is in Catalogue, but it's an OPAC feature, right?
13:20 kados or does it work for both staff and OPAC?
13:21 paul right, should be on OPAC iirc
13:30 kados morning joe
13:31 atz greets
14:27 fbcit g'morning all
14:28 fbcit kados: auth_tag_structure.authtypecode is char(10) while auth_types.authtypecode is varchar(10)... I assume they should be the same type?
14:29 kados yes, all char should be varchar now
14:30 kados as of 5.0, in mysql, there's not much reason to use char anymore
14:30 kados used to be it was faster
14:30 kados and varchar was smaller
14:30 kados but now varchar is just as fast
14:30 kados and smaller
14:30 kados so char is kinda pointless I guess
14:30 paul_ (except for very small chars, as varchar has 3 digits to store size. So a 1 or 2 digit char is smaller than varchar !)
14:31 kados paul_++
14:31 paul_ (3 or 2 to store, not sure so remember well)
14:31 paul_ but with a 1TB hard disk, who care ;-)
14:31 kados hehe
14:31 fbcit The different types will cause slow indexing in pg...
14:32 fbcit auth_tag_structure looks like the only table with char's. I'm switching them to varchar in the pg structure.
14:32 fbcit kados: I'll get this to you in a bit. Trying to polish it....
14:33 kados I see some char(10) in other places too
14:33 kados aqbookfund
14:33 kados aqbudget
14:34 kados wow, quite a few
14:35 kados huh, and somehow we've got quoted integers again :/
14:35 atz booo
14:36 paul_ faar
14:38 owen Hi everyone
14:39 gmcharlt hello
14:39 owen kados, are you on the road today?
14:50 kados owen: yea, I'm leaving at about 3pm to go to MD
14:56 owen I noticed something strange about the upgrade process I went through this last time. When I went to log in, it wouldn't accept my password and I didn't understand why. Only after I logged /out/ would it let me log in with the same credentials I'd just been trying
14:56 kados yea, that is something I noticed a while back as well
14:57 kados so maybe it needs to kill the cookie if your user/password fail
14:57 kados although ... that might not work if you simply don't have permission to view a page
14:57 kados in that case you would be annoyed logging back in
14:57 owen Strange, it's the first time it has happened to me. Very counterintuitive.
15:02 fbcit kados:kohastructure_pg.sql has been submitted
15:02 fbcit kados:Note: It will probably not run without modes to the installer scripts.
15:04 kados w00t
15:04 kados fbcit++
15:07 kados fbcit: I've also send through a patch for quoted integers and the s/char/varchar/
15:08 kados owen: I'll bring it up to chris this afternoon
15:08 kados owen: I think it's worth doing a bug report on, but unfortunately we've probably got bigger fish to fry atm
15:09 kados who knows, maybe it's an easy fix, but my eyes get all wonky every time I look at :-)
15:12 fbcit kados: (got distracted...)I'll work on those as soon as I get a copy up and running over mysql....
15:14 fbcit kados:FWIW: kohastructure_pg.sql is subject to change as I get working on the installer scripts....
15:24 kados *nod* once it enters Git you'll be able to track those changes
15:25 kados well, we'll be able to ... I assume it's already entered your local git repo or you wouldn't have been able to send a patch :-)
15:25 kados fbcit: what I'd be extremely interested in, is patches that make Koha multi-db compliant out of the box
15:26 fbcit kados: I plan on attempting that approach.
15:26 kados I think the web installer is a micro-cosm of the whole codebase
15:26 kados so if we can get the conventions for how to do that defined in there, that'll be a huge step forward to portability
15:27 fbcit sql statements will need to adhere as much as possible to the general standard...
15:27 fbcit this might somewhat limit capitalizing on the strengths of certain dbms over others.
15:28 kados *nod*
15:28 fbcit there a balance there somewhere.
15:29 kados yea, I can imagine in some cases it'd be useful to use dbms-specific stuff, but maybe test for the db in use and default to sql-92 or something
15:30 kados someone recently suggested we could have Koha ship by default running sqllite
15:30 kados so you woudln't even need a database :-)
15:30 kados maybe we need a system preference for the DBMS
15:31 fbcit with the zebra option, do certain tables move to zebra?
15:32 kados no, but I think there is one unused table
15:32 owen atz++ for his great Koha list responses
15:32 kados but it's safe to leave it in there
15:33 kados yea, nice one atz
15:33 atz thx
15:34 kados fbcit: getting your zebra setup is probably not worth the effort at the moment, I've been working with slef (the command-line installer guy) to get the installer to do all the heavy lifting there
15:34 kados fbcit: so I'd start with nozebra if you just want a working system
15:34 atz i was thinking, is there a DBI module for Informix (which is what Unicorn uses anyway)
15:34 atz ?
15:35 kados looks like our one supports informiz
15:35 kados informix even
15:35 kados DBD::Informix
15:35 kados[…]05.02/
15:36 atz cool.  if that works it might be possible to import Unicorn files directly without dumping data
15:36 kados hehe, that'd rock
15:37 atz D'oh, your link gives me a CPAN error
15:37 kados[…]05.02/ works for me :/
15:37 kados sounds like your local cpan mirror might be down
15:37 kados or it's your DNS again :-)
15:38 atz this time I get a CPAN-served error page
15:39 atz here's the newer one, apparently:
15:39 atz[…].0914/
15:41 atz (very new... last month)
17:25 owen Should I post bugs related to date formatting, or is the whole date situation too much in flux?
17:30 kados owen: I'd definitely post them
17:30 kados owen: are you seeing lots of minor issues, or one in particular?
17:31 owen Just some places where dates aren't displaying in the right format
17:31 owen Like news items on the home page
17:32 kados ahh, on my install they are showing in metric I guess
17:32 kados 22/10/2007
17:32 kados that's metric, right?
17:33 kados looks like the GetNewsToDisplay is the prob
17:33 kados yep, that's the prob
17:33 kados hardcoded date format:
17:33 kados SELECT *,DATE_FORMAT(timestamp, '%d/%m/%Y') AS newdate
17:35 owen The other place I noticed was on, where the creation date is formatted correctly and the expiration date isn't
17:35 owen ...when you're viewing existing news
17:37 kados atz: an unintended function of the DHTMLCalendar function/method is the capability to send that to mysql as the requested date format
17:39 kados w00t, that's all fixed
17:41 kados ok, checking why expiration date isn't working properly
17:49 atz yeah, i wasn't sure about the SQL format strings
17:50 atz they appear to be POSIXy, which is what DHTMLCalendar is anyway
17:51 atz certain comparison approaches are destroyed by loosening the format
17:51 kados owen: ok, fixed all those bugs, submitting patches now
17:51 atz for example, you could compare the first 4 digits in US format and get logical results (MM/DD)
17:52 atz but once the format is loosened to allow metric,  you get confusion (DD/MM)
17:52 kados yea
17:53 kados I think for comparison we use a known format
17:53 atz this is god's punishment for cheesy sort routines
17:53 kados iso seems to mke the most sense
17:53 kados hehe
17:53 kados owen: any other places dates aren't showing up?
17:53 kados showing up right I mean
17:53 owen That's the only place I've noticed at the moment
17:54 kados I notice that they don't actually expire though
17:54 kados ie, I've got one set to expire the first of the month and it still show sup
17:54 kados I wonder if that's because I'm superadmin or what
17:54 owen It's working properly fo rme
17:55 kados ahh, right from the main page it does
17:55 kados of course :-)
17:55 owen I'm adding some styles to the koha-news page to distinguish current from expired items
17:55 kados cool
17:56 kados yea, already it looks much much better
17:56 kados owen++
18:15 fbcit kados: trying to follow the debian install ([…]ebian_sarge.html)
18:16 fbcit kados: does the latest Debian netinst do the 2.4 kernel by default?
18:16 kados ahh, that's super old
18:17 kados there aren't any docs for 3.0 installation just yet
18:17 kados but in your git repo there is a README
18:17 kados you'll want to just follow that
18:17 fbcit so just take whatever kernel the latest debian gives me?
18:17 kados yea, kernel isn't a prob anymore, we don't use Event
18:18 kados so you want Debian Etch (4.0)
18:18 kados running MySQL 5.x and Apache 2
18:18 fbcit will dual 1.1G P3 w/1GB ram be fine?
18:18 kados that's the best environment for 3.0, the one most of us are testing on
18:18 kados oh, yea, plenty
18:18 kados our testing environments are running on VPSes
18:18 fbcit I do want to be on the same page...
18:18 kados with like 128MB of ram
18:19 fbcit ouch.
18:22 kados we should include a shell script that has the configuration keywords in it
18:22 kados so you can just edit it and run it and then install
18:23 kados fbcit: you happy with that README.txt?
18:23 kados :-)
18:26 fbcit one sec
18:27 fbcit a script for db creation might be nice...
18:27 fbcit I read this the other day.
18:27 fbcit I need to get Debian installed first.
18:39 fbcit kados: is the "minimal base system" sufficient to start with?
18:40 kados fbcit: yup
18:42 fbcit kados:"Standard System" under 'Software selection'? or nothing?
18:43 kados hmmm, I'm not familiar with that option
01:25 carrots hello
01:26 carrots anyone tried installing koha on CentOS and using XAMPP as its LAMP server????
01:26 kados carrots: I know someone installed on centos, not sure about xampp
01:27 kados shouldn't matter though, it's just a apache distro, right?
01:27 carrots yup
01:27 carrots but i am having problems on the mysql side
01:27 kados is this for a testing system?
01:27 carrots the DBD::mysql perl module wont install
01:27 kados or you planning to roll it out in production asap?
01:28 carrots its a testing system
01:28 kados cool, then I'd recommend giving 3.0 a shot
01:28 carrots if we get to install the koha right we might use this in our library
01:28 kados you can give us feedback on the fancy new installer :-)
01:28 kados carrots: have you used git before?
01:29 kados carrots:[…]lopment:git_usage
01:29 carrots nope
01:29 kados carrots: you can have a look there, soon as you clone the repo, you can have a look at the README.txt file for install directions
01:29 carrots will check thanks
01:29 carrots what does git do???
01:29 kados git is a version control system
01:30 kados the wiki page should explain it's purpose
01:30 carrots okey thanks
01:30 kados it basically lets everyone in the community share their changes with each other
01:30 carrots ohhh okey =)
01:31 carrots thanks kudos!
01:31 kados no worries
01:31 kados let us know how it goes
01:32 carrots yup yup
01:33 carrots ohh ohh i hope the person who installed koha on CentOS can do a docu and upload at wiki... i am really having a hard time on this matter
01:33 carrots =\
01:34 kados it sounds like you're having trouble installing depencies of Koha, not koha itself
01:34 kados personally, I find debian to be the easiest
01:34 carrots yep your right... the dependencies.....
01:36 carrots i tried using debian etch
01:36 kados yea, that's the way to go IMO
01:36 carrots but i had a hard time since i'm more of a red hat
01:36 kados 3.0 will run beautifully on that
01:37 kados you a command-line guy or GUI?
01:37 carrots some command line are different from debian
01:38 kados mostly just the package manager
01:38 carrots more on GUI
01:38 kados I like apt much better, it does more than yum
01:39 carrots but etch has GUI but you have to use teh console to login as root and make changes.....
01:40 carrots *the
01:40 kados servers I mean
01:40 kados I just install the minimal debian system and work from the command line from there
01:46 kados hehe
01:46 kados how so ?
01:47 fbcit-1 it kept wanting to look at the netinst cd rather than the repos....
01:47 kados ahh, that's an easy fix
01:47 kados edit /etc/apt/source.list
01:48 kados add:
01:48 kados deb stable main
01:48 kados deb-src stable main
01:48 kados and comment out the lines for the netinst
01:48 kados then do:
01:48 kados apt-get update
01:48 kados and you should be good to go
01:48 kados while you're in there, I'd also put in the index data sources, you'll need those for yaz and zebra
01:49 fbcit-1 ok. I edited one of the files in /etc/apt, but it must have been the wrong one.
01:49 kados deb etch main
01:49 kados deb-src etch main
01:49 kados huh, you want to edit /etc/apt/sources.list
01:50 fbcit-1 right...
01:50 fbcit-1 I'll be back on the box tomorrow after 11am ... right after Greek :)
01:50 kados hehe
01:56 fbcit-1 kados: add both sets: 'stable main' and 'etch main'?
01:57 fbcit-1 nevermind.... go it...
01:57 kados just etch
01:57 kados sarge is the prevous version
01:58 kados unless you're running sarge
01:58 kados then you want sarge and not etch
01:58 fbcit-1 no, etch
01:58 kados but never both
02:07 fbcit-1 tnx. g'night.
06:18 yesan I have a problem with that neither they allow their customers to have root access to their servers nor provide dedicated ports. As it is required for librarian interface and webopac.
06:19 yesan Can anybody suggest better way to get koha installed on any of the webhosting services provider's servers? We are desperately need of constructive suggestions, this will decide our future course of action on installing/using koha for our union catalogue. There are 25 theological and religious libraries in Bangalore would be joining to provide their catalogues for union catalogue project.
06:19 yesan masonj are u there
06:22 yesan it looks no one there
08:00 Brooke howdy
09:49 yesan while installing koha on, i encountered following error message - [jlcopaco@box341 koha-2.2.9]$ ./ Cannot write to /etc! Please set the etcdir environment variable to a writeable directory.
10:12 yesan masonj, do you hear me,
10:12 yesan glad to see you are back, masonj
10:13 masonj hi yesan
10:14 yesan hi, masonj i was looking for you
10:14 masonj ah, cool, so how are you getting on?
10:15 masonj you are having some problems with access at ?
10:15 yesan i had a problem while installing koha on blue and gave following error msg = ./ Cannot write to /etc! Please set the etcdir environment variable to a writeable directory.
10:16 yesan how do i over come this problem
10:16 masonj hmm, short answer is you need to be root to write to /etc
10:17 masonj but ... you can modify the install scripts to write the /etc/koha.conf file somewhere else
10:18 yesan the directory which i can create in my domain?
10:19 masonj hmm, domain?
10:19 yesan somewhere else means - on my domain directories -
10:20 masonj perhaps a directory under your home directory on the box you are installing to
10:20 masonj /home/yesan/koha/etc/koha.conf
10:20 masonj like that perhaps...
10:23 masonj its possible to install koha on a bluehost type system, yesan
10:23 yesan masonj, should edit this in the perl script
10:23 masonj but you are making things so much harder for yourself
10:24 yesan very encouraging to note that I could do that using Bluehost
10:24 yesan what do you mean by harder for myself?
10:25 masonj harder = much more difficult
10:25 yesan is it required to have dedicted ports for librarian interface and webopac
10:25 yesan how do i assign the ports
10:25 masonj find a old linux box, and get koha successfully installed on it first
10:26 masonj then you can compare all the broken things that dont work on your bluehost koha, and then try to work out how to fix them
10:27 masonj thats how you will succeed with your bluehost install
10:28 yesan How do I assign dedicated ports
10:28 masonj if you have some good experience with linux, apache mysql and perl then your bluehost install will be not so hard
10:29 yesan i have a colleague, he is to some extent good in these
10:31 yesan masonj, what do you do back nz
10:32 masonj 1 tic yesan...
10:33 yesan i am presently serving in South Asia Institute of Advanced Christian Studies, Bangalore
10:34 yesan i got to go for a short break, I shall meet you. if you are still around. bye for now
10:34 masonj cool , my freinds have been to bangalore and love it
10:34 yesan is it
10:34 masonj i work for liblime as a programmer
10:35 yesan it is good to know that you are with liblime. i enjoyed using liblime webpage
10:35 masonj and was working for before
10:35 yesan my brother-in-law is coming to NZ next month
10:36 yesan send me your email id? Myemail id is
10:36 masonj nice, we are in wellington, (capital)
10:36 yesan Do you there is a bible college in Wellington.
10:37 masonj hmmm, im sure there are many
10:37 yesan Our founder Dr. Houghton is from NZ
10:37 masonj wellington is very biblical
10:37 yesan Do you have some contacts with Seminary libraries
10:38 yesan I know there is one NZ Bible College
10:38 yesan sorry it is Bible College of NZ
10:38 masonj yesan: setting up koha's dedicated ports is in koha's apache config file
10:39 masonj usually in /etc/koha-httpd.conf
10:39 yesan sorry for taking your valuable time in takling something else than koha
10:39 masonj awww, thats ok yesan :)
10:40 yesan thank you for understanding
10:40 masonj find yourself an old pc, install debian on it, and get a koha running on there first
10:41 masonj once you can see it running, you can then work out what you need to do manually install it , without root access on bluehost
10:43 masonj ah, and send some emails to the koha mailing-lists too, other koha users that have done it might be able to help you
10:52 yesan thats fine. i shall do that as well
10:53 masonj cool, nice talking to you again yesan
10:53 yesan bye for you

| Channels | #koha index | Today | | Search | Google Search | Plain-Text | plain, newest first | summary