IRC log for #koha, 2006-09-28

All times shown according to UTC.

Time S Nick Message
12:02 thd toins: do you think that file would make the download extra large?
16:08 thd kados: are you there?
16:38 hdl thd chris : is there a ccl zebra configuration tutorial online ?
16:38 hdl kados ?
16:38 dewey kados is becoming a true Perl Monger...
16:39 thd hdl: not for Zebra specifically but for yaz there is
16:40 hdl thd : it would be to know how to build ccl queries and configure search in zebra.
16:42 thd hdl: building queries is easy
16:43 hdl even if you try and search multiple criteria ?
16:45 thd hdl: one problem if you are using the code which kados wrote then he had told me that had broken query nesting for his recent CCL zoomopac implementation
16:47 thd hdl: study the Zebra configuration files recently committed for what kados had to provide CCL support
16:49 thd hdl: and there should also be some barely existent documentation for how to run a CCL query in the recently updated Perl Zoom module
16:52 thd hdl: with CCL structure and other attributes are generally set in the configuration file
16:53 thd hdl: CCL is an ISO standard but it was withdrawn as an ANSI/NISO standard because web interfaces had came along at the time the standard was adopted.
16:57 thd hdl: CCL is almost the same as CQL without the need to use operators to connect multiple words into a query so ti = flying circus works in CCL while CQL requires ti = (flying AND circus) or however it works exactly in CQL
16:59 thd hdl: the actual query attributes used ti su au or whatever are merely a convention and not required in the standard which I have not read as far as I know
17:03 thd hdl: some configuration syntax for czcats ...
17:03 thd        $bib1["kw"] = "u=1016 s=al";
17:03 thd        $bib1["xkw"] = "u=1016 s=pw";
17:03 thd        $bib1["ti"] = "u=4 s=al";
17:03 thd        $bib1["tw"] = "u=4 s=al";
17:03 thd        $bib1["xt"] = "u=4 s=pw";
17:03 thd        $bib1["xti"] = "u=4 s=pw";
17:03 thd        $bib1["se"] = "u=5 s=al";
17:03 thd        $bib1["xse"] = "u=5 s=pw";
17:03 thd        $bib1["au"] = "u=1003 s=al";
17:03 thd        $bib1["xa"] = "u=1003 s=pw";
17:03 thd        $bib1["xau"] = "u=1003 s=pw";
17:03 thd        $bib1["pu"] = "u=1018 s=al";
17:03 thd        $bib1["xp"] = "u=1018 s=pw";
17:03 thd        $bib1["xpu"] = "u=1018 s=pw";
17:03 thd        $bib1["date"] = "u=30 s=pw";
17:03 thd        $bib1["isbn"] = "u=7 s=pw";
17:03 thd        $bib1["issn"] = "u=8 s=pw";
17:03 thd        $bib1["lccn"] = "u=9 s=pw";
17:04 hdl thx thd. this is much valuable.
17:05 hdl I hope to be able to understand how to make it work soon.
17:05 thd hdl:this follows yaz syntax for specifying CCL but is only found in the Yaz documentation to my knowledge
17:08 thd hdl: the rest of my CCL configuration which includes RAMEAU ..
17:08 thd        $bib1["bnb"] = "u=10 s=pw";
17:08 thd        $bib1["bgf"] = "u=11 s=pw";
17:08 thd        $bib1["db"] = "u=52 s=pw";
17:08 thd        $bib1["mt"] = "u=1031 s=al";
17:08 thd        $bib1["ddc"] = "u=13 s=al";
17:08 thd        $bib1["udc"] = "u=14 s=al";
17:08 thd        $bib1["lcc"] = "u=16 s=al";
17:08 thd        $bib1["nlmc"] = "u=17 s=al";
17:08 thd        $bib1["nalc"] = "u=18 s=al";
17:08 thd        $bib1["cn"] = "u=20 s=al";
17:08 thd        $bib1["su"] = "u=21 s=al";
17:08 thd        $bib1["xs"] = "u=21 s=pw";
17:08 thd        $bib1["xsu"] = "u=21 s=pw";
17:08 thd        $bib1["lcsh"] = "u=27 s=al";
17:09 thd        $bib1["xlcsh"] = "u=27 s=pw";
17:09 thd        $bib1["ram"] = "u=22 s=al";
17:09 thd        $bib1["xram"] = "u=22 s=pw";
17:09 thd        $bib1["rswk"] = "u=46 s=al";
17:09 thd        $bib1["xrswk"] = "u=46 s=pw";
17:09 thd        $bib1["rvm"] = "u=28 s=al";
17:09 thd        $bib1["xrvm"] = "u=28 s=pw";
17:09 thd        $bib1["mesh"] = "u=25 s=al";
17:09 thd        $bib1["xmesh"] = "u=25 s=pw";
17:09 thd        $bib1["note"] = "u=63 s=al";
17:09 thd        $bib1["xnote"] = "u=63 s=pw";
17:09 thd        $bib1["ab"] = "u=62 s=al,r";
17:09 thd        $bib1["ab"] = "u=62 s=pw";
17:10 hdl Rameau and mesh ;)
17:10 thd oops looks like the last line has a mistake should be abw
17:11 thd hdl: czcats has absolutely every Bib1 attribute but not complete in CCL
17:11 thd hdl: Do you men which ones i MARC 21?
17:12 hdl I will look in att files.
17:13 thd hdl: in MARC 21 topical  subjects use 650 and the indicators and $2 specify the thesaurus used
17:13 thd hdl: this is very similar to UNIMARC usage
17:21 thd hdl: the relevant section of the Yaz documentation is
17:24 thd hdl: one caution, if you do not specify the structure attribute in your configuration Yaz will set it to phrase for queries with only 2 or 3 words if I remember
17:25 hdl how can I specify the structure attribute in your configuration Yaz ?
17:25 thd hdl: I found that behaviour undesirable even if it were sometimes helpful so I always set structure explicitly
17:25 thd hdl: s is a Yaz nickname for structure
17:27 thd hdl: actually my earliest experiments with PHP/YAZ found that using the numeric values for some attributes in CCL did not work well so my CCL configuration does not use the numeric values
17:29 thd hdl: numeric values always worked fine for me using Polish notation with PHP/Yaz but not CCL, although, that may have been a bug eliminated in more recent versions
17:31 thd hdl: actually use attribute 21 is much more reliably supported when doing remote queries than specifying any particular thesaurus
19:46 thd +                                       c  
07:23 kados morning everyone
07:23 kados paul: did you do an announcement about koha 2.2.6?
07:23 toins hi kados
07:24 paul hi kados.
07:24 paul nope, because I just found a bug just after uploading 2.2.6 :-(
07:24 kados what bug?
07:24 dewey bug is, like, most likely that you have truncated the system preference with VARCHAR(200) instead of TEXT
07:24 paul in MARC editor, when you have hide_marc=ON and want to repeat a subfield that is the only subfield of the field
07:25 paul quite a tricky one... but toins is investigating, as it's probably javascript
07:38 thd kados: yesterday, paul asked abut whether to include the simple frameworks.
07:38 kados thd: right ... what is your feeling?
07:38 paul hello thd, thx to remind me this.
07:39 paul my question was just to ask you about the official release : the 2 marc21_* frameworks are 10MB large, and the .tar.gz size has grows highly
07:39 paul I just wanted to know if I let those files in the tarball or not.
07:39 thd paul: marc21_simple_frameworks.sql started as custom set of non-standard frameworks for different record types for one particular library to their specification.  However, since I created it the frameworks are close to what standard frameworks for those record types would be except for about 10%  hidden fields, absent by default for new records, in addition to too many fields being collapsed in the editor at the customer's request
07:40 thd paul: it is only heavy because the frameworks must replicate any possible subfield as hidden to avoid data loss in editing copy catalogued records.
07:40 paul and also why you putted them in misc/ and not in misc/sql_files/en/frameworks to let libraries adding them easilly during setup
07:41 thd paul: well they are not quite standard so they should have 10% more fields and fewer collapsed values to be standard
07:43 thd paul: so they are a supplementary option until someone has the time to adjust the custom values to standard ones
07:44 thd paul: anyone could replace the default framework by importing the SQL file
07:44 paul thd : I don't want to argue about the content of the file, you know what you're doing. I just want to know if I let them in the release & if I let them at this place, where is is quite hidden & can't be found easily by 1st time installer !
07:46 thd paul: maybe since they also include the default framework, they are better than nothing but I would recommend the default framework alone until simple is adjusted for standard values
07:48 thd paul: default supports many different record types, in itself, perhaps a little too many :)
07:49 thd paul: so maybe leave it out for now if it grows the file size very much
07:49 thd unless kados has a different thought
07:51 thd kados may think they are good but he has not tried actually cataloguing with it for real instead of just a pretend test
07:55 thd paul: actually I think kados should agree because even if it is otherwise close too many of the collapsed values are silly which kados considers to be a blocking bug.  Yet, that was what the customer wanted in that case.
07:58 thd kados: you had not yet modified your plugins for fixed fields to support the additional frameworks had you?
07:59 kados thd: no
07:59 kados I think we should hold off on the simple bib framework's inclusion in the release by default
07:59 kados maybe for 2.2.7
08:00 kados let my clients work out some of the issues with it
08:00 thd kados: when those are ready simple should be part of the distribution even if the rest of simple is not yet standard
08:02 kados paul: you noted that acquisitions in broken in the release notes?
08:02 kados s/in/is/
08:02 paul I added :
08:03 paul * don't use spaces in currencies codes. Use USD, not US DOLLAR, for example. spaces breaks acquisition module.
08:03 kados[…]w_bug.cgi?id=1146
08:03 kados I will test this right now
08:04 kados paul: how do I delete 'the two lines' from the db?
08:04 paul manually, with phpmyadmin or something like that
08:04 kados paul: what table?
08:04 paul aqorders
08:05 kados delete from aqorders; ?
08:06 paul yep, but with "where ...", otherwise you'll empty it ;-)
08:08 kados acqui/newbiblio still has the js error:
08:08 kados Error: f.elements[currency] has no properties
08:08 kados Source File:[…]lerid=1&basketno=
08:09 kados Line: 147
08:09 kados and what is 'invoice number'?
08:11 kados and I still don't understand the distinction between 'order' and 'basket'
08:17 paul the order is 1 line of a basket.
08:19 paul you still have "US DOLLAR" as currency.
08:19 paul so, there is a space. remove it, it should be better
08:19 paul US_DOLLAR or USD
08:20 kados I have USD
08:20 kados[…]admin/
08:20 paul hehe... but you don't have modified your supplier currency.
08:20 paul so it's still US DOLLAR
08:20 paul (& I agree it's a shame that koha don't tell you)
08:21 kados ok, it's modified
08:21 paul miracle ! it works now ;-)
08:21 paul about invoice number !
08:21 paul :
08:21 kados wait ...
08:22 kados where are the orders I created before?
08:22 kados ahh, I see now
08:22 kados good, it seems to work
08:22 paul it's something that had been done by katipo for Koha 1.x.
08:22 kados so invoice number and also parcel code
08:22 paul you get here a possibility to order AND recieve something
08:22 kados and why is there a basket-level invoice number
08:22 paul right, it's something we forget to change in the templates.
08:23 kados it should be removed?
08:23 paul not sure, even if none of my libraries used it : if they already have something, they don't order it, they just catalogue it !
08:23 paul you should ask katipo I think
08:24 kados katipo doesn't use this acquisitions as it's broken for them
08:24 kados they re-wrote it and keep it in their own CVS
08:24 kados so what is invoice number?
08:25 kados and it is marked with a *, seems to be a required field?
08:26 thd kados: chris had told me that he committed all fixes to the koha cvs
08:26 kados thd: not rel_2_2 though
08:26 thd yes, not rel)_2_2
08:27 kados like closing a basket for instance ... what if I did it by accident?
08:28 kados or what if I want to delete a supplier?
08:28 kados paul: also, the prices don't display on the order screen
08:29 kados paul: i said something costs 12.00, but it doesn't show up in
08:30 kados paul: I understand you want to get 2.2.6 out asap
08:30 hdl kados: it was to be out in March.
08:30 kados paul: perhaps you can just mention that there are many bugs in acquisitions and that we'll try to fix them in 2.2.7
08:30 kados hdl: that is the problem with 'timed' releases
08:31 paul kados : i said something costs 12.00, but it doesn't show up in >> what do you mean ?
08:31 kados hdl: in March, 2.2.6 would have been a disaster
08:31 paul[…] seems to work
08:31 kados ahh, so it's the javascript problem, you have to manually fill the fields
08:32 hdl kados : release early, release often.
08:32 paul kados : I have 1 library using 2.2.6RC live since 2 weeks, and they do acquisitions without any problems.
08:33 kados hdl: only when there is stable code
08:33 paul hdl : this is something for unstable softwares. for stable, you have to be more careful
08:33 paul ok, kados, you won ;-)
08:33 kados paul: so invoice number? could you explain it a little big?
08:34 kados s/big/bit/
08:34 hdl yes but between 224 and 226 what a big change.
08:34 hdl ->[]
08:34 paul a little big too, if you want ;-)
08:34 kados :-)
08:35 kados hdl: 2.2.6 is _almost_ as stable as 1.2 :-)
08:35 paul if you enter an "invoice" (=parcel code) here, you tell to koha that your order is already recieved and attached to a given parcel
08:35 kados ahh ...
08:35 paul but you should ask katipo about this feature, as I don't use it & never modified it (at least volunteerly)
08:35 kados ok
08:36 kados I'll ask chris later today
08:36 kados I suspect it should be removed from this version
08:36 kados unless you can confirm that it still works
08:37 kados in fact, this is quite a strange feature ... if the order is already received, then when you close the basket it should not be able to be received again
08:37 kados and if a basket has an order that's already received, how can it have one that's not?
08:41 kados paul: receiving still is broken
08:42 kados paul: when I click on 'save' after receiving an order, it says '0 bibliographic records received'
08:42 kados and the list of pending orders is gone
08:43 kados I will try now in default templates
08:44 kados ok, it works in default it seems
08:44 kados so I will ask owen to update npl templates
08:44 paul I won't announce 2.2.6 until owen or kados confirm that the templates are fixed.
08:44 kados paul: thanks
08:45 paul (and i'll upload a 2.2.6b or something like that)
08:45 paul (because i'm afraid savannah won't accept another koha-2.2.6.tar.gz file
08:45 kados strange
08:45 kados can you remove the one that exists and then re-upload?
09:56 toins kados: are you around ?
09:58 kados toins: yep
09:59 toins kados: just want to something about dev_week opac
09:59 kados ok
10:00 toins s/to/to know/
10:01 toins kados: are opac-zoomsearch still used ?
10:01 toins or there is ONLY search ?
10:02 kados toins: there is only search
10:02 toins ok
10:02 toins good
10:02 paul no, there is only XUL
10:02 paul hop /me ->[]
10:03 toins hehe
10:03 toins !
10:03 paul kados, another note : when a library has hide_marc=ON, the cloneSubfield in MARC editor was buggy.
10:03 paul Super-toins fixed it, and it work fine now for default templates.
10:04 kados toins++
10:04 paul do you want to report  the fix to npl (i can do it if you want)
10:04 kados I will tell owen
10:04 paul ok.
10:04 kados toins has committed the fix?
10:04 kados hehe
10:04 toins kados: yes

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