IRC log for #koha, 2009-11-12

All times shown according to UTC.

Time S Nick Message
00:00 mason awwww, thanks ian
00:07 Nate goodnight # Koha!
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02:42 chris_n2 any thoughts on what the problem might be here:
02:42 chris_n2 18:35:20-11/11 [warn] Record didn't contain match fields in (bib1,Local-number)
02:42 chris_n2 18:35:20-11/11 [log] error grs.marcxml.record C:\DOCUME~1\Me\LOCALS~1\Te​mp\UPfnH9F7VQ/biblio/expo
02:42 chris_n2 rted_records 753800
02:43 chris missing bib numbers? or bib numbers in the wrong field?
02:43 chris_n2 so that is what the warn is telling me?
02:44 chris *nod*
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03:04 chris_n2 chris: is there some sort of regex filtering of the isbn before it is inserted into the biblioitems table?
03:04 chris its plausible
03:05 chris i dont know for sure
03:05 * chris_n2 sees some things like: 0802452965 (v.
03:05 chris_n2 which should be 0802452965
03:05 chris_n2 bulkmarcimport seems to botch the isbn up even more
03:06 chris_n2 coming up with things like: 8476452438 (v.1) | 8476453221 (v.2)
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03:34 Amit hi chris_n2, chris
03:34 Amit good morning #koha
03:35 chris_n2 hello Amit
03:35 * chris_n2 is up too late again
03:36 chris_n2 chris: should I expect to encounter some problems when exporting records from one koha install and importing them into another?
03:37 chris hmm i wouldnt have thought so, but maybe the export mucked something up
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03:53 Amit heya brendan
03:53 brendan Hi Amit
03:53 brendan good day to you
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03:58 chris_n2 chris: the issue appears to be with bibs with multiple 020 fields
03:59 chris ah
03:59 chris_n2 maybe a bug?
03:59 chris sounds like it might be
03:59 chris_n2 should the export/import routine handle this case?
03:59 chris im not sure, i think you need someone who understands marc more than i do
03:59 chris_n2 there also seems to lack some normalization
03:59 chris_n2 galen?
04:00 chris yeah galen or thd
04:00 * chris_n2 is the farthest thing from a marc guru :-P
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04:03 chris_n2 my problem is every time I find a bug I want to fix it immediately
04:03 * chris_n2 heads off to find sleep
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06:44 Ropuch Morning #koha
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07:46 hdl hi
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08:17 kf morning #koha
08:19 nahuel[…]z3950-server.html
08:19 nahuel hi kf
08:19 kf hi Nahuel
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08:45 chris paul_p: did you know sebastien chabal is doing advertisements in nz, for a sports store ... i just saw it on tv
08:47 paul_p chris: no.
08:47 * paul_p leave for 2 hours, meeting with bank...
08:48 chris ahh good luck, in case u need it
08:49 paul_p chris: just going to negociate a line of 100k€ ;-)
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08:51 chris ahhh
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09:04 * chris is watching the twitter coverage of nengard speaking
09:04 chris
09:06 kf chris: me too :)
09:07 Ropuch [;
09:07 Ropuch Guten tag kf, hello chris
09:07 Ropuch s/tag/Tag
09:07 chris hi Ropuch
09:08 kf Guten Tag Ropuch
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09:16 |Lupin| good day folks !
09:18 kf hi |Lupin|
09:21 |Lupin| hello kf !
09:22 * |Lupin| booting Windows... biam
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09:35 Ropuch Is there an agenda for the conference? I'd like to post a news about it on polish librarian forum
09:36 chris lemme see if i can find it
09:37 Ropuch Thanks
09:39 chris[…]
09:40 chris
09:40 chris[…]2Fnode%2F22&tl=en in english
09:41 Ropuch Thanks chris
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10:19 Ropuch Livestream from Bergen is pretty good
10:19 chris i couldnt get it to work
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10:20 chris i think that's a sign i should go to sleep
10:21 Ropuch I'm only 1k kliometers from Bergen ;>
10:22 chris ahh that makes sense, im about 1million :)
10:22 Ropuch Yea, I know :)
10:22 chris ok, good night
10:23 chris have a good day europe :)
10:23 * chris goes to bed
10:23 Ropuch Hm, due to dns issues it's actually the only web services that works form me now ;>
10:23 Ropuch Good night
10:26 |Lupin| good night chris
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10:42 CGI597 Trying to get the 856 tag (Online Resources) text to be linkable but open in another windows. I have tried adding some html into the feild but this won't work,. Does anyone know if this can be done?
10:45 |Lupin| question for librarians
10:46 |Lupin| could somebody pls tell me in which marc flavour the title is in 245 ?
10:46 |Lupin| is that MARC21 style ?
10:47 CGI597 Well, 245 is a (one) title tag, yes. Is that what you mean?
10:47 Ropuch Yep
10:48 |Lupin| CGI597: does Koha know that the field is a link ? (cf. cataloguing framework...)
10:48 CGI597 Link? Do you mean link an Authority link?
10:48 |Lupin| CGI597: I'm not sure... I get a MARC thing from a Z39.50 server and I'm not sure of the flavour...
10:49 CGI597 You saved a MARC record from a Z39.50 server? What are you trying to do with it?
10:49 |Lupin| CGI597: no, a web link. In Koha you can say that a field contains a link, and if that is specified Koha will make it possible to click on the link... go to the cataloguing framewok array, search for your field and you shold be able to activate it as a link
10:50 |Lupin| CGI597: trying to figure out the right syntax for the server :)
10:50 CGI597 I am getting confused!!! Are you helping me with the question I asked about opening in a new window?
10:50 Ropuch CGI597: you can tweak the .tmpl to do this
10:52 CGI597 Oh, never thought of that. I can try and find it, but don't suppose you know which tmpl file offhand, do you? opac-results maybe?
10:54 Ropuch opac-detail.tmpl
10:55 CGI597 cool, thanks
10:55 Ropuch aaa
10:55 Ropuch wair
10:55 Ropuch Wait
10:55 CGI597 ok
10:55 CGI597 for what
10:55 Ropuch I totally forgiot
10:55 Ropuch Ypu don't have to ,mess with tmpl
10:56 CGI597 even better!
10:56 Ropuch Just set the OPACURLOpenInNewWindow sypref ON
10:56 Ropuch [;
10:56 CGI597 that easy!? super, will try that.
10:57 Ropuch Guess I need coffee more than I thought
10:57 CGI597 um, it is on already but still opens in the same window
10:57 Ropuch Hm
10:57 Ropuch <!-- TMPL_IF NAME="OPACURLOpenInNewWindow" --><a href="<!-- TMPL_VAR NAME="MARCURL" -->" title="<!-- TMPL_VAR NAME="MARCURL" -->" target="_blank"><!-- TMPL_ELSE --><a href="<!-- TMPL_VAR NAME="MARCURL" -->" title="<!-- TMPL_VAR NAME="MARCURL" -->"><!-- /TMPL_IF -->
10:57 Ropuch It's from my template
10:58 CGI597 from the opac-detail? I'll check
10:59 CGI597 yeah, strange. It's there on mine too.
11:00 Ropuch Put <!-- TMPL_VAR NAME="OPACURLOpenInNewWindow" --> somewhere on opac-detail and see what it will show
11:01 CGI597 anywhere in that file?
11:02 Ropuch <div class="results_summary"><span class="label">Online resources: <!-- TMPL_VAR NAME="OPACURLOpenInNewWindow" --></span>
11:02 Ropuch Like that
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11:02 Ropuch You will know then when to look for it ;>
11:02 Ropuch Setting OPACURLOpenInNewWindow works for me - the urls are opened in new windows
11:03 CGI597 Even more strange. I have done this and it still opens in the same window.
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11:13 |Lupin| back ! sorry, had network problems
11:13 |Lupin| (a power failure actually)
11:14 |Lupin| CGI597: did you find an answer for your URL problem ?
11:14 Ropuch CGI597: you have any value after Online resources: ?
11:19 |Lupin| hmm ok... given a marc record, is there a way to figure out which flavour it is, which encoding is used for the characters, etc. ?
11:19 |Lupin| I assume there is no way, else Koha would deal with that by itself...
11:23 |Lupin| k, editor in 260...
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11:36 Ropuch kf: I haven't noticed the onscreen hebrew keyboard on your opac before - I want to introduce koha to roclaw Study of Jewish Culture and Languages and I'm sure they will ask about hebrew titles
11:38 kf Ropuch: its a simple solution, most code is the html table
11:38 kf CGI597: which version of Koha are u using? is XSLt-display on?
11:40 Ropuch kf: now I have working example
11:40 kf Ropuch: I can send you a German howto
11:40 Ropuch I wonder if any polsih commercial ILS can do this [;
11:40 Ropuch kf: it would be great
11:41 Ropuch I will inlude sshot from your library in my presentation for sure [;
11:41 kf Ropuch: its still in our non-public wiki - but I am working on a public documentation too - its just a time problem. will send you a pdf as email
11:41 kf Ropuch: thank you!
11:41 Ropuch kf: thank you :)
11:44 Ropuch I've just ordered Deutsch-Polnisches Sprachtandem : Aufgaben und Tipps f�r Anf�nger
11:45 Ropuch We have a trainee in Centrum, he's learning polish, so we can help each other
11:45 kf Ropuch: cool :) you can train a little with me too :)
11:46 Ropuch Actually he's speaking polish very good after only one year course
11:46 Ropuch kf: let me learn some basic first :)
11:47 kf Ropuch: email sent
11:48 kf Ropuch: my notes are in German, but I think you can just copy the code to sysprefs
11:49 Ropuch kf: that is not a problem at all: I have lots of german speaking people around, pro translators and native geramn speaker included
11:49 Ropuch [p;
11:52 kf Ropuch: :)
11:58 kf lunch time - bbl :)
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12:01 CGI597 connection hung there, couldn't refresh.....anyway, I still didn't solve the OPACURL problem
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12:56 |Lupin| is it possible with a Koha in Unimarc to receive and impor records in MARC21 from a Z39.50 server ? does Koha handle this correctly ?
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13:04 nicomo_laptop |Lupin| not that I know of, there's no format translation on the fly
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13:11 |Lupin| nicomo_laptop: hmm! thanks :)
13:12 |Lupin| nicomo_laptop: so if one attempts to do that, what happens ? fields are copied "blindly", so, say, MARC21 field 800 becomes unimarc field 800, no matter the semantics ?
13:12 nicomo_laptop as far as I gather, yes
13:13 nicomo_laptop it uses the default framework and tries to enter data in that
13:14 nicomo_laptop that being said, now that we have a unimarc xslt, and a marc21 xslt we could theoretically do something on the fly
13:14 |Lupin| nicomo_laptop: ok...
13:15 |Lupin| nicomo_laptop: and do you think there are conversions tools outside of Koha, open-source tools that I could tr to integrate somewhere somehow ?
13:16 nicomo_laptop I've been looking for that, but have not found any so far. I did not search thoroughly, though
13:17 |Lupin| nicomo_laptop: I'm trying to understand how far the two dialects are from each other
13:17 |Lupin| nicomo_laptop: is it just a matter of permutation of fields and subfields, or are there deeper semantic differences ?
13:18 nicomo_laptop on the biblio level, it's just permutation of fields/subfields
13:18 nicomo_laptop authorities are different
13:18 |Lupin| nicomo_laptop: I see...
13:18 |Lupin| So, a conversion tool would not be too difficult to write, would it ?
13:18 |Lupin| nicomo_laptop: I think the mapping is documented on
13:19 nicomo_laptop Ask Kivutar, I think he started something on this
13:22 Kivutar |Lupin|:
13:23 Kivutar and we started a marc21tounimarc.xslt
13:23 |Lupin| Kivutar: ok this page is one thing, but is there some code that could be used to translate one into the other ?
13:24 |Lupin| Kivutar: I don't understand why it is an xslt thing you did... for us we don't want to convert just for display... we want to convert when the records are sent by the Z39.50 server and then store them in Unimarc in Koha...
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13:24 Kivutar |Lupin|: xslt is not 'just for display' :)
13:25 nicomo_laptop XSLTransform
13:25 Kivutar it'is a transformation language, you can get its output
13:26 |Lupin| Kivutar: so when a record arrives, ou'd store it in MARCXML, transform it with the xslt, and then reload it... right ?
13:27 Kivutar |Lupin|: yes, using an XSLT processor
13:28 |Lupin| Kivutar: yep.
13:28 Kivutar |Lupin|:
13:28 |Lupin| Kivutar: what I don't really understand: why would this be preferable to just write something in Perl using the MARC::Record and MARC::Field modules ? wouldn't that be just lighter and easier to integrate to Koha ?
13:29 Kivutar good question
13:29 Kivutar the good thing with xslt is its portability
13:29 Kivutar you can't let users upload perl scripts on your server right?
13:29 Kivutar but you can let them specify an xslt url
13:30 Kivutar for the same result (and more code) you get security
13:30 |Lupin| Kivutar: hmm... for somehting intended to be integrated to Koha, I'm not sure requiring an additional dependency over an XSLT processor is more interesting than having a native Perl translator... unless Koha already depends on an XSLT processor for something ?
13:31 Kivutar I think it does
13:31 |Lupin| Kivutar: why should users have to upload something ? as I see it this converter should be integrated into Koha...
13:32 |Lupin| Kivutar: ah but I think I understand your point... it's because not every body will want to do the mapping the same way, right ?
13:32 Kivutar |Lupin|: first they don't need to upload, just specify an url
13:32 |Lupin| Kivutar: so for you some flexibility has to be left to the user regarding the way the mapping is done...
13:32 Kivutar |Lupin|: if they want to specify the url for a MARC21toDANMARK.xlst they can
13:33 |Lupin| Kivutar: you mean they can with the curent version of Koha ?
13:34 Kivutar |Lupin|: not with the current version, but if we choose to use xslt for convertion, then they will be able
13:35 Kivutar and we could do the same thing for pdf generation with xsl-fo :)
13:36 Kivutar that would be great
13:37 |Lupin| Kivutar (or nicomo?): is the MARC21toUNIMARC.xsl file mentionned in your code available somewhere ?
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13:40 Kivutar |Lupin|: not released yet, it is not finished and I must say I am not proud of how I coded it =/
13:40 Nate good morning #Koha!
13:41 jwagner good morning Nate & everyone.
13:42 |Lupin| Kivutar: I see...
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13:51 Roger Hi there! There is someone who can help me? I have a simple doubt.
13:52 jdavidb Several who might be able to, Roger, depending on the problem.
13:52 Roger Ok
13:53 Roger I just wanna know.. can I install koha in a windows server?
13:54 jdavidb It can be done; it has been done.  It's *not* easy or trivial, as I understand it.  I have not ever done it, myself.
13:54 Roger ok
13:55 Roger indeed I wanted to install it in a simple windows xp
13:55 Roger I don't need more than this, my library is very small
13:56 Roger have you heard about this was already done before?
13:57 jdavidb Oh, yeah, it's been done plenty.    I suggest looking at this page on the koha wiki:
13:58 Roger Yes, thank you very much for your help!
13:58 jdavidb You bet.  :)  Glad I could be of service.
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14:02 jwagner question for people on calendars and branches -- it looks the the system obeys the calendar of the branch _owning_ the item when checking it out (for closed dates, etc.), rather than the calendar of the patron.  Is that the case, and is there a way to change it?
14:03 jwagner We have a library where patrons can borrow items belonging to any branches, but the branches are closed different days than the main library.  This is resulting in different due dates for items checked out on the same day, because one item belongs to main & another to a branch.
14:05 owen Sounds like a bug... Wouldn't you always want the due date to be set according to the issuing branch?
14:05 kf CircControl
14:05 jwagner I'm not sure -- I wanted to get input from people who have more experience with multi-branch systems than I do.
14:06 kf I think the syspref CircControl is used for things like that
14:06 jwagner kf, you're right -- the circcontrol syspref is set to item home library.  What are the implications of changing that to patron library?  I think it has broader effects than just due dates.
14:07 kf I have only 1 branch per installation (and glad about it) , so I never tested it
14:08 kf but I think the calendar uses it too (I think I saw it in the code for notices/fines)
14:09 owen jwagner: I only find references to that preference in and, FWIW
14:10 jwagner I seem to remember it also affects holds and circ rules.  Have to do some testing....  Thanks.
14:10 kf jwagner: I think there is also a new syspref for reserves in head, with similar choices
14:11 Ropuch Hm, correspondence in x subfield instead of v
14:11 Ropuch Polish use of MARC21 is creepy sometimes
14:11 hdl jwagner: Maybe you should set CircControl to PickupLibrary in your cas rather than ItemHomeLibrary in your case
14:12 jwagner Thanks, we'll do some experimenting on it.
14:13 Ropuch kf: what german z3950 server can you recommend? I'm using atm
14:13 kf Ropuch: oh, can you give me the date for that one?
14:14 Ropuch kf: sure
14:14 kf Ropuch: you know, there are several union catalogs in Germany, I work for SWB, but not sure if MARC21-Z39.50 is already publicly available
14:17 kf Ropuch: hm, problem is, we already have 3 MARC21 formats here
14:18 Ropuch We had 2 few years ago, but national library managed to switch to MARC21
14:19 kf I am speaking of MARC21
14:19 Ropuch Noticed it now
14:20 kf we have something like 'worldcat format' without $0 $w (ids for authority / title linking), DNB withoug ISBD punctuation and for ILS (which is for Koha with ISBD punctuation and $0, $w etc.)
14:22 owen I love it when I see notes on a patron's account that start this way: "DO NOT READ THIS NOTE OUT LOUD"
14:24 kf :)
14:24 paul_p owen: lol
14:24 jwagner reminds me of some test notes I used with message creation -- being excessively grumpy one day, I set up a note that read "Patron is a PITA" (meaning Pain In The Ass).
14:24 paul_p and good morning/afternoon/evening/night everybody
14:24 kf Ropuch: I will check if our Z39.50 is accessible for you
14:25 owen The sad thing is I know why the message had to start that way... Some people just can't seem to restrain themselves.
14:25 Ropuch kf: thanks
14:25 paul_p hdl: on peut skyper 2mn ?
14:27 chris_n g'morning
14:43 kf good morning chris_n
14:45 |Lupin| I'm wondering what "breeding" means... can somebody explain, pls ?
14:45 |Lupin| or perhaps give a tranlsation in french ?
14:46 kf Lupin: context?
14:46 |Lupin| kf: so the module would be a kind of context ?
14:47 kf hm.
14:48 kf perhaps its related to staged marc import? or import? (not very sure here)
14:50 |Lupin| kf: yeah it's definitely related to imports, that's how I came to it... I was just trying to clarify how...
14:50 |Lupin| kf: thanks anyway !
14:58 Ropuch I've just read that MS want to patent sudo ;>
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15:06 * jdavidb saw "skeeved" used in the Washington Post today, and though of wizzyrea, who was the first person he ever saw use it at all.
15:08 wizzyrea LOL!
15:08 wizzyrea nice!
15:09 jdavidb first-screen-listed article, too, not some back-of-beyond link.
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15:17 reiko hi, sorry for abusing of this channel to ask questions but i can't find a solution for my problem: i'm running koha 3.00.01 and i'm having problems with authorities search: 1.Koha won't retrieve results for 3 of the 5 auth types we have 2. When i search for authorities using the parameter "all headings" i get an error 114 (attribute not suported), which probably refers to attr 1=Any.
15:20 wizzyrea nah, we like abuse :)
15:21 wizzyrea (though I'm sorry I don't have an answer for your question)
15:21 reiko thank you wizzyrea
15:26 |Lupin| I was wondering...
15:26 |Lupin| is there a Koha conference planned for next year ?
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15:29 Colin reiko: You night want to look at the zebra config files for a later release. I'm sure there was a fix applied for it
15:30 wizzyrea |Lupin| International KohaCon is going to be in New Zealand, I'm pretty sure
15:34 chris_n git gurus: can I 'git merge working_branch testing_branch' to merge "test" work back into my working branch?
15:37 Colin chris_n: yes
15:38 Colin If you just want a couple of commits you can use git cherry-pick
15:39 chris_n Colin: tnx
15:54 hdl reiko: are you using DOM or GRS1 configuration ?
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16:03 reiko hdl DOM
16:04 reiko i think, how can i check that hdl?
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16:10 kf ok - time to leave work :)  have a nice day/morning/evening everybody
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16:12 hdl reiko: you can check koha-conf.xml
16:12 hdl And see if it refers to authorities-dom.xml
16:12 hdl And see if it refers to authorities-dom.cfg
16:12 reiko it does
16:12 hdl If so, you are using DOM.
16:12 reiko yeay!
16:12 reiko but it isn't workin
16:12 hdl Any is not defined in DOM mode
16:12 hdl You have to use that.
16:13 hdl sorry Add that
16:13 reiko ah !
16:13 reiko that explains 114 when searching with any
16:13 reiko where do i need to add that?
16:13 hdl in your index.xsl
16:14 reiko authority-zebra-indexdefs or koha-indexdefs-to-zebra ?
16:14 hdl authority-zebra-indexdefs
16:17 reiko wow, its a big file
16:19 reiko hdl, can it be that the auth types i can't get search results from need to be defined here aswell?
16:20 hdl mmm could be
16:21 reiko now all i need is to understand how i am going to add those
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16:43 pianohacker Hi
16:43 owen Hi pianohacker
16:43 pianohacker hey
16:52 schuster Brendan here?
16:52 schuster drat - was wanting a contact for the Vermont group.
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17:14 chris morning
17:15 owen Hi chris
17:17 chris hiya owen
17:17 pianohacker morning chris
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17:23 schuster Hey...  chris et. al..
17:23 chris heya schuster, hows texas?
17:24 schuster As a librarian I don't understand this full tech part - so was wondering if there is a document or something that can explain how a developed "patch" submitted to git gets "packaged" etc...  I may have the cart before the horse, but don't know.  Just in theory.
17:24 |Lupin| wizzyrea: do you intend to participate ?
17:25 pianohacker schuster: I don't know if there's a document per se
17:26 schuster yesterday I asked about the 3.2 and the merging bibs - and chris indicated it needed to be "packaged" and I don't really understand what/how that works.
17:26 schuster I also talked about the work pianohacker had done and was posted on the wiki and chris indicated there again about "installing and packaging it"...
17:27 schuster There have been references in the past that "packaging" after developing something can take some time to do - so I am just trying to understand how the full Development cycle works.
17:28 Ropuch joined #koha
17:28 Ropuch Good evening
17:28 schuster Idea, design, develop, test, revise, package?, git, release? or what is the flow and the steps.
17:29 chris hmm i dont think i said packaged
17:29 brendan joined #koha
17:30 chris i said merged
17:30 schuster OK so I made that word up, but you get my question?
17:30 chris when someone sends a patch
17:30 chris the release manager has to apply it to the branch in git it is applicable to
17:33 chris so you develop, test locally, send a patch, the release manager applies and tests, if it is ok, pushes it to the main git repo
17:34 chris some time later a release is made, containing not just that feature/bugfix but a bunch of others
17:34 chris with pianohacker's ajaxcirc work, the patches were out of date, so had to be brought back up to date and fixed, before they can be resubmitted
17:35 pianohacker chris and I are working on that at the moment
17:36 chris it is a perfect example of what happens when patches arent either sent or applied in a timely manner, and what is gonna happen on a much bigger and much more annoying scale, when liblime finally decide in 2020 to release their lek code
17:37 brendan morning schuster, pianohacker, chris, and everyone else
17:37 brendan @wunder 93117
17:37 munin brendan: The current temperature in Northwest Goleta, Goleta, California is 15.7�C (9:36 AM PST on November 12, 2009). Conditions: Mostly Cloudy. Humidity: 85%. Dew Point: 13.0�C. Pressure: 29.84 in 1010.4 hPa (Rising).
17:37 pianohacker hi brendan
17:37 schuster So again Librarian here...  how much time on the release managers part does it take to "applies and tests" just one patch and say it is a simple thing nothing elaborate like HOLDS redo or anything.
17:38 chris craploads
17:38 pianohacker schuster: varies
17:38 schuster hi brendan...  I was looking for you earlier, but got my answer.
17:38 brendan sweet
17:38 chris schuster: always more than you think
17:38 brendan was it on IRC
17:38 schuster brendan yes.
17:38 chris unless it is a one or 2 line template change
17:38 brendan cool will go read in the Logs
17:39 chris the main thing is testing for unintended side effects
17:39 schuster I would suspect that is the hardest thing to determine are the side effects.
17:39 chris that's why it is in fantastic that for 3.4 we are going to have a bug wrangler and a qa manager
17:39 chris that takes 2 jobs off the RM
17:40 chris which will allow them more time to do other things, and should hope in faster turnaround on patches
17:40 schuster So will the aq and wrangler have their own systems that are "in sync" with the RM? theoretically or will they all be working off the same system?
17:40 chris own systems in sync
17:40 schuster aq/qa sorry.
17:40 chris git makes that easy
17:40 brendan schuster the best person to talk with at vokal
17:40 brendan is Richard Pritsky
17:41 brendan he was at kohacon
17:41 schuster brendan - ok thanks - this was in regards to KUDOS in the US and someone that was at ALA annual.  I think it was the director from stowe
17:41 brendan Yes Stephanie Chase was their
17:41 brendan there
17:42 schuster That's who I have emailed so am waiting to hear from her.  Thanks for your time.
17:42 brendan of course
17:54 * chris is watching nz vs pakistan in cricket
17:55 brendan test match
17:56 chris 20/20
18:04 chris and adding travel tips
18:04 chris[…]ngton#travel_tips
18:05 chris i hope to hear back from more venues soon, would love to confirm dates and venue
18:06 jwagner chris, I had a dream the other night that I was on the plane for Kohacon in NZ, first class seat, big smile on my face, looking forward to the trip despite the long flight. The bell dinged for the pilot to say you could move around the cabin now, except horrid reality intruded and it was my alarm clock instead :-(
18:06 chris hehe
18:07 chris_n jwagner: lol
18:08 chris_n chris: can you free my email from the list jail please :-)
18:08 chris yup
18:08 jwagner Dreams are SO much nicer than reality....
18:11 chris the flight is really not that bad anymore, now you have the seatback entertainment its much better, course i have done that flight about 30 times now
18:11 chris so im used to it
18:11 chris just get an aisle seat so you can walk around is my tip
18:12 jwagner the problem is that I have arthritis rather badly (and also need a knee replacement) -- I have real trouble sitting in an airplane seat for that long, even with getting up and moving around occasionally.
18:12 schuster At one point you recommended a particular airport etc...  I was looking the other day and Aukland was a major airport with a transfer to Wellington I believe...  Comments?
18:12 schuster Might be good to put that info on the wiki too.
18:12 chris yep you really only have 2 options
18:12 chris three maybe
18:13 chris auckland, and christchurch are the 2 major international airports
18:13 chris or there are direct flights australia to wellington
18:13 chris jwagner: ahh yeah, that would be bad
18:13 jwagner I did some checks for flights and some were connecting through Sydney to Wellington
18:13 chris *nod*
18:14 * jdavidb debates the fun of arriving in Auckland and *driving* to Wellington.
18:14 jwagner Yeah, travel is generally painful.  But going to New Zealand might be worth it.
18:14 chris be warned that will add a few hours to your trip (going thru sydney)
18:14 chris jdavidb: its about 10 hours in a car
18:14 chris if you dont stop
18:15 chris or 55 mins in a plane :)
18:15 jdavidb No biggie, then, for those of us used to that.  I'd rather take a night, and make a mini vacation out of it.
18:15 chris *nod*
18:15 chris its a nice drive
18:15 chris just keep left :-)
18:15 jdavidb :)  I can do that.
18:16 jwagner I've driven in England -- guess I can remember the trick of it.  But I hope the roads are a bit wider than some of the English country roads.
18:18 chris there are tons and tons of akl->wlg flights
18:19 chris so getting to auckland for cheap is the best bet :) you do have to pick up your luggage and clear customs there anyway
18:19 chris so booking a flight all the way through, doesnt save you much, unless it is cheaper :)
18:27 joetho joined #koha
18:28 jwagner is now known as jwagner_meeting
18:30 chris bbiab
18:42 schuster hmmm  $1400USD right now from DFW to Wellington 2 stops - not bad.
18:43 jdavidb LAX and Aukland, for the stops, schuster?
18:43 * jdavidb can't type today.  Auckland, of course.
18:47 owen is now known as owen-away
18:48 schuster Yep.
18:48 jdavidb $2300 from the DC area, right now, round-trip.  Lordy.
18:49 |Lupin| does anyone know how the number of items displayed in OPAC result pages is computed ? I assume it's from the number of rows in the items table with the same biblionumber... ?
18:49 |Lupin| are you guys taling about the prices of planes to NZ because of the conference ?
18:50 schuster Funny my mibbit has deals to NZ starting at $798! quantas and Air NZ
18:51 pianohacker |Lupin|: on search results it comes from the holding tags in the MARC, on detail pages it comes from the items table; and yes
18:52 |Lupin| pianohacker: ok jesse, thanks a lot for this both concise and informative response :)
18:52 pianohacker you're welcome :)
18:53 |Lupin| is there a date that has been decided for the next conf already ?
18:53 chris jdavidb: i found one 1049 lax->akl retn
18:53 pianohacker Yes
18:53 chris tentative
18:53 chris 15, 16, 17 november
18:53 chris those dates or ones similiar
18:53 chris i have 4 more quotes to receive
18:54 chris then i will confirm
18:54 chris should be in a week or so
18:54 chris (wont go later than that, dont want to get to close to thanksgiving in the US)
18:54 chris so may be the week before
18:54 chris 8,9,10
18:54 chris but most likely 15,16,17 november 2010
18:55 chris jdavidb: check out virgin australia, seems to be cheap at
18:55 chris the moment
18:55 chris ok now i have to catch my bus
18:55 brendan I've been watching the quantas deals and it seems that's close to good window for travel.  Anything that gets close to Thanksgiving time here -- the prices shot way up
18:56 brendan so I've vote for earlier in November
18:56 brendan errrr... I'll
18:57 brendan typed english is failing me at the moment :)
18:57 |Lupin| chris: ok, thanks a lot for the info, very good to know !
18:58 |Lupin| gotta go
18:58 |Lupin| see you soon all
18:58 |Lupin| left #koha
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19:24 owen-away is now known as owen
19:35 richard joined #koha
19:35 richard hi
19:36 brendan good day richard
19:36 richard hi brendan
19:36 chris back
19:36 richard hiya chris'
19:38 brendan wb chris
19:38 brendan how goes the cricket
19:39 chris we suck
19:40 chris[…]story/434285.html
19:40 brendan Still need to route from them :)
19:40 brendan whoops -- root
19:41 brendan are there going to be any cricket matches in NZ around the time we'll be there for kohacon
19:41 brendan or any rugby?
19:42 * wizzyrea would like to watch rugby, even though sports are not normally her thing.
19:43 chris cricket will def be on
19:44 chris its summer, so rugby will only be on tv
19:44 wizzyrea hrmph
19:44 chris nz will be touring the northern hemisphere handing out beatdowns to france, italy, england etc
19:44 chris but we could watch a game at a sports pub
19:44 chris thats quite an nz experience :(
19:44 chris :) even
19:46 brendan pubs++
19:46 hdl hi chris
19:46 brendan hi hdl
19:46 hdl hi brendan
19:47 wizzyrea beer++
19:47 brendan NZ++
19:49 chris hiya hdl
19:57 brendan doesn't like it when my co-workers are traveling -- don't have anyone to talk with :)
19:57 brendan so tag -- you're it #koha
19:57 wizzyrea awww
19:58 chris hehe
19:58 chris looks like it was a good first day
19:58 chris of the conference
19:58 brendan does anyone know of a status for a bulk item editor
19:58 brendan I thought I heard word of something
19:59 * brendan goes to look through bugs
19:59 chris yeah it exists
19:59 chris i have it running on my catalyst demo, another biblibre one
19:59 chris im not sure if its in master yet
19:59 brendan bug 3509
20:00 munin Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=3509 enhancement, P5, ---,, ASSIGNED, Batch item edit
20:00 chris lemme find it for ya
20:00 chris it might be a little bit different
20:04 chris http://librarian.koha.catalyst[…]tools/
20:05 chris works pretty good
20:06 schuster do you have a login we can play with?
20:08 chris check your pm schuster :)
20:09 chris[…]refs/heads/master
20:09 chris is what it is running
20:09 chris git clone git://
20:09 chris will get you a copy of it
20:10 chris it has my nearly finished recommendations feature
20:10 chris as well as kete integration
20:10 owen Recommendations feature?
20:10 * chris will pull it up for ya
20:11 chris prolly cant be used so good with us libraries that anonymise checkouts, not in its current form
20:11 chris http://opac.koha.catalystdemo.[…]  <-- that is kete integration
20:11 chris excuse the slowness, the machine it is on is currently running 38 virtual servers
20:12 ricardo joined #koha
20:12 ricardo Hi everyone!  :)
20:14 schuster That works pretty good.  Thanks for sharing chris.
20:14 schuster I wonder if you could use something very similar for batch deletes?
20:15 chris http://opac.koha.catalystdemo.[…]pl?biblionumber=4
20:15 chris owen: click the recommendations tab
20:15 chris schuster: im sure it could
20:15 owen Neat. And that's based on circ data?
20:16 chris yep, cron job runs nightly, that updates the recommendations
20:16 chris too slow to calculate on the fly
20:16 brendan nice nice
20:16 brendan recommendations++
20:16 chris so if it was run before the circ data was anonymised
20:16 brendan howdy owen
20:17 chris then after running it for a few montsh, you could switch it on in the opac
20:17 chris and you would have some decent data
20:17 chris all it stores is this
20:17 chris +----+------------+------------+-----------+
20:17 chris | id | biblio_one | biblio_two | hit_count |
20:17 chris +----+------------+------------+-----------+
20:17 chris |  1 |          4 |      68692 |         2 |
20:17 chris |  2 |          4 |     108069 |         2 |
20:17 brendan chris where is this coming from - is this your development
20:17 schuster chris that is way cool!
20:18 * brendan reads back :)
20:18 chris yep, for albany senior high school, im rolling it out there in the next week or so
20:18 chris it will miss the cut for 3.2 (we are in feature freeze already)
20:18 chris but ill submit the patches up so people can use it, and it will go in to master as soon as 3.2 is branched
20:19 * chris does all development in the open
20:19 owen :)
20:20 schuster :)
20:20 brendan open development++
20:20 schuster karma chris++
20:20 * brendan has had a bunch of coffee this morning :)  throwing lots of karma around
20:21 schuster What happened with granular permissions??  I poked and don't see anything on the borrower record.
20:21 chris lek happened
20:21 chris i think biblibre have done some work on it though as well
20:21 chris lemme find it for ya
20:21 pianohacker PTFS did some work in that realm also
20:21 pianohacker not sure when it will be submitted
20:21 schuster curious what happens with the few granular permissions that I have right now and what will happen when I get updated to 3.2...
20:21 pianohacker jdavidb (or jwagner when she gets back)?
20:22 jdavidb We've been hacking on it some, and as soon as that worthless geek who does that (me) gets his head above water, it'll be out on the street.
20:22 pianohacker jdavidb: awesome
20:22 brendan jdavidb any update on a public repo for PTFS
20:22 schuster boy chris may have his work cut out for him with 3.4 if all that development drops at the same time.
20:22 jdavidb <--the bottleneck.
20:22 brendan good luck jdavidb
20:22 chris schuster: id rather that than the oppositie ;-)
20:23 schuster jwagner - would you go over and make him quit eating donuts...
20:23 chris typing fail
20:23 schuster True chris.
20:23 jdavidb It's possible I might get a few branches tossed over the wall this weekend, depending on how a couple of things go between now and then.
20:24 sekjal joined #koha
20:30 brendan hello sekjal
20:31 chris hiya sekjal
20:31 schuster chris et al - granular wasn't turned on so they didn't show... few.
20:31 chris cool
20:31 jwagner_meeting is now known as jwagner
20:32 jwagner schuster -- saw the comment about making jdavidb quit eating donuts.  That's not the problem :-)  But for the past week or so he's been in my office raiding my leftover Halloween candy!
20:33 Ropuch chris: I'm just translating some Koha history into polish, on wiki I've read "In 2001, Paul Poulain (of Marseille, France) began adding new features to Koha, most significantly support for multiple languages.", on your blog Benedykt P. Barszcz and Pawel Skuza are meant to "start the translation ball rolling"
20:33 pianohacker halloween candy is a danger to society and waistlines
20:33 schuster and teeth!  I feel mine rotting daily!
20:33 Ropuch I will happily mention polish guys, but I want to be acurate [;
20:34 chris yeah they beat him
20:34 Ropuch hehehe
20:34 chris the most accurate one is the history.txt in git
20:35 chris[…]docs/history.txt;
20:35 Ropuch Thanks
20:35 chris June 23 2001     Benedykt P. Barszcz working on translations     translation, community, poland
20:36 chris June 24 2001     Pawel Skuza working on a script to automate translations       translation
20:36 chris February 22 2002         Paul Poulain sends an email saying he will work on Koha
20:36 chris March 6 2002     Paul becomes the 7th committer to Koha
20:37 chris uly 12 2001     Pawel Skuza becomes the 2nd committer outside of Katipo, and 6th overall and commits his translation script
20:37 Ropuch I just want to mention them, it's brief history ;>
20:37 sekjal hi, chris and brendan
20:37 sekjal sorry, was gliffing
20:37 chris so polish guys were very early in the history of koha
20:38 Ropuch I wonder what they are doing nowadays
20:38 sekjal trying to document the process by which we're going to connect our SFX Open Linker Resolver to Koha
20:38 chris Ropuch: if i remember right Benedykt was from a monastery
20:40 ricardo2 joined #koha
20:41 jdavidb left #koha
20:41 ricardo2 chris: There's also another religious "Benedict"... but I think that one works in the Vatican and not in a Monastery  ;-)
20:42 chris heh
20:43 ricardo left #koha
20:44 ricardo2 is now known as ricardo
20:44 chris wow i found an email from him from august 2000
20:44 pianohacker long_term_email_storage++
20:45 ricardo pianohacker: Hmm.... I'm not sure I know that nick  ;-)
20:45 owen outlook_express-- # for long_term_email_storage
20:45 owen (That's what ate my 2000-era email archive)
20:47 Ropuch chris: yes, he's from Societas Apostolatus Catholici
20:47 chris good work sherlock holmes :)
20:48 jwagner sekjal, re SFX -- I've done a little work with setting Koha to link to SFX, but haven't gone the other way.  Shouldn't be too hard -- just put in the URL prefix and isbn=whatever.
20:48 chris  <-- wellington zoo today
20:48 Ropuch chris: ;-)
20:49 ricardo (one of the good things of being Portuguese is that it's easy to understand *some* Latin, even without having learned it, eheh)
20:49 jwagner awwwwww
20:50 ricardo chris: I hope that the two creatures lying down had their lunch *before* that pic  ;-)
20:50 chris hehe
20:52 sekjal jwagner:  yes, we figure it won't be too hard to create an SFX target to connect to Koha; it's missing amongst the ILS Targets already in SFX, and that should not persist
20:52 ricardo sekjal: SFX? We're not talking about "Sound Effects", are we?
20:53 jwagner About two jobs ago I worked on an install of SFX/Metalib, and Ex Libris was pretty willing to work with us on setting stuff up, and including it in future general releases if appropriate.  They might still be open to that.
20:53 sekjal ricardo: no, we're talking about Ex Libris' OpenURL resolver
20:54 ricardo sekjal: Gotta love TLAs... Thanks for the info  :)
20:54 jwagner Would there be general interest in the work I did to make a link from Koha to SFX?  I hard coded it in the template, but it wouldn't be hard to set it up as a syspref to enter the URL, then wrap it around the ISBN.
20:55 sekjal jwagner: that might be neat.  we were thinking some JS overtop might be the least invasive way to do it quickly
20:55 jwagner Might be at that -- I'm no JS wizard.  I go for the brute force approach :-)
20:55 jwagner I turned on the COINS thing, but that apparently only works if someone has a browser plugin.  This site wanted the link always on for all their users.
20:56 jwagner er, ISSN for SFX that is.
20:56 sekjal my original plan was to dump the SFX menu URL into the biblioitems.uri field (MARC21's 856), but rethinking it, that's not strictly necessary
20:56 jwagner (I did both ISBN and ISSN for this site at their request)
20:56 jwagner I just coded it around the 856u in the XSLT templates.
20:57 sekjal I'd just need to hardcode our SFX root URL, and then have the JS pluck up the ISBN/ISSN from the bibliorecord
20:57 jwagner Gotta head home now -- keep me posted & let me know if you want what I've done.
20:57 sekjal jwagner: will do!
20:57 Ropuch What kind (male/female) of noun is "Koha"? [;
20:57 jwagner left #koha
20:58 richard it virtually means "gift" but i'm not sure if that has any male/female connections
20:59 sekjal does Maori have gendered nouns?
20:59 Ropuch I wonder
21:00 Ropuch Well, as it ends with 'a' I treated her liek a girl ;-)
21:00 richard not that i'm aware of but chris will be your best bet there
21:01 Ropuch I guess
21:02 sekjal according the collective wisdom that is a naive Google search, Maori generally does not have gendered nouns.
21:03 sekjal which I always found a source of confusion when I was studying German.
21:03 sekjal perhaps this will make it easier for me to pick up Maori by next year
21:03 chris :)
21:04 Ropuch So she's a girl for me ;>
21:04 chris no note gendered nouns
21:05 Ropuch We have gendered verbs in polish
21:05 sekjal Ropuch: interesting!  ::takes note::
21:06 ricardo2 joined #koha
21:06 ricardo2 (grumble...)
21:06 chris koha is a noun or a verb
21:06 ricardo2 Mibbit is not as stable today as it usually is
21:06 hdl shuter already done
21:07 hdl (batch deletes I mean)
21:07 Ropuch sekjal: ;>
21:07 chris we dont really have gendered anything
21:07 chris but we have different possessives
21:07 Ropuch Lucky you
21:08 ricardo left #koha
21:08 ricardo2 is now known as ricardo
21:08 Ropuch When posting forms we're forced to add male/female versions
21:08 chris tāku for my/mine when the possessor is dominant
21:08 Ropuch As "Gdyby zechcial Pan/Zechcia�a pani"
21:08 ricardo Portuguese has genders in its language (as do most "latin" languages, I think - Spanish, Italian, French...)
21:09 chris taku hē = my mistake
21:09 richard is now known as rich-away
21:09 chris tōku is neutral form
21:09 hdl reading back logs
21:09 chris (both are singular)
21:10 sekjal Ropuch: what is the difference between the male and female forms of a verb?  when would I use one over the other?
21:10 chris drop the t, for plural
21:11 chris one gotcha
21:11 chris is i would say taku he, for my mistake
21:11 chris but toku whakaaro, for my thoughts
21:12 chris also, even though you are dominant over food, you would say toku kai ... because food is so important
21:12 chris here endeth the lesson
21:13 Ropuch sekjal: it does matter in past forms: On poszed�, Ona posz�a, Ono posz�o
21:13 Ropuch He went, She went, it went
21:13 * owen remembers the same from his Czech lessons
21:13 Ropuch But there's not a hard rule for it
21:14 Ropuch owen: yep
21:14 sekjal Ropuch: ah, so the verb gender connects to the pronoun/noun gender
21:14 Ropuch yes
21:14 sekjal chris, Ropuch:  this is great.  I find linguisitics fascinating
21:15 sekjal I took a semester in college, same semester as my first programming course, and my advanced algebra
21:15 chris sekjal: you must talk with my dad then
21:15 sekjal that semester was a headtrip
21:15 chris he is a licensed translator and interpreter
21:15 sekjal chris: very cool
21:15 chris majored in russian at university, speaks italian, russian, german, and maori
21:16 chris (oh and english)
21:17 chris my sister majored in chinese, and did a year doing her masters at shanghai university
21:17 chris im the only one in my family that only speaks 2 languages hehe
21:17 owen left #koha
21:19 Ropuch We have a treinee from Germany at work: besides german he speaks french, little italian & spanish, english and after just one year of learning he's actually speaking polish
21:19 Ropuch And he speaks good - I'm more than impressed
21:20 chris some people have natural ability
21:20 chris it is a great skill to have ;)
21:21 Ropuch Yeah
21:23 pianohacker linguistics is fun
21:23 pianohacker interesting to see unexpected connections between languages (like similar vowel pronunciation of spanish and japanese)
21:23 hdl python, java ruby, javascript, fortran, ada, Haskell
21:24 hdl trinitary roots
21:24 chris :)
21:26 pianohacker bbl
21:28 hdl quite a huge discovery in linguistics
21:28 francharb left #koha
21:30 Ropuch I've counted 75 languages on
21:30 Ropuch Nice
21:31 ricardo Ropuch: Don't talk about languages, please. OK? I'm in "turbo mode" translating the Portuguese PO file for staff! ;-)
21:31 chris hehe
21:31 ricardo hdl: Hi Henri!  :)
21:32 chris yeah i just added sindhi the other day
21:32 Ropuch I don't feel like translating staff today, I'm preparing speech on Koha for open source conference ;>
21:32 chris cool
21:32 ricardo hdl: I'm around line 43000 in the Portuguese PO file. I think that I will have this wrapped up in a day or two. Would that be still on time for 3.0.5?
21:32 mib_xud273 joined #koha
21:33 ricardo Ropuch: That's cool. Good luck for your speech!  :)
21:34 hdl ricardo I think so
21:34 hdl hi ricardo
21:34 finnx joined #koha
21:35 ricardo hdl: Cool. Thanks for the info  :)
21:35 hdl ricardo: I thought I should release this week.
21:35 finnx left #koha
21:36 ricardo hdl:Hmmm... And do you still think that?
21:36 hdl But some weirdness in french po and my work kept me out of this.
21:36 ricardo hdl: That's great! (please don't take this the wrong way, eheh)
21:36 hdl So I think it will have to wait next week
21:37 finnx joined #koha
21:37 ricardo hdl: That's (very) fine by me.
21:38 mib_xud273 left #koha
21:39 sekjal time to head to the train.  cheers, #koha
21:39 sekjal left #koha
21:42 Ropuch - is this a most comprehensive list of Koha users/
21:42 Ropuch ?
21:43 ricardo hdl: Talking about weirdness, there's some weirdness related to "C4::Language" that affects the Portuguese pt-PT translation (mistakingly uses the very incomplete - specially for staff - pt-BR one). I talked with Chris about that and he suggested to remove the pt-BR translation, while he doesn't get around to "refactor" C4:Language. Right chris?
21:43 chris yeah, i meant to email you hdl, can we leave the pt-BR .po file out of the 3.0.5 release
21:44 chris Ropuch: its one list of users
21:44 chris another list is at libwebcats lemme get it for ya
21:45 chris http://www.librarytechnology.o[…]
21:45 chris just type koha in the current automatiion system (dont choose any of the options just type koha)
21:46 chris and it will find all the koha - independent, koha - liblime, koha - ptfs etc
21:46 chris there are 43 pages of them :)
21:50 ricardo OK. I'm leaving to home now. Take care everyone!  :)
21:50 hdl ricardo: I can
21:50 ricardo hdl: Cool. Thank you very much!  :)
21:50 ricardo chris: Thank you, as well
21:50 ricardo OK. Off I go. Bye people!
21:50 ricardo left #koha
21:52 Ropuch chris: bah, I totally forgot about  lib-web-cats
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22:12 schuster bye
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22:14 brendan @wunder 93117
22:14 munin brendan: The current temperature in Northwest Goleta, Goleta, California is 16.9�C (2:12 PM PST on November 12, 2009). Conditions: Mostly Cloudy. Humidity: 79%. Dew Point: 13.0�C. Pressure: 29.75 in 1007.3 hPa (Falling).
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23:06 rich-away is now known as richard
23:29 richard is now known as rich-away
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23:34 chris_n2 g'evening
23:35 Ropuch Good evening & good night [;

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