IRC log for #koha, 2009-08-27

All times shown according to UTC.

Time S Nick Message
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03:13 brendan 13 minutes and counting
03:25 Amit joined #koha
03:25 Amit hi chris, brendan
03:25 Amit good morning #koha ;)
03:25 chris heya Amit
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03:57 brendan hey amit
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04:45 susan Good day everyone
04:45 susan anyone awake? Its morning my time...
04:46 chris some people are, some people are about to wake up, some are about to go to sleep, and some are asleep :)
04:47 susan Located in Abu Dhabi :) my apologies
04:47 chris im in NZ
04:47 chris so nearly time for me to go home from work ;)
04:47 susan I have an urgent question that I need to give an answer to today.  Is there an already existing way of importing data into koha from OCLC or not?
04:47 susan :)
04:47 chris yes
04:48 chris OCLC has a Z3950 server eh?
04:48 susan Do you have an article/blog/ anything that I can read
04:48 susan Does it? How can I find this server information?
04:48 chris
04:48 chris you can just add that server to your list of servers to query then do a z3950 search in the cataloguing interface
04:49 susan wow..that simple
04:49 susan your great. Thanks alot for the help.  Sure glad you are awake hehe
04:49 chris no problem :)
04:49 susan :)
04:51 Amit hi susan
05:02 susan Hi amit
05:02 susan sorry for the delay.  I was talking to my manager :)
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05:12 Amit no problem ;)
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05:13 susan Hi Amit, did you want to say something?
05:13 Amit no
05:15 susan Sorry then :)
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05:24 brendan good night #koha
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05:41 Amit hi ncomo
05:41 Amit hi nicomo
05:41 nicomo Hi Amit
05:41 nicomo hi all
05:41 Amit any one know patron data in MARC format
05:42 nicomo Amit: this question reminds me of something
05:42 nicomo it's been asked before, right?
05:42 Amit yes
05:42 nicomo here? or on the mailing lists? can't rememer
05:42 Amit in
05:42 Amit IRC
05:43 Amit i have all tag and indicator of patron data in MARC
05:43 nicomo ok
05:43 Amit format but unable to test
05:43 nicomo I'm puzzle by this
05:43 nicomo why would you want patron records in Marc in the 1st place?
05:44 Amit means please be clear
05:45 nicomo why is it better for you to have the patron data in Marc, rather than just in the DB?
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06:18 nicomo hi magnusenger
06:18 magnusenger good morning, nicomo
06:21 Amit hi magnusenger ;)
06:21 magnusenger hi Amit
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08:03 |Lupin| hello there
08:04 paul_p joined #koha
08:06 chris hi |Lupin|
08:08 laurenthdl joined #koha
08:08 laurenthdl hello
08:08 laurenthdl nahuel_: around ?
08:08 nahuel_ yep
08:11 |Lupin| hey chris
08:20 chris is laurenthdl travelling today?
08:23 kf good morning #koha
08:24 laurenthdl chris: yes
08:24 Amit_G hi lupin, laurendthdl
08:31 |Lupin| hello Amit
08:31 |Lupin| guten morgen kf
08:40 kf InternetExplorer--
08:41 chris ie--
08:42 chris ie6-- #especially ie6
08:42 chris @karma for ie
08:42 munin chris: for ie has neutral karma.
08:42 chris @karma ie
08:42 munin chris: Karma for "ie" has been increased 0 times and decreased 3 times for a total karma of -3.
08:43 kf ie--
08:43 chris @karma ie
08:43 munin chris: Karma for "ie" has been increased 0 times and decreased 4 times for a total karma of -4.
08:43 kf decreasing ie's karma makes me feel a little better g
08:46 chris hehe
08:49 kf trying to change xslt to display our hebrew records nicely
08:49 kf oh, and zotero is broken - but its broken on detail page in general in 3.2
08:50 chris oh really?
08:50 * chris looks
08:51 kf and marc view tabs looks strange in ie, they are jumping around a little
08:52 chris well zotero only works with firefox afaik
08:52 kf strange
08:52 |Lupin| ie--
08:52 |Lupin| just by solidarity
08:53 chris zotero is a firefox extension isnt it?
08:53 kf yes
08:54 kf ok, result list works fine, but detail page not
08:54 kf I dont get the possibility to add it
08:54 kf we have amazon covers and reviews activated
08:54 kf and xslt on
08:55 chris ahh
08:55 chris if you turn xslt off does it show?
08:57 chris hmm nope
08:58 kf you can reproduce it now?
08:59 chris yeah shows on normal, doesnt show on xslt
09:00 chris thats a bug, want to do a bug report and ill try and fix it
09:01 kf i will try to add one - zotero does not work on opac detail page with xslt on?
09:01 kf I think it did work in 3.0.3
09:01 kf but cant test - we only have 3.2 n
09:02 chris yep that sounds like a good bug report
09:07 kf severity?
09:08 chris critical or major
09:10 kf @bug 3559
09:10 munin kf: Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=3559 major, P5, ---,, NEW, Zotero does not work on opac detail page with xslt on
09:10 chris right i think i just fixed it
09:10 chris http://opac.koha.workbuffer.or[…]biblionumber=1134
09:10 chris showing for you here?
09:11 kf you are fast!
09:11 kf will check, one second
09:12 kf sory, no
09:13 chris ahh make sure you change your langauge to en
09:13 kf mom
09:13 kf yes
09:13 kf that was the problem
09:13 chris (i only fixed it on taht template)
09:14 chris cool, will send a patch, you will need to regen your german templates when the patch is pushed
09:14 kf works fine now
09:14 kf ok
09:14 kf thx chris!
09:15 chris cool
09:15 kf mom, is it now possible to have different xslt files for different languages?
09:17 chris not yet im afraid
09:17 chris but the xslt is only part of what builds that page
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09:17 chris the actual coins stuff is in opac-detail.tmpl
09:18 kf ah ok
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09:25 |Lupin| what's Zotero btw ?
09:27 kf kind of reference management software
09:27 kf its a popular firefox plugin
09:28 |Lupin| kf: ok, thanks
09:28 kf but I think coins is not only used by Zotero but by other applications as well, I think coins is a way to mark bibliographic data in html
09:29 chris yep
09:29 kf and you can import it to zotero as a reference
09:30 |Lupin| ahah
09:30 |Lupin| wasn't aware of this
09:33 |Lupin| kf: thanks for having explained
09:34 chris
09:35 kf coins = microformat? I read something about microformats for calendars some time ago
09:38 kf @karma encoding
09:38 munin kf: Karma for "encoding" has been increased 0 times and decreased 3 times for a total karma of -3.
09:38 kf encoding--
09:38 |Lupin| why kf ?
09:38 |Lupin| @karma ms
09:38 munin |Lupin|: Karma for "ms" has been increased 1 time and decreased 1 time for a total karma of 0.
09:39 |Lupin| @karma microsoft
09:39 munin |Lupin|: microsoft has neutral karma.
09:39 |Lupin| ms--
09:39 kf our vendor has problems with display of umlauts
09:39 |Lupin| microsoft--
09:39 |Lupin| kf: I see
09:40 * |Lupin| things that when he will start to catalogue things in tibetan things will really become fun
09:41 kf is tibetan ltr or rtl?
09:42 |Lupin| ltr
09:42 |Lupin| but in reality things are a bit more complicated than that, because the structure of a syllable is not in one dimension, but on two dimensions
09:43 |Lupin| so a syllable can be seen as a matrix where each letter can have several others stacked on top of it or underneath it
09:43 kf sounds like fun :)
09:43 chris @karma
09:43 munin chris: Highest karma: "paul_p" (54), "hdl_laptop" (40), and "owen" (38).  Lowest karma: "<!" (-16), "failed" (-10), and "<-" (-9).  You (chris) are ranked 4 out of 382.
09:47 |Lupin| kf: yes. Since recently I can type tibetan in my LInux console and the letters are displayed correctly on the screen. In braille, however, each letter is represented by a question mark at the moment. I'll have to choose a braille representaiton for each letter, which is not very easy :)
09:47 |Lupin| @karma kf
09:47 munin |Lupin|: Karma for "kf" has been increased 4 times and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 4.
09:48 kf yay :)
09:48 chris @most
09:48 munin chris: (most [<channel>] {increased,decreased,active}) -- Returns the most increased, the most decreased, or the most active (the sum of increased and decreased) karma things. <channel> is only necessary if the message isn't sent in the channel itself.
09:49 chris @most increased
09:49 munin chris: "paul_p": 54, "hdl_laptop": 40, "owen": 39, "chris": 37, "gmcharlt": 34, "slef": 28, "atz": 27, "fbcit": 27, "kados": 16, "wizzyrea": 15, "pianohacker": 15, "nengard": 14, "thd": 13, "kyle": 10, "toins": 10, "pierrick": 8, "tumer": 8, "brendan": 7, "git": 7, "ricardo": 6, "jwagner": 5, "|Lupin|": 5, "mason": 5, "schuster": 5, and "acmoore": 5
09:49 chris @most decreased
09:49 munin chris: "<!": 16, "failed": 10, "<-": 9, "-": 6, "ie": 5, "encoding": 4, "+---------------+---------------------+--------​-----------+------+-----+---------+-------------​---+---------------------------------+--------": 3, "--><th>Renew</th><!": 3, "class="highlight"<!": 3, "<tr<!": 3, "savannah": 3, "google": 3, "there": 2, "capital_letters": 2, "nz": 2, "ms": 2, "kados": 2, "jerks": 2, (1 more message)
09:49 chris @clear <!
09:49 munin chris: Error: You don't have the #koha,op capability. If you think that you should have this capability, be sure that you are identified before trying again. The 'whoami' command can tell you if you're identified.
09:50 chris @whoami
09:50 munin chris: chris
09:50 chris ah will get gmcharlt to clear it ;)
09:50 gmcharlt @clear <!
09:50 munin gmcharlt: The operation succeeded.
09:50 chris gmcharlt++
09:51 kf hm I need to do something for my karma :)
09:51 chris @languages
09:51 munin chris: downloading the Perl source
09:53 |Lupin| kf: your karma does not seem too bad
09:53 chris gmcharlt: do you ever watch letterman?
09:53 gmcharlt chris: very, very rarely
09:54 chris apparently the nz prime minister is going to be doing one of the top ten lists
09:54 gmcharlt @lcear --><th>Renew</th><!
09:54 munin gmcharlt: I've exhausted my database of quotes
09:55 gmcharlt @lcear '--><th>Renew</th><!'
09:55 munin gmcharlt: I'll give you the answer just as soon as RDA is ready
09:55 gmcharlt @clear --><th>Renew</th><!
09:55 munin gmcharlt: The operation succeeded.
09:55 gmcharlt @clear +---------------+---------------------+--------​-----------+------+-----+---------+------------​----+---------------------------------+--------
09:55 munin gmcharlt: The operation succeeded.
09:55 gmcharlt @clear class="highlight"<!
09:55 munin gmcharlt: The operation succeeded.
09:56 chris @most active
09:56 munin chris: "paul_p": 54, "hdl_laptop": 40, "owen": 40, "chris": 37, "gmcharlt": 35, "slef": 28, "atz": 27, "fbcit": 27, "kados": 18, "wizzyrea": 15, "pianohacker": 15, "nengard": 14, "thd": 13, "failed": 10, "kyle": 10, "toins": 10, "<-": 9, "pierrick": 8, "tumer": 8, "brendan": 7, "ricardo": 7, "git": 7, "-": 6, "jwagner": 5, and "|Lupin|": 5
09:56 gmcharlt @most decreased
09:56 munin gmcharlt: "failed": 10, "<-": 9, "-": 6, "ie": 5, "encoding": 4, "<tr<!": 3, "savannah": 3, "google": 3, "there": 2, "capital_letters": 2, "nz": 2, "ms": 2, "kados": 2, "jerks": 2, "sirsi": 2, "microsoft": 1, "ie6": 1, "InternetExplorer": 1, "--": 1, "[…]ebraqueue-daemon-": 1, "": 1, " (1 more message)
09:56 gmcharlt @clear <-
09:56 munin gmcharlt: The operation succeeded.
09:56 gmcharlt @clear --
09:56 munin gmcharlt: The operation succeeded.
09:56 gmcharlt @most decreased
09:56 munin gmcharlt: "failed": 10, "-": 6, "ie": 5, "encoding": 4, "<tr<!": 3, "savannah": 3, "google": 3, "there": 2, "capital_letters": 2, "nz": 2, "ms": 2, "kados": 2, "jerks": 2, "sirsi": 2, "microsoft": 1, "ie6": 1, "InternetExplorer": 1, "[…]ebraqueue-daemon-": 1, "": 1, "[…]ibution-with-Koha": 1, (1 more message)
09:56 gmcharlt @clear -
09:56 munin gmcharlt: The operation succeeded.
09:56 gmcharlt @clear <tr<!
09:56 munin gmcharlt: The operation succeeded.
09:56 gmcharlt @most decreased
09:56 munin gmcharlt: "failed": 10, "ie": 5, "encoding": 4, "savannah": 3, "google": 3, "there": 2, "capital_letters": 2, "nz": 2, "ms": 2, "kados": 2, "jerks": 2, "sirsi": 2, "microsoft": 1, "ie6": 1, "InternetExplorer": 1, "[…]ebraqueue-daemon-": 1, "": 1, "[…]ibution-with-Koha": 1, "March": 1, "ago": (1 more message)
09:57 chris nabble_and_its_crazy_urls--
09:58 |Lupin| it's to bad the bot hasn't some aliases, so that, say, ms and microsoft refer to the same thing
10:18 Amit hi galen
10:18 gmcharlt hi Amit
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10:20 |Lupin| does someone know how whether there exists some verb in english to say something like "contact again a client who didn't reply so far" ?
10:21 |Lupin| a substantive may be helpful, too
10:22 gmcharlt very informally, "poke" or "prod"
10:22 |Lupin| gmcharlt: ok, thanks. It's to write in a paper, so I assume from what you said that none of these two would work ?
10:23 gmcharlt correct
10:23 |Lupin| gmcharlt: ok
10:24 |Lupin| At this stage, it may be helpful to have a database of rightsholders with precise contact information, plus a system to keep track of orders and assist the librarian in sending new requests to those rightholders who did not repl so foar.
10:24 |Lupin| would this sentence be okay ?
10:25 gmcharlt yes, except for the typos at the very end ;)
11:04 |Lupin| gmcharlt: s/repl/reply/, something else ?
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11:29 gmcharlt |Lupin|: s/foar/far/
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11:43 |Lupin| gmcharlt: wow, sorry, I didn't notice this one. Thanks.
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12:01 |Lupin| time to leave
12:01 |Lupin| bye
12:01 |Lupin| left #koha
12:02 Amit time to leave bye
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12:06 greenmang0 @wunder mumbai
12:06 munin greenmang0: The current temperature in Mumbai, India is 30.0�C (5:10 PM IST on August 27, 2009). Conditions: Smoke. Humidity: 74%. Dew Point: 25.0�C. Pressure: 29.68 in 1005 hPa (Steady).
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12:47 jdavidb gmcharlt:  ping?
12:48 gmcharlt jdavidb: pong
12:48 jdavidb Some time when you've got a few minutes, I'd like to visit with you about the build_holds_queue cron, and the hold_fill_targets table..  Something about it has me scratching my head, and "git blame" shows your name a *lot* in there.
12:50 gmcharlt jdavidb: sure - busy this morning, but feel free to ping me this afternoon
12:51 jdavidb Willdo.  EBPL may have a fringe use-case here (*everything* about EBPL is a fringe use-case, IMO...) and it's causing some headaches.  I can short-circuit it, but I'd like to understand it instead, if possible.
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13:19 schuster Owen - how's the baby?  sleeping through the night yet?
13:20 owen She has always been a remarkable sleeper, especially compared to our first
13:20 owen She wakes up once or twice, otherwise she sleeps great
13:22 schuster Oh you are lucky!  Does your wife work?  One of our librarians has had to go back to work after having her baby in May and the adjustment to daycare has not been good.  Once an all nigh sleeper is waking up every 2 hours wanting food or to be played with.
13:24 jdavidb My older daughter slept all night the first night home from the hospital.  She hasn't done it since, of course...she'll be 17 this fall...
13:26 paul_p good morning USA !
13:27 owen My wife teaches high school, so she got the summer off plus one extra month this month. Then back to school.
13:27 owen Hi paul_p
13:28 paul_p France is great here: you get 20weeks off when you've a baby (6 before and 14 after the birth), at full salary. For the 3rd or more (of for twins), you get 26. If you have 3 or more babies at the same time it's 36 (but not sure the pain to have 3 babies is worth the 10 more weeks...)
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13:29 jdavidb That is good,paul_p...way, way better than here.
13:30 owen paul_p: Maybe so, but according to some American politicians France is a horrible communist country where people wait in line for days for basic health care!
13:30 collum paul_p: Do the father's also get days off?
13:30 paul_p collum: of course, but just 2 weeks
13:31 paul_p and (except for the 1st), anyone (mum or dad) can take 1 year with 1k€ or upto 3 years with 500€ (monthly) to take care of the child
13:31 paul_p my wife is in this status for 5 years now (Jérémie, then 2.5 years later Matthieu)
13:32 paul_p it's called "parental education allocation"
13:32 jdavidb owen:  Saw this article on AlterNet, and it points out several pretty dramatic differences in the US and French healthcare systems:
13:32 jdavidb I knew that France's system was better, but I didn't quite realize how *much* better.
13:34 paul_p the other side : if you have a salary of 1k€ (net), the mandatory health care amount is almost another 1k€
13:34 jdavidb Well, sure.  There ain't no free lunches.
13:35 gmcharlt but no such thing as "pre-existing conditions", I bet
13:35 paul_p something like 50% for diseases, 25% for retirement, 25% for family allocation.
13:35 gmcharlt what is family allocatin?
13:35 paul_p a frenchism, probably ;-)
13:35 * jdavidb nods at gmcharlt.
13:35 gmcharlt paul_p: no doubt :) but what is it?
13:36 paul_p it's the 1k€ / 500€ I spoke previously + an amount EVERY famil gets just to have childrens
13:36 owen chris++ for fast Zotero/xslt patch
13:36 jdavidb "pre-existing" has been a problem for me all my life.  Since I've always been an amputee, anything having to do with my right leg is a "pre-existing condition."
13:36 gmcharlt ah
13:36 * owen could have sworn there was an existing bug for that one
13:36 paul_p monthly : 0 for the 1st, 100 for the 2nd, 160 for 3rd and each one after
13:36 paul_p until your children is 18
13:37 paul_p for us, we get almost 1000€ every months (we have 4 childrens, and wife in "Parental Education Allocation")
13:37 jdavidb Oh, I can so see women here taking way too much advantage of that..  Lordy.  "Octomom" wouldn't be news any more.  "*only* 14 kids?  Pssht."
13:38 collum paul_p: What happens at 18.  Is university paid for?  We just sent our 18 year old to college.  He's finding that he really didn't want as much freedom as he has been asking for since he was 14.
13:38 paul_p jdavidb: in fact, some ppl here are complaining about ppl from north africa having too much babies, just to get the money.
13:39 paul_p collum: are you seated ? if no, the take a chair...
13:39 paul_p universities are free (as beer) in France...
13:39 collum paul_p: I'm braced.
13:39 collum Beer is free? European beer!!!!
13:40 * jdavidb is trying to think of good reasons why *not* living in France is a good idea, and coming up short.
13:40 paul_p (no, it was just refering to free as beer / free as speech)
13:40 paul_p jdavidb: maybe => we speak french ?
13:40 paul_p (but anyway, it's true that a lot of ppl complains the allocation stops when the childrens cost more !)
13:41 jdavidb paul:  We have that problem in our immigrant communities.  They're not US citizens, but if their baby is born here, the baby is.  And so the parents get support money, etc...  and there are strong incentives to have lotsa the little monsters.)
13:41 gmcharlt jdavidb: but I suspect not as much as you'd think - we're long past the days where you could set your kids to work on the farm, after all
13:41 jdavidb paul:  I don't see speaking French as a problem.  I don't, but there's no reason I *couldn't*...
13:42 * paul_p heads back to printing the X0000 of pages I have to print for an RFP (poor trees...)
13:42 jdavidb gmcharlt:  Move to south Texas.  We really oughta draw a line from El Paso to San Antonio to Houston, and give everything south of the line back to Mexico...  They don't set 'em to work on the farm, unfortunately.  Quite a few end up in really violent gangs and such.
13:43 jdavidb My brother used to live down there, and he had to move, because my nephew was the *last* native-English speaker in the whole school district--they were only going to offer ESL.
13:44 jdavidb The fact that so darn many of them seem to *want* to live in the squalid conditions of the Rio Grande Valley says something about the place they came from that is really unnerving to me.
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13:56 |Lupin| hi again
13:57 owen Is anyone familiar with this problem?[…]t-to25134301.html
13:58 owen I'm not sure I understand how to reproduce it
13:58 gmcharlt owen: I had poked around with that footer in HEAD a while back; it's possible that it may not be reproduicible in HEAD
14:02 Sharon joined #koha
14:04 |Lupin| hi Sharon
14:04 Sharon good morning
14:05 |Lupin| Sharon: ah good morning... here it's afternoon already
14:05 Sharon this global community stuff 'bakes my noodle' as Liz would say
14:06 |Lupin| Sharon: coudl you explain a bit pls ? who is Liz, what does this expression mean ? :)
14:07 Sharon Liz is my co-worker who's on here as wizzyrea.  Bakes my noodle = confuses me
14:11 rhcl_away is now known as rhcl
14:11 |Lupin| Sharon: okay, thanks for the subtitles :)
14:12 rhcl I need coffee. brb
14:12 |Lupin| wizzyrea: do you allow me to re-use this expression ? I like it ! :)
14:12 |Lupin| Sharon: where are you located ?
14:13 wizzyrea |Lupin| of course :)
14:13 Sharon |Lupin| we are in Kansas, middle of the US
14:13 wizzyrea technically, that one came from my dad. In my dad's vernacular, the "noodle" was your head, thusly, to bake it was to be completely confused
14:14 wizzyrea so you could say "health care in the US totally bakes my noodle"
14:15 |Lupin| aaaah
14:16 |Lupin| wizzyrea: I think I got it. It expresses confusion because noodles are supposed to be boiled rather than baken, so if you bake them it's you must be totally confused... correct ?
14:16 |Lupin| Sharon: ok
14:16 wizzyrea you could also "bonk your noodle" (hit your head)
14:16 wizzyrea yep, that's about right
14:16 wizzyrea though that makes somewhat less sense
14:17 wizzyrea lol
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14:18 wizzyrea |Lupin| Kansas is where Dorothy is from in the story The Wizard of Oz, if that helps.
14:18 * wizzyrea ducks and waits for the inevitable "there's no place like home's"
14:19 kf hi liz - did you have a chance to look at your self checkouts for renewals?
14:19 gmcharlt wizzyrea: cataloging professor is using the Wizard of Oz as an example this semester - lots of cornfield and Kansas jokes already :/
14:20 wizzyrea kf- indeed, I got the info back late yesterday afternoon: the way ours work is that it just checks out the book again with a refreshed circ rule. It doesn't seem to follow the renewal rules.
14:20 wizzyrea gmcharlt - you can tell him that we have more wheat than corn ;) (nyah nyah)
14:21 gmcharlt wizzyrea: I'll let her know ;)
14:21 wizzyrea her*
14:21 wizzyrea and it's fine to make fun of Kansas... there's a lot of comedic fodder here.
14:21 wizzyrea though not as much as Missouri ^.^
14:22 Sharon that would be missoura...
14:22 wizzyrea I mean, any place whose name phonetically sounds so much like "misery" has to be funny, right?
14:23 kf rofl
14:23 Sharon gmcharlt we used that book for my cataloging class back at IU Bloomington.  I don't remember KS jokes, but I'm sure there were some.
14:24 |Lupin| wizzyrea: heay it helps, I remember now. Thanks !
14:24 kf wizzyrea: thx - perhaps we can do something similar. I already noticed that checking out a already checked out book leads to a renewal - was not sure if this could be a problem, when people accidently check out more than one and loose their renewals this way
14:25 chris hmm why am i awake at 2.30am .. oh thats right because of[…]ms/snzo-drum.html
14:25 jdavidb wizzyrea: When I was in college speech class, we were supposed to do a promotional speech for some tourist site we knew about.  A guy from Topeka did one about "if you want a fun vacation, *don't* come to Kansas."
14:27 collum
14:27 jdavidb Earthshaker a few minutes ago, chris ?
14:27 nahuel_ gmcharlt, around ?
14:27 gmcharlt nahuel_: yes
14:28 nahuel_ gmcharlt, cool, can you say me something about this syspref : emailLibrarianWhenHoldIsPlaced ?
14:28 nahuel_ why i do not find anything with a grep ?
14:28 nahuel_ instead in sql
14:28 rhcl I see in my absence people have been maligning Missoura.
14:28 gmcharlt nahuel_: it's not implement - it may have been in dev_week, but is not there now
14:28 chris yeah, centred 20km away, only 5.2 but a big jolt
14:28 nahuel_ ho ok ! So i'll do it :)
14:28 nahuel_ gmcharlt, thanks :)
14:28 gmcharlt nahuel_: it strikes me as something that only a really small library would want
14:29 nahuel_ depends, we have "big" libraries that needs it
14:29 nahuel_ "frenchies" big libraries
14:29 nahuel_ hehe
14:30 jdavidb That would be!  Any damage, that you know of?
14:30 nahuel_ gmcharlt, anyway, thanks :)
14:30 gmcharlt nahuel_: indeed - but I can see even a small US  public library crashing their mailing server due to volume they turned that on ;)
14:30 nahuel_ ^^
14:30 nahuel_ hehe ok
14:30 owen wizzyrea: Your dad was the Oracle in The Matrix? That's where I first heard "bake your noodle"
14:43 wizzyrea hmm.. no, but he was saying that long ago
14:43 wizzyrea way way before the movie
14:44 wizzyrea I forgot about that one though, you're right, it is in that movie
14:44 wizzyrea little different context
14:44 * owen has seen it a few too many times
14:44 kf wizzyrea++ for helping with renewals :)
14:45 wizzyrea kf: np :)
14:45 |Lupin| wizzyrea++ for the poetic noddle expression
14:45 wizzyrea ooh karma is falling from the saky
14:45 wizzyrea sky
14:45 |Lupin| Sharon++ also, for having used it
14:46 wizzyrea owen: obsessive matrix viewing from you does not surprise me
14:46 kf I declined a lot of karma today - is has to end up somewhere
14:46 kf "at a better place"
14:46 wizzyrea :)
14:51 chris ok, thats the kids placated, no after shocks, im going back to sleep
14:51 owen "Daddy, there's an earthquake in my room!"
14:55 wizzyrea nub question: nozebra indexing needs to be scheduled?
14:55 wizzyrea w/  cron?
14:56 wizzyrea (I don't do much with the back end usually, but have an eensy library coming on to a dedicated server)
14:58 brendan left #koha
14:59 wizzyrea aww, not even a RTFM?
15:00 kf mom g
15:00 kf[…]hterm=cron%20jobs
15:00 gmcharlt wizzyrea: no, nozebra indexing is done on the fly
15:01 kf oh no zebra
15:01 kf sorry
15:01 gmcharlt usually need only be run if you change index definitions
15:13 jdavidb Now, this is novel.  One of our customers is apparently quite nervous, all of a sudden, about the possibility of SQL injection attacks in the staff client.  Actually presented what they thought would be a plausible scenario--which didn't work, when I tried it on a test server.
15:14 nahuel_ As I know
15:14 nahuel_ you cannot made sql injections easily
15:14 nahuel_ I already tryied
15:14 nahuel_ $dbh only execute one sql request, even if you pass 2
15:16 jdavidb Ahh...nice feature, that.
15:23 wizzyrea gmcharlt: another question... ccode searching with nozebra, should this work?
15:23 wizzyrea because I can't seem to get it to
15:24 wizzyrea (but I may have something set up wrong
15:24 wizzyrea )
15:25 gmcharlt wizzyrea: depends entirely on index definitions - need a 'ccode' index in the syspref pulling from the appropriate 952 subfield
15:25 wizzyrea ok cool I will check them
15:25 wizzyrea thanks
15:25 wizzyrea I'm guessing it doesn't come with that one by default?
15:26 gmcharlt dunno offhand - check the syspref
15:26 wizzyrea k I wil
15:26 wizzyrea l
15:26 wizzyrea ty
15:29 wizzyrea >.< sorry, you would add something like 'ccode' => '9528'
15:29 wizzyrea ?
15:29 wizzyrea and reindex?
15:30 gmcharlt yep
15:31 wizzyrea okies
15:31 wizzyrea ty
15:32 magnusenger left #koha
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15:44 wizzyrea bleh, I added it but it's still not finding it, the records have it. I feel like I've witnessed this conversation many times, it's like deja vu, but I can't remember it all.
15:44 joetho joined #koha
15:44 wizzyrea they must have changed something in the matrix
15:47 joetho left #koha
15:47 joetho joined #koha
16:41 kf left #koha
16:52 pianohacker joined #koha
16:52 |Lupin| hi pianohacker
16:52 pianohacker Hi, |Lupin|
16:53 |Lupin| pianohacker: I feel guilty for not remembering your name... Jesse ?
16:53 pianohacker That's the one. I had to use whois to remember Sébastien, so...
16:54 |Lupin| pianohacker: ah... but one day you called me Sébasien and since then each time I great you I think I should use your real name, too
16:55 pianohacker Ok :)
16:57 cait joined #koha
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17:05 nicomo left #koha
17:12 joetho Hi, JESSE
17:12 joetho how could I forget?
17:12 pianohacker Hi, tho
17:18 |Lupin| left #koha
17:50 jdavidb left #koha
18:04 rhcl @ping wizzyrea
18:04 munin pong
18:04 rhcl ?
18:04 pianohacker @ping
18:04 munin pong
18:04 pianohacker wizzyrea: ping
18:05 pianohacker ^-- is the preferred method
18:05 rhcl wizzyrea: you on?
18:05 cait playing ping pong with munin?
18:05 rhcl that might work?
18:05 rhcl I was just trying to ring wizzy's bell and see if she's on
18:05 cait perhaps try to message her directly too
18:06 rhcl For US libraries the CPSC just released guidance for testing of lead in children's books
18:06 rhcl It had been a matter of concern, but the guidance says (basically) that we don't have to test them.
18:07 rhcl Could have been a big big expense for us.
18:09 joetho wizzy is lrea at nekls dot org  (that is an L at the beginning)
18:09 joetho @ping
18:09 munin pong
18:10 joetho ha h a ha ha oh I like a bot with a sense of humor
18:10 joetho @ding
18:10 munin joetho: I suck
18:10 joetho @flip
18:10 munin joetho: I suck
18:10 rhcl Not that critical really, but my director was happy that we seem to be in the clear now, and apparently the news was just released, so I thought I'm mention it to her.
18:11 cait what does this mean, guidance for testing of lead in children's books?
18:11 cait I dont understand it :)
18:11 joetho to see if there is any lead (the metal) in the paper or ink or cover or anything...?
18:12 rhcl Apparently there had been some threat from recent legislation that libraries were going to have to test children's books for lead, or replace all of them with certified lead-free books.
18:12 cait ah
18:12 cait the metal
18:12 cait now I got it :)
18:12 rhcl Applied mostly to older books, I think.
18:12 rhcl A lot of libraries were sweating the issue.
18:13 owen Tricky homonyms.
18:13 joetho I'm all for it, if there is a cheap test
18:13 joetho "The Tough Coughs As He Ploughs the Dough"
18:13 rhcl Don't think there is such a thing (cheap test) and however cheap one test might be can you imagine the time and cumulative expense of testing hundreds or thousands of books?
18:15 joetho This could go hand in hand with the library I read of recently in the US northeast, a wealthy community...
18:15 joetho they wanted to restrict their library to exclude poor people, basically
18:15 joetho they could use the poor people to taste-test their books
18:16 joetho Just a modest proposal.
18:16 rhcl Oh, a Modest Proposal.
18:16 owen About 73,000 books in our collection would have been required to be tested.
18:17 joetho how old does a book have to be suspicious?
18:17 rhcl Beats me.
18:17 joetho I mean, if it is newer than ten years is it certifiably OK?
18:17 rhcl On August 26, 2009, the CPSC’s final rule on children’s products
18:17 rhcl containing lead was released....
18:17 rhcl In the rule, CPSC confirmed that
18:17 rhcl libraries have no independent obligation to test library books for lead
18:17 rhcl under the law.
18:17 joetho this belongs on publib-L
18:17 rhcl CPSC also announced its intention to release a Statement
18:17 rhcl of Policy specifically providing guidance for libraries with regard to
18:17 rhcl the treatment of older children’s books that could potentially contain
18:17 rhcl lead.
18:17 joetho hey owen
18:18 rhcl According to our conversations with CPSC officials, that Statement
18:18 rhcl of Policy should be released within the next several weeks."
18:18 joetho is there any lead in any of your css customizations?
18:18 owen joetho: it's not the age of the book that is a concern. The law was prompted by issues with imports
18:18 joetho ahhh
18:18 joetho like the toys
18:18 owen Right
18:18 joetho yikes
18:18 rhcl Is there a marc field for identifying books that might have environmental concerns?
18:19 owen Only at Hogwarts.
18:20 collum left #koha
18:22 cait or the invisible university
18:23 pianohacker Probably just a generic 500.
18:24 pianohacker cait: From discworld?
18:26 cait yes
18:26 pianohacker One would hope they'd gotten beyond MARC, at least
18:32 cait I think they would use something even more complicated than marc ;)
18:32 pianohacker Ack
18:34 joetho marc robinson? from denton, tx?
18:35 pianohacker Hehe, poor marc, at liblime
18:40 chris_n left #koha
18:43 owen Anyone else notice a problem with HEAD where it won't forget your "specify due date" date?
18:45 owen when I first load the circ page it pre-loads a date in the "specify due date" field. Even if I clear it before checking out I still get a warning that the date is invalid
18:46 chris havent seen that
18:46 * chris tries
18:47 owen chris: never mind, I must have been testing the globalDueDate pref. I had a date entered there.
18:47 owen I didn't realize it worked by pre-populating the "specify due date" field.
18:51 chris ahh good
18:51 chris cos i couldnt reproduce :)
18:52 joetho Koha 3 supports SIP2, correct? Why yes, Joe, it does.
18:52 joetho Thanks
18:53 joetho how about NCIP?
18:53 owen Fat chance
18:53 joetho but which one is more reliable?
18:53 cait we just tested sip2 with our vendor
18:54 joetho fat chance with ncip?
18:54 joetho what vendor, cait ?
18:54 cait renewals seem to have some problems and when checking in a barcode not known to koha self checkout crashes
18:54 joetho yikes
18:54 cait but we did many test cases rest works fine
18:54 joetho owen
18:55 cait its their self checkout machine thats loses connection - dont know what the problem is
18:55 owen No NCIP
18:55 cait its a German vendor
18:55 joetho owen gives me bad news today
18:55 joetho frown at owen
18:56 joetho so, with koha, it's sip2 or NUTTIN.
18:56 chris for now
18:56 cait but sip2 is not so bad
18:56 joetho I don't need it for much.
18:56 brendan joined #koha
18:57 chris there is work on gettng the NCIP support up and going
18:57 owen I would be very happy to accept donation of NCIP functionality to Koha. Maybe WALDO--oh wait, never mind.
18:57 chris reeeoooowww
18:58 chris *hiss* *hiss*
18:58 chris :-)
18:58 cait @karma WALDO
18:58 munin cait: Karma for "WALDO" has been increased 0 times and decreased 1 time for a total karma of -1.
18:58 chris jerks--
18:59 cait I mourn for recall and hourly loans
18:59 chris the good news is, the sip2/ncip toolkit is something both Evegreen and Koha use
18:59 chris so any improvements on it benefits both projects, and i know there is stuff planned
19:01 owen That is good news
19:01 owen Okay, quick poll everyone: "due date" or "date due"
19:01 gmcharlt "due date"
19:01 cait due date
19:02 chris ditto
19:02 cait not a native speaker - but our old systems uses that to
19:02 cait too
19:03 * owen is working on Bug 3106 hoping it can be ready for 3.2
19:03 munin Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=3106 enhancement, P5, ---,, NEW, checked out list should look the same in all places
19:05 chris ohh sweet
19:05 schuster joined #koha
19:05 chris right time to feed kahu some breakfast
19:05 chris bbiab
19:05 davi left #koha
19:06 schuster Is there a way to see the last time a borrower record was updated?  We just did a student load and now I want to identify the students that didn't get updated as part of that load.  53,000 students and probably 6,000 needles in a haystack.
19:08 joetho duedue date
19:08 pianohacker I don't think there's a modification time on borrower records, unfortunately
19:08 owen I'm surprised the borrowers table doesn't have a timestamp column
19:09 cait isnt there are borrowers logß
19:09 joetho ahhh
19:09 joetho if I had 53000 patrons I might have that log turned off.
19:09 pianohacker cait: If they're enabled
19:09 cait when its turned on
19:10 pianohacker jinx^3
19:10 cait hm?
19:10 pianohacker Oh, just an American thing (we all said the same thing at the same time, so jinx)
19:11 owen for you pianohacker:[…]7/boll/index.html
19:12 pianohacker owen: Haha, nice
19:12 pianohacker To be honest, I think some corporate legal battles might actually make more sense if conducted by first-grader rules...
19:14 cait pianohacker: thx for exlaining :)
19:14 davi joined #koha
19:15 schuster drat...
19:16 schuster I see another enhancement request...
19:16 chris it did
19:16 chris last_modified
19:16 pianohacker We might have to do something about the borrowers table. With the recent PTFS enhancements, we're getting into the 60-column range
19:16 chris was a timestamp
19:17 chris someone killed it between 2.2.9 and now
19:17 cait I like the new country columns - my library asked for it and next day I got them :)
19:17 schuster That isn't a column in my borrowers table.
19:17 chris and the need a kicking
19:17 chris they even
19:18 schuster Lots of things got killed between 2.2.9... rrrr yes they even...  too bad the code is gone no signature!
19:18 schuster Easy to determine when someone adds, hard to find when someone removes!
19:18 chris_n joined #koha
19:18 chris i bet i could find out, but it serves no purpose :)
19:18 chris git grep schuster
19:19 schuster ;) - so is there a list of PTFS enhancements?
19:19 schuster I usually check to see the activity but sometimes those criptic programmer notes don't mean anything to me.
19:20 Sharon schuster PTFS put a lot of there enhancements in bugzilla
19:21 chris_n EHLO
19:21 schuster AH! - I have not looked at that lately are those enhancements to be done or complete can you search it easily?
19:21 pianohacker schuster: Mix of submitted, complete, and unfinished
19:21 joetho git.koha works kind of OK for me but only if I am looking for something very specific
19:21 joetho and if I know where to start looking
19:22 schuster Cool thanks pianohacker.
19:22 * chris_n tries to hammer xp pro into submission on sun vbox :-P
19:23 schuster Has anyone seen the ISBN 13 normalization type stuff come through?  10 digit and 13 digit searching interchangable - so that when you search a 13 it converts it to 10 to make sure you don't already have that book?
19:23 schuster chris_n good luck SUN burns XP... ;)
19:23 cait perhaps search for asignee
19:23 Sharon owen on 3106, will Liz still be able to hide the check in feature? It doesn't trigger transfers and holds correctly (yet)
19:23 gmcharlt schuster: it's submitted, will be integrated
19:23 gmcharlt definitely will make it in for feature freeze
19:24 owen Sharon: Is she using Javascript to do that right now?
19:24 schuster Great thanks gmcharlt - that's a big piece of code that I think librarians will love.
19:24 Sharon she's using whatever you shared at kohacon
19:24 Sharon jquery
19:25 pianohacker Sharon: She'll have to change the JavaScript, but I'd imagine it would still be possible
19:25 owen Sharon: That should still work.
19:25 schuster PS loved sitting in on your Cat class yesterday on facebook - funny... RDA - did they know what they were talking about or just throwing out something they had heard of...  I'm still waiting to see what they do with RDA!
19:25 Sharon cool.  I like that there's going to be consistency.
19:25 schuster that PS was for gmcharlt
19:26 gmcharlt schuster: it's was more a case that the the professor doesn't want to teach the controversy just yet ;)
19:26 * owen realizes the checkout page has said "Holds(s)" probably since the release of Koha 3.
19:26 owen Holdses.
19:26 schuster How can you teach it if there isn't any practicing by almost nobody on how to!
19:27 schuster Gotta go sort some boxes...
19:27 gmcharlt schuster: can't teach RDA yet, but you could go on and on about the debate ;)
19:44 owen Sharon: Is there a bug report for the transfers/holds problem you mentioned?
19:46 chris im glad pianohacker answered the xml cataloguing question, cos i didnt know where to start
19:47 gmcharlt Koha is (not yet) the digital repository you are looking for
19:48 gmcharlt err, make that Koha is not (yet) the digital repo...
19:48 Sharon I think so
19:48 pianohacker xml--
19:48 pianohacker But he's free to use whatever convoluted cataloging process he desires
19:49 cait owen: perhaps @bug 3514
19:49 munin Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=3514 enhancement, PATCH-Sent, ---,, NEW, Returning items through patron Details tab doesn't activate all circulation functions
19:49 Sharon give me a minute, I'll go look
19:49 chris i catalogue xml in yaml in xml in sgml in xml
19:50 pianohacker Oh my. The data files for the new sysprefs editor are almost there; they're html in yaml in an html-template
19:50 chris i actaully like yaml
19:51 owen Hmf. I was about to say "that's not an enhancement" but I see that the the patch isn't really a fix.
19:51 pianohacker It is fun. Hopefully my ever-so-slight abuse of it won't raise too many developer hackles :)
19:52 chris <time>7.45<bus>4<whiplash>y​es</whiplash></bus></time>
19:52 * chris goes to catch his bus
19:52 pianohacker See ya
19:53 cait good night everybody :)
19:53 pianohacker Good night
19:54 cait left #koha
19:57 Sharon owen bug 3536
19:57 munin Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=3536 enhancement, P5, ---,, NEW, Checked In item requiring transfer does not consistently trigger transfer prompt
19:59 pianohacker gmcharlt++ (that bug lookup feature of munin is very helpful)
20:00 owen Especially since I never seem to configure chatzilla to link to bugs properly on the first try
20:00 owen Although, chatzilla++ for offering a way to link directly to a bugzilla database from "Bug XXX" mentions
20:09 owen The display of holds on and includes a column for item type. Strictly speaking you can either display the bib-level item type or the item-level item type for *allocated* items.
20:10 owen Better not to show the item type column at all, or to show the item-level item type only for waiting holds?
20:10 gmcharlt owen: the former
20:10 gmcharlt item-type level holds no longer really exist; when they get rebuilt (stronger, and better!), can add back then
20:11 owen Okay.
20:13 Sharon owen we have a problem with bib level item types because in a consortium, libraries choose slightly different itypes (newbook v. book) for example
20:14 Sharon I think we whined until all itypes displayed in our catalog pull from the item record, not the bib.
20:19 Sharon Question - is this koha-generated email something new.  The subject line is: Delayed Mail (still being retried)
20:23 pianohacker Sharon: That sounds like something generated by your mail server, rather than Koha itself
20:23 Sharon well then I'll ask wizzyrea about it.  Thanks!  It's something new and it's clogging inboxes (or so I'm told)
20:25 owen See y'all later
20:25 owen left #koha
20:25 pianohacker Sharon: It's probably related to the mail problems mentioned on the Koha list
20:33 chris hmm yeah
20:39 chris that mail thing could be causing a bunch of mess
20:40 richard joined #koha
20:40 richard hi
20:40 chris hiya richard
20:42 richard i wondered what woke me up last night -[…]145159g-maps.html
20:43 rhcl chris was talking about it. How close were you to it?
20:44 chris richard lives about 1 km away from me
20:45 chris we both live at about the top tip of the star
20:45 chris on that map
20:45 rhcl The Seismicity Map at the link above is pretty impressive.
20:46 wizzyrea ok... the mail thing... lol
20:46 wizzyrea do. not. panic.  our situation was normal email operation
20:47 wizzyrea it was just a new (for them) message. This is what I get when I leave my desk. Panic and mayhem.
20:47 chris :-)
20:48 chris rhcl: oh yeah we get a lot .. that one last night was the biggest jolt i have felt in a while tho, i sleep through most of them
20:48 wizzyrea chris: chillens get woken up/excited/upset?
20:48 richard it woke me up but i didn't realise it was an earthquake
20:49 chris wizzyrea: kahu said and i quote "HEY!! HEY!!!! MY SLEEPING!!!!"
20:49 chris and went back to sleep
20:49 wizzyrea lol
20:49 wizzyrea cute
20:49 chris he hates being woken up
20:49 rhcl Somebody needs to set up munin to track earthquakes, like @felt earthquake NZ
20:50 chris you can follow geonet on twitter :)
20:50 rhcl too much work, I have yet to get too enthused about twitter.
20:50 wizzyrea ah. i've found that it's hard until you find a client you like
20:51 wizzyrea b/c web twitter is meh
20:51 rhcl nobody ever says anything I think is important
20:51 chris you arent following me then
20:51 chris har de ha ha
20:52 rhcl Oh, well, then I'll fire up my twitterer thing right now.
20:52 rhcl Now, were'd that d* think go to? Do you use a web browser?
20:53 rhcl As much as I'm really into Linux and tech stuff, most people expect me to be really Web 2.0, but I'm not at all.
20:53 wizzyrea twhirl is my favorite client atm, you can do and twitter on it simultaneously. but a lot of people like tweetdeck.
20:57 rhcl I was following Richard Stallman for a couple of weeks, and he never said a word.
20:59 chris_n2-away left #koha
21:08 |Lupin| joined #koha
21:08 |Lupin| hi again
21:12 |Lupin| ... and good night
21:13 |Lupin| left #koha
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22:14 rhcl is now known as rhcl_away
22:38 chris_n2 is now known as chris_n2-away
22:39 Sharon left #koha

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