IRC log for #koha, 2009-08-04

All times shown according to UTC.

Time S Nick Message
13:25 CGI016 can anyone tell me what software is used to create the irc logs on the koha website?
13:25 CGI016 (or for that matter: what do you yourself use to create irc logfiles?)
13:26 gmcharlt CGI016: it's a custom bot (newlogbot) + web interface - not actually released as OSS, IIRC
13:26 gmcharlt most bots can do logging
13:26 gmcharlt munin, for example, is a supybot, and there are a couple modules for supybot to log to file or database
13:26 munin gmcharlt: I suck
13:27 gmcharlt @dunno add I'll give you the answer just as soon as RDA is ready
13:27 munin gmcharlt: The operation succeeded.  Dunno #5 added.
13:27 CGI016 ok, so that's the way to go.
13:28 CGI016 i'll take a look at supybot, hope that's simple enough... ;)
13:30 CGI016 thanks.
14:38 jwagner nahuel, you broke up my string of consecutive bugzilla numbers :-)
14:38 nahuel héhé
14:39 nahuel you had to be faster :)
14:40 jwagner Hey, it takes time to pull all these together!  I'm at 32 and counting....
14:41 jwagner gmcharlt, I _WAS_ going to apologize for making bugzilla send you all those emails, but if you're going to crack the whip, I won't!
14:41 gmcharlt :)
14:41 kf jwagner: this fast add feature rings a bell ;)
14:41 nahuel jwagner, w000w
14:41 gmcharlt s'ok, I'm subscribed to koha-bugs anyway
14:42 jwagner I left them all as new/unassigned -- is that how you want me to do them?  Some of them have already had patches sent.
14:43 wizzyrea jwagner: I usually just note that a patch has been sent in a comment
14:43 wizzyrea that's how most ppl do it
14:43 nahuel wizzyrea, the status "PATCH-SENT" too
14:43 gmcharlt jwagner: since most (all?) of these are for completed work, they should be assigned to which ever PTFS person is in charge of the bug
14:43 wizzyrea that too
14:44 gmcharlt yes, that too pretty-please
14:44 wizzyrea probably the status is enough
14:44 gmcharlt note that NEW means that the bug is theoretically up for grabs for anybody to pick up and implement
14:44 jwagner Well, we have a bunch of different people doing the development and the person submitting isn't always the person developing.  I may just pick one person's name to use overall.
14:44 nahuel jwagner, and you must attache the patch to the ticket :)
14:44 gmcharlt ASSIGNED means that the assigne is (in theory anyway) implicitly promising to do something about it
14:45 gmcharlt attaching patches to tickets is desirable but (IMO) optional
14:45 gmcharlt and in any event, you don't necessarily need to do it until you send the patches for a particular bug to koha-patches
14:46 gmcharlt unless any of the patches in question you're not sure about and are specifrically asking for special community review before they are submitted
14:46 nahuel ok
14:46 jwagner OK.  I'm still overhauling my list (believe it or not, there are a bunch MORE not yet entered).  I'll go back & update status where needed.
14:47 jwagner gmcharlt -- I think I remember you saying that a person's email had to be subscribed to patches listserv to be able to send a patch.  Is that correct?  We were looking at using a generic alias email address for submission.
14:47 jwagner (rather than trying to use diff people's emails all over the place)
14:47 gmcharlt jwagner: correct
14:47 gmcharlt you can subscribe but set the alias address to not receive mail from the list
14:48 jwagner Well, shoot.  Another great idea withers in the cold light of reality....
14:48 gmcharlt jwagner: umm, I don't think there's a problem
14:48 gmcharlt doing it the way you want
14:48 jwagner OK, if we can subscribe the address, that might work.
14:49 gmcharlt what I do care about is that the patch author has the Real Name (tm) of the person who made that patch (the contractor who doesn't want to be identified being the exception)
14:49 jwagner OK, we'll look at our submit process with that in mind.
14:51 paul_p jwagner: i'm very happy to see all those coming patches. Congrats & kudos (and the fines part of koha lacked a lot of features, for sure !)
14:52 jwagner paul_p, thanks.  We still have a bunch in development, but with luck we'll be able to send patches for some of this (current bugzilla entry) crop soon.
14:52 paul_p can I suggest you create the bugs asap, even if the patch is still under development.
14:52 paul_p that could be usefull to know what you're working on (and maybe do some suggestion)
14:52 jwagner If we can, we will, but some of them are interrelated and we have to finish solving one piece before we can submit the rest.
14:53 jwagner As far as creating the bug entries, I'm still reviewing the rest to see how well defined they are.  Durned specs keep changing....
14:54 paul_p jwagner: just submit the feature 1st
14:54 paul_p with community help, you may get some interesting ideas about how to do something.
14:54 jwagner OK, I'll work on them.
14:57 wizzyrea yea, I'd agree with Paul, I'm sure some of the things you're working on have the same idea floating around in varying forms
14:57 paul_p jwagner: of course, you would not have to deal with them, but you may get interesting ideas that needs no time, or even that will reduce time !
14:59 jwagner paul_p, I'm sure of it.  I'm not doing much of the development myself (as I keep saying, I Are Not A Real Programmer), but the various developers do monitor all the lists & discussions.
15:01 wizzyrea hmm... is there some reason why I couldn't get a shelf list of more than 10000 items?
15:01 wizzyrea this report seems to die at 10k items
15:02 paul_p wizzyrea: maybe a field size...
15:03 jwagner wizzyrea, I reported a bug a while back -- the report download truncates at 10,000 no matter how much data is returned.  Lemme see if I can find that bug report.
15:03 wizzyrea OHH
15:03 wizzyrea jwagner++ for having the answer lol
15:03 wizzyrea (I thought it was me)
15:04 wizzyrea yes, that's a problem
15:04 wizzyrea hum. So... how am I going to get my shelf list :P
15:05 jwagner I thought I created/added a bug on that 10,000 limit, but I can't find it.  Someone else opened one that seems to be the same problem -- bug 3419
15:05 munin Bug http://bugs.koha.org/cgi-bin/b[…]w_bug.cgi?id=3419 normal, P5, ---, gmcharlt@gmail.com, NEW, Downloaded saved reports do not contain all records
15:06 wizzyrea yea, that's the one I am looking at
15:07 wizzyrea sigh
15:07 wizzyrea work around?
15:07 wizzyrea any ideas?
15:07 jwagner Damfino how to solve it, but I wish someone would figure it out.  Those of us who are (a) SQL-challenged or (b) don't have system-level access can't get the data out.
15:08 jwagner Be my guest :-)
15:08 jwagner But no one will know who you are now!
15:09 damfino *sigh* fine
15:10 wizzyrea well, I think it has more to do with (B) in my case
15:10 wizzyrea b/c I wrote the report. :P
15:10 wizzyrea ohhh kay. Well.
15:11 wizzyrea the library has 42k items... suppose if I could figure out how to split it into 4 10k reports that would be a way around it
15:16 paul_p wizzyrea: bug found !
15:16 paul_p C4/Reports/Guided.pm, line 398
15:16 paul_p    $limit  = 9999 unless $limit;
15:16 paul_p if Koha don't propose a limit, then it's truncated at 9999
15:16 wizzyrea DOH!
15:16 paul_p and for DL, there is no limit provided
15:16 paul_p so defaulted to 9999
15:17 wizzyrea Paul_p: you are the BEST.
15:17 wizzyrea hm. wonder what a good limit would be
15:18 paul_p wizzyrea: for DLing, there should be no limit
15:18 gmcharlt agreed
15:18 wizzyrea if that's technically possible (damfino, hah) then yea, there should be no limit
15:22 paul_p wizzyrea: yep, that's technically possible, but your Apache server must have a high timeout, otherwise, you may get a "apache stopped the process blabla"
15:23 wizzyrea i wonder if that's why they changed it in the first place
15:24 wizzyrea and "who would ever need a report of more than 10k items?"
15:24 wizzyrea ./facedesk
15:25 jwagner Maybe add a warning somewhere & a way to override the limit?
15:26 wizzyrea well... even with an override the apache thing is still kind of problematic
15:26 wizzyrea because if that's not set right, then it won't work anyway
15:27 wizzyrea is there a place where "settings for optimal usefulness" is defined?
15:27 wizzyrea in the documentation?
15:27 wizzyrea (server settings)
15:28 wizzyrea is = are. Sigh.
15:28 jwagner How about a different approach?  If a report will produce a large number of results, add an option to get the output emailed to a specified address, rather than displayed/downloaded?
17:31 jwagner Question for folks on Item Circulation Alerts -- http://koha.org/documentation/[…]irculation-alerts
17:31 jwagner This appears to just be controlling email notifications for various events.  Howe does it relate to patron messaging settings?
17:41 wizzyrea 1s reading
17:41 wizzyrea this may be our enhancement...
17:41 jwagner The item circ alerts?
17:42 wizzyrea the handling of setting defaults by patron type
17:58 wizzyrea jwagner what question did you have (specifically)?
17:58 jwagner Just wanted to know what it did & if it needs to be set up.  Does the messaging setting(s) in the patron account override this?
17:58 wizzyrea yes, it does
17:59 wizzyrea this just sets the defaults for the patron types
17:59 wizzyrea example: you have a patron type of Mytown -> adult
17:59 wizzyrea you want Mytown -> adult to always get hold notifications, you want all *new* Mytown -> adult patrons to have this setting by default
17:59 wizzyrea when you add patrons
18:00 jwagner We're doing that through the messaging settings in patron categories.
18:00 wizzyrea this really just sets the default settings when adding new patrons
18:00 wizzyrea hm, then I guess I'm not sure what it's for exactly
18:00 wizzyrea sorry >.<
18:00 jwagner So this would allow finer control than the settings in patron categories?  Residents for library X could have this setting, while Residents for library Y could have that?
18:01 wizzyrea right
18:25 zico hi
18:25 zico i hv been trying to establish two koha servers in one machine
18:25 zico so.. what i did.. is..
18:25 zico i copied two files... from /usr/share/koha  & named it /usr/share/koha1
18:26 zico nd.. from /etc/koha  & named /etc/koha1
18:26 zico i created two users.. root & koha1
18:26 zico & also two database koha & koha1
18:26 zico root has priviledge for koha & koha1 has all priviledge in koha1 database
18:26 zico i changed the koha-conf.xml for koha1 ... server
18:27 zico changed the database name from "koha" to "koha1" in there
18:27 zico & also changed the "user" and "password" as... "koha1" & "1234"
18:28 zico nd.. i can access this two servers.. with two different ports... say for first one... 192.168.1.254:80 & for second one... 192.168.1.254:89
18:28 zico but.. the PROBLEM IS... ONLY "ROOT" CAN LOG INTO THESE TWO SERVERS... BUT... "KOHA1" CANNOT LOGIN THERE
18:28 zico CAN ANYONE PLEASE HELP ME?? I NEED YOUR HELP BADLY
18:38 wizzyrea wait, root can log into both?
18:38 wizzyrea zico: root can log into both?
18:40 zico yes..root can log into both
18:41 zico zico: yes...root can log into both
18:41 wizzyrea so, that would indicate to me that both koha installs are pointing to the same config file.
18:41 zico but.. i changed from koha-conf.xml
18:41 zico :(
18:43 wizzyrea you edited both koha-conf.xml for koha1 to indicate the koha1 credentials?
18:43 gmcharlt zico: in the Apache config, is the SetEnv KOHA_CONF ... line different for each set of virtual hosts?
18:44 wizzyrea nm, I guess you said that you did. gmcharlt probably has it
18:49 zico gmcharlt: SetEnv KOHA_CONF?? i cannot get it
18:51 gmcharlt check in the Apache configuration file you set up for the virtual host(s)
18:51 zico yep
18:51 zico it is there
18:51 zico SetEnv koha3_CONF "/etc/koha3/koha3-conf.xml"
18:52 zico in /etc/apache2/sites-available/koha3
18:54 gmcharlt and is different in your /etc/koha/1/koha1-conf.xml ?
18:59 zico in /etc/koha/1/koha1-conf.xml ... i hv changed each & every "koha" with "koha1"
18:59 zico plus.. i hv changed the name of database... from "koha" to "koha1"
18:59 pianohacker zico: Are both of your Koha virtual hosts set up in /etc/apache2/sites-available/koha3 ?
18:59 zico nd.. also changed the user from "root" to "koha1"
19:00 zico yes... my both virtual hosts r set up in /etc/apache2/sites-available/
19:00 pianohacker zico: Okay. In the virtualhost blocks for each of them, there should be a line that starts with SetEnv KOHA_CONF
19:01 pianohacker It has to be that exact name; anything else will confuse Koha
19:08 zico SetEnv koha_CONF "/etc/koha3/koha-conf.xml" this is there in every virtual block
19:11 chris it needs to be different in each one
19:12 zico different in each & every "koha" word?
19:12 chris no
19:12 zico i hv changed each & every "koha" with "koha3" in /etc/koha3/koha-conf.xml file
19:13 chris zico
19:13 chris got to http://pastebin.com
19:14 zico do u need my koha-conf.xml file?
19:14 chris no
19:14 chris we need your koha-httpd.conf file
19:15 chris i want to see all your virtualhosts :)
19:18 zico ok
19:20 zico this is it
19:20 zico http://pastebin.com/m69913f29
19:21 chris SetEnv koha3_CONF "/etc/koha33/koha3-conf.xml"
19:21 chris thta line is wrong
19:21 chris it needs to eb SetEnv KOHA_CONF
19:22 zico ok..lemme check
19:22 zico :P
19:30 zico it bring me this error:
19:30 zico when i go 4 reloading the apache2 server....
19:30 zico damn!!
19:30 zico debian:/etc/apache2/sites-available# /etc/init.d/apache2 restart Restarting web server: apache2apache2: apr_sockaddr_info_get() failed for debian apache2: Could not reliably determine the server's fully qualified domain name, using 127.0.0.1 for ServerName apache2: apr_sockaddr_info_get() failed for debian apache2: Could not reliably determine the server's fully qualified domain name, using 127.0.0.1 for ServerName  failed!
19:30 zico apache2 says... "failed"!!! :(
19:37 wizzyrea ok, for one... is it koha3 or koha1 that your 2nd koha install lives in?
19:38 wizzyrea b/c your config file has a lot of koha3 in it, but no koha1.
19:39 wizzyrea i'm wondering if that's where you've gone wrong
19:39 zico itz koha3
19:39 zico :)
19:39 zico no.. actually.. my koha1 is different
19:39 zico actually.. this is my new koha.. & itz "koha3"
19:40 wizzyrea Hmm.
19:40 wizzyrea i copied two files... from /usr/share/koha  & named it /usr/share/koha1
19:40 wizzyrea [1:26p] zico:
19:40 wizzyrea nd.. from /etc/koha  & named /etc/koha1
19:41 wizzyrea [1:26p] zico:
19:41 wizzyrea i created two users.. root & koha1
19:41 wizzyrea [1:26p] zico:
19:41 wizzyrea & also two database koha & koha1
19:41 wizzyrea [1:26p] zico:
19:41 wizzyrea root has priviledge for koha & koha1 has all priviledge in koha1 database
19:41 wizzyrea [1:26p] zico:
19:41 wizzyrea i changed the koha-conf.xml for koha1 ... server
19:41 wizzyrea [1:27p] zico:
19:41 wizzyrea changed the database name from "koha" to "koha1" in there
19:41 wizzyrea [1:27p] zico:
19:41 wizzyrea & also changed the "user" and "password" as... "koha1" & "1234"
19:41 wizzyrea [1:28p] zico:
19:41 wizzyrea nd.. i can access this two servers.. with two different ports... say for first one... 192.168.1.254:80 & for second one... 192.168.1.254:89
19:41 wizzyrea this would seem to indicate otherwise.
19:41 zico yes... actually... i just wanna let u know tht... i am going 2 use another named than "koha"
19:41 zico :)
20:49 chris back
20:56 wizzyrea ok, question
20:56 wizzyrea is there ANY status for an item that will prevent it being checked in?
20:56 wizzyrea that would trigger a message similar to "this item cannot be checked in
20:57 gmcharlt wizzyrea: are you seeking to have that happen?
20:57 wizzyrea Well, it's one of several ways to skin a cat
20:57 wizzyrea er
20:57 gmcharlt wizzyrea: in a indy branches setup, it can be done, but that's the only circumstance IIRC
20:58 wizzyrea Interesting. I'm thinking about fines and withdrawn items (you may have talked to mickey about this stuff).
20:59 wizzyrea scenario: library has an item that is long overdue (60 days) they want to fine the tardy patron and consider the book gone. If the item should come back, they do not want the fine lifted from the patron's account. They do not want to check the item in.
21:00 wizzyrea the problems as the system currently is: 1. deleting the item outright accomplishes the "this item cannot be checked in" problem, but removes the fine description. Bad.
21:00 wizzyrea 2. changing the item to withdrawn allows the item to be checked in, and removes the fine. Wrong.
21:01 wizzyrea (even though it doesn't unset the withdrawn status)
21:01 wizzyrea so my thought was: create a withdrawn status that cannot be checked in (probably a big project) or
21:02 wizzyrea make the fines table look for the item in *both* the existing items and the deleted items table (no links if deleted, of course, and pruning of that table would obviously affect that reporting)
21:03 gmcharlt wizzyrea: of the options, I think it would be easier to handle it on the fines accounting end rather than preventing the checkout
21:03 wizzyrea That was what I thought as well
21:04 wizzyrea i mean, that's technically just a display
21:04 wizzyrea I also didn't know if the forthcoming fines fixes would address that
21:20 wizzyrea ok, i'm going to be a pest/nub: I'm looking at the deleted biblio/items tables in the structure documentation. displaying the title of a deleted item isn't an easy thing, is it?
21:30 gmcharlt wizzyrea: wouldn't say that - two step process; check to see if bib still exists, if so, grab title from biblio.title
21:30 gmcharlt if bib is deleted, grab it from deletedbiblio.title
22:24 chris well its all out in the open now
22:24 pianohacker chris: ?
22:24 chris email to the koha list
22:25 chris titled Support for Koha
22:25 pianohacker Ah, right
22:27 chris im gonna need more coffee i can tell
22:30 brendan heya pianohacker
22:30 pianohacker Hi, brendan
22:30 brendan just saying hi -- not much more to add
22:30 pianohacker Heh
22:30 gmcharlt hi brendan
22:30 brendan heya gmcharlt
22:30 brendan how's atlanta
22:31 gmcharlt not there yet - going up next week
22:31 brendan ok
22:31 brendan I'll be there towards the end of this month
22:31 brendan hopefully you break them all in for me :)
22:47 pianohacker gmcharlt: Confirmed that I have a 3.0 textual MARC record editor
22:48 pianohacker It does validate records by sending them to the server for parsing
22:48 gmcharlt pianohacker: I suggest throwing it out there as a branch, even if there are still glitches
22:48 pianohacker k
23:05 chris branches are good
23:05 chris specially public branches
23:06 pianohacker Now that I've finally gotten a github up, that should be fairly easy
23:06 chris *nod*
23:09 chris has anyone here integrated biblios with koha? i know it can be done in theory has anyone done it in practice?
23:09 pianohacker Yes, actually. It required some code hacking, but I was able to do it
23:09 pianohacker (it's been a while)
23:11 chris cool
23:11 chris days work? 2 days work, 2 weeks work?
23:11 brendan did it awhile ago, waiting for the next release.
23:11 chris :)
23:11 brendan I think it's still on .9
23:11 pianohacker I was able to do it in 4-8 hours
23:11 chris fab, ill go 6-12 then :)
23:12 pianohacker Note that item editing was not integrated (you'd have to add from biblios, then find in the catalogue, then add items from Koha)
23:12 chris righto
23:13 pianohacker (Gah, the directory naming is britrotting my brain) Heh. I was not very familiar with Koha 3.0 at that time, so you might be able to do it faster
23:13 brendan betcha chris cormack would help you out too.
23:14 chris ?
23:14 brendan whoops
23:14 brendan I meant the other chris
23:14 pianohacker :)
23:14 chris :)
23:14 chris yep true good point
23:15 brendan too many chris-c's involved in koha
23:15 chris heh
23:33 chris and so it begins
00:06 pianohacker brb bike ride
00:51 richard hi
00:52 pianohacker Hi, richard
00:52 richard hi pianohacker
00:53 pianohacker richard: I don't think I've ever asked. What do you do for Katipo?
00:54 richard the job is called 'business development manager' - so it's sort of a managerial job
00:54 pianohacker Get to do much coding?
00:54 richard nah. i've forgotten everything from "sam's teach yourself perl in 21 days"
00:55 richard the main sort of coding i did was bunging html into chris's perl
00:55 pianohacker You're probably a bit saner for it
01:33 Wizzyrea_ ...wow
01:41 chris wow indeed
02:05 chris ahh redbull, how i love you
03:03 Wizzyrea_ jdavidb, hi
03:03 jdavidb Wizzyrea_:   Hiya!  :D
03:16 pianohacker Hi, David, Liz
03:17 Wizzyrea_ jesse, you're up late
03:17 jdavidb Hey there, jesse!
03:17 pianohacker Hallo
03:18 pianohacker I am up late. Trying to finish an invoice
03:18 Wizzyrea_ oooh
03:18 Wizzyrea_ i'm watching excrement hitting impellers.
03:18 pianohacker mailing list?
03:18 Wizzyrea_ heh yea
03:19 pianohacker Ever so polite
03:19 Wizzyrea_ lol, this channel's logged >.>
03:19 Wizzyrea_ I have to be nice
03:20 jdavidb You're nice all the time, Liz.  
03:20 Wizzyrea_ clearly you have not seen me at my salty best
03:21 Amit hi brendan, chris
03:21 Amit good morning #koha
03:21 Amit hi jdavidb
03:21 Wizzyrea_ heya amit
03:22 pianohacker Hi, Amit
03:22 Amit heya Wizzyrea_, pianohacker
03:22 jdavidb Hi, Amit! :)
03:25 brendan heya Amit
03:25 brendan and all others :)
03:25 brendan heya there wizzyrea_ jdavidb
03:25 Wizzyrea_ yo :)
03:25 jdavidb howdy, brendan!
03:30 Wizzyrea_ hi jo
03:30 jdavidb Hello, Jo.  :)
03:30 brendan heya Jo
03:35 Amit heya Jo
03:42 pianohacker Good night (man it's much too late to be staring at the screen)
03:50 jdavidb Yayez!  My indexing run finished up, so I'm done for the night.  Back up again in five hours, to head for work.  To bed!  
04:36 Jo Hiya all
04:36 Jo (sorry - I'm terrible - I login then go and do something else without looking at whats happening :)
06:47 kf good morning #koha
06:58 nicomo morning kf
07:00 kf good morning nicomo
07:08 chris morning europe
07:16 kf hi chris
07:26 indradg__ chris, ping
07:28 chris heya indradg__
07:28 chris bbiab
07:28 chris putting kids to be
07:28 chris d
07:29 indradg__ chris, aah sure :)
07:49 chris back
07:51 chris indradg__: you wanted me?
07:52 kf interesting read on mailing lists today
08:01 paul_p kf: what are you speaking about ? "Support for Koha" ?
08:01 paul_p hello chris & kf & others
08:01 kf yes
08:01 kf and good morning paul
08:01 paul_p what's your opinion/feeling ?
08:01 chris hi paul and kf
08:02 paul_p thanks. Summer weather in Marseille.
08:02 kf I have a bad feeling when LibLime customers create kind of their own community outside of the koha community
08:02 paul_p kf: that's exactly it !
08:02 kf and when code is not given back or given back at a later point in time - koha develops so fast, will it be possible to integrate it into Koha then?
08:03 paul_p I would just change and say "LibLime and some of their customers ..."
08:03 paul_p kf++
08:03 paul_p you're fully right
08:04 paul_p I can leave with it, but i'm tired of josh speaking of the 60% of the contributed code. Because it's wrong
08:04 chris paul_p: at least its not 97% anymore
08:04 paul_p katipo created 100% of koha 1, I created 80% of koha 2, and LL created 60% of koha 3
08:05 chris which is what it was in the minutes :)
08:06 kf and I think their funding model (I didnt understand it all of it) sounds like what you have with proprietary vendors
08:06 paul_p kf: you should answer publicly on koha ML
08:06 paul_p the more answers this mail will result in, the better result we will have !
08:07 chris paul_p: in the good news front, has mason shown you this yet http://library.kapiticoast.govt.nz/ ?
08:07 kf so you get a separate koha version which perhaps will make it difficult to leave LL and pay not for your development and dont know what you exactly will get for your money?
08:08 paul_p mason++
08:08 paul_p (chris: nope I didn't saw that)
08:09 paul_p kf: the "main" problem is that it's LL that owns koha.org. So they can kick everybody out of the game if they want (but they won't do it, they'll just let things going nowhere)
08:11 kf thats bad, but I think the community can do something about it - and perhaps start a new web site if its necessary
08:11 kf we discussed translating the manual - but I think we will do something with the online help and I will try to contribute this templates back
08:12 paul_p kf: right. But that would be very "expensive" in terms of notoriouty
08:12 kf notoriouty?
08:12 chris notoriety
08:12 paul_p mmm... sorry (wanted to speak of notorious)
08:12 paul_p yep, sorry
08:13 chris kf: you understand that word? reputation
08:13 chris is similair
08:13 kf now I do, tried to look it up
08:15 kf you think people might still end up looking at koha.org
08:15 paul_p kf: dunno, but maybe. And anyway, that will be a pain.
08:16 kf I still hope a new web site will not be necessary
08:16 paul_p I can add that LL also own git, so they can do what they want with proposed patches. The only thing that they don't manage are the mailing lists (we -BibLibre- do), even if they have the DNS entry, of course.
08:17 kf perhaps it would be a good idea to involve the liblime customers into the discussion to know what they think about it
08:17 chris paul_p: thats not really true
08:18 chris they only own git.koha.org
08:18 chris thats the beauty with git, there are 100's of repo's
08:19 kf you can get all the data out of it, can you?
08:19 chris yep
08:19 paul_p chris: yep, but he has the "final cut" for patches on git.koha.org
08:19 chris galen does
08:20 paul_p that's why, if LL don't want to accept a patch, then, we are stuck
08:20 chris no, its not LL, its galen
08:20 chris unless LL want to try to kick out the release manager
08:20 indradg__ chris, and totally subvert the community process
08:21 chris galen had his first day at his new job today
08:21 chris and still committed to git.koha.org .. so until that changes, its business as usual
08:22 chris but in theory yes, they could lock galen out
08:22 chris but locking out the community elected release manager would be utter madness
08:25 magnusenger to me it sounds like LL wants to have it's own RM for it's own version of Koha?
08:27 chris well, the thing to remember is LL have only been around since 2005
08:27 chris and have had RM for 3.0 and 3.2 (until recently)
08:28 chris so unlike biblibre and katipo etc they havent had to deal with RM's outside their control
08:28 chris so are perhaps scared
08:29 chris but it is the reality of working in the FOSS world, you cant be in control all the time
08:29 kf and scared of their competitors?
08:30 chris *nod*
08:33 magnusenger to re-phrase paul_p: "if [the RM] don't want to accept a patch, then, we are stuck"
08:34 chris yep, true of every FOSS project
08:35 chris altho with git, you are way less stuck than you were with cvs
08:35 magnusenger so there can always be situations where a company develops something for a customer, but the dev is rejected by the RM
08:35 chris yep, altho it happens quite rarely
08:35 chris usually it is not rejected outright, but the implementation of it may be, until its fixed
08:36 nicomo magnusenger: you're quite right
08:36 nicomo hence the need for better communication between vendors and generally among developpers
08:37 nicomo prior to any developement taking place
08:37 chris this is why im happy to see all the enhancements being logged by jwagner on bugs.koha.org
08:37 nicomo taking about the features, etc
08:37 nicomo yes, that's exactly what we should aim for
08:37 nicomo magnusenger: if you discussed your intended dev beforehand with the community
08:38 nicomo you'll get feedback and avoid having it rejected afterwards
08:38 chris *nod*
08:38 chris and often you will get "oh i started on that, here take a look"
08:38 chris or, "have you thought about doing x when you do y there?"
08:40 nicomo but we've not been good at this in the last couple of years
08:40 nicomo still we have to
08:41 chris yes, we need to improve this
08:48 chris i think that more public WIP branches would help too
09:11 nahuel hi@all
09:12 chris hiya nahuel :)
09:26 kf hi nahuel
09:27 nahuel :)
09:36 Amit hi nahuel
09:39 gmcharlt hi folks
09:40 kf hi gmcharlt
09:41 chris good grief, its the man who never sleeps :)
09:41 gmcharlt look in a mirror, dude
09:42 gmcharlt ;)
09:42 chris hehe
09:42 chris touche
09:42 nicomo touché
09:43 nicomo I love when a language uses a word from another
09:43 chris like rendezvous
09:43 nicomo when the French say "rugbyman" for "rugby player" ;-)
09:43 chris or vice versa
09:44 nicomo nope
09:44 nicomo vice versa is latin
09:44 nicomo but vis a vis
09:45 nicomo my favorite is "coup de grace"
09:45 nicomo because it's so hard to pronounce in English
09:47 gmcharlt "koop de gracie" ;)
09:49 nicomo ˌkuË?də ˈɡrɑË?s in English whereas kudəɡÊ?as in French
09:49 nicomo the Ê? is difficult
09:56 paul_p gmcharlt: the "p" is silent in "coup de grace"
09:57 chris paul_p: i think he was making a joke :)
09:57 chris the hardest word i know is the swiss german word for cupboard
09:58 chris Chuchichäschtli
09:59 kf German word for squirrel is Eichhörnchen
09:59 kf try that :)
09:59 chris i like bat
09:59 kf bat?
09:59 kf Fledermaus?
10:00 chris yep
10:00 chris sounds so cool
10:00 chris sounds like flying mouse
10:00 chris easy to remember
10:00 chris :)
10:01 gmcharlt :)
10:05 indradg__ don't need to look so far... me (on indian-style british english) and my wife (on american english) can't even agree on the pronunciation of "schedule" =P
10:06 chris heh
10:06 chris skedule
10:06 chris shedule
10:07 indradg__ hhe
10:08 gmcharlt and then there's people like me, Americans who watched so much British TV at an impressionable age that there's no telling *what* accent we have ;)
10:08 chris hehe
10:09 chris its true
10:10 kf not sure if I want to know how my English accent would get described
10:13 magnusenger am I right in thinking that the general meeting will start in about 23 hours and 50 minutes? Still a bit confused by the time zones...
10:13 chris thats the time i have too magnusenger
10:13 kf ask wolfram alpha :)
10:14 magnusenger kf: hadnt thought about that! :-)
10:14 magnusenger thanks!
10:14 kf it shows the hours to midnight
10:18 chris hi schuster
10:20 gmcharlt you scared him off ;)
10:20 chris hehe
11:31 kf hi jwagner
11:31 jwagner Hi kf
11:33 chris hi jwagner
11:35 jwagner Morning Chris
11:37 chris thanks heaps for filing those enhancement bugs, very useful
11:37 jwagner There's more to come -- haven't had a chance to finish the list.
11:38 chris awesome
11:55 jwagner G'night chris
11:58 kf good nicht chris

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