IRC log for #koha, 2022-12-09

All times shown according to UTC.

Time S Nick Message
00:59 fridolin joined #koha
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07:05 marcelr joined #koha
07:05 marcelr hi #koha
07:05 marcelr bug 32417
07:05 huginn Bug https://bugs.koha-community.or[…]_bug.cgi?id=32417 minor, P5 - low, ---,, Needs Signoff , Cannot insert order: Mandatory parameter biblionumber is missing
07:08 marcelr i need a signoff too on bug 32399 (major; simple patch)
07:08 huginn Bug https://bugs.koha-community.or[…]_bug.cgi?id=32399 major, P5 - low, ---,, Needs Signoff , Database update for bug 30483 is failing
07:16 ashimema on it marcelr
07:16 marcelr great !
07:18 davidnind I think I can handle the first one, if that helps...
07:18 fridolin joined #koha
07:19 ashimema this is again all to do with bad deleted_* tables isn't it ☹️
07:19 ashimema maintaining constraints in perl never feels especially right..
07:19 ashimema but that's not going away any time soon.. so I get it.
07:19 davidnind just waiting for KTD to update ⏲️
07:21 marcelr great davidnind
07:22 ashimema oh
07:22 ashimema sorry.. I just did it 😜
07:22 marcelr ashimema: it is quite weird that this problem occurs with Maria 10.1 and not 10.4 or 5
07:22 ashimema feel free to add a second signoff though, it never hurts davidnind
07:22 ashimema that is strange
07:22 marcelr ashimema: talking about 32417 or 32399
07:23 ashimema I did 32417
07:23 marcelr but this approach seems to tackle it
07:23 ashimema just about to look at 3239
07:23 ashimema should the bug title be 'cannot cancel order' or similar...
07:23 marcelr 32417 is a nice example of two bugs hiding each other
07:23 ashimema it seems it's mostly around the cancel action rather than the store itself
07:24 marcelr its hard to get a good title there
07:24 ashimema yeah.
07:24 marcelr so i just used the warn
07:24 ashimema I agree
07:25 ashimema makes sense
07:25 ashimema y
07:26 davidnind ashimema++
07:26 marcelr ashimema++ davidnind++
07:26 marcelr i still have a larger one too :) bug 32334
07:26 huginn Bug https://bugs.koha-community.or[…]_bug.cgi?id=32334 enhancement, P5 - low, ---,, Needs Signoff , Sync comments in database with schema
07:26 marcelr quite a bunch of code but not affecting general operation
07:27 marcelr i should set it to medium patch
07:27 marcelr Koha::Database::Commenter->new->reset_to_schema;
07:28 marcelr it syncs all column comments in the database with kohastructure
07:28 ashimema nice
07:28 marcelr it helps you find the real problems by clearing the column diffs
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07:29 marcelr diffs on comments
07:29 reiveune hello
07:29 marcelr hi reiveune
07:30 ashimema that patch feels so strange for bug 32399..
07:30 huginn Bug https://bugs.koha-community.or[…]_bug.cgi?id=32399 major, P5 - low, ---,, Needs Signoff , Database update for bug 30483 is failing
07:30 ashimema db versions are fun aren't they
07:31 marcelr weird things happen
07:31 marcelr at first i unset FK checks but QA wasnt happy
07:32 marcelr so plan B is remove constraints, add them back later
07:33 ashimema I think the patch makes good sense once one wraps their head around it..
07:34 ashimema I sort of wish there was an easy way for users, from the UI, to say 'do the recommended action' rather than just warning, dieing and expecting a server admin to step in.
07:35 ashimema but that's not a problem with your patch.. that's a feature enhancement request 😛
07:35 marcelr yeah we already benefit from interrupting the installer a bit more user friendly
07:35 ashimema indeed
07:35 marcelr by catching exceptions etc
07:35 ashimema this is much more friendly
07:35 ashimema having the exceptions caught
07:36 ashimema and a nice clear advice
07:40 marcelr thx ashimema
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07:47 ashimema How would people feel about moving/adding OPACBaseURL up into the branches table?
07:47 ashimema I.e. allowing per branch opacs out of the box
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07:57 marcelr interesting idea ashimema
07:57 marcelr how do you differentiate technically?
07:58 marcelr subdomains?
07:58 davidnind For 32417 how do I generate the error? If I cancel the order and delete catalog record I don't see anything in the error logs. (tests now pass, so OK there)
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08:06 thibaud_g hello everybody :)
08:20 marcelr davidnind: the test shows the error now at least; I had the warning in my logs in 21.11; have no scenario to reproduce right away
08:22 davidnind :q
08:22 davidnind wrong window...
08:39 davidnind marcelr: figured it out I think, have added notes to the bug
08:40 marcelr great
08:40 marcelr thx for spending the additional time
08:43 davidnind sorry it took so long, my computer is "playing up" - looking forward to a new one which should arrive next week...
08:54 cait1 davidnind: new computers are fun - hope you will have a smooth switch to the new one :)
08:56 davidnind cait1: I'm looking forward to a faster processor and more memory (only have 8GB, going to 32GB), not looking forward to reinstalling everything and tidying all my files...
10:16 ashimema That's a nice boost
10:17 ashimema Yeah, subdomains or even entruely different domains marcelr
10:17 ashimema One would still need to do some work with vhosts I reckon
10:17 ashimema But it would alleviate some of the SetEnvIf stuff we currently do to achieve this
10:19 marcelr looking forward to your patches :)
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13:01 aude_c Hello!
13:01 cait1 helllo aude_c :)
13:04 aude_c How are you cait1? :)
13:05 aude_c Am I here at the wrong time for the Doc meeting? :-D
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13:36 davidnind hi aude_c
13:37 davidnind in about another hour and 1/2 -[…]iso=20221209T1500
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14:23 magnuse__ anyone else agree that the new "Edit" button on reports should be a split button, where the main action is to edit, and then duplicate and delete can be in the little dropdown on the side?
14:29 cait1 @later tell aude_c sorry, missed your question (was in another meeting) - hope you come back for docs meeting - 30 minutes now!
14:29 huginn cait1: The operation succeeded.
14:39 magnuse__ if a test plan gets really long, is it okay to just write "see bugzilla for test plan", or should it go in the commit no matter the length?
14:50 caroline_catlady I think in the commit is ok. It's easy to see there and bugzilla can get confusing when there are many comments
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14:59 * cait1 is here
14:59 lukeg joined #koha
15:01 caroline I am helping an intern, be there in a couple of minutes
15:02 marie-luce Hi everyone
15:03 caroline Hi all! ready?
15:04 cait1 yes :)
15:04 caroline #startmeeting Documentation IRC meeting 2022-12-09
15:04 huginn Meeting started Fri Dec  9 15:04:07 2022 UTC.  The chair is caroline. Information about MeetBot at
15:04 huginn Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.
15:04 huginn The meeting name has been set to 'documentation_irc_meeting_2022_12_09'
15:04 caroline #topic Introductions
15:04 caroline (please use "#info" in front of your introduction to have it show up in the automatic minutes)
15:04 caroline #info Caroline Cyr La Rose, inLibro, Quebec, Canada
15:04 marie-luce #info Marie-Luce Laflamme, inLibro, Montreal
15:05 davidnind #info David Nind, New Zealand
15:06 caroline ashimema, I think Aude is with you, rught? do you want to ping her?
15:06 cait1 #info Katrin Fischer, BSZ, Germany
15:06 ashimema She is indeed
15:07 ashimema as is Lucy
15:07 ashimema I've just pinged them both
15:07 caroline thanks!
15:07 ashimema they were certainly intended to attend
15:07 ashimema probably just lost trck of time
15:07 caroline Yeah I saw Aude's message earlier, that's why I pigned you
15:07 cait1 Aude was here earlier askign about the meeting, but I missed her
15:08 caroline me too :(
15:08 caroline I'll go on but they can join any time
15:08 ashimema hmm, neither of them are responding..
15:08 ashimema so yeah, go on without them
15:08 ashimema they'll join when they can
15:08 caroline #topic Review of action points
15:09 caroline Since there hasn't been a meeting in a while, we're starting over
15:09 caroline Thanks davidnind++ for organising this one!
15:09 caroline #info No action points, starting over!
15:10 caroline #topic Project updates
15:10 davidnind sorry about the late notice!
15:10 caroline I don't know If anyone wanted to take on a big project?
15:11 caroline I'm working on moving stuff from tools to cataloging to follow the new structure in Koha
15:11 caroline #info Caroline is moving cataloging tools from the tools chapter to the cataloging chapter
15:11 ashimema hugs caroline... apologies for doing that one and making docs a bit of a pain 😜
15:11 cait1 be right with you - finishing a phone call
15:12 caroline I have been a bit busy with upgrades and migrations lately so I haven't been able to work on it, much, but I'm getting there
15:12 davidnind I've (finally!) been working on a couple of projects - have added updates to the agenda
15:13 davidnind Automated screenshots: have something working, now just a case of adding "tests" to generate screenshots
15:13 caroline #info David is working on automated screenshots
15:13 davidnind Happy to demonstrate at the next meeting - once I've added a few more, and written some example tests for common types of screenshots
15:13 caroline #info David is also working on a manual reorganization
15:13 wahanui okay, caroline.
15:14 caroline oops, you will be forever working on reorganizing the manual it seems
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15:14 caroline David?
15:14 aude_c Hello, sorry for being late
15:14 caroline no, ok lol! I thought wahanui would answer me
15:14 davidnind Have also started some work on reorganising the contents - see bug 32391 - just added a screenshot, will shared a copy of the site for feedback
15:14 huginn Bug https://bugs.koha-community.or[…]_bug.cgi?id=32391 enhancement, P1 - high, ---, david, ASSIGNED , [DOCS] Reorganise the manual contents
15:15 davidnind hi aude_c!
15:15 marie-luce Do you have suggestions on where I could help?
15:15 caroline wow that is very nice davidnind!
15:15 davidnind is it a bit too radical?
15:16 caroline No!! I love it
15:16 cait1 i haven't looked, just keep in mind that we need to link from Koha :)
15:16 caroline I think the modules will stay the same from what I understand?
15:17 davidnind Yes - I haven't changed the underlying pages
15:17 ashimema looks lovely
15:17 davidnind https://bugs.koha-community.or[…]ent.cgi?id=144530
15:17 ashimema I really like that
15:18 davidnind Also just noticed all my spelling errors!
15:19 caroline what would be the next steps to get this into the real manual?
15:19 caroline Think we could get it ready for 23.05?
15:19 cait1 +1
15:21 davidnind Not too much more to do - just adding some text for the landing pages, and putting the contents under the right areas
15:22 davidnind I'll finish what I'm doing and then send around a message to the mailing list for feedback, if that would work?
15:22 cait1 sounds good
15:22 aude_c sure
15:22 cait1 davidnind++
15:22 cait1 :)
15:23 davidnind Some work to do on the areas where we don't have any content - like the What's new and Getting started
15:23 caroline Would it impact other modifications that we do? Like if I push my big move from tools to cataloging, will it impact how I should do it?
15:23 ashimema davidnind++
15:23 caroline yep davidnind++ definitely!
15:24 davidnind No - as I'm just basically changing the index page at the moment and adding some new pages that don't exist
15:24 cait1 if this affects mostly the contents page, that might not be a problem?
15:24 cait1 :)
15:24 caroline alright!
15:25 caroline Ok well, keep us updated and let us know if/how we can help
15:26 caroline I think automated screenshots will be a big plus too, especially with the interface change
15:26 davidnind action David to finish work on reorganizing the manual and adding a landing page - send out to the mailing list for feedback (expect it to be iterative)
15:26 caroline #action David to finish work on reorganizing the manual and adding a landing page - send out to the mailing list for feedback (expect it to be iterative)
15:26 davidnind oops!
15:26 caroline #chair davidnind
15:26 huginn Current chairs: caroline davidnind
15:26 lucyvh joined #koha
15:27 cait1 I have a translation issue i'd like to discuss... if that could go on agenda somewhere?
15:27 caroline not sure if you needed that...
15:27 * ashimema thinks you could branch early this cycle and then publish your work in progress manual early too..
15:27 davidnind no, I didn't put in a #
15:27 caroline cait1, maybe in the Content development guidelines (..items for discussion, including any work flow issues..
15:27 caroline )?
15:27 ashimema thus you could merge that re-organisation nice an early to get feedback without affecting the stable manual
15:28 cait1 let me know when it's a good moment? :)
15:28 caroline I also wanted to talk about branching
15:28 lucyvh Hi docs people - sorry I'm late
15:28 davidnind hi lucyvh!
15:28 cait1 it's all good, you can #info yourself still if you want
15:29 caroline Ok I added a couple of thing to the agenda...
15:29 caroline moving on?
15:29 cait1 do we have a link to agenda?
15:29 caroline crap sorry
15:30 caroline #link https://wiki.koha-community.or[…]eeting_2022-12-09
15:30 lucyvh #info lucy vaux-harvey PTFS Europe
15:30 caroline #topic What's been done so far
15:30 caroline A couple of months (?) ago we changed the system preference links
15:31 caroline We now have to link to the label, we can't link to the system preference itself
15:32 caroline iirc, the reason is that having headers as link targets made a bunch of errors when building the manual
15:32 aude_c #info Aude Charillon, PTFS Europe
15:32 caroline cait1, davidnind is this correct, do you remember?
15:33 cait1 sorry, was just editing the agenda
15:33 ashimema ho.. did I break something with the sysprefs stuff
15:33 ashimema I thought I'd made the situation better rather than worse?
15:33 cait1 it did resolve the errors, but I thinkt here was also a configuration change associated?
15:34 cait1 ashimema: this is a different thing, not what you did with the direct link to pages
15:34 ashimema phew
15:34 cait1 but you can no longer do ref::"prefname"
15:34 cait1 or shoudl not
15:34 caroline I'm looking for the gitlab issue, just a sec
15:35 cait1 I think we used some type of setting that auto-generated 'labels' for headings, but we had issues with translations and error handling
15:35 caroline this is what I'm talking about[…]anual/-/issues/18
15:35 davidnind that sounds right - you found a solution to getting rid of the duplicate label warning messages when buidling the manual
15:36 cait1 ah right, so if you had a heading like "summary" that appeared in mulitple places, it created an error too
15:36 cait1 because the headings and the auto-generated labels weren't unique then
15:36 caroline I also updated the reference guide on the wiki on how to link https://wiki.koha-community.or[…]ks#Internal_links
15:36 davidnind caroline++
15:36 cait1 caroline++
15:37 cait1 btw always happy to help with such clean-up tasks - if you have something similar let me know :)
15:37 caroline davidnind++ and cait++ for doing it so quickly! We managed to change all links to system preferences in an afternoon between the trhee of us
15:37 caroline (or in an evening, or morning)
15:37 cait1 loved the interaction
15:38 marie-luce davidnind++, cait++ and caroline++
15:38 caroline It was great teamwork!
15:38 cait1 and the manual now builts without errors!
15:38 caroline I haven't tried it recently, but it is now so much easier to see the "real" errors when building
15:39 ashimema nice
15:39 caroline #info links to system preferences have been changed in the manual
15:39 ashimema do let me know if you want ptfs-e help on those things too... lucyvh and aude don't lurk so much, but I can always poke them 😜
15:39 * ashimema just added a topic to the agenda after this one
15:39 caroline #info links to system preferences must now have the same format as links to everything else :ref:`SysPrefName <sysprefname-label>`
15:40 cait1 in the process we also found and fixed other errors like broken links, so overall a good thing
15:40 caroline #info this change, related to gitlab issue 18, resolved a lot of errors when building the manual
15:40 aude_c yes, we can easily be found ;-) Very happy to help, just need clear instructions as I'm not very comfortable using the gitlab web interface yet
15:41 caroline tbh, I'm not comfortable with the gitlab interface either lol
15:41 aude_c haha, that re-assures me a lot! Thank you
15:41 * ashimema noticed there's considerations on using markdown later and was going to talk about making contributing easier then too
15:41 cait1 with our big files it's often esier to edit locally - maybe that can be fixed as we go along with new toc etc
15:42 davidnind there isn't an easy way to keep your fork up-to-date now, as mirroring is now a paid feature
15:42 cait1 davidnind: about your earlier topic: i think there is tons of screenshots to do... if this is something you could teach me and it makes sense, I'd be happy to help
15:42 cait1 i just have no idea about Cypress etc right now
15:42 ashimema tl:dr I think we should stop encouraging use of gitlab editors and start advocating local more using nicer clear tools instead
15:42 davidnind so basically, you would have to fork each time, if you didn't want to set things up locally
15:42 ashimema indeed
15:42 caroline I think ashimema and I managed to get our mirrors going no?
15:43 ashimema vscode has some nice options for rst too
15:43 ashimema it's something you can still do if you forked before they changed their policies caroline.. but I don't know how long that will last
15:43 aude_c erm... what do you mean by setting things up locally?
15:43 caroline ok, ok... I have my setup made so that I don't need it
15:44 ashimema editing a copy of the manual on your own PC aude_c
15:44 aude_c does that mean Martin will have to spend some time with Lucy and I again to sort us out? :D
15:44 ashimema and then posting the change up
15:44 cait1 then you can use your favourite editor basically
15:44 ashimema instead of trying to use the gitlab editor..
15:44 aude_c ok
15:44 caroline aude_c, https://wiki.koha-community.or[…]sitory_and_editor
15:44 ashimema I find the gitlab editor changes too quickly and is rather difficult to use
15:44 cait1 ashimema: I am sure ashimema would be happy to spend time with you ;)
15:45 ashimema yup
15:45 caroline But yeah, if ashimema could set you up, after that it's a couple of simple commands
15:45 davidnind I have experimented with using "GitPod" - basically gives you VSCode in the browser (don't have to install anything locally), you still have to use git though... (and is not quite open source - you get 50 free hours of editing)
15:45 aude_c thanks
15:45 * ashimema is actually going to get the new dev team here to start contributing too..
15:45 thibaud_g joined #koha
15:45 ashimema aim being all submissions from ptfs-e come with docs submissions included
15:45 davidnind ptfs-e++
15:45 caroline ptfs-e++ ashimema++ for ambition!
15:45 cait1 if someone write docs and just needs help shaping them up for a git submittion, I am happy to help too
15:46 cait1 I am not the best "writer" myself, but know the technical bits
15:46 ashimema I also now have a process that can take a google doc and turn it into rst without too much extra manual interaction in between
15:46 ashimema that is soooooooo much easier to work with
15:46 cait1 oh that's is interesting
15:46 cait1 coudl you share?
15:46 cait1 caroline: be ready to action him ;)
15:46 ashimema once I write it up, sure
15:47 ashimema that's how we did ERM and Bundles submissions
15:47 * cait1 might have had to many meetings today already, sorry if I am being a little silly today
15:47 caroline lol!
15:47 ashimema what topic are we on.. I've lost strack
15:48 cait1 Waht's been done so far
15:48 cait1 but we moved into making it easier to edit I guess?
15:48 caroline yeah, I'm a bit lost to... bad chair!
15:48 cait1 so maybe we shoudl move on officially .)
15:48 caroline alight ? ashimema I think?
15:48 cait1 caroline: I think we are to blame
15:48 ashimema I added 'dashboard' to the agenda very late.. you may have missed it..
15:48 davidnind I'll have a go at updating/finishing the Git guide - may need some help from the Git Gurus though
15:48 ashimema in short.. I added a documentation team leaderboard the other day..
15:49 luvyvh joined #koha
15:49 ashimema it needs a little more work though as currently it only picks from the status change
15:49 cait1 ashimema++
15:49 ashimema and doesn't know about the 'docs' section of bugzilla
15:49 caroline #info Martin added Documentation leaderboard to
15:49 ashimema but it's a start.. hopefully it'll encourage a bit of gamification of manual editing
15:50 cait1 it also helps make people's work visible, love it
15:50 ashimema it rewards even just going through the 'Needs documentation' queue and triaging.. i.e. deciding it doesn't need a change so marking as RESOLVED
15:50 ashimema if you want to appear, when you do a docs thing, remember to update the bugzilla status to show it's been submitted 🙂
15:51 ashimema happy to accept any idea's on how to improve that process.. reduce the pain in any way
15:51 ashimema that's all i had to say
15:51 caroline #info to appear on the board, you need to change the status from Needs Documenting to RESOLVED
15:52 caroline Cool! Thanks ashimema++ !
15:52 davidnind ashimema++
15:52 caroline You do so many things behind the scenes
15:53 * ashimema might be a bit addicted to Koha ;P
15:53 caroline #topic Content development guidelines
15:53 caroline davidnind, Any interest in being able to use Markdown to make it easier to contribute (for new sections anyway) - have been experimenting locally using the MyST parser
15:54 cait1 how would that work? would we need to make changes to the build process?
15:54 cait1 also translations scripts etc.?
15:54 ashimema honestly.. I love markdown.. but I don't think it's different enough to rst to really warrant it..
15:54 cait1 hm it's a point
15:55 cait1 i think markdown is also more a thnk devs know already, but others might still have to learn
15:55 davidnind it basically lets you use Markdown (with some constraints) for new pages - basically a package like the theme - was really simple to setup
15:55 ashimema personally I'd stick with rst and instead of trying to introduce markdown, focus on what editors can do to help people..
15:55 ashimema like using google docs and then running it through a script to convert to RST..
15:55 ashimema or using a more wysiwyg editor for rsy in vscode.
15:56 * ashimema has been experimenting a little with vscode plugins and they do make the process a little simpler.. not quite WYSIWYG yet.. but closer
15:57 cait1 It woudl be nice, but wonder if it coudl also be confusing to someone
15:57 ashimema google docs is by far the easiest for end users.. but the little fixes required after using pandoc to convert it to rst are vaguely erksome.. but not terrible
15:57 cait1 you'd have to learn 2 syntax depending on what you want to edit
15:57 ashimema cait1++
15:57 davidnind I personally think it is easier using markdown than rst, headings are a lot easer - but apart from links/references pretty much similar
15:57 ashimema that's my thoughts too
15:58 cait1 but if we want to do it, i'd love a test run with the tarnslation tools done first
15:58 cait1 because they can be finicky too
15:58 cait woudl be switching the whole manual be an option?
15:58 cait are there rst features that don't transport to markdown?
15:59 davidnind hadn't thought of that for translation - happy to see what is required
15:59 cait like... creating our labels or so? I don't really know, just wondering what we should check on for a switch
16:00 caroline What is the + of a switch? Is it just the headers?
16:00 davidnind I've had a couple of goes at converting using command line tools - seemed pretty straight forward
16:01 luvyvh I find rst fine for the small edits I usually do
16:02 davidnind I just think it is a bit more straight forward, one less thing to learn - headers, paragraphs, links/refers/images/notes/warnings etc
16:03 davidnind Happy to leave for the moment if you are okay with rst
16:03 cait I think using both in parallel... might not be ideal, but I'd be open for switching to markdown for the whole manual
16:03 caroline Do we have a consensus that rst is not that bad and a switch would require a lot of tweaks?
16:04 davidnind I'll do some more work - and share a copy - no real tweaks required 🙂
16:04 caroline We are already overboard on time, but I think since this is the first meeting in a while, it's ok to go over?
16:04 cait ok for me
16:04 davidnind I'm OK
16:04 * ashimema will be around a little longer too
16:04 luvyvh I can stay for another 10 mins
16:05 caroline ok, so is there a decision about markdown?
16:05 cait maybe revisit?
16:06 davidnind Happy to revisit once I've done some more work, but consensus seems to be to stay with rst
16:06 caroline #action davidnind to check scripts and translations tweaks for a switch to markdown and report back
16:07 caroline is that ok?
16:07 davidnind caroline++
16:07 caroline Next is Translation issues for system preferences - Bug 29063 cait?
16:07 huginn Bug https://bugs.koha-community.or[…]_bug.cgi?id=29063 major, P5 - low, ---, david, ASSIGNED , [DOCS] Manual: Translation issue with repeated strings in system preferences
16:07 cait Right, maybe this is a Gemran issue
16:07 cait So we have something like: Asks: ___ cash registers with the accounting system to track payments.
16:08 cait with ___ being Don't use, Use
16:08 cait I can't change where the ___ goes in Koha, so I often don't do a literal translation of use/don't use
16:08 cait to make the grammar work
16:08 cait that's means... my Don't use/Use translate to a lot of different things
16:09 cait but... in the manual translations, they only show up one time for all preferences...
16:09 cait so I am stuck
16:09 cait which is the main reason we haven't finished the manual translation to German yet
16:09 cait it just doesn't work for the preferences
16:09 caroline Hm... it's a bit tricky
16:09 cait are we stuck on how we format those?
16:09 cait I mean... could we imagie doing something like...
16:10 cait [Use|Don't Use] cash registers with the accounting system to track payments. Default: Use or so?
16:10 cait instead of the multi-line thing?
16:10 caroline mkay, what about those with more options thatn two?
16:10 cait good question
16:11 caroline like opac|staff interface|staff interface and opac|none
16:11 cait I am happy to rewrite to whatever... but I need the strings to differentiate more
16:11 cait and hoped you'd have ideas...
16:11 cait for Koha the po files are built in a way that allows it, but the manual doesn't reflect that
16:12 cait the pref strigs for one pref are all separate, even same strings are not mixed together
16:12 cait because I believe not only German had that issue...
16:12 caroline I understand the problem, I'm just not sure how to go about solving it
16:12 aude_c no, I can imagine it happening in many languages
16:13 cait is there a way to add context maybe?
16:13 cait like we started to do in koha?
16:13 caroline We could ask julian maybe?
16:13 caroline I think he was the one who did the context in Koha
16:13 cait it might be tied to TT
16:14 cait as said, I'd be happy to take on the task to update the manual for all the prefs - but I need some help figuring out a solution
16:14 caroline #info The problem in bug 29063 is that while in Koha strings for each syspref are separate and can be translated differently, in the manual, they are all bunched together
16:14 huginn Bug https://bugs.koha-community.or[…]_bug.cgi?id=29063 major, P5 - low, ---, david, ASSIGNED , [DOCS] Manual: Translation issue with repeated strings in system preferences
16:14 davidnind so we need to indicate that the option values should be translated individually, so they can be done in context?
16:15 cait if we want to keep the current format I think so
16:15 cait #link[…]spreferences.html for an example
16:15 cait every line goes in po, lines that are exactly the same, can only be tranlstaed ones
16:15 cait once
16:16 cait Example: CheckPrevCheckout - Do, Do not ...
16:16 cait a Do without context... is hard, can be mulitple things really
16:17 cait the context also need to be visible in the po of course... so you see which pref you are trnslating it for
16:17 caroline #info current options 1) write the system preference descriptions as "[Use|Don't use] blah blah" 2) somehow add context to the strings like we do in Koha 3) somehow change how the strings are extracted so that each syspref is extracted individually like in Koha
16:17 caroline does that summarized it?
16:17 cait yep
16:17 cait nicely
16:17 cait as said, happy to volunteer for the foot work... but need help :)
16:18 caroline We can do 1) on our own, but we need dev for 2 and 3
16:18 caroline I'll add the options to the bz
16:18 cait thank you
16:18 cait maybe it will trigger some ideas/attention too
16:19 reiveune bye
16:19 reiveune left #koha
16:19 cait ok to move on
16:19 caroline Branching was my topic
16:20 caroline I know we have this debate every cycle
16:20 cait heh
16:20 caroline Do we branch right away at the same time as Koha, even if the manual doesn't reflect that version of Koha, or do we wait later?
16:21 cait wodners if the manual link still works without branching
16:21 cait I'll quickly check in oe of the demos
16:21 caroline I said before that we don't have the (wo)manpower to cherry-pick everything like they do in Koha
16:22 caroline So branching early would mean that the manual for that version would not reflect 100% the functionalities in Koha, this is already the case however since we are so behind
16:22 cait 22.11 links to the manual nicely it looks like: works
16:22 caroline wasn't it for translations that you wanted to branch?
16:23 davidnind There are about 90 odd bugs in the needs documenting queue, so I would suggest leaving for a little
16:23 cait hm yes, that's a thing
16:23 cait there are no translated manuals before branching
16:23 davidnind My focus for the next little while will be working through these
16:23 cait bit, this appears to still work at least:[…]html/serials.html
16:24 caroline pros of branching early: access to translations
16:24 caroline pros of branching late: more functions are documented
16:24 davidnind I'm still confused about how things should happen https://wiki.koha-community.or[…]lating_the_manual
16:24 caroline cons of branching early: little chance of every functionality being cherry-picked for each version
16:25 cait we also need to push po files to the repo again - those you see above should have been mostly translated actually :(
16:25 cait looking at the wiki link davidnind posted:
16:25 cait 4. Translation files and preview versions of manual updated each night  > this is no longer happening
16:26 cait the latest versions have no nightly preview - the last is 21.05
16:26 cait so at the moment... if people translate, there is nowhere they can see their translations
16:26 cait and the website manuals are terribly out of date - not reflecting the work doen at all
16:26 caroline We need to tell bernardo about this one?
16:27 cait i did
16:27 caroline ok
16:27 cait I don't think it#s going ot happen/be fixed soon
16:27 cait maybe translations shoudl go on agenda for next time
16:28 caroline when you say the website manuals are out of date, you mean on translations or on actual content?
16:28 cait but we shoudl refresh po files on the different branches (will add to agenda as a topic for next time)
16:28 cait translations
16:28 wahanui translations is another endpoing IMO
16:28 caroline ok
16:28 cait they are build from the manual repo, so the contents are correct
16:28 cait but we don't transfer the translation work into the manual repo
16:28 caroline #action add manual translations on agenda for next meeting
16:30 caroline still no decision on branching though... we can do like this meeting and start fresh for this cycle with a new branch and try to stay up-to-date?
16:30 cait maybe a month would be ok
16:30 cait but if there is not much action on catching up on features, better to branch maybe
16:30 caroline I can try to cherry-pick if it's clear in the merge message, but I can't guarantee I will always do it, especially if there are a lot and/or conflicts
16:31 cait that's fair
16:31 davidnind I'll make a concerted effort to get the needs documenting queue down from 90 - all of these relate to 22.11
16:31 caroline Ok maybe we can branch in January?
16:32 caroline There isn't anything being pushed in Koha for 23.05 now anyway
16:32 davidnind OK with me, if everyone else is OK with that?
16:32 caroline that I know of
16:32 cait +1
16:32 caroline yup of let's go with that
16:32 cait are we aiming for monthly meetings?
16:32 cait so we could put a reminder for nex
16:32 cait t
16:32 caroline #agreed branching for 23.05 will happen in January 2023
16:32 caroline #action caroline needs to branch manual in january
16:32 cait heh
16:33 caroline I think we should do more frequent meetings so that we don't do 2hour meetings each time lol!
16:33 davidnind +10
16:33 caroline #topic Next steps
16:34 caroline #link General documentation tasks https://bugs.koha-community.or[…]&v2=Documentation
16:34 caroline #link Needs documenting https://bugs.koha-community.or[…]y_format=advanced
16:34 caroline #info priority should be on the "needs documenting" status for bugs pushed in 22.1
16:35 caroline So if you're not sure what to do , go to that second link :)
16:36 caroline #topic Set time of next meeting
16:37 caroline Is this a good day? friday?
16:37 cait friday is not ideal at this time
16:37 cait at least here people often leave early
16:38 caroline I don't see the dev and general meetings in the agenda, what day are they on?
16:38 cait wednesdays usually
16:38 caroline just to avoid conflict and meeting-itis
16:38 davidnind I think it was "Friday" because I made a mistake..., so maybe the Thursday?
16:38 caroline ok so thursday?
16:38 cait +1
16:38 caroline second week of january? or is that too early?
16:39 caroline maybe third week?
16:39 caroline Jan 19?
16:39 cait +1
16:39 caroline this time is good for me, what about europe?
16:39 caroline and NZ, I guess this is the middle of the night?
16:40 cait 4pm works for me - I think anything arlier is too hard to nz (even this is bad)
16:40 cait 4 am for davidnind i think?
16:40 davidnind I'm happy to get up early once every month, so not na issue for me
16:40 davidnind it is
16:40 caroline ok sorry about that davidnind! :( You are way more dedicated than I am
16:41 davidnind as long as the time works for you all, I'm OK
16:41 cait might need to see how things change with daylight savings again, but we should be good for a while now then
16:42 caroline #info Next meeting: 19 January 2023, 15 UTC
16:42 caroline #endmeeting
16:42 huginn Meeting ended Fri Dec  9 16:42:55 2022 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)
16:42 huginn Minutes:        https://meetings.koha-communit[…]-12-09-15.04.html
16:42 huginn Minutes (text): https://meetings.koha-communit[…]2-12-09-15.04.txt
16:42 huginn Log:            https://meetings.koha-communit[…]09-15.04.log.html
16:43 davidnind caroline++
16:43 caroline thanks everyone! let's get this manual on the road! :)
16:43 cait caroline++ davidnind++ lucyvh++ aude_c++
16:44 caroline caroline++ davidnind++ lucyvh++ aude_c++ cait++ ashimema++ <3
16:44 huginn caroline: Error: You're not allowed to adjust your own karma.
16:44 caroline oops! I just copied cait's message lol
16:44 caroline davidnind++ lucyvh++ aude_c++ cait++ ashimema++ <3
16:44 caroline there we go!
16:45 caroline Who do I need to ping to run the script?
16:46 cait tcohen maybe, but the script appears broken still
16:46 cait the general irc on the wiki hasn't linked / no new page was created
16:48 caroline Didn't think the meeting would go so much over... Still 0-0 Brazil-Croatia at 1 minute before the end!
16:48 davidnind I don't think it is working properly yet - last time I ran it I basically had to do manually
16:48 cait heh
16:48 caroline Hopefully all the dramam is still top come
16:48 caroline *drama
16:48 davidnind Will try again, and add manually if it doesn't
16:53 aude_c sorry, had to duck out for another meeting and catching up now
16:53 aude_c Thanks! See you next time
16:53 davidnind off topic:[…]iving-focused.gif
16:54 caroline cute!
16:54 caroline I recently found this website It helps when things get too stressful
16:55 davidnind nice!
17:05 davidnind aude_c lucyvh marie_luce - thanks for attending the docs meeting!
17:17 cait bye all and have a nice weekend!
17:17 cait left #koha
17:18 fridolin joined #koha
17:51 lukeg joined #koha
18:17 lukeg Curious if anyone can recreate this: https://bugs.koha-community.or[…]_bug.cgi?id=32442
18:17 huginn Bug 32442: normal, P5 - low, ---, koha-bugs, NEW , Invalid Template Toolkit in notices can cause errors
18:18 cait[m] I have seen explosions, but not on the start page - which notice did you edit?
18:19 lukeg cait[m]: I was testing something else in AUTO_RENEWALS_DGST when this happened to me
18:19 lukeg but I can recreate by using any notice
18:19 lukeg just have to start with some TT that is invalid
18:19 cait[m] maybe it depends on the type of error
18:20 cait[m] or type of TT mistake you make
19:27 drbone joined #koha
23:44 fridolin joined #koha

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