IRC log for #koha, 2018-01-24

All times shown according to UTC.

Time S Nick Message
00:25 wizzyrea tcohen: thanks for all of that - really helpful <3
00:25 wizzyrea humbug he's not here
00:26 wizzyrea @later tell tcohen thanks for the advice, really helpful <3
00:26 huginn wizzyrea: The operation succeeded.
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05:51 paxed it doesn't seem like Makefile.PL obeys a command line parameter like "--db_tls no"??
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06:27 saa is it possible to change koha patron category code details one of the library has added . while defining category code and after upgrading koha is not allowing to edit those patrons hw this problem can be solved
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06:50 BobB saa it should always be possible to edit a patron's category code
06:50 BobB if you have permissions
06:51 BobB have you just upgraded? clear the browser cache perhaps?
06:51 saa will clearing browser cache solve issue
06:51 saa i dont think
06:51 saa from where can i create category code
06:51 saa category code hw to edit
06:52 BobB er, on the Koha Administration page?
06:52 BobB or in the Patron Details page to change the patron's cateogory
06:53 BobB you need to be a bit clearer about your exact problem
07:03 saa we cannot change category code text right once it is created
07:04 saa there is no edit option in koha admin for changing category code
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07:18 sjamso I am using koha 3.20. Now I want to use the latest koha i.e koha 17.11. But the issue is I cannot upgrade to new one with the old database. There is problem while dumping the old database to new koha system. Can anyone help with this. I installed the koha 17.11 on ubuntu 16.04.3
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07:24 LibraryClaire saa: to edit patron categories go to administration. Under the heading Patrons and Circulation is the option 'Patron categories'
07:24 LibraryClaire saa: you can edit and create categories there
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07:29 reiveune hello
07:29 wahanui privet, reiveune
07:29 saa the code which is already created that cannot be edited
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07:37 LibraryClaire saa: then you will need to create a new patron category with the code you want and use the patron batch modification tool to move patrons into the new category
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07:43 eythian hi
07:43 wahanui bidet, eythian
07:43 alex_a bonjour
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08:06 fridolin hi
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08:27 tuxayo Hi Koha \o
08:29 LibraryClaire hi tuxayo
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08:54 LibraryClaire anyone else missing the 'diff' view on bugzilla?
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09:42 * andreashm waves
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12:22 josef_moravec hi #koha
12:24 andreashm hi josef_moravec
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12:41 oleonard Hi gang
12:41 josef_moravec hi oleonard
12:41 wahanui hi oleopard
12:43 eythian hi oleopard
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12:54 LibraryClaire hi oleonard
12:54 wahanui hi oleopard
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13:15 tcohen morning #koha
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13:16 oleonard Anyone here seen solutions for the process of transferring items from a "new" shelf to another specific shelving location?
13:16 oleonard Catalogers identify the correct shelving location for an item, but then it should go to the "new" shelf for a certain period of time.
13:17 oleonard How to know what the correct "original" shelving location is?
13:22 tcohen oleonard: add a tmp_shelving_location attribute
13:22 tcohen hehe
13:25 kidclamp course reserves oleonard?
13:26 kidclamp or automatic item modifications by age, and shove the real location in a secondary field?
13:27 oleonard I was definitely hoping for, "Oh didn't you know about this feature which does exactly what you want?"
13:32 tuxayo Has something changed on Bugzilla? It seems that I can't tag a comment obsolete now.
13:32 tuxayo This might be related to the message of LibraryClaire few hours ago «anyone else missing the 'diff' view on bugzilla?»
13:32 LibraryClaire hullo
13:33 LibraryClaire yeah I was trying to obsolete something earlier and couldn't figure out how so I had a conversation with myself in the comments instead
13:36 LibraryClaire as well as the diff view being gone
13:40 kidclamp It's a great idea oleonard, would you like to sponsor a development? ;-)
13:40 oleonard kidclamp: I would if I could go back in time to one year ago and do it then
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13:41 * kidclamp checks ebay for deloreans
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13:49 eythian[…]elorean-runs-perl <-- kidclamp
13:52 kidclamp neat!
13:52 kidclamp bug 20086
13:52 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=20086 major, P5 - low, ---, koha-bugs, NEW , AddRenewal is not executed as a transaction and can results in partial success and doubled fines
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14:07 tcohen Joubu++ # koha-plack --rebugger pushed!
14:07 tcohen \o/
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14:10 * LeeJ waves
14:10 LeeJ hi #koha
14:12 LibraryClaire hi LeeJ
14:13 LeeJ hi LibraryClaire
14:13 tcohen hi LeeJ LibraryClaire
14:13 LeeJ hi tcohen
14:13 LibraryClaire hi tcohen
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15:37 tuxayo Hi, is there a wiki page where we can put debugging tricks and resources? (Koha specific and general Perl ones)
15:41 oleonard If you dont find one, please make one tuxayo. That sounds useful.
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15:48 tuxayo oleonard: good, I'll start a draft. I have few things in text files that could be useful for someone learning Perl (actually I am, that why I document these things ^^)
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15:58 tuxayo see you tomorrow!
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16:09 LeeJ I second it that a page like that would be really useful
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16:18 mtompset Greetings, #koha.
16:18 mtompset @seen tcohen
16:18 huginn mtompset: tcohen was last seen in #koha 2 hours, 4 minutes, and 49 seconds ago: <tcohen> hi LeeJ LibraryClaire
16:29 tcohen hi mtompset
16:29 mtompset tcohen: I'm looking at bug 18336
16:29 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=18336 normal, P5 - low, ---, tomascohen, Needs Signoff , Use utf8mb4 instead of utf8 for MySQL tables, columns, and connections
16:29 mtompset And I've got this massive question.
16:29 mtompset Why 191?
16:29 tcohen I'm aware
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16:30 tcohen index size for VARCHAR on InnoDB has a max size, in bytes, of 767 bytes (or similar)
16:30 mtompset Okay, but 767 > 255.
16:30 mtompset OH...
16:30 tcohen utf8 uses 3 bytes for each char, and utf8mb4, 4
16:31 tcohen thus smaller max size
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16:31 mtompset 767/4 ~= 191 ... okay...
16:32 tcohen mtompset: this is good literature about it
16:32 tcohen[…]e-conversion.html
16:32 mtompset Thanks for the explaination. I'll comment on it, and then sign off after testing. :)
16:34 tcohen mtompset: I change the index size everywhere
16:34 tcohen BUT
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16:34 tcohen for tags_* I also changed the column size
16:35 tcohen because I couldn't find a way to make it work
16:35 mtompset Right. I get it.
16:35 tcohen ideally it should be like the rest of them
16:35 tcohen but I didn't manage
16:35 tcohen maybe you have better luc
16:35 tcohen k
16:35 tcohen I did it like that because it doesn't really matter :-D
16:35 mtompset So technically, shouldn't all the other varchar 255's be 191 as well?
16:35 mtompset For tags, it doesn't. :)
16:36 mtompset anyways... I get it now. Thanks for the explanation.
16:40 mtompset oleonard++ # thanks for telling me about the xulrunner version of chatzilla.
16:40 mtompset The firefox quantum update just bleeped my chatzilla add on in my other machine.
16:40 * oleonard is a longtime fan
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16:42 mtompset By the way... the overnight build is 17.06.x and not 17.12.x for the kohadevbox.
16:42 mtompset Who do I ask to update that?
16:42 mtompset Wait... I mean the default experimental build that comes with kohadev.
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17:09 MartiF Morning! I have a potentially super silly question about SIP messages if anyone has a second.
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17:12 reiveune bye
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19:52 kidclamp meeting in a bit, who's excited?
19:53 kidclamp qaers?
19:53 kidclamp qa team?
19:53 wahanui i guess qa team is hunting all the bugs!
19:53 kidclamp hmmm..I know there is magic for pinging all the pings
19:53 kidclamp rmaints?
19:53 wahanui it has been said that rmaints is kidclamp (17.11), fridolin (17.05), rangi (16.11)
19:53 kidclamp qateam?
19:53 kidclamp qa superfriends?
19:53 kidclamp qa?
19:53 wahanui qa is Quality Assurance?
19:54 kidclamp qa_team?
19:54 wahanui qa_team is alex_a jajm marcelr khall kidclamp tcohen josef_moravec
19:55 mtompset kidclamp: I'm not excited about a meeting.
19:55 mtompset I'm excited about being able to use emojis for passwords!
19:55 mtompset bug 18336
19:55 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=18336 normal, P5 - low, ---, tomascohen, Signed Off , Use utf8mb4 instead of utf8 for MySQL tables, columns, and connections
19:55 kidclamp mtompset: humansnack
19:55 khall[…]?resize=180%2C180
19:56 kidclamp 🍺🍴😴
20:00 kidclamp #startmeeting Development IRC meeting 24 January 2018
20:00 huginn Meeting started Wed Jan 24 20:00:23 2018 UTC.  The chair is kidclamp. Information about MeetBot at
20:00 huginn Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.
20:00 Topic for #koha is now  (Meeting topic: Development IRC meeting 24 January 2018)
20:00 huginn The meeting name has been set to 'development_irc_meeting_24_january_2018'
20:00 kidclamp #Topic Introductions
20:00 wahanui #info wahanui, a bot that has become sentient
20:00 Topic for #koha is now Introductions (Meeting topic: Development IRC meeting 24 January 2018)
20:00 kidclamp #info Nick Clemens, byWater Solutions
20:00 wizzyrea #info liz rea, Catalyst IT
20:00 aleisha #info Aleisha Amohia, Catalyst IT
20:01 kidclamp hi catalyst!
20:02 khall #info Kyle M Hall, ByWater Solutions
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20:03 kidclamp hmm..small crowd - forge ahead or reschedule? we can wait a bit too
20:03 thd how many of us are there now?
20:04 kidclamp with you 5
20:04 thd 5 is not terrible
20:05 kidclamp I just odn't know if there are people too represent the topics in the agenda
20:05 kidclamp forging ahead :-)
20:05 thd I was just going to raise that.
20:05 kidclamp #Topic Announcements
20:05 Topic for #koha is now Announcements (Meeting topic: Development IRC meeting 24 January 2018)
20:05 kidclamp floor is open
20:06 wizzyrea nice work on the "don't store bugzilla passwords in the clear" A+
20:06 thd #info Thomas Dukleth, Agogme, New York City
20:06 kidclamp yes, +1
20:07 wizzyrea Aleisha did you have any comments from academy week, good or bad?
20:07 kidclamp #link https://wiki.koha-community.or[…]g_24_January_2018 Agenda
20:07 kidclamp #info kudos for work on not storing BZ passwords in plain text
20:08 wizzyrea i guess on to 18.05 stuff?
20:09 kidclamp #topic Update from the Release manager (18.05)
20:09 Topic for #koha is now Update from the Release manager (18.05) (Meeting topic: Development IRC meeting 24 January 2018)
20:09 kidclamp Joubu is not here - I think he wants more QA and offers free hugs
20:09 aleisha oops sorry, Academy was awesome and the community was a huge help
20:09 wizzyrea hugs for patches, seems fair trade
20:10 kidclamp #info Joubu could not make meeting, no updates
20:10 kidclamp #topic Updates from the Release Maintainers
20:10 Topic for #koha is now Updates from the Release Maintainers (Meeting topic: Development IRC meeting 24 January 2018)
20:10 kidclamp #info Academy was awesome and the community was a huge help
20:10 kidclamp #info 17.11.02 and 17.05.08 released today
20:10 kidclamp that's the big news
20:10 wizzyrea \o/
20:11 kidclamp #topic Updates from the QA team
20:11 Topic for #koha is now Updates from the QA team (Meeting topic: Development IRC meeting 24 January 2018)
20:11 kidclamp just working where I can
20:12 kidclamp #info every day rhymes with QA day: e.g. Monday is QA day, Tuesday is QA day....
20:12 kidclamp QA Monday, QA Tuesday etc. if you prefer
20:12 kidclamp #topic General development discussion (trends, ideas, ...)
20:12 Topic for #koha is now General development discussion (trends, ideas, ...) (Meeting topic: Development IRC meeting 24 January 2018)
20:12 kidclamp Bug 17241
20:12 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=17241 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, kyle, Signed Off , Start using Bower for installing and managing Koha's JavaScript Dependencies
20:13 kidclamp khall?
20:13 wahanui khall is volunteering to come over and fix it for you, it seems. ;)
20:13 khall ah yes
20:14 khall so, the question is basically: should we use bower for our web dependencies?
20:14 kidclamp I think we maybe need marcel and other with opinions?
20:14 khall just looking for a general yay or nay
20:14 khall or we can just make owen decide
20:14 khall ; )
20:14 thd ;)
20:15 kidclamp okay to table to next meeting?
20:15 kidclamp unless there are comments?>
20:15 wizzyrea i'm a general nay because every time we add on stuff like this it makes it harder to onboard developers.
20:15 khall we don't webpack any of our assets, and even if owen adds webpack, I'm not sure if he's going to add our existing assets
20:15 wizzyrea but I recognise that might not be the best reason.
20:15 thd wizzyrea++
20:15 khall wizzyrea: it actually makes things easier.
20:15 wizzyrea well, actually, it doesn't.
20:16 khall right now adding a new dep is a real pain. and for using existing libraries it doesn't affect anything at all
20:16 wizzyrea ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ i'm happy to disagree with you
20:16 khall can you explain your thoughts wizzyrea ?
20:16 wizzyrea every time you add a new manager, when someone is a new dev, and they want to do work
20:17 wizzyrea it's another barrier.
20:17 wizzyrea I don't like that.
20:17 wizzyrea but
20:17 wizzyrea that may not be a good enough reason to not do it.
20:17 khall wizzyrea: do you have experience with bower?
20:17 khall have you had trouble using it in the past?
20:17 thd khall: Would you adress the learning curve?
20:18 khall thd there is no learning curve, seriously
20:18 khall if I were to play devil's advocate, I'd say new developers see the stone age way we handle things and run for the hills ; )
20:18 wizzyrea there is always a learning curve. Always. But as I said, it may not be a good enough reason not to do it.
20:19 kidclamp maybe it would eb helpful to have a 'here's what we do now' versus 'here's waht we do with bower'
20:19 thd wizzyrea: If implementation is trivial and khall writes a one line tutorial for the wiki then I will be for it. :)
20:19 kidclamp I think that is what cait asked for too
20:19 khall we can do that
20:19 khall here it is: bower install <package>
20:19 wizzyrea ^ this is fine, but we often end up not getting that
20:19 khall as in: bower install jquery
20:20 khall I'd be happy to write a companion wiki page for bug 17241
20:20 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=17241 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, kyle, Signed Off , Start using Bower for installing and managing Koha's JavaScript Dependencies
20:20 khall assuming it gets pushed
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20:21 khall we already use far more complicated tools for compiling our css, yet we continue to use them and even move forward with better tools ( like scss )
20:22 wizzyrea ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ I can see you feel strongly about it. I really dont.
20:22 aleisha the academy students were very intimidated by anything css because it's a lil hard to look at, especially the minified stuff
20:23 kidclamp as long as the process is understandable I am generally for it
20:23 khall lol, thanks wizzyrea ; )
20:23 khall unless a dev is adding a new dependency, they'll never even know it's there
20:23 wizzyrea all I'm getting at is, I've watched new developers try to do stuff. The more tools like this they have to learn before they can do work
20:24 wizzyrea the less work they do.
20:24 khall the *biggest* positive is also that it makes upgrading packages like jquery much simpler than what we do now
20:24 wizzyrea and the more frustrating it is to contribute
20:24 khall wizzyrea: bower is definitely a de-frustrator
20:25 wizzyrea ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
20:25 kidclamp I think owen's opinion or others is necessary, move on?
20:25 khall if you install a library that requires another library, it gets installed automatically
20:25 wizzyrea yep onward
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20:25 khall ok, can we say that owens decision stands?
20:25 khall I'm fine with that
20:26 thd wizzyrea's point should be well understood, but I am an outlier for avoiding JavaScript as much as I can myself and running noscript.
20:26 kidclamp i am okay with that, but others may have mroe to add
20:26 aleisha agreed, should wait for more devs to have some input
20:26 khall works for me
20:26 kidclamp #topic REST api
20:26 Topic for #koha is now REST api (Meeting topic: Development IRC meeting 24 January 2018)
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20:26 kidclamp #info Vote: PATCH implementation. Proposal to implement JSON-merge ( as a start. Then implement JSON-patch ( This could be done in two steps taking advantage of Content/Type application/json-patch+json to choose between implementations).
20:27 kidclamp I don't knwo who added this, assuming tomas?
20:27 kidclamp tcohen?
20:27 wahanui tcohen is obsessed with packages' scripts
20:28 LeeJ #info Lee Jamison, Marywood University
20:28 kidclamp I am gonna say table unless someone can champion this
20:29 kidclamp #info waiting for next meeting and tomas to explain
20:29 khall we needs it
20:29 thd What would be the alternative?
20:29 khall there is no alternative
20:29 kidclamp generally I am for whatever tomas needs for rest
20:29 khall we don't support partial updates in the REST api without PATCH
20:30 khall the alternative is to never allow partial updates and always require the full copy of whatever to put used with PUT
20:30 thd Consequently, this is a mere formality about specifying an unavoidable standard.  Do I understand correctly?
20:31 khall for example, if you want to change a persons surname, with PATCH you just send the surname
20:31 khall bascially yes thd
20:31 notarock Anybody know where i can find the code behind Email::Valid->address( ) ? I've seen this like in C4/, and Koha/ seems empty.
20:31 wizzyrea notarock: in a minute, it's meeting time :)
20:32 khall I'd propose a vote so tomas can get back to work ; )
20:33 thd Unless there is some objection we few should vote on the formality.
20:33 kidclamp #vote Shall we implement PATCH  using JSON-merge and JSON-patch as described in the agenda? Yes, No, Abstain
20:34 kidclamp #startvote Shall we implement PATCH  using JSON-merge and JSON-patch as described in the agenda? Yes, No, Abstain
20:34 huginn Begin voting on: Shall we implement PATCH  using JSON-merge and JSON-patch as described in the agenda? Valid vote options are Yes, No, Abstain.
20:34 huginn Vote using '#vote OPTION'. Only your last vote counts.
20:34 kidclamp Yes
20:34 kidclamp voet yes
20:34 kidclamp vote yes
20:34 kidclamp #vote yes
20:34 kidclamp do it like that ^
20:34 thd #vote Yes
20:34 kidclamp #vote Yes
20:35 khall #vote Yes
20:35 wizzyrea abstain, no opinion.
20:36 wizzyrea #vote abstain
20:37 kidclamp last call
20:37 aleisha #vote abstain
20:38 kidclamp #endvote
20:38 huginn Voted on "Shall we implement PATCH  using JSON-merge and JSON-patch as described in the agenda?" Results are
20:38 huginn Yes (3): kidclamp, thd, khall
20:38 huginn Abstain (2): wizzyrea, aleisha
20:38 kidclamp #topic Bug 20086
20:38 Topic for #koha is now Bug 20086 (Meeting topic: Development IRC meeting 24 January 2018)
20:38 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=20086 major, P5 - low, ---, koha-bugs, NEW , AddRenewal is not executed as a transaction and can results in partial success and doubled fines
20:38 kidclamp I just bring this up for opinions
20:39 kidclamp we have an issue in that if AddRenewal fails partially we are generating doubled fines for patrons
20:39 kidclamp it would be good to use more transactions for things like this, however, it may cause unforeseen issues
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20:40 kidclamp with patches there all tests pass, but I think we need more eyes/inputs on how we shold correctly implement multipart updates
20:40 * kidclamp has opened the can of worms, that is all
20:40 thd kidclamp: What qualifies as a multipart update?
20:41 kidclamp so for instance - in a renewal we close the fine, then we update the issue, then we update the stats
20:41 khall thd: any time a subroutine updates multiple tables
20:41 kidclamp anytime that one action depends on another
20:43 kidclamp #topic Review of coding guidelines
20:43 Topic for #koha is now Review of coding guidelines (Meeting topic: Development IRC meeting 24 January 2018)
20:43 kidclamp #info Stop using "type" attribute on <script> and <style> tags. See Bug 20053 and Bug 20054
20:43 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=20053 normal, P5 - low, ---, indradg, Signed Off , Drop type attribute "text/javascript" for <script> elements used in OPAC templates
20:43 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=20054 normal, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, Signed Off , Remove attribute "text/css" for <style> element used in the OPAC templates
20:44 thd The issue seems to be that if one part of the multipart update fails we may need to roll back the others wich succeeded.  Do I understand correctly?
20:44 kidclamp yes thd
20:46 kidclamp I think this one makes sense, but needs to be written as a guidleine
20:46 * LeeJ nods
20:46 kidclamp #action indradg please write up a guideline for submission for removing 'type' attributes
20:47 kidclamp #info New rule Coding_Guidelines#SQL12: Booleans (DRAFT)
20:47 kidclamp Thi smakes sense to me, standardizing is always noce
20:47 kidclamp any discussion?
20:48 LeeJ kidclamp: if removing type resolves multiple bugs then it stands to reason the same situation would re-appear in the future
20:48 LeeJ so I agree it makes sense to standardize the practice in favor of removing it
20:49 kidclamp oh, I meant for the next topic :-) I think the type thing is good, just needs to be written up
20:49 LeeJ :P
20:50 kidclamp #startvote Should we adopt SQL12 as drafted in the coding guidelines? Yes, No, Abstain
20:50 huginn Begin voting on: Should we adopt SQL12 as drafted in the coding guidelines? Valid vote options are Yes, No, Abstain.
20:50 huginn Vote using '#vote OPTION'. Only your last vote counts.
20:50 kidclamp #vote Yes
20:51 wizzyrea #vote yes
20:52 LeeJ #vote Yes
20:53 kidclamp last call
20:53 thd #vote Yes
20:53 kidclamp #endvote
20:53 huginn Voted on "Should we adopt SQL12 as drafted in the coding guidelines?" Results are
20:53 huginn Yes (4): kidclamp, wizzyrea, LeeJ, thd
20:55 kidclamp #action tomas please finalize SQL12
20:55 kidclamp #Topic Set time of next meeting
20:55 Topic for #koha is now Set time of next meeting (Meeting topic: Development IRC meeting 24 January 2018)
20:55 kidclamp two weeks out would be february 7th
20:56 kidclamp but is alos gneeral meeting
20:56 kidclamp so I suggest 2018-02-14 13 UTC?
20:58 kidclamp #info Next meeting: 14 February 2018, 13 UTC
20:58 kidclamp #endmeeting
20:58 Topic for #koha is now Welcome to #koha this channel is for discussion of the Koha project and software
20:58 huginn Meeting ended Wed Jan 24 20:58:25 2018 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)
20:58 huginn Minutes:        http://meetings.koha-community[…]-01-24-20.00.html
20:58 huginn Minutes (text): http://meetings.koha-community[…]8-01-24-20.00.txt
20:58 huginn Log:            http://meetings.koha-community[…]24-20.00.log.html
20:58 kidclamp thanks all
20:59 LeeJ kidclamp++
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