IRC log for #koha, 2015-02-18

All times shown according to UTC.

Time S Nick Message
00:04 dcook eythian: :p
02:02 rocio left #koha
02:06 eythian hah, so I think my dumb query mistake yesterday was putting _any when I meant _all
02:11 ngourlay joined #koha
02:14 dcook eythian: Ouch!
02:15 eythian anybody need a petabyte of online storage? is doing a referral program where I'll get a $24,000 bonus, which would be nice.
02:23 mtj hi all
02:23 mtj hey, this is kinda curious..
02:23 mtj
02:24 eythian it's something we could possibly implement with elasticsearch, I think
02:24 eythian I'm no 100% sure though
02:24 eythian *not
02:25 mtj ah nice
02:25 mtj its a tricky feature to spec huh.. the results will always be a bit subjective
02:27 eythian yeah
02:28 mtj different results, depending on the current lang.
02:29 mtj the way i imagine it working is a pretty useless way
02:29 eythian well, I was thinking it'd work from the current database
02:29 eythian so pretty much the same as a fuzzy search
02:29 dcook chrisvella_: Are you still about?
02:30 mtj eythian: yeah, thats the sensible way
02:32 mtj add some wildcards to the inital query, and try again... then show those results as some suggested search queries
02:33 dcook Actually, mtj, you might be the right person to talk to about bug 3144...
02:33 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=3144 normal, P5 - low, ---, mjr, Pushed to Stable , anti-spam for opac-suggestions
02:37 mtj hi dcook, whats the Q?
02:37 dcook The boss raised the query about the negative captcha and screen readers
02:37 dcook It looks like screen readers would read out that field :/
02:37 dcook I'm doing some more reading about it atm
02:41 mtj hmm, ok
02:41 chrisvella_ yea dcook I am
02:42 dcook chrisvella_ I was just going to pose the same Q to you ;)
02:42 dcook Just looking at this site now:[…]cessible-captchas
02:43 chrisvella_ hmmm thats interesting
02:44 mtj dcook: negcap seems to have a trivial fix?
02:44 chrisvella_ it does sound like a downside for accessibility but I doubt its going to be an issue for 99.99% of people
02:44 rangi and problem still way more accesible than an actual captcha
02:45 dcook mtj: Hmm?
02:45 dcook rangi: totes
02:45 dcook chrisvella_: true true
02:45 dcook I imagine with a label of "negcap", most people would probably leave it empty anyway
02:46 mtj i was just thinking of removing the text 'negcap'
02:46 rangi it's funny
02:46 chrisvella_[…]rties#aria-hidden dcook mtj
02:47 rangi because all the alternatives they suggest assume everyone speaks english
02:48 dcook chrisvella_: Oh... that's cool
02:48 rangi i like the neg captcha because it doesn't bank on people's english comprehension level
02:48 dcook rangi: Yeah, they mention that on that visionaustralia page I linked
02:48 rangi i meant the ones they suggest on that page as possible alternatives :)
02:48 * dcook looks again
02:49 dcook "The biggest problem with logic questions is that they’re specific to a language, usually English."
02:49 mtj chrisvella_'s aria page looks good
02:49 rangi yeah which imho is a way worse problem
02:49 dcook Yeah, I'm down with the aria stuff
02:49 dcook rangi: Yeah, the English language stuff isn't a good alternative
02:49 rangi certainly there's more non english people than people using screen readers
02:50 dcook hehe
02:50 chrisvella_ yea agreed
02:50 chrisvella_ we have only implemented the negcap for the purchase suggestions page right?
02:50 dcook Ultimately, even the aria stuff could be circumvented. But pretty much anything can be with enough time and effort.
02:51 dcook I think so?
02:51 dcook Btw, in general, I'm totally in favour of the negcap. I hate captchas.
02:51 chrisvella_ I think its the right solution for koha
02:51 rangi i think we have a plain bad captcha on the borrwer self reg page
02:51 rangi we should fix that
02:51 dcook Ah yeah, I seem to recall a pretty bad one there
02:52 chrisvella_ this screen reader issue has totally surprised me, but I think its a minor issue all things considered
02:52 chrisvella_ the only potential issue is if koha becomes enough of a target for spammers
02:52 dcook We've had a few of our Kohas spammed pretty hard :/
02:52 dcook But yeah, probably not very targetedly
02:52 chrisvella_ exactly
02:53 dcook Even in the screen reader case, most people would probably leave it blank, so probably not much of an issue
02:53 chrisvella_ like purchase suggestions are not a high value target
02:53 dcook Depends on how many times the spammers request FSOG, I guess
02:53 chrisvella_ as said above lets make the class/div name really obvious
02:53 rangi yep
02:53 * dcook nods
02:53 chrisvella_ "donotfillmein"
02:53 rangi and put it in the template in a way that's translatable
02:53 dcook ^
02:53 rangi since the rest of the interface can be
02:54 chrisvella_ hahaha dcook. just google "FSOG"
02:54 chrisvella_ googled*
02:55 chrisvella_ has anyone had issues with the negcap?
02:55 dcook ;)
02:55 dcook Not that I know of
02:55 dcook I was just looking to backport it to 3.14
02:55 dcook And the boss mentioned the screen reader thing
02:56 chrisvella_ amazing pickup
02:56 dcook Well, we have quite a few government clients, so accessibility is always on the radar
02:56 chrisvella_ fair enough
02:57 dcook Actually, I think using Bootstrap has helped with that
02:57 chrisvella_ how so?
02:57 dcook Well, I don't have any examples off my head, so I should've probably said nothing :p
02:57 dcook But something in the back of my mind tells me that they try to keep accessibility in mind
02:58 dcook At least to a certain degree, and probably to a larger degree than anything we cook up would be
02:58 chrisvella_ the intention always seems to be there
02:58 chrisvella_ we have had to deal with similar things
02:58 dcook But not always the expertise :/
02:58 chrisvella_ hahaha exactly
02:59 dcook I have a few friends who know a lot about accessibility, so I like to grill them for info :p
02:59 chrisvella_ I find its usually some arbitrary "make this text bigger" "make that brighter"
02:59 wizzyrea we do have a plain bad captcha on the selfreg page
02:59 wizzyrea in fact
02:59 chrisvella_ yea its an interesting topic
02:59 wizzyrea it needs a going over, generally.
03:00 chrisvella_ wizzyrea do you think a negcap would work there?
03:00 dcook Yeah, the "make this text bigger" "change these colurs" can be tough... although I see the point
03:00 * dcook prefers white text on a black background in many cases
03:00 chrisvella_ grosssss dcook :)
03:00 dcook wizzyrea: Yeah, I think there might be an issue with the cardnumber... I think I fixed it locally but I can't recall what it is now
03:00 dcook Too busy for my own (and everyone else's) good
03:00 dcook Which reminds me I should go for lunch because if I don't go now I'll never go
03:01 wizzyrea not just that, it's just not terribly usable.
03:01 wizzyrea I don't see why a negcap wouldn't work there.
03:01 chrisvella_ cool
03:02 chrisvella_ but then this screen reader issue becomes a bigger problem
03:03 chrisvella_ much more likely to have user interaction there
03:04 wizzyrea yep, accessible bot-proofing is a challenge.
03:05 wizzyrea google had a thing where they could tell if you were a human or bot just by the way you used the page - which sounds like deep dirty magic to me but...
03:05 chrisvella_ f googles implementation of that.
03:05 wizzyrea ikr
03:06 chrisvella_ there are terrible. the capturas were almost impossible on firefox when that was implemented
03:06 chrisvella_ they*
03:06 wizzyrea don't think I ever had the pleasure of actually having to use one, I only read about it.
03:07 wizzyrea sounded pretty eesh though
03:07 chrisvella_ idk if its still as bad. but it was super anti-competitive at first
03:08 chrisvella_ don't quote me on this
03:08 * wizzyrea totes quotes you
03:08 wizzyrea j/k
03:08 chrisvella_ hahaha
03:09 chrisvella_ but I believe using adblockers and stuff reduces your likelihood of being marked as "human"
03:09 chrisvella_ and using a google account and stuff
03:10 chrisvella_ basically submit to the botnet or spend your days filling in impossible cap's
03:12 chrisvella_ good message on the bug report dcook
03:30 dcook Thanks chrisvella_ :)
03:30 dcook Hmm, orthodontists seem sketchy...
03:30 dcook Even the one I like uses a hotmail address :p
03:31 eythian haha
03:31 wizzyrea judging people based on their email domain. tsk.
03:31 dcook It's medical info!
03:31 dcook Mind you, why are you emailing people with medical info...
03:32 wizzyrea these are better questions to be asking yourself.
03:32 dcook Oh man, that reminds me of so many different courts that want you to email your credit card details...
03:32 wizzyrea or government websites that don't use SSL
03:32 dcook ^
03:32 wizzyrea <shudder>
03:33 dcook I emailed them being like "Maybe you should use SSL and have the ability to upload documents that way, as email isn't a secure way of transferring documents, especially credit card details, at all."
03:33 dcook And I never heard from them again...
03:33 wizzyrea heh.
03:33 dcook Fortunately, we found the documents and didn't need replacements :p
03:33 dcook But man...
03:33 dcook wizzyrea: The weird thing with the hotmail is that they have someone hosting a website for them. You'd think that they'd have email as well..
03:34 dcook Mind you, the website is buggy so that's... not good
03:34 wizzyrea mmm those two things don't necessarily go together
03:34 wizzyrea but it's pretty easy to get a google apps domain
03:34 dcook Although now that I think about it... I did help that out with some graphic design stuff a few years ago when I had some time to kill
03:34 wizzyrea and use your own.
03:34 * eythian just asks people for the GPG key, with the assumption they have one. So far two people we've worked with have created one (which is also the number of people I've asked for one.)
03:34 dcook eythian: Which people?
03:34 wizzyrea hehehehhehh
03:35 eythian usually IT people at other organisations
03:35 eythian i.e. if I'm sharing passwords or some such
03:35 wizzyrea that might not work with an orthodontist.
03:35 * wizzyrea challenges eythian to try
03:35 wizzyrea not that he needs an orthodontist
03:35 * wizzyrea backs away slowly
03:35 dcook I'm sure the orthodontist could've been more tech savvy in a different life
03:36 eythian no, it probably won't. But if it points out that they shouldn't be emailing medical stuff...
03:36 eythian I used to have an orthodontist
03:36 eythian now I no longer need one.
03:36 eythian that's how they work :)
03:36 * dcook just needs someone to take a mould of his teeth, create a super thick plastic appliance, and give it to him with a minimum of fuss
03:36 dcook Alas, I'm a bruxist...
03:36 eythian appliance, like a washing machine?
03:36 dcook I foresee always needing an applicance
03:36 eythian in the form of a tooth
03:36 wizzyrea I am totally lost in the world of teeth straightening.
03:36 dcook That could be a space saver
03:36 dcook eythian ^
03:37 dcook wizzyrea: As per my earlier post about blood and needles, I actually kind of like teeth pulling and stuff as well. Very satisfying sound when they come out.
03:37 eythian dcook: ah yeah, I had that and it was causing my TMJ to screw up.
03:37 dcook Although brace wire breakage sucks...
03:37 wizzyrea I just got a squicky feeling reading that.
03:37 eythian a mouthguard thing for a few weeks sorted it.
03:37 dcook eythian: TMJ?
03:37 dcook wizzyrea: sorry :(
03:38 * dcook thought about being a forensic pathologist, so body stuff is more interesting than icky to him
03:38 eythian dcook: temporomandibular joint
03:38 dcook Of course, I've thought about doing all sorts of things really
03:38 wizzyrea i have a high school friend who has/had a tmj ... thing
03:38 wizzyrea quite a good singer.
03:38 wizzyrea unrelated.
03:38 dcook Hmm, neato
03:38 * dcook seems to sleep stressfully
03:39 dcook I'm not going to share the contents of my next phone call. Hopefully it should be more straightforward.
03:39 dcook I just find medical/dental stuff so different in Australia...
03:39 dcook It's so easy back in Canada, but here it's all...
03:39 wizzyrea dcook: just be glad you're not in the states.
03:40 dcook I am so so glad I'm not in the states
03:45 eythian well, now I'm sortof getting authority results
03:45 eythian that's a start
03:47 anilautade joined #koha
03:50 dcook Ohh... this one is interesting
03:51 dcook The super expensive doctors email you a link to your message
03:55 dcook I was wondering what they meant when the email said "Secure email" :p
04:47 dcook Hmm..
04:47 dcook Has Wheezy always linked "sh" to "dash"?
04:47 dcook I thought "dash" was just used in Ubuntu..
04:49 eythian I think wheezy already has
04:49 eythian not sure when debian started doing it
04:49 dcook Yeah, I just noticed that this Wheezy install I'm using uses dash
04:49 eythian squeeze does too
04:49 dcook I thought the wheezy I have at home didn't though...
04:49 dcook Really?
04:49 dcook Huh..
04:49 dcook I must not write as many shell scripts on Debian based systems..
04:49 eythian yeah, just checked a server
04:50 dcook I've been converting a lot of my shell scripts to Python scripts lately
04:50 eythian well shell scripts should be sh compatible and work fine, or declare /usr/bin/bash
04:52 dcook Hmm, maybe something else is up..
04:52 dcook Ahhh
04:52 dcook More "bashisms" than I thought
04:53 dcook I think openSUSE uses bash by default..
04:53 * dcook should really review some of his shell scripts to double-check their syntax...
04:54 eythian wahanui: irc is multiplayer notepad
04:54 wahanui ...but irc is|a good place to ask question. This week is more quiet that usual because of the Koha Conference...
04:54 eythian wahanui: irc is also multiplayer notepad
04:54 wahanui okay, eythian.
04:54 dcook hehe
04:54 dcook It's funny because it's true...
05:09 dcook eythian: Quick question about Debian packages if you're up for it
05:09 eythian sure
05:09 dcook When you pin a package, it doesn't get updated by doing "apt-get upgrade", right?
05:09 eythian that's mostly right
05:10 dcook What's the part that mostly isn't?
05:10 eythian well, it's generally the case. However you can do things like use pinning to prioritise another repo.
05:11 dcook Mmm, right. I recall seeing something about priority.
05:11 dcook Say you only had one package that wasn't available via another repo
05:11 dcook Can you still manually update it even though it's pinned?
05:11 eythian yeah
05:11 eythian $ cat /etc/apt/preferences.d/koha-common
05:11 eythian Package: koha-common
05:11 eythian Pin: origin ""
05:11 eythian Pin-Priority: -1
05:11 wahanui koha-common is the one you want, the main koha one needs a bit more work (its for setting up a single instance)
05:11 dcook just "apt-get install package"?
05:11 eythian hmm
05:11 eythian not sure.
05:12 eythian maybe
05:12 eythian you can do apt-get install package=1.2.3
05:12 eythian and it'll force that version
05:14 eythian apt-cache policy package is useful for checking what's going on
05:15 dcook Hmm..
05:18 dcook Hmm, I think maybe what I want is... "Pin: version 3.18*" perhaps
05:18 eythian you might be able to do that, I'm not sure
05:18 dcook[…]h-apt-get.en.html
05:18 dcook I'm intrigued by these priorities..
05:18 eythian we just pin it to stop automatic upgrades, so we can do them manually as needed.
05:19 dcook Well, apparently "Pin: version 3.18*" will let the automatic upgrades through for minor version updates
05:19 dcook Ah wait.. maybe not
05:19 dcook Maybe this is a Debian specific thing..
05:19 dcook Like "0.4.99-1 and 0.4.99-10"
05:19 eythian I don't follow
05:19 dcook Well, let's say you have 3.18.2
05:19 eythian would it not be 3.18.*, too
05:20 dcook In theory
05:20 dcook I'd hope that would work
05:20 dcook And that * isn't replaced with "-blah"
05:20 dcook Which it probably isn't and I'm just overthinking it :p
05:20 eythian oh, I see
05:21 eythian well, we don't yet do -1 type stuff
05:21 eythian one day I'll make it do that
05:21 eythian (we used to, then build rules got stricter)
05:21 dcook Stricter?
05:22 eythian koha is treated as a debian-native package because the debian/ directory is included in the upstream source
05:22 eythian as there's no separation of debian/ and source, you can't (in theory) update one without updating the upstream version
05:22 eythian so, it doesn't permit putting -1 on the end
05:22 dcook Ah right... I recall you mentioning something about this before
05:23 eythian I plan one day to separate out the packaging stuff
05:23 dcook Cool!
05:23 eythian so that koha is treated as upstream and then a separate repo contains the packaging details
05:24 dcook :)
05:24 eythian or maybe just have a script that separates them out.
05:25 dcook I keep telling myself that I'll learn to package RPMs for openSUSE, but...
05:25 eythian heh
05:26 dcook I would if it would be beneficial here... but it would require some work to make it worthwhile at the moment
05:34 * eythian heads off
05:34 eythian later
05:35 dcook later
05:35 dcook thanks for answering my questions, eythian :)
05:38 timmmy joined #koha
05:39 timmmy hello.  where are the XSLT files?
05:40 timmmy I have a brand new default installation.
05:43 dcook And I was just about to answer
06:55 * magnuse waves
06:58 bigbrovar joined #koha
07:30 reiveune joined #koha
07:30 reiveune hello
07:31 kivilahtio rangi: Fight the FUD man! Just show them what we do :)
07:32 kivilahtio eythian: nooooooooooo. I don't want to configure elasticsearch indexes in 4 different places
07:32 kivilahtio eythian: *When modifying Items, I don't want to deal with converting perfectly good items-rows to MARC Item representation and then covnerting them back to items-object so it can be saved to DB.
07:52 sophie_m joined #koha
07:57 alex_a joined #koha
07:57 alex_a bonjour
08:03 drojf joined #koha
08:05 paul_p joined #koha
08:07 Joubu hello
08:07 wahanui hi, Joubu
08:08 Joubu @later tell khall yes got it, thanks!
08:08 huginn Joubu: The operation succeeded.
08:08 Joubu @later tell pianohacker the most important is not the number of patches but their readability :)
08:08 huginn Joubu: The operation succeeded.
08:13 kivilahtio Joubu: Do you know of anyone using Koha with RedHat?
08:13 fridolin joined #koha
08:13 kivilahtio Oulu libraries have some tight bindings with their local IT support provider and they only provide RedHat linux
08:14 Joubu I think we had a partner using RedHat, but it was a nightmare to install Koha on it
08:15 kivilahtio Joubu: I am trying to convince those RedHat peeps to install Ubuntu or Debian
08:15 kivilahtio Joubu: Just looking for ammunition for my arguments
08:15 Joubu If I remember correctly, fridolin did the install
08:15 Joubu fridolin: do you remember?
08:16 kivilahtio yeah fridolin! Can we recommend RedHat as a OS for Koha?
08:16 kivilahtio Isn't RedHat like 50% proprietary?
08:17 kivilahtio could I say you cannot install Koha on RedHat :)
08:17 kivilahtio it doesnät work :)
08:19 drojf kivilahtio: the university of applied sciences in wildau (in germany, close to berlin) has redhat or centos, they provide koha for the local public library. i tried hard to convince them to use debian, but they also have an it department that insisted on doing it that way. it works, but it must be horrible to update ;)
08:19 Viktor joined #koha
08:19 kivilahtio drojf: The point here is that we are forming a nationwide cooperation of Koha developers. And it might be that some day I have to update their Koha
08:19 drojf lolnope
08:21 kivilahtio drojf:, Joubu: I wonder what is the benefit of using RedHat over Debian/Ubuntu?
08:21 kivilahtio there must be something because they insist on it
08:21 drojf a contract with an outside support company, i think
08:21 kivilahtio they clami that they get vendor support
08:21 drojf yup
08:21 kivilahtio but you can get vendor support for ubuntu as well
08:22 kivilahtio afaik nobody needs that :)
08:22 drojf but they have it for everything else and won't change all that for you
08:22 Joubu kivilahtio: did you have a look at the wiki page?
08:22 Joubu[…]dhat_Enterprise_6
08:22 Joubu But it looks outdated
08:22 kivilahtio Joubu:  thanks, I read it and it looks like something I don't want to be a part of
08:23 drojf heh
08:24 kivilahtio thanks guys. BTW do you know anyone Richard Washington from Tonga?
08:26 Joubu No but I know Richard Tonga from Washington
08:26 fridolin hie all
08:26 kivilahtio Joubu:  heh, has he got something to do with Koha?
08:26 kivilahtio hi fridolin!
08:27 fridolin kivilahtio: unfortunaly 100% NO
08:27 kivilahtio well that is a good recommendation
08:27 fridolin all dependances of Koha are managed in Debian packages
08:27 Joubu just something to do with my mind
08:28 fridolin we have often a demand for CentOS of Fedora
08:28 kivilahtio fridolin: I installed MAriaDB I had to install dependencies outside of the koha-dependecies -package, but I still sintalled everything from packages
08:28 kivilahtio was quite easy :)
08:28 fridolin kivilahtio: on a RedHat ?
08:29 kivilahtio on Ubuntu 14.04 :)
08:29 rangi centos or fedora is one thing
08:29 rangi that's doable
08:29 kivilahtio rangi: ok
08:29 rangi redhat .. not so much
08:30 rangi its old everything
08:30 brinxmat joined #koha
08:30 kivilahtio rangi: fedora and centos
08:30 kivilahtio rangi: doesnt save my day :)
08:30 kivilahtio rangi: and neither does theirs. Can you tell me any details?
08:31 gaetan_B joined #koha
08:31 kivilahtio like packages are aoutdated? or hte RedHat is outdated?
08:31 gaetan_B hello
08:31 kivilahtio it looks like verything must be compiled from hte source, even the Perl modules
08:31 rangi fedora does 6 monthly releases just like ubuntu, its mostly up to date
08:32 rangi a lot of the perl modules are packaged, quite a few still arent
08:32 rangi but mariadb, etc are packaged
08:33 rangi redhat releases are like ubuntu lts .. except even more focused on stability
08:33 kivilahtio fridolin: so you think 100% NO :) that is good :)
08:33 rangi and long release cycle
08:33 kivilahtio rangi: I don't quite follow what does it have to do with running Koha?
08:33 kivilahtio rangi: You mean the new Perl modules we use are becoming available for RedHat in two years?
08:34 rangi or longer
08:34 kivilahtio rangi: With a delay of 2 years
08:34 rangi its not two years its longer for rhel
08:34 rangi centos is rhel without the paid for support, but also because its community driven, people package for it too
08:35 rangi none of them are impossible to install koha on, ive run it on all 3
08:35 kivilahtio ok
08:35 rangi but it's significantly more work
08:35 rangi its just like on any system you have installed from cpan on
08:35 rangi its up to you, to monitor all of those modules
08:35 rangi and upgrade for security
08:36 rangi for 100+ modules, thats a lot of work
08:37 rangi multiply that by a few servers and yeah .. who needs that headache
08:39 brinxmat joined #koha
08:42 kivilahtio rangi: Yeah, we also run Koha separated on ~7 virtual servers
08:42 kivilahtio rangi: So upgrade those :)
08:42 kivilahtio I prefer apt-get upgrade :)
08:44 rangi if they really wanted to run on an rpm based distro, they should package the modules
08:44 rangi and get them into fedora
08:44 fridolin kivilahtio: I would like to make it work, I think it is possible
08:44 rangi just like we have been doing with debian
08:45 fridolin but I think we should work on a standalone perl env for Koha
08:45 rangi[…]
08:45 rangi[…]
08:45 rangi etc
08:47 rangi i think getting the modules packaged as rpm would benefit more than just koha users, so is a worthy thing to do, but i dont have time to do that
09:00 brinxmat joined #koha
09:01 magnuse hei brinxmat
09:01 akafred At OPL we're putting Koha in Docker. Inside Docker it's debian, but outside it is ubuntu (but could be redhat or centos or anything that runs Docker).
09:01 magnuse fridolin: what do you mean by "standalone perl env"?
09:02 paul_p joined #koha
09:02 fridolin magnuse: all dependances in /usr/local/share/perl
09:02 akafred kivilahtio: ^^^^
09:04 magnuse fridolin: would something like be relevant?
09:04 fridolin since perl is a source code, it is not linked to the OS
09:05 brinxmat hei magnuse
09:10 fridolin magnuse: I dont know this, maybe good indeed
09:12 fridolin akafred: we are using LXC in local for dev and production, also Ubuntu for host and Debian for guest
09:14 rangi fridolin: that's fine if you want to be in charge of monitoring all the security updates on all the modules in there
09:15 akafred ah cool, Docker is sort of a nicer packaging around e.g lxc
09:15 rangi personally i like the fact that debian-security keep an eye on them
09:15 rangi as would the fedora team if they were packaged as rpm
09:16 fridolin rangi: which solution is fine ?
09:17 rangi standalone perl env
09:18 rangi it's only fine if you want to monitor cpan for all the updates (especially security) personally id much rather get the modules as part of a distribution
09:18 bigbrovar joined #koha
09:18 rangi and have many more eyes on them
09:22 brinxmat Question regarding authorized values: Does the interface provide any method of validating input?
09:22 akafred I would say Koha in Docker increases security. The host needs a lot less packages (Koha & dependencies), and the guest (inside Docker) has limited access to the host and doesn't even run ssh etc.
09:23 magnuse brinxmat: nope, you can't say e.g. "this authorized value should only contain integers"
09:23 rangi akafred: sure as long as you are still using the packaged modules, not compiling from source and then forgetting to update them
09:24 fridolin akafred: secure indeed
09:25 drojf1 joined #koha
09:25 brinxmat magnuse: spot on
09:25 rangi personally im happy that debian security exists, and am more than willing to have their help
09:25 akafred But we're mostly using Docker for other benefits - e g we can test a new Koha-in-docker image (with updated packages) before pushing to production - and be more confident everything keeps working. Also we can move dockerized applications between servers, and even run applications with conflicting requirements.
09:27 brinxmat magnuse: I'm assuming there are authorized values that have special status in Koha, i.e. the categories are not just arbitrary names, is this correct?
09:28 rangi and of course i was talking about stand alone perl devs not docker anyway, i dont know anyone who isnt doing virtualisation of some sort, be it container based or heavier like xen or kvm
09:30 magnuse brinxmat: yeah, there are lots of authorized values that have to be present for koha to work properly
09:30 * rangi heads to sleep
09:31 brinxmat magnuse: has there been an effort to provide validation for data entry in these?
09:31 magnuse not that i know of, but i might have missed it
09:31 sijobl joined #koha
09:32 magnuse it's the sort of thing where i think we tend to assume data will be entered by people who know what they are doing :-)
09:33 brinxmat magnuse: "we tend to assume data will be entered by people who know what they are doing", come on, it's me you're talking to :D
09:35 magnuse :-)
09:36 magnuse i'm sure noone would object to a patch that makes data validation possible :-)
09:37 brinxmat joined #koha
09:54 mveron joined #koha
09:54 mveron hi #koha
09:55 mveron Question regarding "Commands provided by the Debian packages": Do they work on Ubuntu as well? -[…]e_Debian_packages
10:00 magnuse mveron: yes
10:01 mveron Thanks, magnuse :-)
10:01 bigbrovar Hi guys, I noticed that some patrons in koha (3.16 debian packages) are unable to place items on hold.. while others (in same categories ) are able to. what could be wrong?
10:02 bigbrovar I checked the circulation rules and all seem fine.. like I said but patrons are from same categories
10:05 brinxmat joined #koha
10:15 paul_p joined #koha
10:19 BobB bigbrovar, are the borrowers in the same category at the same branch, trying to reserve the same items?
10:19 BobB the items are not 'Not for Loan' and the borrowers have not reached their 'holds' limit?
10:19 bigbrovar yes.. it but different branches
10:20 BobB or have oustanding fines beyond their limit?
10:20 bigbrovar it is same items.. same categories .. no fines at all
10:20 bigbrovar I think its because they are from different branches
10:20 BobB then I would compare the issuing rules for the different branches
10:21 BobB there is also a system preference, iirc, that allows holds on other branches
10:21 bigbrovar ok... or could there be a setting preventing a patron from one branch from placing on hold an item from another branch
10:21 BobB i.e. if the borrower and item are in different branches, a hold might not be allowed
10:21 bigbrovar BobB: yeah I think thats it
10:21 bigbrovar I just have to find that settings :)
10:23 BobB check the Global System Preferences at Circulation/Holds Policy
10:23 bigbrovar BobB: Thanks
10:24 BobB also at Administration/Circulation and Fines Rules there are default holds policies on two places on that page, if they have been populated
11:15 brinxmat joined #koha
11:19 bigbrovar joined #koha
11:39 tcohen joined #koha
12:27 tcohen joined #koha
12:28 tcohen morning
12:30 meliss joined #koha
12:42 magnuse hola tcohen
12:47 NateC joined #koha
12:55 NateC joined #koha
12:55 collum joined #koha
12:57 carmen joined #koha
12:59 paul_p joined #koha
13:06 jwagner joined #koha
13:08 mveron joined #koha
13:19 Joubu @later tell khall patch submited on bug 13726 ;)
13:19 huginn Joubu: The operation succeeded.
13:19 Viktor joined #koha
13:24 tcohen hi Joubu
13:29 NateC joined #koha
13:37 fridolin left #koha
13:40 Dyrcona joined #koha
13:40 fridolin joined #koha
13:53 gerundio joined #koha
14:00 JoshB joined #koha
14:05 talljoy joined #koha
14:20 Shane-S joined #koha
14:20 drojf joined #koha
14:21 Shane-S quick question...on an item the damage status says
14:21 Shane-S choose...but nothing is listed, where do I populate that field at in the admin side?
14:23 cma joined #koha
14:46 Shane-S is it quite or am I connected to nothing?
14:46 Shane-S p.s. found it, under admin > basic > authorized values
15:01 amyjeankearns joined #koha
15:06 tcohen joined #koha
15:17 tcohen back
15:18 * tcohen is tempted to remove the "CREATE USER.." part for the --use-db switch of koha-create, it makes no sense. At all
15:23 carmen joined #koha
15:31 meliss1 joined #koha
15:36 paul_p joined #koha
15:37 paul_p joined #koha
15:42 fridolin see u
15:42 fridolin left #koha
15:43 barton good morning, #koha
15:48 barton I have a library who is trying to  do a keyword search for 'A spool of blue thread', which fails, but 'spool of blue thread' succeeds.
15:48 tcohen morning barton
15:48 barton If I specify title:​f+Blue+Thread&op=and&idx=kw ... I get results as well.
15:49 barton morning tcohen!
15:49 barton this happens in both OPAC and staff client.
15:50 barton Other searches using articles, such as 'The Help' are successful.
15:52 tcohen What do u have in etc/zebradb/lang_defs/en/sort-string-utf.chr for A?
15:52 tcohen map (^A\s)      @ ?
15:53 barton tcohen: I'll take a look.
15:55 barton map (^a\s)      @
15:55 barton map (^A\s)      @
15:57 * tcohen is reading the zebra docs for map files
16:01 reiveune bye
16:01 reiveune left #koha
16:01 barton zebra docs: where angels fear to tread.
16:02 tcohen heh, not that bad
16:02 tcohen barton: please put a @later for dcook with the situation
16:10 barton tcohen: will do.
16:13 barton @later tell dcook strengeness with keyword search:  'A spool of blue thread', which fails, but 'spool of blue thread' succeeds... but when I specify title -- I get results. tcohen looked at etc/zebradb/lang_defs/en/sort-string-utf.chr and asked me to @later you on it.
16:13 huginn barton: The operation succeeded.
16:38 barton tcohen: never mind ... the library in question is still on 3.12 with a lot of custom code. I can't replicate the issue anywhere else.
16:39 barton @later tell dcook  never mind ... the library in question is still on 3.12 with a lot of custom code. I can't replicate the issue anywhere else.
16:39 huginn barton: The operation succeeded.
16:41 barton I fear for Hugin, that he come not back, yet more anxious am I for Munin.
16:41 mveron @wunder Allschwil
16:41 huginn mveron: The current temperature in Wetter Allschwil, Allschwil, Switzerland is 1.7°C (5:41 PM CET on February 18, 2015). Conditions: Overcast. Humidity: 72%. Dew Point: -3.0°C. Windchill: 2.0°C. Pressure: 30.60 in 1036 hPa (Steady).
17:23 rocio joined #koha
17:26 cma joined #koha
17:40 edveal joined #koha
17:44 carmen_ joined #koha
18:02 JoshB joined #koha
18:03 bag morning
18:04 drojf joined #koha
18:12 drojf kivilahtio: can you elaborate a little on what the plans are for the koha party in may?
18:13 cma joined #koha
18:30 magnuse bag: HI
18:30 wahanui hey, magnuse
18:31 magnuse barton: channeling Odin?
18:31 cait joined #koha
18:32 barton magnuse: chenneling wikipedia ;-)
18:32 barton not sure who would win in a fight.
18:33 magnuse hehe
18:34 * cait waves
18:37 gerundio joined #koha
18:46 cma joined #koha
18:53 edveal joined #koha
19:09 cma joined #koha
19:15 * mveron waves
19:17 * mveron would like to see Bug 11400 "Out of discussion" :-)
19:17 huginn Bug[…]_bug.cgi?id=11400 trivial, P5 - low, ---, tomascohen, In Discussion , Show "Login as a different user" instead of "Logout" if not enough premissions
19:20 rangi whats holding it up?
19:20 * rangi has to leave soon to take kids to school but will read back
19:27 drojf hi mveron. now that you added a patch you should switch it to needs signoff
19:27 drojf if somebody wants to have more discussion they will probably let you know ;)
19:29 mveron drojf:Ok, will do...
19:31 Viktor joined #koha
19:39 carmen joined #koha
19:40 cma joined #koha
19:49 cait joined #koha
19:56 trea joined #koha
19:57 * cait waves
20:04 wnickc joined #koha
20:09 cma joined #koha
20:19 rangi back
20:48 * magnuse waves
20:49 rangi hi magnuse
20:55 andreashm joined #koha
21:01 magnuse hiya rangi
21:02 magnuse rangi++ for shooting down some ebsco-related fud on linkedin
21:03 cait very successfully too :)
21:04 rangi years of practice
21:04 magnuse :-)
21:04 cait :)
21:07 eythian hi
21:07 wahanui salut, eythian
21:08 cait morning eythian
21:09 magnuse kia ora eythian
21:12 eythian kivilahtio: you're going to have to have more patience.
21:12 * mveron says good night / daytime / worldtime to everybody
21:13 rangi cya mveron
21:13 mveron :-)
21:17 andreashm joined #koha
21:21 eythian aww, I've got to go back to doing terrible SAML work today. I was so close to having basic authority searching working properly
21:21 eythian in es
21:22 wizzyrea sadface
21:23 * magnuse too
21:24 eythian (I did discover that the way authority search is handled is naturally totally different to the way normal search is handled. That is very annoying to me.
21:24 eythian )
21:26 magnuse special cases for all the things!
21:27 magnuse eythian: is handled = is handled in koha-with-zebra?
21:28 eythian yeah
21:28 eythian I suppose it does have different requirements
21:29 eythian e.g. counting the number of records that match (still unsure how I'm going to implement that.)
21:29 * magnuse should get around to reading that bok about es
21:31 eythian ES is one of those tricky projects that is 80% documented. It always seems to explain everything except that one thing that your case really needs.
21:36 magnuse sounds like fun
21:38 drojf eythian:  there is this "filemaker -- the missing manual" book. horrible people telling you all the time how great filemaker is and how great you are for using filemaker and once in a while explaining things. maybe you would like to do "the missing 20% of ES docuentation" while you're working on the rest ;)
21:40 kohanta left #koha
21:51 rocio left #koha
22:05 timmmy joined #koha
22:06 timmmy Hi.  Can someone help me find the XSLT files?
22:09 wizzyrea how did you install Koha?
22:10 timmmy according to
22:11 wizzyrea /usr/share/koha/opac/htdocs/opac-tmpl/boo​tstrap/en/xslt/MARC21slim2OPACDetail.xsl for example
22:11 eythian run:  dpkg -L koha-common | grep xslt
22:11 wizzyrea or that
22:13 timmmy great! thanks!
22:38 talljoy joined #koha
23:03 JoshB joined #koha
23:30 papa joined #koha
23:31 papa joined #koha
23:34 JoshB joined #koha
23:58 Francesca joined #koha
23:58 * Francesca waves
23:59 Francesca hello!

| Channels | #koha index | Today | | Search | Google Search | Plain-Text | plain, newest first | summary