IRC log for #koha, 2012-09-04

All times shown according to UTC.

Time S Nick Message
00:04 wajasu pulled fresh master. all test passed (make test).
00:10 wajasu prove t/db_dependant   => Cannot determine source for t/db_dependant at /usr/share/perl/5.10/App/ line 496.
00:11 wajasu ls
00:11 wajasu :)
00:13 wajasu might ned dev install.
00:19 wajasu ok running db_dependent...
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01:25 jenkins_koha Starting build #154 for job Koha_3.8.x (previous build: SUCCESS)
01:31 halcyonCorsair can anyone help me with mysql and getting it completely utf8?
01:32 rangi with the newer versions you shouldn't have to do anything, the db schema forces all the tables into being utf8
01:33 rangi however you can do this
01:33 rangi[…]Configuring_MySQL
01:33 rangi you definitely dont what the medium config tho
01:34 rangi on a box with less than 2gig ram
01:34 rangi the rest of the instructions are ok
01:36 halcyonCorsair i'll give it a shot, that's slightly different than what I was trying
01:41 halcyonCorsair rangi: with 5.5?
01:43 rangi hmm thats probably older than 5.5, the last install I did, i didnt touch the mysql conf at all, just let the koha set up the tables/db with utf8
01:57 halcyonCorsair gah
01:57 * rangi just does koha-create --create-db <instancename goes here>
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02:15 mtompset Greetings, #koha.
02:15 mtompset I'm confused how determines what is installed and what is not.
02:16 mtompset libchi-perl is already the newest version.
02:16 mtompset Really?! says it isn't installed.
02:16 halcyonCorsair rangi: this did the trick:
02:17 rangi cool
02:17 mtompset Oh... I like that much better than my solution.
02:18 mtompset[…]a_on_Ubuntu#MySQL (you'll need to scroll down some)
02:18 wajasu rangi: ok i see a bunch of db-dependent tests failing.  a few fail because thay can't find HTML::Template:Pro  and few others,  ApacheBench etc.
02:19 rangi any that fail because of HTML::Template::Pro either need to be removed, or fixed, since we dont use that at all anymore
02:20 wajasu ok.
02:27 wajasu it db_dependent/00-strict.t that is picking up   HTTPD/Bench/   Unix/ (  File/  are  missing.
02:29 rangi yep, those are optional dependencies you mustn't have installed
02:29 rangi used by the benchmarking scripts for one
02:33 jenkins_koha Project Koha_3.8.x build #154: SUCCESS in 1 hr 8 min: http://jenkins.koha-community.[…]b/Koha_3.8.x/154/
02:33 jenkins_koha mtompset: Bug 4064 - Uninitialized variable errors in
02:33 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=4064 normal, P5 - low, ---, mtompset, Pushed to Stable , Uninitialized variable errors in
02:34 wajasu so we have test dependencies (not required in and we just need to find out at run time.
02:35 wajasu i can probably address uninitialized errors that are in tests as well :)
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02:39 wajasu i guess we remove these from sysprefs:  PrefillItem   SubfieldsToUseWhenPrefill  OpacSuppressionByIPRange  since they fail the existence test.
02:39 rangi no
02:39 rangi that just means you havent run updatedatabase lately
02:39 wajasu ahh
02:42 * mtompset smiles, "Thanks for the push, rangi."
02:42 wajasu i did a dev install.  i answered yes to db tests.  i had created a kohatest DB and selected that for the tests.   so i must need to change my koha-conf.xml?
02:43 rangi no
02:43 rangi why?
02:43 rangi just visit your koha site, and it will tell you you need to run the update, do that
02:43 rangi or manually run
02:44 mtompset then run the db tests. :)
02:44 rangi yep
02:44 wajasu webinstalling...
02:44 rangi make sure you install all the sample data
02:45 wajasu i saw that.
02:45 mtompset answering yes to the db tests runs them before the webinstall. I thought that was a bizarre thing. Though, it would work if you were moving from one system to another and the db was already up to date.
02:47 mtompset That's why I always say 'no'. :)
02:55 wajasu can i skipp one test?     prove t/db_dependent  --SKIP 00-strict.t        or such to save myself some time?
03:54 halcyonCorsair rangi: what does the koha user need to be able to do? eg. have a real home / shell?
04:08 mtompset I don't think so, halcyonCorsair. As the packages versions of koha (apt-get install koha-common, etc. see[…]n_Debian_Squeeze) only insert an entry into the /etc/passwd file.
04:20 wajasu halcyonCorsair: one thing is /var/lib/koha contains zebra indexes.   find /var/ -name "*koha*"        might give you some hints.
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04:31 halcyonCorsair are these important?
04:35 wajasu when i run -a none of those are "required" for the master code branch.  can't be sure about 3.8 though.  when you run the webinstaller at first login, i thought i remember it would complain if a required module was missing.
04:35 * wajasu wonders is has been broken for some time (since 3.4) after scanning bugs and it uses HTML::Template::Toolkit
04:41 mtj wajasu,  its html::template-pro thats removed -  html:tt  is ok :)
04:49 halcyonCorsair bloody hell what a pita to install manually :\
04:50 wajasu so i can rewrite using template toolkit.  i'll have to mock accordingly though.
04:51 mtj 'it uses HTML::Template::Toolkit' , already ?
04:52 rangi there is not HTML::Template::Toolkit
04:52 rangi only Template::Toolkit
04:52 rangi it uses HTML::Template::Pro, and isn't in use by anyone afaik, because sending sms involves dealing with telcos and that sux
04:53 mtj all of the above :)
04:53 halcyonCorsair anyone know what might be causing this? v
04:53 wajasu my $template = HTML::Template::Pro->new(filename => $intranetdir.'/scripts/misc/notifys/templates ...    in master.
04:53 halcyonCorsair
04:54 mtj anyhoo… sounds good wajasu! :)
04:54 wajasu it reminds me ov
04:55 rangi halcyonCorsair: you are installing from master? (the dev branch) yeah that moose stuff is to do with the Solr stuff
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04:56 rangi sorry i should have told you to use one of the stable branches, 3.8.x or 3.6.x if you wanted to have a clean install, master is a moving target
04:56 halcyonCorsair rangi: err, right
04:56 cait morning
04:57 rangi however, you can skip the make test and continue with the install, the Moose stuff is optional, but the tests don't think it is (in master anyway) i submitted a bug for that, but the author hasnt fixed it yet
04:57 wajasu rangi: the same things goes for the  it uses the old template module.
04:58 rangi wajasu: id be more inclined to deprecate them, or at least threaten to, and see if anyone complains, they cant have been being used for nearly 2 years now
04:58 halcyonCorsair rangi: i'll just go back to stable for now
04:58 rangi halcyonCorsair: probably the best for your purposes
05:00 wajasu thats the way i feel.  i would rather rewrite the messaging as plack apps, and use template toolkit to get rid of alot of duplicate code.
05:00 * rangi goes to catch the bus
05:01 wajasu later
05:02 wajasu rangi: maybe sms and rss should be brought up at the upcoming meeting.
05:03 cait wajasu: you can add it to the agenda if you want to
05:03 cait but maybe also something for the mailing list
05:04 wajasu i'll make a note of it.
05:04 halcyonCorsair where does the apache conf get its virtualhost ip?
05:07 wajasu in /etc/koha/koha-http.conf
05:09 wajasu and /etc/apache2/port.conf
05:10 halcyonCorsair wajasu: yes, btw where does koha-http.conf get it from / how do I override it during installation?
05:10 wajasu make sure   NameVirtualHost *:8080  in ports.conf   matches what is inthe koha-httpd.conf   (use asterisk)
05:10 wajasu the LIsten line?
05:11 wajasu in ports.conf   Listen 80       and   Listen 8080   is in ports
05:13 cait halcyonCorsair: I think you get asked when running
05:13 cait when you are running from the packages, there is a conf file used (i think)
05:15 halcyonCorsair Makefile.PL doesn't ask
05:15 halcyonCorsair the packages do so, they do something different
05:16 cait ok
05:32 mtompset halcyonCorsair: Manual install how? git? tarball?
05:33 halcyonCorsair either or :)
05:33 mtompset nevermind... I scrolled back. :)
05:33 halcyonCorsair i think i almost have a very very dirty chef recipe
05:39 mtompset I'm starting to get pretty good at installing.
05:39 mtompset I keep installing and installing in multiple VMs. :)
05:41 * magnuse waves
05:43 cait hi magnuse
05:43 mtompset Greetings, magnuse.
05:43 halcyonCorsair mtompset: with any luck that'll end up being veeery easy
05:43 mtompset Greetings, cait.
05:44 mtompset That's what I did for my koha. I'm running Ubuntu...[…]ki/Koha_on_Ubuntu
05:44 mtompset I updated it with my notes.
05:44 mtompset That's tarball instructions.
05:44 mtompset I haven't finished cleaning up the git instructions.
05:45 cait hi mtompset
05:45 magnuse hiya cait and mtompset
05:46 mtompset I installed Debian, and tried a previous version of my instructions. I had difficulty.
05:46 mtompset Though, I suspect with the tweaks I have made recently, I'd get further. :)
05:46 mtompset But if you are running Debian or Ubuntu... why do a tarball install? ;)
05:47 mtompset Hindsight is 20/20. ;)
06:03 magnuse hehe... SaaD - Software as a Disservice
06:11 halcyonCorsair is the 3.8.x branch stable?
06:12 mtj the 3.8.x branch is stable
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06:19 cait morning drojf
06:19 drojf good morning cait and #koha
06:20 mtompset Greetings, drojf
06:21 mtompset How annoying. i have to specify #header.clearfix BEFORE my div id in order to get my properties to cascade to it?!
06:25 mtompset Ah... because I was before the .clearfix definition.
06:26 mtompset That's dumb.
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06:39 reiveune hello
06:39 wahanui hola, reiveune
06:45 cait hi reiveune :)
06:45 reiveune salut cait :)
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06:48 mtompset bonjour, reiveune sophie_m.
06:49 sophie_m hi mtompset
06:49 mtompset I'm going to pull this failed QA patch onto the right patch if it kills me. ARG!
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06:55 mtompset bonjour, julian_m
06:55 julian_m hello mtompset
06:55 mtompset Let me check... I think you may have looked at my bug before...
06:56 mtompset Yes... perhaps you wouldn't might looking at 8175 again?
06:56 mtompset bug 8175.
06:56 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=8175 normal, P5 - low, ---, gmcharlt, Needs Signoff , items.materials check logs error or displays incorrectly in
06:56 mtompset wouldn't mind...
06:56 cait mtompset: you should assig that bug to yourself :)
06:56 mtompset Sorry for the typographical errors.
06:56 cait assign
06:57 mtompset I did test it.
06:58 mtompset There I assigned it to myself... which basically only means I tested it correct?
06:58 mtompset and provided a patch.
06:59 cait if you provide a patch
06:59 cait you assign it to yourself
06:59 cait if you test it, you leave it assigned to the patch writer
07:00 cait ok, have to go
07:00 cait bye all
07:00 mtompset That part of the bug process I still need to remember. :)
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07:05 gaetan_B hello
07:05 wahanui hi, gaetan_B
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07:08 francharb` good morning #koha
07:09 mtompset Greetings, gaetan_B, francharb.
07:10 matts hi !
07:11 mtompset Greetings, matts.
07:23 mtompset YAY! I think I have rescued my bug from a failed QA status. :)
07:37 mtompset Oh yuck.
07:38 mtompset I think one of my bugs lost a QA contact.
07:38 mtompset bug 8175
07:38 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=8175 normal, P5 - low, ---, mtompset, Needs Signoff , items.materials check logs error or displays incorrectly in
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08:00 kf good morning #koha
08:15 mtompset Greetings, paul_p and kf.
08:16 kf hi paul_p and mtompset
08:20 mtompset Anyone know how to tell IE to pretend it is an earlier version?
08:21 laurence1 joined #koha
08:24 mtompset Hmm... I tried developer tools, and this website still complains. GRR... oh well, at least it isn't a Koha problem. :)
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09:07 Joubu1 hi all
09:07 kf hi Joubu1
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09:17 magnuse hiya hdl kf Joubu and eythian
09:17 eythian hello
09:17 wahanui bonjour, eythian
09:23 kf hi eythian
09:24 eythian hello
09:24 wahanui privet, eythian
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09:47 kf packages
09:47 wahanui packages is at
09:51 mtompset That's actually a redirect, kf. But, I made sure it works. :)
09:52 kf that#s ok
09:52 kf I found what I was looking for
09:52 eythian <-- kf, my "office" at the moment
09:53 kf meany
09:56 kf give the good weather back1
09:56 kf it's still cold here
09:56 eythian It's mine now!
09:56 kf hmpf
09:57 magnuse @wunder boo
09:57 huginn magnuse: The current temperature in Bodo, Norway is 12.0°C (11:20 AM CEST on September 04, 2012). Conditions: Light Rain. Humidity: 82%. Dew Point: 9.0°C. Pressure: 29.36 in 994 hPa (Falling).
09:58 kf @wunder Konstanz
09:58 huginn kf: The current temperature in Taegerwilen, Taegerwilen, Germany is 20.4°C (11:55 AM CEST on September 04, 2012). Conditions: Mostly Cloudy. Humidity: 79%. Dew Point: 17.0°C. Pressure: 30.09 in 1019 hPa (Steady).
09:58 magnuse hehe
09:58 eythian @wunder oosterhout
09:58 huginn eythian: The current temperature in MeteOosterhout, Oosterhout Nb, Netherlands is 22.9°C (11:56 AM CEST on September 04, 2012). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 67%. Dew Point: 16.0°C. Pressure: 30.21 in 1023 hPa (Steady).
09:58 eythian I win!
09:59 kf hmpf.
10:00 magnuse eythian: the pic looked rather nice too... are you sure you are not having too much fun?
10:00 eythian I feel that I might be treading a fine line, but I'm OK with that
10:01 kf hmpf.
10:01 kf hehe
10:01 magnuse well as long as *you* are fine with i guess all is as it should be :-)
10:01 kf do they give you icecream too?
10:02 kf eythian: installing ubuntu server edition now... I am not giving up yet.
10:02 eythian no, but I did have appelflap
10:02 * magnuse would do a benchmark comparing processing marc records with xslt versus tt, if he had the time for it
10:02 eythian OK :)
10:02 kf what is appelflap?
10:03 kf eythian: oh, and I foudn out it might be a bug or something in current virtualbox - as soon as it gets more than 2000 ram it guru meditates
10:03 magnuse [% record.field('245').subfield('a') %] hm...
10:03 kf ooh
10:03 eythian <-- kf
10:03 kf mmh
10:04 eythian kf: ah, tricky. I don't think I've ever run with more than about 1GB or so
10:04 kf yeah, will see how it turns out this time
10:04 kf only have to figure out how to access the koha installation from the host
10:05 eythian two network devices
10:05 kf yeah
10:05 eythian one NAT for the internet, the other host-only network for the host to talk to it
10:06 kf have to figure out the right settings .)
10:06 kf thx!
10:20 mtompset host-only needs to be promiscuous -- Allow-Host or Allow-All. ;)
10:21 mtompset kf... are you using virtualbox? There are GREEN and RED sections in the memory selection bar.
10:21 mtompset You go into the RED, and your machine may barf.
10:22 mtompset Also... virtualbox may be only 32bit... so a 2GB limit is kind of implied. :)
10:23 mtompset (assuming signed integers)
10:23 eythian mtompset: no it doesn't, the default host-only adapter config works (for me, anyway)
10:24 mtompset depends on if she wants someone else on the network to reach it and how the lan is setup. ;)
10:24 eythian in that case you'd use a bridge adapter, but that would make the BSZ network people unhappy I'd guess
10:24 mtompset Actually, this is why in my VM's I have three adapters: 1 Bridged, 2 NAT, 3 Host-Only.
10:25 mtompset Bridged doesn't work over wireless, as far as I know.
10:25 mtompset So, if I'm in a wireless only environment, I need the other two adapters.
10:25 eythian No, I don't think it does
10:26 eythian I always just set up a reverse proxy to allow external access, but it's not something I need a lot anyway
10:27 mtompset I'm in the midst of waiting for my colleague to figure out why my ssh access to a VM isn't working.
10:27 mtompset Then I'll be able to look at the reverse proxy setup we have.
10:28 mtompset And then try to figure out why the file modifications which were discussed briefly last night as a bad idea (tm) work.
10:34 eythian Many things that are bad ideas work.
10:35 eythian wahanui: IPv6 is <reply> When I hear the word "IPv6", I reach for my resolver
10:35 wahanui OK, eythian.
10:35 eythian IPv6?
10:35 wahanui When I hear the word "IPv6", I reach for eythian's resolver
10:35 eythian haha
10:36 eythian wahanui: forget ipv6
10:36 wahanui eythian: I forgot ipv6
10:36 eythian wahanui: IPv6 is <reply> When I hear the word "IPv6", I reach for \my resolver
10:36 wahanui OK, eythian.
10:36 eythian IPv6?
10:36 wahanui When I hear the word "IPv6", I reach for my resolver
10:42 slef I found the cause of that strange foreign key error.
10:42 slef userflags was a myisam table
10:42 kf hm the test suite seems quite unhappy
10:43 slef I'm now checking the git, but does anyone remember when userflags was changed to innodb?
10:43 kf hm, I don't remember the change at all :(
10:43 kf so either it's old, or I missed it
10:44 slef well this will be a test of git ;)
10:46 slef f8e9fb6 rel_3_0 moved to HEAD (introducing new files)
10:46 slef from 2007
10:47 slef so it's a bit odd a 3.0 install had that
10:48 slef is there any way to see if it's an upgrade from 2.x before I got here?
10:48 kf hm, there is none I am aware of
10:49 jcamins_away slef: if the DB is a mess, it's probably an upgrade from 2.x? :P
10:49 slef jcamins: heh.
10:53 slef it changed after a3999812e691110f2e16fffd91ce0ed82d69178c
10:56 slef I wonder if was ever run on this koha.
10:56 slef surely it wouldn't work at all if not?
10:56 magnuse kf: i had to install DBD::Mock to get the tests to complete
10:57 kf hmm
10:57 kf I thought I installed that one
10:57 kf will try again
10:58 slef anyway, seems like it's probably a local problem
11:10 logbot joined #koha
11:10 Topic for #koha is now  Welcome to #koha this channel is for discussion of the Koha project and software The Next General Meeting is 5 September 18 UTC
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11:19 mtompset Greetings, everyone.
11:19 mtompset eythian: You still here?
11:20 mtompset I have access to the reverse proxy.
11:20 mtompset it was passing a short name for the host name.
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11:28 eythian mtompset: that sounds like the problem then
11:29 mtompset and editing the /etc/apache2/sites-enabled/<instance config> to add a second name later is kosher?
11:29 eythian not only kosher, recommended
11:30 eythian I usually add ServerAlias for those sorts of things
11:36 mtompset Ah. Okay.
11:36 mtompset because we may be transitioning and/or running concurrently a site with and
11:37 eythian yeah, serveralias will let you do that sort of thing if you need it to
11:37 mtompset So Koha is not reverse proxy aware?
11:37 eythian that's not really a statement that makes sense, I think
11:38 eythian I think it understands some things to do with X-Forwarded-For, but that's about all that counts as reverse-proxy aware.
11:39 jcamins eythian: Koha doesn't handle X-Forwarded-For.
11:39 eythian Oh, there was talk about that a while ago.
11:39 jcamins My patch for that languished so I closed it when I stopped using a reverse proxy.
11:39 eythian I assumed it was resolved the way I consider best ;)
11:39 mtompset where's the patch?
11:39 wahanui hmmm... the patch is pretty old now, good luck
11:39 jcamins Very true.
11:39 wahanui I know. That's why I said it.
11:39 jcamins bug 5600
11:39 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=5600 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, julian.maurice, RESOLVED FIXED, Bulk MARC biblio export script
11:40 jcamins bug 6700
11:40 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=6700 normal, P3, ---,, RESOLVED FIXED, Better handling of version numbers in updatedatabase
11:40 jcamins Okay, I don't remember.
11:40 jcamins However, the patch won't help you.
11:40 jcamins Your problem is a misconfigured proxy.
11:41 mtompset we're going to put the fully qualified names in.
11:41 jcamins bug 5400?
11:41 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=5400 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, gmcharlt, NEW , add test case to detect merge conflict markers in the code
11:41 eythian that's the best idea, even if you collapse them into one set of names, so long as apache knows what those names are it'll work
11:42 jcamins bug 6800
11:42 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=6800 major, P3, ---, jcamins, RESOLVED WONTFIX, Koha authentication should handle proxies better
11:43 mtompset So why aren't you running being a reverse proxy anymore?
11:44 jcamins I moved my Koha instances to a different server with direct access to the internet.
11:47 mtompset Could I resurrect this, if I wanted?
11:48 jcamins If you wanted.
11:48 jcamins It's going to need an impressive amount of rebasing.
11:50 mtompset speaking of rebasing...
11:50 mtompset that reminds me of my bug that I think I have saved from a failed QA.
11:51 mtompset bug 8339.
11:51 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=8339 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, mtompset, Needs Signoff , div id="login" should be id="login_controls" in
11:51 mtompset I got back to it today.
11:52 jcamins I saw that.
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11:58 mtompset Welcome back, alex_a.
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12:20 tcohen morning #koha
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12:22 jcamins Good morning, tcohen and oleonard.
12:22 mtompset Greetings, tcohen and oleonard
12:22 oleonard Hi
12:22 tcohen hi jcamins, rangi signed on bug 8520
12:22 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=8520 critical, P5 - low, ---, jcamins, Signed Off , Authorities display incorrectly in staff results
12:22 jcamins oleonard: what a coincidence. I was just thinking about you.
12:23 jcamins tcohen: I saw. :)
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12:23 mtompset jcamins has been seeing a lot. ;)
12:23 mtompset Greetings, nengard.
12:23 jcamins oleonard: I want to add sortable to a new page on the staff client.
12:23 nengard hello
12:23 mtompset Oh right... I forgot to log that other bug!
12:24 mtompset Thanks for the reminder, jcamins.
12:24 jcamins It seems that our jquery-ui master js file is lacking sortable.
12:24 * mtompset grumbles about the sorting of a page.
12:24 oleonard Ah, you don't mean table sorting then jcamins
12:25 jcamins No.
12:25 jcamins Sortable.
12:25 jcamins It's SO COOL!
12:25 jcamins :D
12:25 jcamins <-- awesomeness incarnate
12:25 oleonard jcamins: For the record, I don't object to any additions to the jQueryUI library
12:25 oleonard I just object to putting them all in without having a use for all of them.
12:25 jcamins Sorry, I was called away from the computer for the moment.
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12:26 jcamins The question is, how does one go about adding to the jQueryUI library?
12:26 oleonard[…]_jQueryUI_widgets
12:27 jcamins Excellent, thank you.
12:27 oleonard See if that makes sense jcamins, and if not I'll expand on it
12:27 jcamins Yep. Makes sense to me.
12:29 oleonard I wish their download builder could use specified previous versions. Since it doesn't, your addition might include a jqueryUI upgrade.
12:29 jcamins Yeah, that was the other thing I was going to ask you about.
12:30 mtompset Will that break other things?
12:30 jcamins No.
12:30 jcamins If it does, we can't upgrade jqueryui.
12:31 mtompset And then you will be sad about not being able to use the cool tool? ;)
12:31 jcamins mtompset: no, if we can't upgrade jqueryui we probably need to fix it.
12:32 oleonard Yes, we should never not upgrade jqueryUI because something will break. We always fix what is broken.
12:33 mtompset in other words, that's acceptable scope creep. ;)
12:35 oleonard Yes, and an issue which has been covered in the comments on Bug 8498, FWIW
12:35 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=8498 normal, P5 - low, ---, kyle, Pushed to Master , can't specify an hour when specifying due date
12:42 libsysguy joined #koha
12:44 oleonard Hi libsysguy
12:45 libsysguy hey oleonard
12:45 wahanui i guess oleonard is still here, if you just wish hard enough. or Koha's master UI designer
12:50 jcamins oleonard: <-- those two boxes can be sorted into different orders
12:51 oleonard jcamins: Next you can apply it to re-ordering holds and to re-ordering news items
12:51 jcamins Hahahaha!!!!!
12:52 * oleonard isn't sure how to interpret that laughter
12:52 jcamins Appreciation of your comedic genius? :P
12:52 oleonard "Drunk with power" or "Not on your life"
12:52 jcamins We're going to have to go with option B, I think.
12:52 oleonard Dang
12:52 jcamins I haven't figured out yet how to save the data.
12:53 jcamins I'm thinking I'll actually stick it in the systempreferences table.
12:54 * tcohen is about to start working on calendar/suspensions
12:55 tcohen is there any identified group of bugs about that?
12:55 * magnuse cheers jcamins on, 'cause he will need a similar trick for the digital signs stuff
12:56 kf tcohen: I think ColinC commented on one of them recently
12:56 jcamins magnuse: the advantage of using a hidden syspref is that we have a backup plan for accessing the data.
12:56 kf @query suspend
12:56 huginn kf: Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=8030 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, koha.sekjal, NEW , edit hold from patron record
12:56 huginn kf: Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=8632 minor, P5 - low, ---, kyle, NEW , suspend in opac jumping to bottom of page
12:56 huginn kf: Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=8007 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, kyle.m.hall, NEW , Discharge management
12:56 huginn kf: Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=5911 enhancement, P3, ---, srdjan, Passed QA , Transport Cost Matrix of transporting an item between branches
12:56 huginn kf: Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=4222 major, P2, ---, srdjan, Failed QA , Nonpublic note not appearing in the staff client
12:56 kf hm none of those
12:57 jcamins oleonard: are the colors I used okay?
12:57 oleonard libsysguy: You're working on the calendar though eh?
12:57 oleonard Fine with me jcamins
12:59 magnuse jcamins: cool
12:59 mtompset Well, I found a sort order that makes sense (Auth down) for the marctagstructure when display subfields is checked... Now to figure out how to make it impossible to change under that condition.
13:00 mtompset But for now... Good day (24 hour period). I'm off.
13:02 libsysguy oleonard, I put it down for a bit last week
13:02 libsysguy I got a lot done with it
13:02 tcohen kf: Bug 8656
13:02 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=8656 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, colin.campbell, Signed Off , Koha::Calendar not loading both sets of special dates
13:02 libsysguy but its not ready to be submitted
13:03 * oleonard doesn't want libsysguy and tcohen's work to overlap
13:03 kf hm
13:03 kf I think libsysguy is doing a rewrite
13:03 kf and we still have some nasty bugs to fix now
13:04 libsysguy yeah it completely kills c4::calendar
13:04 jcamins Where would I find an example of fieldset done properly?
13:04 kf tcohen: there was one for suspending borrowers too - not sure what exactly you want to work on
13:04 libsysguy moves all the write functions to Koha::Closure and all the reads to Koha::Calendar
13:05 oleonard jcamins: Hopefully any form?
13:05 jcamins oleonard: I found one in stage MARC.
13:05 Oak joined #koha
13:05 tcohen i have both issues on 3.8: incorrect patrons debar, weird behaviour of calendar on calculating due_dat, debar-until date
13:06 kf bug 8418
13:06 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=8418 critical, P5 - low, ---, koha-bugs, Signed Off , Koha::Calendar is_holiday ignores all user data
13:06 kf bug 8110
13:06 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=8110 blocker, P1 - high, ---, kyle.m.hall, Signed Off , Add tests for Calendar modules
13:06 kf bug 8253
13:06 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=8253 blocker, P3, ---, kyle.m.hall, Failed QA , Fine doubling
13:07 kf ah bug 8251
13:07 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=8251 critical, P1 - high, ---, koha, Pushed to Master , Patrons are systematically debarred at checkin
13:07 trea joined #koha
13:09 Oak kia ora #koha
13:09 Oak magnuse
13:09 Oak kf
13:10 kf hi Oak
13:10 Oak :)
13:10 magnuse Oak
13:10 Oak \o/
13:10 tcohen kf, i remember all of them
13:11 magnuse kf: yeah, looks to me like 8251 is not fixed after all
13:15 talljoy joined #koha
13:29 drojf wow, downloading a driver with < 100KB/s. hello samsung, it's 2012. and i got other things to do than wait 20 minutes for this :(
13:34 jcamins Where do we parse JSON in Koha?
13:35 magnuse jcamins: do we?
13:35 magnuse just use
13:35 jcamins Right, I'm looking for an example of where we do that.
13:36 magnuse grep -r "use JSON" *
13:36 magnuse or something like that?
13:37 jcamins Yeah, that's what I did.
13:37 jcamins We don't seem to read in JSON ever, just write it out.
13:39 jcamins Looks like I just use from_json.
13:39 jcamins Easy to do.
13:44 magnuse yay
13:44 gmcharlt @quote random
13:44 huginn gmcharlt: Quote #128: "When TDF was founded, the group's leadership invited Oracle to participate in the hope that the database giant would be willing to hand over the OOo trademark and allow the vendor-neutral governance body to take over stewardship of the project" (added by wizzyrea at 07:11 PM, April 18, 2011)
13:46 * magnuse heads out to buy an ukulele
13:47 jcamins ... really?
13:48 maximep joined #koha
13:49 jcamins That's pretty cool. :)
13:51 wizzyrea dude! ukulele!
13:52 wizzyrea that will be two impossibly tall nordic guys I know who play uke. ;)
13:52 wizzyrea what are the odds.
13:52 wajasu i'm looking a t/db_dependent/Reserves.t   it assumes a biblio exists after a fresh db create with all optional data inserted.   i am thinking i should just add a test biblio, so the reserve test doesn't have a NULL biblio to reserve.
13:52 jcamins wajasu: by default there are no bib records in test data.
13:53 wizzyrea it probably wouldn't hurt to have some :P
13:53 wajasu so i am going to copy some AddBiblio code from Biblio.t to prime the unit test.
13:53 wizzyrea or make it an optional part of the installation
13:54 wajasu i added "The hobbit" using z3950 search.   and the Reserves.t passed.
13:54 wajasu so i'm going to add a minimal test biblio.
13:55 libsysguy wajasu are you writing new unit tests?
13:55 wajasu i'm trying to fix the broken ones in t/db_dependent
13:55 wajasu then i will
13:56 libsysguy ahh ok
13:56 libsysguy I was about to start writing some as well
13:56 libsysguy is there  a bug number you're working off of?
13:56 wajasu no
13:56 libsysguy i'd hate to overlap
13:57 libsysguy perhaps I could make some for each C4:: module
13:57 wajasu the t tests passed on master, but there are a bunch in t/db_dependent that fail.
13:57 libsysguy i see
13:57 wizzyrea you have to have the right data for the ones in t/db_dependent
13:57 wizzyrea if you don't have it, they will fail.
13:58 libsysguy are you writing them to not use the database but to use that perl module that mimics the db
13:58 wizzyrea so instead of poking at the tests, I'd make sure there's an option to "add all necessary data for tests" to the installer
13:58 wizzyrea or do that
13:58 wajasu i did a clean db install, and webinstaller install all data.
13:58 * libsysguy tries to remember the name
13:58 wizzyrea mock somethingerother
13:58 wizzyrea yea, but the webinstaller doesn't install all data necessary for tests.
13:58 wajasu the and use HTML:Template:Pro so they fail.
13:59 wajasu wizzyrea, do you know of some more test data(mysql script or such) I can run to get the needed data?
14:01 wizzyrea I had a test db that had all of it for running the tests about 6 months ago
14:01 wizzyrea let me see if I can find it
14:01 jcamins wizzyrea: the test DB you gave me passed all tests, I think.
14:03 wizzyrea[…]-andcheckouts.sql
14:03 wizzyrea ^^ this is the one I gave you, jcamins
14:03 wizzyrea I think
14:03 jcamins Yup, that looks right.
14:03 eythian joined #koha
14:03 wajasu also, some times i see errors refering the /usr/share/koha/lib/...     do i need to do a make install? or change PERL5LIB?  Shouldn't the tests refer to a path int he git heirarchy?
14:03 jcamins No, the tests use whatever Koha installation you're testing.
14:03 jcamins So you need to set PERL5LIB to match your environment.
14:04 wajasu wheres the wiki?
14:04 wahanui hmmm... the wiki is
14:06 wajasu so maybe a note, in the wiki saying make install is required ((only because i ran   perl Makefile.PL, make, make test, (w/o make install)
14:06 wizzyrea it's not required.
14:06 wajasu did the wiki run out of memory again?
14:07 wizzyrea ping gmcharlt
14:07 wajasu ok
14:07 gmcharlt pong; looking at it
14:07 wizzyrea the wiki's gone amok ;)
14:07 jcamins wajasu: but install is not required.
14:07 wizzyrea ty :D gmcharlt++
14:07 jcamins which installl?
14:07 jcamins which install?
14:08 jcamins Anyway, if you're doing development, it is recommended that you use a dev install.
14:08 eythian[…]4gw-1226464921343 <-- unrelated, but ahahahahaha
14:08 wajasu i did a dev install.
14:08 jcamins If you are running Koha from /usr/share, then you will, of course, need to run make install.
14:08 jcamins In that case, you didn't set PERL5LIB correctly.
14:08 wajasu but i didn't set my PERL5LIB
14:08 wajasu yup
14:08 wajasu thx
14:09 jcamins Right, you always have to set PERL5LIB.
14:09 jcamins Regardless what type of installation.
14:09 wizzyrea ba hahahahahahaha
14:10 wajasu reminds me of
14:11 wizzyrea hm not really the same at all.
14:11 wizzyrea They were supposedly holding the domain "in trust" for the community
14:11 wizzyrea a
14:11 wizzyrea n
14:11 wizzyrea d
14:11 wizzyrea just the trust was gone
14:12 wajasu so it was stolen out from underneath.
14:13 wizzyrea not really, we gave it to them, originally. They just wouldn't give it back.
14:13 wizzyrea well they wouldn't give it back without rather insane and untenable conditions.
14:15 wajasu ah
14:15 gmcharlt the wiki is back up
14:15 oleonard And then they said they would give it back if they could give it to a third party, and we made that possible, and then they said nuh-uh.
14:16 wajasu gmcharlt++
14:18 wajasu wizzyrea: maybe we can get that test data as an attachment to
14:20 wajasu OR checked in with the unit tests.
14:20 hdl joined #koha
14:24 rambutan joined #koha
14:25 wajasu i take that idea back.
14:25 laurence1 left #koha
14:26 wajasu the unit test need to create the objects.   so that when the schema changes, we adjust the unit test object factory accordingly.
14:26 wajasu i know we aren't OO, yet :)
14:26 jcamins wajasu: yes, that's the point of unit tests.
14:28 wajasu that github data is a datebase dump.  it drops tables a creates them, and it may not match the master schema i am testing.
14:29 jcamins Right. So you have to upgrade the schema before using it.
14:30 hdl joined #koha
14:31 wajasu yes. the schema is upgrade by the installer according to master's updatedatabase, but over time, that specific script with destroy my test schema, since it drops/creates tables. not in sync.
14:31 wajasu though it only 20 days old.
14:32 jcamins I don't think you quite understand what updatedatabase is for.
14:33 wajasu it migrates the schema.
14:33 jcamins Right.
14:33 jcamins If tests fail as a result of the updatedatabase, then the functionality *is* broken.
14:33 jcamins Period.
14:33 jcamins That is exactly the sort of thing that is supposed to cause unit tests to fail.
14:34 wajasu i'm just saying that wizzyrea's script   recreates the schema and the tests my pass.
14:34 wajasu may pass
14:34 jcamins You install a database.
14:35 jcamins In this case, the sample that wizzyrea just shared.
14:35 jcamins Then you run updatedatabase whenever you update your system.
14:35 jcamins At no point should unit tests stop working.
14:35 jcamins If they stop working, then they have identified an error in the functionality.
14:36 jcamins Which needs to be fixed.
14:36 jcamins Alternatively, you have failed to incorporate changes into the unit test, in which case you have to fix the unit test.
14:37 jcamins Either way, the updatedatabase script should always take you from a working state to a working state, and any time it doesn't, you've found an error.
14:38 wajasu oh, i see, install wiz's db, then upgradedatabase,  that works.   i was working from no db, upgradedatabase, load tests data, run unit tests
14:39 jcamins Right, that workflow is going to fail almost all the time because updatedatabase needs to be run *after* the test data is loaded.
14:41 hdl joined #koha
14:43 hdl1 joined #koha
14:46 wajasu i can see that to test updatedatabase itself.  but for a unit test, each probably should manage their own setup.teardown of its own test data.
14:53 jcamins_phone That would be the ideal, yes.
14:54 eythian kf: I've fixed the routing list reordering
14:55 eythian just about to post the fix on bug 8716
14:55 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=8716 normal, P4, ---, koha-bugs, NEW , Reordering of routing list entries doesn't work
14:55 kf cool
14:55 kf eythian++
14:55 kf I have to work some on it law this week, but will try to test asap :)
14:58 eythian cool. Patch submitted.
15:01 jcamins Good news! My ethernet port is working again.
15:03 rambutan hammer and screwdriver?
15:04 kf jcamins: yay!
15:07 reiveune bye
15:07 reiveune left #koha
15:07 jcamins rambutan: reset the power regulator, actually.
15:11 Joubu bye ++
15:11 Joubu left #koha
15:11 oleonard jcamins: Did that reverse the polarity of the neutron flow?
15:12 jcamins oleonard: seems to have.
15:14 kf bye all
15:17 kf left #koha
15:23 gaetan_B does having no issues at all in the system blocks patron batch delete ?
15:23 gaetan_B when trying to delete patron who have not issued documents since today (in a system where no document was ever issued) i was not able to delete any patron
15:24 gaetan_B i kept getting the confirmation message "0 patron will be deleted"
15:41 asaurat left #koha
15:42 wizzyrea gaetan_B: that seems odd
15:43 eythian It does seem quite odd
15:43 wizzyrea can you delete them in the normal way?
15:46 gaetan_B yes i can go on a patron's page and choose delete
15:56 annab joined #koha
15:58 annab anyone know much about transferring from millennium to koha?
15:58 Oak @later tell cait sorry I was away... read your message now
15:58 huginn Oak: The operation succeeded.
15:58 tcohen annab, I once got an MARC21 export from Millenium (1.5M records) which flawlessly got migrated into Koha 3.4
15:59 tcohen I only had to tell the super-hacker-librarian to export holdings following the Koha requirements
15:59 annab so marc21 format doesn't require too much extra work to migrate? we're thinking of doing it ourselves rather than hire out
15:59 magnuse Bug 7067 - yay!
15:59 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=7067 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, kyle.m.hall, Needs Signoff , allow patron self registration via the opac
16:00 tcohen exactly
16:00 annab that's good to know
16:00 jcamins annab: it depends on your records, really.
16:00 tcohen they had an ETL-expert librarian
16:00 jcamins Sometimes it will take staggering amounts of conversion.
16:00 tcohen and actually used standard MARC21
16:01 annab jcamins do you have experience with it being difficult or just speaking in general?
16:01 tcohen just had to adjust holdings data (branches, created first, etc)
16:01 jcamins annab: I did the training for a formerly-Millenium library.
16:01 jcamins It was a bit of a nightmare.
16:01 annab tcohen we only have one branch so that is helpful
16:02 annab jcamins why was it so difficult? can you give me specifics at all?
16:02 annab we're in very early prep stages so i know next to nothing about the transfer, which is our main concern right now
16:02 tcohen as jcamins says, it will depend on how healthy the records are I guess
16:02 jcamins annab: well, serials are just awful all the time, and their MARC records reflected several decades worth of changing standards.
16:03 annab tcohen that definitely makes sense
16:03 annab jcamins haha i've seen that no one likes serials
16:03 annab jcamins i don't think our marc records will have that much differentiation in data
16:03 annab but we are planning on cleaning up before we try exporting, that much i know
16:04 annab i guess i just wanted to see if anyone had specific knowledge on that kind of transfer
16:05 hdl joined #koha
16:05 annab like i said, very early stages here
16:06 annab but it's good to hear some viewpoints so thanks!
16:10 tcohen annab, good luck
16:10 cait joined #koha
16:10 tcohen it might be painful, but it is worth
16:10 * cait waves
16:10 annab tcohen thanks, i'm sure i'll be back when i know more about our records
16:10 tcohen so, Roddick retires today
16:10 annab tcohen i appreciate your help
16:11 melia joined #koha
16:11 eythian annab: it's worth experimenting to get a feel for it
16:11 eythian it'll at least let you know if you have big problems
16:11 annab eythian i've been playing with a demo our state is hosting but it doesn't have a whole lot of data imported
16:12 annab but that is a good point
16:12 eythian Well, I mean experimenting with migrations.
16:12 eythian see what happens if you do a simple dump and import
16:13 annab eythian oh i see what you are saying
16:13 eythian ideally it'll let you spot any issues early on
16:13 annab eythian thanks that makes sense
16:14 annab i'm actually a student intern so this is all pretty new to me
16:22 sophie_m joined #koha
16:23 heber joined #koha
16:24 eythian if someone's done something that messes up the history in a branch, is there a way to get it back? In this case, I do a rebase and get 490 commits. I think somone's been using merge in confusing ways or something.
16:26 eythian Basically, any patch that's in the upstream, even if it has a different commit ID, I'd like it to put it in there with the right ID
16:26 jcamins Ummm... git rebase --onto
16:26 jcamins Maybe.
16:27 tcohen [flame] so, Roddick retires today
16:27 eythian jcamins: not sure that'd work
16:28 jcamins Then I am out of ideas.
16:28 eythian hmm
16:35 gaetan_B bye !
16:47 ago43 joined #koha
16:49 mbalmer joined #koha
16:49 mbalmer Toyota!
16:50 eythian Mazda?
16:51 wizzyrea fiat.
16:52 rambutan I have a 1994 Suzuki Sidekick.
16:53 * wizzyrea has a vw
16:53 wizzyrea for now. :P
16:58 bag convertible :)
16:58 wizzyrea must be torture ;)
16:59 * cait has no car
17:00 rambutan cait needs a virtual car then.
17:02 khall joined #koha
17:07 cait and a virtual driver's license :)
17:13 jcamins I am baffled.
17:13 jcamins I can't figure out how these buttons work.
17:13 jcamins I would like the button to *not* submit.
17:14 jcamins Just to call some javascript, like in the syspref editor.
17:14 jcamins I can't see anything special in the syspref editor to make it do that.
17:19 jcamins Figured it out.
17:19 jcamins Well, not how the syspref editor does it.
17:19 jcamins But how to do it myself.
17:20 jcamins The trick is that the return false; has to be *in* the onclick.
17:20 libsysguy joined #koha
17:25 cait jcamins++
17:30 Magnusem joined #koha
17:32 * jcamins wonders who this Magnusem is, and whether s/he has any relationship to magnuse. :)
17:32 cait hm
17:32 * cait wonders the same
17:33 Magnusem One and the same...
17:34 Magnusem Just trying out mibbit on the tablet
17:35 cait :)
17:35 tcohen question on NoZebra: is it worth to remove *at least* the sysprefs for it?
17:37 tcohen git pull
17:37 wahanui i guess git pull is really simple.
17:37 tcohen he he, focus problem
17:38 jcamins tcohen: it is worth removing all of it.
17:39 slef @query opaclanguages pnf
17:39 jcamins I just haven't gotten around to it.
17:39 huginn slef: No results for "opaclanguages pnf."
17:39 jcamins pnf?
17:39 slef nfi
17:39 tcohen jcamins, I was about to start doing it
17:39 slef but it's showing on one of my kohas
17:39 tcohen but remembered that big patches are lost in time
17:39 tcohen and noticed that (1) a lot of things are being rewritten
17:40 jcamins pnf? nfi?
17:40 tcohen (2) upgrade from NoZebra is currently broken
17:40 slef wahanui: nfi?
17:40 wahanui nfi is no fine idea
17:40 jcamins Ah.
17:40 jcamins pnf?
17:40 jcamins wahanui doesn't know.
17:40 wahanui jcamins: excuse me?
17:40 slef there's a folder containing xsl called pnf
17:40 jcamins tcohen: I agree, we should remove the sysprefs as a start.
17:40 slef opac/htdocs/opac-tmpl/prog/pnf/xslt~HEAD/
17:40 slef anyone know what that's about?
17:40 tcohen jcamins, I'll send a patch for that
17:41 jcamins slef: looks like something from CVS.
17:41 tcohen and then *maybe* for bug 7440
17:41 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=7440 major, P3, ---, gmcharlt, NEW , Vestiges of NoZebra should be removed
17:42 slef jcamins: wonder what it's doing in koha-common_3.8.4-1_all.deb then
17:42 jcamins o.O
17:42 jcamins slef: nfi.
17:42 tcohen NoZebra, QueryRemoveStopwords, NoZebraIndexes?
17:43 Magnusem left #koha
17:44 jcamins tcohen: yep. But there also needs to be a database update to change QueryRemoveStopwords to "Don't ignore."
17:44 jcamins Because actually it *does* have an impact, just not the desired one, given a certain combination of sysprefs.
17:45 tcohen ok, so, remove  nozebra and nozebraindexes? change queryremovestopwords?
17:46 jcamins Or delete from the database.
17:47 tcohen i meant delete those to, and update queryremovestopwords
17:47 slef Bug 8725 has been added to the database
17:47 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=8725 minor, P5 - low, ---, koha-bugs, NEW , koha-common_3.8.4-1_all.deb has an opaclanguages option of pnf
17:48 jcamins tcohen: you could delete all three. Traditionally, Koha doesn't *delete* sysprefs, it just stops showing them in
17:48 tcohen so, it set some convenient values, and hides them
17:49 jcamins Right.
17:49 jcamins I'm not sure why we do it like that.
17:51 eythian joined #koha
17:52 slef hi eythian
17:52 eythian hiya
17:54 tcohen jcamins, i don't like it he
17:59 slef eythian: sorry for giving you a bug
18:00 eythian slef: hrm, thanks for pointing that out.
18:00 eythian Apparently my "make sure everything is clean first" process isn't up to snuff
18:01 slef eythian: librarian should be thanked for asking what language has code pnf. ;)
18:01 eythian heh
18:01 slef bbl
18:01 eythian a client of ours that has custom templates
18:06 jcamins Woohoo! I managed to save the configuration.
18:06 jcamins And load it!
18:06 jcamins :D
18:06 Viktor joined #koha
18:07 cait hi Viktor :)
18:07 jcamins Not that it does anything.
18:08 jcamins But, you know, saving and loading are both important.
18:08 Viktor Hi cait
18:08 cait jcamins: I am sure you will figure it out :)
18:08 cait Viktor: have you figured out the translations?
18:09 Viktor Yes it's starting to shape up to a plan at least. But it's a lot of stuff happening at the same time.
18:10 jcamins I don't see *any* way to handle this without Javascript.
18:10 cait hm is that bad?
18:11 jcamins Meh.
18:11 jcamins I like non-JS fallbacks.
18:11 cait which is good :)
18:11 Viktor Currently we're having magnuse contracted to do work implementing touchscreen digital signs into Koha. cait
18:11 cait Viktor: I have seen the rfc :)
18:11 jcamins But at a certain point we have to say "staff must use a modern browser with javascript."
18:11 * jcamins is at that point.
18:11 cait I am sure it will turn out great :)
18:12 Viktor What is the policy on non-javascript fallbacks btw? Is it a must or a recommendation?
18:12 cait more a recommendation I think
18:13 cait in staff
18:13 oleonard JavaScript is required for the staff client.
18:13 oleonard JavaScript should not be required for the OPAC to work, but it is accepted that some features may be unavailable.
18:13 Viktor Ok. Required is more comfortable as a developer of course :) I'll go with that.
18:14 Viktor Opac oleonard - seems like a good balance. Thanks!
18:14 cait but it would be nice if we could make new features accessible
18:14 Viktor I'm disussing multiple cover photo-sources in opac with javascript for deduplication
18:15 cait not introducing more problems
18:15 Viktor cait - Yes. I agree.
18:15 jcamins How do we do a CSS alert in the staff client?
18:15 jcamins class=alert?
18:16 oleonard class="dialog alert"
18:16 jcamins Thanks.
18:16 jcamins Do we make the text bold or anything?
18:17 oleonard Not by default, but you can selectively
18:17 * jcamins is adding the <noscript> "sorry, you can look but not touch" warning.
18:17 Viktor Since knowledgable people is present: How does the IE bundled with Win7 work for the staff client? Older versions used to have som problems.
18:17 jcamins Pfeh.
18:17 jcamins IE.
18:17 Viktor :)
18:17 * magnuse waves to Viktor
18:17 jcamins Actually, it generally works okay, I understand.
18:17 Viktor Hi! magnuse
18:17 Viktor Great - thanks jcamins
18:18 oleonard Viktor: I don't know if any one of us knows for sure since none of us use it extensively.
18:18 * jcamins has worked with someone who does.
18:18 jcamins He runs into occasional issues, but is apparently satisfied.
18:18 Viktor Great.
18:18 Viktor Catalouging had a IE bug I think. Or IE had the bug rather.
18:19 oleonard Viktor: We do try to fix IE bugs when they are reported, we just don't test much in IE
18:19 tcohen bug 8724
18:19 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=8724 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, gmcharlt, Needs Signoff , Upgrade from NoZebra installs is broken
18:19 Viktor I have a library coming up who might have an easier time with their IT-department using standard Win7 IE.
18:19 cait I think drag&drop in basket grous does not work with ie
18:20 jcamins We have drag&drop in basket groups?
18:20 cait we do
18:20 oleonard[…]---&list_id=40127
18:20 jcamins Huh. I didn't know that.
18:20 cait you open a basket group and then you can drag&drop the baskets into it
18:20 oleonard yeah, I think that drag and drop thing is on  my list of YUI replacement tasks
18:20 jcamins Viktor: probably configuring Did you mean plugins will not work so well.
18:21 jcamins I think it'll require IE8+
18:21 Viktor Ok.
18:21 oleonard Is IE8 what Win7 shipped with?
18:21 Viktor Useful list oleonard - thanks!
18:21 jcamins oleonard: I thought it was IE7?
18:22 Viktor I´ll try to set them up with FF of course - but Sweden is still Microsoft country in large parts.
18:22 rambutan joined #koha
18:22 jcamins It works fine with IE8.
18:23 jcamins Kind of ugly-looking, but what would you expect from a browser that doesn't know how to do rounded corners?
18:23 oleonard Wikipedia says Win7 had IE8
18:23 jcamins Oh.
18:23 jcamins Cool.
18:23 jcamins Viktor: my new management screen will work fine. ;)
18:24 Viktor jcamins :)
18:24 tcohen bye #koha
18:24 Viktor bye
18:25 jcamins <-- what happens if you have javascript turned off
18:25 Viktor Oh - is it tomorrow this time the meeting is? I might sit in and listen if I get the chance.
18:25 oleonard Yes  Viktor
18:25 wahanui i guess Viktor is doing a great job on fixing that drojf :-)
18:26 ago43 joined #koha
18:26 magnuse[…]_5_September_2012
18:26 cait Viktor: would be nice if you dropped in :)
18:27 magnuse 20 o'clock, our time, Viktor
18:27 cait but you don't only have to listen
18:27 talljoy1 joined #koha
18:27 magnuse yeah, very cool if you show up Viktor - we could double the participation from the nordic countries :-)
18:27 Viktor Thanks magnuse - It's sort of the first time I've had to calculate time difference for a meeting.
18:27 Viktor :)
18:28 magnuse hehe, you get used to it after a couple of years :-)
18:28 magnuse and there is always a link to a time converert in the wiki page for the meetings
18:29 magnuse jcamins: nice js-warning!
18:29 jcamins magnuse: thanks.
18:30 talljoy2 joined #koha
18:30 magnuse i think more warnings like that are a good idea
18:30 * magnuse plans on dusplaying a warning on the digital signs admin page if digital signs are not turned on in prefs
18:30 Viktor Yes - an error message actually explaining what to do. A rare thing to be treasured :) jcamins
18:31 * jcamins considered not explaining the workaround, but realized that it would be a lot easier to say "no, sorry, I am not walking you through the basics of JSON" if the system says "here's the workaround, but BEWARE!"
18:31 Viktor Seems like an idea to save a lot of grief :) magnuse
18:32 magnuse yeah, and we can link to things too, that might be useful
18:32 jcamins Oh, I didn't think of the fact that I could put a link in there.
18:33 jcamins Eh. No rush to change that. It still doesn't have any impact.
18:35 Viktor What would you say are top three on your wishlists for Koha? The stuff that would make libraries in general say "Thank you - finally"?
18:36 cait hm that is not easy
18:36 Viktor I´m trying not to overlook necessary development...
18:36 cait I think libraries are all so different
18:36 cait I had libraries asking for a bindery module, but only very few would need that
18:36 cait erm
18:36 cait electronic resource management was another
18:36 jcamins Viktor: search that isn't awful.
18:36 oleonard A bribery module? Sounds useful to me.
18:36 rambutan 1. more built-in reports, reporting templates
18:36 cait oh yeah
18:36 jcamins But that's my particular obsession.
18:37 cait if you want to put money somewhere, the search rewrite is an a+ candidate :)
18:37 * jcamins agrees.
18:37 cait it will enable lots of cool features long term
18:37 Viktor Reports could be easier...
18:37 brylie joined #koha
18:37 cait lying good foundation to build on and getting rid of the most awful module koha has probably :)
18:37 jcamins Viktor: ah, but the proposal for the search rewrite is already written. :)
18:37 cait search rewrite?
18:37 cait hm,
18:37 jcamins Hm.
18:38 Viktor How is Solr related to search being awful or not?
18:38 jcamins search rewrite is[…]earch_Rewrite_RFC
18:38 * cait leaves that job to jcamins and goes to take care of the laundry
18:38 jcamins search rewrite?
18:38 wahanui hmmm... search rewrite is[…]earch_Rewrite_RFC
18:38 jcamins There we go.
18:38 cait Viktor: btw - I sent you a pm ealrier, wondering if you did see it :)
18:38 jcamins Viktor: at the moment, Solr isn't a complete replacement for Zebra, and it replaces one set of limitations with a different set.
18:39 jcamins The search rewrite provides the rest of the plumbing to so that all the work that BibLibre has done on solr can be used.
18:39 jcamins s/to so/so/
18:40 Viktor Sounds good jcamins
18:40 jcamins (if you didn't gather, the search rewrite is my pet project)
18:40 Viktor :D
18:41 Viktor It looks interesting.
18:41 jcamins There's even a nice funding thermometer.
18:41 jcamins :)
18:41 * jcamins is inordinately proud of that funding thermometer. It turns out to be about the simplest thing *ever*, as javascript goes, but it's quite functional
18:42 rambutan what thermometer where?
18:43 jcamins rambutan: ooh, you didn't see the thermometer?
18:43 Viktor I do think the whole thing will be above our budget though. We are looking for some additional funding but I doubt we will be this successful :)
18:43 jcamins rambutan:[…]earchrewrite.html
18:43 Ccorrales joined #koha
18:43 jcamins Viktor: we're not looking for a single funder to cover the entire cost.
18:43 wizzyrea yep, we're looking for lots of little funders
18:44 rambutan ah, that thermometer there
18:44 wizzyrea lots of people to make one big thing happen
18:44 jcamins rambutan: yeah, isn't it a nice thermometer? :)
18:44 Viktor That is nice jcamins
18:44 Viktor Visualization is important.
18:44 Viktor Looks a lot less expensive already
18:45 jcamins Vindicated!
18:45 jcamins Viktor: yeah, the "here's what we're looking to raise" number on the wiki does not tell the whole story.
18:45 rambutan that's a mighty fine thermometer jcamins, mighty fine
18:45 Viktor The library I'm going to work with would like better search so some bits might apply. We also have a spelling API from the national library that we will implement.
18:46 jcamins Viktor: you know who to contact if you'd like to be involved (hint: me). :)
18:46 jcamins (or Brooke)
18:49 Viktor Ok - saving those URLs for later then. Still two weeks before the request for funds is due - and some additional time until the answer :) jcamins
18:53 Viktor irl is calling
18:53 Viktor idling for a while
19:00 * jcamins cheers.
19:00 jcamins I did it!
19:00 jcamins I successfully left myself with no option but to edit the configuration in Local Use.
19:00 jcamins ... wait, that wasn't the *goal*?
19:01 magnuse jcamins: are you open for donations on the ~$100 scale too? those numbers seem kind of daunting...
19:02 jcamins magnuse: yup.
19:03 magnuse did you consider kickstarter or similar?
19:04 wizzyrea yea I was wondering why there wasn't a kickstarter or indiegogo
19:04 wizzyrea probably because people would have to actually pay the money?
19:04 wizzyrea instead of just pledging
19:05 magnuse ?
19:05 jcamins magnuse: yeah, but we haven't quite figured out how to handle that. Some of the institutions aren't comfortable with kickstarter, and most don't use credit cards.
19:05 magnuse but there could be multiple "channels"
19:06 wizzyrea there are some others besides kickstarter
19:06 wizzyrea and indiegogo
19:06 wizzyrea o
19:06 wizzyrea n
19:06 wizzyrea e
19:06 wizzyrea I
19:06 wizzyrea sa
19:06 wizzyrea good lord!
19:06 wizzyrea what is wrong with my keyboard
19:06 magnuse hehe
19:06 jcamins Uhhh...
19:06 wizzyrea one I saw was specifically for open source software projects
19:07 magnuse ooh, remember what it was?
19:07 jcamins slef suggested
19:07 wizzyrea
19:08 wizzyrea
19:09 wizzyrea (but none of these are the actual one I was thinking of - they must be new. Which is rather cool.)
19:09 wizzyrea oh,
19:09 wizzyrea or
19:09 jcamins Yeah, there's a new crowdfunding platform every week.
19:09 wizzyrea cofundos is what I was thinking of
19:10 magnuse wow, how to choose the *right* one...
19:10 wizzyrea however cofundos seems to be having… issues
19:10 wizzyrea which is not encouraging.
19:11 wizzyrea
19:11 jcamins magnuse: and now you know why we haven't set one up yet.
19:11 cait maybe something simpler?
19:11 wizzyrea I like that last one
19:11 cait for small donations?
19:11 wizzyrea well it's really just pledges right?
19:11 wizzyrea until you get to a certain level of funded-ness
19:12 cait ah right
19:12 magnuse well, if the goal is reached pledges quickley turn into donations...
19:12 wizzyrea I mean jcamins has the facility to bill it out, if he knows who to bill
19:13 jeff joined #koha
19:13 magnuse but it would be cool if it was easy for lots of people to chip in a little...
19:13 wizzyrea yep, I like the one
19:13 jcamins Of those, bountyoss seems like the most useful.
19:14 wizzyrea Pledges may be paid by credit card, or by check payment to Open Source Bounty, Inc., P.O. Box G, Santa Clara CA 95055. Checks are accepted only if drawn on a US bank. A check payment is considered to have been received when the check clears. We use WePay as our credit card processor; OSB is not responsible for the performance of WePay.
19:14 wizzyrea so I guess they accept the payments, take a small cut (?) and then pass it on
19:15 jcamins Yeah, that's what it looks like.
19:15 cait hm
19:15 cait not sure that works well for libraires
19:15 cait for individuals I think it's easier
19:15 wizzyrea oh almost any library can write a check, at least in the US
19:15 cait than for institutions where someone needs to know where the money did g
19:15 cait o
19:15 jcamins cait: right, I can bill libraries directly.
19:16 cait yeah you can :)
19:16 cait was thinking about all this websites
19:16 wizzyrea oh it's 5%
19:16 wizzyrea that seems … like a lot?
19:16 * wizzyrea doesn't know
19:16 cait it is a lot
19:16 jcamins magnuse's question was about micro-crowdfunding (ooh! I am  a trendsetter, making up new words!), which is not really something I know how to do.
19:17 wizzyrea at least these people put their terms of use in normal language.
19:17 wizzyrea and normal sized type
19:18 jcamins 5% seems pretty standard.
19:18 jcamins indiegogo is 8%.
19:18 wizzyrea yuk
19:19 magnuse might be worth it if the alternative is sending bills to 100 people...
19:19 wizzyrea yea, it's your time vs money
19:19 wizzyrea which is more valuable?
19:19 jcamins magnuse: yeah, bountyoss would be a lot more viable than kickstarter for this.
19:19 * wizzyrea would go with "time"
19:20 * jcamins would agree.
19:20 magnuse not a lot of projects on bountyoss yet?!? but someone has to lead the way...
19:21 wizzyrea yea, idk.
19:21 * magnuse is writing invoices as we speak - not a fun passtime...
19:21 jcamins magnuse: FWIW, switching to QuickBooks from gnucash made invoicing a lot less painful.
19:23 jcamins You may have had the foresight not to try gnucash in the first place.
19:23 magnuse nope, i use a web based system
19:23 wizzyrea some things just haven't caught up yet.
19:24 magnuse tried to do my own book-keeping, and the invoice-thing is part of that
19:25 jcamins Oh, I do my own bookkeeping too. Even with QuickBooks, that's painful.
19:25 magnuse i gave up on doing my book-keeping
19:26 jcamins Smart!
19:26 magnuse again time is important, and i sleep better when i know there is someone else to blame :-)
19:26 * jcamins is so glad his grandfather is a CPA.
19:29 slef hahahahaha
19:29 slef you ever tried blaming QuickBooks?
19:29 slef I'm sure it was QuickBooks that the MD of my last company used and it botched our sales taxes.
19:30 wizzyrea and lord knows sleep is probably in short supply in the magnuse household :)
19:30 jcamins slef: no, that's why I have my grandfather check everything for me. (CPA = Certified Public Accountant)
19:30 jcamins wizzyrea: shhhh. magnuse just nodded off!
19:31 * wizzyrea whispers be vewwy quiet magnuse is sleeping
19:31 magnuse nah, still here!
19:31 wizzyrea shhhhhhhhh
19:31 magnuse :-)
19:31 wizzyrea :D
19:32 slef jcamins: do public and private enterprises use the same accounting rules in the US? They're quite different here - I think there's even a different professional body for public accountants here.
19:32 slef jcamins: anyway, the advice I received was to keep the accounting as simple as possible and so the co-op has done that most of the time
19:33 jcamins slef: they mostly do. Plus, it's not like I'm doing anything complicated.
19:33 magnuse jcamins: any tricks for billing the right people at the right time?
19:33 magnuse make all contracts start on january 1st?
19:35 slef magnuse: metadata and scheduled alerts...?
19:35 jcamins magnuse: I wanted to do that, but everyone seems to prefer start dates like October 15 (no, I'm not kidding).
19:36 jcamins I add estimates, and do billing the last and fifteenth day of every month.
19:36 jcamins Since I can post-date estimates, it's just a matter of checking to confirm that none of the dates are approaching.
19:37 jcamins The part that I have trouble with is almost-due reminders.
19:38 magnuse ?
19:39 magnuse ok, guess i am tired after all...
19:39 magnuse have fun #koha, i'm off!
19:39 jcamins Good night.
19:45 cait good night magnuse
19:47 jcamins Cool.
19:47 jcamins The suggestion plugin for 8211 is working, module translatability.
19:47 jcamins *modulo
19:47 slef bbl
19:48 jcamins Jeez, try to sound smart, and I end up sounding dumber than if I'd just used a regular word.
19:48 rangi Morning
19:49 wizzyrea mornin
19:51 cait morning
19:51 jcamins Morning.
19:51 wahanui somebody said morning was a state of mind. or whenever the cat wants breakfast.
19:52 hankbank joined #koha
19:52 wizzyrea hey hankbank
19:52 wahanui i think hankbank is not worthy
19:53 * wizzyrea scowls at wahanui
19:53 jcamins Hehe.
19:53 rangi Lol cron changes depending on how many bits your system is
19:54 rangi I appreciate that 'theory'
19:54 hankbank hoy!
19:55 hankbank i truly am not...
19:56 hankbank working on presentation to Future of Libraries conference in SF about Koha at LG needed to talk about IRC as cultural phenom
20:01 rangi It's been around a while I've been on ice since 93
20:05 wizzyrea everything old is new again
20:05 cait good night #koha
20:05 wizzyrea gnite cait
20:07 nengard left #koha
20:09 jcamins Where would I find an example of using C4::Templates?
20:09 jcamins Ooh.
20:09 jcamins Cart in master.
20:10 bag grep is your friend ;)
20:10 jcamins bag: but what exactly would I grep *for*?
20:11 bag "something"
20:11 bag heh
20:13 bag
20:13 bag lame I know ;)
20:16 jcamins Nifty feature, but none of those do quite what I wanted. I'm thinking I'll use gettemplate, notwithstanding the fact that it means putting an internal template in modules/
20:17 jcamins "Easy and close enough" has many advantages.
20:18 oleonard See ya #koha
20:22 libsysguy joined #koha
21:05 SJeffery joined #koha
21:08 rangi mveron++
21:08 rangi all we are missing now is Translation manager, QAM, and meeting chair(s)
21:08 rangi[…]ki/Roles_for_3.12
21:10 * SJeffery has the feeling he will be doing a lot of bug testing of 3.12 *looks at his calendar in bewilderment*
21:12 rangi put your name down as a bug wrangler :)
21:12 rambutan joined #koha
21:13 brylie joined #koha
21:14 SJeffery I prefer to pop out of the woodwork every once in a while to point out a whole bunch of bugs and then scamper for cover before the coders realize it.
21:14 rangi we know where you live
21:14 rangi :)
21:15 maximep left #koha
21:15 wizzyrea sjeffery?
21:15 wahanui sjeffery prefers to pop out of the woodwork every once in a while to point out a whole bunch of bugs and then scamper for cover before the coders realize it.
21:15 * wizzyrea giggles
21:15 SJeffery I hate you.
21:15 wizzyrea awwww
21:15 jcamins SJeffery: actually, that was all you. :)
21:16 jcamins @later tell oleonard The only thing remaining for my patch is to add jQuery-UI. The coding guidelines are not entirely clear about which files are needed, and where to put them. If you could give me a few pointers, that would be much appreciated.
21:16 huginn jcamins: The operation succeeded.
21:16 jcamins SJeffery: wahanui understands "I."
21:17 SJeffery jcamins: be nice or I will start bug testing your code again.
21:17 mtj we need that thermometer grapfic  on
21:17 jcamins SJeffery: oh, you'll have lots of opportunity. Your test server is due for some updates.
21:25 SJeffery joined #koha
21:45 trea left #koha
22:12 halcyonCorsair is there an easy way I can check to see whether my koha needs to run make upgrade?
22:14 rangi it should only need to run make upgrade if you are installing a new tarball
22:15 rangi make upgrade won't touch the database, that is done by and they way Koha knows if it should run that is by comparing what is in
22:15 rangi to what is stored in the version number in the db
22:19 rangi ie
22:19 rangi if  C4::Context->preference('Version') < C4::Context::KOHAVERSION;
22:21 halcyonCorsair rangi: so, if i'm updating to a new git checkout, then...?
22:22 rangi if you chose a dev install then the code is all updated, so no need to run make upgrade
22:22 rangi but you should run
22:23 rangi ./installer/data/mysql/
22:23 rangi if it doesnt need to do anything, it won't, but if it does need to, it will upgrade your database
22:23 rangi (normally this happens in the web browser)
22:23 halcyonCorsair rangi: if you do a dev install, then everything gets symlinked to point to the location of the checkout?
22:23 rangi yep
22:24 rangi so normally you would try to use koha, and if in the opac you would get the maintenance page, in the staff side you would get redirected and told your db needs to be upgraded
22:24 rangi but you can also just run the script from the cli
22:25 halcyonCorsair rangi: it should be harmless to just run?
22:25 rangi yup
22:25 rangi it does that comparison, and does nothing unless it needs to
22:26 rangi if you apt-get upgrade, it does that
22:29 halcyonCorsair rangi: if you want a play later, i have a pretty dirty recipe that's almost there
22:29 rangi ohh sweet
22:30 rangi unfortunately im stuck in answering rfp land today, but ill try to have a look tonight
22:33 halcyonCorsair rangi: oh yeah, how's the stability of the 3.8.x branch?
22:33 rangi both the 3.6.x and 3.8.x have monthly releases, but only bug fixes, on the 22nd of every month
22:34 rangi so 3.8.5 will be released on september 22
22:34 rangi we tag all releases
22:34 rangi so you could do
22:34 rangi git checkout v3.08.04
22:34 rangi would get you the 3.8.4 release, etc
22:42 halcyonCorsair rangi: will make install overwrite /etc config each time, or no?
22:43 rangi hmm its been a long time since ive done a tarball install
22:43 rangi i think yes
22:49 rambutan left #koha
22:53 jcamins_away Sometimes you need to run make upgrade.
22:54 jcamins_away When Zebra config files change.
22:58 halcyonCorsair jcamins_away: is there a way to detect that?
23:01 jcamins_away halcyonCorsair: if any file changes in etc/zebradb
23:02 halcyonCorsair jcamins_away: err
23:03 jcamins_away Agreed, detecting changes may be problematic.
23:06 jcamins_away Ooh, figured it out: git log --pretty=format:%cD -n 1 etc/zebradb
23:06 jcamins_away Wait, even better! git log --pretty=format:%ct -n 1 etc/zebradb
23:07 jcamins_away Then stat prev-install-log and compare the timestamps.
23:09 jcamins_away (note that this *only* applies to when you're doing development... in production you should *always* use packages)
23:11 rangi halcyonCorsair: jcamins_away isn't that far away from you, he's in new york
23:11 halcyonCorsair well, I guess I'll put the 'production' issue off for later :)
23:11 * jcamins_away waves widely so you can see from four hours north. :)
23:11 halcyonCorsair lol
23:12 halcyonCorsair jcamins_away: am thinking about swinging by NYC, but not sure whether it'll happen or not atthe moment
23:12 jcamins_away New York is... revolting today, actually.
23:13 halcyonCorsair jcamins: revolting, or in revolt?
23:13 jcamins The former.
23:13 wahanui the former is much more complicated.
23:13 jcamins The humidity is ca. 100%, it's warm, and it's trash collection day.
23:14 rangi eeew
23:17 halcyonCorsair yuck
23:17 halcyonCorsair do the packages run the web installer from the cmdline, or is that where they stop?
23:18 jcamins They run updatedatabase.
23:18 jcamins They do not run the initial webinstaller.
23:19 halcyonCorsair out of curiousity, can it be done?
23:19 papa joined #koha
23:19 rangi it could
23:19 rangi using something like mechanize
23:20 * jcamins uses mechanize to do it.
23:20 halcyonCorsair umm, unimarc/marc21? does it matter?
23:20 rangi actually jcamins, youve done it with your release scripts eh?
23:20 jcamins Yup.
23:20 jcamins halcyonCorsair: oh yes. MARC21.
23:20 rangi halcyonCorsair: for your purposes id choose MARC21
23:20 rangi UNIMARC is primarily Europe and mostly just france afaict
23:21 halcyonCorsair oops, ah well :) i'm about to blow it all away in a couple of minutes to see how clever I am anyway
23:21 jcamins halcyonCorsair:[…]
23:22 halcyonCorsair is there sample book data to import, or did I miss a step somewhere?
23:22 rangi nope you didn't
23:23 rangi it's something ive been meaning to add, but the easiest way to get one is to go to cataloguing, and use the z3950 search to import a record or 3 from library of congress
23:25 halcyonCorsair ah, ok
23:25 jcamins Library of Congress will only work if you're using MARC21.
23:27 rangi oh yeah
23:29 halcyonCorsair i'll try it post blowing away this VM then
23:29 halcyonCorsair preferred zebra option would be daemon, yes?
23:30 halcyonCorsair or no?
23:30 mtj hmm, what are the options?
23:30 wahanui the options are defined in the template.
23:33 jcamins Do not use zebraqueue daemon.
23:33 mtj what he said ^^
23:33 halcyonCorsair i'm looking at:[…]dexing_with_Zebra is that bad?
23:35 jcamins Oh, that one's fine. I like fredericd's daemon.
23:36 halcyonCorsair does anyone have an init script for it?
23:36 jcamins Ummm... tcohen does.
23:36 jcamins Somewhere in bugzilla.

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