| Time |
S |
Nick |
Message |
| 00:02 |
|
ftherese |
I think I hit the jackpot |
| 00:02 |
|
ftherese |
http://trd.mom.fr/article.php3?id_article=87 |
| 00:02 |
|
joetho |
I think I crashed my z39 client |
| 00:03 |
|
joetho |
that looks very french! |
| 00:04 |
|
joetho |
good luck ftherese. I need to leave pretty soon. |
| 00:04 |
|
ftherese |
thanks! |
| 00:05 |
|
joetho |
You'll find lots of answers here. |
| 00:05 |
|
ftherese |
the only problem now is that it locates the records but doesn't download them! |
| 00:05 |
|
ftherese |
ttyl |
| 00:05 |
|
joetho |
<---not so many from me, but from others |
| 00:05 |
|
joetho |
if you can see them you can download them, usually |
| 00:05 |
|
joetho |
you'll solve it |
| 00:05 |
|
joetho |
ttyl |
| 00:06 |
|
joetho |
after changing my targets a bit, my z39 client quit entirely |
| 00:06 |
|
joetho |
frozen. |
| 00:06 |
|
joetho |
Time to take a break. |
| 00:06 |
|
|
joetho left #koha |
| 00:07 |
|
|
rich-away is now known as richard |
| 00:21 |
|
pianohacker |
good night, #koha |
| 00:21 |
|
|
pianohacker left #koha |
| 00:25 |
|
|
nengard left #koha |
| 00:56 |
|
brendan |
cya in a bit #koha |
| 01:07 |
|
|
brendan left #koha |
| 02:36 |
|
chris_n2 |
C4::Search seems a bit convoluted to me |
| 02:36 |
|
chris |
damn skippy |
| 02:36 |
|
chris |
its on my proposal |
| 02:37 |
|
chris |
or the most part this module does it job, but it is overly complicated and hard to maintain and change. Refactoring this a major goal. |
| 02:37 |
|
chris_n2 |
I was going to try to dress up the available item count a bit, but on second thought... :-P |
| 02:37 |
|
chris |
yeah, its gonna get a rewrite |
| 02:39 |
|
chris_n2 |
"Availability: Copies available: Jones Library (1), Jones Library (1), " should be "Availability: Copies available: Jones Library (2)" imho |
| 02:40 |
|
chris |
that would certainly be a lot nicer |
| 03:21 |
|
* chris_n2 |
hears his pillow calling... g'night #koha |
| 03:21 |
|
chris |
night |
| 03:28 |
|
|
brendan joined #koha |
| 03:31 |
|
|
Amit joined #koha |
| 03:32 |
|
Amit |
hi chris, brendan |
| 03:32 |
|
Amit |
good morning #koha |
| 03:32 |
|
brendan |
Hi Amit |
| 03:32 |
|
brendan |
@wunder 93117 |
| 03:32 |
|
munin |
brendan: The current temperature in Northwest Goleta, Goleta, California is 15.6�C (7:27 PM PST on November 02, 2009). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 72%. Dew Point: 11.0�C. Pressure: 30.00 in 1015.8 hPa (Rising). |
| 03:42 |
|
Amit |
@wunder Delhi |
| 03:42 |
|
munin |
Amit: Error: No such location could be found. |
| 03:42 |
|
Amit |
@wunder New Delhi |
| 03:42 |
|
munin |
Amit: The current temperature in New Delhi, India is 21.0�C (8:30 AM IST on November 03, 2009). Conditions: Smoke. Humidity: 68%. Dew Point: 15.0�C. Pressure: 30.09 in 1019 hPa (Rising). |
| 03:43 |
|
Amit |
@wunder Bangalore |
| 03:43 |
|
munin |
Amit: The current temperature in Bangalore, India is 21.0�C (8:30 AM IST on November 03, 2009). Conditions: Partly Cloudy. Humidity: 79%. Dew Point: 18.0�C. |
| 04:02 |
|
|
brendan left #koha |
| 04:11 |
|
|
ian left #koha |
| 04:20 |
|
Amit |
@wunder Dehradun |
| 04:20 |
|
munin |
Amit: The current temperature in Dehradun, India is 14.0�C (5:30 AM IST on November 03, 2009). Conditions: Haze. Humidity: 78%. Dew Point: 12.0�C. Pressure: 30.09 in 1019 hPa. |
| 04:26 |
|
|
kernel_2 joined #koha |
| 04:31 |
|
|
greenmang0 joined #koha |
| 04:38 |
|
|
richard left #koha |
| 04:42 |
|
|
brendan joined #koha |
| 04:54 |
|
brendan |
night all |
| 04:54 |
|
|
brendan left #koha |
| 04:59 |
|
|
thd-away is now known as thd |
| 05:00 |
|
thd |
chris: are you there? |
| 05:09 |
|
|
kernel_2 left #koha |
| 06:11 |
|
|
nicomo joined #koha |
| 06:26 |
|
|
richard joined #koha |
| 06:26 |
|
richard |
back |
| 06:49 |
|
chris |
i am now thd |
| 06:50 |
|
thd |
chris: I had a question about non-Zebra Koha but I found the answer. |
| 06:50 |
|
chris |
cool |
| 06:50 |
|
chris |
http://www.itwire.com/content/view/29010/1090/ |
| 06:50 |
|
chris |
i think abrams has bit off more than he can chew really |
| 06:51 |
|
chris |
its starting to make mainstream press |
| 06:51 |
|
thd |
chris: Do you know of anyone using non-MARC Koha 3.0? |
| 06:52 |
|
|
kernel_2 joined #koha |
| 06:54 |
|
chris |
no |
| 06:54 |
|
chris |
but only because you cant |
| 06:54 |
|
chris |
not because they dont want to |
| 06:54 |
|
Ropuch |
Good morning #koha |
| 06:55 |
|
Ropuch |
Hi chris, thd |
| 06:55 |
|
thd |
hello Ropuch |
| 06:56 |
|
chris |
hi Ropuch |
| 06:56 |
|
thd |
chris: yes I had thought that the code to support non-MARC is gone. |
| 06:56 |
|
thd |
chris: having the system preference to allow the choice of code which is no-longer there is dangerous. |
| 06:57 |
|
|
indradg joined #koha |
| 06:58 |
|
thd |
chris: The value should not be adjustable without changing the code unless there is some intention to support the option . |
| 06:59 |
|
chris |
yes |
| 07:02 |
|
|
magnusenger joined #koha |
| 07:04 |
|
thd |
chris: If Abram had made the investigation of Koha of and Evergreen which he claims that libraries should, then he would have knowledge for criticisms which might legitimately scare libraries. |
| 07:06 |
|
thd |
chris: Misdirecting people is easier than doing the hard work of informing them about important issues. |
| 07:10 |
|
chris |
exactly |
| 07:10 |
|
thd |
Does Koha and Evergreen violate hundreds of SirsiDynix patents come next? |
| 07:10 |
|
chris |
i suspect so |
| 07:11 |
|
chris |
i don't think he realised that he has now picked a fight with the entire floss community, not just liblime and equinox, who were his targets |
| 07:11 |
|
chris |
there is a comment pending from me for his blog, which im waiting to see if he lets through |
| 07:11 |
|
thd |
then the issue may make it to Slashdot |
| 07:12 |
|
chris |
it made Linux Weekly News and Free Software Daily |
| 07:12 |
|
chris |
i suspect it might make linux journal and the register next |
| 07:13 |
|
chris |
he left himslef wide open with this |
| 07:13 |
|
chris |
As everyone can note, and having been a librarian for over 30 years, I do my research based on as much information as I can get whether I have to ask for it or not. It's just not that big a barrier when the decision is important. Others may disagree but I just have this value system that guides me to seek the full information regardless of my personal preferences and beliefs |
| 07:13 |
|
chris |
which is his reply to the latest comment |
| 07:13 |
|
chris |
so i quoted that and said |
| 07:14 |
|
chris |
In that case, for FLOSS everyone can get the full information, will you give me the source code for symphony if I ask for it? If so, consider this asking for it |
| 07:15 |
|
chris |
he also said "When I have the full information, only then I can make my recommendations and decisions." |
| 07:15 |
|
chris |
and I said, this is what FLOSS allows ... why are you against it? |
| 07:16 |
|
chris |
so it wil be interesting to see if it makes it |
| 07:18 |
|
thd |
He has said that he is for it except for his own business. |
| 07:20 |
|
thd |
He basically said at some point that open source is OK even SirsiDynix uses it when appropriate but it is a poor choice for the ILS as a whole.. |
| 07:22 |
|
thd |
When SirsiDynix is integrating it, then open source is OK. When replacing SirsiDynix, then open source is communism. |
| 07:22 |
|
chris |
yep :) |
| 07:23 |
|
|
laurenc1 joined #koha |
| 07:24 |
|
thd |
chris: If he replies, I expect you will have some equivalent to that would undermine our business, that would be communism argument. |
| 07:24 |
|
chris |
the longer he tries to defend his position, the worse it looks |
| 07:24 |
|
chris |
*nod* |
| 07:25 |
|
thd |
The trouble is that SirsiDynix is no longer being run by people who are concentrating on making good software for libraries. |
| 07:26 |
|
thd |
Those good people sold out. |
| 07:26 |
|
thd |
The recent management is scary. |
| 07:28 |
|
chris |
yep, and abrams is a major shareholder and is rearranging deck chairs on the titanic |
| 07:29 |
|
thd |
The may not be scary enough to make real legal threats but I have had a detailed question prepared for the Software Freedom Law Center for the past couple of months specifically about the Sirsi API and committing migration code to Koha which uses it. |
| 07:30 |
|
thd |
We need solid legal advice as a basis for encouraging one of the major areas which support companies hold back on committing code to Koha. |
| 07:30 |
|
|
kf joined #koha |
| 07:31 |
|
kf |
morning #koha |
| 07:31 |
|
thd |
We should have system X to Koha migration scripts in Koha. |
| 07:31 |
|
thd |
hello kf |
| 07:31 |
|
kf |
hello thd |
| 07:32 |
|
kf |
thd: got my mail? |
| 07:32 |
|
thd |
I had not seen it yet. |
| 07:32 |
|
* thd |
checks his mail |
| 07:34 |
|
chris |
id prefer that to be in its in own repository |
| 07:34 |
|
chris |
and not part of koha |
| 07:35 |
|
chris |
in all the migrations i have been part of, i have made it the libraries job to get the data out |
| 07:35 |
|
chris |
i dont want to taint koha |
| 07:35 |
|
chris |
its just not worth it |
| 07:35 |
|
chris |
even if you have a solid case, that often doesnt matter |
| 07:35 |
|
chris |
its easier/safer to just avoid the issue |
| 07:36 |
|
thd |
chris: being right is often not of much matter but we need to find a safe way to share such scripts where they are free and everyone can contribute to them. |
| 07:37 |
|
chris |
yeah, id prefer they are totally seperate to koha |
| 07:37 |
|
thd |
s/matter/matter in court/ |
| 07:39 |
|
thd |
chris: However, even if you link or otherwise point to the repository over there whatever legal hazard exists will exist for merely pointing. |
| 07:39 |
|
|
audun joined #koha |
| 07:40 |
|
|
richard left #koha |
| 07:46 |
|
magnusenger |
oups, i have my migration scripts (for Norwegian ILSs) in a GitHub repo, that's pointed to from the "public git repos" page on the wiki... |
| 07:46 |
|
magnusenger |
i can't imagine norwegian companies suing anyone over that, though... |
| 07:47 |
|
thd |
ng. |
| 07:47 |
|
thd |
ng. |
| 07:47 |
|
thd |
ng. |
| 07:47 |
|
thd |
ng. |
| 07:47 |
|
thd |
ng. |
| 07:47 |
|
thd |
ng. |
| 07:47 |
|
thd |
ng. |
| 07:47 |
|
thd |
ng. |
| 07:47 |
|
chris |
thd: yep, hence why i never have |
| 07:47 |
|
thd |
ng. |
| 07:47 |
|
thd |
ng. |
| 07:47 |
|
thd |
ng. |
| 07:47 |
|
thd |
ng. |
| 07:47 |
|
thd |
ng. |
| 07:47 |
|
thd |
ng. |
| 07:47 |
|
thd |
ng. |
| 07:47 |
|
thd |
ng. |
| 07:47 |
|
thd |
ng. |
| 07:47 |
|
thd |
ng. |
| 07:47 |
|
thd |
ng. |
| 07:47 |
|
thd |
ng. |
| 07:47 |
|
thd |
ng. |
| 07:48 |
|
magnusenger |
ng? |
| 07:50 |
|
thd |
oops, I have had a keyboard bug for the past several months. |
| 07:51 |
|
magnusenger |
looks like a "next generation"-bug? ;-) |
| 07:52 |
|
thd |
magnusenger: Being Norwegian helped but not quite enough for Jon Johansen. |
| 07:53 |
|
thd |
magnusenger: Fortunately, we are not adversaries of the big content industry. |
| 07:54 |
|
magnusenger |
well, he was on trial, but found "not guilty" twice... |
| 07:54 |
|
magnusenger |
true! |
| 07:54 |
|
magnusenger |
should i remove the link? |
| 07:54 |
|
thd |
magnusenger: Even being accused is no fun. |
| 07:54 |
|
magnusenger |
thd: very true! |
| 07:55 |
|
thd |
magnusenger: No, you should not be afraid to develop useful software. |
| 07:55 |
|
thd |
magnusenger: The Koha community needs to seek legal advice about the issue to minimise risks. |
| 07:56 |
|
magnusenger |
thd: sounds reasonable |
| 07:56 |
|
magnusenger |
thd: i would imagine its mostly a US problem, though? What with everyone suing everyone over anything all the time... ;-) |
| 07:57 |
|
thd |
Fortunately, there are very good lawyers who have funding to help free software projects. |
| 07:59 |
|
magnusenger |
it's actually something libraries should be worrying about: what kind of access and ownership do they really have to their own data? |
| 07:59 |
|
thd |
magnusenger: It is mostly a US problem but many want to have the long term Koha foundation based in the US because of the larger financial benefits which may be possible. |
| 08:00 |
|
thd |
magnusenger: Do Norwegian ILS companies charge for accessing data from the old system when migrating? |
| 08:00 |
|
chris |
civica used to, probably still do |
| 08:00 |
|
hdl_laptop |
hi |
| 08:00 |
|
chris |
hi hdl_laptop |
| 08:01 |
|
thd |
hello hdl_laptop |
| 08:01 |
|
magnusenger |
thd: it varies: my customer #1 had to pay for 3-4 hours of work to extract marc, loans, holdings and patrons. I know another library paid about USD 500 to get a script developed that would allow them to get their marc out at any time |
| 08:02 |
|
thd |
magnusenger: Those are trivial sums compared to the sense I have of some charges to access data in the ILS. |
| 08:02 |
|
magnusenger |
trouble is: libraries arn't migrating much... ;-) |
| 08:03 |
|
magnusenger |
thd: yes, it's not much, but it should be free and the libraries should be able to get hold of whatever data they want at any time, without going through the vendor... |
| 08:04 |
|
magnusenger |
thd: customer #1 had to wait for a couple months before the old vendor got round to extracting the data... |
| 08:05 |
|
thd |
magnusenger: Do Norwegian libraries typically contract a maintenance agreement for a few years which locks them to a vendor during that period? |
| 08:06 |
|
magnusenger |
thd: i don't have any stats on that, but i *think* it's mostly one year at a time |
| 08:06 |
|
thd |
chris: is a multi-year maintenance contract part of the proprietary ILS model in NZ? |
| 08:07 |
|
thd |
magnusenger: So the Norwegian ILS contract period may be similar to the typical French one year period. The US period is usually 3-5 years. |
| 08:08 |
|
magnusenger |
thd: wow, that makes things a lot harder! |
| 08:08 |
|
chris |
thd: yes |
| 08:08 |
|
chris |
its even worse here |
| 08:09 |
|
chris |
because its a small market, far from anywhere except australia |
| 08:09 |
|
chris |
so you pay your 3 years |
| 08:09 |
|
thd |
magnusenger: The advantage in the US is that the market is much larger than elsewhere and more libraries spend large sums. |
| 08:09 |
|
chris |
and there isnt even anyone in your country to do support |
| 08:09 |
|
magnusenger |
chris: ouch! |
| 08:11 |
|
|
Kivutar joined #koha |
| 08:12 |
|
thd |
chris: They need free software migration code to show libraries everywhere how easy it is. |
| 08:21 |
|
chris |
i dont mind the libraries doing that :) |
| 08:21 |
|
chris |
i think its safer for the vendors not too tho |
| 08:22 |
|
chris |
here the libraries have helped each other |
| 08:22 |
|
chris |
you have to be fairly mental to sue a library |
| 08:22 |
|
chris |
but going after a vendor, thats accepted behaviour |
| 08:24 |
|
thd |
chris: That one reason why we need code assignment. |
| 08:24 |
|
thd |
... with a grant back of rights. |
| 08:26 |
|
thd |
chris: Howevr, I suppose a largely library controlled Koha foundation would seem just like another vendor to some litigious companies which would never sue an individual library. |
| 08:26 |
|
chris |
im not sure that will actually protect you |
| 08:26 |
|
chris |
yes exactly |
| 08:27 |
|
chris |
my position is that it is too dangerous to paint a target on ourselves |
| 08:27 |
|
chris |
let something like kudos handle that |
| 08:28 |
|
|
francharb joined #koha |
| 08:28 |
|
thd |
chris: There is certainly something short of system X to Koha would be quite safe. |
| 08:30 |
|
thd |
chris: High level Koha migration scripts which normalise data for Koha but are not specific to any proprietary system could be safely developed. |
| 08:30 |
|
thd |
s/developed/developed in an open repository/ |
| 08:31 |
|
|
anasha joined #koha |
| 08:58 |
|
hdl_laptop |
happy birthday kahu |
| 08:58 |
|
chris |
not til the 20th :) but thanks |
| 09:34 |
|
|
ftherese left #koha |
| 09:46 |
|
|
reiko joined #koha |
| 09:46 |
|
reiko |
hello |
| 09:47 |
|
Amit |
hello reiko |
| 09:53 |
|
|
ftherese joined #koha |
| 10:03 |
|
|
Jpr joined #koha |
| 10:05 |
|
Jpr |
Hi all, I'm looking for a bit of help with zebra... we recently changed (almost) all of our passwords on our server, and while nothing else has been adversely affected, Zebra indexing isn't working any longer |
| 10:05 |
|
Jpr |
it seems as though zebra is still trying to access Mysql with the old password, but I can't for the life of me find a config file to change this |
| 10:06 |
|
Jpr |
I say this b/c il koha-zebraqueue-output.log is giving an error of this sort: |
| 10:07 |
|
Jpr |
DBI connect('dbname=kohadb;host=localhost;port=3306','xxxxx',...) failed: Access denied for user 'xxxx'@'localhost' (using password: YES) at /usr/share/koha/lib/C4/Context.pm line 666 |
| 10:10 |
|
reiko |
after migrating from koha 2.2.8 to koha 3.0, is there any way to migrate the parameters aswell ? |
| 10:10 |
|
ftherese |
is there any way to add staff users? |
| 10:10 |
|
ftherese |
or do they all log in with the admin account? |
| 10:11 |
|
chris |
ftherese: a staff user is just a patron, but you assign them some privileges |
| 10:11 |
|
ftherese |
aahhh good... ok thanks |
| 10:12 |
|
chris |
yep, time to ressurect ithttp://koha.org/documentation/[…]?searchterm=staff |
| 10:12 |
|
chris |
hmm bad paste |
| 10:12 |
|
chris |
http://koha.org/documentation/[…]?searchterm=staff |
| 10:12 |
|
chris |
i recommend the docs :) |
| 10:14 |
|
magnusenger |
Jpr: the settings should be at the bottom of /etc/koha/koha-conf.xml on a normal install |
| 10:22 |
|
Jpr |
yes, that's the strange thing, that koha-conf.xml has been updated with the new password and a login to mysql from the command line using the same username and pw from koha-conf.xml works just fine |
| 10:24 |
|
ftherese |
hmmm I can't seem to add a patron |
| 10:24 |
|
chris |
right bedtime for me |
| 10:24 |
|
ftherese |
maybe I need to add a category of patrons frist? |
| 10:25 |
|
magnusenger |
Jpr: hm, that is strange... and you tried stopping/starting zebra? |
| 10:25 |
|
magnusenger |
g'night, chris! |
| 10:26 |
|
Jpr |
yes, though perhaps I could try it again... |
| 10:28 |
|
Jpr |
when, I try a manual rebuild of the zebra indexes I get the following error (if that helps at all...): |
| 10:29 |
|
Jpr |
Can't locate C4/Context.pm in @INC (@INC contains: /etc/perl /usr/local/lib/perl/5.8.8 /usr/local/share/perl/5.8.8 /usr/lib/perl5 /usr/share/perl5 /usr/lib/perl/5.8 /usr/share/perl/5.8 /usr/local/lib/site_perl .) at /usr/share/koha/bin/migration_tools/rebuild_zebra.pl line 5.BEGIN failed--compilation aborted at /usr/share/koha/bin/migration_tools/rebuild_zebra.pl line 5. |
| 10:30 |
|
Jpr |
which is where the rebuild zebra script calls the context script |
| 10:33 |
|
hdl_laptop |
export KOHA_CONF=/path/to/koha-conf.xml |
| 10:34 |
|
hdl_laptop |
ftherese: yes you need a patron category to add a patron |
| 10:35 |
|
|
reiko left #koha |
| 10:38 |
|
Jpr |
hdl_laptop: I just re-exported that variable, as per your suggestion, but it doesn't seem to have helped |
| 10:40 |
|
hdl_laptop |
you also should have EXPORT PERL5LIB set to your koha source directory |
| 10:43 |
|
Jpr |
that's already the case as well |
| 10:44 |
|
hdl_laptop |
doesnot look it is set : |
| 10:44 |
|
hdl_laptop |
@INC contains no path to koha sources ;) |
| 10:44 |
|
munin |
hdl_laptop: Error: "INC" is not a valid command. |
| 10:46 |
|
Jpr |
hdl_laptop: you're right, thanks, I'd done a printenv, and didn't think to have to re-export the variable; thanks again. |
| 10:47 |
|
hdl_laptop |
no problems. |
| 10:48 |
|
Jpr |
magnusenger: it seems like restarting zebra has gotten indexing humming along again; thanks for the suggestion |
| 10:49 |
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magnusenger |
Jpr: you're welcome! |
| 10:50 |
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Topic for #koha is now Discussion channel for the Koha ILS | Next general IRC meeting will be held on 4 November 2009 at 10:00 UTC+0 | Time Converter: http://tinyurl.com/ydkgnn4 |
| 12:54 |
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chris_n |
g'morning #koha |
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Nate |
good morning #koha ! |
| 13:00 |
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reiko |
hello |
| 13:03 |
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| 13:15 |
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reiko |
has anyone migrated fro 2.2.* to 3.0 ? |
| 13:22 |
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hdl_laptop |
many of our customers did. |
| 13:22 |
|
reiko |
i'm having so much troubles migrating |
| 13:22 |
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reiko |
many of the scripts don't seem to work |
| 13:22 |
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hdl_laptop |
(they all use UNIMARC) |
| 13:23 |
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reiko |
yes, that makes it easier |
| 13:24 |
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hdl_laptop |
well we assisted them. |
| 13:25 |
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hdl_laptop |
and it still is quite heavy |
| 13:27 |
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| 13:30 |
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| 13:31 |
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chris_n |
howdy owen |
| 13:31 |
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ftherese |
Hello |
| 13:31 |
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owen |
Hi |
| 13:32 |
|
ftherese |
I just created a staff user and I can't log in with the account and password that I created for him |
| 13:32 |
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ftherese |
it is the first Patron that I have created |
| 13:32 |
|
ftherese |
also... the library doesn't remain set when I log out of kohaadmin |
| 13:33 |
|
ftherese |
what is the problem? |
| 13:33 |
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chris_n |
ftherese: kohaadmin is technically the db user and does not have a "proper" koha account and so that setting is not retained for that user |
| 13:34 |
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chris_n |
ftherese: did you set the proper permissions for the user account you created? |
| 13:35 |
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| 13:36 |
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ftherese |
I created a library |
| 13:36 |
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ftherese |
then I created a patron type of staff |
| 13:36 |
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chris_n |
ftherese: see http://koha.org/documentation/[…]atron-permissions |
| 13:36 |
|
ftherese |
then I created a new patron |
| 13:41 |
|
* owen |
is happy to see that work might be done on Bug 1611 |
| 13:41 |
|
munin |
Bug http://bugs.koha.org/cgi-bin/b[…]w_bug.cgi?id=1611 normal, P5, ---, jeanandre.santoni biblibre.com, NEW, Intelligently redirect users after they have been asked to log into the Opac |
| 13:43 |
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ftherese |
@chris_n thank you! That was it... permissions had to be set |
| 13:43 |
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munin |
ftherese: Error: "chris_n" is not a valid command. |
| 13:43 |
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ftherese |
well fine then |
| 13:44 |
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ftherese |
chris_n: thank you! That was it... permissions had to be set |
| 13:45 |
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| 13:45 |
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chris_n |
ftherese: np, glad to help |
| 13:46 |
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* chris_n |
greets Colin |
| 13:46 |
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Colin |
Hi |
| 13:53 |
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| 13:53 |
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|Lupin| |
hello :) |
| 14:04 |
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hdl_laptop |
hi |Lupin| |
| 14:05 |
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|Lupin| |
hello hdl_laptop |
| 14:08 |
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| 14:08 |
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|Lupin| |
perl question please |
| 14:08 |
|
|Lupin| |
my $uploaded_file_name = $input->param($file_field_name); |
| 14:09 |
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|Lupin| |
$uploaded_file_name is both a filename and a filehandle |
| 14:09 |
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|Lupin| |
so for instance if it is passed as a parameter to a template for being displayed, the result is odd because there is first the file handle which is displayed, like fh0001 and then the name |
| 14:10 |
|
|
rhcl_out is now known as rhcl |
| 14:10 |
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|Lupin| |
the only way I've come up with so far to have a correct display is to pass '' . $uploaded_file_name to my template |
| 14:10 |
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|Lupin| |
but I don't find this very satisfactory and I'm wondering whether there is a cleaner way to do this |
| 14:11 |
|
|Lupin| |
(I can imagine very well a maintainance programmer seeing this '' . $foo and simplifying it to $foo because he/she finds the '' . useless... |
| 14:19 |
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| 14:20 |
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Colin |
Lupin: uploaded_file_name is a reference? To an array? |
| 14:25 |
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|Lupin| |
Colin: no no |
| 14:27 |
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| 14:27 |
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Colin |
OK It can be the filename or the opened filehandle |
| 14:28 |
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|Lupin| |
Colin: it's a scalar, but depending on the context it can be interpreted as a handle, for instance you can write <$uploaded_file_name> |
| 14:28 |
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|Lupin| |
Colin: yeah exactly |
| 14:29 |
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|Lupin| |
Colin: and my quesiton is: is there a way to use it in a non-ambiguous way in those contexts whichh Perl can't de-ambiguate... |
| 14:31 |
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Colin |
Lupin: I think there is.. I think I used it once... I'll check |
| 14:31 |
|
|Lupin| |
Colin: thanks a lot |
| 14:32 |
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|Lupin| |
Colin: fo the moment the only whay I have found is to concatenate an empty string, but IMO it's not very clean and someone may remove it thinking it's useless |
| 14:32 |
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|Lupin| |
Colin: do you think the scalar function would be a good candidate ? |
| 14:33 |
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Colin |
Lupin: I was thinking ref |
| 14:35 |
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| 14:35 |
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|Lupin| |
Colin: like putting a ref and removing it immediately ? I'm not sure I understand wy that would work... |
| 14:35 |
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|Lupin| |
hi gmcharlt |
| 14:36 |
|
gmcharlt |
hi |Lupin| |
| 14:36 |
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|Lupin| |
gmcharlt: would you have 1 minute for a Perl quesiton, pls ? |
| 14:36 |
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gmcharlt |
what's the question |
| 14:36 |
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|Lupin| |
gmcharlt: my $uploaded_file_name = $input->param($file_field_name); |
| 14:36 |
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Colin |
Lupin ref returns what your variable is |
| 14:36 |
|
|Lupin| |
gmcharlt: this gives back an object which is both a file name and a handle to the opened file |
| 14:37 |
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|Lupin| |
gmcharlt: I'm wondering how to tell Perl to interprete it as a string i |
| 14:37 |
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|Lupin| |
gmcharlt: oops |
| 14:37 |
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|Lupin| |
gmcharlt: if you give that to a parameter to a template, it's displayed wrongly because Perl prints the file handle and then the name |
| 14:38 |
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|Lupin| |
gmcharlt: I can get a correct display (only the name) if I give as a parameter to the template the expession '' . $uploaded_file_name because here Perl knows from the context that one is refering to the name rather than to the handle |
| 14:39 |
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|Lupin| |
gmcharlt: but I find this ugly and would like to find a more readable way |
| 14:39 |
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|Lupin| |
gmcharlt: does the question make sense ? |
| 14:40 |
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| 14:41 |
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gmcharlt |
|Lupin|: '' . $foo + a comment works |
| 14:42 |
|
reiko |
hello |
| 14:42 |
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|Lupin| |
gmcharlt: ok... I hoped I could find something more elegant but perhaps elegance is not something one should be too picky about when programming in Perl.. |
| 14:43 |
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|Lupin| |
hi reiko |
| 14:43 |
|
reiko |
hi |Lupin|, i'm having problems with my koha migration |
| 14:43 |
|
reiko |
can i ask some questions ? |
| 14:44 |
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Colin |
Lupin: Its the ugly side of DWIM |
| 14:45 |
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|Lupin| |
reiko: just ask your questions, don't ask if you can ask... :) |
| 14:45 |
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|Lupin| |
Colin: perhaps... I feel more comfortable with more strict languages... |
| 14:46 |
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Colin |
Lupin We all do on occasions |
| 14:47 |
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|Lupin| |
Colin: well for me it's not _on occasions_ ! :) |
| 14:47 |
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| 14:47 |
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reiko |
i'm having trouble running some of the scripts in the migration tutorial: move_marc_to_authheader.pl gives me an error and i think that keeps me from having authorities in koha |
| 14:48 |
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| 14:48 |
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reiko |
i see that many of koha migration scripts are for UNIMARC, and i guess that script is too, is there anyway to migrate my authorities that are MARC21 from koha 2.2.8 to koha 3.0 ? |
| 14:49 |
|
|Lupin| |
reiko: I have no idea, I'm sorry |
| 14:50 |
|
|Lupin| |
reiko: I think if you don't get any useful reply here, jsut send an e-mail to the Koha mailing list, it has a rather large audience and I would be very surprised if you get no valuable help from there |
| 14:52 |
|
reiko |
okay, thank you |Lupin| |
| 14:56 |
|
|Lupin| |
reiko: np :) didn't do much, unfortunately |
| 15:00 |
|
kf |
there is a mail on german mailing list asking about koha on windoes |
| 15:00 |
|
reiko |
|Lupin| what flavour do you use, MARC21? |
| 15:01 |
|
kf |
I think 2.2.9 was last version working on windows? |
| 15:03 |
|
paul_p |
kf: right. noone could install 3.0 on windows (some perl dependancies) |
| 15:03 |
|
paul_p |
the right solution with win is to have a VM with linux/koha |
| 15:06 |
|
kf |
paul_p: thx :) |
| 15:06 |
|
chris_n |
kf: we're very close with the latest Strawberry release |
| 15:07 |
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chris_n |
we need to have gdbm compile on win32 now |
| 15:07 |
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| 15:07 |
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chris_n |
kf: I'm working on it in my spare (what's that?) time... :-) |
| 15:08 |
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| 15:09 |
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owen |
Good to keep in mind: http://www.wired.com/science/d[…]ews/2006/02/70179 |
| 15:10 |
|
jwagner |
owen, as jdavidb likes to say, You Mean They Didn't Purchase the Psychic Module???? |
| 15:11 |
|
* jdavidb |
wants to develop a Psychic Module for koha, but the underlying technology is not under the GPL... |
| 15:15 |
|
jdavidb |
If I got it working, you could just bill deadbeat borrowers for lost items at the moment of checkout. That's V1. I regard the ability to predict what goofiness the library director or board will come up with next as technically unlikely. |
| 15:15 |
|
jwagner |
But it's NOT unlikely that there WILL be goofiness! |
| 15:15 |
|
jdavidb |
absolutely. That's a certainty. Management Training, you know. |
| 15:16 |
|
paul_p |
hello "j" ( I mean jdavidb, jwagner ) |
| 15:16 |
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paul_p is now known as jpaul_p |
| 15:16 |
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jdavidb |
Hi, jpaul_p! :D |
| 15:16 |
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jpaul_p |
new rule: your nick must start by j if you want to write on this channel :D |
| 15:16 |
|
jwagner |
I went through all the study and training to get my Project Management Professional certification. Once I had it, I happened to go back and re-read some Dilbert collections. It was hilarious how much of it was almost word for word from some of the training materials. |
| 15:17 |
|
jwagner |
jpaul_p, that sounds like a very GOOD rule! |
| 15:19 |
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| 15:20 |
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|Lupin| is now known as j|Lupin| |
| 15:20 |
|
* jdavidb |
cackles with laughter. |
| 15:21 |
|
* j|Lupin| |
dicts for cackle and realises it's close to the french caqueter |
| 15:22 |
|
* jdavidb |
dicts for caqueter, and sees that j|Lupin| is right. |
| 15:23 |
|
j|Lupin| |
cackle seems more... mignon to me than caqueter, though, the l has something more close to what it is talking about... |
| 15:24 |
|
jdavidb |
What is distressing is that I'm already being silly and laughing hysterically this early in the week. Normally, takes longer before I get goofy. |
| 15:24 |
|
jwagner |
I was just telling jdavidb, this level of silliness so early in the week does not bode well for the remainder of the week.... |
| 15:25 |
|
jdavidb |
Should make for an entertaining meeting tomorrow |
| 15:31 |
|
chris_n |
quick git question: how do I create a branch off of my current working branch? git checkout -b test_branch current_branch |
| 15:31 |
|
kf |
chris_n: would you recommend installing koha on windows? will it be supported in the same way than the linux version? can yuo get bugfixes from git etc? perhaps I should just redirect his windows question to koha mailing list hm |
| 15:32 |
|
chris_n |
kf: the goal is to be able to work off of the same codebase |
| 15:32 |
|
chris_n |
kf: afaik there is not a win32 port of git |
| 15:32 |
|
chris_n |
kf: but otherwise it would work the same |
| 15:33 |
|
chris_n |
kf: just a reminder, though, we're not there quite yet, but very close |
| 15:34 |
|
* chris_n |
never recommends windows for anything in reality... but that may just be a personal bias... ;-) |
| 15:34 |
|
chris_n |
although if you remove windows, you can get rid of a bunch of stale air |
| 15:36 |
|
kf |
chris_n: thx :) |
| 15:37 |
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nengard joined #koha |
| 15:37 |
|
chris_n |
hi nengard! |
| 15:37 |
|
nengard |
hiya! |
| 15:38 |
|
jdavidb |
Hi, nengard. |
| 15:41 |
|
jwagner |
I have some questions for sites set up as consortia -- no crossover in cataloging, patrons, circ, etc. It looks like some sysprefs only allow one entry, meaning not all libraries in the system can use them. Is this correct? |
| 15:42 |
|
jwagner |
For example, AnonSuggestions (only one dummy patron ID, which would be tied to one library), MARC subfield for call number, MARC Org Code. |
| 15:42 |
|
jwagner |
How do consortia setups handle these? |
| 15:42 |
|
jdavidb |
Cage matches, I think, Jane. |
| 15:43 |
|
jwagner |
Entertaining idea, but not quite what I was looking for :-( |
| 15:53 |
|
nengard |
LOL |
| 15:55 |
|
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brendan joined #koha |
| 15:56 |
|
wizzyrea |
this is the kind of stuff that we thought was going to be part of sysgroups |
| 15:56 |
|
wizzyrea |
where every branch had a set of these prefs |
| 15:56 |
|
wizzyrea |
don't think it's going to make it into 3.2 though, the dev was abandoned |
| 15:59 |
|
jwagner |
wizzyrea, so my suspicion that there's no way to share these at present is correct? |
| 16:00 |
|
nengard |
wizzyrea - development abandoned? I thought this was something NEKLS wanted/sponsored - was I wrong? |
| 16:03 |
|
jwagner |
Unrelated topic/question -- what's the syntax for having munin tell someone something later? |
| 16:04 |
|
brendan |
jwagner it's @later |
| 16:04 |
|
nengard |
ooo - I didn't know you could do that :) |
| 16:04 |
|
nengard |
is there a list of syntax for munin in general? |
| 16:04 |
|
jwagner |
brendan, @later followed by the person's handle, then the message? |
| 16:05 |
|
brendan |
yes so --- @later tell nengard - good morning |
| 16:05 |
|
jwagner |
OK, thanks. I'll give it a try here. |
| 16:05 |
|
brendan |
@later nengard good moring |
| 16:05 |
|
munin |
brendan: Error: The "Later" plugin is loaded, but there is no command named "nengard" in it. Try "list Later" to see the commands in the "Later" plugin. |
| 16:06 |
|
jpaul_p |
wizzyrea / jwagner = we have something about this (branch level syspref) sponsored by Lyon 3 (for 3.4) |
| 16:06 |
|
nengard |
hmmm |
| 16:06 |
|
jwagner |
@list Later |
| 16:06 |
|
munin |
jwagner: notes and tell |
| 16:06 |
|
brendan |
@later tell |
| 16:06 |
|
munin |
brendan: (later tell <nick> <text>) -- Tells <nick> <text> the next time <nick> is in seen. <nick> can contain wildcard characters, and the first matching nick will be given the note. |
| 16:06 |
|
nengard |
@later tell jwagner hi there - testing later :) |
| 16:06 |
|
munin |
nengard: The operation succeeded. |
| 16:06 |
|
nengard |
woo hoo - it worked |
| 16:07 |
|
jwagner |
jpaul_p, your development is a ways off, then? Not going to be in 3.2? |
| 16:07 |
|
jpaul_p |
jwagner: yep |
| 16:07 |
|
jwagner |
OK, somthing to look forward to, then. Thanks. |
| 16:07 |
|
owen |
I wonder if it works in reverse? |
| 16:07 |
|
owen |
@before tell owen not to order the crab |
| 16:07 |
|
munin |
owen: Error: "before" is not a valid command. |
| 16:08 |
|
|
jpaul_p is now known as paul_p |
| 16:08 |
|
owen |
Dang. munin is not paradox-tolerant. |
| 16:08 |
|
jwagner |
@later tell pianohacker Since you're working on sysprefs interface etc., see Bug 3755 -- possible to include? |
| 16:08 |
|
munin |
jwagner: The operation succeeded. |
| 16:08 |
|
schuster |
OK new question - when I print slip or print page in Circ - the Overdue item doesn't show up??? |
| 16:08 |
|
jwagner |
owen, reference earlier discussion -- munin apparently doesn't include the Psychic Module either. |
| 16:09 |
|
owen |
Nor a telekinetic one. He never brings me coffee. |
| 16:10 |
|
schuster |
hmmm doesn't do it for all but I have a patron it isn't printing for...??? |
| 16:10 |
|
jwagner |
schuster, it does print overdues OK for other people? |
| 16:12 |
|
schuster |
never mind it was on the third page only thing to print! ahhh... |
| 16:12 |
|
schuster |
goes screaming from the room... |
| 16:12 |
|
jwagner |
I _TOLD_ you it was going to be a bad week..... |
| 16:13 |
|
|
brendan left #koha |
| 16:19 |
|
Ropuch |
jwagner: so true |
| 16:19 |
|
Ropuch |
;> |
| 16:19 |
|
nengard |
does anyone have JS they use for this preference: intranetuserjs that they want to share with me for the manual/screenshots? |
| 16:20 |
|
schuster |
I have a couple... Let me see what I can find. |
| 16:20 |
|
nengard |
same for 'opacuserjs' |
| 16:20 |
|
nengard |
thanks schuster |
| 16:21 |
|
nengard |
jwagner it should be a good week for me - my last home before 2 weeks in Europe - but I kind of agree with you - it's gonna be NUTS for me - and so - not a good week |
| 16:22 |
|
schuster |
email with 2 for intranet. |
| 16:23 |
|
wizzyrea |
nengard: we wanted it, we were told it was in development by someone else and that if we were just patient we would get it. |
| 16:23 |
|
nengard |
ah :( that sucks :( |
| 16:23 |
|
schuster |
Sorry none for opacuserjs - fyi owen gave me the two I have. |
| 16:23 |
|
nengard |
and thanks schuster!! |
| 16:23 |
|
wizzyrea |
we were never approached to put funds towards that project |
| 16:24 |
|
wizzyrea |
(I suspect we would though) |
| 16:24 |
|
Ropuch |
nengard: i should have opacuserjs, |
| 16:24 |
|
schuster |
ropuch - what does yours do? |
| 16:24 |
|
schuster |
wonders what he is missing for his users! |
| 16:24 |
|
nengard |
awesome Ropuch - you can email it to nengardgmail.com |
| 16:25 |
|
nengard |
schuster - and all - maybe we should put a page up on the wiki for custom JS - like we have for custom reports .... |
| 16:25 |
|
schuster |
The two for intranet that I sent nengard - 1 changes the color at checkin or anyplace the faint orange screen would come up, the other put the self checkout link on the staff login screen. |
| 16:25 |
|
nengard |
Ah - thanks :) |
| 16:25 |
|
schuster |
nengard... OOOOOh so smart... Always helping the other users... |
| 16:25 |
|
nengard |
schuster - always helping other users - yes - but also always thinking of ways to add to the documentation :) hehe |
| 16:26 |
|
nengard |
schuster if you want I'll create the page and put your two JS up |
| 16:27 |
|
Ropuch |
nengard: ow, I sent you email without any message - let's assume I'm saying: Hello, here's the screenshot" ;-) |
| 16:27 |
|
nengard |
LOL |
| 16:29 |
|
|
brendan joined #koha |
| 16:30 |
|
chris_n |
hey brendan |
| 16:30 |
|
Ropuch |
90% of my opacuserjs is taken from owen's tutorial, there are some few my lines for decoding url though |
| 16:30 |
|
Ropuch |
Hi chris_n |
| 16:30 |
|
brendan |
morning chris_n |
| 16:30 |
|
Ropuch |
Hello brendan |
| 16:30 |
|
brendan |
hi Ropuch |
| 16:31 |
|
j|Lupin| |
pls, anyone using a git daemon ? |
| 16:31 |
|
j|Lupin| |
I'd like to know if those how do use runit or not... |
| 16:31 |
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chris_n |
howdy Ropuch |
| 16:31 |
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|
j|Lupin| is now known as |Lupin| |
| 16:35 |
|
jwagner |
Speaking of jquery, does anyone know how to use it to turn off one button/link in the list that appears at the top of the staff search results page? Specifically the Place Holds link? I tried some variations, and succeeded in turning off all the links :-( but couldn't turn off just the one placeHolds() button. See Bug 3093 for the problem I'm trying to work around. |
| 16:35 |
|
munin |
Bug http://bugs.koha.org/cgi-bin/b[…]w_bug.cgi?id=3093 enhancement, PATCH-Sent, ---, sedwardsalloycomputing.com, ASSIGNED, Enhance placing of holds in staff interface |
| 16:38 |
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hdl_laptop |
jwagner: look at (#id).toggle() it could be your best match |
| 16:38 |
|
hdl_laptop |
gmcharlt: ? |
| 16:38 |
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gmcharlt |
hi hdl_laptop |
| 16:39 |
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hdl_laptop |
hi. |
| 16:39 |
|
hdl_laptop |
I just wanted to say that you can pull from koha_biblibre/master |
| 16:39 |
|
hdl_laptop |
Maybe you want a more formal git pull-request ? |
| 16:40 |
|
hdl_laptop |
We fixed the database glitches we had. |
| 16:41 |
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| 16:42 |
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gmcharlt |
hdl_laptop: news that you fixed the DB glitches is all I needed, thanks |
| 16:42 |
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hdl_laptop |
this will allow us to be more participative on koha-patches rather than pushing directly ;) and ensure that we can work over a common base. |
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|
Topic for #koha is now Discussion channel for the Koha ILS | Next general IRC meeting will be held on 4 November 2009 at 10:00 UTC+0 | Time Converter: http://tinyurl.com/ydkgnn4 |
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| 17:41 |
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|Lupin| |
till later all, bye ! |
| 17:41 |
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| 17:41 |
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chris_n |
by |Lupin| |
| 17:41 |
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chris_n |
wb pastebot |
| 17:42 |
|
chris |
morning |
| 17:43 |
|
owen |
chris: "Technically" morning, or really morning? |
| 17:45 |
|
schuster |
OK question about ajax and 3.2 - so is this integrated? http://wiki.koha.org/doku.php?[…]e_staff_interface |
| 17:45 |
|
brendan |
morning chris |
| 17:45 |
|
schuster |
Sorry still just trying to figure out what is REALLY in 3.2... - morning chris... passing you coffee... |
| 17:46 |
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owen |
schuster: Not in 3.2 |
| 17:47 |
|
schuster |
Owen - you are really putting a downer on my day... |
| 17:47 |
|
schuster |
:( |
| 17:47 |
|
chris_n |
hi chris |
| 17:47 |
|
owen |
:) Just the messenger! |
| 17:47 |
|
owen |
the "jpw" referenced on that page is pianohacker? |
| 17:48 |
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chris_n |
owen: he's one of the 'j' crowd :-) |
| 17:49 |
|
schuster |
phwey. |
| 17:49 |
|
owen |
schuster: Note that "Adding AJAX support" is another of chris's proposals for 3.4. |
| 17:52 |
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chris |
schuster: you and me both |
| 17:52 |
|
schuster |
I was hopeful that it was "additional" ajax support... |
| 17:52 |
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chris |
anything promised by liblime is not in 3.2 |
| 17:52 |
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chris |
thats my rule of thumb |
| 17:53 |
|
* jdavidb |
applauds chris |
| 17:53 |
|
chris |
and its usually right, sadly |
| 17:53 |
|
chris_n |
yup |
| 17:56 |
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| 18:09 |
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thd |
gmcharlt: are you there? |
| 18:13 |
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| 18:17 |
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thd |
schuster: Separating holdings management from the bibliographic record is a major need for Koha. |
| 18:18 |
|
thd |
schuster: There are currently two separate threads in koha-devel referring to problems from not having better holdings management. |
| 18:20 |
|
Ropuch |
Koha is too addicting: I've just wantd to make some screencast showing how acqusition and cataloguing works, spotted untraslated term and ended up with gtranslator |
| 18:20 |
|
Ropuch |
An hour ago ;> |
| 18:20 |
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thd |
schuster: Do you try to manage all the school textbooks with Koha in you district? |
| 18:23 |
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thd |
s/you/your/ |
| 18:33 |
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| 18:36 |
|
pianohacker |
nengard: I've pushed fixes for bugs 3748, 3587, 3585, 3739 and 3721; will mark them patch-sent as soon as I get the others and submit a pull-request |
| 18:36 |
|
nengard |
awesome pianohacker |
| 18:36 |
|
nengard |
thanks :) |
| 18:38 |
|
nengard |
i have finished the sys pref documentation as much as I can at this time |
| 18:38 |
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| 18:38 |
|
nengard |
I'll go back and finish it once those patches are pushed |
| 18:39 |
|
pianohacker |
cool |
| 18:40 |
|
nengard |
okay - i have asked this 100 times - this time i will document it |
| 18:40 |
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thd |
nengard: I made an agenda and a reminder announcement about the day before the last foundation forming meeting. There is not yet an agenda or reminder announcement for tomorrow's general meeting. |
| 18:40 |
|
nengard |
how do I switch between git branches? |
| 18:41 |
|
nengard |
thd - i wasn't at the last one due to travel - and won't be at tomorrows due to the same thing ... I'm not sure where we are with everything, but I'm just the survey creator - someone else can take on the job of planner and secretary |
| 18:41 |
|
pianohacker |
git checkout new_branch |
| 18:41 |
|
nengard |
thanks pianohacker |
| 18:41 |
|
nengard |
and how do i list branches? :) |
| 18:42 |
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thd |
nengard: I thought that you had all the jobs :) |
| 18:42 |
|
nengard |
thd - there's only so much I can handle |
| 18:42 |
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thd |
:) |
| 18:43 |
|
* thd |
is not even awake yet |
| 18:43 |
|
nengard |
woo hoo - found it - git-branch |
| 18:47 |
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| 18:48 |
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chris_n |
heya pianohacker |
| 18:51 |
|
* chris_n |
wonders why anyone would want a mixture of barcode types in their catalog |
| 18:53 |
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thd |
chris_n: Is that an option? |
| 18:54 |
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chris_n |
it would appear so from Ed Roche's post, unfortunately |
| 18:55 |
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thd |
chris_n: It would be a very useful option if it allowed for tracking various types of RFID and optical barcodes. |
| 18:56 |
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thd |
chris_n: Having both RFID and optical barcodes for the same item is very useful for transition to RFID and backup for when the RFID system goes down. |
| 18:58 |
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chris_n |
thd: I think what happened to Ed is that somehow he switch from Code39 to Code39 Mod10 in the middle of cataloging |
| 18:58 |
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chris |
ok, time to catch my bus |
| 18:58 |
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chris_n |
and his barcode scanner is choking on it |
| 18:58 |
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chris_n |
but Code39 really should not need a checksum as it is self checking |
| 18:59 |
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chris_n |
thd: but the idea of multiple codes per item is a good one |
| 18:59 |
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chris_n |
one could print barcodes on labels with RFID chips inside them |
| 19:00 |
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pianohacker |
Hi, chris_n, thd |
| 19:01 |
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thd |
hello pianohacker |
| 19:02 |
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chris_n |
pianohacker: back to a full ten fingers now? |
| 19:02 |
|
* chris_n |
notes all of pianohacker's bugfixes |
| 19:03 |
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thd |
chris_n: Most libraries want the cheapest solution even if it turns out not to be the most efficient. |
| 19:03 |
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| 19:03 |
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pianohacker |
chris_n: yup! |
| 19:03 |
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|Lupin| |
hi again |
| 19:03 |
|
pianohacker |
Hi, sebastien |
| 19:04 |
|
|Lupin| |
hello Jesse ! |
| 19:04 |
|
nengard |
okay - need git help - I want to checkout a version of HEAD - but for some reason it keeps saying I can't because 'Entry C4/Auth.pm would be overwritten by merge' |
| 19:04 |
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|Lupin| |
pianohacker: how are the fingers going now that they are free ? |
| 19:04 |
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pianohacker |
|Lupin|: very nice, typin' like a demon |
| 19:04 |
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chris_n |
nengard: is that the entire message? |
| 19:04 |
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pianohacker |
nengard: Try a git status, it sounds like you have uncommitted local changes |
| 19:05 |
|
nengard |
wierd - I do have modified files listed - all in the C4 directory |
| 19:05 |
|
nengard |
but i didn't edit them - how can i overwrite my version with the official one |
| 19:05 |
|
nengard |
without committing these files that I didn't change? |
| 19:05 |
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chris_n |
git reset --hard HEAD |
| 19:05 |
|
nengard |
thanks chris_n |
| 19:05 |
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|Lupin| |
chris_n: be aware that you will lose your changes if you do that |
| 19:06 |
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chris_n |
nengard must be coding in her sleep... ;-) |
| 19:06 |
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|Lupin| |
nengard: if you want to save your changes somewhere and still have an official version, use git stash |
| 19:06 |
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chris_n |
|Lupin|: yes, I think nengard wants to |
| 19:06 |
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nengard |
chris_n I was working in the sys prefs branch for documentation purposes - and went to swtich back to the head branch and it woldn't let me -- not sure what happeend |
| 19:06 |
|
nengard |
Lupin - I didn't make any changes! Nothing to save :) |
| 19:07 |
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|Lupin| |
pianohacker: re:your fingers... that's great. enjoy ! |
| 19:07 |
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chris_n |
git weirdness happens from time to time... it keeps things interesting |
| 19:11 |
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|Lupin| |
chris_n: or annoying... |
| 19:11 |
|
nengard |
anyone have anything to add to bug 3733 ? I'm wondering why PinesISBN is commented out |
| 19:11 |
|
munin |
Bug http://bugs.koha.org/cgi-bin/b[…]w_bug.cgi?id=3733 major, P5, ---, pianohackergmail.com, RESOLVED WONTFIX, new sys prefs - Missing Pines ISBN sys pref from enhanced content |
| 19:15 |
|
pianohacker |
Note that there should probably be a separate bug for PINESISBN not working; 3733 is just a wontfix because of the broken code :) |
| 19:25 |
|
* chris_n |
just learned a very cool perl trick for making a substitution inside many files |
| 19:25 |
|
chris_n |
perl -p -i -e "s/old/new" filename |
| 19:26 |
|
|Lupin| |
chris_n: do you know sed's -i option that does in-place work ? |
| 19:27 |
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chris_n |
|Lupin| no, I missed that with sed |
| 19:27 |
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| 19:27 |
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|Lupin| |
chris_n: it's a GNU extension but on nowadays systems I'd say it's common |
| 19:27 |
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chris_n |
|Lupin| so something like 'sed -i "s/old/new/" filename' |
| 19:27 |
|
|Lupin| |
chris_n: exactly |
| 19:28 |
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|Lupin| |
chris_n: and with -e s/old1/new1/g -e s/old2/new2/g you can even substitute more things at once, shold you have to |
| 19:29 |
|
chris_n |
nice |
| 19:29 |
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chris_n |
we need a page on the wiki for tricks like that |
| 19:29 |
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|Lupin| |
chris_n: yeah I find that useful |
| 19:30 |
|
|Lupin| |
chris_n: not sure I agree... that's just Unix culture... imagine that for any project !? too much redundancy IMO |
| 19:31 |
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chris_n |
|Lupin|: interestingly enough, at my first look google turned up the perl solution, but not the in-place sed solution |
| 19:32 |
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pianohacker |
nengard: Is this pages.pl a locally added script? Can't find it in current head |
| 19:32 |
|
chris_n |
I actually looked to sed first, but then wandered off somehow missing the -i switch |
| 19:32 |
|
pianohacker |
nengard: Ahh, nvm, I see |
| 19:32 |
|
nengard |
pianohacker http://wiki.koha.org/doku.php?[…]torials:kohaascms |
| 19:32 |
|
nengard |
k :) |
| 19:33 |
|
pianohacker |
nengard: What if I just coded up a slightly cleaner replacement for that specific use-case? |
| 19:33 |
|
pianohacker |
wouldn't be at all hard |
| 19:33 |
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nengard |
that works for me - and my purpose - don't know about other uses of it |
| 19:34 |
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|Lupin| |
chris_n: I guess perl is more fashioned, sed is old-style so it gets less gits in Google... :) |
| 19:34 |
|
pianohacker |
nengard: I'll send a message to both mailing lists asking about uses, but I think the reasons I stated in the bug should apply to most other uses of "local use" |
| 19:34 |
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| 19:35 |
|
nengard |
awesome - thanks pianohacker |
| 19:36 |
|
schuster |
pianohacker - question about ajax? You were doing some work for LibLime? did that every get completed as it isn't going to be in 3.2 from the sounds of it. |
| 19:36 |
|
schuster |
http://wiki.koha.org/doku.php?[…]e_staff_interface |
| 19:39 |
|
thd |
schuster: Do you try or hope to manage all the school textbooks in your district with Koha? |
| 19:40 |
|
schuster |
I don't but someone else in our district does as they don't see an alternative that they like. |
| 19:40 |
|
schuster |
With Koha being opensource - they like the possibilities... It would also give those proprietary Textbook vendors a little shaking as well. |
| 19:41 |
|
thd |
schuster: What might be the largest number of items for a single textbook? |
| 19:42 |
|
Ropuch |
I'm about adding a posibility to add a call number while receiving an item from order: you can add barcode, localization etc, the book i shown in opac but you have to edit items only to add a call number |
| 19:44 |
|
chris |
Ropuch: you should talk with the Biblibre people first, they have done an acquisitions rewrite, is in the process of being merged |
| 19:44 |
|
thd |
Ropuch: that should all be an automated process in future as part of acquisitions with no manual editing required. |
| 19:44 |
|
chris |
Ropuch: you don't want to duplicate work |
| 19:44 |
|
nengard |
schuster - did you ever get an answer to your library groups email? I'm asking because I'm about to document groups - but haven't yet heard of a library using them successfully |
| 19:44 |
|
Ropuch |
chris: right, I don't [; |
| 19:45 |
|
pianohacker |
schuster: ajax work was finished on checkout and fines rules and circulation screens; patches were not integrated, would take some work to make them applyable again |
| 19:45 |
|
pianohacker |
schuster: The backend code was submitted separately, and was used for the new sysprefs edito |
| 19:45 |
|
chris |
pianohacker: there is no issue with us applying them to master (not tech issue politic/legal issue) |
| 19:45 |
|
chris |
? |
| 19:45 |
|
pianohacker |
*editor |
| 19:46 |
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thd |
Ropuch: I suspect that you will find more flexibility in the BibLibre acquisitions rewrite but not the level of automation which you describe. |
| 19:46 |
|
thd |
schuster: Are you still there? |
| 19:46 |
|
pianohacker |
chris: not to my knowledge; the patches were made publicly available with galen's consent a while back and mentioned on the list |
| 19:46 |
|
chris |
excellent |
| 19:46 |
|
schuster |
Sorry had to step away. |
| 19:46 |
|
pianohacker |
In fact, they're still up: http://arwen.metavore.com/~jpw/ajaxcirc/ |
| 19:47 |
|
chris |
id be willing to help merge them into a branch based off master to make it easy to resubmit |
| 19:47 |
|
gmcharlt |
chris++ |
| 19:47 |
|
schuster |
chris++ |
| 19:47 |
|
chris |
there was something we were going to work on together eh pianohacker ? |
| 19:47 |
|
pianohacker |
chris++ # that'd be awesome |
| 19:47 |
|
* chris |
emails himself a reminder |
| 19:47 |
|
pianohacker |
chris: the memory leak triage, but this is good too :) |
| 19:47 |
|
chris |
ahh cool :) |
| 19:47 |
|
Ropuch |
thd: well, our call number consists of localization code and part of barcode - i think I can add some dirty hack to generate them automagicaly |
| 19:48 |
|
thd |
gmcharlt: did you see my email message to you from a few minutes ago? |
| 19:51 |
|
gmcharlt |
thd: thanks for the reminder - I'll send out an announcement presently |
| 19:51 |
|
chris |
have i shown you guys this yet http://opac.koha.catalystdemo.[…]q=maori+battalion |
| 19:51 |
|
thd |
gmcharlt: I have put up a tentative agenda now but you should fix it before the announcement. |
| 19:52 |
|
schuster |
We had items in our other system with 1400 items attached. we had to break that up into about 5 different records to get them out of the system and into Koha. |
| 19:53 |
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| 19:53 |
|
schuster |
I'd have to talk with our textbook department as far as number of items for a particular subject. - considering we have 9000 students at our Senior Highs so about 4500 per grade - so I would suspect someplace around that per textbook. |
| 19:54 |
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Ester left #koha |
| 19:54 |
|
thd |
schuster: Yes, those numbers really need separating holdings records from bibliographic records which is now not being shared by LibLime. |
| 19:55 |
|
thd |
schuster: Creating separate bibliographic records as you had done is a workaround. |
| 19:55 |
|
chris |
http://www.liblime.com/demos |
| 19:55 |
|
chris |
making_things_worse-- |
| 19:56 |
|
pianohacker |
chris: kete integration? |
| 19:56 |
|
chris |
pianohacker, well, not just kete |
| 19:56 |
|
chris |
i have this |
| 19:56 |
|
schuster |
right now we just sent out about 200 books and those to teachers. It took about a minute per book to check out 1 item to a teacher. not good. That's why I was so excited about this development for 3.2 |
| 19:57 |
|
pianohacker |
schuster: textbooks, or ajaxcirc? |
| 19:57 |
|
chris |
http://opac.koha.catalystdemo.[…]s=maori+battalion |
| 19:57 |
|
thd |
schuster: The holdings in bibliographic records problem is part of a couple of threads on the koha-devel list currently and keeps recurring as an issue on the koha list. |
| 19:57 |
|
chris |
and |
| 19:57 |
|
chris |
http://opac.koha.catalystdemo.[…]+battalion&json=1 |
| 19:57 |
|
schuster |
pianohacker - ??? both! |
| 19:57 |
|
pianohacker |
chris: ahh, very nice |
| 19:57 |
|
chris |
which will search the source you specify in your syspref |
| 19:57 |
|
chris |
next step, make a table to allow multiple external sources |
| 19:58 |
|
chris |
and use that with pazpar2 |
| 19:58 |
|
pianohacker |
schuster: Note that ajaxcirc will only fix a small part of the problem; your lag would go from 1 minute to about 55 seconds |
| 19:58 |
|
chris |
but for now, its a nice proof of concept |
| 19:59 |
|
pianohacker |
Most of the problem (I think) is that Koha has to update the correct 952 tag in a _gigantic_ MARC record, which results in a lot of parsing and then saving lag |
| 19:59 |
|
chris |
yep |
| 19:59 |
|
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cait joined #koha |
| 19:59 |
|
chris |
thats on my todo list too, HDL has already done some prototypes for fixing that |
| 20:00 |
|
thd |
schuster: chris' proposal for 3.4 should do much for the time issue in circulation. |
| 20:00 |
|
pianohacker |
Making koha so the 952 tags are not actually saved in the record, but only generated on export or zebra indexing will probably be needed, but will be a... pain to say the least |
| 20:00 |
|
chris_n |
I must say that LEK has a sort of cheesy looking interface as compared to FOSS Koha |
| 20:00 |
|
pianohacker |
thd: which proposal is that? |
| 20:00 |
|
sekjal |
and then there is bug 2453 |
| 20:00 |
|
munin |
Bug http://bugs.koha.org/cgi-bin/b[…]w_bug.cgi?id=2453 critical, P3, ---, gmcharltgmail.com, NEW, (very) large biblio/item handling |
| 20:00 |
|
sekjal |
our titles with more than 900 attached items are unsearchable |
| 20:01 |
|
thd |
pianohacker: chris' proposal for 3.4 release manager. |
| 20:01 |
|
* chris |
is secretly hoping someone takes my proposal incorporates it all, adds some and volunteers too |
| 20:01 |
|
chris |
:) |
| 20:01 |
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CGI284 joined #koha |
| 20:01 |
|
CGI284 |
s |
| 20:02 |
|
pianohacker |
chris_n: I think that the academic OPAC would probably be the height of beauty to many in that space |
| 20:02 |
|
pianohacker |
based on all the other academic OPACs I've seen |
| 20:02 |
|
pianohacker |
that people paid actual money for |
| 20:03 |
|
cait |
hi all :) |
| 20:04 |
|
CGI284 |
anyway to hop servers |
| 20:04 |
|
chris |
hiya cait |
| 20:04 |
|
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CGI284 left #koha |
| 20:05 |
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thd |
sekjal schuster: Separating the bibliographic record from holdings records is a much larger problem than improving circulation efficiency by breaking the need to update items in the MARC record in real time. |
| 20:06 |
|
chris |
if someone wants to rfc that, adn work on it for 3.4 that would be awesome, its not gonna be on my radar though |
| 20:06 |
|
thd |
sekjal schuster: Separating real time circulation updates from the MARC record is a necessary first step. |
| 20:06 |
|
chris |
i mainly want 3.4 to clean stuff up, so that doing something like that is actually achievable |
| 20:06 |
|
cait |
hi chris |
| 20:06 |
|
pianohacker |
thd: but could you do the two separately? a lot of koha depends on 1<->1 correspondence between the items table and 952 tags |
| 20:07 |
|
thd |
pianohacker: chris is referring to separating that dependency. |
| 20:07 |
|
pianohacker |
you could remove things like onloan and issues from the items table, but then you run into problems with searching for checked out items |
| 20:07 |
|
sekjal |
thd: we could completely refactor Koha to run on a Native XML Database, so we'd only need to update the MARC data in one place |
| 20:08 |
|
pianohacker |
let me find this and actually read it |
| 20:08 |
|
thd |
sekjal: Zebra is a native XML database. |
| 20:09 |
|
nengard |
schuster - did you ever get an answer to your library groups email? I'm asking because I'm about to document groups - but haven't yet heard of a library using them successfully |
| 20:09 |
|
pianohacker |
yes, used for the one part where XML offers advantages |
| 20:09 |
|
nengard |
or anyone - i don't see how search groups are supposed to work ... |
| 20:10 |
|
sekjal |
thd: huh. I hadn't thought about it like that... but I suppose I can see it. |
| 20:10 |
|
thd |
pianohacker: we need some correspondence between the items table and MARC but not for everything in the items table. |
| 20:10 |
|
pianohacker |
nengard: search groups _should_ actually be working; you add various libraries to a named search domain, and then you can search for books from libraries in that domain from (I believe) the advanced search page |
| 20:10 |
|
|Lupin| |
nengard: btw, wanted to say thank you for your suggestion of the other day on the Koha list (SOPAC). Actually I think it's moe than I need but I didn't know about it and it was a good opportnity to learn, so thanks ! |
| 20:10 |
|
sekjal |
thd: it never came up when I was doing my research on NXDs in school, but that could just be my fault |
| 20:11 |
|
nengard |
pianohacker - i'm only seeing it in the staff client - not on the OPAC - is this cause of me? my install? or what? |
| 20:11 |
|
thd |
sekjal: Tümer Garip's solution uses an XML metarecord with XPath indexing in Zebra. |
| 20:11 |
|
pianohacker |
nengard: It might only be working in the staff client, I haven't investigated it thoroughly |
| 20:11 |
|
nengard |
Lupin glad to help - and if you don't need SOPAC then you can look at the tutorials on the wiki: http://wiki.koha.org/doku.php?[…]:creatingcmspages |
| 20:14 |
|
pianohacker |
thd: partial mapping, in other words? what would you omit? |
| 20:17 |
|
|Lupin| |
nengard: ahah ! that seems even more helpful !!! thanks !! |
| 20:17 |
|
nengard |
:) |
| 20:17 |
|
nengard |
always ask the doc manager for documentation and tips :) hehe |
| 20:18 |
|
pianohacker |
chris: what sort of time commitment do you see for the bug wrangler position? I could maybe handle that |
| 20:18 |
|
chris |
im thinking not more than 3 or 4 hours |
| 20:18 |
|
|Lupin| |
nengard: I'll keep that in mind and hope you won't get exhausted with me asking questions |
| 20:19 |
|
chris |
mostly its pestering people to close bugs, or add more info etc |
| 20:19 |
|
nengard |
uh oh - what did I do :) hehe |
| 20:19 |
|
pianohacker |
chris: excellent, I'll write a proposal and throw my name in the hat |
| 20:19 |
|
|Lupin| |
nengard: :-)))))) |
| 20:20 |
|
owen |
pianohacker: And then throw that hat in the ring. |
| 20:20 |
|
pianohacker |
And then throw the ring in the arena |
| 20:20 |
|
pianohacker |
etc etc |
| 20:20 |
|
pianohacker |
hi, owen |
| 20:21 |
|
thd |
pianohacker: I would omit real time circulation columns and mere circulation statistics from needing to be stored in the MARC record. |
| 20:22 |
|
cait |
pianohacker: I think I have not enough time to be a good bug wrangler - but perhaps I can help out looking at old bugs or something |
| 20:22 |
|
|Lupin| |
nengard: hmm... I'm not gonna tell you what my last name means in english, you know that already, don't you ? :) |
| 20:22 |
|
chris |
pianohacker: yay!! |
| 20:22 |
|
nengard |
no ... i didn't ... |
| 20:23 |
|
nengard |
woo hoo pianohacker |
| 20:23 |
|
pianohacker |
thd: very good idea, but how do you deal with zebra (showing whether items are checked out) |
| 20:23 |
|
pianohacker |
pestering _other_ people will be a wonderful break from studying, say, history |
| 20:23 |
|
nengard |
hey - i have a feature request - i'm going to put it in bugs.koha.org - but want to get some feedback |
| 20:23 |
|
nengard |
i'd love to see the currency and exchange rates automated |
| 20:24 |
|
jwagner |
thd, question for you. I think I remember hearing that you did the development work on the frameworks, correct? The 040 subfield c is marked as required, and asks for the MARC Organization Code. The MARCOrgCode syspref exists, and appears to be used to fill in the 040c. Is that syspref used anywhere else, and does the 040c really have to be mandatory? |
| 20:24 |
|
nengard |
I found some APIs that might be helpful in this |
| 20:24 |
|
nengard |
http://www.programmableweb.com[…]urrency&sort=date |
| 20:24 |
|
thd |
pianohacker: I would have just one subfield for available or not updated in a batch job, not real time. |
| 20:25 |
|
pianohacker |
thd: k |
| 20:25 |
|
thd |
jwagner: The mandatory settings which I used were from the minimal level requirements from the MARC 21 standard. |
| 20:26 |
|
pianohacker |
nengard: If one of those has a good terms of use that would allow shipping it completely set up, that'd be nice |
| 20:26 |
|
nengard |
not sure - would have to read through them all |
| 20:26 |
|
thd |
jwagner: The problem is that the field is not populated except by first entering the field in the record editor. |
| 20:26 |
|
pianohacker |
nengard: If the end-user had to set it up manually, that'd still be useful but not as much so |
| 20:26 |
|
nengard |
it's just that exchange rates change hourly and so your acq may not have accurate accounting without pulling it in real time |
| 20:27 |
|
thd |
jwagner: We need to have the field populated without manually entering the field in the record editor. |
| 20:27 |
|
thd |
jwagner: The record editor needs to be completely rewritten on an entirely new model. |
| 20:28 |
|
jwagner |
thd, grepping through the code, it seems to want to use the syspref for the 003, the 040c, and something to do with Authorities. I'm working with a site that will be a consortial setup -- different org codes per site, and I don't think the syspref can handle that. So my options seem to be leaving it blank (or filling in only one of the sites' codes) and/or making the 003/040c not mandatory. |
| 20:29 |
|
pianohacker |
nengard: right. You'd probably want a cron job, but it'd be something used more like rebuild_zebra |
| 20:29 |
|
thd |
jwagner: Meanwhile, disabling some required fields may be a good workaround. |
| 20:29 |
|
pianohacker |
jwagner: those are your options at the moment, yes |
| 20:29 |
|
pianohacker |
jwagner: that would be an excellent field to put on the branches table |
| 20:31 |
|
jwagner |
pianohacker, you weren't online earlier where I asked about this one & a couple of other fields that may need different settings for different libraries -- AnonSuggestions (only one dummy patron ID, which would be tied to one library), MARC subfield for call number, MARC Org Code. There maay be other settings that would need breaking out for a true consortial setup. |
| 20:31 |
|
thd |
jwagner: Yes, I suggest leaving it blank unless you want to rewrite the Perl script for filling the value and add more sophistication to the system preferences. |
| 20:32 |
|
jwagner |
thd, thanks. I figured that was going to be the case, but wanted to check. |
| 20:32 |
|
pianohacker |
jwagner: MARC subfield for call number? having that different across multiple libraries in the same koha db sounds... problematic |
| 20:33 |
|
jwagner |
It may not really be an issue, but suppose one library uses LC, and one uses Dewey. Does the syspref allow you to fill in both, and only apply the one that's right for your library? |
| 20:33 |
|
thd |
jwagner: I favour investing hugely in rewriting the record editor maybe by building on top of code from the Biblios record editor. |
| 20:33 |
|
jwagner |
thd, I have a HUGE wishlist for redoing the MARC editing/general handling..... |
| 20:34 |
|
thd |
jwagner: The design of the internal Koha record editor has some of the best features in Koha but limitations of the design make it ultimately unfixable. |
| 20:34 |
|
jwagner |
That's the problem :-( |
| 20:35 |
|
thd |
jwagner: We have an opportunity to leap over every other system if we rewrite with an RDA based model at the core. |
| 20:36 |
|
thd |
jwagner: No other ILS will contemplate that leap for years. |
| 20:37 |
|
sekjal |
thd: agreed |
| 20:37 |
|
thd |
jwagner: We could make such a leap perhaps together with Evergreen because record editing is so weak in both systems that a complete rewrite is needed. |
| 20:38 |
|
thd |
jwagner sekjal: RDA will have an extensible XML schema. There was a preview shown at the ALA conference. |
| 20:39 |
|
thd |
MARC could be merely an export and import format for communicating with other systems. |
| 20:39 |
|
jwagner |
Sounds like a possibility. I'm not familiar enough with the code issues to know what's possible/desirable, but I know a lot of things I want as a staff user. Things like being able to run a report to list all the 856, or 111, or whatever fields in the catalog. That's been a big need for every cataloger I've ever worked with. |
| 20:40 |
|
thd |
jwagner: You could do that with a special purpose Perl script. |
| 20:41 |
|
jwagner |
But you shouldn't need to -- it should be a basic functionality in Reports. Staff should be able to say, I need to see all the XXX fields, or all that match a search string, and run a report to spit them out. |
| 20:41 |
|
chris |
while we are there, make sure you can catalogue in DC too |
| 20:41 |
|
* owen |
sometimes misses the ability in 2.x to search a specific MARC field...but wouldn't give up Zebra to get it back |
| 20:41 |
|
jwagner |
Yes, at least adding a framework for Dublin Core. |
| 20:42 |
|
thd |
chris: If cataloguing would be based on XML then cataloguing in any semantics should be easy. |
| 20:42 |
|
jwagner |
owen, that's another need. Maybe I spent too long working with Unicorn, but I really miss the MARC handling tools. |
| 20:42 |
|
pianohacker |
owen: I don't think you can do that through zebra very well, no |
| 20:43 |
|
chris |
thd: then you have my vote |
| 20:43 |
|
pianohacker |
just because of the way searches are communicated over z39.50 |
| 20:44 |
|
|
ian joined #koha |
| 20:45 |
|
thd |
jwagner: The Koha reports tool is designed for reporting SQL data at the granularity of the SQL columns. MARC is merely a BLOB in those columns and thus is not accessible to the Koha reports tool. |
| 20:45 |
|
chris |
hey ian, hows kapiti today? |
| 20:45 |
|
ian |
windy...bleak... |
| 20:45 |
|
chris |
yeah its not that nice down here either |
| 20:45 |
|
thd |
chris: the RDA schema will be in part based on work for the DCMI. |
| 20:46 |
|
ian |
is anyone else having Skype problems? |
| 20:46 |
|
ian |
just continual hang for me |
| 20:47 |
|
ftherese |
hello... |
| 20:47 |
|
ftherese |
I don't have any experience with marc tags |
| 20:48 |
|
ftherese |
and I need to import my library using marc tags |
| 20:48 |
|
pianohacker |
ian: I seem to be seeing the same things |
| 20:48 |
|
ftherese |
I am using MarcEdit |
| 20:48 |
|
ftherese |
and the delimited text translator |
| 20:49 |
|
nengard |
okay 4 manual updates submitted today: http://git.biblibre.com/cgi-bi[…]ohadocs;a=summary |
| 20:49 |
|
nengard |
more tomorrow night |
| 20:49 |
|
chris |
nengard++ |
| 20:49 |
|
ftherese |
I am assuming that I should map the fields to a three digit number... is there anything I need to know... does it matter if I put the wrong information in a tag? |
| 20:49 |
|
nengard |
done for today :) may be back again later |
| 20:49 |
|
|
nengard left #koha |
| 20:50 |
|
thd |
jwagner: We would need a special purpose MARC reporting tool or would need to add a MARC reporting tool to fulfil the need you have identified for reports about MARC data.. |
| 20:50 |
|
ftherese |
for instance... what is the difference between "Control Number" and "Control Number Identifier" |
| 20:50 |
|
|Lupin| |
good day/night all, bye ! |
| 20:50 |
|
jwagner |
thd, I know the reports work off SQL, but getting to the MARC data is a real need. Something to think about. But not today....I'm going home...... |
| 20:51 |
|
pianohacker |
bye, sebastien, jwagner |
| 20:51 |
|
|Lupin| |
bye all ! |
| 20:51 |
|
cait |
control number is the number and identifier is the source I thinkj |
| 20:51 |
|
|
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| 20:51 |
|
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jwagner left #koha |
| 20:51 |
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pianohacker |
ftherese: see http://www.loc.gov/marc/biblio[…]hic/examples.html for some examples |
| 20:52 |
|
cait |
=001 00002211X |
| 20:52 |
|
cait |
=003 DE-576 |
| 20:52 |
|
pianohacker |
ftherese: It's usually only something you would have if your records come from some central source, like OCLC |
| 20:52 |
|
ian |
pianohacker: ta |
| 20:54 |
|
thd |
ftherese: see http://www.loc.gov/marc/bibliographic/ . |
| 20:54 |
|
ftherese |
I am looking at that |
| 20:54 |
|
ftherese |
still wondering what to do about 001 and 003 |
| 20:54 |
|
thd |
ftherese: MARC standards are designed for sharing and exchanging records populated according to a common standard. |
| 20:55 |
|
ftherese |
ok |
| 20:56 |
|
thd |
ftherese: You could use MARC any way you like in your own system but then you loose the benefit of sharing and receiving records from others. |
| 20:56 |
|
pianohacker |
ftherese: you shouldn't have to create those fields, for your use case |
| 20:56 |
|
thd |
ftherese: We presume that you are using MARC 21. |
| 20:57 |
|
thd |
pianohacker: the frameworks require those fields according to the MARC 21 standard by default when using the internal record editor. |
| 20:58 |
|
pianohacker |
Hmm. I remember making them mandatory in every installation I've done |
| 20:58 |
|
* pianohacker |
wonders why they're mandatory |
| 20:59 |
|
thd |
ftherese: You could adjust the Koha MARC bibliographic frameworks to remove the requirement that the subfields are required. |
| 20:59 |
|
thd |
pianohacker: they are mandatory because otherwise you would not have a consistent means of tracking records acquired from another system. |
| 21:00 |
|
pianohacker |
thd: Wouldn't those normally be imported through z39.50? |
| 21:00 |
|
pianohacker |
Most records that don't have them to start with probably never will |
| 21:00 |
|
ftherese |
ok... here is my plan... I want to put my entries in, and I would like to also be able to import new entries off the z39 server |
| 21:00 |
|
thd |
pianohacker: Most records should have them. |
| 21:01 |
|
ftherese |
do I need to include a 001 or 003 number in my imported file? |
| 21:01 |
|
pianohacker |
thd: even original cataloging? |
| 21:01 |
|
pianohacker |
ftherese: I don't believe so |
| 21:02 |
|
pianohacker |
thd: my question is, when would you need to add a control number through the marc editor? |
| 21:02 |
|
thd |
pianohacker: Systems which do the correct things with the data populate 035 with the former 001 003 values for records originating from an external system. |
| 21:03 |
|
ftherese |
so... if I just find the corresponding marc field numbers for my own records, will I still be able to import z39 server info? |
| 21:03 |
|
ftherese |
not into the old records |
| 21:03 |
|
ftherese |
but as new records |
| 21:03 |
|
thd |
pianohacker: In Koha the internal control number is in 999 by default. |
| 21:03 |
|
thd |
... for MARC 21. |
| 21:04 |
|
pianohacker |
thd: So Koha should be moving 001/003 to 035 and saving the biblionumber in 001 (possibly only if an 003 value has been configured)? again, only for marc21 |
| 21:05 |
|
ftherese |
another question... I will first import my card catalog |
| 21:05 |
|
thd |
pianohacker: The problem for lack of use of 001 as an internal control number is the legacy of the rushed work to MARC Koha a few years ago. |
| 21:05 |
|
ftherese |
then I will import my actual book items |
| 21:05 |
|
ftherese |
how do I link the two? |
| 21:06 |
|
ftherese |
they are already linked by a bibID number |
| 21:06 |
|
ftherese |
would I just make a marc field equavalent to my local bibID number? |
| 21:06 |
|
thd |
pianohacker: I think that LibLime customers have all been recently using 001 for the biblionumber. |
| 21:07 |
|
pianohacker |
ftherese: technically, the best way is to add the items to the record in the form of Koha's 952 holdings tags |
| 21:07 |
|
pianohacker |
thd: interesting |
| 21:07 |
|
thd |
pianohacker: The trouble is that Z39.50 import does not move 001 and 003 into 035 as it should. |
| 21:07 |
|
pianohacker |
thd: What would you put into 003? |
| 21:08 |
|
thd |
003 is for the library organisation code. |
| 21:08 |
|
pianohacker |
thd: same list as MARCOrgCode? |
| 21:08 |
|
thd |
Anyone can obtain one from filling out a form at the LC website if you do not have one already. |
| 21:09 |
|
pianohacker |
hmm, why would you have the separate 040 field then? |
| 21:10 |
|
thd |
040 is for tracking who contributed to changing the record, not for what system it resides on. |
| 21:10 |
|
ftherese |
so if I populate 952 with the BibID number - which connects all the items with their card - will that do the trick? |
| 21:11 |
|
pianohacker |
ftherese: No; 952 tags hold the actual item information (barcode, location, price, etc) |
| 21:11 |
|
|
ian left #koha |
| 21:11 |
|
thd |
ftherese: Internal numbering is generated automatically. |
| 21:11 |
|
ftherese |
so... where should I put the mapping number that relates items to their card |
| 21:12 |
|
ftherese |
but I have two separate databases |
| 21:12 |
|
ftherese |
one is full of the information |
| 21:12 |
|
thd |
ftherese: Where do you have it already in your records? |
| 21:12 |
|
ftherese |
the other is full of items... whose information is included in the first |
| 21:12 |
|
thd |
ftherese: Do you have MARC records in your previous system? |
| 21:13 |
|
ftherese |
no... I am moving from a homemade filemaker database |
| 21:13 |
|
ftherese |
which is actually several databases |
| 21:13 |
|
ftherese |
one for authors, one for books, one for catalog information, one for call numbers, one for patrons, etc. |
| 21:14 |
|
ftherese |
they are all connected by the almighty BibID number |
| 21:14 |
|
thd |
ftherese: What most databases systems identify as tables are identified as separate databases in Filemaker. |
| 21:14 |
|
ftherese |
right... because in later versions of filemaker, they actually have tables |
| 21:15 |
|
ftherese |
but ours was written with fileMaker 4 |
| 21:15 |
|
ftherese |
so what do I do with the marc translation? |
| 21:16 |
|
thd |
ftherese: marc translation? |
| 21:16 |
|
thd |
ftherese: what do you mean by "marc translation"? |
| 21:16 |
|
ftherese |
how do I tag my records... coming from different databases... in such a way that they remain connected? |
| 21:17 |
|
|
Jo joined #koha |
| 21:17 |
|
ftherese |
different "tables" if you will |
| 21:17 |
|
ftherese |
that are connected by a common number |
| 21:18 |
|
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| 21:19 |
|
thd |
So for every item you should have a separate 952 field in MARC. You do not need to populate the Koha itemnumber, biblioitemnumber, or biblionumber because those are all autogenerated. |
| 21:21 |
|
ftherese |
sorry, I am very new at this... right now I have been following the instructions at http://wiki.koha.org/doku.php?[…]ha_using_marcedit |
| 21:21 |
|
thd |
ftherese: You would only need to preserve your old system numbering if preserving that would be important to you. |
| 21:22 |
|
ftherese |
the old numbering is important because we have multiple copies of the same book that are all referenced in the catalog |
| 21:22 |
|
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| 21:22 |
|
thd |
ftherese: That page is very incomplete. |
| 21:22 |
|
ftherese |
all our book items "hang" on the card catalog |
| 21:22 |
|
ftherese |
via a number |
| 21:23 |
|
ftherese |
sometimes there are several book items hanging on the same card |
| 21:23 |
|
thd |
ftherese: What do you mean by hang? |
| 21:23 |
|
thd |
ftherese: How do you identify your books on the shelf? |
| 21:24 |
|
ftherese |
every book has a call number and an id number |
| 21:24 |
|
ftherese |
printed on it |
| 21:25 |
|
ftherese |
within the computer record for that individual book - |
| 21:25 |
|
ftherese |
there is ANOTHER number, and that number refers to the information card in the "virtual card catalog" |
| 21:26 |
|
thd |
ftherese: You should put your call numbers in the appropriate place in 952 and maybe put the old ID number in a notes field in 952 merely to preserve it. |
| 21:26 |
|
ftherese |
that way... many copies of the same book have one information sheet |
| 21:27 |
|
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| 21:27 |
|
ftherese |
which old id number... ? |
| 21:28 |
|
ftherese |
I am really sorry, I wish I could be more clear |
| 21:28 |
|
thd |
ftherese: The number for the bibliographic record as a whole could go in 001 although the MARC 21 frameworks do not.use 001 to track by default. |
| 21:29 |
|
ftherese |
how do I connect the individual books with their bibliographic record? |
| 21:29 |
|
thd |
ftherese: The Koha MARC frameworks are adjustable but it may be the indexing which is more important to you and you can adjust the indexing to index any fields you need.. |
| 21:30 |
|
* chris_n |
hands pianohacker a lariat :-) |
| 21:32 |
|
ftherese |
well... what I am going to do is just try something and see what happens |
| 21:39 |
|
ftherese |
man... ok "marc fields greater than 10 must define a subfield code" what does that mean? |
| 21:44 |
|
thd |
ftherese: The control fields 000-008 have no subfields in the MARC standard. |
| 21:45 |
|
ftherese |
I don't know how to define a subfield... I don't even know what that means within the context of a marc translator |
| 21:46 |
|
thd |
ftherese: The design of Koha presumes that even fields 000-009 secretly have subfield. |
| 21:47 |
|
thd |
ftherese: A subfield designated by the symbol @ is used to represent the data in the control fields. |
| 21:48 |
|
thd |
ftherese: A subfield is merely what the name implies, a field which is a subsidiary part of another field. |
| 21:49 |
|
thd |
ftherese: Fields in MARC are usually designated by a 3 digit number. |
| 21:49 |
|
pianohacker |
ftherese: the 000-009 fields have only one piece of information attached; 010 and up have multiple pieces of information, stored in subfields |
| 21:50 |
|
pianohacker |
ftherese: the 245 tag, for example, usually has an a and c subfield |
| 21:50 |
|
thd |
ftherese: Subfields are usually designated by a one digit number or the letters of the English language. |
| 21:51 |
|
thd |
ftherese: tag is a common synonym for field in Koha jargon at least. |
| 21:56 |
|
ftherese |
ok.... I am trying to process that |
| 22:00 |
|
pianohacker |
ftherese: MARC is a truly nasty data format to learn and use :/ |
| 22:01 |
|
thd |
ftherese: In SGML, HTML, and XML there are entities (tags) and attributes for various aspects of the entities. The relation between fields and subfields in MARC is similar to that between entities and attributes in HTML. |
| 22:02 |
|
ftherese |
alright... one of the things I need to include for koha - apparently - is the type of item (i.e. "book") what marc number does that fall under? |
| 22:02 |
|
thd |
pianohacker: fear not, we can fix all that with RDA quite soon. |
| 22:02 |
|
ftherese |
ok.. the HTML reference makes sense... thank you |
| 22:03 |
|
pianohacker |
thd: bleh, pardon me for being a bit skeptical |
| 22:03 |
|
pianohacker |
thd: also, thank you, html is a good analogy :) |
| 22:03 |
|
thd |
pianohacker: we will need translations forever though |
| 22:04 |
|
thd |
s/translations/import and export mappings/ |
| 22:04 |
|
pianohacker |
right |
| 22:04 |
|
* pianohacker |
is pondering a possible user-friendly migration tool, for some far-off, imaginary date when he has free time |
| 22:05 |
|
ftherese |
alright... one of the things I need to include for koha - apparently - is the type of item (i.e. "book") what marc number does that fall under? |
| 22:06 |
|
sekjal |
ftherese: 952 |
| 22:06 |
|
sekjal |
subfield y |
| 22:07 |
|
ftherese |
thank you |
| 22:07 |
|
hdl_laptop |
pianohacker: have you solved the translation problem for your system preferences and yaml ? |
| 22:07 |
|
thd |
ftherese: look also at the table of dependencies in http://www.loc.gov/marc/biblio[…]hic/bdleader.html |
| 22:08 |
|
sekjal |
ftherese: the value of this 952$y subfield must match the Item Types you've configured in Koha |
| 22:08 |
|
pianohacker |
hdl_laptop: ahh, yes, I think I have found a solution |
| 22:08 |
|
pianohacker |
simply prefix every string in the YAML file that needs to be translated with _ |
| 22:08 |
|
ftherese |
:/ |
| 22:08 |
|
thd |
ftherese: The leader is control field 000 and starts its position numbering at position 00 as the first position. |
| 22:08 |
|
pianohacker |
Administration: becomes _Administration: |
| 22:09 |
|
hdl_laptop |
_my string that needs translation ? |
| 22:09 |
|
pianohacker |
hdl_laptop: still requires dealing with tmpl_process3.pl, but is easier |
| 22:09 |
|
pianohacker |
hdl_laptop: yup |
| 22:09 |
|
sekjal |
ftherese: you can create your Item Types, which are used to determine item loan rules, under Administration -> Item Types |
| 22:10 |
|
hdl_laptop |
imho, we should not use tmpl_process3.pl but rather use gettext and msgmerge. |
| 22:10 |
|
ftherese |
Once I've imported the data... is it stuck the way I imported it? or can I change it? |
| 22:10 |
|
hdl_laptop |
And then do a shell script that would rule them all |
| 22:11 |
|
sekjal |
ftherese: you can of course edit individual records in the Cataloging module, but as for batch updates, that feature is forthcoming |
| 22:11 |
|
pianohacker |
hdl_laptop: note that my current pref translation idea still involves writing out translated files, rather than having the interface access the .po files |
| 22:11 |
|
sekjal |
batch Item updates are due in Koha 3.2, while batch biblio updates are still waiting |
| 22:12 |
|
thd |
ftherese: Are you based in France? |
| 22:12 |
|
pianohacker |
ftherese: You can change records and items one-at-a-time, though |
| 22:13 |
|
hdl_laptop |
So we should have to translate the system preference template ? |
| 22:15 |
|
thd |
ftherese: You should experiment with importing and testing whether it works well before you start actually using Koha. |
| 22:15 |
|
pianohacker |
hdl_laptop: kind of, though the strings would be extracted, much like normal templates |
| 22:16 |
|
thd |
ftherese: A few things may be difficult to fix later but it is easier to have things right the first time. |
| 22:16 |
|
hdl_laptop |
so template translation would go into po file. But not YAML, that is what you mean. |
| 22:17 |
|
thd |
s/first time/from the point when you start using the system/ |
| 22:17 |
|
pianohacker |
hdl_laptop: I think so, yes |
| 22:17 |
|
pianohacker |
the work flow would be exactly the same as with a .tmpl file |
| 22:18 |
|
hdl_laptop |
yes : SQL and tmpl translation would become YAML and tt2 |
| 22:18 |
|
hdl_laptop |
I have to play more with your system. |
| 22:19 |
|
hdl_laptop |
But I also have to go to sleep. |
| 22:19 |
|
hdl_laptop |
good night |
| 22:19 |
|
|
hdl_laptop left #koha |
| 22:21 |
|
|
francharb left #koha |
| 22:24 |
|
ftherese |
I am in france @thd |
| 22:25 |
|
thd |
ftherese: There are libraries in France which use MARC 21 but you should consider using UNIMARC which is better for interoperating with French libraries. |
| 22:25 |
|
ftherese |
oh gosh... what does that mean? |
| 22:26 |
|
ftherese |
Am I going about the process wrong if I want UNIMARC? |
| 22:26 |
|
thd |
ftherese: The meaning of the fields is very different and the Koha MARC frameworks are different for UNIMARC. |
| 22:27 |
|
ftherese |
so now what's the procedure? |
| 22:27 |
|
thd |
ftherese: MARC 21 has the widest usage internationally but not in France. |
| 22:28 |
|
ftherese |
so I want to use UNIMARC |
| 22:28 |
|
ftherese |
what do I do? |
| 22:28 |
|
ftherese |
what do I read? |
| 22:28 |
|
thd |
ftherese: many things will be quite the same but you have options to choose the base language and the MARC flavour as it is known in Koha on installation. |
| 22:29 |
|
ftherese |
so I can change that in my koha installation |
| 22:29 |
|
pianohacker |
brb work |
| 22:29 |
|
|
pianohacker left #koha |
| 22:30 |
|
|
Topic for #koha is now Discussion channel for the Koha ILS | Next general IRC meeting will be held on 4 November 2009 at 19:00 UTC |
| 22:30 |
|
thd |
ftherese: you cannot change from MARC 21 to UNIMARC after installing. |
| 22:31 |
|
ftherese |
so I have to reinstall |
| 22:31 |
|
thd |
ftherese: you would need to drop the tables in your database and install again from the begining if you want a different MARC flavour. |
| 22:32 |
|
ftherese |
how do I drop tables into my database? |
| 22:32 |
|
thd |
ftherese: The most up to date public UNIMARC documentation is linked from http://www.bnf.fr/pages/infopr[…]-acuni.htm#Biblio . |
| 22:33 |
|
thd |
s/public/free/ |
| 22:33 |
|
ftherese |
this is sort of nightmareish |
| 22:34 |
|
|
Jo left #koha |
| 22:34 |
|
thd |
ftherese: how did you create your MySQL database in the first place? |
| 22:34 |
|
thd |
ftherese: everything is nightmareish the first time. |
| 22:34 |
|
Nate |
good night everyone! |
| 22:35 |
|
ftherese |
http://wiki.koha.org/doku.php?[…]uide_ubuntu_hardy - followed this installation guide |
| 22:35 |
|
|
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| 22:35 |
|
thd |
ftherese: There are support companies to help manage the whole process for you of course. |
| 22:35 |
|
ftherese |
and they would probably get paid for that... but I don't know who is going to pay them... |
| 22:35 |
|
ftherese |
I certainly don't get paid |
| 22:37 |
|
thd |
ftherese: Droping the database might be simpler. |
| 22:37 |
|
|
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| 22:37 |
|
ftherese |
what do you mean by dropping the database? they mysql one I hope |
| 22:38 |
|
thd |
ftherese: reversing a line of the instructions you followed. $ sudo mysqladmin -uroot DROP koha -p |
| 22:39 |
|
ftherese |
there is nothing in the database yet though |
| 22:39 |
|
ftherese |
well... unless the install process does something to it |
| 22:39 |
|
ftherese |
crap |
| 22:40 |
|
thd |
ftherese: During the install process you have to choose MARC 21 or UNIMARC |
| 22:40 |
|
thd |
ftherese: Did you make it to that step? |
| 22:40 |
|
ftherese |
surely |
| 22:41 |
|
ftherese |
let me check what I put |
| 22:42 |
|
thd |
ftherese: If you had then DROP the koha database and start again from Create MySQL Database in the instructions which you followed. |
| 22:43 |
|
|
schuster left #koha |
| 22:45 |
|
thd |
ftherese: You should also know about koha-fr.org and the French Koha mailing lists, although, there are more people to help you in English. |
| 22:47 |
|
ftherese |
well... I may check that out when it comes to specifics... but I have a hard enough time managing the vocab in English |
| 22:48 |
|
ftherese |
So I need to rebuild koha after I delete the database correct? |
| 22:48 |
|
ftherese |
(deleted and recreated the database) |
| 22:49 |
|
thd |
ftherese: yes, after you DROP (delete) the koha database, then start again from Create MySQL Database in the instructions which you followed. |
| 22:49 |
|
ftherese |
oh boy... |
| 22:50 |
|
thd |
ftherese: Actually you can skip some steps |
| 22:52 |
|
thd |
ftherese: After Create MySQL Database, then skip to Configure Apache. |
| 22:53 |
|
ftherese |
I can't seem to find anything on google about creating a UNIMARC |
| 22:54 |
|
thd |
ftherese: Within the Apache configuration step is #Browse to http://servername:8080/ and answer the questions. |
| 22:54 |
|
thd |
ftherese: It should be one of the questions. |
| 22:54 |
|
ftherese |
k |
| 22:55 |
|
ftherese |
what about importing my data into unimarc format? |
| 22:56 |
|
thd |
ftherese: Instead of 952 you would use 995 in the default Koha UNIMARC frameworks. |
| 22:56 |
|
ftherese |
that is the least of my problems... I think |
| 22:56 |
|
ftherese |
what do I do with my gigantic cvs file |
| 22:57 |
|
ftherese |
sorry csv file |
| 22:58 |
|
thd |
ftherese: Field 995 is for items holdings roughly following Recommandation 995 (actually an interlibrary loan standard in France) |
| 22:59 |
|
thd |
ftherese: use the documentation for UNIMARC linked from http://www.bnf.fr/pages/infopr[…]-acuni.htm#Biblio |
| 22:59 |
|
ftherese |
thank you |
| 23:01 |
|
thd |
ftherese: The Recommandation 995 standard is linked from http://www.adbdp.asso.fr/spip.php?article674 |
| 23:02 |
|
|
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| 23:09 |
|
ftherese |
I have a couple of choices... Unimarc_complet and Unimarc_lecture_pub |
| 23:10 |
|
ftherese |
complete or public-read |
| 23:10 |
|
thd |
ftherese: The specific Koha implementation is important to know. Use the complete UNIMARC framework, although, one set of important values has not been defined for any French UNIMARC frameworks.. |
| 23:10 |
|
thd |
ftherese: If you keep to the basic fields which appear in the record editor you will be fine. |
| 23:11 |
|
ftherese |
so... I should look at the record editor? |
| 23:11 |
|
ftherese |
confused!! |
| 23:11 |
|
ftherese |
sorry!! |
| 23:11 |
|
thd |
ftherese: Yes. |
| 23:11 |
|
ftherese |
what record editor? |
| 23:12 |
|
ftherese |
MarcEdit? |
| 23:12 |
|
thd |
ftherese: See which fields and subfields actually appear in the record editor. |
| 23:12 |
|
|
pianohackr|work left #koha |
| 23:13 |
|
thd |
ftherese: See which fields and subfields actually appear in the record editor. |
| 23:13 |
|
thd |
ftherese: oops |
| 23:13 |
|
|
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| 23:14 |
|
thd |
ftherese: look at the administration interface yourservername:8080 by the instructions |
| 23:14 |
|
thd |
ftherese: you should have a login screen after you have finished with the web installer |
| 23:15 |
|
thd |
ftherese: The link to the bibliographic record editor is at Cataloguing > Add MARC record. |
| 23:15 |
|
ftherese |
k |
| 23:17 |
|
thd |
ftherese: http://YourServerName:8080/cgi[…]uing/addbiblio.pl or something like that. |
| 23:18 |
|
|
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| 23:19 |
|
ftherese |
I am looking at the editor |
| 23:19 |
|
ftherese |
but I don't understand what is supposed to happen |
| 23:19 |
|
ftherese |
every line looks like this 010 _ _ - ISBN |
| 23:19 |
|
ftherese |
two mini blanks |
| 23:20 |
|
cait |
good night #koha |
| 23:20 |
|
|
cait left #koha |
| 23:20 |
|
ftherese |
what is supposed to go in those blancs? |
| 23:20 |
|
thd |
ftherese: Those are for the indicators which can be mostly ignored in UNIMARC |
| 23:21 |
|
ftherese |
they are are too small to have any data longer than one character in them |
| 23:21 |
|
thd |
ftherese: Exactly |
| 23:21 |
|
ftherese |
the big ones are |
| 23:21 |
|
ftherese |
000 - Label |
| 23:21 |
|
ftherese |
001 - Numero de notice |
| 23:21 |
|
thd |
ftherese: Press the + to enter a value in one of the collapsed fields |
| 23:22 |
|
ftherese |
when I press + it just gives me a second one |
| 23:22 |
|
thd |
ftherese: You can adjust the Koha MARC frameworks to define which fields are collapsed or expanded in the record editor. |
| 23:22 |
|
thd |
sorry |
| 23:23 |
|
thd |
ftherese: Press the - on the left |
| 23:23 |
|
thd |
ftherese: to the left of the label |
| 23:24 |
|
thd |
ftherese: after the indicator boxes and before a label such as ISBN is a - |
| 23:24 |
|
thd |
ftherese: the defaults in the French UNIMARC frameworks are not as helpful as they should be. |
| 23:25 |
|
ftherese |
ahhh! ok |
| 23:25 |
|
ftherese |
I got it now... |
| 23:26 |
|
thd |
ftherese: they can be fixed for better defaults but that requires a bit of time. |
| 23:26 |
|
ftherese |
so what I need to do is go through the list and find all the fields that I have in my old library |
| 23:26 |
|
thd |
ftherese: yes. |
| 23:26 |
|
ftherese |
which correspond to numbers and letters |
| 23:27 |
|
ftherese |
then add that to the MarcEdit tool |
| 23:27 |
|
ftherese |
which creates a marc21 file to my knowledge |
| 23:27 |
|
ftherese |
what do I do with that? |
| 23:27 |
|
thd |
ftherese: each of the rows at top with a number is a different grouping. |
| 23:27 |
|
thd |
ftherese: MARCEdit creates a MARC file |
| 23:28 |
|
thd |
ftherese: The number and letter codes merely have a different meaning |
| 23:28 |
|
thd |
ftherese: ... between MARC 21 and UNIMARC |
| 23:28 |
|
ftherese |
so the only difference between marc21 and unimarc is the number-letter codes? |
| 23:29 |
|
thd |
ftherese: In MARC 21, field 245 is used for title. In UNIMARC, field 200 is used for title. |
| 23:30 |
|
ftherese |
right... for example |
| 23:30 |
|
thd |
ftherese: yes only the code meanings are different |
| 23:30 |
|
thd |
ftherese: One thing to notice in the MARC editor is that some fields have a ... after them. |
| 23:30 |
|
ftherese |
yes... |
| 23:30 |
|
ftherese |
what does that mean? |
| 23:31 |
|
thd |
ftherese: If you click the .... link then you have a popup form which guides you to completing the field correctly. |
| 23:31 |
|
ftherese |
right ... got that |
| 23:37 |
|
thd |
ftherese: If you look at the end of http://git.koha.org/cgi-bin/gi[…]ework_DEFAULT.sql |
| 23:38 |
|
thd |
ftherese: You can see which 995 subfields are used for item mappings such as items.callnumber |
| 23:39 |
|
thd |
ftherese: items.itemcallnumber is stored in 995 $k |
| 23:40 |
|
thd |
ftherese: $ is merely one convention for designating subfields. |
| 23:40 |
|
ftherese |
right |
| 23:41 |
|
ftherese |
I got that part |
| 23:41 |
|
ftherese |
where do we tell koha which library it belongs to? |
| 23:41 |
|
ftherese |
the branch code goes in which marc number |
| 23:42 |
|
thd |
ftherese: 995 $b Propriétaire is for items.homebranch |
| 23:43 |
|
thd |
ftherese: items.homebranch stores a code which may be much shorter than the actual branch name. |
| 23:43 |
|
ftherese |
does koha need that? |
| 23:44 |
|
thd |
ftherese: yes, that is important |
| 23:45 |
|
ftherese |
what does itemcallnumber mean? |
| 23:45 |
|
thd |
ftherese: just the complete call number |
| 23:46 |
|
thd |
ftherese: Items are managed with an editor only for items, although, they are stored in the same MARC record as the rest of the information. |
| 23:47 |
|
ftherese |
itemcallnumber is the pointer? |
| 23:47 |
|
thd |
ftherese: itemcallnumber is the actual call number. |
| 23:48 |
|
ftherese |
hmmm |
| 23:50 |
|
thd |
ftherese: itemcallnumber might be REF 760.823 BAC 1978 c.2 for a full Dewey Decimal number with a prefix designating reference only, DDC, cutter code, year, and a copy number indicating the second copy at the end. |
| 23:50 |
|
|
pianohackr|work left #koha |
| 23:50 |
|
thd |
ftherese: The call number is merely whatever you use to classify the documents at your library. |
| 23:50 |
|
ftherese |
Is the title under the 500s or the 200s ? |
| 23:51 |
|
thd |
ftherese: The title should be 200 in UNIMARC. |
| 23:51 |
|
|
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| 23:52 |
|
ftherese |
and the author? |
| 23:52 |
|
ftherese |
there are WAY TOO MANY CHOICES HERE... this could drive someone mad!!! |
| 23:53 |
|
thd |
ftherese: Authors are 700 - 703 for primary, secondary, and additional personal authors. |
| 23:53 |
|
chris |
tell me about it, koha wouldnt support MARC if librarians didn't want it, certainly theres no way a programmer born in this generation would come up with that |
| 23:54 |
|
thd |
ftherese: You can limit the choices by editing the Koha MARC frameworks. |
| 23:54 |
|
thd |
ftherese: The frameworks are extremely flexible. |
| 23:54 |
|
ftherese |
can I tell it... "only ask me the essential questions" |
| 23:54 |
|
thd |
ftherese: ... one of the nice features of Koha. |
| 23:54 |
|
ftherese |
or do I have to sift through everything to find that out |
| 23:56 |
|
thd |
ftherese: ... Go to Home > Administration > Catalog > MARC Bibliographic framework to edit the bibliographic frameworks. |
| 23:56 |
|
ftherese |
ok |
| 23:58 |
|
ftherese |
so for several different co-authors.... I would have multiple 701$a's |
| 23:58 |
|
thd |
ftherese: If you hide all the subfields for a field appropriately in the framework, then it will not appear in the record editor. |
| 23:58 |
|
ftherese |
do I need to "join" them? |
| 23:58 |
|
|
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| 23:59 |
|
thd |
ftherese: They are intended to be separated in MARC |
| 23:59 |
|
thd |
ftherese: The primary author would go in 701 |
| 23:59 |
|
thd |
ftherese: The secondary author in 702 |
| 23:59 |
|
ftherese |
according to this the primary author would go in 700$a |
| 23:59 |
|
thd |
ftherese: oops |
