IRC log for #koha, 2009-09-02

All times shown according to UTC.

Time S Nick Message
01:17 chris_n2-away_ joined #koha
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01:18 chris_n2-away_ is now known as chris_n2-away
02:11 pianohacker joined #koha
02:11 pianohacker ops++
02:14 chris sharing the love, that way if someone falls off, there should be someone still with ops
02:14 pianohacker ok. I won't let you down, sir!
02:14 chris and now should be able set the topic without ops too
02:19 no_ops_test joined #koha
02:19 Topic for #koha is now Welcome to #koha - don't ask to ask a question, just ask your question :)
02:19 no_ops_test left #koha
02:21 chris cool
02:56 brendan good night #koha
02:58 pianohacker Good night
02:58 chris night brendan
03:05 pianohacker Good night, #koha
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03:24 Amit joined #koha
03:25 Amit hi chris, brendan
03:25 Amit good morning #koha
03:26 chris hi Amit
03:30 Amit hi indradg
03:39 chris_n2-away is now known as chris_n2
03:39 chris_n2 hi Amit
03:39 Amit hi chris_n2
03:39 Amit n2 means
03:40 chris_n2 n => nighswonger 2 =>my second location nick
03:41 Amit ok
03:49 chris_n2 g'night
03:49 chris_n2 is now known as chris_n2-away
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04:24 richard andrea?
04:24 richard heh, wrong #
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06:45 chris hi hdl_laptop and laurence
06:46 laurence hello chris
06:48 hdl_laptop hi chris
06:57 Topic for #koha is now Welcome to #koha - english channel about Koha ILS - don't ask to ask, please, just ask your questions
07:10 cait joined #koha
07:10 chris hi cait
07:22 nicomo_laptop joined #koha
07:22 chris hi nicomo_laptop
07:22 nicomo_laptop hi chris
07:22 chris re your placing holds on items on issue
07:22 nicomo_laptop yes
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07:23 chris some libraries have a short loan time, and no renewals
07:23 chris on certain itemtypes
07:23 chris people often want to place a hold on it if they havent finished reading it
07:23 chris so they can get it out again
07:24 CGI752 left #koha
07:24 chris of course if it has other holds on it, they get priority
07:24 chris but if not, theres no reason they shouldnt be allowed to get it out again
07:25 nicomo_laptop ok, get it
07:25 nicomo_laptop but not sure it's a good idea
07:25 nicomo_laptop have to leave for a meeting
07:25 chris be that as it may
07:25 nicomo_laptop will ping you back on this
07:25 chris libraries do it
07:26 chris so koha has to be able to do
07:26 chris it
07:26 chris which is why it should be a syspref
07:26 nicomo_laptop left #koha
07:26 chris so libraries that dont want to allow it can turn it off
07:26 * chris assumes nicomo will read the log :)
07:27 chris (libraries do lots of things that arent good ideas :))
07:29 * chris goes to put kahu to bed
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07:34 cait hi chris
07:36 |Lupin| good morning #koha
07:36 |Lupin| hi cait
07:37 cait hi lupin :)
07:43 |Lupin| chris: around ?
07:46 cait (09:29:17) ***chris goes to put kahu to bed
07:47 |Lupin| cait: thanks a ot for your awareness
07:50 cait I think he will be back soon
07:52 CGI483 joined #koha
07:52 |Lupin| cait: yep, probably
07:54 chris back
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07:56 |Lupin| ah hi chris
07:57 |Lupin| chris: I'd like to ask a question about what may be a bug in Koha.
07:58 |Lupin| chris: to sum up: private virtual shelves are not displayed with lynx in the staff client. However, they appear at OPAC, and public shelves are displayed correctly in the staff client.
07:58 |Lupin| chris: any idea where the problem could come from ?
07:58 chris the template
08:00 |Lupin| chris: one more thing: the pages says NO private shelves" explicitly. (not sure about how it is phrased in english, that's just the tranlsation of what I can see in french)
08:02 * |Lupin| investigating
08:02 chris ahh in that case, it might be that you cant see other peoples private shelves
08:03 chris is the user you have logged in with, the one that made the shelf?
08:04 |Lupin| chris: yes
08:05 chris in that case sounds like a bug
08:07 |Lupin| chris: yeah, the shelves are visible in Firefox, but not in lynx
08:14 |Lupin| chris: shall I report this ? which severity do you suggest ?
08:15 chris normal i thnk
08:16 |Lupin| chris: k
08:20 hdl_laptop |Lupin|: which version are you working on ?
08:22 |Lupin| hdl_laptop: HEAD
08:22 |Lupin| hdl_laptop: from the master branch
08:22 hdl_laptop ok
08:45 bigbrovar yo morning everyone (yeah i know but u get the idea)
08:46 chris :)
08:47 bigbrovar hey chris .. am having some problems importing catalogs from OO.o spreedsheet to koha, i tried using some marcEdit tool. but it was a huge fail ..
08:48 bigbrovar i saved the spreedsheet as cvs, then to a txt file and tried using the marcedit to convert the cvs to marc.. but things didnt go accounding to plan
08:49 bigbrovar csv*
08:51 bigbrovar am going to try again today to see where i went wrong
08:51 chris[…]nuary/016656.html
08:51 chris might help
08:51 bigbrovar thanks
08:53 bigbrovar one question .. i set our lkoha to use DCC for classification, because the librarian said the catalog on the spreedsheet is based on same.. does that mean the koha marc tags would be based on dcc ( am a little confused in that area)
08:55 chris its more dependent on whether you are using MARC21 on UNIMARC
08:56 cait left #koha
08:56 bigbrovar oh ok
08:57 bigbrovar thanks for the link .. i will give it another try ..
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09:13 |Lupin| can someone please remind me how to assign to a hash ?
09:14 |Lupin| more precisely: how to add a key-value pair to an existing table ?
09:14 chris $hash{'key'}='value';
09:14 chris thats to a hash
09:15 chris if its a hashref its $hashref->{'key'} = 'value';
09:15 |Lupin| chris: thanks !
09:15 |Lupin| I tried this and it didn't quite work...
09:15 |Lupin| chris: to declare the hash is it my %hash = (); ?
09:15 chris just my %hash;
09:16 chris or my %hash = {};
09:16 chris () is list
09:16 |Lupin| chris: ok...
09:16 |Lupin| chris: yeah but I thoght it was okay to assign the empty list to a hash, to mean the hash is empty
09:16 chris nope
09:16 chris you are overloading it
09:17 chris its not a hash if you assign a list to it
09:17 chris my %hash; is fine
09:20 |Lupin| chris: ok, thanks a lot. Learned some Perl but apparently not enough
09:20 chris :)
09:26 hdl_laptop chris |Lupin| you can assign a pair-wised list into a hash in perl.
09:26 hdl_laptop No problem with that
09:26 |Lupin| chris: $h{'a'} = $book->{'boAuthorLN'}); gives a syntax error..
09:26 |Lupin| chris: canyou see why ?
09:26 hdl_laptop )
09:27 hdl_laptop just before ;
09:27 chris yep you cant assign an empty list tho hdl_laptop
09:28 chris you are overloading it to be an array in that context
09:28 |Lupin| hdl_laptop: yeah I kind of remembered having seen it in my Perl book. I just didn't remembered that an empty list was not a paired list
09:29 chris well you can, but its unnessecary
09:31 |Lupin| chris: k, thanks for the clarification
09:32 chris its much nicer in perl6
09:33 |Lupin| chris: will this language ever be used ?
09:34 chris yep
09:34 chris people are using it already
09:34 |Lupin| chris: any schedule for that ?
09:34 chris not really, when it's done
09:34 chris rakudo is a fairly complete implementation tho
09:35 chris
09:35 chris simple differences, that make it a lot nicer
09:35 |Lupin| ok !
09:35 |Lupin| is the implementation in Haskell ?
09:37 chris parrot is C
09:37 |Lupin| ok
09:37 * |Lupin| has nothing against Haskell btw... that would more be the countrary actually
09:37 chris and rakudo runs on that
09:38 chris pugs is haskell
09:38 chris so you can use either
09:39 chris if you like haskell, you will like the fact you can do some nice functional programming with perl6
09:41 chris (it has reductions like say [+] 1..5; )
09:41 chris say [*] 1..5;
09:41 chris etc
09:42 |Lupin| that's nice indeed
09:42 |Lupin| the syntax for doing maps and things like that looks much heavier in Perl5 than in languages such as Haskel, to me
09:43 chris yeah maps are more like haskel
09:43 chris in perl6
09:43 chris also instead of $hash{key}=value
09:44 chris %hash{key}=vaule, more readable imo
09:44 |Lupin| agreed
09:45 chris[…]_operator_zi.html
09:45 chris i like zip too :)
09:47 |Lupin| yeah
09:48 |Lupin| I think those usign functional languages couldn't live without it
09:48 |Lupin| I'm wondering how much work it would represent to get rid of bulkmarcimport's warnings...
09:50 chris not much, some ifs
09:51 |Lupin| is it worth a bug report as a first step ? or would just sending a patch be OK ?
09:51 chris sending a patch is ok
09:51 * |Lupin| may be able to do it if it's not too difficult
09:51 |Lupin| chris: k
09:57 |Lupin| chris: is it ok to add things to virtualshelves manually ? Not sure what will happen with the timstamp, and what to use for the flags...
09:58 chris don't know im afraid
09:58 |Lupin| k
09:59 |Lupin| thanks
09:59 |Lupin| Isn't there a documentation of the database format on the wiki somewhere ?
09:59 |Lupin| can't find it at the moment...
10:00 hdl_laptop zeno put some online some time ago
10:02 |Lupin| hmm it's a schema, I assume it does say a lot about the flags
10:29 |Lupin| +not
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10:43 gmcharlt good morning
10:43 gmcharlt op!!!!!!
10:43 chris heh
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11:18 * gmcharlt awaits the development of TCP/IP over smoke signal
11:28 Amit heya galen, lupin
11:29 gmcharlt hi Amit
11:36 |Lupin| hello Galen!
11:37 |Lupin| hi Amit
11:37 gmcharlt hi |Lupin|
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12:10 imp heyho
12:11 * chris_n notes gmcharlt's reference to ham radio with interest
12:11 chris_n I think I'll start submit my work by packet radio via moon bounce :-)
12:12 gmcharlt chris_n: actually, bouncing radio signals off the moon at me would not be such a good idea
12:12 * gmcharlt is not actually a ham operator
12:12 |Lupin| who's gonna moderate the meeting btw ?
12:12 gmcharlt I will
12:13 |Lupin| great
12:13 jdavidb chris_n:  Are you a ham?
12:13 chris_n jdavidb: ku4dd
12:13 Amit hi jwagner, jdavidb
12:13 jdavidb KU4DD GM OM DE KB5GHE.
12:14 chris_n cool!
12:14 jdavidb I haven't been active in a while, but I was working slow-code traffic and local NTS nets in Texas for a while.
12:15 chris_n jdavidb: when did you get your ticket?
12:15 jdavidb 1988.  I'm still listed as Technician; I was "Tech-Plus" for many moons, since I had the 5 wpm code.
12:16 * jdavidb finds it hard to fathom that he will soon be eligible for QCWA.  *shudder*
12:16 chris_n I got my first license in 92
12:17 jdavidb My interests were mostly in paper-chasing and traffic.  Paper-chasing appeals to the OCD geek in me.
12:17 chris_n then worked like a dog and passed 20wpm when testing for 15
12:17 chris_n heh
12:18 jdavidb I never quite managed to bust the 10 wpm barrier.  I passed the General written back in the five-class days, but never could get that code.
12:18 chris_n I've done a bit of satellite work (hence my interest in galen's post) but mostly do ARES stuff now
12:19 chris_n opps... s/15/10/... you can tell its been a while since I worked cw :-P
12:19 jdavidb A few people say that NTS is really antiquated and should be discarded, but I disagree; I've seen it help people out, and actually managed to handle some WELFARE-class traffic during Katrina.
12:19 chris_n when hurricane Fran hit NC we were the sole source of comms for our county
12:20 jdavidb For EMERGENCY and DISASTER classes, there are usually faster ways, but WELFARE is a really useful service, IMO.
12:22 jdavidb I had looked into MARS, but that system has just about been made moot, with most ships and posts having sat email now...
12:23 chris_n Fran was an interesting lesson in how sophisticated technologies can fail dramatically under massive stress
12:23 jdavidb You'd think people would remember that sort of happens with hurricanes, but 9/11 was another example.
12:23 chris_n it resulted in us obtaining state and federal funding for much needed equipment, etc.
12:24 * chris_n thinks he has digressed from the topic of koha, though
12:24 jdavidb heheh.
12:25 chris_n and blames it on gmcharlt
12:25 chris_n ;-)
12:25 jdavidb Yes.  gmcharlt is to blame
12:28 gmcharlt chris_n: implement a method to send overdue notices by packet radio, and you'll be back on topic ;)
12:29 chris_n lol!
12:29 jdavidb e-mail-to-NTS gateway...
12:29 chris_n gmcharlt: is something wrong with
12:29 chris_n jdavidb++
12:29 chris_n gmcharlt: looks like a bare repo directory listing
12:29 chris_n from here
12:29 gmcharlt chris_n: nope - that's what you're supposed to get
12:30 gmcharlt is for the pretty gitweb
12:32 chris_n k
12:34 |Lupin| folks
12:34 |Lupin| is it planned to add a field for records saying who has created that record ?
12:34 |Lupin| (or imported) ?
12:34 |Lupin| if it's not planned, would it represent a lot of work ? would a patch doing that be acceepted ?
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12:40 |Lupin| hm ?
12:41 |Lupin| have I said something I shouldn't have ? :-)
12:41 jdavidb I can't imagine that it would be a huge problem, Lupin, to add a field to biblio, for instance, and fill in who created it.
12:41 jdavidb (or even last-modified, too)
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12:42 |Lupin| jdavidb: right... maybe my next patch
12:43 jdavidb If you wanted to keep up with changes to the MARC--who did what--that'd be hairier, but a single field for who initially created?  Should be easy enough.
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12:46 |Lupin| k
12:46 |Lupin| thanks jdavidb
12:46 owen Wow, #koha has a topic
12:47 jdavidb you betcha.  I think it's a swell idea, for what that is worth, and look forward to seeing it implemented.
12:47 jdavidb Howdy, owen. :)
12:48 |Lupin| jdavidb: Well, If I can find a mentor, I may do it
12:49 jdavidb Lupin, I don't have gobs of free time for detailed stuff, but if you want someone to look it over before you throw it to gmcharlt, I'd be happy to do that.  :)
12:50 jdavidb I'm not The Patch King or anything, but I don't mind putting another set of eyes on it for ya.
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13:00 |Lupin| jdavidb: ok, thanks. Since I have really no experience I expect that the first attempts will not be very good, I may to look into some places and so, so I need some instructions about which places I should check, after I have done a patch
13:00 |Lupin| simpler quesiton atm
13:01 |Lupin| my librarian tells me she does not know how to modify records
13:02 |Lupin| she says she clicks on the modify button of a record, but then she does not know how to, say, add a MARC field
13:02 |Lupin| could someone please give a hint ?
13:04 jdavidb If it's a field that is in the framework, the little + out the right of the field name will let you add another one like that.  Like, 247 _ _ - FORMER TITLE + -    Just click the + to add another one.
13:05 |Lupin| jdavidb: yep I hink that she has found out.
13:06 |Lupin| jdavidb: but if a field is in the cataloguing framework and there is no such field currently in the record, will the field still appear in the interface with a + sign and clicking on it will insert one ?
13:07 jdavidb They do on mine.  You don't have to click the + in that case; clicking the title expands out the subfields.
13:08 |Lupin| jdavidb: and then, once the subfields are expanded, how do you edit them ?
13:09 jdavidb Just type in the boxes.  Subfields you don't want, just leave blank.
13:11 |Lupin| jdavidb: ok, and that works as soon as the fields are part of the catataloguing framework, so if a field is not listed it means one has to add it to the cataloguing framework to be able to edit it. Is that correct ?
13:12 jdavidb I believe that is correct, yes.
13:12 brendan morning
13:12 jdavidb Howdy, Brendan.
13:13 brendan howdy jdavidb
13:14 |Lupin| jdavidb: okay, thaks a lot !!!
13:15 jdavidb You betcha.  :)
13:16 |Lupin| what does betcha mean ? I guess it's the contraction for something ?
13:16 jdavidb Ah, the language barrier.   "You betcha." is another way to say "Sure thing, no problem!"
13:16 |Lupin| also: it seems my LANG category of authorised values has no possible value associated to it. Is that normal ?
13:17 owen "You bet", meaning "You can bet on it" meaning "You can bet on it and win because it is true" meaning "Yes"
13:17 * jdavidb talks like a Texan too much some times.
13:18 |Lupin| jdavidb: oh it's an expression used in Texas ?
13:18 jdavidb It's used all over, I'm sure, but Texans do say it a lot.
13:18 |Lupin| jdavidb: k
13:20 owen I guess it's really "you betcha" like "You betcher boots" as in "You can bet your boots" as in your important horse-riding Texas boots
13:21 jdavidb Heh.  Probably so--though I do ride, but don't own any boots.
13:22 jwagner owen, question for you (or anyone) on the OPAC search results?
13:23 jwagner When you've done a search and have your results list, there's a box for changing the sort order.  Default is relevance, but you can also sort Author A-Z, etc.  What index is the author sort using?
13:23 jwagner I can tell what indexes are being used for the searches, but can't see what's controlling the sort.
13:24 * owen knows nothing of indexes
13:24 jwagner But, but, you're the King of the OPAC!!! :-)
13:24 * owen is very shallow--it's all the surface stuff I know about
13:26 jwagner Drat.  It _looks_ like the sort is basing off the 100 (or maybe 1xx) fields, but the Author display is pulling from 100/7xx fields.  So when you do an Author A-Z search, the display shows lots of authors near the end of the alphabet first, but when I looked at their MARCs, they didn't have 100s but did have 700s.
13:28 |Lupin| anybody knows if there are some values defined for the LANG authorised value somewhere in Koha, please ?
13:31 owen Our installation does not include one
13:31 owen |Lupin|: Where do you expect it to be used?
13:31 |Lupin| owen: ahah ! So it's up to each library to define it ?
13:32 owen |Lupin|: Where do you expect it to be used?
13:33 |Lupin| owen: there is a MARC field where you can define the language of the document and which is bound to this authorised value, at least on the installation we have here
13:35 owen I thought in order for a field to be linked to an authorized value the authorized value had to exist
13:37 owen The "Other Options" part of pulls from existing authorized values to generate the select form field.
13:37 |Lupin| owen: yeah precisely, so this field couldn't be edited, because there is no authorised value LANG here
13:38 owen So you have a LANG category but no existing values for it?
13:40 |Lupin| owen: I have a marc field linked to this category, but no value for it
13:41 |Lupin| an authorised value can't exist without having at least one value associated to it
13:42 owen Is there a LANG category defined in authorized values?
13:43 owen Where is the MARC field you're referring to?
13:43 |Lupin| it's an unimarc one
13:43 |Lupin| 101$a
13:44 |Lupin| owen: and no there was no lang category in authorised_values
13:44 |Lupin| that was my problem
13:44 owen Then I don't understand how a MARC field could be linked to a LANG category
13:46 |Lupin| owen: clearl on the web interface you can only link a marc field to an existing authorised value
13:47 |Lupin| owen: but perhaps this is one of the things that are in the pre-installed database, at this level there is no check to ensure that the authorised value yu link to really exists
14:05 wizzyrea @later tell chris_n thanks for the label rewrite with the print time label settings. that will make the labels module a lot better. Can't wait to see it!
14:05 munin wizzyrea: The operation succeeded.
14:06 owen community contributions++
14:14 wizzyrea yepper. So excited.
14:17 |Lupin| folks
14:18 |Lupin| our librarian tells me that when she tries to modify a record and then saves it, Koha complains that some fields are mandatory. Where is it that this is defined, please ?
14:19 jdavidb That'd be in the framework, I imagine.
14:19 |Lupin| jdavidb: k...
14:20 |Lupin| thanks
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15:04 jdavidb Howdy jmr. :)
15:04 jmr Hi jdb
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15:18 jdavidb howdy, pianohacker!
15:18 |Lupin| hello pianohacker !
15:19 pianohacker Hello, David, Sébastien
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15:31 fredericd hi
15:32 pianohacker Hello
15:34 |Lupin| pls
15:34 |Lupin| we try to add a record into KOha
15:34 |Lupin| we define a language in 101$a
15:35 |Lupin| but when we try to save the record it says 101$A is not defined
15:35 |Lupin| anyh idea where this can come from, pls ?
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15:40 owen |Lupin|: I think you'll have to find a Unimarc person to help you. paul_p or hdl_laptop maybe.
15:43 fredericd or fredericd
15:43 owen :)
15:45 pianohacker jwagner: what do you have against Romans?
15:46 |Lupin| fredericd: hello, nice to see you again around
15:46 |Lupin| fredericd: any idea ?
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15:47 rhcl @seen chris
15:47 munin rhcl: chris was last seen in #koha 5 hours, 4 minutes, and 13 seconds ago: <chris> heh
15:47 fredericd |Lupin|: Never seen. I'd need to see more to help you in any mean
15:49 rhcl @seen wizzyrea
15:49 munin rhcl: wizzyrea was last seen in #koha 1 hour, 34 minutes, and 58 seconds ago: <wizzyrea> yepper. So excited.
15:49 rhcl wizzyrea: you on
15:49 rhcl ?
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15:52 |Lupin| fredericd: like what would you need to see ?
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15:55 miguelacalvo hello
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16:00 miguelacalvo hi
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16:09 wizzyrea rhcl sup
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16:09 wizzyrea sorry had a meeting
16:11 rhcl I just talked w/ Greg xxx, assistant director at Lincoln Public LIbraries. Seems that they have a consortium (Project Pioneer) of 7 libraries representing 45% of Nebraska, and they are going to Koha.
16:14 jmr left #koha
16:16 jwagner pianohacker, was off on another screen for a while.  I don't got nothin' against Romans!  But one of my sites does....
16:20 mib_1bl3ci joined #koha
16:20 mib_1bl3ci left #koha
16:21 vickiteal joined #koha
16:23 kr1shnan joined #koha
16:25 owen Hi vickiteal
16:25 jdavidb Hi, vickiteal! :)
16:26 kr1shnan Hi schuster!
16:28 slef hi all
16:29 kr1shnan slef: well, that settles it...
16:34 cait joined #koha
16:36 CGI622 joined #koha
16:37 CGI622 left #koha
16:37 gmcharlt hi slef, vickiteal
16:38 gmcharlt & hi kr1shnan
16:39 kr1shnan gmcharlt: Hi, when do we begin? just can't remember offhand...
16:39 pianohacker Hello, all
16:39 pianohacker kr1shnan: 19:00 UTC
16:39 cait hello all
16:39 pianohacker Comes out to 3:00 PM here in MDT
16:39 gmcharlt kr1shnan: i.e., 2 hours and 19 minutes from now
16:39 kr1shnan thanks, all
16:39 gmcharlt pianohacker: so how does that work out to 3:00 PM MDT?
16:40 pianohacker Hm. Nevermind. 1:00
16:42 sekjal joined #koha
16:44 owen is now known as owen-away
16:46 kr1shnan gmcharlt: The idea of a Koha day, was that today or 6th September...
16:47 gmcharlt kr1shnan: 6 September
16:48 |Lupin| till soon all, c u for the meeting
16:48 |Lupin| left #koha
16:57 vickiteal Hi all. Finally figured out how this works.  See you later.
16:57 pianohacker cya
16:58 schuster Koha day??? Sept 6th?  Is this a secret society thing?
16:59 pianohacker It's when the developers all get together to plot new bugs to make your life difficult
16:59 cait schuster: its feature freeze and a date from koha history
17:00 pianohacker Also feature freeze, yes
17:00 brendan pianohacker++
17:00 cait September 6 1999Work starts on Koha
17:01 jmr joined #koha
17:01 schuster Ah thank you for that clarification.
17:02 cait 10th birthday of koha :)
17:08 paul_p joined #koha
17:12 * chris_n runs out to get virtual hors d'Å“uvre for the meeting
17:13 pianohacker Hmm. Had dark chocolate cake with cocoa whipped cream icing and raspberries
17:13 schuster wizzyrea - are you pac holds working
17:13 pianohacker If anyone wants to fly to Colorado, I can share
17:13 schuster hmmmm...
17:17 jmr left #koha
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17:27 CGI885 joined #koha
17:28 CGI885 left #koha
17:31 chris_n dark chocolate cake with cocoa whipped cream icing and raspberries++
17:33 paul_p left #koha
17:34 * jdavidb likes Jesse's idea for the purpose of Koha Day...
17:34 jdavidb Anything to make your life more difficult, schuster.
17:38 owen-away is now known as owen
17:40 miguelacalvo joined #koha
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17:46 miguelacalvo joined #koha
18:10 * owen isn't sure what to make of the "new koha installer" message to the Koha list
18:13 joetho joined #koha
18:13 jdavidb I'm with you on that, owen.  Koha already has a decent install package...
18:20 chris_n maybe this one would push the buttons and work the mouse... ;-)
18:21 pianohacker If they can make a Koha 3.0 Windows Installer, I'd be very interested
18:22 kr1shnan i think the best installer is where you do an "apt-get install koha"
18:22 chris_n pianohacker: you have seen the work we've done thus far?
18:22 kr1shnan and you answer a few prompts and its done
18:22 pianohacker chris_n: I've heard rumblings, but no links
18:23 kr1shnan i know some people have done work on this...debian packaging...
18:23 chris_n pianohacker:[…]installer_project
18:23 chris_n last time I touched it was jan 08
18:24 |Lupin| joined #koha
18:24 |Lupin| hi again, al
18:25 chris_n pianohacker: XML::LibXSLT is the real holdup
18:25 pianohacker ok
18:25 pianohacker XSLT strikes again
18:39 chris morning
18:39 pianohacker Good early morning
18:40 |Lupin| hi chris
18:40 |Lupin| thanks for being here
18:40 |Lupin| brb
18:40 |Lupin| left #koha
18:40 chris kr1shnan:[…]oha.git;a=summary
18:40 brendan left #koha
18:40 chris just needs to be finished
18:41 chris owen: me either, I think i asked the important (well important to me) question
18:41 slef kr1shnan: you ought to be using aptitude in debian>5.0
18:41 chris free as in cost i dont care about at all
18:41 owen Can't be too careful these days
18:42 pianohacker slef: Does aptitude have a command to see what files a package contains (<-- soon to be a very reluctant debian user)
18:42 ricardo joined #koha
18:42 slef pianohacker: no, use dpkg -L packagename for that
18:43 slef well, it might
18:43 * slef checks
18:43 pianohacker Cool. That makes apt/dpkg a little less teeth-grindingly unpleasant
18:43 ricardo Hi everyone. I'll just have a quick dinner and then I'll get back here (to the meeting). But feel free to start it, anyway!  :)
18:44 pianohacker Hi, ricardo :)
18:44 chris dpkg -L has worked forever pianohacker :)
18:44 pianohacker Heh. I imagine, just never knew about it before
18:44 chris_n hi chris
18:45 chris apt-cache is handy too
18:45 pianohacker Yup.
18:47 laurenthdl joined #koha
18:47 laurenthdl hello
18:47 |Lupin| joined #koha
18:47 |Lupin| back
18:47 pianohacker Hi, Henri, |Lupin|
18:48 laurenthdl hi jesse
18:48 hdl_laptop joined #koha
18:48 |Lupin| hello henri-damien
18:51 sekjal how much code would I need to edit to display the Materials Specified instead of the Call Number for items attached to serial biblios?
18:51 pianohacker laurenthdl: Is your first name Henri-Damien, or is your middle name Damien?
18:51 sekjal in both the staff client and the opac
18:52 hdl_laptop well... since you ask, my first name is Henri-Damien my surname is LAURENT
18:52 pianohacker If you wanted to _only_ one instead of the other, you could set the itemcallnumber syspref or remap the field
18:52 hdl_laptop pianohacker++
18:52 pianohacker Doing both in different situations would involve editing templates and possibly some database APIs
18:53 sekjal figured as much
18:53 pianohacker hdl_laptop: My mom's first name is two words too, and it annoys her when people only call her by the first
18:53 Colin joined #koha
18:54 brendan joined #koha
18:54 owen pianohacker: I'll be she can quickly identify telemarketers and used car salesmen that way
18:54 sekjal we don't give call numbers to our serials, and we don't usual specify materials for our monographs, so testing on biblio.serial would probably work well for us
18:54 hdl_laptop my mom told all my friends "put a coin" whenever they called me only by the 1rst one
18:54 chris_n lol owen
18:54 jdavidb Howdy, Colin. :)
18:54 pianohacker hdl_laptop: Haha
18:55 brendan just made it back in time :)
18:55 pianohacker owen: Heh, yeah. Also anyone reading her name off a form
18:55 chris hdl_laptop: te po atarau has 3 first names :)
18:55 hdl_laptop who is te po atarau ?
18:55 chris my son
18:56 hdl_laptop Does it mean anything ?
18:56 slef pianohacker: dpkg -S filename is also handy
18:56 slef tells you which package gave a file
18:56 pianohacker slef++
18:56 pianohacker That could be very handy
18:57 slef great timing for my network connection to go flakey - sorry if I vanish unexpectedly in-meeting
18:57 slef well, not vanish - I'll just appear to go idle
18:57 chris[…]/whats-in-a-name/
18:57 gmcharlt slef: and here I was hoping you'd be taking the official notes again ;)
18:57 thd-away is now known as thd
18:58 slef gmcharlt: and here I was hoping to duck it after doing it last time and this being a worse time for me ;)
18:58 ruth joined #koha
18:58 gmcharlt heh
18:58 slef I'm trying to chat, cook and work and expect phone call(s) too
18:58 gmcharlt chris, would you mind being volunteered to take notes for the meeting wiki page?
18:59 Colin Hi David (et al)
18:59 chris i cant guarantee being around either, kahu will be waking up shortly
18:59 jmr joined #koha
18:59 chris so i may have to disappear for bits
18:59 chris its all being logged tho
18:59 gmcharlt ok - pianohacker, could you do it?
19:00 gmcharlt yeah, of course it's logged, but summaries are nice :)
19:00 atz joined #koha
19:00 owen Hi atz!
19:00 gmcharlt anyway, let's get started
19:00 chris_n hi atz
19:00 chris atz!!! :)
19:00 atz greets all
19:00 hdl_laptop hi atz
19:00 jdavidb atz! :D
19:00 gmcharlt greetings folks, and welcome to today's general IRC meeting of the Koha project
19:00 pianohacker gmcharlt: Trying to mix in some history work, so it may be later, but I could do it
19:00 pianohacker Hi, joe
19:00 gmcharlt pianohacker: thanks
19:00 gmcharlt let's start with a round of introductions
19:00 * gmcharlt = Galen Charlton, 3.2 release manager
19:01 * pianohacker = Jesse Weaver, programmer
19:01 * hdl_laptop = Henri-Damien LAURENT , 3.0 release maintainer
19:01 tajoli joined #koha
19:01 * chris = Chris Cormack, Translation manager
19:01 * jdavidb = J. David Bavousett, PTFS
19:01 |Lupin| |Lupin| = Sébastien Hinderer
19:01 * slef = MJ Ray, webmaster for TTLLP
19:01 * sekjal = Ian Walls, NYU Health Sciences Libraries
19:01 * chris_n = Chris Nighswonger, FBC
19:01 * brendan = Brendan Gallagher, ByWater Solutions
19:01 Colin Colin Campbell PTFS-Europe
19:01 cait kf / cait = Katrin Fischer, BSZ Konstanz
19:01 * atz Joe Atzberger, now w/ Equinox
19:01 jmr jmr = john rose, PTFS
19:01 brendan atz++
19:02 * thd Thomas Dukleth, Agogme
19:02 slef I think I bring apolgies from davi = Davi Leals
19:02 jdavidb atz++  Good to see you, my friend.
19:02 ruth Ruth Vargas, Howard County Library
19:02 hdl_laptop paul_p and nicomo from BibLibre won't be there.
19:02 * atz "... not dead yet"
19:02 collum Garry Collum, Kenton County Library
19:02 magnusenger = Magnus Enger, Libriotec, Norway
19:03 tajoli Zeno Tajoli, CILEA (Italy)
19:03 * owen = Owen Leonard, Nelsonville Public Library, Interface designer for 3.x
19:03 vickiteal vickiteal=Vicki Teal Lovely
19:04 gmcharlt thanks, all, for coming
19:04 vickiteal at South Central Library System (Madison, WI)
19:04 gmcharlt the agenda today is
19:04 gmcharlt 1.Update on Roadmap to 3.2
19:04 gmcharlt 2.Update on Koha 3.0 Roadmap
19:04 gmcharlt 3.Follow-up on actions from General IRC Meeting 5 August 2009
19:04 gmcharlt finding new default assignee's and tidying up orphaned bugs
19:04 gmcharlt 5.To mantain documentation about MySQL level (tables, indexes, relations).
19:05 gmcharlt so starting with 3.2
19:05 gmcharlt as a reminder, feature freeze is the end of the day, 6 September 2009
19:05 gmcharlt which also coincides with (by one measure) the 10th anniversary of Koha
19:05 gmcharlt as I mentioned in an email to koha-devel earlier today
19:06 gmcharlt feature freeze basically means that by 6 September, any new features must be submitted
19:06 gmcharlt but the definition of "submission" is intentionally a bit loose
19:06 gmcharlt and can consist of patch submissions
19:06 gmcharlt pull requests
19:06 gmcharlt publication of git repos with relevant changes
19:07 schuster david schuster  - Plano ISD
19:07 gmcharlt or even strong promises that patches are available and will be forthcoming *very* soon - though not *too* much leeway on that latter
19:07 gmcharlt on Sept 6, I'll update the roadmap on the wiki
19:07 chris cool
19:07 gmcharlt with the list of everything that has been submitted
19:07 gmcharlt and if there's something that you believe you've submitted, but isn't reflect on the roadmap by 7 September
19:07 gmcharlt feel free to ping me or raise it on koha-devel
19:08 indradg left #koha
19:08 gmcharlt then next step will be pulling together the various branches
19:08 hdl_laptop tough job
19:08 gmcharlt and packaging a rough alpha in the next couple weeks
19:08 gmcharlt to be used for testing
19:08 gmcharlt new features submitted after 6 September will be left on an unstable branch
19:09 gmcharlt bugfix patches will always be welcome for HEAD/3.2
19:09 gmcharlt significant changes since last meeting
19:09 gmcharlt * formatino of biblibre-integration branch
19:09 gmcharlt * I've got access to other BibLibre submisssions that will be pulled out onto topic branches, then integrated into HEAD
19:09 hdl_laptop which donot have new_acquisitions
19:09 gmcharlt right, new_acq will be a separate topic branch
19:10 gmcharlt * submission of labels rework by Chris Nighswonger
19:10 chris topic_branches++
19:10 gmcharlt * and pianohacker starting to submt his syspref stuff
19:10 pianohacker yes
19:10 gmcharlt other stuff I hope to see in the next few days include RFID features from slef
19:10 ricardo (I'm back and I already read the backlog)
19:11 gmcharlt main focus through September will be integration and bugfixes and stabliization
19:11 gmcharlt I understand that BibLibre may be palnning a hackfest in France
19:11 gmcharlt and I'd like to propse a general Koha bug squashing session
19:11 Colin left #koha
19:11 gmcharlt on (let's say) the weekend of 19-20 September
19:11 |Lupin| something in France, cool !
19:11 |Lupin| BibLibre++
19:12 chris im hoping to get some other catalysta's to help out with bug squashing too
19:12 chris september 20 is software freedom day
19:12 slef to be clear, it's the RFID device direct control driver
19:12 ricardo chris: "catalysta's"?
19:12 chris people who work at catalyst :)
19:13 hdl_laptop gmcharlt: ++
19:13 slef most users will want to continue using SIP and tagging stations
19:13 ricardo chris: Do you mean  ?
19:13 slef but this is FOSS alternative using commodity devices
19:13 chris ricardo: yes, thats where i work
19:13 gmcharlt and that's it for 3.2 update - I'm expecting that the update at the next meeting October 7 will be more full of details
19:13 ricardo chris: OK, thanks for the explanation  :)
19:14 gmcharlt and I suggest that October is a good time to start discussing planning for 3.4 and/or 4.0
19:14 gmcharlt questions on 3.2?
19:14 |Lupin| yes
19:14 schuster gmcharlt - so the specific items that should be in 3.2 you will have posted on the roadmap if you fingers can type that fast on Sept 7th so if there is a feature that we think should be there it "should" be listed.  Otherwise contact?
19:14 |Lupin| as I understood BibLibre is developing tools to help merging records.
19:15 |Lupin| Will these be in 3.2 ?
19:15 gmcharlt |Lupin|: yes, they've been submitted IIRC
19:15 chris |Lupin|: yes i am testing that now
19:15 hdl_laptop how will the branches merge into oneanother ?
19:15 gmcharlt hdl_laptop: not sure of sequence yet, but order will probably be somethign like
19:15 gmcharlt biblibre-integration => master
19:15 gmcharlt labels_recon => master
19:15 gmcharlt new_acq crated, then merged => master
19:15 gmcharlt new_sysprefs => master
19:16 hdl_laptop if one patch cannot be merged easily, or two patches have conflicts, will you choose ?
19:16 atz we're v. lucky to be using git at this point.
19:16 ricardo gmcharlt: I so NOT envy your work  :-/
19:16 chris schuster: yes, if something you think should be there isnt, the 7th is the time to start asking why its not
19:16 gmcharlt hdl_laptop: I'll choose, kick back to submitter, or merge myself depending on circumstances
19:16 chris we can all make gmcharlt's life a lot easier by helping test
19:16 hdl_laptop ok.
19:17 gmcharlt I'll generally try to resolve merges myself if possible to reduce burden on submitters
19:17 hdl_laptop chris work is in progress in order to make the merging tool much more user friendly
19:17 |Lupin| gmcharlt++ for doing that, and
19:17 |Lupin| gmcharlt++ for doing it well
19:17 gmcharlt |Lupin|: well, we'll see based on the final result - don't ++ me yet
19:18 gmcharlt anyway
19:18 chris hdl_laptop: execllent, functionally it works well, but more friendly would be great
19:18 schuster Willing to run scenario test but I won't have a system to do it on :(
19:18 chris i propose that we all try to run a testng koha from the lastest merges so that we can help
19:18 gmcharlt chris: thanks
19:19 |Lupin| sure
19:19 |Lupin| it means HEAD, right ?
19:19 cait I know jane did changes to the xslt files we also changed with our patch, plz let us know if we can do something to get in into 3.2
19:19 gmcharlt cait: I'll do the merge of your work and jwagner 's
19:20 cait ok thx and gmcharlt++ :)
19:20 hdl_laptop @karma gmcharlt
19:20 munin hdl_laptop: Karma for "gmcharlt" has been increased 39 times and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 39.
19:20 gmcharlt ok, I think on to hdl_laptop for 3.0
19:20 hdl_laptop ok.
19:20 gmcharlt hdl_laptop++ # our fearless RMaint
19:20 hdl_laptop as you may know, I have been working on reconciliation brancj
19:21 hdl_laptop it is published on koha-maintenance/reconciliation
19:21 hdl_laptop I announced it on list
19:21 hdl_laptop and had very little remarks on that
19:21 pianohacker hdl_laptop: Real quick for the notes: reconciliation branch is merging select new features and bugfixes, correct?
19:22 chris i have a koha running from that ... but havent had much time to test more than to note it doesnt throw any internal server errors
19:22 hdl_laptop yes
19:22 pianohacker hdl_laptop: Okay, thank you
19:22 hdl_laptop in fact, it takes nearly all the features of current head.
19:22 hdl_laptop + all the bug fixes from 3.0.x
19:23 kr1shnan chris: isn't it possible to setup test servers so volunteers can participate over the Internet
19:23 chris it is if you have the time and the bandwidth
19:23 * chris is lacking in both currently :(
19:23 hdl_laptop I already have a test server for that branch
19:24 hdl_laptop
19:24 kr1shnan hdl_laptop: thanks...
19:24 Colin joined #koha
19:24 hdl_laptop
19:24 hdl_laptop for OPAC
19:24 kr1shnan hdl_laptop: and is there a standard way to report issues?
19:25 ricardo hdl_laptop: Is there a test Username / Password that other people can use or is it just for tests done by BibLibre people?
19:25 hdl_laptop email me.
19:25 kr1shnan hdl_laptop: thanks, i will
19:25 hdl_laptop I will add a test kohatest user
19:26 hdl_laptop test  as login
19:26 ricardo hdl_laptop: Great. Thanks!  :)
19:26 hdl_laptop kohatest pw
19:26 schuster Cool...
19:26 kr1shnan i might actually find a few volunteers that can test as well
19:26 hdl_laptop The more we test, the more accurate it can be
19:26 gmcharlt hdl_laptop: though I hope I can count on BibLibre to help with testing 3.2 -> at this point more of a priority than 3.0.x IMO
19:27 chris i second that
19:27 hdl_laptop Unfortunately, this is UNIMARC
19:27 chris with 3.2 so close
19:27 gmcharlt hdl_laptop: well the UNIMARC needs to work in 3.2 as well
19:27 chris it would make more sense to get the UNIMARC features testing in there
19:27 hdl_laptop gmcharlt: 3.0.4 has to come out since it has the patches for Amazon
19:27 chris couldnt 3.0.4 just have those?
19:28 gmcharlt hdl_laptop: no question, the Amazon patches are needed, but I'm less sure that it's necesaary to effectively backport 3.2 into 3.0.4
19:28 chris seems dangerous splitting of efforts to have 2 big feature releases
19:28 ricardo gmcharlt: Nod... Although, I would like to see 3.2 *BUGFIXES* backported to 3.0.x (when applicable, of course)
19:28 hdl_laptop this is why I wanted to release 3.0.4 before
19:29 chris yes bugfixes, not new features
19:29 gmcharlt ricardo: yeah, of which the Amazon would count as a bugfix
19:29 ricardo chris: Agreed
19:29 ricardo gmcharlt: right
19:30 gmcharlt anyway, the Amazon patches are clearly a necessary part of any 3.0.4
19:30 hdl_laptop well, if we can test 3.0.4 over the next two weeks, then 10 days translation
19:30 hdl_laptop And it would be out
19:30 * edc_away grumbles about koha log file full of " Use of uninitialized value in concatenation (.) or string" messages
19:31 edc_away is now known as ecorrado
19:31 |Lupin| hmm
19:31 |Lupin| question regarding translations pls
19:31 cait1 joined #koha
19:31 gmcharlt ecorrado: feel to work on patches for bug 2505 :)
19:31 munin Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=2505 blocker, P3, ---,, NEW, enable Perl warnings in all modules and scripts
19:31 |Lupin| is there a simple, documented way to generate the non-english languages ?
19:31 chris but there is 3.2 to test ... which is our *feature* release, we shouldnt have new features in a maintanence branch
19:32 ricardo chris++
19:32 gmcharlt |Lupin|: simple, not so well documeted - maybe chris can write something up
19:32 ricardo @karma chris
19:32 munin ricardo: Karma for "chris" has been increased 41 times and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 41.
19:32 chris |Lupin|: ill talk to you about translation later if you want
19:32 |Lupin| chris: yes, please
19:33 gmcharlt ok, upshot is we'll work with hdl_laptop to get 3.0.4 out ASAP, including Amazon patches
19:33 ricardo I have some "loose ideas" about translation changes (basically posted in the Devel Mailing List), but I concede they are difficult to implement before Koha v 3.4 or so...
19:33 gmcharlt other 3.0.x questions?
19:33 chris ricardo: the nice thng with git is you can make a topic branch and get working on it now :)
19:33 tajoli hdl_laptop: when do you think to start the test of 3.0 4?
19:34 hdl_laptop tomorrow
19:34 ricardo gmcharlt: After fixing a bug for Koha HEAD should we ask explicitly to backport it for 3.0.x?
19:34 hdl_laptop just have to create the userid
19:34 hdl_laptop ricardo: no
19:34 hdl_laptop I read the git rss
19:35 ecorrado gmcharlt: I would if I had any idea what the line  $coins_value =~ s/\ /\+/g; was suppsoed to be :-
19:35 tajoli So tomorrow Amazaon patch will be in reconcilation barn
19:35 tajoli branch ?
19:35 hdl_laptop ecorrado: just translating spaces into +
19:35 chris ecorrado: before that if ($coins_value){ that line }
19:35 hdl_laptop tajoli: it is already
19:35 gmcharlt actually, I recommend cherry-picking the Amazon patches direclty into the 3.0.x branch
19:35 chris will stop the warns
19:36 gmcharlt ah, already handled by hdl_laptop
19:36 chris so a small 3.0.4 with bugfixes? i can make time to test that
19:36 hdl_laptop But cherry pikcking direcly on 3.0.x branch was not so easy because of system preference
19:37 ricardo hdl_laptop: Hmmm... How does reading GIT RSS help you decide if a fix applies to both branches (not a critic, but a genuine question... I'm just "one step above" git newbie)
19:37 danny joined #koha
19:37 gmcharlt hdl_laptop: if you want, I can make a 3.0.x version of the patch direct applicable to 3.0.x
19:38 cait left #koha
19:38 chris ricardo: they easiest thing to do is cherry-pick and fix locally then send a patch that is rebased on 3.0.x (makes it easy for the release maintainer)
19:38 ecorrado chris: I don't see an if, but I do see a long $coins_value = "ctx_ver=Z39.88-... line before it.
19:39 hdl_laptop gmcharlt: it would be ok.
19:39 * ecorrado thinks about adding this to the bottom of a very long to-do list since ebsides beign annoying doesn;t seem to be hurting anything
19:39 ricardo chris: Interesting, thanks. I'll try to read about that
19:39 gmcharlt hdl_laptop: ok, I'll work on a patch, then
19:40 gmcharlt ok, moving on to action items
19:40 hdl_laptop gmcharlt: reconciliation branch was required because LL customers were branched on master and master would certainly have problems at some point.
19:40 gmcharlt I've updated the roadmap, and next update will be by 7 September, as I mentioned
19:41 gmcharlt hdl_laptop: which never meant that a lot of 3.2 features had to be backported into 3.0
19:41 ricardo gmcharlt:[…]opment:roadmap3.2  ?
19:41 chris ecorrado: i meant add an if :) we can chat later
19:41 thd MSG ecorrado ecorrado: Is the line in question not attempting to concatinate various elements of a supposed OpenURL into a query string with the appropriate delimiter?
19:41 gmcharlt ricardo: yes
19:41 ricardo gmcharlt: OK, thanks
19:42 gmcharlt on other action items
19:42 gmcharlt tutorial page on wiki has been started
19:42 gmcharlt[…]ntation:tutorials
19:42 * chris has to change a nappy brb
19:42 ecorrado thd: that is what it is trying to do
19:42 * ecorrado looks at an example from a file that has been fixed
19:42 gmcharlt no webcasts or online tutorials have been scheduled
19:43 gmcharlt but obviously a need
19:43 gmcharlt though I suspect timing wise may not happen until after 3.2 release
19:43 gmcharlt on other items, slef, any update on wiki relicensing?
19:43 brendan timing wise that seems the best -- after 3.2 release
19:44 brendan that way we start the tutorials on 3.2
19:44 slef gmcharlt: not yet, sorry. Had a few local problems.
19:44 gmcharlt slef: ok, remains standing and I'll ask again in October ;)
19:45 schuster So will that include "installing 3.2" and Upgrading to 3.2?
19:45 gmcharlt schuster: it could, though initial queries were for things like Git tutorials
19:46 chris back
19:46 schuster I've seen sooo much traffic lately about installing - that was my question.
19:46 brendan I think the tutorials will need more volunteers
19:46 ricardo gmcharlt: So, we're talking more about Koha *development* tutorials, right?
19:46 kr1shnan is there a list of tutorials requested somewhere?
19:46 gmcharlt ricardo: mostly, though the concept could apply to anything
19:47 chris theres always traffic about installing
19:47 kr1shnan gmcharlt: if you put up a list, we can volunteer and sign up
19:47 chris if you put up a list you can volunteer :)
19:47 * chris points to the wiki :)
19:47 kr1shnan of course
19:48 kr1shnan but just wanted to know what was already requested
19:48 cait1 git for beginners :)
19:48 |Lupin| cait1: nothing on git's website or so ?
19:48 ricardo gmcharlt: Right... I say this, because there are already good screencasts about git - e.g. - Obviously, tutorials about setting up Git to follow different Koha branches and having different databases for each branch would be appreciated (Hint! Hint!  ;-)
19:49 chris |Lupin|: it might be just linking to those from the wiki is all that is needed
19:49 gmcharlt ricardo: right, the idea is that the Git tutorial would be focused for intro Koha hackers
19:49 chris the 2 tutorials so far are are how to request a pull
19:49 ricardo gmcharlt: OK
19:49 chris and how to add a syspref
19:49 cait1 ricardo++
19:49 slef local conventions like branch names, bug interactions and so on
19:50 gmcharlt any other action items I've missed?
19:50 gmcharlt if not, let's move to 4. finding new default assignee's and tidying up orphaned bugs
19:51 gmcharlt chris: run with it, please :)
19:51 chris righto
19:52 chris well, you will all be aware that there have been quite a few changes in the community recently, most noticably liblimes decision to withdraaw from the community
19:52 chris which lets face it, is a done deal now
19:52 chris no matter how it is trying to be spun
19:52 slef Did they announce it?
19:52 brendan any LL employees here ?
19:52 chris there is no liblimer here, no patches from liblime since august 8th
19:52 tajoli What exactly ?
19:52 chris not in public
19:52 slef brb, moving back to office
19:53 chris but we can talk about that more later
19:53 miguelacalvo left #koha
19:53 tajoli And Nicole ?
19:53 chris what i wanted to talk about was the fact there are now a lot of bug assignees
19:53 chris tajoli: you will notice her work has been @gmail not @liblime i can only assume she has been working for th community in her own time, not work time
19:54 |Lupin| and atz ? aren't you a liblimer ?
19:54 chris right bug assignees that might need to be changed, and that there are now some bugs taht are orphaned
19:55 slef |Lupin|: see earlier "atz Joe Atzberger, now w/ Equinox"
19:55 schuster atz is not any longer from what I understand.
19:55 |Lupin| oh sorry, forgot about it
19:55 owen chris, do we have a list of default assignees (and haven't I asked that before and forgotten the answer?)
19:55 chris so i propose we pick a day to work through and try and tidy up bugzilla
19:55 kr1shnan chris: please enlighten... what does it take to be a bug assignee?
19:55 pianohacker in-progress summary up at[…]etingnotes09sep02 , please let me know of inaccuracies
19:55 * jdavidb would be willing to be a first-point assignee for Installation and command-line utils, and any orphaned bugs in those components.
19:56 chris volunteering kr1shnan :)
19:56 jdavidb (and also System Administration.  It's what I do.)
19:56 chris and a desire to look after that component of koha
19:56 chris cool thank you jdavidb
19:57 kr1shnan chris: thanks...
19:57 ricardo chris: So, it's you that is managing Koha's Bugzilla -  ?
19:57 jwagner left #koha
19:57 owen it's still Liblime isn't it?
19:57 chris thats another question to answer
19:57 chris its hosted at liblime
19:57 gmcharlt the current list of assignees is
19:57 gmcharlt[…]default_assignees
19:57 |Lupin| hi, Jane
19:57 thd one thing that I might note is that the categories for reporting bugs are large as perhaps they would need to be for the user but I have some particular areas of expertise in which I would be willing to volunteer
19:57 gmcharlt for volunteering, I suggest that we use koha-devel
19:58 thd s/large/broad/
19:58 ricardo gmcharlt: agreed
19:59 owen thd: in that case I think the best thing to do is accept bugs which you see are suited to you
19:59 tajoli As CILEA I could volunteering on About section (and MySQL docs)
19:59 thd I would need to develop the habit of reading all the bugs to identify the right ones
19:59 ricardo tajoli: CILEA =  ?
20:00 jdavidb I see some of the stuff I'm interested in is already with hdl, paul_p or gmcharlt.  Don't mean to steal their pig, but if they want to offload those, I'm willing.
20:00 tajoli yes
20:00 ricardo tajoli: OK, thanks  :)
20:00 kr1shnan concern from earlier comment... is it possible Nicole may not be able to spend as much time...?
20:00 hdl_laptop jdavidb: the more we are the merrier
20:00 kr1shnan in the same way as bug assignees ....are we looking for a new doc manager...i'd hate that!
20:01 hdl_laptop jdavidb: once a bug is declared, you can assing the bug to you if you want to take it
20:01 gmcharlt I'm generally willing to have anybody volunteer to take over as default assigne for any of the components I have (though not *all* of them ;) )
20:01 ricardo kr1shnan: Agreed. I think Nicole is doing and outstanding job / work regarding documentation.
20:01 ricardo s/and/an
20:02 kr1shnan beg, borrow, or steal...but let's make sure Nicole continues to do her great work...
20:02 schuster Would this be a good time to "review" bugs/enhancements as well?  I started to work on this in May and got sidetracked.
20:02 chris kr1shnan: yes i would hate that also, afaik nicole would love to stay on in that role, but i cant speak for her, or what her employer has directed her to do
20:02 gmcharlt schuster: yes, definitely
20:02 * ecorrado is not sure why the koha opac was lookign for files in a directory named "intranet-tmpl" but I moved them there and all seems to be right in the world
20:02 thd krlshnan: I would not want to speak for nengard but the fact that she is not here now may be an indication that she has some less time available at least during the business day.
20:02 schuster OK I'll work on getting a group together and see what we can do.
20:03 * chris_n heads out... will read the buffer later
20:03 kr1shnan schuster: i had volunteered, but never heard back...
20:03 schuster My bad - sorry again...
20:03 pianohacker ecorrado: The OPAC should not be looking for files in that directory; something is likely wrong with your config
20:03 gmcharlt schuster: I do recommend not overdoing it on the committee forming - get some likeminded people to review bugs first
20:04 ecorrado pianohacker: that is what I was thinking.... I need to track it down....
20:04 brendan committees--
20:04 ecorrado it really didn't seem to be effectign anything that they were not there though
20:04 ricardo brendan: Hey! That's not nice for someone that chooses the nick "committees" ;-)
20:04 jdavidb "A committee is the only form of life with a hundred bellies, and no brain."
20:04 brendan ha
20:05 gmcharlt now that we're making committeee jokes
20:05 gmcharlt I think we're done with agenda #4
20:06 gmcharlt so let's move to the last one
20:06 gmcharlt 5. To mantain documentation about MySQL level (tables, indexes, relations).
20:06 gmcharlt tajoli?
20:06 tajoli yes, is mine
20:06 tajoli well now dos about MySQL level is on 3.0.3
20:07 tajoli[…]elopment:dbschema
20:07 kr1shnan sorry...i didn't understand that
20:07 tajoli It is the documentation about Myql tables, indexes and relations
20:08 kr1shnan got it, thanks
20:08 gmcharlt tajoli++
20:09 tajoli So documentation about Mysql tables, indexes and relations is done by schema spy and comments
20:09 chris tajoli++
20:09 tajoli the dcoumentation is not perfect, I need to fix many 'implicit link'
20:10 ricardo tajoli++   (Hey, I'll improve your karma, if you improve mine, eheh... )
20:10 tajoli Because relation between tables are not always done with constraint
20:10 atz tajoli: that is often by design.
20:10 * jdavidb heads out to catch his bus.
20:10 jdavidb left #koha
20:11 chris (oh just going back for a sec, i *think* i still have admin rights on bugzilla (maybe not now)) but if i do, im willing to make the changes for default assignees etc
20:11 ricardo atz: By design? Why?
20:11 tajoli Yes, no problem but more difficult to guees
20:11 atz in particular the tables holding "old" values, the relationship is NOT a FK constraint
20:11 ecorrado pianohacker: it appears be somethign in the thene for specific screens that is looking for the intranet stuff
20:11 pianohacker Odd
20:11 atz or else, you could never delete any patron who checked out a book, for example
20:12 tajoli Clearly
20:12 ricardo atz: Old as in tables that store historical data OR old meaning tables that started as MyISAM (and *not* InnoDB) tables?
20:12 slef and in other places, remember that koha predates mysql foreign keys so it might simply never have been added
20:12 * ecorrado does not think he touched that stuff, but very well could have
20:12 atz ricardo: no, the tables like "old_issues" and "deleted_borrowers"
20:12 ricardo atz: OK. "Historical data" then. Thanks :)
20:13 atz yeah, "inactive data" we might call it
20:13 ricardo atz: right
20:13 tajoli So for the near future, to create the new docs for 3.2 comments in the code are a must, for the installation used by schema spy
20:13 atz but tajoli may have found some cases where constraint should be imposed
20:14 chris tajoli: sounds like a good idea to me
20:14 tajoli We want comments about relation in the everyday SQL definition code or only in a special one ?
20:14 slef Is there any point in splitting them?
20:15 wizzyrea atz!
20:15 wizzyrea welcome back!
20:15 pianohacker wizzyrea = Liz Rea, NEKLS
20:15 atz hi wizzyrea, good to see you, too.
20:16 tajoli The everday SQL defintion file is  installer/data/mysql/kohastructure.sql
20:16 rhcl Has the meeting finished/ready for open comment?
20:16 gmcharlt slef: splitting what?
20:16 gmcharlt rhcl: we're close, but not quite there yet
20:16 rhcl ack
20:16 slef gmcharlt: the everyday SQL definition and a special one with comments about relationships
20:17 * ecorrado finds some offending files and is sure he didn't change them
20:18 gmcharlt slef: ah, right - yeah, I think they ought to be in the same place
20:18 owen ecorrado: You will be more likely to be able to get some help after the meeting is over
20:18 * ecorrado most definietly did not change any files in the tr-TR locale (for example)
20:18 ricardo ecorrado: My recommendation would be then to submit that as a bug and, if possible, submit (or describe) a patch. And "karma points" to you for finding those!  :)
20:19 ecorrado I'll submit a bug report
20:19 ricardo ecorrado++
20:19 slef tajoli: we'd prefer comments in the everyday file
20:19 tajoli In fact as CILEA we have done a tool to update the everyday file
20:19 gmcharlt tajoli: cool
20:20 tajoli But it need a complete installation of Koha
20:20 tajoli ocumentation information is added by using an SQL script called "documentation patch". This patch has to be created dynamically, starting from an existing installation of KOHA because in order to add a comment is necessary to change the table/columns definition. Since the table/column definition can change at any time during the development process, we want to be able to "desume" this definition by looking at the DB structure.
20:20 tajoli To do so, we leverage the XML file containing a representation the DB structure created by SchemaSpy when it runs on the DB of a Koha installation (note: the file will be called "koha.xml" if the DB name is "koha"). By transforming this XML file through an XSLT stylesheet we obtain dynamically an SQL patch. This SQL file can now be edited, for example to add new table/columns comments, and then it should be run again against the DB in order to update i
20:20 tajoli Example of commands needed to create the SQL patch:
20:20 tajoli Step 1: Running SchemaSpy
20:20 tajoli > java -jar schemaSpy_4.1.1.jar -dp <path_to_mysql_java_connector> -o <output_folder> -t mysql -host <host> -u <user> -p <password> -db <db_to_describe>
20:20 tajoli Step 2: Creating the SQL patch:
20:20 tajoli > java -jar saxon9.jar -s:<path_to_XML_file_generated_by_SchemaSpy> -xsl:generate_sql_dbdoc_patch.xsl -o:autogen_dbdoc_patch.sql
20:20 tajoli Step 3: Update autogen_dbdoc_patch.sql
20:20 tajoli vi autogen_dbdoc_patch.sql
20:20 tajoli Insert the comments about new column, fix errors, etc.
20:20 tajoli Step 4: Running the SQL script:
20:20 tajoli > mysql -u <user> -p -h <host> < autogen_dbdoc_patch.sql
20:20 slef ouch floody
20:21 * chris points to
20:21 ricardo tajoli: I think that's in a point that it could be added (COPY+PASTEd) to Koha's wiki... if you haven't done that already  :)
20:22 tajoli With pastebin:
20:23 gmcharlt tajoli: re database structure, the idea is that you should always be able to start with an empty MySQL, then run kohastructure.sql
20:23 gmcharlt and always get the accurate version
20:23 gmcharlt though obviously final version won't be ready until 3.2's DB structure is finalized
20:24 tajoli In fact the diffecent is about the workflow of document modification:
20:25 tajoli 1)To change the everyday file: every developer that change DB level need to write the comment in installer/data/mysql/kohastructure.sql
20:25 kr1shnan i don't think its a good idea to write comments in kohastructure.sql
20:26 kr1shnan at least comments that we hope to preserve for a long time...this is not to make life harder for tajoli...
20:26 tajoli 2)To change a special file:  every developer that change DB level needs to write me and on Koha-devel any new tables, field, indexes and relations
20:27 tajoli Attention, not comment in the file, but comment in SQL structure
20:27 ricardo kr1shnan: Why? I'm not following
20:27 gmcharlt tajoli: for the best long-term maintenance, I prefer that it be possible to modify one file
20:27 gmcharlt for both table changes, and table metadata
20:28 ricardo tajoli: Are we talking about MySQL comments (lines that start with "--" if I'm not mistaken)?
20:28 gmcharlt without making it a two-step process
20:28 |Lupin| tajoli: then kohastructure.sql should perhaps contain instructons about whom to contact as 2)
20:28 pianohacker I think tajoli is pointing to '... COMMENT ""' ([…]create-table.html, column_definition:)
20:28 tajoli Yes
20:28 chris there should be no mysqlism's in kohastructure.sql
20:29 chris any that are there should be removed, and no new ones added
20:29 ricardo pianohacker: Ah! You're right (didn't notice that COMMENT field)
20:29 atz chris: yeah, sorta... i think supporting another DB is a long ways off.
20:30 chris we are working on it now atz
20:30 atz for pg?
20:30 chris it certainly wont be 3.2
20:30 chris yep
20:30 ricardo chris: And is there a "Cross-DB" way of adding these comments to column fields?
20:30 chris but itd be good if we didnt make ti harder
20:30 tajoli As example: ALTER TABLE accountlines CHANGE borrowernumber borrowernumber INT(10)  COMMENT 'Number of the borrower';
20:30 atz hrm... good luck.  i would estimate that to be a 200+ manhours job.
20:30 pianohacker[…]/sql-comment.html ?
20:31 pianohacker Different syntax
20:31 chris atz: sure, making it a 250 one doesnt make it easier tho :)
20:31 ricardo pianohacker: Right  :(
20:31 gmcharlt I believe 'comment on' is a bit mroe standard than what MySQL's doing
20:31 ricardo gmcharlt: Actually the page that pianohacker has this at the end:
20:31 ricardo " There is no COMMENT command in the SQL standard. "
20:31 gmcharlt but in any event, i think the medium-term advantages of keeping tabe definitions and table metadata together
20:32 gmcharlt ricardo: well, 'standard' in the sense that there are other RDBMS that also use 'comment on'
20:32 kr1shnan code comments and code inevitably drift apart...
20:32 gmcharlt kr1shnan: only if you let them
20:32 gmcharlt ;)
20:32 gmcharlt but to complete my thought
20:33 gmcharlt IMO, keeping them together works better
20:33 gmcharlt besides, for a true cross-platfrom DB setup
20:33 pianohacker chris: MySQLisms in general are not good, but if we add '... COLUMN' to the columns, couldn't we port that to PostgreSQL using a Perl script?
20:33 |Lupin| gmcharlt++
20:33 chris if we decide the comments in the db are worth, we will just go back to 2 definitions
20:33 gmcharlt we might end up using DBIx::Class or Rose::DB to express the schema anyway
20:33 ricardo gmcharlt: Possible. I admit that I don't know what other RDMBS use ( proprietary - Oracle, SQL Server - or open source)
20:33 ricardo (for COMMENTs, that is)
20:34 tajoli Attention that for schema spy at the end we need comments inside MYSQL, it is only a way to mainatin them
20:34 chris DBIx::Class is where i have been working, ihave schemas for the tables
20:34 thd atz: Koha would not be making much progress without people willing to undertake those 2XX man hours for some tasks.
20:34 chris and can create a pg database or mysql database from it
20:35 ricardo gmcharlt: I would feel more comfortable using Perl Modules for that, specially if they have already this "cross-db" comment "intelligence" for adding comments. But I understand tajoli's need of Schema Spy support  :-S
20:35 richard joined #koha
20:35 chris so thats probably where i will keep working
20:35 tajoli For documentation the problem are the implici relations
20:35 richard hi
20:35 jmr_ joined #koha
20:35 gmcharlt chris, ricardo, tajoli : in any event, I think this needs to be taken to koha-devel
20:36 chris yep
20:36 gmcharlt as time flies  for this meeting ;)
20:36 ricardo gmcharlt: Agreed
20:36 tajoli yes
20:36 ricardo richard: Hi, homonymous  ;-)
20:36 chris i really appreciate what tajoli has done
20:36 ricardo tajoli++
20:36 gmcharlt the next meeting will be 7 October, first Wednesday of October
20:36 gmcharlt tajoli++
20:36 chris in case there was any misunderstanding ;)
20:36 owen left #koha
20:36 gmcharlt any final questions or comments for today's meeting?
20:36 ricardo gmcharlt: Yeah  :)
20:36 tajoli Most work of Matteo Romanello my staigire
20:37 ricardo But I believe "rhcl" has taken the "ticket" first
20:37 rhcl Maybe a bad time to break in, but as a potential Koha customer someday, I'd like to have some discussion of Liblime's community involvement, if it's not too sensitive of a topic.
20:37 jmr__ joined #koha
20:37 rhcl What with the Koha trademark?
20:37 rhcl Forking Koha?
20:37 thd gmcharlt: At what hour will the next meeting be held?
20:37 kr1shnan i would have liked some discussion on the impact of LibLime pulling out...just to know how it really affects Koha...and to plan better...if that's needed
20:39 ricardo I would like to hear from LibLime first. I understand that August is, traditionally, a Holiday season... and some of the LibLime regulars (atz, gmcharlt ) have left. So, LibLime may just be busy recruiting new staff (just guessing, no info)
20:39 rhcl rhcl = Greg Lawson / Rolling Hills Consolidated Library
20:39 brendan I'd also like to propose that gmcharlt invite more Equinox folks to sit in on the koha meeting -- a little cross- pollination - for joint projects
20:40 schuster Existing LL clients are trying to figure out what is going on as well.  I'm marking it up as lost lots of people lots of work to do trying to reorg and get things back up to snuf.
20:40 chris i hope to hell schuster is right
20:40 chris but a lot of misinformation and downright lies are being spread
20:40 sekjal I've emailed someone at WALDO asking for clarification on things from their perspective.
20:40 chris so a public statement of what is going on would be awesome
20:41 wizzyrea sekjal: any response?
20:41 brendan sekjal -- any reponse ?
20:41 brendan jinx
20:41 wizzyrea (jinx
20:41 sekjal just an "I'm on vacation, more when I get back" response so far
20:41 rhcl Does this remind anyone of the recent Centos situation with the disappearing primary developer?
20:41 wizzyrea heh.
20:41 rhcl :)
20:41 ricardo sekjal: Right, that's understandable (it's the "August" syndrome)
20:41 * wizzyrea makes alien oooOOOOoooo noises
20:42 chris cept in this case they aren the primary developer
20:42 ricardo wizzyrea / brendan: You're twin brothers, right?  ;-)
20:42 sekjal and this contact did tell me they were doing a ton of migrations due by Sept. 1
20:42 wizzyrea erm.... no lol
20:42 sekjal so, otherwise busy
20:42 jmr left #koha
20:42 jmr__ is now known as jmr
20:42 brendan hmmm...  chris  I think no response so far means "no response"
20:42 sekjal now that I'm back, and my migration is somewhat stabilized, I'll send a bump
20:43 ricardo sekjal: Yeah... "August" and "busy". Checks. Yeah, it could be good to "bump" them this week or the next
20:43 joetho <---six LL migrations during October
20:43 brendan I messed around in sekjal install of koha -- and I do want to say -- glad to have you in the community and excellent job
20:43 brendan sekjal++
20:44 wizzyrea NEKLS has a call with LL Friday.
20:44 sekjal thanks, brendan.  I'm still learning, certainly
20:44 * brendan always learning
20:44 sekjal brendan++
20:44 gmcharlt brendan: cross-polination is good, but Equinox is focusing on EG; doesn't have much time to work on Koha directly except what I'm doing
20:45 brendan right -- just thinking about NCIP or other similar things
20:45 pianohacker Note that CC asked for a public statement regarding public contributions ( and we so far haven't heard anything
20:45 ricardo gmcharlt: Right... That's also understandable. I'm more worried when Equinox will "drain you" to EG and *away* from Koha, actually
20:45 |Lupin| gmcharlt: do you mean that working on Koha is still part of what you are payed for ?
20:45 pianohacker That may not mean anything, but it's still out there
20:45 gmcharlt right, I think the point of intersection would be such modules
20:45 tajoli Corret, EG and Koha are quite different as starting analisys
20:45 brendan gmcharlt++
20:46 slef I'm believing nothing until I see LL actions/inactions.  LL customers can/should ask/opine.  I am a bit unhappy that we don't have any Koha foundation to reassure us through this sort of worry, as you know.
20:46 jmr_ left #koha
20:47 ricardo slef++
20:47 wizzyrea yea, asking/opining so far has gotten us very, very little
20:47 gmcharlt |Lupin|: not as such, but I do get to do things like run the occassional Koha IRC meeting "on the clock", as it were
20:47 wizzyrea precious little.
20:47 slef wizzyrea: well, get community contribution into your contracts with LL. I think I mentioned this somewhere before.
20:48 wizzyrea I am almost positive it's already in our contract.
20:48 |Lupin| gmcharlt: can you please let our bosses know ll the Koha commnity is thankful to them for that ?
20:48 ricardo wizzyrea++
20:48 pianohacker |Lupin|: indeed
20:48 gmcharlt |Lupin|: sure - they do know, already ;)
20:48 slef |Lupin|++
20:48 thd ricardo: Although, the issue is really for 3.4 and later.  Obtaining advantage from the work of gmcharlt and atz and others at Equinox may be dependent upon better code sharing between Evergreen and Koha which may require setting up some structures to facilitate that work.
20:48 |Lupin| k
20:48 wizzyrea gmcharlt: remind them again. ;)
20:48 |Lupin| |Lupin|--
20:48 munin |Lupin|: Error: You're not allowed to adjust your own karma.
20:48 wizzyrea oh snap!
20:49 ricardo thd: You may be right
20:49 pianohacker self-deprecatory personalities need not apply
20:49 ricardo munin: Not even to *decrease* it? You ba**ard!  ;-)
20:49 chris heh
20:49 munin ricardo: I suck
20:49 ricardo LOL
20:49 slef wizzyrea: cool
20:49 ricardo OK. Can I make my pitch, now?  :)
20:50 * ricardo searches for the microphone
20:50 |Lupin| just didn't want to gain karma just for saying an obvious thing...
20:50 schuster Whatcha selling?
20:50 tajoli I think difficult to share much code beween Koha and EG
20:50 pianohacker thd: Yes. This might be assisted by setting up git repositories and using git-submodule
20:50 slef rhcl: anything we need to revisit?
20:50 ricardo tajoli: Yes, I'm afraid so
20:50 pianohacker This would require some restructuring of OpenNCIP and Koha's SIP2 server, but would help keep things in sync
20:51 ricardo schuster: Selling? Nothing, really
20:51 brendan not so much code that I was thinking about -- just more education...  I feel that each project can motivate the other --
20:51 pianohacker ricardo: Go for it
20:51 ricardo OK...
20:51 rhcl No, I'm satisfied. TNX to all.
20:52 ricardo SAPO - - is probably the oldest Portuguese web directory (similar to Yahoo).
20:52 tajoli At the base Koha is a multi MARC and multi lang system The analisys of EG is striclty MARC21 and monolang, as I know
20:52 brendan Well at least invite them to the meeting :)
20:52 thd tajoli: while this is perhaps the topic for another meeting and much discussion on the mailing list do not think so much in terms of the difficulties of the differences in the current design of Koha and Evegreen but in terms of major new features which need not have such legacy design constraints.
20:52 brendan thd++
20:52 ricardo SAPO is are now running the 2nd edition of "SAPO Summerbits" (similar to Google Summer of Code)
20:52 rhcl What language is EG written in?
20:53 thd Perl
20:53 |Lupin| rhcl: Java, no ?
20:53 cait1 I think the are multilingual now
20:53 cait1 read something about armenian
20:53 |Lupin| oops sorry
20:53 rhcl Ada forever!
20:53 brendan EG is translated into a few languages now IRC
20:54 ricardo I have proposed myself as the Mentor for finishing of the "Translation and Localization of Koha to Portugal / Portuguese". And that has been accepted as one of the 10 projects!  :)
20:54 chris i think working on the modules like NCIP, ILL etc
20:54 pianohacker ricardo++ # Very nice
20:54 chris that both projects can make use of will be the win
20:54 ricardo For those that can read Portuguese:
20:54 ricardo[…]tasSummerbits2009
20:54 brendan excatly chris
20:54 kr1shnan ricardo: Is there still time to ask for project participation on Sapo
20:54 ricardo "Rafael António" is the Co-Mentor and "Marta Grachat" the selected student
20:55 ricardo kr1shnan: I think that will be a bit difficult. The time is already short as it is (we are also proposing the creation of a virtual machine with Portuguese customizations to Koha in the application)
20:56 ricardo kr1shnan: What did you have in mind?
20:56 gmcharlt re the #koha meeting as such - I think it's over; I'll send an email with the time for the October meeting
20:56 pianohacker gmcharlt: Closing notes
20:56 |Lupin| gmcharlt: thanks for having been our moderator once more and for having done it well
20:57 chris yes thank you gmcharlt
20:57 ricardo gmcharlt++
20:57 brendan gmcharlt++
20:57 chris and for you continued commitment to the community
20:57 gmcharlt re the LL topic, I pretty much am staying out of it
20:57 ricardo gmcharlt: Understood
20:57 brendan fair enough
20:57 atz same here
20:57 gmcharlt except to say that I alway sstand willing to accept patches from any contributor, vendor, library, or individual
20:57 ricardo gmcharlt++
20:58 |Lupin| gmcharlt++
20:58 brendan atz gmcharlt -- hope you find the time to stay involved
20:58 pianohacker Indeed
20:58 wizzyrea def
20:58 |Lupin| yes
20:58 brendan always here to help if you need it
20:59 chris yeah i appreciate you making the time to be here atz
21:00 atz np, i still want to see Koha advance
21:00 ricardo atz: :)
21:00 |Lupin| yeah it's a great tool
21:00 sekjal atz: oh, and you shall.  These first 10 years are only the beginning!
21:00 collum left #koha
21:00 CGI634 joined #koha
21:01 kr1shnan left #koha
21:01 brendan left #koha
21:02 ricardo sekjal: Here! Here!  :)
21:02 chris heh
21:03 ricardo (or "hear! hear!"... I'll have to Google that. It makes sense in both ways)
21:03 chris as long as the next 3 months of year 10 aren as mental as the the 3 months of year 1
21:03 richard :)
21:03 chris ill be happy
21:03 CGI634 hey Chris and all Lee and Stef here from Butte Montana
21:03 chris gotta catch my bus now
21:03 chris bbiab
21:03 CGI634 just wann see what is happening
21:03 sekjal later, chris
21:03 pianohacker ricardo: (usually "Hear! Hear!")
21:03 CGI634 so we will be listening
21:03 ricardo pianohacker: OK, thanks  :)
21:04 brendan joined #koha
21:04 pianohacker CGI634: If you're referring to the Koha meeting, it is unfortunately over
21:05 CGI634 well...we will just read the transcript then ...some one told us 3pm MDT
21:05 Colin left #koha
21:05 pianohacker CGI634: Hopefully that wasn't me! I said something along those lines and was corrected
21:06 CGI634 I believe it was Chris so I will get him back later....evil laugh
21:06 ricardo CGI634: LOL!
21:06 |Lupin| :-)))))
21:06 |Lupin| IRC has many advantages
21:06 CGI634 when will tha transcript get posted?
21:06 |Lupin| my only regret about it is
21:06 slef believe nothing except the output of date -d @1251924874
21:06 brendan gmcharlt -- does your email include an agenda for the next IRC meeting
21:06 |Lupin| we can not meet all together after the meeting and have a bear or so
21:07 gmcharlt brendan: it will when I send it
21:07 brendan sweet :)
21:07 slef CGI634: it's already posted. Isn't it linked from the meeting page yet?
21:07 pianohacker CGI634: Notes at[…]etingnotes09sep02 , full transcript at the end of
21:08 CGI634 thanks ph we will review it and try to make the next IRC on time....
21:08 pianohacker slef: Hmm. It could be, but I'm not sure the new logs interface has an option to select a time range
21:08 schuster left #koha
21:09 slef pianohacker: link to[…]09-09-02#i_295504
21:09 pianohacker slef: Will do, thanks
21:09 pianohacker Not perfect, but at least a good start
21:10 sekjal alright, time to go catch my train, and work on some XSLT
21:10 sekjal cheers, all
21:10 pianohacker See ya
21:10 slef why do I keep typing "pain" instead of pianohacker?
21:10 pianohacker Dealing with me can indeed be painful
21:10 sekjal left #koha
21:10 ricardo pianohacker: LOL!
21:12 brendan pain = pianohacker
21:13 ricardo brendan: Is that a Vim "abbr"eviation that you have?  ;-)
21:13 wizzyrea @quote add Pianohacker: Dealing with me can indeed be painful
21:13 munin wizzyrea: Error: You must be registered to use this command. If you are already registered, you must either identify (using the identify command) or add a hostmask matching your current hostmask (using the "hostmask add" command).
21:14 wizzyrea @quote get 23
21:14 munin wizzyrea: Quote #23: "<gmcharlt> /msg munin register nick password" (added by wizzyrea_ at 04:25 PM, August 06, 2009)
21:14 Jo joined #koha
21:14 wizzyrea grr
21:14 vickiteal left #koha
21:15 wizzyrea bleh w/e
21:16 hdl_laptop good night folks
21:16 slef does anyone else have a problem with a koha database being a couple of Mb in mysql, but the mysqldump being a couple of Gb?
21:16 ricardo Bye hdl_laptop. And congrats / thanks for all the work
21:17 ricardo slef: That's *really* weird. The other way around could be normal (if using InnoDB, I believe the file just keeps getting bigger, to record "transaction")
21:19 tajoli left #koha
21:19 slef I'm playing "spot the big table"
21:19 ricardo slef: Good luck!
21:19 chris back
21:21 slef it's the sessions table - shouldn't something be cleaning that?
21:22 chris yeah a cron job that you write :)
21:22 cait1 isnt there a new cron job for that?
21:22 cait1 I think I saw something on patches list or git
21:22 chris yep i think so
21:22 * slef goes to get it
21:23 gmcharlt slef:  misc/cronjobs/, contributed by jdavidb in eb849c6
21:24 slef gmcharlt: tyvm
21:24 ruth left #koha
21:25 slef argh, I've an old uncommitted change... checking to see if it's upstream already
21:25 chris git stash ftw slef
21:26 slef yep, time for that
21:26 jmr left #koha
21:27 chris well that meeting is gonna make the rest of the day seem boring :)
21:28 gmcharlt chris: wadda talking about?  I have *Cataloging* class starting now ;)
21:28 pianohacker Endless, endless excitement
21:28 chris lol
21:29 CGI634 kill self now avoid slow cataloging death
21:29 pianohacker <nasal voice> "And that is the difference between the 500 and 520 MARC fields"
21:29 Colin_ joined #koha
21:29 CGI634 been there done that have the scars
21:29 pianohacker You may die, but it will be _thoroughly_ recorded
21:31 danny left #koha
21:32 chris hehe
21:32 chris @quote add  < CGI634> kill self now avoid slow cataloging death
21:32 munin chris: The operation succeeded.  Quote #29 added.
21:33 Colin_ left #koha
21:34 chris @quote add  < pianohacker> Dealing with me can indeed be painful
21:34 munin chris: The operation succeeded.  Quote #30 added.
21:38 chris i think i need a chai
21:41 CGI634 well this is about as much fun I can stand for the day...HOPEFULLY next time I will be on time...Chris LOL ciao!
21:41 pianohacker Bye, hope to see you again
21:42 chris cya lee :)
21:42 CGI634 you will, up here in Montana IRC meeting are our FAV entertainment.
21:42 chris hehe
21:42 CGI634 left #koha
21:42 chris theres always something happening on #koha
21:42 cait1 and you always helping someone :)
21:43 pianohacker Given the population density, it might be their only entertainment
21:43 chris ooohhh burn!!!
21:46 richard lol
21:47 chris_n2-away heh
21:47 chris_n2-away is now known as chris_n2
21:48 bigbrovar left #koha
21:51 pianohacker And with that, I should take a break and buckle down on schoolwork. Later, all
21:51 chris cya later pianohacker
21:52 pianohacker bye
21:52 pianohacker left #koha
22:02 steve joined #koha
22:05 chris hi steve
22:06 joetho left #koha
22:10 steve howdy!
22:11 steve am I the n00bie in the crowd? :)
22:11 chris one of them :)
22:12 steve cool!
22:13 steve Well, I am just getting started learning about the ILS world.
22:13 chris cool
22:13 steve s'why I wore a sponge hat
22:14 magnusenger left #koha
22:16 chris most of the librarians arent around at the moment
22:16 chris and we just finished a development meeting, but generally there is usually someone here who can answer most questions
22:17 brendan like the title say's   -- ask away
22:18 rhcl is now known as rhcl_away
22:18 steve nod.  I actually just downloaded Colloquy for my iMac in anticipation of the 19:00 mtg.
22:18 steve so I logged in early
22:19 steve I was going to just lurk this first time but I am curious how well Koha works for consortia in support of ILL?
22:20 chris i know a lot of consortia use it
22:21 chris im not sure any of them are around at the mo
22:21 chris wizzyrea: ?
22:26 chris guess not :)
22:26 chris there are at least 2 people from consortia who are often on here
22:28 chris i do think ILL is an area that needs more work though
22:29 thd is now known as thd-away
22:31 steve np, like I said I have a lot to learn.
22:31 * chris needs a coffee
22:31 chris bbiab
22:57 steve i found my answer
22:58 steve appears to be a pretty good model.  very cool.
23:08 slef this morning's storm has just reached here. I think I just heard the dustbin take off
23:10 steve yikes!
23:10 steve if you had been in it you could have gone for a ride, yes?
23:10 slef also currently hearing random scraping along the walls
23:10 slef I may yet be going for a ride.
23:10 slef @wunder Weston-super-Mare SOMERSET
23:10 munin slef: The current temperature in Weston-Super-Mare, United Kingdom is 14.7�C (12:10 AM BST on September 03, 2009). Conditions: Rain. Humidity: 89%. Dew Point: 13.0�C. Pressure: 29.36 in 994.1 hPa (Steady).
23:11 steve it is a base one, eh?
23:11 slef what no wind speed?
23:12 slef hrm, it says 20km/h which doesn't seem right
23:12 slef Cardiff (across the river) says 61.2 km/h which is a more credible.
23:25 chris dammmmnnnn this label creator is awesome
23:25 chris chris_n2++
23:27 cait1 we really need a tutorial how to have different installations from different branches as mentioned in the meeting today... .9
23:27 cait1 .9
23:27 cait1 .9 = :)
23:27 chris :)
23:27 chris if you are around tonight nz time (the day your time) ill show you how i do it
23:29 cait1 thats tempting, but starting my vacation tomorrow so wont be here for a few days
23:30 gmcharlt but hacking Koha *should* be a restful part of any vacation ;)
23:30 chris :)
23:31 * gmcharlt perhaps needs to get dinner
23:31 brendan I already order room-service for gmcharlt
23:31 chris @quote add <@gmcharlt> but hacking Koha *should* be a restful part of any vacation ;)
23:31 munin chris: The operation succeeded.  Quote #31 added.
23:31 brendan j/k
23:32 gmcharlt brendan: yeah, I'm still stuck in the office, so I suspect they don't go quite that far afield ;)
23:32 cait1 they just wont let me go online where I go :)
23:32 brendan gmcharlt -- time to go
23:32 brendan :)
23:32 cait1 by gmcharlt
23:32 chris excuses excuses cait1 :)
23:32 cait1 bye
23:33 gmcharlt cait1: have a good vacatin
23:33 cait1 thx gmcharlt
23:35 cait1 I will sure come back to your offer if it still stands next week
23:36 chris yep ;)
23:37 gmcharlt left #koha
23:40 cait1 :)
23:52 joetho joined #koha
23:56 |Lupin| @wunder Konstanz, Germany
23:56 munin |Lupin|: The current temperature in Konstanz, Germany is 17.0�C (1:00 AM CEST on September 03, 2009). Conditions: Mostly Cloudy. Humidity: 84%. Dew Point: 15.0�C. Pressure: 29.86 in 1011 hPa (Falling).
23:58 chris chris_n2: you about?
23:59 |Lupin| @wunder Paris, France
23:59 munin |Lupin|: The current temperature in Paris, France is 16.0�C (1:30 AM CEST on September 03, 2009). Conditions: Light Rain. Humidity: 94%. Dew Point: 15.0�C. Pressure: 29.65 in 1004 hPa (Falling).

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