IRC log for #koha, 2009-07-11

All times shown according to UTC.

Time S Nick Message
12:00 |Lupin| nicomo: do item types have a marc binding by default ?
12:00 nicomo 995$r
12:01 |Lupin| nicomo: ok, thanks
12:02 |Lupin| nicomo: this violates the recommandation 995, doesn't it ?
12:02 nicomo no problem
12:02 nicomo nope
12:02 nicomo $r == Type de document
12:02 nicomo in the original French
12:03 nicomo Item Type
12:03 |Lupin| nicomo: isn't this field restricted to one character ?
12:04 nicomo ah well, it should be 2
12:04 nicomo but that being said, the recommandation is
12:04 nicomo a/ just that, a recommandation
12:05 nicomo b/ used to exchange items data between systems
12:05 |Lupin| nicomo: btw, when the item-level_itype system preference is off, does it mean the information is stored outside of the 995 field ?
12:05 nicomo it's not a unimarc constraint at all
12:05 nicomo and you can do whatever you want in the 9XX block
12:05 |Lupin| nicomo: you're right.
12:06 |Lupin| nicomo: given the peculiariies of our usage, I'll probably give moyself a few liberties with respect to r995.
12:06 nicomo :-)
12:06 nicomo i don't know the answer to you itype OFF question
12:09 |Lupin| nicomo: ok, np
12:09 |Lupin| anybody else knows, please ?
14:13 |Lupin| folks
14:14 |Lupin| I just defined an authorized value set for document types
14:14 |Lupin| there was a record in the catalogue with a free text document tpe
14:15 |Lupin| now no document type appears in the OPAC
14:19 hdl_laptop |Lupin|: item-level_itype off you should be able to define itemtype at bibliolevel
14:22 |Lupin| hdl_laptop: yes it's he setting I have.
14:23 ricardo Hi |Lupin|! One more thing, are you using Zebra or not?
14:23 |Lupin| hdl_laptop: did ou see the discussion with Ricardo on the list ? Which field is more approrpiate according to you ? 200b or 990c ?
14:23 |Lupin| hello ricardo
14:23 hdl_laptop Hi ricardo
14:23 |Lupin| ricardo: no zebra in use here
14:24 hdl_laptop We have long used 200$b for that matter
14:24 |Lupin| hdl_laptop: ok
14:24 ricardo |Lupin|: And let me guess... The problem is that when you do an Advanced Search, and choose some Item Type, you get something like "no results found"?
14:25 hdl_laptop But localfields might also be a good choice since they donot harm data if you grab them from BNF
14:25 hdl_laptop Problem is that you have to add that to the index
14:26 |Lupin| hdl_laptop: ok
14:26 ricardo |Lupin|: See if this applies to you:
14:26 ricardo Bug 2599
14:26 munin Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=2599 major, PATCH-Sent, ---,, NEW, Search limits not working for NoZebra
14:27 |Lupin| ricardo: well I didn't even go that far, I just tried to display one record and encountered the problem of not seeing any document type
14:28 ricardo |Lupin|: Oh, OK. In the Intranet? In the OPAC? Both?
14:28 |Lupin| ricardo: thanks ! I'm pretty sure that once I'll have defined the itemtype=>MARC mapping I'll face this problem, too. thanks !
14:28 |Lupin| ricardo: both
14:28 ricardo |Lupin|: You're welcome!  :)
14:28 |Lupin| hdl_laptop: how do you add the field to the index, please ?
14:29 hdl_laptop all depends if you are NoZebra Mode or Zebra mode
14:29 |Lupin| hdl_laptop: NoZebra mode
14:30 |Lupin| also: what should the field where item types are stored contain ? a number referring to an itemtype table in the DB, the content of the item's description field ? something else ?
14:30 hdl_laptop there is the itemtype table
14:31 hdl_laptop you can define in admin/
14:31 hdl_laptop the subfield should contain itemtype codes
14:34 |Lupin| hdl_laptop: ok, that's what I was expecting
14:34 |Lupin| hdl_laptop: and for the indexing issue, how's that handled ?
14:34 hdl_laptop NoZebraIndex
14:34 hdl_laptop change 200b into 990whatever and should be ok.
14:35 hdl_laptop then reindex
14:35 ricardo hdl_laptop: I think you mean "NoZebraIndexes"  :)
14:35 ricardo Which leads to...
14:35 hdl_laptop yes
14:35 ricardo Bug 2178
14:35 munin Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=2178 critical, P3, ---,, NEW, "NoZebraIndexes" system preference is being set to MARC21 values in UNIMARC installations
14:36 |Lupin| oh my god
14:37 |Lupin| thanks ricardo
14:37 ricardo |Lupin|: LOL
14:37 ricardo |Lupin|: You're welcome  :)
14:37 ricardo :)
14:38 |Lupin| does munin log ?
14:38 wizzyrea Lupin: there are logs online
14:38 |Lupin| oh cool !
14:38 |Lupin| where ?
14:38 wizzyrea 1s I'll find them
14:38 |Lupin| wizzyrea: thanks !
14:39 wizzyrea Lupin:
14:39 ricardo Hi Galen & Jesse!  :)
14:39 |Lupin| wizzyrea: cool ! thanks a lot !
14:39 pianohacker Hi, Ricardo
14:39 gmcharlt hi ricardo
14:39 wizzyrea Lupin: no problem. :)
14:40 ricardo Now *I* have one question...
14:40 hdl_laptop ricardo: maybe it is because noZebraIndexes for UNIMARC is in French systempreferences.
14:41 ricardo hdl_laptop: Probably... But shouldn't "NoZebraIndexes" depend only on the MARC flavor and *not* on language?
14:41 |Lupin| ricardo: was that your question ?
14:42 hdl_laptop ricardo: sure, but Unimarc, was first supported by french ppl and sysprefs are only language dependant.
14:42 ricardo |Lupin|: Actually, no, that wasn't my question... I'll get to that in a minute  :)
14:43 |Lupin| :)
14:43 |Lupin| much to say today...
14:43 ricardo hdl_laptop: Sure, I understand that (and I very much appreciate the excellent work done by BibLibre foks), but I'm not sure *why* "System Preferences" are language dependent, except for translating *descriptions* of System Preferences... Am I wrong?
14:44 ricardo s/foks/folks
14:44 hdl_laptop ricardo: no you are not.
14:45 hdl_laptop it is just a matter of translating values in database.
14:45 ebegin my guess is that when hdl_laptop wrote "sysprefs are only language dependant" he meant "are not"...
14:46 ricardo hdl_laptop: OK, thanks  :)  I guess that would be a part that would be worthy of "refactoring". But I understand that would take some time and work to do (changes in Perl code and database model)
14:47 hdl_laptop ebegin: in fact, sysprefs sql data have different directories but differs in language, not in marcflavour
14:49 ricardo hdl_laptop: Right, and I think that can be problematic for additional localizations/translations (more copy+past work... and need to replace things in more places if changes occur, like: "We now need to change the default "NoZebraIndexes" values...")
14:51 gmcharlt there are actually two axes of syspref localizaiton
14:51 gmcharlt one is translating the descriptions
14:51 gmcharlt the other would be initial default values
14:52 ricardo gmcharlt: ++
14:52 gmcharlt which potentially could vary by library type and from country to country
14:53 ricardo gmcharlt: Maybe...
14:56 ricardo gmcharlt: It seems to me that a RFC could be a good thing for this, but I'm the first one to admit that I think I can't help much regarding that (I don't know the current data model / Perl code for this... and I'm already "swamped" in work)
14:56 ricardo Which leads me... to my question  :)
14:57 |Lupin| finally !
14:57 ricardo |Lupin|: LOL!
14:57 |Lupin| ricardo: you are like the portugese Hitchcock !!
14:57 ricardo Does Koha currently support Thesaurus (Authorities for Subjects) with relationships (hierarchical, synonyms, narrower term...) between subjects?
14:57 |Lupin| gmcharlt: that's what I was gonna say !
14:57 ricardo |Lupin|: s/portugese/portug*u*ese ... Thanks!  :)
14:58 |Lupin| ricardo: ooops sorry
14:58 gmcharlt ricardo: not for MARC21
14:58 wizzyrea @quote add <|Lupin|>ricardo: you are like the Portuguese Hitchcock!!
14:58 munin wizzyrea: The operation succeeded.  Quote #15 added.
14:58 ricardo wizzyrea: LOL!
14:59 wizzyrea hey, it made me laugh :P
14:59 ricardo gmcharlt: Thanks... And for UNIMARC... anyone?
14:59 |Lupin| ricardo: no, sorry
14:59 ricardo |Lupin|: No problem  :)  I see that spelling mistake even in some software
15:01 hdl_laptop ricardo: for unimarc, it works
15:01 hdl_laptop well kindof
15:01 ricardo hdl_laptop: That's great. Thanks! :) What fields are used for that? Is there some documentation?
15:02 hdl_laptop $5 used for broader narrower term
15:02 hdl_laptop and $3 for linking
15:02 hdl_laptop Problem is that you cannot link 2 authorities via the web interface.
15:03 hdl_laptop either you blukedit a thesaurus
15:03 hdl_laptop s/bulkedit/bulkimport/
15:03 hdl_laptop or you edit by manually
15:03 ricardo hdl_laptop: Manually, meaning doing SQL Updates?
15:04 hdl_laptop no.
15:04 |Lupin| in the marc editor ?
15:04 hdl_laptop on web interface, filling out $3 authority numbers
15:04 hdl_laptop manually
15:04 hdl_laptop not so handy.
15:04 ricardo hdl_laptop: In what field is that $5 and $3 ?
15:06 hdl_laptop you can find $5 in 5XX fields
15:06 hdl_laptop and $3 should also be in heading
15:09 ricardo hdl_laptop: OK, thanks. I'm assuming that you mean the 5XX fields for "UNIMARC Authorities" and *NOT* the 5XX fields for "UNIMARC Bibliographic". Right?
15:09 hdl_laptop of course ;)
15:12 ricardo hdl_laptop: Hmmm... $3 and $5
15:12 ricardo[…]/uniafull.htm#5--
15:12 ricardo ...
15:12 ricardo $3 Record Number
15:12 ricardo $5 Tracing Control
15:13 ricardo Are you talking about this? ^^^
15:13 hdl_laptop yes
15:13 ricardo hdl_laptop: Great, thanks  :)  Do you know of any Demo / Library Koha site that implements this?
15:18 hdl_laptop[…]
15:18 ricardo ... and does this support "broader term / narrower term" relationships or just "is the same as" (synonym) relationship?
15:19 pianohacker ricardo: I'm currently working on a new sysprefs editor that makes the translation process slightly more sane
15:20 ricardo pianohacker: That's great news!  :)  Any improvement is a good thing
15:21 ricardo hdl_laptop: Many thanks for the URL... A warning. The redirect that the URL does has a small typo:
15:21 ricardo[…]
15:21 ricardo ... leads to ...
15:21 jdavidb pianohacker++
15:21 ricardo
15:21 ricardo Note that the IP address is "glued" to "cgi-bin", meaning there's a "/" (forward slash) missing there
15:22 hdl_laptop ricardo: have you been able to see more ?
15:23 ricardo hdl_laptop: Do you mean, when I added the forward slash in the URL? Yes. Thank you very much!  :)
15:28 ricardo So, I guess that "550"s are "subdivisions" and "750"s are "synonyms" right? (I'm afraid I'm an "UNIMARC authorities" newbie...)
15:29 hdl_laptop 750 are parallel forms : other languages
15:29 hdl_laptop and 550 are associated terms : Broader, Narrower or Related, depending on $5 value
15:30 ricardo hdl_laptop: Very interesting, indeed. Thanks a lot Henri!  :)
15:31 kf have a nice weekend #koha :)
15:31 ricardo Take care kf! :)
15:50 |Lupin| see you later all
15:50 |Lupin| take care !
19:37 joetho busy day in Kohaville.
19:39 rhcl Yea, I just noticed that! Must be friday afternoon or something.
19:41 joetho well in NZ right now it is something like 10:30 Tuesday morning or something. Aren't they usually a little noisier than this?
19:43 pianohacker Well, it is technically the weekend there
19:43 rhcl Chris is usually on, don't know where he is.
19:43 rhcl Jo shows up about this time sometimes.
19:44 rhcl Don't know about Liz and Snow.
19:44 pianohacker @seen wizzyrea
19:44 munin pianohacker: wizzyrea was last seen in #koha 4 hours, 45 minutes, and 49 seconds ago: <wizzyrea> hey, it made me laugh :P
20:00 joetho wow, that is one echoey laugh
20:00 joetho 5 hours and counting
20:02 rhcl 5 until ????
20:02 pianohacker rhcl: 5 since we saw wizzy
20:03 rhcl ic
20:20 Snow_Fox rhcl im central time its friday :|
20:20 Snow_Fox wizzy should be too
20:20 Snow_Fox its about 3:20 here
20:22 Snow_Fox and trust me
20:22 Snow_Fox my brain has already decided its the weekend and left me here to fend for myself
20:26 pianohacker Snow_Fox: You seem to have a pretty antagonistic relationship with that brain of yours
20:26 Snow_Fox dont get me wrong comes in handy for a verity of things
20:26 Snow_Fox but it also is ADD complient
20:27 Snow_Fox very ADD complient
20:28 Snow_Fox i mean its litterally thinking about something and squirrel
20:28 Snow_Fox off to left field
20:32 Snow_Fox and piano no im not completly off my rocker, im quantly holding onto a leg :-P
20:47 chris rhcl and joetho its 8.50am on saturday and i just had the first sleep in in 7 weeks :-)
20:48 pianohacker nz_time = mst_time - 6 hours || cst_time - 7 hours
20:48 pianohacker Easier than trying to deal with 18-hour time shifts
20:49 pianohacker How are you?
20:49 chris good :) glad its the weekend
20:50 chris how bout urself?
20:50 pianohacker Good, trying to forward-port some 2.2 code
20:50 pianohacker Had forgotten how bad the API was
20:51 chris heh yeah, its not pretty
20:52 pianohacker How's Kahu and Atu ?
20:52 pianohacker Kahu sleeping in at all?
20:53 chris Kahu is at my sisters house, with is cousin, hence the sleep in :)
20:54 pianohacker Ahh, very nice
20:54 pianohacker One way to escap
20:54 pianohacker *escape
20:54 chris we are all meeting up at 1pm for a japanese festival
20:54 chris and i can finally sleep through ata's grunting and the other weird noises he makes when he sleeps :)
20:56 rhcl chris!
20:56 chris heya rhcl :)
21:23 chris[…]val-of-wellington  
21:28 pianohacker That's quite a nice website
21:31 chris yeah its quite easy to use
21:31 pianohacker Interesting blurb about nzlive
21:35 chris yep nzlive is what happens when you let consultants loose
21:35 chris with other peoples money
23:10 pianohacker Good night, #koha
06:22 chris @weather wellington, new zealand
06:22 munin chris: The current temperature in Wellington, New Zealand is 9.0°C (6:00 PM NZST on July 11, 2009). Conditions: Mostly Cloudy. Humidity: 66%. Dew Point: 3.0°C. Windchill: 7.0°C. Pressure: 30.06 in 1018 hPa (Steady).

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