IRC log for #koha, 2008-05-20

All times shown according to UTC.

Time S Nick Message
13:46 hdl I couldnot see it in my box.
13:46 hdl thx gmcharlt
13:49 owen nengard: I can confirm that AmazonSimilarItems requires AmazonContent to be turned on
13:50 nengard okey dokey!!
13:52 atz 512 translations?
13:53 nengard at i hope not - owen that's not good
13:53 nengard manual updated
13:53 owen[…]l?biblionumber=92
13:53 nengard ewww
13:54 owen That's not even a title in my database.
13:55 atz that doesn't make any sense
13:55 atz links back to biblionumber 5... "Stand tall, Molly Lou Melon"
13:56 atz When was the "Similar Items" feature introduced?
13:56 owen The biblionumbers are sequential as you go down the list
13:56 lloyd_ before alpha
13:57 owen But it's not happening with everything:[…]l?biblionumber=85
13:58 atz owen: and what kind of intelligence establishes the "similarity" relationship?
13:58 owen Amazon
13:58 atz xISBN or something?
13:59 atz ah
14:03 atz owen: perhaps the odd isbn breaks the recursion?  namely  "0553156993 | 0"
14:04 nengard owen - your shelf browser is showing dup images ... on that last link you sent
14:05 owen Sure, that's because I have Amazon and GoogleJackets on at the same time :)
14:05 nengard ahhh
14:05 nengard okay
14:07 nengard unrelated question - can one of you send me a screenshot the fines page for a patron who has overdue items?  I don't need to see patron's info - just the account section on their profile on staff side ... I want to see what an overdue line looks like on a profile so I can document it
14:08 nengard
14:19 owen atz, what was it we had to do in order to be able to use HTML::Template's variables like EVEN and ODD?
14:20 atz change the constructor call to H:T:P
14:20 atz to include loop_context_vars=>1
14:21 owen Can that be done on a per-script basis? Does that introduce a lot more overhead?
14:21 atz i think the overhead is minor
14:21 atz and no, currently we have one constructor for everything
14:22 atz in the long run whatever overhead there is will be better than our current many reproductions of toggle/highlight/counter code
14:23 owen So the switch should incorporate changes to all scripts that incorporate that stuff
14:24 atz owen: unlikely to occur simultaneously since different terminology and style are used for the same things
15:01 hdl owen : why is there no way to select only his own suggestion on anymore ?
15:03 owen I don't know
15:05 hdl Because some customers were quite pleased to filter suggestions and now, it is not possible.
15:06 hdl More OPAC updates, including changes to how virtual shelves and suggestions links ...
15:06 hdl This feature disappeared in this commit in November 27
15:09 hdl No.
15:10 hdl In fact, it is displaying all users suggestions when it is said to display ONLY your suggestions.
15:11 nengard no one answered - can anyone do this?
15:11 nengard unrelated question - can one of you send me a screenshot the fines page for a patron who has overdue items?  I don't need to see patron's info - just the account section on their profile on staff side ... I want to see what an overdue line looks like on a profile so I can document it
15:11 nengard <nengard>
15:11 owen Sorry nengard, I don't have data with fines either.
15:11 nengard :( oh poo
15:12 owen hdl: OPACViewOthersSuggestions os turned on?
15:12 hdl OFF
15:12 hdl owen is a happy man ;)
15:15 nengard hdl i agree
15:15 nengard there is a bit of a mess going on there
15:24 owen hdl, is this the commit you're referring to?[…]ec4addbf82#patch8
15:25 hdl owen In fact, i have searched too fast.
15:25 hdl was this commit Adding check all/none controls to opac suggestions, following opac shelves interface.
15:25 hdl I think.
15:26 hdl That changed OPAC suggestion behaviour.
15:26 hdl But I will cope with that.
15:26 owen that just added the "check all" buttons and moved teh "new suggestion" link
15:27 owen Are you remembering tabs that showed "suggetions" and "my suggestions" ?
15:28 hdl tabs ?
15:28 hdl it was simply filtering.
15:28 owen A search form?
15:33 hdl it is quite weird.
15:33 hdl When there are no pending suggestions, you cannot create one.
15:33 owen I submitted a patch for that recently...didn't I?
15:36 owen[…]c3419bd64bcd0ccdd
15:57 owen hdl: I'm not finding that it's showing me suggestions other than my own
15:59 owen hdl: I had hidden the "filter suggestions" form if OPACViewOthersSuggestions is turned off. I thought this was justified because it includes a "suggested by anyone" choice
16:00 lloyd_ mmm anybody know why mason's permissions patch hasn't been accepted yet?
16:27 gmcharlt hi kados
16:43 hdl hi kados
16:44 owen Hi kados
17:41 kados owen: got a sec?
17:41 owen Yes
17:41 kados for some reason, the acquisitions and serials links are showing up for staff that don't have access to them
17:41 kados on the dashboard and on the more dropdown
17:42 kados owen: I'm happy to fix that, just wanted to make sure you wern't working on it already to avoid  conflict
17:43 owen Did that permissions variable change?
17:43 kados not that I'm aware of
17:44 owen Those links are wrapped in <!-- TMPL_IF NAME="CAN_user_editcatalogue" -->
17:44 kados yea, the serials one needs to be added in the serials and ditto with acquisitions
17:44 kados I'll take care of it
17:45 kados CAN_user_acquisition and CAN_user_serials
17:53 kados owen: any reason for to stick around?
17:54 owen No
17:54 kados owen: looks like it's being used in a couple places still, but not sure if that's deprecated
17:54 kados grep -r *
17:54 kados modules/maint/catmaintain.tmpl:<!-- TMPL_INCLUDE NAME="" -->
17:54 kados modules/cataloguing/additem-nomarc.tmpl:<!-- TMPL_INCLUDE NAME="" -->
17:54 kados modules/cataloguing/addbiblio-nomarc.tmpl:<!-- TMPL_INCLUDE NAME="" -->
17:54 kados modules/authorities/detail.tmpl:<!-- TMPL_INCLUDE NAME="" -->
17:54 kados modules/catalogue/dictionary.tmpl:<!-- TMPL_INCLUDE NAME="" -->
17:54 kados modules/catalogue/suggest.tmpl:<!-- TMPL_INCLUDE NAME="" -->
17:54 kados owen: can I just replace all of those with
17:55 owen No, it doesn't work that way.
17:55 owen Is catmaintain.tmpl still used?
17:55 owen And those -nomarc files?
17:56 kados don't think so
17:56 kados catmaintain was for managing deleted bibs and items
17:56 kados we should retain it, for future integration
17:56 kados the nomarc tmpls can be removed afaik
17:56 kados dictionary.tmpl should proabbly be retained
17:57 kados not sure what suggest.tmpl is ... is that suggestions management for acquisitions?
17:57 owen Take a look...I'm not sure what that is
17:58 kados /cgi-bin/koha/catalogue/ doesn't work
17:58 kados Undefined subroutine &main::findsuggestion called at /home/jmf/repos/koha-rm-tes​t.git/catalogue/ line 39.
17:58 kados paul, hdl any ideas what is?
17:59 kados it's not linked to from anywhere, I'd say we can remove it
18:00 kados owen: so I think only authorities/ needs to be updated to remove
18:00 kados the others can probably be ignored for now, or removed
18:49 kados owen: got a sec?
18:49 kados owen: I'm on bug duty today and have a questiona bout 1824
18:49 owen Yes
18:50 kados darrell submitted a patch for this, but I'm not clear whether it will work as NPL expects
18:51 owen What is it doing?
18:51 kados well, it's been pushed afaik
18:53 kados I'm guessing the branch specification isn't good enough for NPl yet
18:53 owen Is it doing any branch specification?
18:53 kados[…]
18:53 kados sort of ...
18:53 kados admin / demo
18:54 kados does NPL's queue change from day to day?
18:54 owen Yes
18:54 kados ie, if a book is targeted for a specific branch, and isn't filled the first day, is it bumped to the next branch?
18:54 owen Only if the first branch's copy has been made lost
18:55 kados gotcha
18:55 kados ok, so I'm guessing this won't really work for NPL then as implemented
18:55 owen Doesn't NPL's reserves script do some kind of branch prioritization?
18:55 kados as it doesn't have that targeting capability
18:55 kados owen: yea, it's a static definition
20:12 nengard hdl i'm reading through commits to update manual and see this one:[…]142ddefaa4419b375 what does this sys preference do?
20:14 kados nengard: I can answer that
20:15 kados nengard: it's to p romote some tie-in between serials and acquisitions
20:15 nengard okay
20:15 nengard kados - so how does it work? what does it do?
20:15 kados nengard: if you renew a serial subscription, it generates a suggestion so the selector knows to order it
20:15 nengard Oh!
20:15 nengard neat
20:15 nengard why is it Local Use?
20:15 kados what does Local Use mean?
20:17 nengard kados it's under the local use tab on the admin > general preferences
20:17 kados ahh ... because hdl forgot to assign it to a tab
20:23 nengard kados should I report it? hdl are you around? (probably not - it's late in France)
20:24 kados nengard: I'll take care of it
20:24 nengard thanks kados - where will it go? so i can update the manual
20:25 kados nengard: Acquisitions tab
20:26 nengard well - that makes sense :)
20:26 kados :)
23:02 atz wow... just saw the announcement of OCLC xOCLCnum service
23:02 atz 5 times as many targets as xISBN
23:28 kados yea, that's pretty interesting
23:29 kados with very minor tweaks we could turn that on
23:29 kados but it sorta assumes you use oclc records
23:29 atz right, you still need a starting point OCLCnum
23:30 atz but given that service, it seems like a valuable identifier to have
01:40 owen g'nite #koha
09:51 kados hi paul
09:51 paul hi joshua
09:51 kados so ... I count 40 bugs with blocker, critical and major
09:51 kados
09:52 kados + there are still pretty serious issues with the holds process, fines management, notices, and reports that will make Koha inadequate for most US libraries
09:52 kados holds works perfectly for a single-branch library, but we have to do a workaround for multi-branch libraries
09:53 kados also, we don't have many clients using acquisitions, but I know there are some outstanding and perhaps unreported issues there
09:53 kados paul: so I'm curious if you would recommend a release before or after these issues are fixed
09:54 paul it depends on how many time is needed to fix them ;-)
09:54 paul + for some of them, I think the description is very obscure & I personnaly don't see how to fix /what to fix
09:54 paul for example #1532 (the 1st one)
09:55 kados yep, that's a poor bug report
09:55 kados but it has to do with the holds problems I mention above
09:55 kados in US libraries, holds are managed in a queue
09:55 kados and libraries that own a title are targeted until they say they don't have that item available, then another library is targeted
09:56 kados rather than the Koha approach of broadcasting the hold to all libraries
09:56 kados so NPL for instance, has a holds queue table that is updated every 10 minutes
09:57 paul so it means that the '1st to pick it' as done with Koha atm is not what they need ?
09:57 kados correct
09:57 kados in fact, I can say that 99% of US libraries would be very unhappy with this broadcast 1st to pick it approach
09:58 paul too bad... that will be hard to change...
09:58 kados we can implement NPL's workaround, but it will be a dirty solution
09:58 kados just imagine howard county for instance ... they often have 3-400 holds on a single title
09:58 paul and changing completly the behaviour is a long term & hard solution
09:59 paul 3-400 hold on a single title ????????
09:59 paul wow !
09:59 kados yep
09:59 paul most libraries here limit the number of holds possible to a given item, to avoid ppl having to wait for 5months to get a book
10:00 paul in fact they still will have to wait 5 months, but the hold won't be pending for 5 months ;-)
10:00 kados :)
10:01 kados paul: so holds is a special case as you are happy with it and US libraries aren't
10:01 kados paul: lets ignore that one for now ... we can implement our workaround if need be
10:01 paul yep.
10:01 kados paul: what about the rest of the issues ... fines, reports, notices, and the 40 bugs
10:02 kados surely french libraries will have a problem with many of these
10:02 kados like shipping costs disappearing in acquisitions
10:02 kados 1965
10:02 paul fines, I don't have a library using it. In france, only SAN-OP use them, and they plan to get rid with them.
10:02 kados and 1920: total price not saving to order
10:02 kados oh!
10:02 kados so fines are also a point of contention
10:03 kados !! I begin to see the problem :-)
10:03 paul 1965 : unseen, as in France, most libraries have a public contract, and shipping cost is included, so it's always 0 ;-)
10:03 kados :(
10:04 paul 1965: joe wrote on march, 6 that he sended a patch. It did not solve this bug ?
10:05 kados no, it did not
10:05 kados and I find additional errors too ... the total isn't updated at all when entering amount
10:05 paul however, I agree with you that such bugs must be fixed. even if we (BibLibre clients) don't suffer of it.
10:06 kados paul: there are 163 'normal' bugs ... can you look at the list and make sure none of them should be major, blocker or critical?
10:07 kados paul:
10:07 paul ok, will try to do that today... added to my very long list of things to do...
10:07 ewwc hello?
10:08 kados paul: I worry about the reports issues too ... I guess French libraries don't need much reporting?
10:08 paul hello ewwc. good morning/evening/afternoon, depending on where you come from.
10:08 ewwc Brunei, its evening here
10:08 paul I fact, I think reports are underused because of their bugs.
10:08 paul not because of no need.
10:09 paul but I think we can release 3.0 and fix those bugs after, in 3.0.1
10:09 ewwc is this a good place to get help installing koha
10:09 paul as the datas will be saved correctly.
10:09 paul ewwc: probably the best one ;-)
10:10 ewwc well I followed the instructions for ubuntu gutsy but now i get fatal error trap for the last step
10:11 ewwc there are errors when doing the make test for koha
10:12 ewwc I think the errors are negligible as they are for perl modules that were not mentioned in the walkthrough
10:12 ewwc so where did I go wrong?
10:12 paul could you copy/paste the exact error you get ?
10:13 ewwc hold on, let me boot up the ubuntu
10:13 paul kados : it will be time for lunch for me. Go to take a breakfast, we will continue later.
10:13 kados ok
10:15 ewwc which error did you want?
10:15 ewwc the make test one or the other?
10:17 ewwc when I try to go to http://servername:8080 I get production mode - trapped fatal error
10:19 paul ewwc: this error is useless for debugguing. you must go to your logs and investigate here
10:20 ewwc yeah I'm still new to all this
10:20 ewwc which log and where
10:21 ewwc I got this while installing the zebrasrv: - [fatal] lock file /var/lock/koha/zebradb/biblios/ [No such file or directory]
10:22 ewwc I think this might be the culprit
10:22 paul mmm... I don't think so. It will cause a problem later I think. Not when you start koha.
10:22 ewwc >_<
10:22 paul hdl, do you know where the logs are located on a fresh install by default ?
10:23 paul ewwc: in some hours, you could meet gmcharlt here, that should be much more efficient than me on helping you. atm, I think he's still sleeping (US guy)
10:24 ewwc ah
10:24 ewwc couple more hrs more
10:24 hdl var/log
10:24 hdl (in the koha directory)
10:25 ewwc in that case , here's a usge question - is it advisable to run it on Mac?
10:26 paul MAc OS-X, I think it's fine, as it's an unix/linux flavour
10:27 ewwc just a matter of installation procedure then?
10:27 ewwc btw can't find a var directory anywhere in /etc/koha
10:29 paul look in /usr/local/koha
10:31 ewwc nope
10:31 ewwc no such dir
10:31 ewwc tried the home directory
10:31 ewwc nithing there either
10:34 ewwc has anyone succesfully installed koha3 on OSX Leopard? The help file on the koha wiki is out of date
10:34 paul not me (never tried)
10:34 ewwc i think atz helped someone install one (read it in the forum)
10:35 paul atz is from US as well, so probably sleeping (or just awaking & in the bathroom ;-) )
10:35 ewwc so the best time to catch them is 12 hrs from now, at the end of their day?
10:36 paul nope, in 2-3 hours he should be around
10:36 ewwc ok, guess I'll pop on home for dinner first
11:00 gmcharlt ewcc: about?

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