| Time |
S |
Nick |
Message |
| 12:01 |
|
owen |
We have so many different types of data, I'm not sure we can really choose one method |
| 12:01 |
|
kados |
the semantically correct way to do it is with <dl> |
| 12:02 |
|
kados |
for every definition list we should use dl |
| 12:02 |
|
kados |
IMO |
| 12:02 |
|
owen |
Yes, but how do you define a definition list? :) |
| 12:03 |
|
kados |
Name: Tom Sawyer |
| 12:03 |
|
kados |
that's a definition list :-) |
| 12:04 |
|
owen |
Is the catalogue detail page a definition list as well? |
| 12:04 |
|
owen |
ISBN: 031287863X |
| 12:04 |
|
kados |
looks that way to me |
| 12:04 |
|
owen |
Detailed notes: "A Tom Doherty Associates book." |
| 12:05 |
|
owen |
What other cases are there where we are outputting data like that? |
| 12:05 |
|
paul |
I would say "every where". |
| 12:05 |
|
paul |
member detail for example |
| 12:05 |
|
kados |
any time we have something that looks like: |
| 12:05 |
|
kados |
Label : Value |
| 12:06 |
|
kados |
except for forms |
| 12:32 |
|
paul |
owen: who is supposed to answer to your question ? I don't understand what you're speaking of |
| 12:34 |
|
owen |
I wish I had the definitive answer for how to mark up forms and data. I just think it's odd that we say use <dl> when outputting, but use labels and paragraphs and whatnot when inputting the data |
| 13:07 |
|
kados |
paragraphs shouldn't be used for inputting IMO |
| 13:07 |
|
paul |
why ? it's not html valid ? |
| 13:07 |
|
paul |
I thought <p> was mandatory even in this case |
| 13:07 |
|
kados |
it's not semantic |
| 13:08 |
|
kados |
<p> should only be used when dealing with actual paragraphs |
| 13:08 |
|
paul |
how do you put 2 input on 2 lines then ? |
| 13:08 |
|
kados |
<div> |
| 13:08 |
|
kados |
wait |
| 13:08 |
|
paul |
wow ! |
| 13:08 |
|
kados |
no, I answered to quickly :-) |
| 13:08 |
|
paul |
I can't believe you're right |
| 13:08 |
|
kados |
that's handled in css |
| 13:08 |
|
kados |
not with div |
| 13:08 |
|
kados |
sorry :-) |
| 13:08 |
|
paul |
how do you handle that in css ? |
| 13:08 |
|
kados |
input { display: block; } |
| 13:09 |
|
paul |
mmm... and if you want to have 2 input on & line, then a large textarea just below ? |
| 13:09 |
|
kados |
use classes |
| 13:09 |
|
kados |
one class to put on one line |
| 13:09 |
|
kados |
one to have a large text area |
| 13:10 |
|
kados |
semantics shouldn't be comprimized for presentation IMO |
| 13:10 |
|
paul |
mmm... i can't believe you're right. |
| 13:10 |
|
kados |
otherwise, someone else who wants to present it differently can't easily do it |
| 13:10 |
|
kados |
ask in freenode.net #html ;-) |
| 13:10 |
|
paul |
you did it ? |
| 13:11 |
|
kados |
<p><input></p> simply isn't semantic |
| 13:11 |
|
paul |
I don't understand why in fact. |
| 13:11 |
|
kados |
because <p> semantically means 'paragraph' |
| 13:11 |
|
paul |
but it is a paragraph according to me. |
| 13:11 |
|
kados |
it is related to a document division |
| 13:11 |
|
paul |
in a form, but a p |
| 13:11 |
|
kados |
nope, what you are talking about is 'presentation' |
| 13:12 |
|
kados |
<p> should never be used to determine presentation |
| 13:12 |
|
kados |
it is used to describe the semantic relationship of one block to another |
| 13:12 |
|
paul |
when I have : |
| 13:12 |
|
paul |
<p>search publicationyear between <input> and <input></p> |
| 13:13 |
|
paul |
<p>limit search to <input> results</p> |
| 13:13 |
|
paul |
that's paragraphs imho |
| 13:13 |
|
kados |
paul: not according to w3.org |
| 13:14 |
|
kados |
The organization of information into paragraphs is not affected by how the paragraphs are presented |
| 13:14 |
|
paul |
I don't understand |
| 13:14 |
|
kados |
ok, I will try to explain |
| 13:15 |
|
kados |
semantic markup is used to specify semantic relationships between elements on the page |
| 13:15 |
|
kados |
presentation logic should ideally be separate from semantic markup |
| 13:16 |
|
paul |
mmm... there is a semantic diff between |
| 13:16 |
|
paul |
<p>search publicationyear between <input> and <input></p> |
| 13:16 |
|
paul |
and |
| 13:16 |
|
paul |
<p>limit search to <input> results</p> |
| 13:16 |
|
kados |
yes, but it's not a 'paragraph' |
| 13:16 |
|
kados |
you should use <div> |
| 13:16 |
|
kados |
which is used for generic division |
| 13:17 |
|
paul |
when do you use <p> then ? |
| 13:17 |
|
paul |
(a sample) |
| 13:17 |
|
kados |
in a document |
| 13:17 |
|
kados |
or in a block of text that's equivilent |
| 13:17 |
|
kados |
help file, etc. |
| 13:18 |
|
kados |
so pretend you are a screen reader |
| 13:18 |
|
kados |
if you see <p> you will assume you are in 'document' mode |
| 13:18 |
|
kados |
<div> signals that this is not a document |
| 13:18 |
|
kados |
make sense? |
| 13:18 |
|
paul |
no, sorry... |
| 13:19 |
|
paul |
i'll ask a usenet french forum |
| 13:19 |
|
paul |
maybe in french i'll understand... |
| 13:20 |
|
kados |
div and span are related |
| 13:20 |
|
kados |
they indicate 'generic' divisions |
| 13:20 |
|
kados |
other divisions have specific semantic meaning |
| 13:21 |
|
kados |
<p> means paragraph |
| 13:21 |
|
kados |
<h*> means 'heading' |
| 13:21 |
|
kados |
paul: when do you use div? |
| 13:22 |
|
kados |
IMO, you can have <div><p></p></div> but not <p><div></div></p> |
| 13:22 |
|
paul |
I agree. |
| 13:23 |
|
kados |
and you can always have <div><div></div></div> |
| 13:23 |
|
paul |
<p><span></span></p> is better |
| 13:23 |
|
kados |
nope |
| 13:23 |
|
kados |
they are different |
| 13:23 |
|
kados |
<div> is a block level |
| 13:23 |
|
kados |
<span> is an inline |
| 13:24 |
|
paul |
yes, and in a paragraph, you can just have inlines. otherwise, you have 2 paragraphs in fact. |
| 13:24 |
|
kados |
but we don't have paragraphs :-) |
| 13:24 |
|
kados |
this is an application |
| 13:24 |
|
kados |
so unless it's text, there are no paragraphs |
| 13:24 |
|
kados |
there are instead 'logical divisions' <divs> |
| 13:24 |
|
kados |
and 'inline divisions' <span> |
| 13:24 |
|
paul |
you're saying we should have no <p> in Koha ? |
| 13:25 |
|
kados |
I think we should have <p> in Koha when there is long blocks of text |
| 13:25 |
|
paul |
(that means no p then...) |
| 13:25 |
|
kados |
help files, etc |
| 13:25 |
|
kados |
otherwise, it should be <div> and <span> |
| 13:25 |
|
paul |
(that means almost no p then...) |
| 13:25 |
|
kados |
yep |
| 13:25 |
|
kados |
hardly any <p> |
| 13:26 |
|
paul |
so, how to differentiate the different kinds of <div> ? |
| 13:26 |
|
kados |
div class=type1 |
| 13:26 |
|
kados |
div class=type2 |
| 13:26 |
|
paul |
and div class="p" ? |
| 13:26 |
|
kados |
? |
| 13:26 |
|
kados |
why would you need that? |
| 13:26 |
|
paul |
was a joke ;-) |
| 13:26 |
|
kados |
just use a <p> if you have a paragraph |
| 13:26 |
|
kados |
hehe |
| 13:27 |
|
paul |
could you say how many "type" would be needed ? |
| 13:27 |
|
kados |
I haven't counted in fact ;-) |
| 13:27 |
|
kados |
but as few as possible |
| 13:27 |
|
paul |
that's something like 3 or 30 ? |
| 13:27 |
|
kados |
hopefully we only need 5-6 types |
| 13:27 |
|
paul |
ok, I agree with "as few as possible" ;-) |
| 13:28 |
|
paul |
if you clearly define what we need, I candidate to help updating templates. |
| 13:28 |
|
paul |
but you'll have to tell exactly how/what to do |
| 13:28 |
|
kados |
I will try to add to our coding guidelines info on 'semantic' markup |
| 13:29 |
|
kados |
I didn't realize that it wasn't understood :-) |
| 13:29 |
|
paul |
I understand, even if I don't see the benefits... |
| 13:29 |
|
kados |
ok, simple practical benefit |
| 13:30 |
|
kados |
you can have <div><div><div></div></div></div> |
| 13:30 |
|
kados |
but you can't have <p><p><p></p></p></p> |
| 13:30 |
|
kados |
so <div> gives you 'nesting' |
| 13:30 |
|
kyle |
hey paul, kados |
| 13:30 |
|
kados |
hey kyle |
| 13:31 |
|
paul |
hello kyle |
| 13:31 |
|
kyle |
I've a question... |
| 13:31 |
|
kados |
paul: does that make sense? |
| 13:31 |
|
paul |
yep |
| 13:31 |
|
kados |
kyle: sure |
| 13:31 |
|
kados |
paul: so now do you see the benefits? :-) |
| 13:31 |
|
kyle |
I'm adding a warning for failed renewals from moremember.pl |
| 13:31 |
|
kados |
(or one at least?) |
| 13:31 |
|
kados |
kyle++ that's been a bug for a while |
| 13:31 |
|
kados |
or feature enhancement IIRC |
| 13:32 |
|
kyle |
I wanted to add a column for the number of renewals for each item, so I tried <!-- TMPL_VAR name="renewals" --> but it comes up blank. |
| 13:32 |
|
paul |
yes. although they seems not that major to me. but i'll follow you here, as i'm really a rookie. |
| 13:32 |
|
kados |
paul: it's not major unless you try to design nice looking templates ;-) |
| 13:32 |
|
paul |
(I'm only still afraid by the time we will need. and hope you don't forget my concern on this matter) |
| 13:33 |
|
kyle |
It's being pull using Search.pm::borissues which is pulling everything from issues, but the tmpl_var tag is still coming up empty. |
| 13:33 |
|
kyle |
Do I have to explicitly push that on the template params somewhere? |
| 13:35 |
|
kados |
hmmm |
| 13:35 |
|
kyle |
if you have an updated copy of dev_week from cvs, my fix is in there. But it's not fully working. For some reason, even if there are multiple failed renewals, it only says there is one failed renewal. The code that the bug must be in is at the top of moremember.pl |
| 13:38 |
|
kados |
kyle: have you traced the other borrissues stuff to see if it's explicitly pushed out? |
| 13:40 |
|
kyle |
kados: None of the other borissues stuff appears to be explictly pushed out. |
| 13:40 |
|
kados |
that's weird |
| 13:40 |
|
kados |
if the others show up, you'd expect that to as well |
| 13:40 |
|
kyle |
indeed. |
| 13:41 |
|
kyle |
at the bottom of moremember.pl is $template->param($data) |
| 13:51 |
|
kyle |
Well, I fixed the error in my work, I'll commit it now. |
| 13:51 |
|
kados |
kyle++ |
| 13:51 |
|
kyle |
I still cannot get the number of renewals to show up, but that's not a big deal. |
| 13:52 |
|
kyle |
How do I alert the other template maintainers of the fix? |
| 13:52 |
|
kados |
in your commit message you could alert them |
| 13:52 |
|
kados |
they all get an email on that |
| 13:53 |
|
kados |
otherwise, if you feel it's important enough you can send a mail to koha-devel |
| 13:53 |
|
kados |
or file a bug on bugzilla |
| 13:53 |
|
kados |
with a explanation of how to patch it |
| 13:53 |
|
kados |
probably the bug would be best |
| 13:53 |
|
kados |
as it won't get lost |
| 13:54 |
|
kados |
ok, I've gotta run |
| 13:54 |
|
kados |
be back a bit later |
| 13:54 |
|
kyle |
is there a bug report for this issue already in there? |
| 15:15 |
|
rch |
hdl: still around? |
| 15:35 |
|
cm |
kados, are you back? |
| 17:20 |
|
hdl |
rch around ? |
| 17:24 |
|
rch |
hi hdl |
| 17:25 |
|
rch |
was talking with kados re: installer |
| 17:26 |
|
rch |
were you going to add the redirects to prevent opac/intranet access prior to successful install? |
| 17:27 |
|
hdl |
yes. I have to. |
| 17:42 |
|
rch |
hdl: are you running on Debian Linux? |
| 17:43 |
|
rch |
etch? |
| 18:45 |
|
qiqo |
hi |
| 18:45 |
|
qiqo |
anyone up? |
| 18:46 |
|
qiqo |
hello |
| 18:46 |
|
dewey |
bonjour, qiqo |
| 18:46 |
|
qiqo |
hi dewey |
| 18:47 |
|
qiqo |
ive a problem with koha |
| 18:48 |
|
chris |
whats the problem? |
| 18:48 |
|
dewey |
i guess the problem is that it's usually very hard to understand ! |
| 18:49 |
|
qiqo |
no not really |
| 18:49 |
|
qiqo |
ermm ive installed koha on a suse 10.2 |
| 18:50 |
|
qiqo |
well i found the solution on why the page doesnt load |
| 18:50 |
|
qiqo |
you must set folder permission on koha-httpd.conf |
| 18:50 |
|
qiqo |
however my problem is my apache installation does not recognize SetEnv directive |
| 18:52 |
|
chris |
right you will need to make sure that module is installed |
| 18:52 |
|
chris |
and that apache is loading it |
| 18:52 |
|
chris |
apache 1.3 or apache 2? |
| 18:52 |
|
qiqo |
apache 2 |
| 18:53 |
|
chris |
ok what you want to do |
| 18:53 |
|
chris |
is if you look in /etc/apache2/ |
| 18:53 |
|
dewey |
Hmm. No matches for that, chris. |
| 18:53 |
|
chris |
is there a mods_available and mods_enabled dir? |
| 18:54 |
|
qiqo |
nothing |
| 18:55 |
|
chris |
so you have no /etc/apache2 ? |
| 18:55 |
|
chris |
or no mods-enabled dir? |
| 18:55 |
|
chris |
- not _ sorry |
| 18:55 |
|
qiqo |
i have /etc/apache2 directory |
| 18:55 |
|
chris |
whats in there? |
| 18:56 |
|
qiqo |
the folders are: |
| 18:56 |
|
qiqo |
conf.d, extra, ssl.crt, ssl.crl,ssl.key, ssl.rpm, sysconfig.d vhosts.d |
| 18:57 |
|
chris |
hmmm suse sets it up quite different then |
| 18:57 |
|
chris |
anything in sysconfig.d ? |
| 18:58 |
|
qiqo |
i think im figuring it out |
| 18:58 |
|
chris |
basically |
| 18:58 |
|
chris |
LoadModule env_module /usr/lib/apache2/modules/mod_env.so |
| 18:58 |
|
qiqo |
yeah |
| 18:58 |
|
chris |
that line needs to be executed at some point :) |
| 19:00 |
|
qiqo |
ok ill try it again |
| 19:01 |
|
chris |
with debian it involves just symlinking the env.load file from mods-available to mods-enabled |
| 19:01 |
|
chris |
and restarting apache |
| 19:01 |
|
chris |
but im not sure how you do it in suse |
| 19:01 |
|
chris |
you might have to edit the conf |
| 19:02 |
|
qiqo |
ei its loading |
| 19:02 |
|
qiqo |
cool!!!! |
| 19:02 |
|
qiqo |
hehehe |
| 19:02 |
|
qiqo |
i guess i may have to create a how to install on suse then |
| 19:02 |
|
chris |
cool |
| 19:03 |
|
chris |
good idea, write it up on the wiki, there might be a start of somethgin there |
| 19:03 |
|
qiqo |
yeah,, |
| 19:12 |
|
qiqo |
btw my problem now is with the barcode |
| 19:13 |
|
qiqo |
i just want to create a code39 barcode |
| 19:17 |
|
mason |
heya qiqo |
| 19:17 |
|
qiqo |
hi mason |
| 19:17 |
|
mason |
i wrote some of the barcode stuff a while ago |
| 19:17 |
|
qiqo |
i just want a straight forward barcode |
| 19:17 |
|
qiqo |
ahh really? |
| 19:17 |
|
qiqo |
at the mailing list? |
| 19:17 |
|
mason |
there was a bug with the code39 barcodes that i fixed |
| 19:18 |
|
qiqo |
uhh |
| 19:18 |
|
qiqo |
ok |
| 19:18 |
|
mason |
gimme a tick to find it again |
| 19:19 |
|
qiqo |
ok |
| 19:19 |
|
mason |
aaaah, here it is... |
| 19:20 |
|
mason |
so u might need to grab a newwer version of Labels.pm from savannah's cvs |
| 19:20 |
|
mason |
ill get a url for you |
| 19:21 |
|
qiqo |
okie thanks |
| 19:21 |
|
qiqo |
usually when i generate labels.. all i see on the pdf is the word "BOOK" no barcodes whatsoever |
| 19:21 |
|
mason |
try this -> http://cvs.savannah.nongnu.org[…]bels.pm?root=koha |
| 19:22 |
|
mason |
and put the file in the /usr/local/koha/internet/modules/C4 dir |
| 19:23 |
|
qiqo |
ok ill check on that' |
| 19:24 |
|
mason |
the bug was that code39 barcodes need to be wrapped in '*' s, |
| 19:24 |
|
mason |
like this, *123456789* |
| 19:24 |
|
qiqo |
ahh ok |
| 19:25 |
|
mason |
but i think you have a different problem that that |
| 19:25 |
|
mason |
you arnt getting any barcodes at all ? :( |
| 19:25 |
|
qiqo |
yeah |
| 19:25 |
|
qiqo |
:( |
| 19:25 |
|
mason |
do any of the other barcode types work ok? |
| 19:26 |
|
qiqo |
the barcodesgenerator work |
| 19:26 |
|
qiqo |
the label-barcode doesnt |
| 19:26 |
|
qiqo |
ooh code 39 works |
| 19:26 |
|
qiqo |
cool |
| 19:26 |
|
qiqo |
i was using upc a whle ago |
| 19:27 |
|
mason |
woo |
| 19:28 |
|
mason |
ok, now try them with your barcode scanner to make sure they are correct :) |
| 19:28 |
|
qiqo |
yeah it works |
| 19:28 |
|
qiqo |
but |
| 19:28 |
|
qiqo |
i could see the call number |
| 19:28 |
|
qiqo |
just the barcode |
| 19:29 |
|
mason |
ok, lemme check on our dev box for something.... |
| 19:30 |
|
kados |
mason: we have a client that still has problems with the code39 production |
| 19:30 |
|
mason |
really? |
| 19:30 |
|
kados |
I think so |
| 19:31 |
|
mason |
i thought the *12345678* bug was the problem , that was fixed? |
| 19:31 |
|
kados |
I think it's something to do with the checksum |
| 19:31 |
|
mason |
yep, that was it |
| 19:31 |
|
qiqo |
is openbiblio active? because i suggested to the head librarian of a public library here to shift to koha |
| 19:31 |
|
kados |
not sure the client was able to get it working |
| 19:32 |
|
qiqo |
they are using openbiblio |
| 19:32 |
|
mason |
kados, this twas the fix -> http://cvs.savannah.gnu.org/vi[…].3.4.5&r2=1.3.4.6 |
| 19:32 |
|
qiqo |
but openbiblio guys release ob once a year! |
| 19:32 |
|
qiqo |
lol |
| 19:34 |
|
kados |
mason: wow, I missed that fix |
| 19:34 |
|
kados |
mason: updating and informing client now |
| 19:34 |
|
kados |
mason: thanks! |
| 19:34 |
|
qiqo |
i installed koha in our computer laboratory |
| 19:35 |
|
qiqo |
just to teach people about MARC |
| 19:35 |
|
qiqo |
hehe |
| 19:35 |
|
mason |
bah, my responsibility to inform you josh |
| 19:35 |
|
mason |
qiqo, just settings up barcodes here... |
| 19:35 |
|
qiqo |
ok |
| 19:42 |
|
qiqo |
ei mason,, thank you very much |
| 19:42 |
|
qiqo |
i have to go to school |
| 19:42 |
|
qiqo |
thank you and godbless |
| 19:42 |
|
mason |
ok :( |
| 19:42 |
|
mason |
come back soon and ill help you with the problem |
| 19:42 |
|
qiqo |
thanks really |
| 19:43 |
|
qiqo |
ill be writing a guide on suse |
| 19:43 |
|
mason |
no problem! |
| 04:17 |
|
hdl |
rch : running Mandriva. |
| 04:21 |
|
hdl |
kados still awake ? |
| 06:24 |
|
Lea |
hi! |
| 06:25 |
|
Lea |
My librarian is complaining that koha times out too quickly. Is that a koha setting or apache? Thanks. |
| 06:41 |
|
chris |
more info needed :) |
| 06:42 |
|
chris |
times out in what way ... the authentication? |
| 06:42 |
|
chris |
ie makes them reauthenticate too soon? |
| 06:42 |
|
chris |
if so thats a setting in system preferences |
| 07:19 |
|
Lea |
sorry chris |
| 07:19 |
|
Lea |
was afk |
| 07:20 |
|
Lea |
it's when she's adding a book to the system |
| 07:20 |
|
Lea |
i think her authenticated session times out |
| 09:14 |
|
hdl |
Lea: see in System preferences. |
| 09:14 |
|
hdl |
Lea: timeout parameter. |
| 09:34 |
|
hdl |
kados : hi |
| 09:34 |
|
dewey |
hello, hdl |
| 09:42 |
|
Lea |
hdl: thanks |
| 10:11 |
|
slef |
hello |
| 10:11 |
|
dewey |
niihau, slef |
| 10:11 |
|
slef |
kados: are you in yet? |
| 10:25 |
|
slef |
biab |
| 10:25 |
|
slef |
bbi60+ |
| 10:30 |
|
hdl |
slef hi |
| 10:36 |
|
kados |
hey slef |
| 10:36 |
|
kados |
slef: got git installed |
| 10:36 |
|
kados |
slef: and working :-) |
| 10:37 |
|
kados |
slef: is this the week you have some bandwidth to devote to the installer? |
| 10:38 |
|
owen |
'morning kados |
| 10:39 |
|
kados |
hey owen |
| 10:39 |
|
kados |
howdy |
| 10:39 |
|
dewey |
bonjour, kados |
| 10:40 |
|
kados |
but I'm not sure if everyone's OK with prog having some double spans and other stuff from yui |
| 10:40 |
|
kados |
owen: any thoughts? |
| 10:40 |
|
owen |
That's a tough one. |
| 10:40 |
|
kados |
yea |
| 10:41 |
|
owen |
Do you have an example? Is it the button thing? |
| 10:42 |
|
Lea |
yui rocks |
| 10:42 |
|
kados |
all I have atm are some screenshots |
| 10:42 |
|
Lea |
ooh lets see :D |
| 10:42 |
|
owen |
You use it Lea? I'm just getting to know it |
| 10:42 |
|
kados |
http://kados.org/stuff/yui_borrowers.png |
| 10:43 |
|
Lea |
i use jquery mainly but I was made aware of yui + yui-ext from a recent merger/collab |
| 10:43 |
|
kados |
meaning, I've implemented some stuff, but it's on my local machine so I can't show it off :-) |
| 10:43 |
|
Lea |
heh |
| 10:43 |
|
Lea |
you seen yui-ext? |
| 10:44 |
|
kados |
no, I hadnt |
| 10:44 |
|
owen |
I'm aware of it, but haven't really looked at it yet |
| 10:44 |
|
kados |
ahh, yea I had seen that |
| 10:45 |
|
kados |
datatable is really slick, but definitely still a beta :/ |
| 10:45 |
|
owen |
kados, part of me wants to say that yui stuff should be presentation layer, since theoretically it should all be progressive enhancement |
| 10:46 |
|
owen |
You're finding cases where the markup needs to be altered to suit? |
| 10:46 |
|
kados |
well the markup in head is pretty awful ;-) |
| 10:46 |
|
kados |
so I've been modifying as I go |
| 10:47 |
|
kados |
I'm prob about 80% done with members/ |
| 10:47 |
|
kados |
not counting the memberentry stuff which needs a complete re-write |
| 10:47 |
|
owen |
kados, the screenshot looks great, so it looks like you're on the right track |
| 10:48 |
|
kados |
the other idea we had was to commit my modifs as a 'liblime' template |
| 10:48 |
|
owen |
I'd hate to see your markup-cleaning only make it into a separate template |
| 10:49 |
|
kados |
yea |
| 10:49 |
|
kados |
IKWYM |
| 10:49 |
|
Lea |
btw guys, jquery is VERY good |
| 10:49 |
|
kados |
Lea: yea, I plan to look more closely at the ajax stuff shortly |
| 10:49 |
|
owen |
Lea, any thoughts about how it compares to YUI? |
| 10:50 |
|
Lea |
i wrote a really cool little webapp yesterday in 1 hour that allows you to enter a youtube URL, it'll dl the video locally and generate code that you can insert in moodle to view the video. Jquery is slick |
| 10:50 |
|
Lea |
i can help with ajax stuff if you like, although I'm no expert |
| 10:50 |
|
Lea |
I've not looked at YUI yet but it looks neat |
| 10:51 |
|
kados |
owen: one thing that has to be included for grids (of course) is the correct class names |
| 10:51 |
|
Lea |
AFAICT, you can intermix JS libraries, so you could use jquery+yui no problem. I *think*. |
| 10:51 |
|
kados |
owen: which are yui specific |
| 10:52 |
|
owen |
That's just layout stuff, right? |
| 10:52 |
|
kados |
it's just things like <div class="yui-b"> |
| 10:54 |
|
kados |
but there's also some javascript and css |
| 10:54 |
|
kados |
that's a bit less pretty |
| 10:54 |
|
kados |
for buttons/links |
| 10:55 |
|
paul |
hello guys |
| 10:56 |
|
kados |
hi paul |
| 10:56 |
|
paul |
kados : the guys that answered on usenet forum are as septical as me about <p> removal. |
| 10:57 |
|
kados |
I'm sorry to hear that |
| 10:57 |
|
owen |
I guess if we're really going to be strict with the concept of the prog templates, we'd have to say no to the YUI stuff |
| 10:57 |
|
kados |
the bottom line is that <p><p></p></p> is illegal whereas <div><div></div></div> isn't |
| 10:57 |
|
owen |
But maybe the concept of the prog templates has never really worked |
| 10:57 |
|
kados |
owen: *nod* |
| 10:57 |
|
kados |
yea |
| 10:57 |
|
kados |
on both accounts |
| 10:58 |
|
kados |
the prob with prog templates |
| 10:58 |
|
kados |
1. they are not really prog templates :-) |
| 10:58 |
|
kados |
2. we have to do twice the work to maintain |
| 10:59 |
|
kados |
the problem is no prog templates |
| 10:59 |
|
kados |
1. developers don't use design principles when laying out their html (they are programmers so that's ok) |
| 10:59 |
|
paul |
kados : the concept of prog template never enthusiamed me. so, i have no problem abandonning them... |
| 11:00 |
|
kados |
paul: but if we share a set of templates, we need to agree to a set of guidelines |
| 11:00 |
|
paul |
and I still think (since more than 1 year...) that even developpers can write correct HTML if they have correct directions. |
| 11:00 |
|
paul |
you beat me ;-) |
| 11:00 |
|
kados |
:-) |
| 11:01 |
|
paul |
I repeat what I said yesterday : give/write clear method to write templates, and i will obey. |
| 11:02 |
|
owen |
I hoped that developers wouldn't have to use design principles when laying out their HTML. |
| 11:02 |
|
paul |
owen : I think that's a good idea ... with enough developpers & template designers |
| 11:03 |
|
paul |
that we don't have. |
| 11:05 |
|
owen |
Then I think we're at a point were the Release Manager gets to decide what goes into the templates |
| 11:06 |
|
kados |
I think the advantages that yui give us outweigh the minor problems with having it as the core template system |
| 11:08 |
|
paul |
kados : what are the advantages ? |
| 11:09 |
|
paul |
only a clear & standard GUI |
| 11:09 |
|
Lea |
The reality is, most people will probably use the intranet interface as is and never change it. The opac on the other hand is the opposite. |
| 11:09 |
|
paul |
or something else |
| 11:09 |
|
Lea |
*by internet, I mean the admin stuff |
| 11:09 |
|
paul |
ALL french users uses released templates. |
| 11:09 |
|
paul |
(for admin I mean) |
| 11:09 |
|
kados |
right |
| 11:09 |
|
kados |
kados.org/stuff/moremember.png |
| 11:10 |
|
kados |
well I'm addicted to Grids |
| 11:10 |
|
paul |
Grids ? |
| 11:10 |
|
kados |
it's the perfect solution to layout IMO |
| 11:10 |
|
kados |
paul: in YUI grids is the layout module |
| 11:11 |
|
kados |
and I really like YUI buttons too |
| 11:11 |
|
kados |
to make a nice button all I need is: |
| 11:11 |
|
kados |
<span class="linkbuttons" id="linkbutton1"><span class="first-child"><a href="/cgi-bin/koha/members/memberentry.pl?op=add&guarantorid=<!-- TMPL_VAR NAME="borrowernumber" -->&category_type=C">Add child</a></span></span> |
| 11:13 |
|
kados |
don't think the double span is even necessary come to think of it |
| 11:13 |
|
paul |
class="linkbuttons first-child" should work |
| 11:13 |
|
rch |
kados: I imagine grids are not supported in older browsers. Do we lose sorting functionality if these become default templates? |
| 11:14 |
|
kados |
rch: datatable is what gives us the table sorting |
| 11:14 |
|
kados |
rch: and grids do degrade well if your page layout is sane |
| 11:14 |
|
kados |
I've tested all my designs with lynx |
| 11:14 |
|
kados |
for sanity |
| 11:14 |
|
kados |
and they are usable |
| 11:15 |
|
rch |
just not resortable ? |
| 11:15 |
|
kados |
right |
| 11:15 |
|
kados |
cuz that's done entirely in js |
| 11:15 |
|
rch |
yui docs say firefox 1.5+ and ie6+ |
| 11:15 |
|
kados |
but honestly datatable's got some bugs |
| 11:16 |
|
rch |
for 'full support'... |
| 11:16 |
|
kados |
yea |
| 11:16 |
|
kados |
we should definitely test the older browsers |
| 11:16 |
|
kados |
but our current templates don't degrade well to be hontest :-) |
| 11:16 |
|
kados |
esp with IE |
| 11:17 |
|
paul |
rch / kados : on admin interface, we can say "firefox X.X or IE Y.Y needed" |
| 11:17 |
|
paul |
so that's not a problem imho |
| 11:17 |
|
kados |
paul: *nod* |
| 11:18 |
|
kados |
brbr |
| 11:18 |
|
rch |
Sure, and on the opac side, all the yui stuff will be enhancements, so not a problem if they don't quite work right on older browsers. |
| 11:30 |
|
kados |
ok, so I'll commit my yui stuff, after I clean it a bit |
| 11:30 |
|
kados |
and I'll stick to just grids and button for now |
| 11:30 |
|
kados |
since datatable has some bugs |
| 11:30 |
|
kados |
paul: that OK with you? |
| 11:31 |
|
paul |
yep. then, i'll summarize what I've understood on koha-devel. |
| 11:31 |
|
paul |
and if I'm right, let's modify templates... |
| 11:31 |
|
paul |
(just to avoid doing things a 3rd time...) |
| 11:32 |
|
kados |
yep |
