| Time |
S |
Nick |
Message |
| 13:09 |
|
rch |
hey paul , hdl |
| 13:09 |
|
hdl |
hi |
| 13:09 |
|
dewey |
que tal, hdl |
| 13:09 |
|
paul |
hey rch |
| 13:09 |
|
rch |
morning :) |
| 13:10 |
|
rch |
working on getting rel_3 installed |
| 13:10 |
|
rch |
wondering firstly about sql defs |
| 13:10 |
|
rch |
there's a phpmyadmin dump in installer/ |
| 13:10 |
|
rch |
but it has some errors |
| 13:11 |
|
rch |
should that dump be authoritative db def? |
| 13:11 |
|
hdl |
some errors in regards with mysql 5.0 |
| 13:11 |
|
hdl |
? |
| 13:11 |
|
rch |
i think firstly syntax on fkey constraints |
| 13:12 |
|
rch |
(not mysql5 specific) |
| 13:12 |
|
rch |
but, okay, i didn't test on 4.1 |
| 13:13 |
|
kados |
is there a way to make it compatible with both 5 and 4.1? |
| 13:13 |
|
kados |
or do we need two sql schemas? |
| 13:14 |
|
hdl |
kados : for db structure, i think there should be a way to have only one sql chema. |
| 13:14 |
|
hdl |
I hope so. |
| 13:15 |
|
rch |
yes, there is an fkey constraint problem for mysql5 also |
| 13:15 |
|
rch |
but i'm not sure how to fix |
| 13:15 |
|
kados |
hdl: so the dump in the installer/ dir should be considered authoritative? |
| 13:15 |
|
rch |
but this should be the authoritative database structure, correct? |
| 13:16 |
|
hdl |
Yes, it should. |
| 13:16 |
|
hdl |
koha.mysql is old now. |
| 13:16 |
|
kados |
rch: so you will work on making it work for 5.0? |
| 13:16 |
|
kados |
hdl: any reason we can't just replace koha.mysql? |
| 13:16 |
|
kados |
hdl: with the new authoritative version? |
| 13:16 |
|
kados |
hdl: also, it seems your installer only works if Koha is installed already, is that right? |
| 13:17 |
|
hdl |
1 : No good reason. |
| 13:17 |
|
hdl |
2: yes. |
| 13:17 |
|
hdl |
in some ways. |
| 13:17 |
|
hdl |
In fact, with koha30 |
| 13:18 |
|
hdl |
installation is in two steps. |
| 13:18 |
|
kados |
right |
| 13:18 |
|
kados |
system and librarian |
| 13:18 |
|
kados |
makes good sense |
| 13:18 |
|
kados |
ok, a few more questions :-=) |
| 13:18 |
|
kados |
what is 639-2norm.csv? |
| 13:19 |
|
hdl |
it is the normalized languages. |
| 13:19 |
|
hdl |
It is not used at the moment. |
| 13:19 |
|
kados |
it's official iso file? |
| 13:19 |
|
hdl |
But my point was to help the librarian build an authorised value list |
| 13:20 |
|
hdl |
yes. |
| 13:20 |
|
kados |
it seems we have two standards for describing languages: iso and MARC |
| 13:20 |
|
kados |
http://www.loc.gov/marc/languages/ |
| 13:20 |
|
kados |
I think ISO is probably better, eh? |
| 13:20 |
|
kados |
hdl: so what will become of 639-2norm.csv? |
| 13:21 |
|
kados |
hdl: because in install.pl I see 'my %language=( 'list of hardcoded values' ) |
| 13:22 |
|
kados |
instead of drawing from the iso file |
| 13:23 |
|
hdl |
%languages is based on koha different languages. |
| 13:23 |
|
hdl |
could be drawn from iso languages. |
| 13:24 |
|
kados |
so we have in fact three 'codes' for languages: |
| 13:24 |
|
kados |
1. MARC |
| 13:24 |
|
kados |
2. iso |
| 13:24 |
|
kados |
3. Koha |
| 13:24 |
|
hdl |
But would change quite a lot of things. |
| 13:24 |
|
kados |
maybe we should use iso for Koha? |
| 13:24 |
|
hdl |
Koha uses : en for english, fr for french, ge for German, zh for Chinese. |
| 13:25 |
|
kados |
in the iso file I see: |
| 13:25 |
|
kados |
"eng","anglais","anglais","English","en" |
| 13:25 |
|
hdl |
en is iso 639-1 |
| 13:25 |
|
hdl |
eng 639-2 |
| 13:26 |
|
kados |
what is anglais? french ? |
| 13:26 |
|
hdl |
anglais is french term for english. |
| 13:26 |
|
kados |
I see |
| 13:27 |
|
kados |
on translate.koha.org I tried to have: |
| 13:28 |
|
kados |
1. a code for language following MARC list of languages (maybe the same as iso 639-2) |
| 13:28 |
|
kados |
2. the language in the script of the language (e.g., ä¸æ–‡ for chinese) |
| 13:28 |
|
kados |
3. the english name of the language |
| 13:29 |
|
kados |
do you think that's a good way to represent languages for Koha in other places a list appears? |
| 13:30 |
|
kados |
for instance, in the 'language switch' and in the search language limit: http://search.athenscounty.lib[…]xpanded_options=1 |
| 13:30 |
|
kados |
also the installer |
| 13:30 |
|
kados |
hdl: ? |
| 13:30 |
|
hdl |
Could be. |
| 13:31 |
|
hdl |
But !!! |
| 13:31 |
|
hdl |
1st : the language list in installer must match koha directory names. |
| 13:32 |
|
hdl |
(I say language codes.) |
| 13:32 |
|
kados |
agreed |
| 13:32 |
|
kados |
so maybe we should switch to 639-2 for directory names? |
| 13:32 |
|
hdl |
I am quite touchy at renaming base dirs. |
| 13:33 |
|
hdl |
That could break Many things. |
| 13:33 |
|
hdl |
I think it is not time to do so. |
| 13:33 |
|
hdl |
too late or too early. |
| 13:33 |
|
paul |
i'm here... |
| 13:34 |
|
paul |
what's the question/problem ? |
| 13:34 |
|
hdl |
see before. |
| 13:34 |
|
hdl |
kados proposed changing en to eng |
| 13:34 |
|
hdl |
fr to fre |
| 13:35 |
|
kados |
I propose to simplify all lists of langauges |
| 13:35 |
|
kados |
to use 639-2 (which is also the MARC codes for langauges, so could be used by searching too) |
| 13:35 |
|
hdl |
So that we use only ISO 639-2 in or language lists. |
| 13:35 |
|
kados |
http://www.loc.gov/standards/iso639-2/ |
| 13:35 |
|
kados |
and http://www.loc.gov/marc/languages/ |
| 13:35 |
|
hdl |
But this changes directory basenames for templates. |
| 13:36 |
|
kados |
yep |
| 13:36 |
|
kados |
do we hardcode any dir names? |
| 13:36 |
|
kados |
I don't think so |
| 13:36 |
|
kados |
otherwise translations wouldn't work |
| 13:37 |
|
hdl |
SANOP is in production time. |
| 13:38 |
|
paul |
ok I understand the problem. |
| 13:38 |
|
hdl |
and then cvs updates on templates would not be updated for them. |
| 13:38 |
|
paul |
i'm ok with kados proposal as well as with hdl note. |
| 13:38 |
|
kados |
paul: fence rider :-) |
| 13:38 |
|
hdl |
:D |
| 13:38 |
|
paul |
(even if SANOP situation is not the main problem I think) |
| 13:39 |
|
hdl |
(it is only a visible part of an iceberg) |
| 13:39 |
|
paul |
kados : what would this change improve ? |
| 13:40 |
|
kados |
well, the change is not necessary I think |
| 13:40 |
|
kados |
we can use both two letter and three letter codes |
| 13:40 |
|
kados |
what I propose is to introduce a standard way to get a list of available languages |
| 13:40 |
|
kados |
so we get: |
| 13:40 |
|
kados |
1. a language code (two or three letters) |
| 13:41 |
|
kados |
2. the language name in the languages script ( like ä¸æ–‡ for chinese) |
| 13:41 |
|
kados |
3. the English name of the language |
| 13:41 |
|
kados |
and have all places in koha use the standard way to get lists |
| 13:41 |
|
kados |
so we have: |
| 13:41 |
|
kados |
1. the installer |
| 13:41 |
|
kados |
2. search interface (for searching langauges) |
| 13:42 |
|
kados |
3. language switch |
| 13:42 |
|
kados |
(for interfaces) |
| 13:42 |
|
kados |
(in the case of the search interface, MARC21 uses 639-2, so that is one advantage to switching) |
| 13:42 |
|
kados |
(stored in leader field IIRC) |
| 13:43 |
|
kados |
so a simple Languages.pm with a few new functions? |
| 13:44 |
|
hdl |
kados : thinking about it... It is more complicated. |
| 13:44 |
|
kados |
getAllLanguages (for the whole list), getTranslatedLangauges (for just existing translations, with interface passed as argument) |
| 13:45 |
|
hdl |
3. should be description of the language in the chosen language. |
| 13:45 |
|
hdl |
Say. |
| 13:45 |
|
hdl |
I am using french interface |
| 13:45 |
|
kados |
good point |
| 13:46 |
|
hdl |
I want to see Perse and not persian. |
| 13:46 |
|
kados |
yep |
| 13:46 |
|
kados |
so we introduce a new file for translation |
| 13:46 |
|
kados |
language_list.tmpl |
| 13:47 |
|
hdl |
We should. |
| 13:47 |
|
hdl |
But we can also take advantage of ISO639-2. |
| 13:47 |
|
hdl |
It is translated already. |
| 13:47 |
|
kados |
ahh, excellent |
| 13:53 |
|
hdl |
http://209.85.135.104/search?q[…]&client=firefox-a |
| 13:53 |
|
hdl |
for deutsch |
| 13:54 |
|
kados |
I'm writing a mail to koha-devel |
| 13:54 |
|
kados |
summarizing our 'findings' :-) |
| 13:54 |
|
hdl |
polski |
| 13:54 |
|
hdl |
http://pl.wiktionary.org/wiki/[…]j%C4%99zyk%C3%B3w |
| 13:55 |
|
hdl |
I am sure wiktionary could be of great help. |
| 13:55 |
|
hdl |
And there is a perl module interface to Wikipedia :D |
| 13:55 |
|
hdl |
(I never used it) |
| 13:57 |
|
rch |
hdl: can you take a look at the phpmyadmin export? |
| 13:57 |
|
hdl |
is there a problem ? |
| 13:57 |
|
rch |
in the ALTER TABLE ADD CONSTRAINT statements |
| 13:58 |
|
rch |
partial statements are repeated. |
| 13:59 |
|
hdl |
Delete the 1st ones. |
| 13:59 |
|
hdl |
I hope it will solve the problems. |
| 14:00 |
|
rch |
right, i edited so as not to give errors for mysql 4.1 |
| 14:07 |
|
kados |
hdl: mail sent to koha-devel, thanks for chatting about it |
| 14:07 |
|
kados |
hdl: final question about installer system |
| 14:08 |
|
kados |
hdl: InstallAuth.pm? Is it necessary? Can't we just use C4/Auth.pm? |
| 14:08 |
|
paul |
hehe... no, because Auth.pm relies on a mySQL table, that may not exist at this moment |
| 14:09 |
|
paul |
(I already asked the question to hdl, thus my answer ;-) ) |
| 14:09 |
|
kados |
but can we instead modify Auth.pm to accomodate the installer? |
| 14:09 |
|
kados |
I fear too many Auth modules will be hard to maintain |
| 14:10 |
|
paul |
this one is a very simple & basic one if I don't mind. and only for the installer. |
| 14:10 |
|
paul |
kados : do you have any plan(s) about a user manuel for koha 3 ? |
| 14:10 |
|
kados |
re: installer, ok |
| 14:10 |
|
kados |
re: user manual, just some ideas |
| 14:11 |
|
kados |
ideal would be like the mysql docs |
| 14:11 |
|
kados |
a version link, for each page |
| 14:11 |
|
kados |
and user contributed text as notes at bottom of each page |
| 14:11 |
|
kados |
also, ability to create a physical book |
| 14:11 |
|
kados |
and to do translations of each page |
| 14:12 |
|
kados |
I will investigate plone, to see if it's a good platform for this |
| 14:12 |
|
kados |
it can do user contribs (comments) and languages |
| 14:12 |
|
kados |
and perhaps with some modifs, versioning, and export to pdf for physical book |
| 14:12 |
|
kados |
paul: do you have any ideas? |
| 14:13 |
|
paul |
nope, but some ppl asked me if there is something to tranlaste to french... |
| 14:13 |
|
kados |
ahh |
| 14:14 |
|
kados |
so maybe another email to koha-devel asking about ideas for a platform for documentation? |
| 14:14 |
|
paul |
kados++ |
| 14:30 |
|
kados |
paul: sent |
| 14:31 |
|
kados |
paul: re: Koha 2.2.8 email to koha-Infos |
| 14:32 |
|
kados |
paul: I have some reservations about a 3.0 SQL version of Koha |
| 14:32 |
|
kados |
paul: for one, it will be very complicated to maintain |
| 14:32 |
|
kados |
paul: since we will need to have code for zebra and non-zebra |
| 14:33 |
|
kados |
paul: and like with unimarc vs usmarc, it could be challenging to make sure both are working |
| 14:35 |
|
paul |
so, how do you plan to do with small libraries ? |
| 14:36 |
|
kados |
and imporve the API, etc., over time |
| 14:36 |
|
paul |
it will be more complex imho |
| 14:38 |
|
paul_away |
bye world, see you tomorrow |
| 14:41 |
|
kados |
bye paul |
| 17:43 |
|
thd |
kados: are you there? |
| 20:04 |
|
kados |
thd_away: ping |
| 22:10 |
|
kados |
thd_away: you around? |
| 23:11 |
|
thd |
kados: I am back |
| 23:34 |
|
kados |
thd: hi |
| 23:34 |
|
dewey |
niihau, kados |
| 23:34 |
|
thd |
nihau? |
| 23:36 |
|
thd |
kados: had you spoken to stephen about the wiki/documentation recently? |
| 23:37 |
|
kados |
not recently |
| 00:32 |
|
thd |
found it |
| 00:32 |
|
thd |
kados: are you still there? |
| 07:34 |
|
Lea |
hi there! :D |
| 07:35 |
|
js |
hi Lea |
| 07:35 |
|
Lea |
how are you? |
| 07:40 |
|
js |
i m fine with the sun thx :) and you ? |
| 07:48 |
|
Lea |
yeah good thanks! Had a productive day with Koha yesterday. Think I'm pretty much on top of it now. Will be migrating 3 libraries to it and adding 2 new branches. |
| 07:48 |
|
js |
cool :)) |
