IRC log for #koha, 2005-09-08

All times shown according to UTC.

Time S Nick Message
12:00 hdl ok.
12:00 hdl So still some work.
12:19 kados [Tue Sep 06 12:41:50 2005] [error] [client] malformed header from script. Bad header=38028:, referer: http://intranet.athenscounty.l[…]rc/
12:19 kados [Tue Sep 06 12:41:50 2005] [warn] /cgi-bin/koha/circ/ did not send an HTTP header
12:20 kados hehe
12:20 kados[…]rect_headers.html
12:20 kados there's a whole book on this mod_perl problem ;-)
12:21 owen Hi meushi
12:21 meushi hi Owen
12:23 meushi I didn't get any time to work on koha today :(
15:27 russ kados : are you around?
15:27 kados russ: yep
15:27 kados russ: keep bugging me ... I'll finish soon ;-)
15:28 russ heh
15:28 russ the support section is the one i am most keen to see finished from your lot
15:28 kados cool ... I'll re-prioritize then
15:29 kados atm I'm trying to get Koha up-and-running on mod_perl2
15:29 kados got the OPAC working but the Intranet has a few bugs yet
16:40 kados [Tue Sep 06 17:38:18 2005] [error] [client] Use of uninitialized value in numeric eq (==) at /usr/local/koha/intranet/mod​ules/C4/Circulation/ line 349., referer: http://intranet.athenscounty.l[…]a/circ/
16:41 kados lots of stuff about uninitialized stuff
16:41 chris yep
16:41 chris and for the most part those are ignorable warnings
16:41 kados chris: but I think that's actually going to be a prob for mod_perl
16:41 kados I could be wrong
16:41 chris the easy fix is
16:42 chris for that line
16:42 kados we also get a fair amount of:
16:42 kados [Tue Sep 06 17:38:17 2005] [error] [client] "my" variable $loanlength masks earlier declaration in same scope at /usr/local/koha/intranet/mod​ules/C4/Circulation/ line 918., referer: http://intranet.athenscounty.l[…]a/circ/
16:42 chris yeah thats worth fixing
16:42 chris can you paste in line 349 of ?
16:43 chris sorry
16:43 kados yea
16:43 chris ($iteminformation->{'dewey'} == 0) && ($iteminformation->{'dewey'}='');  is this it?
16:43 kados yep
16:44 chris i hate those constructs .. but thats just a personal preference
16:44 kados I dont even get it
16:44 kados I though == was a comparison operator
16:44 chris it is
16:44 chris its saying this
16:44 kados but there's no control statement
16:45 chris if ($iteminformation->{'dewey'} == 0){
16:45 chris ($iteminformation->{'dewey'}='');
16:45 chris }
16:45 kados that's an implied if? bugger!
16:45 chris yeah
16:45 chris to fix that warn
16:45 kados who would code like that
16:45 chris id make it
16:45 kados it's insane ;-)
16:45 chris if ($iteminformation->{'dewey'} && $iteminformation->{'dewey'} == 0){
16:46 chris $iteminformation->{'dewey'}='';
16:46 chris }
16:47 chris that will stop it warning about us trying to compare  $iteminformation->{'dewey'} when its uninitialized
16:47 kados gotcha
16:47 chris also makes the program one tiny fraction faster
16:48 kados sweet
16:49 chris what was the other error?
16:49 kados there are a ton of those comparisons that don't check for the existance of the element
16:49 kados in and elsewhere
16:49 chris 'my $loanlength = $sth->fetchrow_hashref;
16:49 chris theres a ton of them
16:49 chris my $loanlength = $sth->fetchrow_hashref;
16:49 chris in getLoanLength
16:49 chris looks to me like a cut and paste
16:50 chris ripping all the my's out except for the for first one cant hurt
16:51 kados done ...
16:53 kados there are just so many warnings it's really overwhelming
16:54 kados [Tue Sep 06 17:52:33 2005] [error] [client] Use of uninitialized value in numeric eq (==) at /usr/local/koha/intranet/mod​ules/C4/Circulation/ line 1259., referer: http://intranet.athenscounty.l[…]a/circ/
16:54 kados I assume this is the same prob
16:54 kados if ($patroninformation->{'debarred'} == 1) {
16:54 chris yeah same thing
16:54 kados should be if ($patroninformation->{'debarred'} && $patroninformation->{'debarred'} == 1) {
16:55 kados man ... that's going to take forever ;-)
16:55 kados they are everywhere ;-)
16:55 chris yeah, but they dont hurt .. those are legit warnings
16:55 kados I bet every control statement in
16:55 kados what do you mean ... it should be changed?
16:55 kados or it doesn't matter?
16:56 chris it doenst matter, its tidying .. nicer to change them all, but it doesnt break anything to leave them
16:56 kados except my disk when it fills up with warnings in the log ;-)
16:56 chris yeah cept that
16:56 chris thats why the rule is
16:56 chris "develop with warnings, turn them off for production"
16:57 kados gotcha
16:57 chris unfortunately it looks like we are doing it the other way round :)
16:57 kados hehe
16:57 kados trouble is
16:57 kados it's really tough to spot important warnings
16:57 kados with all the junk
16:58 kados so one major way to troubleshoot mod_perl is through warnings
16:58 chris yep
16:58 chris fixing them certainly doesnt hurt
16:58 kados but it's pretty much impossible with this many warnings coming through every second
16:58 thd kados: the way to spot important warnings is to fix them all :)
16:58 kados thd: exactly
16:59 kados maybe we should have a 'fix Koha warnings' meeting on IRC
16:59 kados we can each take a module
16:59 chris we should make sure we get steven
16:59 chris stephen even
16:59 kados hedges?
16:59 chris to add "always develop/test with warnings on"
16:59 kados ahh
16:59 chris to the code document thing
16:59 kados yes
16:59 kados in fact, I like that idea so much I'm going to announce it to koha-devel ;-)
17:00 kados (the warnings meeting)
17:00 chris :)
17:00 kados chris: you're going to be away for a bit real soon right?
17:00 kados chris: when is the con ... the 9-14?
17:01 chris yeah your dates
17:01 kados ok ... I'm off to get some dinner
17:01 chris 11-15 is the conference .. we are heading down on the 10th
17:02 kados be back soon
17:02 chris k
19:37 russ wb kados
20:23 kados russ: a first go at the support index.html was just uploaded
20:24 kados russ: for the pay page ... how do we want it organized?
20:25 kados russ: I think the current pay for support site is a bit much
20:25 kados russ: as in I think there might be more companies listed than there are actual Koha installations ;-)
20:27 kados must be lunch time in NZ ;-)
20:28 thd :)
20:29 thd kados: have you seen the message on the koha-devel list forwarded from the koha list?
20:29 kados thd: yep
20:29 kados thd: haven't had a chance to reply
20:29 kados thd: but I will asap
20:31 thd kados: The Koha map certainly needs more dots in Canada even if some of the message presumptions may be a little confused.
20:34 thd kados: You might organise the pay page by the number and size of Koha installations supported within each of the regional categories.
20:34 russ hi sorry
20:34 russ was working on an important email
20:35 russ yeah i was wondering about the support companies
20:36 russ the aussie and kiwi ones are certianly all current
20:36 russ actually
20:37 russ at least i think they are
20:38 russ kados you there?
20:38 kados russ: yea
20:38 kados russ: now _I'm_ writing an email ;-)
20:39 russ :-)
20:41 kados k ... done
20:41 kados russ: what's up?
20:51 kados russ: so how shall we organize vendors?
20:51 kados russ: active vendors are:
20:52 kados Katipo, Paul, Turo, LibLime, ?Skemota?, ?INEO?
20:52 kados russ: any others?
20:53 thd does pate-lurk maintain any Koha installations?
20:53 chris roger buck is still active
20:53 kados ahh ... cool
20:53 chris so are strategic data
20:54 chris dunno about hardsoft
20:54 chris we could email and ask
20:54 kados never even heard of strategic data
20:55 kados Adam ... hmmm ... sortof sounds fammiliar
20:55 chris the adams did philanthropy australia
20:55 chris with us
20:55 kados ahh
20:56 chris well they did the install we did some customised stuff
20:56 kados gotcha
21:00 kados so any ideas on how to organize this?
21:00 kados by continent? country? alphabetical?
21:04 russ seeing as we are happy to support anyone overseas who will front up with an airfare :-)
21:04 kados hehe ... yea ... us too ;-)
21:15 kados russ: pay.html draft uploaded
21:20 russ cool
21:21 russ gee that worked out well for us :-)
21:21 kados chris: can you install CGI::IRC on the Koha site so folks don't have to download an IRC client to get real-time support?
21:21 kados russ: yea ... /me blushes guiltily ;-)
21:22 russ must find out if paul has a company that he uses
21:23 kados he doesn't
21:23 kados I checked already
21:23 kados it's a sole proprietorship
21:26 kados russ: k ... draft of free.html headed your way
21:26 kados you'll have to convince chris to take 10 minutes to install CGI::IRC ;-)
21:26 kados test it out here:
21:26 kados
21:27 kados if you're skeptical that a web-based IRC chanel is possible (as I was before I saw this client)
21:29 kados russ and chris, do you guys have a new template for your conference?
21:32 rach I think we do
21:32 rach based on the pictures I did  -[…]-4/search_ideas_1
21:33 rach but I haven't seen it yet
21:35 rach and we installed cgi::irc just last week for a client :-)
21:40 kados sweet
21:51 russ nice - Community Portal
21:51 russ heck if I know what this is
21:51 kados :)
22:51 thd Both Default and NPL templates discard invoice number in 2.2.3.  Is normal acquisitions broken in 2.2.3 with standard templates or did I miss something?
23:17 thd chris, anyone: help
23:17 thd hello russ
23:18 thd russ: are you there?
23:31 russ hi
23:31 thd hello
23:32 thd russ: Is normal acquisitions broken in 2.2.3?
23:32 russ um not sure
23:33 russ i may be
23:33 russ i know we are fixing a bunch of bugs for a couple of clients who are
23:33 russ deploying 2.2.3 and want to use normal acquisitions
23:34 thd russ: The French sites use normal acquisitions, do they not?
23:34 russ sorry i dont know
23:36 thd russ: Why does the demo have only till reports under reports?
23:37 russ Koha version:  1.9.2
23:37 russ it is quite an old version of koha
23:38 thd russ: I had remembered that it was old but are other report types in some other location for that version?
23:39 russ no i dont think they are there
23:39 russ i think alot of the reports only come with the more recent versions
23:39 rach the french sites do not use normal acquisitions as far as I'm aware, they use simple I believe
23:41 rach which will be why it doesn't work
00:17 thd hello again Katipo
00:18 thd four underscores after kados :)
00:19 thd rach: are you there?
02:34 thd good morning hdl
02:35 hdl good morning thd
02:35 thd hdl: Do your libraries take periodic inventory?
02:36 hdl Maybe.
02:36 hdl But then they are likely to use the inventory/stocktaking report page.
02:37 thd hdl: is part of the reports module.
02:37 hdl yes.
02:37 thd hdl: exactly
02:39 thd hdl: how would libraries actually use inventory/stocktaking reports to verify that the inventory actually on the shelf and on loan is the same as recorded in Koha?
02:39 hdl se
02:41 thd hdl: se?
02:41 hdl seems that when you get on the page, you can choose the itemcallnumber to watch for.
02:41 hdl and you can select the time you last saw them.
02:42 hdl see is lend or receive.
02:43 thd hdl: how would that help determine whether material is missing or misplaced from a shelf?
02:44 hdl usually, itemcallnumber are organized by shelves.
02:45 hdl Nevertheless, I agree that there is only two status seen or not and not misplaced.
02:46 hdl But if it was misplaced, then you could place it back on its shelf.
02:46 thd hdl: should I expect to see a list sorted by call number which I would take to the shelf to verify if anything was missing from its proper location?
02:46 hdl And mark it seen. if you already searched the shelf
02:48 hdl I think yes. Does that sound crazy to you ?
02:49 thd hdl: It seems reasonable for the original use of such systems, especially before computers.
02:51 thd hdl: I had expected a method for scanning books from the shelf and have the system inform if anything was missing from the range.
02:53 jean Hi / Bonjour
02:53 thd hdl: Scanning the books from a location would seem to be a much faster way to perform the mechanical process rather than checking items off of a printed list.
02:53 hdl Sure.
02:54 hdl shouldnot be a dev too important. But for now
02:54 hdl s/too important/too hard/
02:55 hdl no cliant asked for it.
02:55 thd hdl: checking against the printed cards for the shelf list is the method that was used before computers.
02:55 hdl s/cliant/client/
02:56 thd hdl: maybe your clients do not take inventory very often, or do not have very large collections to verify.
02:56 thd hello jean
02:56 hdl hi jean
02:57 hdl they donot are not urged to make inventory.
02:57 thd hdl: I know of libraries required to take inventory by government mandate.  It is a big task for them.
03:00 thd hdl: How are authority records imported into Koha?
03:01 hdl they are rebuilt from biblios
03:02 thd hdl: Is UNIMARC Koha unable to use UNIMARC authority records from BNF for example?
03:03 hdl Never tested myself but it should..
03:04 hdl There is MARC structure for authority.
03:05 thd hdl:  Do the MARC records built from biblios have the MARC authority record structure?
03:06 hdl They only have the main form on. No rejected one. But they abide by MARC Authority structure.
03:07 thd hdl: "main form on"?  "rejected one"?
03:11 hdl I don't know english terms for vedette ("star"), which usually is 2XX-fields UNIMARC and "rejetée" usually 4XX-fields
03:19 thd hdl: heading or authorised heading for 2XX.  See reference tracing for 4XX.  See also reference tracing for 5XX.
03:21 hdl thx.
03:25 thd hdl: Would Koha now identify which records are authority records from record label 000/06--09 for building the Koha authority value lists?
03:27 hdl But don't think so.
03:28 thd hdl: As record label or leader support has barely been added to Koha  imagine it would not.  At least not yet.
03:29 hdl Koha has to different tables. One for biblio, one for authorities, and bulkmarcimport doesn't do any effort in this field.
03:29 hdl Yes, not yet.
03:30 thd hdl: Therefore I would presume that Koha could not use the authority records from BNF if they were imported.  Koha would not recognise them yet.
03:31 hdl I answered beacause one could design a kind of bulkmarcimport for authorities that would do the job.
03:31 hdl Structure is there. One just need to populate.
03:32 thd hdl: Must authorities for Koha currently necessarily be built from existing bibliographic records and not existing authority records?
03:35 thd hdl: Where is the structure stored for authorities in Koha?  Is there an authority schema as there is a bibliographic schema?
03:35 hdl ATM, No automatic import is done for authorities.
03:36 hdl thd : yes; see Thesaurus Structure.
03:36 thd hdl: Oh I had forgotten about that :)
03:41 thd hdl: How can Koha generate UNIMARC 4XX and 5XX from bibliographic records?
03:42 hdl It CAN'T. I said only 2XX were generated, and event, not the complete 2XX, only $a and some other fields.
03:44 thd hdl: The logical necessity of generation form the bibliographic records :)  Sorry, I had misunderstood earlier.
03:46 thd hdl: The current design could not cope with all the authority records from BnF in any case.
03:47 hdl why ?
03:49 thd hdl: Imagine all the personal name headings for every author showing up in the pop-up authority selection window or all the RAMEAU subject headings in the selection window :)  A different design would be needed for that.
03:50 thd s/every author/every author in the BnF names authority file/
03:51 hdl Anyway hopefully, libraries only use a very small sub-set of Rameau or BNF authorities.
03:52 thd hdl: One major advantage of using authority records is to select the correct authorised form when doing original cataloguing of material where the name or subject is not already part of the collection.
03:54 thd hdl: That only works when libraries have authority records for material not already part of the collection.
03:59 thd hdl: Another advantage for authority records is for finding material catalogued under the authorised heading by searching against authority 4XX, 5XX, etc. field indexes when searching within a field corresponding to a particular type of authority record.
04:01 thd hdl: Can authority records currently be edited in the Koha record editor?
04:01 hdl Use authority.
04:02 hdl That is meant for that purpose.
04:03 thd hdl: I found that function but I have not built any authority records yet.  I am trying to complete the feature list for the new website before Katipo goes to a library conference.
04:06 hdl You can add an authority, search for authority, and build authorities, add a new category of authority, edit the authority structure.
04:06 thd hdl: That function will not allow me o build original authority records manually.  It will only allow alteration of preexisting records I presume.
04:07 hdl No, you can add an authority also, bbut you have to chose the category... In fact, it is in koha2.2.3 but menus made this feature disappear.
04:08 thd hdl: Where can I find this add an authority feature without the templates?
04:09 hdl Just take the 2.2.3 templates and not cvs version. it will work
04:17 thd hdl:  The only thing somewhat like adding an authority record is adding an authorised value list for a category.
04:18 thd hdl: /cgi-bin/koha/admin/  Is that what you had meant for adding an authority?
04:19 hdl thd: you have to go to Authorities in the latest stable version and you will see you can ADD and search authorities.
04:19 hdl thd: No. you have to look a bit closer.
04:20 osmoze hello all
04:21 hdl thd : http://localhost/cgi-bin/koha/[…]l?authtypecode=CO
04:22 hdl where authtypecode is a code you have in your base.
04:23 hdl osmoze hi.
04:25 hdl http://localhost/cgi-bin/koha/admin/ to see which authtypecodes you have in your base.
04:26 thd hdl: Sorry, I had overlooked the top of the page.  The grey had blended in the default templates I had switched on to try in vain to see normal acquisitions working.  It was right in front of me but maybe the contrast or arrangement is a little clearer in the NPL templates.
04:27 thd hello osmoze
04:28 thd hdl: Do none of your libraries use normal acquisitions?
04:28 hdl they scarcely do.
04:29 hdl They useually do it only to create providers.
04:29 thd hdl: I have found normal acquisitions to be broken in 2.2.3.  Katipo is supposed to be committing a number of bug fixes.
04:29 hdl in order to use serials
04:30 hdl Maybe, but they sent their acquisition page to me.
04:32 thd hdl: I did not experiment with serials acquisitions specifically other than to look at the order template.  I know kados was having some difficulty with partially filled serials tables in a migration experiment.
04:33 thd hdl: I found that 2.2.3 would not save the invoice number for monograph orders.
04:35 hdl Yes... And many other bugs that I encountered but couldn't find out how to fix... Since few persons really masters acquisition.
04:35 thd hdl: Nothing more can be done with a monograph order to alter or receive the order without an invoice number being stored.
04:36 thd hdl: Katipo have been fixing them because they have a couple of customers who want to use 2.2.3 :)
04:39 thd hdl: If I initiate a new serial order, is the supplier automatically notified by email upon my confirming the order in Koha?
04:40 hdl no.
04:43 thd hdl: Is there anything other than overdue item patron notices, library patron fines, and administrator messages that have automatic notification triggered by Koha?
04:45 thd hdl: how do I assign a manually added authority record to a category?
04:46 thd hdl: maybe I will be prompted for a category if I save a record.
04:46 hdl You First Choose a category, Then you create an authority record. That's the way it is.
04:47 hdl And to use them, you have to link MARC field with authority.
04:48 hdl then you have ... to click on and search for the authority you need.
04:49 thd hdl: My choices are blank since I have not linked a field with an authority yet :)
04:50 hdl thd : try to look carefully at authorities, then link a biblio diels with an authority, and make a true test.
04:53 thd hdl: I would have proceeded more carefully with more advance experimentation, but I am running out of time to at least have a good start for the feature list ready.
04:55 hdl But it is not with asking frantically questions that you can really have a good feature list.
04:55 thd hdl: My detailed aggregate features list is heading towards twenty pages and needs subdivision into readable lengths.
04:57 hdl So to crate. First select the authority type you want and click on create. Fill in the form.
04:58 hdl To search and edit, select the authority type then type in the keywords, either only in heading or everywhere.
04:58 hdl and click on search... You weil be able to edit.
05:01 hdl Then, to use an authority, you first must link a field to a category of authority (usually 7XX UNIMARC-field).
05:01 hdl Then, when editing a biblio, when clicking on ... you open a window where you can search for an authority.
05:01 hdl And authority values are reported into the record.
05:07 hdl Is that clear enough ?
05:18 thd hdl: I have created a category unititle.  I have linked it to uniform title in the bibliographic record structure.  Yet it does not appear in the drop down list for adding an authority record of a particular type.
05:20 thd hdl: Would this be related to a similar problem in Koha such that when the value list is null then even the category will not appear?
05:21 hdl thd : wher ave you created the category.
05:23 hdl Where have you searched for to link it ? should be in Auth : dropdown box.
05:25 hdl thd : where have you created the category ? should be in Tresaurus Structure. Add Auhtority type.
05:26 hdl Then you have to edit the authority  structure.
05:26 hdl You also have to choose which tag to report.
05:28 thd hdl: Sorry, I had added a value list category, not an authority type.
05:44 thd hdl: I created a new authority structure and defined the tag reported but the new authority structure does not seem to be available for assigning to a bibliographic record field in the bibliographic structure.
05:44 hdl what do you mean ?
05:45 hdl Then, to use an authority, you first must link a field to a category of authority (usually 7XX UNIMARC-field).
05:45 hdl [12:03:37] <hdl> Then, when editing a biblio, when clicking on ... you open a window where you can search for an authority.
05:45 hdl [12:04:09] <hdl> And authority values are reported into the record.
05:45 hdl [12:09:33] <hdl> Is that clear enough ?
05:45 hdl Have you done that ?
05:46 hdl No use making it in 2XX since it is not the right place.
05:48 thd hdl: Attempting to link a field to the authority structure that I have created has no authority structure name appearing in the bibliographic structure editor for a field.
05:49 hdl Can you make it available for me ?
05:50 hdl http://localhost/cgi-bin/koha/[…]frameworkcode=PER
05:50 hdl should be there
05:50 hdl with frameworkcode=what you have.
05:51 thd hdl: Not on the system that I have been using but I will recreate it on another system if your suggestion still has me lost.
05:51 hdl look at theusarus and not auth value.
05:51 hdl thesaurus!
05:53 hdl Auth value is for authorised values lists. I realize why you mixed up.
05:53 hdl :/
05:54 thd hdl: Yes, that had been my original mistake.  I have not found the path to your link yet.  I certainly had not found that form.
05:55 thd hdl: I was well past my original mistake and onto new ones :)
05:55 hdl It is in parameters/biblioframework
05:55 hdl choose a framework
05:55 hdl choose a tag, then edit subfields.
05:56 hdl and you have thesaurus.
05:56 hdl Then, you can add a new biblio.
05:56 hdl And change the field you need with your authorities.
06:39 thd hdl: I have authorities working :-)
06:42 kados____ hi all
06:42 kados____ thd: /nick kados
06:43 thd hdl: What is meant to appear in the summary column of the heading table for the authority search results table in use for editing a bibliographic record?
06:43 kados____ thd: one problem with storing the statuses in MARC is that it alienates the non-marc libraries
06:44 thd kados: you are still kados____
06:44 kados____ thd: also, does MARC even contain enough complexity to deal with status?
06:44 kados____ thd: I know, it won't let me change ;-)
06:44 kados____ thd: it says that kados is already in use
06:45 thd kados____: well there is an IRC command for that which I have never had to use.
06:45 thd kados____: something about killing a ghost user.
06:46 kados____ I think I'd have to be an oper
06:46 kados____ anyway it's not a big deal ;-)
06:46 kados____ hdl: you around? I've got one quick question/request
06:46 thd kados____: I think you can kill your own ghosts.
06:48 thd kados____: I had meant that statuses should be in MARC in addition to items.status
06:48 kados____ right ... but where?
06:49 kados____ not, I assume in 942 $k
06:51 thd kados____: There may be no place for temporary status.  942 $k will do :)  Most systems do something similar with a local use field.
06:52 thd s/no/no official/
06:53 kados____ thd: if MARC doesn't contain a place for temporary status why are we trying to put it in?
06:54 kados____ thd: it would certainly not be 'to standard' to do so
06:54 kados____ thd: in your email you mention 'standards compliant holdings' .... what are the standards for holdings?
06:58 thd kados____: Well there is 876-878 $l but I do not think that is the right place.
06:59 thd kados____: Concise MARC 21 holdings standards
07:00 kados____ that's more for a temporary location
07:00 kados____ I think
07:01 kados____ like if I had to move books from the stacks to overflow stacks or if I had a 'new books' section that I kept new items at temporarliy right?
07:02 thd kados____: I wrote that Koha was not ready to use the standard yet.  Yes my 876-878 $l suggestion is trying to stretch something for an unintended purpose, naughty of me.
07:03 kados____ so in fact, status should _not_ be in MARC ;-)
07:03 kados____ as it's not part of the standard ;-)
07:05 thd kados____: Temporary status as opposed to permanent status seems like something not defined for MARC 21.  However, most systems do use MARC to store non-MARC information as far as I know.
07:06 kados____ hehe
07:06 kados____ so we've moved from arguing that Koha isn't ready to use the standard to saying 'everybody else is doing it' ;-)
07:06 kados____ my vote is that we keep it out the MARC record
07:07 thd kados____: I had imagined that the same local use field that was used to store other information from the items table in Koha would be used for items.status .
07:07 kados____ unless there is some Z39.50 extended service that accounts for having it in the MARC record
07:07 kados____ in which case it might be useful for inter-library loan etc.
07:07 kados____ though that will certainly be covered by OpenNCIP
07:08 kados____ thd: btw: you have seen right?
07:08 kados____ thd: a LibLime-sponsored NCIP toolkit
07:08 thd kados____: I have seen the standards agency pages.
07:11 thd kados____: I had not seen before.
07:13 thd kados____: No news yet :)
07:13 kados____ thd: it's a brand new project ;-)
07:13 kados____ thd: join the list if you're interested
07:13 thd kados____: I see that news :)
07:14 kados____ thd: we don't even have any code yet ... just been throwing some ideas around
07:14 thd kados____: On which NCIP list is this being discussed?
07:15 kados____ um ... the LibLime OpenNCIP list ;-)
07:15 thd kados____: Just noticed the link now :)
07:19 thd kados: NCIP will not give an instant answer about status within Z39.50.
07:24 thd kados____: I may not want to initiate a loan.  I may merely want to consult the shelves at another local library, outside my own library system but in the same area.  Loans take longer than travelling, if one has instant access to the status to judge whether the trip may be worthwhile.  I may also not have reserve privileges on the neighbouring system.
07:26 thd kados____:  I have been waiting over a month now to have an answer about the interlibrary loan requests that I have placed.
07:31 thd kados____:  At least a month is a typical wait time in my experience with ILL requests originating from the NYPL research collections.  Travelling in real time to consult the material is much better if a near enough library can be found.
07:33 thd kados____: NCIP only works if both systems support it.  There will be a large lag between an OpenNCIP download and enough implementations in the world to make a significant difference.
07:35 thd kados: are you still there?
07:36 thd kados____: ?
07:36 kados____ thd: yes ...
07:36 kados____ thd: pretty busy at the moment :-)
07:38 thd kados____: Above: why NCIP cannot replace the advantages of status in Z39.50.
07:38 kados____ thd: ok ... but I have yet to see an example of a standards-based status display n Z39.50 ;-)
07:51 thd kados____: Do you not usually find status information stored in a local use field when you migrate a collection to Koha?
08:40 hdl thd around.
08:59 kados____ thd: are you around?
08:59 kados____ thd: I've got a question about your work on the Z3950 client for Koha
09:16 kados____ hdl: I'm not sure if this is helpful ... I'm trying to troubleshoot the z3950 client probs
09:17 kados____ hdl: I deleted all entries in z3950queue and z3950results
09:17 kados____ hdl: then I ran processesqueue from console
09:17 kados____ thd: I do a query
09:17 kados____ hdl: then I get:
09:17 kados____ 1. user sees 'Nothing found'
09:18 kados____ 2. in z3950queue: | 39 | cryptonomicon | title | 1126102762 | 1126102762 |    1 | NULL    |       NULL | NELSONVILLE PUBLIC LIBRARY/|​MELVYL/ | 272919054.915295 |
09:18 kados____ 3. in z3950results: two entries
09:18 kados____ 3. a. 62 |      39 | MELVYL/                    | 1126102762 | 1126102763 | 'Net::Z3950::Record::GRS1=ARRAY(0x86fe228)​Net::Z3950::Record::GRS1=ARRAY(0x87020fc)' |          2 |             2 |           0 |     -1 |
09:18 kados____ 3. b. 63 |      39 | NELSONVILLE PUBLIC LIBRARY/ | 1126102762 | 1126102762 | 'Net::Z3950::Record::GRS1=ARRAY(0x86fd7f4)'                                          |          1 |             1 |           0 |     -1
09:20 hdl seems results are there but not used.
09:20 hdl or not seen by breeding script.
09:21 kados____ is it breeding script or ?
09:25 hdl It is in processz3950queue and it calls for ImportBreeding in line 288
09:27 hdl Maybe you could make it more verbose and get it say whether it is notmarc, alreadyindb, infarm or imported.
09:27 hdl my ($notmarcrecord,$alreadyind​b,$alreadyinfarm,$imported) = ImportBreeding($result,-1,"Z395​0-$globalname",$x[3],$random);
09:27 hdl I bet there is an error with marcrecord... But Why ???
09:29 hdl try tracing marcarray in ImportBreeding.
09:30 kados____ ok ...
09:30 hdl or print warnings.
09:32 hdl Maybe \x1D is not the right character too look for.
09:34 kados____ hdl: print warnings in processz3950queue ?
09:36 kados____ Use of uninitialized value in numeric eq (==) at processz3950queue line 175.
09:36 kados____ Use of uninitialized value in numeric eq (==) at processz3950queue line 233.
09:36 kados____ Use of uninitialized value in concatenation (.) or string at processz3950queue line 244.
09:37 kados____ I don't think those are the problem
09:39 hdl No but @warnings in ImportBreeding...
09:40 kados____ I see on line 285 of processz...
09:40 kados____ $result.=$marcdata;
09:41 kados____ there is no \x1D char to split the MARC records up
09:41 kados____ unless I'm missreading it
09:41 kados____ how do I put warnings in ImportBreeding?
09:41 hdl IN
09:41 hdl you have
09:41 hdl my @marcarray = split /\x1D/, $marcrecords;
09:42 kados____ ahh
09:42 hdl lin 59
09:42 hdl and then
09:42 hdl my @warnings = $marcrecord->warnings();
09:42 hdl if (scalar($marcrecord->fields()) == 0) {
09:42 hdl $notmarcrecord++;
09:42 hdl line 78
09:43 hdl these are the information taht may account for the problem.
09:43 hdl And one day, I will write a line without mistakes...
09:45 kados____ you could be right
09:46 kados____ I changed the '0' to '5'
09:46 kados____ just to test
09:46 kados____ and now in the log I get:
09:46 kados____ 15290/42 : MELVYL : 2 records found, retrieving them (max 80)
09:46 kados____ Use of uninitialized value in hash element at /usr/local/share/perl/5.8.4/MARC/ line 205.
09:47 kados____ Use of uninitialized value in concatenation (.) or string at /usr/local/share/perl/5.8.4/MARC/ line 209.
09:47 kados____ Use of uninitialized value in hash element at /usr/local/share/perl/5.8.4/MARC/ line 210.
09:47 kados____ Use of uninitialized value in pattern match (m//) at /home/nbbc/cvsrepos/2.2.x/koha/C4/ line 1100.
09:47 kados____ Argument "" isn't numeric in numeric gt (>) at /home/nbbc/cvsrepos/2.2.x/koha/C4/ line 1101.
09:53 kados____ hdl: I tried:
09:53 kados____ if (!$marcrecord->fields()) {
09:53 kados____ but I get same result as with if (scalar($marcrecord->fields()) == 0) {
09:55 kados____ hdl: ahh ... I put a warn in
09:56 kados____ hdl: in the if control statement
09:56 kados____ hdl: now it warns:
09:56 kados____ hdl: not a marc record at /home/nbbc/cvsrepos/2.2.x/koha/C4/ line 78.
09:56 kados____ hdl: so you must be right ... it must be a problem with that section
09:58 hdl kados try and get the values of @marcarray, $i,
09:58 hdl kados____ try and get the values of @marcarray, $i,
09:58 kados____ ok
10:00 hdl and warn line 115 $marcrecord->as_formatted.
10:02 hdl It seems that there is one value that makes things go wrong with MARC::Record.
10:02 kados____ bbiab ... I have a meeting with client now
10:39 kados____ hdl: ok ... I"m back

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