IRC log for #koha, 2012-05-01

All times shown according to UTC.

Time S Nick Message
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03:45 Amit_Gupta heya bag
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05:10 Amit_Gupta heya federicd around?
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06:13 Amit_Gupta chris   around?
06:30 Irma joined #koha
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07:59 francharb hello #koha
07:59 rangi hi francharb
08:11 cait joined #koha
08:11 francharb 0/ rangi cait
08:11 cait hi francharb
08:11 cait hi rangi
08:15 rangi hi cait
10:29 Oak joined #koha
10:30 Oak kia ora #koha
10:30 Oak hello cait :)
10:32 cait hi Oak
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12:12 * oleonard suppresses a yawn
12:14 * cait waves at oleonard
12:17 NateC joined #koha
12:19 * oleonard tries to remember what he was doing yesterday
12:19 cait hm
12:20 cait replacing sth with jquery?
12:21 oleonard That's a safe bet :)
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13:06 * chris_n rubs his eyes and blinks
13:07 chris_n g'morning cait, oleonard
13:07 cait good morning
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13:53 wizzyrea wow, really quiet night
13:53 wizzyrea lots of "hi"
13:55 cait hi wizzyrea
14:02 nengard joined #koha
14:08 magnuse hi wizzyrea
14:31 slef hi wizzyrea
14:31 wizzyrea hey slef :)
14:31 wizzyrea and magnuse :)
14:34 sekjal joined #koha
14:39 Oak joined #koha
14:39 Oak hello my hearties
14:41 oleonard I think you mean "Ahoy me hearties" Oak
14:41 Oak :) ah yes
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14:43 wizzyrea hehe, ahoy.
14:49 * sekjal has this sudden urge to break into song... but resists
14:50 wizzyrea !
14:50 wizzyrea what song?
14:50 wahanui song is somewhat infectious.  The video is a lot of vintage baseball footage, a baseball trivia geek's dream come true.
14:50 sekjal wizzyrea:  Reise, Reise by Rammstein :/
14:50 wizzyrea hmm.
14:50 * wizzyrea suspects that is not happy singing.
14:51 sekjal for variable definitions of "happy", sure
14:54 francharb sekjal, check out this :[…]Rw&feature=relmfu
14:55 francharb i love kids playing with their siblings at home and covering songs on youtube video!
14:55 sekjal lulz
14:56 francharb they play a yardbirds song which is good actually ...[…]&
14:58 francharb i should dedicate a blog for all those videos i found on youtube...
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15:22 slef @query bulk modification SQL
15:23 huginn slef: No results for "bulk modification SQL."
15:23 slef @query bulk SQL
15:23 huginn slef: No results for "bulk SQL."
15:23 slef @query batch SQL
15:23 huginn slef: Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=6946 minor, P5 - low, ---, koha.sekjal, NEW , Import Batches _update_batch_record_counts has inefficient SQL
15:23 slef huginn: is that all?
15:23 huginn slef: I'll give you the answer as soon as RDA is ready
15:23 jcamins_away slef: what are you looking for?
15:24 slef jcamins: I thought I remembered a batch item or bibilo editor enh that allowed SQL
15:25 jcamins slef: I don't recall that.
15:26 slef Of course, I was looking for it for Subject: Re: [Koha-devel] SQL reports [error]
15:45 wizzyrea I think the guy should go ahead and do whetever he wants to to his local code.
15:46 wizzyrea nmp if he allows his catalogers to drop table biblio;
15:46 * wizzyrea goes all tough love on his tooshie.
15:48 oleonard I think that's the consensus isn't it?
15:48 jcamins Yup.
15:49 * oleonard does think it would be nice to be able to pipe results of reports to batch modifications (i.e. pass a set of barcodes)
15:51 wizzyrea yes, that would be cool.
15:51 sekjal oooh, that'd be interesting to hack on...
15:52 sekjal make it flexible enough to handle various keys (itemnumber, barcode, biblionumber, borrowernumber, patron barcode, etc)
15:53 JesseM joined #koha
15:53 wizzyrea maybe just start with barcode/itemnumber?
15:53 wizzyrea :)
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16:03 jcamins fredericd: there's a UNIMARC patch on bug 7818 with your name on it. :)
16:03 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=7818 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, gmcharlt, Signed Off , support DOM mode for Zebra indexing of bibliographic records
16:03 jcamins (for sign-off)
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16:42 oleonard chris_n around?
16:42 chris_n full of lunch, but still slightly coherent
16:42 chris_n did you see the datatables editor plugin?
16:43 oleonard I'm testing Bug 7977 and wondering about the "last displayed" column
16:43 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=7977 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, cnighswonger, Needs Signoff , Add a "Quote-of-the-day" feature to the OPAC homepage
16:43 oleonard ..which I thought wasn't working but now I see it is. Never mind :)
16:44 chris_n the timestamps will all be zero until they are selected for display
16:44 chris_n too bad allan decided to charge licensing fees for the use of the editor plugin
16:45 oleonard chris_n: ?
16:45 chris_n
16:45 chris_n it super-slick
16:45 chris_n but is only oss license for total non-profit use
16:46 * chris_n had very similar things in mind for table based editing in koha
16:47 jcamins chris_n: oh no! After all that work we can't use the editor you did?
16:48 chris_n jcamins: not so... this is a plugin for datatables
16:48 chris_n datatables core uses a compatible license
16:49 chris_n but the editor plugin referenced above would not be compatible (in my reading)
16:49 chris_n so in the long run, we roll our own
16:49 jcamins I see.
16:50 chris_n oleonard: be aware that I'm working on a bug in the QOTD editor which causes single added quotes not to immediately display
16:54 oleonard chris_n My primary complaint is you left out all of George W. Bush's best quotes :P
16:57 * chris_n seems to recall some questions regarding the authenticity of the cherry tree incident ;-)
16:57 chris_n but file a bug for it... who knows? maybe we can add it in :)
16:57 chris_n opps
16:58 chris_n way too much lunch
16:58 chris_n "George W. Bush"
16:58 chris_n oleonard: well, just hit the add-a-quote button and have at it
17:35 nengard joined #koha
17:37 nengard good morning all - i'm in a training in OR - say hi to the new Koha community members
17:39 oleonard Hi OR!
17:39 cait hi :)
17:41 francharb 0/ all ;)
17:42 nengard okay back to work :)
18:05 * chris_n goes for the smoker
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18:17 oleonard Another spontaneous Firefox crash. Yay version 12.
18:18 cait :(
18:25 chris_n FF--
18:31 datadoctor joined #koha
18:45 oleonard FF, the worst browser in the world except for all the others.
18:48 cait oleonard: we should write our own :)
18:48 oleonard Oh yeah, just a little side project to working on Koha? :P
18:49 cait hm
18:49 cait we could make koha a browser
18:49 cait it woul be absolutely standard compliant of course
18:49 cait ? :)
18:50 datadoctor Love how FF is positioning itself as the anti-browser by promoting the Collusion plugin
18:50 datadoctor Collusion displays the sources of your cookies.
18:51 oleonard If they want to be serious about it they'd give us tabs which could be sandboxed from each other
18:51 datadoctor I love Chrome too, but Firefox has the community and the cool plug-ins.
18:52 datadoctor There's always Midori, if you like the real open source...
18:53 datadoctor I like the sandbox idea - hmm, hope to see that soon.
18:53 oleonard I think they might be working on it.
18:55 chris_n chrome is better than FF imho
18:55 chris_n why can't code just work as soon as I finish typing it?
18:56 rangi only if you don't care about privacy (chrome being better)
18:56 oleonard Better performance maybe chris_n. Not better tools or better for my paranoia.
18:56 rangi exactly
18:56 chris_n TOR is the answer to all privacy concerns :-)
18:56 rangi not with chrome
18:56 rangi it still leaks data to google
18:57 chris_n well, for that matter we'd better stop using unencrypted email
18:57 * oleonard feels he should if he wants to use GMail
18:57 chris_n and credit cards
18:57 rangi i have a soft spot for mozilla, because they seem to be the only ones working on things like browserid, and they essentially freed the web
18:58 rangi chris_n: those are active choices, i can choose to encrypt my mail or not, with chrome i cant choose not to tell google what sites im visiting
18:58 chris_n I like mozilla as well, just not the fact that their browser crashes regularly
18:58 rangi i find 10 rock solid on linux, i havent had a crash yet
18:59 rangi cant speak for windows or anything of course
18:59 chris_n the thing crashes regularly on Ubuntu.. at least the last few versions
18:59 rangi weird, not on mine
19:00 rangi i dont run gnome tho, so that could be why
19:00 chris_n kde?
19:00 rangi lxde and xmonad
19:01 rangi tiling window managers ftw :)
19:01 rangi @wunder christchurch nz
19:01 huginn rangi: The current temperature in Christchurch, New Zealand is 7.0°C (6:00 AM NZST on May 02, 2012). Conditions: Rain Showers. Humidity: 81%. Dew Point: 4.0°C. Windchill: 4.0°C. Pressure: 30.42 in 1030 hPa (Steady).
19:01 rangi @wunder nzwn
19:01 huginn rangi: The current temperature in Wellington, New Zealand is 8.0°C (6:00 AM NZST on May 02, 2012). Conditions: Heavy Rain Showers. Humidity: 93%. Dew Point: 7.0°C. Windchill: 2.0°C. Pressure: 30.33 in 1027 hPa (Rising).
19:02 rangi doesnt look like i can escape the rain today
19:02 rangi ok, now ive ranted about freedom as is my weekly want
19:02 rangi ill go finish packing and go to the airport :)
19:02 rangi cyas later
19:02 * oleonard wonders where rangi is going
19:03 rangi christchurch today, bucklame tomorrow
19:03 * rangi wanders off
19:04 chris_n lxde sounds cool
19:04 oleonard safe travels rangi
19:05 * oleonard thinks he tried lxde once but can't remember what he didn't like about it
19:05 oleonard Some interface thing I'm sure.
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19:23 * jcamins_away wanders back
19:25 oleonard You missed the browser wars jcamins. The outcome was inconclusive.
19:27 jcamins oleonard: excellent, we can have a sequel once Luke Skywalker grows up!
19:27 chris_n oleonard: I'll fix the points you mention tomorrow :-)
19:27 oleonard Thanks chris_n. I hope all that was clear and didn't sound petty
19:28 chris_n no, I was hoping you would point up things of that nature
19:29 * chris_n is becoming a UI designer only with great reluctance :)
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19:42 * jcamins decides to poke at 3.6.x.
19:42 cait jcamins++
19:42 cait :)
19:44 jcamins Okay, I guess step 1 is to create a 3.6-testing branch.
19:46 jcamins Done.
19:46 jcamins Step 2: find the instructions I wrote down for using chris_n's scripts.
19:47 jcamins chris_n: so it's better to use get_commits?
19:47 jcamins Or get_bugs?
19:48 * cait cheers jcamins on
19:48 cait but don't knw about the scripts
19:48 jcamins Or do I use both?
19:49 chris_n jcamins: one is for auto-cherry-picking, the other is for release notes
19:49 jcamins Ohhh.
19:49 jcamins Right.
19:49 jcamins Thanks.
19:49 chris_n ymmv
19:49 chris_n by a wide margin :-)
19:50 jcamins Do you use libgit-pure-perl or libgit-wrapper-perl?
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19:51 jcamins Wait, I misread the error.
19:52 * jcamins returns to step 0.
19:53 jcamins (check out new repository directly from
19:59 jcamins 65%
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20:09 jcamins Well, get_commits is doing something.
20:10 jcamins Very busily.
20:12 pastebot "jcamins" at pasted "chris_n: is this what the output should look like?" (11 lines) at
20:13 gbengaadara joined #koha
20:15 mtj very interesting... ->[…]ing-as-we-know-it
20:15 mtj FOSS vs. lawyers ? :(
20:17 oleonard Intellectual property law is a hot mess, there's not doubt about it.
20:18 datadoctor patent wars - the end of civility in internet business - wall up with patents you buy from trolls
20:18 * liw will start using AGPL 3+ for any APIs he ever makes in the future, if APIs become copyrightable (but they won't be)
20:18 datadoctor Yes, that's a great public license.
20:19 jwagner joined #koha
20:19 jcamins I think I'm doing this wrong.
20:20 datadoctor Against intellectual monopoly:[…]ctual/against.htm
20:20 datadoctor It's a fun read.
20:22 oleonard I could have sworn the Acquisitions home page showed a warning if you had no budgets defined, but git says that was removed three years ago?
20:22 oleonard cait do you remember that?
20:22 oleonard Or am I remembering it in some other place more recently?
20:23 cait not the home page
20:23 cait but when you want to order something
20:23 cait after creating or before creating a basket
20:23 cait I think the home page perhaps had one with old acquisitions?
20:23 cait the new warning was done by robin
20:24 cait does that make sense?
20:25 oleonard Yes
20:26 jcamins Okay, I'll work on this sometime when rangi is around.
20:30 oleonard See ya later everybuddy
20:32 francharb i'm going too
20:32 francharb see ya
20:33 datadoctor have a great evening / morning!
20:33 jcamins chris_n: do you have the various txt files for 3.6.x?
20:33 datadoctor :)
20:34 jcamins It looks like without them I have to revisit all the decisions you made for 3.6.1-3.6.4.
20:34 kathryn joined #koha
20:34 chris_n jcamins: I'll send them along in a bit
20:34 jcamins chris_n: thanks!
20:35 chris_n that paste is generally correct
20:35 chris_n bbl
20:35 jcamins chris_n: yeah, I didn't understand what the message was about. It's referring to the txt files I don't have. :)
20:50 chris_n jcamins: check your inbox
20:50 chris_n place them in the same directory as the script
20:51 chris_n rerun the script
20:51 chris_n and try to maintain your sanity ;-)
20:53 jcamins huginn: thanks!
20:53 huginn jcamins: I suck
20:53 jcamins huginn?
20:53 wahanui i think huginn is a bot too veera, not a person
20:53 jcamins chris_n: I meant to thank you.
20:53 chris_n meeting in ~5 hours?
20:54 jcamins chris_n: wait, really?
20:54 jcamins Oh. Yes.
20:55 jcamins I guess I might be there after all.
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20:56 * jcamins read "20:00 UTC+0" before
20:57 chris_n jcamins: release notes templates for 3.6.x are in the repo @[…]efs/tags/v3.06.04
20:58 * chris_n heads off to trim hooves
20:58 jcamins Thanks.
20:58 chris_n maybe the goats will behave better than the jquery did :-P
20:59 gbengaadara Hello all
21:05 kathryn hello all from me too
21:05 jcamins Hello!
21:06 cait hi kathryn :)
21:07 kathryn heya jcamins and cait :)
21:07 cait @wunder Konstanz
21:07 huginn cait: The current temperature in Konstanz, Germany is 17.0°C (11:00 PM CEST on May 01, 2012). Conditions: Overcast. Humidity: 47%. Dew Point: 9.0°C. Pressure: 29.94 in 1014 hPa (Falling).
21:07 jcamins Bug 5339
21:07 huginn Bug[…]w_bug.cgi?id=5339 enhancement, P3, ---, julian.maurice, Needs Signoff , Parcel closing in acq
21:07 kathryn @wunder wellington nz
21:07 huginn kathryn: The current temperature in Wellington, New Zealand is 9.0°C (9:00 AM NZST on May 02, 2012). Conditions: Rain Showers. Humidity: 87%. Dew Point: 7.0°C. Pressure: 30.36 in 1028 hPa (Steady).
21:07 kathryn doh!
21:07 cait guess I win :)
21:08 kathryn oh no there it is  - it's coooold!
21:08 kathryn yep you win cait
21:08 cait give it half a year... and it changes again :)
21:09 kathryn cait, although I travel to work on this ferry and there was a rainbow over it this morn
21:09 cait ok, travelling to work on a ferry with a rainbow... that means you win
21:10 mtj kathryn:  wow - impressive! :)
21:10 kathryn yuss!
21:10 kathryn didn't have my camera sadly
21:12 mtj y'know what... i reckon we need a 'waiting for qa' status in koha's bugzilla
21:12 cait mtj: we have
21:12 cait signed off
21:12 cait :)
21:13 cait all that is signed off is waiting for qa :)
21:13 mtj cait:  not quite...
21:13 cait persuade me :)
21:13 jcamins mtj: do you have a counter-example where the problem isn't that the QA-er didn't set the status back to Needs signoff?
21:14 mtj some 'signed-off' bugs are waiting for qa
21:14 mtj some 'signed-off' bugs are waiting for a 2nd sign-off
21:14 cait I think those are very few
21:14 cait and perhaps they should not be set to signed off then
21:14 jcamins mtj: anything that's waiting for a second sign-off should be set to "needs signoff."
21:14 cait yep
21:14 cait I agree
21:15 mtj currently, there is no way to distinguish between those 2 types of bugs
21:15 cait I think they are not 2 type
21:15 cait s
21:15 cait I think either it's ready for qa = signed off, or it's waiting for a sign-off
21:15 jcamins Yes.
21:15 mtj hmm, well - that would work
21:15 jcamins If something is waiting for a second signoff, it should still be "needs signoff."
21:16 mtj yes, ok - that will work  :)
21:16 jcamins Bah.
21:16 jcamins *Nothing* will apply.
21:17 cait :(
21:18 mtj ok, perhaps i write this discussion as an email to koha-dev mailing-list
21:18 mtj ... so everyone can discuss and hopefully agree to this :)
21:19 jcamins mtj: I don't think that's the way to do it.
21:19 jcamins I think the thing to do is send an e-mail to the devel list reminding everyone that if something requires an additional sign off, it should remain at "needs signoff" so that people will be more likely to actually do it.
21:22 mtj jcamins:  this topic has already been discussed and agreed?
21:23 jcamins mtj: I don't see any need for discussion.
21:23 jcamins mtj: if it's not on needs signoff, those of us who sign off on things won't.
21:23 cait I think the status is clear
21:23 cait it's only not clear when something does need another sign off
21:23 cait someotimes we add follow ups
21:23 jcamins If you're not going to QA it because it *needs signoff* it should be marked as such.
21:24 cait so- do we want the first part to be pushed, while the second needs a signoff?
21:24 libsysguy left #koha
21:24 cait should go on a separate bug then... but we don't always do
21:24 * cait feels like she is not making much sense
21:25 mtj makes sense to me
21:25 mtj i now understand the process, so i am happy... :)
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21:43 * chris_n thinks a separate "QA status" might be useful
21:43 jcamins chris_n: but then we need someone to go through and mark every signed off bug as being ready for QA.
21:44 cait I think perhaps more useful
21:44 chris_n signed-off could fire a db trigger marking it read for QA
21:44 chris_n ready, even
21:44 cait would be to separate the pushed from the resolved status
21:45 cait chris_n: but what would be the gain then?
21:45 cait we can't see easily what's been pushed to which version
21:45 chris_n setting the QA field to "failed" would trigger the status back to "needs sign-off"
21:46 chris_n the RM is supposed to set the version field accordingly when the patch is pushed
21:46 cait so you want a separate qa field?
21:46 chris_n allowing for "accurate" version tracking... in theory
21:46 jcamins chris_n: oh, you meant a "QA status" not "Needs QA" status.
21:46 jcamins That makes sense.
21:46 chris_n what he said ^^
21:46 cait chris_n: I know, but once it's 3.6 but not pushed to 3.6 yet- can I mark resolved?
21:46 chris_n no
21:47 cait so we probably never mark them resolved
21:47 chris_n not according to the currently accepted workflow
21:47 cait yeah and that is a problem I think
21:47 cait and I did it wrong then
21:47 cait becuse i don't think anyone is testing on 3.6
21:47 cait or soon 3.8
21:47 * chris_n agrees with you
21:47 cait so we will only have a gazillion unresolved bugs in the system :(
21:48 chris_n on the "no one is testing" part at least
21:48 cait we don't have enough peopl etesting master
21:48 cait it's like that
21:48 chris_n but in reality, if it has passed QA and been pushed and marked for backporting, it should only need minimal testing
21:48 cait hm
21:48 cait some things are difficult to test
21:49 chris_n but jcamins idea of having a "beta" stable branch could help with that
21:49 aogle joined #koha
21:49 chris_n if he is able to push 30 days ahead
21:49 * chris_n thinks cait did some very good pre-maintenance release testing :-)
21:50 cait hm?
21:50 jcamins chris_n: well, yeah, 3.6.5 won't quite live up to my ideal.
21:51 jcamins But I hope by 3.6.7 to RMaint'ing more or less figured out.
21:51 cait you will :)
21:51 cait figure it out I mean
21:57 mtj so it looks like we need to improve the bug workflow, to handle backporting 'pushed-to-master' bugs to stable and old-stable branches
21:58 jcamins mtj: yeah. My long-term plan involves a cron job that cherry picks bugfixes to 3.6-testing.
21:58 cait I am not sure it will work without some manual work
21:59 jcamins cait: oh, it will certainly require manual work.
21:59 jcamins But if I have a list of commits that require manual intervention every morning, it'll be a lot easier.
21:59 cait I am still pondering the resolved problem
21:59 cait because I really want to get our bug numbers down... not sure how to achieve that
21:59 cait I can't test on 3 versions!
22:00 cait perhaps... works in master... pushed way down would be enough to mark resolved?
22:00 maximep left #koha
22:01 jcamins cait: that's my feeling.
22:03 mtj hmm... we could even add a new 'backporting' status to help track backporting?
22:04 jcamins mtj: I'm not sure how much help that would be.
22:05 mtj well, more help than not having it -  for sure
22:06 jcamins mtj: I guess I'm not really seeing how having a separate status for backporting would *reduce* the amount of time we need to spend managing bugzilla.
22:07 jcamins We already have problems because we can't tell if the Version has been set properly.
22:07 jcamins (and often it hasn't been)
22:07 cait too many statuses make work harder for wranglers I think
22:07 cait the lists are less useful
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22:08 cait what I would like to see removed is the workflow settings
22:08 cait to change something back to new - I have to move through 4 steps
22:08 cait and every step creates a mail
22:08 jcamins Yes, that does make sense.
22:08 cait it's not helpful
22:08 cait it's a good idea
22:08 cait but it does not work well
22:11 mtj cait:  just curious , when/why do you change a bug back to new?
22:11 cait ok, it was when someone mistakenly set the wrong status
22:11 cait bug confusion :)
22:12 cait but there are some quirks
22:12 cait where you can't go back
22:12 cait directly
22:12 cait and I thin it's more confusing than helpful
22:14 mtj aah, actually i have just clicked to something good....
22:14 bag @wunder 93109
22:14 huginn bag: The current temperature in K6LCM-Westside/Mesa, Santa Barbara, California is 16.9°C (3:14 PM PDT on May 01, 2012). Conditions: Overcast. Humidity: 80%. Dew Point: 13.0°C. Pressure: 29.92 in 1013 hPa (Falling).
22:14 mtj there *is* a way currently to track backporting in bugzilla, i think
22:16 NateC joined #koha
22:16 mtj so.. the 3.8 RM would search on bugs that are status='RESOLVED' , version='MASTER', etc....
22:17 jcamins mtj: yeah, that's what we do now.
22:17 jcamins The problem is there are already too many opportunities for human error.
22:17 eythian we clearly need to remove humans from the process.
22:18 mtj then backport that bug to 3.8, and set the bug-version to 'koha-3.8', with a note saying 'backported to 3.8'...
22:18 jcamins mtj: right, that's what we're doing now.
22:18 jcamins eythian: agreed.
22:18 eythian wahanui: humans
22:18 wahanui eythian: i'm not following you...
22:18 cait morning eythian
22:19 mtj jcamins: ok, so that works perfectly :) now i understand the process....
22:19 eythian hi cait
22:19 jcamins mtj: well, no, unfortunately it doesn't work so well. But the principle is sound.
22:21 mtj jcamins:  i am sure when more people understand the process, it will work better
22:22 jcamins mtj: from your mouth to reality.
22:24 mtj hmm, is the process described on the wiki yet?
22:26 * mtj looks, cant find anything....
22:26 jcamins mtj: I don't know.
22:26 jcamins I think so.
22:27 mtj ok, so i learn't something back there -  i'll drop the topic now... :)
22:29 jcamins mtj:[…]nt-patch_Workflow
22:37 eythian wahanui: humans is <reply>KILL ALL HUMANS|<reply>
22:37 wahanui OK, eythian.
22:38 mtj jcamins:  oooh, thanks for that
22:42 jcamins humans?
22:42 wahanui KILL ALL HUMANS
22:42 jcamins humans?
22:42 wahanui
22:42 jcamins Cool.
22:43 jcamins I didn't know you could do that.
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22:54 Topic for #koha is now Koha 3.8.0, 3.6.4 and 3.4.8 Now Available | Koha Community Website - | General IRC meeting, 2 May 2012 at 2:00 UTC+0
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