Time  Nick             Message
07:23 reiveune         hello
07:53 alex_a           Bonjour
08:41 fridolin         hihi
08:42 magnuse          hoho
08:59 nlegrand         Bonjour !
09:08 ashimema         Mornin'
10:10 magnuse          should MARC21slimUtils.xsl for opac and intranet be identical?
10:26 ashimema         pass
10:27 ashimema         it's all very quiet in here today
10:32 ashimema         tuxayo, did you get anywhere on bug 18017
10:33 ashimema         did you need a biblibre bod to help get it over the finish line?
11:38 oleonard         Hi #koha
11:40 slef             Hi oleonard
11:40 wahanui          hi oleopard
11:40 TimothyAlexis    I created an atomicupdate perl file, modified sysprefs.sql and also modified circulation.pref. Is the next step to run updatedatabase.pl to test?
11:41 oleonard         That sounds right to me TimothyAlexis
11:41 TimothyAlexis    Since I updated koha-testing-docker, it fails to start with ku.
11:42 oleonard         TimothyAlexis: That often happens to me but then the second time I try it works
11:42 TimothyAlexis    Previously, I've needed to run 'kd' and then 'ku' again to get it working.
11:43 slef             Does anyone know why Koha/Token.pm isn't in master git branch? I've been out of koha's git for farrrr too long.
11:43 oleonard         TimothyAlexis: Yes, that's my experience too.
11:43 pastebot         "TimothyAlexis" at 127.0.0.1 pasted "koha_koha_1 exited with code 1" (12 lines) at http://paste.koha-community.org/27961
11:43 TimothyAlexis    This time it seems to be something with ES
11:44 TimothyAlexis    es_1         | [1]: max virtual memory areas vm.max_map_count [65530] is too low, increase to at least [262144]
11:48 TimothyAlexis    I increased vm.max_map_count to 262144, still getting this though:
11:48 TimothyAlexis    koha_1       | {UNKNOWN}: DBI Exception: DBD::mysql::db selectrow_array failed: Table 'koha_kohadev.systempreferences' doesn't exist [for Statement "SELECT COUNT(*) FROM systempreferences"]  at /usr/share/perl5/DBIx/Class/Schema.pm line 1118.
12:05 cait1            TimothyAlexis: do you want to share how your update file looks like?
12:05 koha-jenkins     Yippee, build fixed!
12:05 wahanui          Congratulations!
12:05 koha-jenkins     Project Koha_Master_D9_My8 build #518: FIXED in 1 hr 3 min: https://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_Master_D9_My8/518/
12:05 cait1            slef: not sure about what this one does, sorry, maybe just moved?
12:07 nlegrand         I've update to last 20.11 and that updated translation, and I have a funny error: En
12:07 nlegrand         tity 'nbsp' not defined
12:07 nlegrand         We use a lot none breaking space in French.
12:08 nlegrand         Maybe we should use   in translations instead of  ?
12:08 nlegrand         Or did I just misse something? This is a package install.
12:10 cait1            slef: https://git.koha-community.org/Koha-community/Koha/src/branch/master/Koha/Token.pm
12:11 cait1            nlegrand: they are not valid in the xslt
12:11 cait1            you need to remove them there
12:12 cait1            are you using custom xslt by chance?
12:12 cait1            bug 25381
12:12 nlegrand         cait1: nope. (I mean... not yet!)
12:13 nlegrand         My concern is I think I'm using community XSLT with community transtlation :)
12:14 nlegrand           is very valid in XSLT :)
12:17 magnuse          kia ora slef!
12:18 magnuse          i just did a git pull and i have Koha/Token.pm in place
12:22 tcohen           morning
12:23 TimothyAlexis    cait1: This also happens when I start koha-testing-docker with the master branch checked out'
12:25 cait1            nlegrand: i know you can make use of them, but check the bug, it has an explanation
12:25 cait1            it's a security thing is what i get
12:25 cait1            not to use entities at all
12:25 cait1            nlegrand: maybe it slipped back inot the translations, although i thought we did clean them up
12:25 cait1            TimothyAlexis: still not a koha-testing-docker user :( but maybe tcohen?
12:28 Joubu            TimothyAlexis: is your ktd repo up-to-date?
12:28 Joubu            TimothyAlexis: see also the README
12:28 Joubu            225 Increase *vm.max_map_count* kernel setting to at least 262144:
12:29 Joubu            ha sorry, it's what you did
12:29 nlegrand         cait1: $ grep -c -r nbsp misc/translator/po/fr-FR-marc-UNIMARC.po
12:29 nlegrand         94
12:29 nlegrand         cait1: this is master.
12:30 cait1            nlegrand: i am not sure, sorry
12:30 nlegrand         cait1: perl -ilol -n -E 's/ / /g;print' misc/translator/po/fr-FR-marc-UNIMARC.po do the job, but I'm not sure It's the right way to correct this, the op are imported from somewhere right?
12:31 nlegrand         s/ op / po /;
12:32 nlegrand         I'll ask Séverine, she knows more about translations than I do :)
12:33 nlegrand         Arg, she's not working today...
12:33 Joubu            nlegrand: you need to fix it in pottle
12:34 Joubu            maybe ask Bernardo to do it for you
12:34 nlegrand         Joubu: oy ve. I'll try to find someone else to do it '^^
12:35 nlegrand         Ho great, who is Bernardo?
12:35 tcohen           he's not on IRC (usually bgkriegel)
12:35 tcohen           not now, I mean
12:35 tcohen           ping him, bgkriegel at gmail
12:36 nlegrand         tcohen: thanks!
12:42 koha-jenkins     Yippee, build fixed!
12:42 wahanui          Congratulations!
12:42 koha-jenkins     Project Koha_Master_D9 build #1574: FIXED in 49 min: https://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_Master_D9/1574/
12:45 nlegrand         I wrote to bgkriegel and cced fridolin.
12:49 slef             cait1: magnuse: OK, I'll kick my git and see what it's got wrong.
12:50 slef             thanks for checking
12:52 fridolin         nlegrand: ah, french translation team has directiv to not use   anymore in translation
12:52 fridolin         to much messy
12:52 fridolin         and it is useless
12:52 slef             ok, my git clone had lost its tracking information...
12:52 fridolin         we use regular space
12:53 nlegrand         cait1: thanks for the bug.
12:54 nlegrand         fridolin: well, it's full of   or did I fail my rebase? And not just the French translation...
12:55 nlegrand         fridolin: why not use  ? I was about to write to kohala to warn translators, do you think it's useless?
12:55 fridolin         nlegrand: translation is made by non-cyborg poeple so we try to keep it simpel ;)
12:56 fridolin         no warn is always good
12:56 oleonard         fridolin: non-cyborg *as far as we know*
12:57 slef             --set-upstream seems to have fixed my problem. At least the bug still exists there.
12:57 nlegrand         fridolin: I won't let you say no-break space is useless. I would also love to see narrow no-break space widely used in French translations! XD
12:57 fridolin         ^^
12:58 nlegrand         fridolin: ok then! Dank je wel!
12:58 slef             Does no-break space have a useful function in French? In English, its main function seems to be to make wrapped lines look ugly ;)
13:00 oleonard         I'm not able to think of a good reason to use &nbsp;. I have a habit of adding it to an empty <th> but I think that dates back to the 1990s.
13:00 nlegrand         slef: we use spaces or narrow spaces before : ; ? ! » and after «. A no-break space prevents your ponctuation from beginning the next line :)
13:00 oleonard         Ah that makes a lot of sense
13:01 oleonard         ...but is an unfortunate workaround for a problem which should be fixed by the browser's localization :(
13:01 fridolin         indeed
13:03 nlegrand         oleonard: nice point. I think it's an old habit from times where we add less automated goodies. I used to do it un lot in TeX or HTML. Now I don't write anymore so I can't really tell.
13:08 nlegrand         fridolin: but still, 20.11.03 XSLT translations are broken as of now or is it just me?
13:08 nlegrand         And master by the way.
13:11 fridolin         nlegrand: aarf i will test
13:12 fridolin         nlegrand: please contact mailling list  gt_traduction_kohala@framalistes.org
13:33 koha-jenkins     Project Koha_Master_D9 build #1575: SUCCESS in 50 min: https://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_Master_D9/1575/
13:42 koha-jenkins     Project Koha_Master_D10 build #484: STILL UNSTABLE in 49 min: https://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_Master_D10/484/
14:06 slef             nlegrand: oh yeah, the bizarre French attitude to double punctuation
14:10 Joubu            khall_: did you see my comment on 27837?
14:50 caroline         ashimema: are you testing things? should I not merge all the requests?
14:50 Joubu            ashimema: ping 27048
15:21 ashimema         working with bernardo right now on getting the 20.11 translations working
15:21 ashimema         something funky going on there
15:22 ashimema         oops. sorry.. been meaning to reply to that.
15:22 ashimema         I'm not sure we need to label it.. but am happy to do so if you think so ;
15:22 domm             is there way (besides dumping/restoring tables) to import/export serials?
15:23 Joubu            domm: no
15:23 Joubu            ashimema: ok
15:23 domm             Joubu: ok, thanks
15:28 koha-jenkins     Project Koha_Master_D9 build #1576: FAILURE in 49 min: https://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_Master_D9/1576/
15:30 nlegrand         slef: what do you mean?
15:30 Joubu            what do you mean???
15:33 oleonard-away    By extension the French have a bizarre attitude about English where they don't speak it all the time.
15:34 caroline_catlady lol!
15:34 nlegrand         French speaking English? I'm pretty sure this never happens.
15:46 cait1            :)
15:46 cait1            bye all!
15:57 tuxayo           ashimema: «tuxayo, did you get anywhere on bug 18017»
15:57 tuxayo           Got some advice of someone from BibLibre which clarified some of the stuff. And I asked a librarian if the UNIMARC part look good.
16:05 slef             nlegrand: punctuation spaced like it's a word itself, rather than something applied to an adjacent word. It seems very strange to speakers of other languages. And even more strangely, Canadian French only puts extra spaces next to : « » and not ; ! ?
16:31 koha-jenkins     Project Koha_Master_D10 build #485: STILL UNSTABLE in 55 min: https://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_Master_D10/485/
16:31 caroline         slef: it is weird when you put it like that... I'm just so used to it.
16:32 nlegrand         slef: well, it's something you get used to, like other strange things in a foreign language :)
16:33 slef             nlegrand: nearly 40 years and I am still not used to it ;)
16:33 Joubu            ashimema: Some failures from the transit patches, can you have a look please? https://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_Master_D10/485/consoleFull
16:33 nlegrand         I was first surprised when reading the TeXbook English could have double space after a period. And then I got used to it.
16:34 nlegrand         slef: oh well, somme people never changes :).
16:36 slef             I think double space after a full stop is dying out. Mainly still used by people who learned to type pre-computer. Some touchscreen keyboards now punish it by switching the automatic capitalisation off when you press space a second time.
16:37 nlegrand         I've got more trouble with French baroque orthography. English also have a baroque orthography by the way.
16:39 slef             I hear phrases like "baroque orthography" and am very glad I am a humble hacker :)
16:39 nlegrand         Ah! Punctuation problems and HTML with Bidi, let's talk about it.
16:40 nlegrand         In a table the direction of script is choosed at the top of the table, you can't change it in cells.
16:41 slef             sounds like an oversight
16:42 nlegrand         The Koha search results are displayed in a table. If some results are in arabic or hebrew script and the table direction is from left to right, then you cannot say your arabic or hebrew parts should be from left to right.
16:43 nlegrand         And then you can see horrible things happening with punctuation. Worse than French punctuation :)
16:44 nlegrand         Most of the time I pretend it doesn't exist to cope with the trauma.
16:44 nlegrand         .In English et would look like this
16:46 nlegrand         Anyway time to go! Bye koha, bye slef.
16:58 koha-jenkins     Project Koha_Master_D9_My8 build #519: FAILURE in 40 min: https://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_Master_D9_My8/519/
17:12 tcohen           is there a reason the collate for authorised_values.authorised_value is case insensitive?
17:12 tcohen           I think I already asked this around 2010 and my bug was closed, but I cannot find it haha
17:31 slef             tcohen: is there any speed or storage difference? If not, it may be an oversight from a past conversion.
17:31 tcohen           my hunch feeling is people might be relying on this, i.e. to be safe from bad data
17:32 slef             tcohen: and not finding bugs you know you filed is worse than me. I sometimes discover bugs I forgot I reported when I hit them again... sometimes even with a solution I forgot I developed.
17:33 tcohen           hahaha
17:53 * cait           waves
17:53 davidnind        hi cait!
17:53 cait             hi davidnind :)
17:54 cait             thx for the sign-offs!
17:54 cait             you took some weight off me there
17:55 davidnind        no problem, feel guilty sometimes about filing up the QA queuethough!
17:55 cait             don't :)
17:55 cait             just... don't :)
17:55 davidnind        :)
17:57 cait             tcohen: all the collations are case insensitive, only exceptions are the tables with subfield codes afaik
17:57 cait             case insensitive is the default overall
17:59 tcohen           right, the question is 'is there something that would prevent us from changing that, at least for AVs?'
18:11 cait             tcohen: i tihnk this direction it should work?
18:11 cait             meaning making something case insensitive is harder than making it stricter
18:11 cait             should be no trouble with existing data
18:21 tcohen           cait tanks
20:35 reiveune         bye
21:07 koha-jenkins     Project Koha_Master_D9 build #1577: STILL FAILING in 4 min 16 sec: https://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_Master_D9/1577/
21:29 mtj              hey #koha
21:30 mtj              hi tcohen, Joubu.. any idea why ktd-20.11 builds are recently failing?
21:31 mtj              https://gitlab.com/koha-community/koha-testing-docker/-/jobs/1071187159
21:34 mtj              build was ok before...
21:34 mtj              https://gitlab.com/koha-community/koha-testing-docker/-/jobs/1006727247
21:39 mtj              same problem with 20.05, but master images build ok
21:43 mtj              we might need to switch to a 'Credentials store' to keep docker login happy...
21:43 mtj              https://docs.docker.com/engine/reference/commandline/login/#credentials-store
21:47 mtj              same problem with 19.11 now too :/