Time Nick Message 05:38 alexbuckley thank you davidnind for testing bugs 25460 and 26589 the other day! davidnind++ 05:39 davidnind no problem! 05:39 alexbuckley :) 05:51 ashimema[m] Good morning 05:51 * ashimema[m] sends dcook cookies 05:51 dcook Morning :) 05:51 dcook Why do I get cookies? 05:51 dcook lol 05:51 dcook other david 05:51 dcook Makes waaaaay more sense 05:51 dcook Wait.. 05:51 dcook No dcook 05:52 dcook I'm so lost 05:52 dcook davidnind++ 05:52 ashimema[m] davidnind++ #mr SO machine 05:52 dcook Thanks for signing off my patch yesterday heh 05:52 ashimema[m] Just read your Facebook from two hours ago and though you could do with a more positive interaction dcook :) 05:52 dcook I just saw your comment heh 05:53 dcook And cheers :) 05:53 dcook Much appreciated 05:53 ashimema[m] Nice to see you sign up for QA team btw 05:53 ashimema[m] Welcome aboard 05:53 dcook I have to say though Linus gives me a run for my money in terms of length and verbosity of messages.. 05:53 dcook And thanks :) 05:54 ashimema[m] Pooh, what did Linus do now.. assuming your talking about The Linus 05:54 dcook Oh, just saying how anyone who uses the sched_yield syscall is basically the worst 05:55 dcook I don't do enough low level programming to know if he's being overly harsh or on point though heh 05:55 ashimema[m] I think you mix in way more technical circles than me at times.. I'm focused back down to Koha possibly a bit too much at the minute.. I should re-broaden my coding really.. bit I love the friendly community here 05:55 dcook And an Erlang programmer having a go at someone for asking a question 05:55 dcook The friendly community here is the best 05:56 ashimema[m] Erlang is hard.. I'd be asking lots of questions if I tried Erlang again 05:56 dcook A few months ago, I saw some rather bigoted things on listservs (not Koha of course) and it just had me shaking my head 05:56 dcook I'm mostly looking at a few concerns people have about RabbitMQ and its CPU usage 05:56 dcook and it seems like it comes at least partially from busy waiting/spinning.. 05:57 dcook Which I get in concept but in practice... not so much 05:57 ashimema[m] I'm still keen to try and do a Koha lite or whatever we decided to call it 05:57 dcook I can't remember what we decided either heh 05:57 dcook Isn't that the way.. 05:57 ashimema[m] But I'm not sure how to approach it.. needs some funding really 05:58 dcook Well, my first go at a Koha lite would just be with fewer required dependencies 05:58 dcook And then slowly decomposing things to be lighter and ligheter 05:58 dcook lighter* 05:58 ashimema[m] I'm sure there are some me lighter weight alternatives to RabbitMQ and Elastic out there that could give us 90% of what we need for the average users 05:58 ashimema[m] Yeah 05:58 dcook Yeah, I've been thinking about that a bit lately 05:58 ashimema[m] Decomposing would be great for everyone 05:59 dcook I'd be curious to see how the further move to Mojolicious will go too 05:59 dcook Julian was saying he was getting great performance with hypnotoad even for static assets 05:59 ashimema[m] But I don't think it's a priority for any businesses here unfortunately.. 05:59 dcook (That led me down another rabbit hole of comparing major web servers and their sendfile(2) syscall support heh) 05:59 dcook Yeah, true enough 06:00 dcook It's more a professional interest of mine than a business one.. 06:00 ashimema[m] Wonder if there are any grants out there that could help keep Koha runnable for poorer nations 06:00 dcook Hmm good question 06:01 ashimema[m] Totally.. personal and professional interest.. but I already don't have enough hours in the day to follow those 06:01 ashimema[m] :( 06:01 dcook Saaame 06:02 ashimema[m] With a grant I feel like I could give up some of the day job and focus on those more altruistic concerns like this 06:04 ashimema[m] Mojo is another area I'd really like to help move forward.. 06:05 dcook I am planning to play more with Mojo 06:05 dcook I messed around with Mojo::IOLoop a little while ago and would like to look at that again 06:06 ashimema[m] Mojo is cool.. I'm really glad I got to code something's Ng fresh and new with it before looking at it from a Koha perspective though.. 06:06 dcook Hehe I bet 06:07 dcook I was doing some OpenAPI work with Perl the other day but couldn't use Mojolicious... not fun 06:07 dcook In the end, I actually just used the OpenAPI spec to document it and didn't bother with any autogenerated code.. 06:07 ashimema[m] Koha is awesome but it has one heck of a legacy and momentum which makes it really hard to make the most of newer technologies 06:07 dcook Mojo::IOLoop was interesting. Very minimal interface 06:07 dcook Yeah, it's what... 20 years old now? 06:08 dcook Definitely makes it tough to modernize.. 06:09 dcook Huh... TIL that VMware apparently own RabbitMQ 06:09 dcook Don't know why I didn't notice that before 06:09 dcook I mean fortunately since we're using Net::Stomp for the connections, we can always sub in a different MQ 06:10 dcook (Although I think we do some RabbitMQ-specific stuff for it) 06:13 ashimema[m] I've not looked at our us of RabbitMQ in detail yet.. I took a step back when I saw people more knowledgeable sounding than me looking at it.. 06:13 ashimema[m] Was more than happy to bow out as it's not an area I'm all that familiar with at the moment 06:23 dcook I'm pretty happy with RabbitMQ overall 06:23 dcook Although the concerns that people have raised intrigue me 06:24 dcook Basically, RabbitMQ using a small amount of CPU constantly even when it's not processing any messages 06:25 dcook According to the RabbitMQ docs, this is due to "busy waiting", which they say you can turn off, but doing so only seems to partially achieve the goal 06:25 dcook They say RabbitMQ will sleep the schedulers, but I don't see any actual evidence of that 06:25 dcook Of course, I'm not too worried about 1% CPU usage 06:25 dcook But it's just interesting technically speaking 06:26 dcook So yeah... looked at the Erlang runtime to see if there was anything obvious.. 06:26 dcook I think Golang is supposed to have some busy wait too, although I haven't seen it in practice yet. I think I've only seen it actually sleep when it had no work to do.. 06:27 dcook I just wish I'd make some blog entries so I'd keep records of my deep dives lol 06:33 dcook Of course, now it's the end of my work day, and I don't really feel like working on technical things... heh 06:33 dcook Anyway, have a good day ashimema[m] and all 06:33 dcook And thanks for the cookies ;) 06:36 reiveune hello 06:42 fridolin hi 06:42 wahanui hi, fridolin 06:45 alex_a Bonjour 06:45 wahanui que tal, alex_a 06:56 ashimema[m] Sorry, got caught in the rush to get kids ready for school 06:56 ashimema[m] Reading back now 07:15 ashimema[m] is there a reason 19.05_D8 is disabled? 07:15 ashimema[m] on Jenkins that is 10:10 henryb I was looking at the 21.05 roles and wondered if there was space for a new role for someone to focus on accessibility 10:10 henryb e.g. test from an accessibility perspective, update accessibility guidance and documentation, generally promote accessibility issues and file new bugs 10:10 henryb A bit like the topic expert but without any extra QA points 10:11 henryb I think it would be a great signal that we value accessibility 10:11 henryb And an excuse/opportunity for someone to develop expertise 10:11 henryb I guess the role would vary depending on the person's skillset and experience 10:12 henryb does anyone have any thoughts? And if you think it's a good idea how do we go about adding a role? 10:12 kohaputti It should be included to the QA process imho 10:12 kohaputti but also pre-existing bugs should be filed 10:14 kohaputti so I suggest we add some instructions for the qa team regarding this in https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/How_to_QA in the section "What to look for" 10:16 kohaputti Also probably for the relevant parts it should be in the Coding guidelines (https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Coding_Guidelines) 10:19 henryb Yes, I absolutely agree. But I thought that if there was someone (or more than one person?) who had accessibility in their role then they might be more likely to prioritise accessibility and update the instructions 10:22 oleonard henryb are you interested in taking that position? 10:24 henryb Possibly if nobody else wanted it although I'm sure there are other people much more qualified! 10:25 vfernandes Can someone help me with a koha dev question? I'm trying to expand a Koha .pm file but i'm getting this error: "Template process failed: undef error - The method test is not covered by tests! at /KEEPS/koha/lib/C4/Templates.pm" 10:26 oleonard henryb it's the kind of role that can be self-created if you'd like to see it happen. I think it's a great idea. 10:26 kidclamp vfernandes, what files did you edit? 10:27 Joubu vfernandes: did you restart plack? 10:28 oleonard henryb having "official" recognition of the role might be useful if there was disagreement about the worthiness of the task, but I don't think there is. 10:30 oleonard henryb: On the other hand, if "official" recognition of the role helped you get the time and resources in your "day job," then we can give you a title and an official badge if necessary :D 10:31 vfernandes lib/Koha/Patron/Attribute/Type.pm 10:31 vfernandes the error appears after restarting pack 10:32 kohaputti oleonard, henryb yup, I think it is just important that somebody is interested doing the instructions and filing pre-existing bugs for this, whether there is separate role for this or not I don't think matters but I wouldn't be against having designated person for this 10:32 kohaputti (there just needs to be a volunteer to do this work) 10:33 kidclamp vfernandes: are you running kohadevbox? or koha testing docker? 10:33 kidclamp generally in dev you aren't editing the lib/ files directly, but the ones in the kohaclone 10:33 vfernandes i'm using a custom installation 10:35 ashimema[m] I love the idea of someone focusing on accessability henryb :) 10:36 ashimema[m] even if it ends up a temporary role that only exists for a few cycles.. having someone concentrate on working through adding suitable guidelines and documenting our shortcomings on that front would be fantastic. 10:36 kidclamp vfernandes, restart plack AND memcached? 10:37 ashimema[m] I know there's a real push for more accessability aware stuff at the moment.. obviously here in the UK, but I'm also aware of a few projects more widely in europe too.. would be great to have someone take the lead on helping to bring attention to those bugs and adding guidlines around them.. 10:37 vfernandes ohhh my bad... I put the method test in lib/Koha/Patron/Attribute/Types.pm instead of lib/Koha/Patron/Attribute/Types.pm :D 10:38 vfernandes *instead of lib/Koha/Patron/Attribute/Type.pm 10:38 ashimema[m] henryb++.. assuming you have a wiki account, feel free to stick a new role in and write a little proposal for it.. we can vote as a community to ratify it (and I'm yet to see a role like this turned down) 10:39 ashimema[m] ah yes.. that would do it vfernandes :) 10:40 kidclamp heh 10:42 ashimema[m] fridolin++ 10:43 ashimema[m] unicorns++ 10:46 henryb Ok thanks for the comments and encouragement, I will add something to the wiki 10:47 ashimema[m] let me know if you need a hand with anything 10:49 ashimema[m] https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Roles_for_20.11 (there's an example of writing a proposal on there for Jonathan D as RM.. something similar for what you would like to see the role take on would be perfect) 10:50 ashimema[m] or you could add the proposal for role to https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Project_roles and we can help flesh it out at a later date :) 11:44 koha-jenkins Project Koha_19.05_D8 build #260: SUCCESS in 41 min: https://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_19.05_D8/260/ 12:16 koha-jenkins Project Koha_19.05_D8 build #261: SUCCESS in 32 min: https://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_19.05_D8/261/ 12:18 tcohen morning 12:35 kidclamp ok guys, no one touch the holds code anymore from now on everyone must accept it as is 12:35 kidclamp :-P 12:38 Joubu deal 12:40 ashimema[m] wha 12:40 ashimema[m] morning 12:42 ashimema[m] well.. afternoon here.. but morning for you tcohen 12:42 ashimema[m] ;P 12:55 tcohen late morning actually :-D 12:55 tcohen it takes me almost an hour to pick the nanny as there's no public transportation 12:56 tcohen kidclamp at least allow to push bug 25260 12:56 huginn Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=25260 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, tomascohen, Needs Signoff , Merge 'reserves' and 'old_reserves' into a new 'holds' table 12:56 tcohen it is tiny :-P 12:56 kidclamp couldn't affect a thing :-P 12:58 ashimema[m] lol 12:59 tcohen I must admit I got surprised how easy was switching things into using the new table 12:59 tcohen I expected many things to explode, and it was just a bunch of edge cases that had regression tests 13:00 * ashimema[m] likes that bug 13:00 ashimema[m] did I not sign it off already.. 13:00 ashimema[m] oops 13:22 tony Can someone tell me why I'm getting a Internal Server Error when in the admin area and trying to open 'about koha' --- BTW Everything else works perfect --- I'm using Koha 20 13:23 tcohen what do the logs say? 13:24 tcohen tail -f /var/log/koha/<instance>/plack-error.log 13:37 tony tcohen -- tks for responding, the log sez: Use of uninitialized value $query in pattern match (m//) at /usr/share/koha/lib/C4/Search.pm line 1296. Use of uninitialized value $query in pattern match (m//) at /usr/share/koha/lib/C4/Search.pm line 1297. Use of uninitialized value $query in pattern match (m//) at /usr/share/koha/lib/C4/Search.pm line 1306. Use of uninitialized value $query in pattern match (m//) at /usr/share/koha/lib/C4/Search 13:37 tcohen those are harmless warnings 13:37 tcohen keep the command running (tail -f) 13:38 tcohen and reload the interface to trigger the error 13:38 tony I understand however I can initialize any of the 'perl' if I can't see what's there 13:38 Joubu I would tail -f on the whole /var/log/koha/<instance>/*.log 13:46 tcohen ah, plack-intranet-error.log? 13:46 tcohen what Joubu said 13:48 tony Thank you both -- I had to run perl -MCPAN -e 'install Bundle::KohaSupport' and now it is working --- tks again 13:49 tcohen Oh 13:49 tcohen So a plugin was breaking Koha? 13:50 tcohen are you sure you're using Koha 20.05? 13:50 tcohen that library dates back to 2008 13:52 Joubu FYI all: Dev meeting in less than 10min 13:53 tony Yes I'm sure another reason to get into the About Koha 13:53 Joubu tony: you should not need that, really :) Something else is going wrong 13:54 tony Hmmmmm well it is still running so I should see the results soon 13:54 tcohen how did you install tony? 13:54 Joubu it installs some modules, you are certainly missing one 13:54 tcohen how did you install Koha I mean 13:55 tony I installed via the web installation 13:55 tcohen yes, but did you apt install koha-common? 13:55 tony I'm running it on Ubuntu 16.04 so it might be something that is within that version 13:55 tcohen https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Koha_on_Debian 13:56 tcohen Ah, that Ubuntu version is not supported by Koha 20.05 13:56 tcohen https://koha-community.org/koha-20-05-released/ 13:57 Joubu I may work actually 13:57 Joubu At least our CI is green 13:57 tony It shows on the site that it is still good for 20 13:57 tcohen but it might have dependency issues 13:58 Joubu I think mtj fixed that 13:58 tcohen then why is tony having deps issues he 13:58 tcohen ok 13:58 tony That is just what I'm thinking since this version of Ubuntu is old 13:58 Joubu but yeah, if you are starting from scratch you should prefer Ubuntu 18 or 20 13:59 tony Well that is what I should have upgraded to but the client was pressuring so much I just kept it on 16 14:00 tony It is showing me that I have some XML issues going on 14:01 tcohen tony, we have a dev meeting right now 14:01 tcohen lets talk a bit later 14:01 tony Got it 14:01 Joubu #startmeeting Development IRC meeting 7 October 2020 14:01 huginn Meeting started Wed Oct 7 14:01:31 2020 UTC. The chair is Joubu. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 14:01 huginn Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. 14:01 huginn The meeting name has been set to 'development_irc_meeting_7_october_2020' 14:01 Joubu #topic Introductions 14:01 Joubu #info Jonathan Druart 14:01 Joubu qa_team? 14:01 wahanui i think qa_team is cait Joubu marcelr kohaputti josef_moravec tcohen kidclamp khall ashimema alex_a jajm matts 14:01 Joubu rmaints? 14:01 wahanui rmaints is lukeG, aleisha, and tuxayo, I SUMMON THEE!!âš¡âš¡ 14:01 ashimema[m] #info Martin Renvoize, PTFS Europe 14:02 tcohen #info Tomas Cohen Arazi, Theke Solutions 14:02 jajm #info Julian Maurice, BibLibre 14:02 Joubu #link https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Development_IRC_meeting_7_October_2020 14:02 amoyano #info Agustin Moyano, Theke Solutions 14:03 oleonard #info Owen Leonard, Athens County Public Libraries, Ohio, USA 14:04 Joubu #topic Announcements 14:04 Joubu #info Roles for 21.05 are opened https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Roles_for_21.05 14:04 Joubu please add your name :) 14:04 Joubu I candidate to continue as serving for RM 14:05 ashimema[m] long live the RM 14:05 oleonard Joubu++ 14:05 Joubu Anyone have something else to announce? 14:06 Joubu as usual, just ask me with quick "!" or "." or whatever if you want me to stop 14:06 Joubu otherwise I am moving on 14:06 Joubu #topic Update from the Release manager (20.11) 14:06 ashimema[m] :) 14:07 Joubu bug 20582 and bug 22417 have been pushed this week 14:07 huginn Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=20582 enhancement, P5 - low, Future, julian.maurice, Pushed to master , Turn Koha into a Mojolicious application 14:07 huginn Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=22417 new feature, P5 - low, ---, jonathan.druart, Pushed to master , Add a task queue 14:07 Joubu Keep going the work on those 2 and SO/QA on existing dependent patches or open/write follow-up bug reports. 14:07 amoyano great news! 14:07 Joubu #info If you face issues with ktd you certainly need to `docker-compose pull` 14:08 Joubu Those using kohadevbox will certainly to install new dependencies. Let us know if you face any problems related to them. 14:08 Joubu Other point, I would like to highlight bug 24488: That would be great to see one or two of us offering their help to aleisha. 14:08 huginn Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=24488 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, aleisha, ASSIGNED , Holds to Pull sometimes shows the wrong 'first patron' details 14:09 Joubu #info The new git server will be live next month, after the October stable releases 14:09 * ashimema[m] has been tip toeing around that one.. 14:09 ashimema[m] awesome on the gitserver front 14:09 Joubu I have started to add the release-notes-needed flag on some bug reports pushed to 20.11 that need them. Please add them when missing! At least for the ones I flagged. 14:09 Joubu And that's all for me, any questions? 14:10 Joubu ha yes, release dates will be published on the ML very soon 14:10 Joubu #topic Updates from the Release Maintainers 14:11 ashimema[m] are there any here? 14:11 Joubu #info October stable releases will be rolled out on 27th 14:11 * ashimema[m] is happy to see fridolin running for rmaint next cycle 14:11 Joubu postponed after KohaCon 14:12 Joubu #topic Updates from the QA team 14:12 ashimema[m] QA has been flowing well.. but there's always more that can be done 14:13 Joubu Queue is getting high a bit, 65 bugs 14:13 ashimema[m] usual suspects are shouldering allot of the burden 14:13 Joubu It would be great to see some of you focussed on Katrin's patches 14:13 Joubu as she did an awesome job last month to lower the numbers 14:13 ashimema[m] +1 (I'm locked out of most as I've done a chunk of SO on them) 14:14 ashimema[m] most are simple to QA too.. boost your numbers by taking some on chaps 14:15 Joubu #info @QA - QA ALL THE THINGS. There are easy ones to boost your name on top of the dashboard :) 14:16 Joubu #info Actions from last meeting 14:16 Joubu #topic Actions from last meeting 14:16 Joubu #topic ashimema is collecting notes about bug 15522 and is going to review and dig a bit more into the code (postponed) 14:16 huginn Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=15522 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, jonathan.druart, Patch doesn't apply , New interface for revamped circulation rules 14:16 ashimema[m] It would be nice to see some more QA's from matts and alex_a 14:16 matts ashimema[m], I agree. 14:17 Joubu ashimema[m]: what is the status of this? 14:17 ashimema[m] OK.. 15522 generally I'm happy with.. I was hoping to see a vue alternative put forward for comparison to highlight the complexity/simplicity of the javascript 14:17 Joubu What are the feedbacks of the users? 14:18 ashimema[m] I believe the existing branch needs a minor rebase for the changes to our build scripts 14:18 amoyano I'll try to add my 2 cents on vue for that one 14:18 ashimema[m] UX wise everyone seemed happy 14:18 tcohen amoyano++ 14:18 ashimema[m] amoyano that would be awesome 14:18 tcohen there's the need to revisit the gulpfile 14:18 tcohen I'll take a look there 14:18 Joubu amoyano: when do you think you will have time to dedicate to it? 14:18 ashimema[m] I've a feeling at this point it's not a 20.11 piece but one for very very early 21.05 14:19 Joubu it's definitely too late for 20.11 14:19 ashimema[m] I'd rather wait a month/cycle and see a nice proof of vue 14:19 Joubu maybe something to present during KohaCon? 14:19 amoyano I'll try to do something this week 14:19 Joubu I really would like to get some feedback from real users 14:19 ashimema[m] I'm not expert enough in either react or vue to have a strong feeling.. but I will admit the react code looks complex 14:19 Joubu (ie. not devs) 14:19 ashimema[m] amoyano that is awesome 14:20 ashimema[m] I got our support team to give it a run down and they liked it.. 14:20 ashimema[m] especially once they'd had a chat with their contemporaries at ByWater.. 14:20 Joubu #action amoyano Will try to provide a Vue alternative to bug 15522 14:20 ashimema[m] we also have a customer on standby to play with it 14:20 Joubu ashimema[m]: where are the notes you collected? 14:21 ashimema[m] in the end it was sumamrised as.. "We like it" 14:21 amoyano hehe 14:21 Joubu Could we imagine a sandbox with sample data with a lot of circ rules? 14:21 Joubu and ask the list for feedback? 14:22 ashimema[m] that's a nice idea 14:22 Joubu you are voluntering, right? 14:22 ashimema[m] how big is big.. 14:22 tcohen ashimema[m]++ 14:22 Joubu #action ashimema Setup a sandbox with lot of circ rules (ideally from production data) to test 15522. Then ask the list for feedback. 14:23 Joubu great :) 14:23 ashimema[m] the tests we ran with it were with a customers data.. a few hundred lines of circ rules 14:23 Joubu #topic davidnind Find and update relevant places to record Perl version required, including release notes, manual and wiki (one source of the truth) (postponed) 14:23 ashimema[m] I'll ask said customer if they're happy for me to share such a set (with anonymised users of course) 14:23 Joubu I think I pinged him at the last meeting but cannot remember his answer :-/ 14:24 ashimema[m] me either 14:24 Joubu @later tell davidnind Can you update the actions assigned to you for the next dev meetings please? 14:24 huginn Joubu: The operation succeeded. 14:24 Joubu #action davidnind Find and update relevant places to record Perl version required, including release notes, manual and wiki (one source of the truth) (postponed) 14:24 Joubu #action davidnind to add information about what to backport to the release maintainers role page (as a starting point for further notes and guidance) 14:25 Joubu #topic ashimema to write a guideline to forbidding the use of type "number" 14:25 ashimema[m] hmm 14:26 ashimema[m] I thought I did that 14:26 ashimema[m] just trying to find the draft 14:26 amoyano is it part of the qa script? 14:26 Joubu I think so 14:26 Joubu or there is a merge request 14:27 Joubu https://gitlab.com/koha-community/qa-test-tools/-/issues/38 14:27 Joubu there is a merge request associated to the issue 14:27 ashimema[m] OK.. seems I never added it 14:28 * fridolin waves 14:28 Joubu and it has been approved, I will merge it. I guess I was waiting for the guidelines to be approved 14:28 ashimema[m] I'll add it to the guidelines as "ACC2: Input type number should not be used" 14:28 Joubu #action ashimema to write a guideline to forbidding the use of type "number" (postponed) 14:28 ashimema[m] ajha.. I bet I drafted it on the bug report 14:28 Joubu #topic tuxayo to collect notes (if any) from past&present RMaints about their backport policies. 14:29 Joubu #info tuxayo collected notes from past and present RMaints about their backport policies at https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/User:Victor_Grousset_-_tuxayo/Release_maintenance_tips 14:29 Joubu #topic General development discussion (trends, ideas, ...) 14:30 Joubu ashimema[m]: ideally we should update the action entry directly on the meeting page 14:30 Joubu that will help to know if we should postpone or if the action has been done 14:30 Joubu especially if the author does not attend the meeting 14:31 ashimema[m] good idea 14:31 Joubu #topic What to do when updatedatabase fails ? 14:31 ashimema[m] thanks 14:31 Joubu jajm: you added that, right? 14:32 ashimema[m] It comes up semi-frequently 14:32 ashimema[m] most recent broader discussion is on bug 25078 14:32 huginn Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=25078 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, koha-bugs, In Discussion , Gracefully stop updatedatabase/installer when a database change cannot be applied 14:32 Joubu yes 14:32 Joubu I was trying to find this one 14:32 jajm Joubu, yes, but I wasn't aware of bug 25078 14:32 ashimema[m] which was raised a a bug after discussions on bug 22887 14:32 huginn Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=22887 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, jonathan.druart, Pushed to master , authorised_values is missing a unique constraint on category + authorised_value 14:33 koha-jenkins Yippee, build fixed! 14:33 wahanui Congratulations! 14:33 koha-jenkins Project Koha_19.11_U16 build #8: FIXED in 44 min: https://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_19.11_U16/8/ 14:33 ashimema[m] and more recently came up in bug 18050 14:33 huginn Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=18050 minor, P5 - low, ---, katrin.fischer, Signed Off , Missing constraint on aqbudgets.budget_period_id in aqbudgets 14:33 Joubu basically, see my last comment on 25078 14:33 ashimema[m] In short.. there's a strong feeling amongst some that updatedatebase should somehow gracefully fail to ensure the database is consistent for all as apposed to just warning. 14:34 Joubu (note to myself: never write you are going to do something during the next dev cycle...) 14:34 ashimema[m] hehe 14:35 ashimema[m] well.. is it still a goal people are strongly feeling should be met 14:35 jajm Joubu, "As I said I would prefer to have the whole thing ran in one go." so you want to run every DB update even if the first failed ? 14:35 Joubu My point is: we can explode, people is supposed to have a backup. 14:35 ashimema[m] my feeling is as much as I'd like to see it done.. it also doesn't present me with enough of an issue to work on it personally.. 14:35 Joubu jajm: yes 14:35 Joubu you get all the errors 14:35 ashimema[m] and.. I don't feel we should be failing existing bug reports for it 14:36 Joubu then you restore the backup, fix the problems and run the upgrade again 14:36 jajm errors that can happen only because the first failed 14:36 Joubu it's just a my developper point of view. Seems easier to fix 14:37 Joubu than redoing the whole script every error it faces 14:38 Joubu I am suggesting to continue the discussion on the bug report 14:38 Joubu I am open to anything we decide and I am willing to work on it if we find an concensus 14:39 Joubu ok? 14:39 jajm it seems dangerous to assume everyone has db backups and that the backups work :) 14:40 jajm ok to continue on the bug report 14:41 Joubu Another last minute discussion? 14:41 Joubu #topic Set time of next meeting 14:42 Joubu #info Next meeting: 28 October 2020, 20 UTC 14:42 Joubu in 3 weeks, after the KohaCon 14:42 Joubu #endmeeting 14:42 huginn Meeting ended Wed Oct 7 14:42:28 2020 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) 14:42 huginn Minutes: https://meetings.koha-community.org/2020/development_irc_meeting_7_october_2020.2020-10-07-14.01.html 14:42 huginn Minutes (text): https://meetings.koha-community.org/2020/development_irc_meeting_7_october_2020.2020-10-07-14.01.txt 14:42 huginn Log: https://meetings.koha-community.org/2020/development_irc_meeting_7_october_2020.2020-10-07-14.01.log.html 14:42 ashimema[m] Thanks Joubu 14:47 Joubu ashimema[m]: maybe you should link the gov uk recommendation to ACC2? 14:47 Joubu hmrc 14:48 Joubu no it was not hmrc :D 14:48 Joubu https://technology.blog.gov.uk/2020/02/24/why-the-gov-uk-design-system-team-changed-the-input-type-for-numbers/ 14:48 Joubu I meant this one 14:51 ashimema[m] I think they've rebranded themselves a bit since the original 14:51 ashimema[m] but yeah.. not a bad idea to link to it. 14:54 tcohen Joubu++ 15:10 reiveune bye 16:00 kidclamp Joubu: please see my followup on 24488 and approve or obsolete 16:04 Joubu erk 16:04 Joubu I was going to submit a follow-up :-( 16:05 ashimema[m] lol 16:05 ashimema[m] you did ask for help in the meeting ;) 16:05 ashimema[m] glad I'm here to see others do it.. as I was also thinking of jumping in next.. haha 16:05 * ashimema[m] lets the dust settle a bit 16:06 kidclamp heh, sorry 16:06 Joubu kidclamp: I think you missed something 16:06 Joubu I am attaching mine 16:07 Joubu kidclamp: we did almost the same things, but you forgot the { '!=', undef } part 16:07 Joubu I think it should be kept 16:08 Joubu also, the count of items: we don't need the pass a column and "distinct" 16:08 Joubu otherwise yes, it's the same idea :) 16:08 Joubu what do you think? 16:08 kidclamp yes, I missed some :-) nice one 16:09 Joubu kidclamp: I was wondering if we should not actually retrieve all the items instead of replaying the same query 16:10 Joubu we could do that in perl 16:11 Joubu like: my @items = Koha::Items->the_search; my @location = uniq {map $_->location} @items; 16:11 Joubu misplaced {}, but you got the point I'm sure 16:11 kidclamp I did wonder which would be more efficient 19:07 kathryn hi caroline I'm here again for the meeting, did I also have the time wrong? :) 19:08 tcohen something's wrong with bugzilla 19:09 tcohen kathryn: did you get a bunch of materials from Argentina? 19:10 caroline hi again kathryn! it is in an hour (according to the calendar...) 19:10 caroline hi davidnind! 19:11 kathryn tchoen I have a new one yesterday labelled Aniversario Koha-ffyh not sure if that's one you know 19:11 tcohen it is 19:11 kathryn cool :) 19:12 davidnind hi caroline! 19:12 kathryn hi davidnind 19:12 tcohen hi caroline davidnind 19:15 davidnind hi kathryn tcohen 19:22 caroline hi tcohen! 19:51 aleisha hello 19:52 caroline hi aleisha! 19:52 tcohen hi aleisha 19:53 marieluce hi everyone 19:54 aleisha missed the dev meeting but here for the community meeting! 19:59 caroline Joubu around? 20:00 caroline if not any volunteers to chair the meeting? 20:02 caroline I guess I can do it since I'm around and don't have much to say 20:02 caroline #startmeeting General IRC meeting 7 October 2020 20:02 huginn Meeting started Wed Oct 7 20:02:34 2020 UTC. The chair is caroline. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 20:02 huginn Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. 20:02 huginn The meeting name has been set to 'general_irc_meeting_7_october_2020' 20:02 caroline #topic Introductions 20:02 caroline please use "#info" in front of your introduction to have it show up in the automatic minutes 20:03 aleisha #info Aleisha Amohia, Catalyst IT, Wellington ZN 20:03 aleisha oops 20:03 caroline #info Caroline Cyr La Rose, inLibro, Montreal 20:03 marieluce #info Marie-Luce Laflamme, inLibro, Montreal 20:03 davidnind #info David Nind, Wellington, New Zealand 20:03 lisettelatah #info Lisette Scheer Latah County Library District, Moscow, Idaho, US 20:03 kathryn #info Kathryn Tyree, Catalyst IT, NZ 20:03 henryb #info Henry Bolshaw, House of Lords Library, UK 20:05 caroline cait sends her apologies as she is not able to attend today 20:05 caroline #topic Announcements 20:05 rangi #nfo Chris Cormack, Catalyst IT 20:05 rangi lol 20:05 caroline The wiki pae for 21.05 roles is open! 20:05 rangi #info Chris Cormack, Catalyst IT 20:06 caroline #link https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Roles_for_21.05 20:06 caroline #info Wiki page for 21.05 roles is open add your names! 20:07 caroline any other announcements? (we'll do a separate topic for Kohacon) 20:07 kathryn :) 20:09 caroline #topic KohaCon updates 20:09 caroline the floor is yours 20:09 wahanui i already had it that way, caroline. 20:09 kathryn Thanks! 20:09 caroline wahanui what is the floor? 20:09 wahanui well, the floor is yours 20:09 kathryn Here's something I prepared earlier :) 20:09 kathryn Catalyst are very busy with preparation, but it's a moving train now and it's going to arrive on 19 October! 20:09 kathryn #info Please can all online and in-person attendees register at https://2020.kohacon.org/posts/registration/ there is room for more in person, and the internet has more space too :) We will email the URL for the stream to everyone registered. 20:09 kathryn All presenters who are pre-recording please send in your recordings this week. 20:09 kathryn Thanks to all that contributed to the video! We hope it works out when we put it all together - we will see! 20:09 kathryn All are welcome at Kohacon, whether they use Koha now or not and are interested to listen in and see how they can apply our Koha stories in their own libraries. Please share the news :) 20:10 caroline less than 2 weeks! 20:10 kathryn way less! let me try and put the rest in the in minutes 20:10 kathryn #info All presenters who are pre-recording please send in your recordings this week. 20:10 kathryn Thanks to all that contributed to the video! We hope it works out when we put it all together - we will see! 20:10 kathryn #info All are welcome at Kohacon, whether they use Koha now or not and are interested to listen in and see how they can apply our Koha stories in their own libraries. Please share the news :) 20:11 kathryn sorry one more time for the notes 20:11 kathryn #info Thanks to all that contributed to the video! We hope it works out when we put it all together - we will see! 20:11 caroline kathryn++ 20:11 marieluce kathryn++ 20:12 kathryn In short, we're seeing lots of registrations at the moment, keep them coming, it's all happening! 20:12 hayley kathryn++ 20:12 kathryn Anyone else want to add anything or ask? 20:12 caroline And for those in Europe and America, don't forget that it starts on October 18 for us 20:12 caroline I just realized this this week 20:12 caroline we live int he past 20:13 aleisha hehe 20:13 kathryn yeah caroline, also we just started daylight savings which is why I thought this meeting was an hour ago, as well as yesterday ;) 20:13 thd #info Thomas Dukleth, Agogme, New York City 20:13 kathryn perhaps we'll put that in the next koha list email 20:13 caroline presenters, make sure to check your times otherwise you will be one day late lol! 20:14 henryb Will the in-person workshops be recorded or available online too? 20:14 kathryn #info we'll send out the stream link a day or two before the conference 20:14 caroline good question henryb! 20:15 kathryn henryb no sorry :( we decided it's a bit hard on the presenters to cater to both in person and remote learners/participants 20:16 kathryn if we can share some notes/summaries/slides we will do that 20:16 caroline Workshops on Oct. 25 are online though? 20:17 caroline and what about the DIY days? 20:17 kathryn no, there was just one online workshop proposed, the rest are in person 20:18 henryb Ok thanks kathryn. The workshops sound really interesting so it would be great to see notes afterwards if that's possible. 20:18 kathryn The DIY days we'll be in IRC, in person here in Wellington NZ, and have video conference available if people want to work together that way 20:19 kathryn henryb we also don't have a camera set up in the workshops room, whereas the main auditorium has all the gear fro recording/streaming 20:19 caroline just to summarize for online viewers it's days 1-3 for talks and days 6 and 7 for DIY on IRC, is that right? 20:20 kathryn yes 20:20 caroline #info for online viewers it's days 1-3 for talks and days 6 and 7 for DIY on IRC 20:20 caroline thanks for the clarification kathryn! 20:21 henryb Looking forward to it! Although still not sure when I will sleep 20:21 rangi plus the one online workshop if ppl are interested in rfid stuff 20:21 kathryn #info #kohacon20 is the hashtag! 20:21 caroline #info there is one online workshop on day 5 too 20:22 caroline davidnind will be manning the twitter? 20:23 kathryn Tosca from Catalyst will be on @nzkoha 20:23 caroline any other questions for the kohacon organizers? 20:23 rangi im sure davidnind will be retweeting and adding more on @kohails too :) 20:23 kathryn which we've been using for the conference - but would love to have david on ^ yep :) 20:24 davidnind I was planning to, and can provide access if anyone else wants to - hopefully don't get blocked this time for too many tweets! 20:24 davidnind might not be the same volume - not sure whether it is too much live tweeting sonetimes... 20:24 caroline thank you organizing team for turning around and organizing this for the new noemal 20:25 caroline #info follow @nzkoha and @kohails on Twitter during the conference 20:25 davidnind kathyrn++ (and team!) 20:26 kathryn you're welcome, lets see how it goes :) looking forward to it! 20:26 henryb kathryn++ 20:26 caroline alrighty if there aren't any other questions we'll move on to the next topic 20:27 caroline #topic Update on releases 20:27 caroline anybody from the meeting this morning can summarize? 20:27 caroline rmaints? 20:27 wahanui rmaints is lukeG, aleisha, and tuxayo, I SUMMON THEE!!âš¡âš¡ 20:27 aleisha hello 20:27 aleisha i wasnt in the meeting this morning 20:28 caroline I guess Jobou and team are on schedule to release 20.11 in november 20:28 aleisha basically 20:28 wahanui basically is checks the Bugzilla statuses are correct, then updates the status, adds the 'released in versions' text and adds a comment 20:28 hayley shh wahanui 20:28 aleisha #info string freeze for october release will be 20th and release will be 27th 20:29 sam_s where is the koha-conf.xml located in the koha install? The manual refrences it but doesn't say where it's located 20:30 caroline alright, anything else for releases? 20:31 hayley sam_s usually /etc/koha/sites/<instance>/koha-conf.xml I think 20:31 caroline ok then, moving on 20:31 caroline #topic Actions from last meeting 20:31 caroline #info no actions from last meeting 20:32 caroline any other topics y'all wanted to discuss? 20:33 caroline I feel like I'm going through topics very fast, don't hesitate to tell me to wait a bit :) 20:33 davidnind lisettlelatah++ and koha-US team for a successful online conference last month 20:34 caroline lisettelatah++ 20:34 lisettelatah Thanks! all the recordings and slides are up on our website for anyone who missed it. 20:35 lisettelatah http://koha-us.org/learn/conferences/onlinetogether2020/ 20:35 caroline #info recordings and slides of Koha-US conference are on Koha-US website 20:35 caroline #link http://koha-us.org/learn/conferences/onlinetogether2020/ 20:37 caroline #topic Set time of Next meeting 20:37 caroline First week of november? 20:38 caroline I propose to still keep it at this time for Kohacon wrap up, even if it's a bit inconvenient for europeans 20:38 sam_s hayley: thx! 20:38 davidnind +1 20:39 thd +1 20:39 hayley sam_s :) 20:39 caroline So wednesday nov 4 20UTC? 20:39 thd +1 20:39 caroline Objections? 20:40 aleisha +1 20:40 henryb +1 20:40 davidnind +1 20:40 caroline #info Next meeting: 4 November 2020, 20 UTC 20:40 caroline #endmeeting 20:40 huginn Meeting ended Wed Oct 7 20:40:37 2020 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) 20:40 huginn Minutes: https://meetings.koha-community.org/2020/general_irc_meeting_7_october_2020.2020-10-07-20.02.html 20:40 huginn Minutes (text): https://meetings.koha-community.org/2020/general_irc_meeting_7_october_2020.2020-10-07-20.02.txt 20:40 huginn Log: https://meetings.koha-community.org/2020/general_irc_meeting_7_october_2020.2020-10-07-20.02.log.html 20:40 davidnind caroline++ 20:41 marieluce caroline++ 20:41 caroline thanks everyone! I can't wait to see your faces at Kohacon! 20:41 henryb caroline++ 20:41 caroline (or the backs of your heads if you're not presenting lol) 20:43 caroline @later tell ashimema[m] can you run the post-meeting script for minutes? 20:43 huginn caroline: The operation succeeded. 20:54 tcohen oh noes 20:55 * tcohen got distracted (kids) 20:55 tcohen koha++ 20:55 tcohen caroline++ 21:41 sam_s hey, i'm trying to work on a plugin in koha testing docker, but I cant figure out how to enable plugins in it. I thought starting with "kup" would do this as it's described as "Start the env, plugin development set" but the plugins option doesn't show up under more when starting it in this mode