Time  Nick          Message
03:51 bag           hola
05:31 * magnuse     waves
05:32 magnuse       kia ora cait!
05:32 cait          morning magnuse :)
05:46 * mtj         waves to bag, magnuse cait
05:46 cait          hi mtj :)
05:47 mtj           hey cait, i loved those kohacon fotos of you all
05:47 magnuse       hiya mtj
05:47 cait          :)
05:48 mtj           very very jealous
05:48 * magnuse     too
05:48 mtj           peeps, i was looking at this again, last nite... ->  http://try.discourse.org
05:49 mtj           http://www.discourse.org/
05:50 mtj           i was wondering if it might be a good fit for Koha project...
05:51 magnuse       is that like a free software version of disqus?
05:51 mtj           its free, we can run it on our own server, etc..
05:51 magnuse       what's not to like? ;-)
05:51 magnuse       oh, ruby?
05:51 wahanui       somebody said ruby was easy to install. Any > 1.8.7 works fine
05:51 mtj           its more like a free version of stack-exchange
05:52 magnuse       oh
05:52 magnuse       so it would be for koha-related discussions?
05:52 magnuse       i thought it was comments on individual catalogues...
05:53 magnuse       hm, i still can't get to the wiki. cait and mtj, can you?
05:53 cait          not this morning
05:53 mtj           nor me
05:56 magnuse       :-(
05:56 magnuse       who can give it a kick? i guess that info is... on the wiki
05:57 mtj           heh, yeah, it is
05:58 mtj           gmcharlt, rangi have logins ^
05:58 mtj           its an ESI box (i think)
05:59 magnuse       or maybe it doesn't need actual kicking, someone in the us was able to get in yesterday when i couldn't
06:00 cait          i could still reach it then too
06:00 cait          maybe someone locked us out? :)
06:01 magnuse       could be :-)
06:02 mtj           http://isup.me/wiki.koha-community.org
06:02 mtj           looks down
06:04 mtj           magnuse:  discourse could be an option for our failed SE attempt...
06:04 mtj           http://lists.katipo.co.nz/public/koha/2013-September/037402.html
06:06 magnuse       wow, that was 2 years ago? :-)
06:06 magnuse       if someone sets it up i'll be glad to try it
06:07 mtj           discourse is made by one of the orig. SE devs, Jeff Atwood
06:07 magnuse       nice
06:08 * mtj         just throwing the idea out there, for the logs...
06:12 mtj           discourse with docker, on a digitalocean VM
06:12 mtj           -> https://meta.discourse.org/t/beginners-guide-to-deploy-discourse-on-digital-ocean-using-docker/12156
06:17 mtj           fyi: discourse was mentioned during those inital discussions
06:17 mtj           http://lists.katipo.co.nz/public/koha/2013-September/037409.html
06:17 mtj           ... but it only recently had a 1.x release
06:19 mtj           anyhoo, something to ponder
06:40 reiveune      hello
06:40 wahanui       que tal, reiveune
06:44 magnuse       looks like there is a problem with debian.koha-community.org too
06:44 petter        Hi koha folks!
06:45 magnuse       hei petter
06:45 magnuse       i would guess eythian is involved with that
06:46 magnuse       mtj: could you get on your bike and find eythian and give him a kick? ;-)
06:57 alex_a        bonjour
07:00 magnuse       bonjour alex_a
07:00 alex_a        hello magnuse
07:10 ashimema      I'd be game for a discourse play ;)
07:19 magnuse       just need a volunteer to set it up and host it, then
07:23 * Oak         waves
07:24 Oak           magnuse
07:25 magnuse       Oak
07:26 Oak           :)
07:26 magnuse       :-)
07:29 gaetan_B      hello
07:41 ashimema      I have a feeling my current dev is going to be a bit bold for Koha ;)
07:43 ashimema      ILL (Inter Library Loans).. with a fairly chunky amount of the code based on khalls Koha::Object classes, pianohackers Koha::Service object (which no-one out there has really seen yet) and the addition of AngularJS for the client side interface.  Might get some people thinking though :)
07:43 magnuse       sounds cool!
07:44 magnuse       how far along are you? i'll be working on ill in 2015 :-)
07:44 ashimema      I've learnt allot lately working on another project (Mojo, AngularJS and Bootstrap based).. i've brought a few of them to the table with this piece.
07:45 ashimema      put it this way magnuse.. I need somthing to show the boss by the end of the week.. we're on a sprint here with Colin working on British Library API integration and Alex working on the data storage and configuration side..
07:45 ashimema      so with the three of us hacking at it.. it's going reasonably well ;)
07:46 ashimema      We also did allot of work first time around using ARTemail as the interface.. but we've basically ditched that with the British Libraries move to a reasonable decent API instead
07:47 ashimema      The real far future aim I'd like to see.. is for our dev to go a bit further and allow Koha to do both sides and act as a service provider implimenting most fo the BL api the other way around..
07:47 ashimema      but for this sprint we're just aiming for making requests to BL.. not supplying ;)
07:49 magnuse       cool
07:49 magnuse       are you thinking about facilitating other protocols/apis? in norway we will be basing ill on ncip
07:49 ashimema      random interface question.. with Angular you can obviously affect dom with immediate effect without requiring a page reload.. so I have an option when adding a request.. to immediately add said request to the visible requests table, then highlight it and remove it if there's a failure between the client and the server.. or the other way around.. only adding to the user interface once the 'ok' signal has made it's way back from
07:49 ashimema      the server.
07:49 wahanui       i heard the server was behind a Firewall and Reverse Proxy
07:50 ashimema      Well.. the way we've implimented it.. it should be trivial to write an api specific driver to plugin to it I think..
07:50 ashimema      that's the bit alex has been working on..
07:50 magnuse       very cool
07:51 ashimema      a server side user configuration to map api calls to koha classes and results.
07:51 ashimema      but it's all rather BL api specific at the moment in terms of whats actually visible..
07:51 ashimema      code wise.
07:51 magnuse       yay. i have no time for it now, but ill will be one of my main concerns in 2015
07:52 ashimema      but yeah.. the idea would be that using this config file.. you can effectively map in one place and then have all the data dynamically added to display using said mapping.
07:52 ashimema      it's the process that may need some tinkering with.. if the process is entirely different that could lead to some interesting challenges ;)
07:53 ashimema      But then.. BL's process is pretty all encompassing.. so hopefully pretty much all others would fit within it somewhere ;)
08:26 Oak           [off] http://pando.com/2014/10/18/gms-hit-and-run-how-a-lawyer-mechanic-and-engineer-blew-the-lid-off-the-worst-auto-scandal-in-history/ stay safe on roads guys.
08:48 magnuse       kia ora paul_p
08:48 paul_p        hi magnuse (& others)
08:49 petter        Are there any mirrors of debian.koha-community.org? Has been down for a while
08:59 magnuse       petter: i don't think there are any, alas
09:00 petter        magnuse: ok, thanks!
09:07 * cait        waves
09:19 * magnuse     waves back
09:20 magnuse       ping papa?
09:21 papa          pong
09:22 papa          magnuse: you have 5 mins left, I was on my way out... :)
09:24 magnuse       papa: yay! you don't happen to be able to kick http://debian.koha-community.org/ ? it's been down for a while
09:24 magnuse       or unavailable, at least
09:30 papa          umm, no I'm afraid, that's way out of my jurisdiction
09:30 magnuse       ah, no worries! eythian is the one we need, probably?
09:31 papa          ashamed to admit, but don't know. it is possible though. I'll ask him and Chris tomorrow
09:32 magnuse       excellent! now be on your way ;-)
09:32 papa          sure, have a great day :)
09:38 magnuse       guess it's getting too late to catch rangi too...
10:36 cait          gmcharlt: ping
10:46 dexap         huh. "perl translate help" dumps the whole translate file contents on the screen
10:51 paxed         ...and the wiki is down?
10:52 magnuse       yup
10:53 magnuse       paxed: i get a nice help page when i do "perl translate help"
11:21 ashimema      quiet in here today..
11:28 paxed         weird.
11:43 Oak           la la lala
11:43 Oak           there you go. bit of noice.
12:10 tcohen        morning!
12:22 magnuse       ¡hola tcohen!
12:22 tcohen        hola magnuse
12:22 magnuse       tcohen: can yo uget to the wiki?
12:22 tcohen        nope
12:23 magnuse       we need to gang up on the first bywaterian to wake up, then, i think? ;-)
12:24 tcohen        i wanted to post my photos and cannot login
12:24 tcohen        maybe biblibre? i'm not sure who hosts it
12:24 tcohen        magnuse: about bug 12750
12:24 huginn        04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=12750 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, tomascohen, Needs Signoff , koha-create should be able to configure SRU server for the created instance
12:25 tcohen        do u think koha-sru --enable|--disable is needed?
12:28 magnuse       tcohen: dunno. my thought was that a separate script would be more flexible - make it possible to turn the public server off and on after the instance has been created
12:29 magnuse       also, i think koha-create is quite big already - the less we add to it the better  (as long as it fits into a separate script, of course)
12:35 tcohen        adding switches cannot be avoided I think
12:35 tcohen        i'll think of it
12:35 tcohen        but i've already packaged several functions into a bashlib
12:40 edveal        Is there a Koha meeting soon?
12:46 barton        anyone else having trouble getting to http://wiki.koha-community.org/ ?
12:47 edveal        Yes. I can’t get there either.
12:49 barton        yeah. downforeveryoneojustme.com couldn't see it either.
12:50 barton        morning oleonard!
12:50 oleonard      Hi
12:50 wahanui       hola, oleonard
12:51 edveal        Hello olenard and wahanui
13:05 edveal        Is the Koha meeting starting?
13:05 khall         I thought that was tomorrow?
13:05 khall         The next Koha General IRC meeting is 22 October, 13:00 UTC
13:05 edveal        Ah great. Thanks khall.
13:05 khall         np!
13:11 oleonard      wiki down.
13:11 magnuse       and we can't check the wiki to see who is responsible...
13:12 magnuse       is it bywater?
13:12 * magnuse     gotta run
13:15 ashimema      equinox I tihnk.
13:15 ashimema      it's gmcharlts area I beleive
13:22 talljoy       good day #koha
13:35 talljoy       who hosts wiki.koha-community.org?
13:35 talljoy       needs kicking.  not coming up for me.
13:39 oleonard      gmcharlt?
13:39 wahanui       gmcharlt is probably an expert in all things library technology.
13:57 tcohen        still 6:57 in seattle
14:00 oleonard      Surely one of those cats would have woken him up by now!
14:03 talljoy       lol
14:03 talljoy       you would think so!
14:21 cait          sql-- today
14:21 cait          i need to see all borrowers of type x and see if they have a book x (full list of borrowers, null or barcode for those which have it checked out) and i fail
14:35 talljoy       is it a darmduscher today cait?
14:36 talljoy       poor sql.
14:37 talljoy       are you looking for one specific book that is checked out?  or checked out in the past?
14:38 cait          lol
14:39 cait          talljoy: i got it now :)
14:39 talljoy       good!
14:39 cait          using a left join (select ....)
14:39 cait          it's for a school
14:39 talljoy       yes sounds about right
14:39 cait          a complete list of the class and a column where they can see if they have checked out the specific book they are supposed to read yet
14:39 talljoy       gotcha!
14:40 cait          glad it's working now sql++
14:59 * tcohen      hates side-effects
15:00 cait          tcohen: what's the side effect?
15:01 tcohen        i'm trying to write tests for the facets retrieval code
15:01 tcohen        and it seems that on GRS-1, some stuff depends on side-effects to work
15:08 gmcharlt      wiki rebooted, sorry for the downtime
15:08 gmcharlt      looks like crawler at first glance
15:08 cait          tcohen: not so surprised...
15:09 talljoyphone  thanks gmcharlt
15:10 cait          gmcharlt++
15:18 druthb        gmcharlt++
15:26 oleonard      I did not know you could use the template name in the way the patch for Bug 13112 does
15:26 huginn        04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=13112 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, veron, Needs Signoff , Add name of template file in html comment for each '.tt' file.
15:26 ashimema      we've been having a mare with crawlers today.
15:27 oleonard      I wonder if there is any reason not to check template name in an include to determine what page one is on
15:27 oleonard      (that is, what page the include file is being included by)
15:28 oleonard      ...as opposed to setting a variable in the script and checking that, like we do with the OPAC's usermenu.inc
15:40 magnuse       gmcharlt++
15:58 oleonard      My bug fix has feature-creeped.
15:58 oleonard      Feature-crept?
16:03 * oleonard    runs into Bug 12585 again
16:03 huginn        04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=12585 major, P5 - low, ---, gmcharlt, In Discussion , Tag searching broken if QueryParser is turned on
16:03 cait          sounds painful
16:03 cait          ok, leaving for today - cya later all :)
16:14 gaetan_B      bye
16:33 oleonard      If you want to set  OPACXSLTResultsDisplay to a path (not a full URL) what is it relative to? For instance, what would the correct path be for the default MARC21slim2OPACResults.xsl?
16:37 reiveune      bye
16:46 oleonard      Figured it out. Full system path, not relative to the site root or something like that.
17:02 tcohen        oleonard: did u find a way to reproduce it?
17:03 oleonard      tcohen: I don't really know how to go about finding out why it happens for me but not for you
17:07 tcohen        oleonard: but the steps to reproduce are just enabling queryparser?
17:08 oleonard      Well, I get the error if QueryParser is on. I don't get the error if QueryParser is off. But I suppose it could be a combination of QueryParser and other preferences as well.
17:16 tcohen        what bothers me, is that if QueryParser has problems loading the file, it silently falls back to no-QueryParser
17:20 tcohen        oleonard: i'll try to reproduce
17:20 tcohen        again
17:29 cait          oleonard++ :)
17:29 cait          lots of new patches? :)
18:11 oleonard      It started with Bug 13083 and I just kept seeing more things to fix
18:11 huginn        04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=13083 minor, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, Needs Signoff , Hard-coded " by " in opac-tags.pl
18:15 cait          wow
18:15 cait          super stormy outside
18:15 cait          @wunder Konstanz
18:15 huginn        cait: The current temperature in Konstanz, Germany is 16.0°C (8:00 PM CEST on October 21, 2014). Conditions: Thunderstorms and Rain. Humidity: 60%. Dew Point: 10.0°C. Pressure: 29.70 in 1006 hPa (Falling).
18:17 druthb        @wunder 77098
18:17 huginn        druthb: The current temperature in WEST UNIVERSITY, HOUSTON, Texas is 26.2°C (1:16 PM CDT on October 21, 2014). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 41%. Dew Point: 12.0°C. Pressure: 30.01 in 1016 hPa (Steady).
18:18 tcohen        @wunder cordoba, argentina
18:18 huginn        tcohen: The current temperature in Bo Alto de San Martin, Cordoba City, Argentina is 35.6°C (3:05 PM ART on October 21, 2014). Conditions: Scattered Clouds. Humidity: 32%. Dew Point: 16.0°C. Pressure: 30.01 in 1016 hPa (Falling).
18:19 oleonard      Wow tcohen, hot!
18:19 oleonard      @wunder 45701
18:19 huginn        oleonard: The current temperature in Whitlind Woods, Athens, Ohio is 11.2°C (2:18 PM EDT on October 21, 2014). Conditions: Overcast. Humidity: 87%. Dew Point: 9.0°C. Pressure: 29.98 in 1015 hPa (Falling).
18:19 magnuse       @wunder boo
18:19 huginn        magnuse: The current temperature in Bodo Vi, Norway is 4.0°C (8:00 PM CEST on October 21, 2014). Conditions: Partly Cloudy. Humidity: 49%. Dew Point: -3.0°C. Pressure: 29.69 in 1005 hPa (Rising).
18:21 druthb        brr
18:24 tcohen        oleonard: they say it will be worse tomorrow
18:24 * tcohen      hopes that air conditioner gets installed at home soon
18:24 talljoy       tcohen that sounds like a good temp to me!  like Texas weather
18:25 talljoy       @wunder 76109
18:25 huginn        talljoy: The current temperature in Tanglewood, Fort Worth, Texas is 25.2°C (1:21 PM CDT on October 21, 2014). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 54%. Dew Point: 15.0°C. Pressure: 30.07 in 1018 hPa (Falling).
18:25 talljoy       we're going down because of fall.  sigh.
18:25 talljoy       :-(
18:27 tcohen        talljoy: saw you had a fernet night
18:27 tcohen        was it good?
18:27 talljoy       it was very good.  just like in Cordoba
18:32 tcohen        #koha: is the wiki still in trouble? would like to add our KohaCon14 photos
18:34 magnuse       tcohen: works for me
18:34 oleonard      And me
18:36 magnuse       hah! lonely planet says northern norway is the 5th best region in the world to visit :-)
18:36 tcohen        it works, but i cannot login
18:36 tcohen        i mean, edit
18:38 magnuse       hm, same for me akshuly. when i click on "edit" nothing happens
18:44 * oleonard    has another patch to submit but is tired of writing test plans
18:44 tcohen        magnuse: http://snag.gy/hgA6Q.jpg
18:50 magnuse       tcohen: my spanish is not quite up to that level, but yeah, i can't get to edit it either
18:51 magnuse       methinks we might have to summon forth gmcharlt again
18:55 oleonard      But we just cleaned up after the last time! Fine, I'll get the candles and the goat.
18:56 tcohen        oleonard: i already got a goat
18:56 tcohen        bring the knife
18:57 cait          tcohen: maybe i prefer the thunder storms here to 35 degrees...
18:57 cait          oleonard: lol
18:57 tcohen        sshhh, we are in the middle of a summoning
18:58 * cait        shuts up
18:59 jcamins       cait: now look what you did. You summoned chris_n instead of gmcharlt, and chris_n doesn't have shell access to the wiki.
18:59 * cait        goes to stand in the corner
18:59 * cait        yells - we need another timmy
18:59 cait          um .. goat
19:00 oleonard      Good luck #koha. I'm leaving before it gets messy!
19:00 * chris_n     steps out of the woodwork
19:02 cait          hola chris_n
19:02 chris_n       heya cait
19:03 * gmcharlt    is tied up in conf call, will check in a bit
19:03 magnuse       a conf call - is that like purgatory?
19:03 cait          heh
19:04 cait          probably
19:04 cait          :)
19:05 magnuse       from whence spirits can be summoned with candles and goats...
19:06 tcohen        maybe a dark Nick Cave background song too
19:07 cait          [off] we need another timmy - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MM1S27fPUQY
19:10 talljoy       hahaha cait.  love it.
19:11 cait          :)
19:12 jenkins_koha  Yippee, build fixed!
19:12 wahanui       o/ '`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`
19:12 jenkins_koha  Project Koha_Master_U14 build #176: FIXED in 44 min: http://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_Master_U14/176/
19:14 magnuse       confetti!
19:14 wahanui       well, confetti is http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lpm3j6aNaN1qh8hleo1_400.gif
19:19 jenkins_koha  Project Koha_Master_D7 build #190: STILL FAILING in 2 min 10 sec: http://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_Master_D7/190/
19:19 jenkins_koha  * Marc Veron: Bug 12914 - Wrong message 'Patron(..) is blocked for 2014-09-30 day(s).
19:19 jenkins_koha  * Bernardo Gonzalez Kriegel: Bug 12068 - label-create-pdf.pl Add support for RTL language
19:19 jenkins_koha  * Owen Leonard: Bug 10960 - Holds Queue Report display loc code not description
19:19 huginn        04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=12914 minor, P5 - low, ---, veron, Pushed to Master , Wrong message 'Patron(..) is blocked for 2014-09-30 day(s).
19:19 huginn        04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=12068 normal, P5 - low, ---, bgkriegel, Pushed to Master , label-create-pdf.pl Add support for RTL languages
19:19 huginn        04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10960 normal, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, Pushed to Master , Holds Queue Report display loc code not description
19:24 huginn        New commit(s) kohagit: Bug 10960 - Holds Queue Report display loc code not description <http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=commitdiff;h=01c509f37d06a25aa4409ad2cd05cb67eee73f77> / Bug 12068 - label-create-pdf.pl Add support for RTL language <http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=commitdiff;h=0ac72275aac8a2d0511b021cee0643aa38a7ba09> / Bug 12914 - Wrong message 'Patron(..) is blocked for 2014-09-30 day(s). <http://git.
20:05 jenkins_koha  Project Koha_Master_D7 build #191: NOW UNSTABLE in 40 min: http://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_Master_D7/191/
20:17 rangi         oh yes i did
20:20 cait          rangi:  hm?
20:21 rangi         mailing list
20:21 wahanui       mailing list is, like, at http://koha-community.org/support/koha-mailing-lists/
20:21 pianohacker   hello
20:21 rangi         heya pianohacker
20:21 wahanui       pianohacker is a Dune fan, it seems.
20:21 mtj           thats some classic cormack
20:22 rangi         :)
20:22 talljoy       omg pianohacker is that really you?
20:22 cait          i think something got stuck in my spam filter again
20:22 pianohacker   talljoy: I return from the abyss!
20:22 * talljoy     whacks cait on the back
20:22 talljoy       did that dislodge it?
20:23 jenkins_koha  Yippee, build fixed!
20:23 wahanui       o/ '`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`
20:23 jenkins_koha  Project Koha_Master_U12 build #194: FIXED in 59 min: http://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_Master_U12/194/
20:23 jenkins_koha  * Marc Veron: Bug 12914 - Wrong message 'Patron(..) is blocked for 2014-09-30 day(s).
20:23 jenkins_koha  * Bernardo Gonzalez Kriegel: Bug 12068 - label-create-pdf.pl Add support for RTL language
20:23 jenkins_koha  * Owen Leonard: Bug 10960 - Holds Queue Report display loc code not description
20:23 huginn        04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=12914 minor, P5 - low, ---, veron, Pushed to Master , Wrong message 'Patron(..) is blocked for 2014-09-30 day(s).
20:23 pianohacker   how are you, talljoy? recovered from vacation?
20:23 huginn        04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=12068 normal, P5 - low, ---, bgkriegel, Pushed to Master , label-create-pdf.pl Add support for RTL languages
20:23 huginn        04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10960 normal, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, Pushed to Master , Holds Queue Report display loc code not description
20:23 pianohacker   *working vacation ;)
20:24 talljoy       bah.  nonstop work.
20:24 cait          talljoy: yp found it ;)
20:24 talljoy       pianohacker: it was the flights there and back that need recovering from.
20:24 ashimema      ooh.. pianohacker is around
20:25 talljoy       duck and run pianohacker
20:25 pianohacker   *BZRRT* This has been an automated message from pianobot. If this were a real message from pianohacker, you would now be receiving sarcasm. *BEEEEEEEP*
20:26 jenkins_koha  Yippee, build fixed!
20:26 wahanui       o/ '`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`
20:26 jenkins_koha  Project Koha_Master_U12_MariaDB build #122: FIXED in 58 min: http://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_Master_U12_MariaDB/122/
20:26 jenkins_koha  * Marc Veron: Bug 12914 - Wrong message 'Patron(..) is blocked for 2014-09-30 day(s).
20:26 jenkins_koha  * Bernardo Gonzalez Kriegel: Bug 12068 - label-create-pdf.pl Add support for RTL language
20:26 jenkins_koha  * Owen Leonard: Bug 10960 - Holds Queue Report display loc code not description
20:26 ashimema      :P
20:26 pianohacker   anyway, hi ashimema
20:26 talljoy       lol
20:27 ashimema      been playing with your Services stuff ;)
20:27 talljoy       wiki still down?
20:27 ashimema      tis nice
20:27 talljoy       or down again?
20:27 pianohacker   glad to hear.
20:27 pianohacker   any major quibbles with the API?
20:29 ashimema      not really.. seems to work nice (though I am hoping to get TO_JSON methods added tot he Koha::Object base classes as then it'll work muhc mroe nicely with them ;) )
20:29 pianohacker   ooh! That'd quite nice
20:29 ashimema      I have doctored the output routine in Koha::Service a tiny bit..
20:29 pianohacker   JSONification of anything but base types is a bit of a hack atm
20:29 pianohacker   ashimema: what change did you make?
20:30 ashimema      You had JSON->new->convert_blessed->encode
20:30 ashimema      I found it'd only work with
20:30 talljoy       gmcharlt i'm guessing your cats are playing with computer cables and taking out the wiki?  :-)
20:30 gmcharlt      xcache is not playing nice
20:30 ashimema      JSON->new->allow_blessed(1)->convert_blessed(1)->encode
20:30 gmcharlt      I'm now threatening to toss it into the kibble dish
20:30 ashimema      but I may well have been using it wrong.. wasn't exactly sure how you intended to use it.
20:31 talljoy       gmcharlt dooeet.
20:32 ashimema      but yeah.. I found that allowing blessed and conveting them seemed to do the trick pretty 'magically' in most cases..
20:32 ashimema      just need to add those TO_JSON methods to the 'clever' object when we need them ;)
20:32 cait          ashimema: what about you qa the wiating holds queue patch? :P
20:32 * cait        tries that delegating thing heh
20:33 ashimema      bug number ciat ;)
20:33 cait          but it seems like many people like it
20:33 ashimema      oh.. that one.. ;)
20:33 cait          so we should just go with it
20:33 pianohacker   ashimema: That seems reasonable enough. I think my only reason for not having allow_blessed enabled was to make sure that one didn't accidentally send something sensitive or gigantic back to the user, but if that causes more problems than it solves in practice go for it
20:33 ashimema      yeah.. I should probably get on and qa it
20:34 ashimema      I'de held off untll i'de really got my head around the objects.. but I think i'm there now ;)
20:34 cait          probably omre then me
20:34 cait          :)
20:34 ashimema      I think I foud that convert_blessed didn't do anything unless you allowed blessed first ?
20:34 ashimema      hense my confusion to start with.. but I do understand your reasoning..
20:35 cait          hmpf
20:35 cait          some RM wanted this patch asap... but the test plan reads:
20:35 ashimema      I have a love hate relationship with the Objects cait..
20:35 cait          Test Plan: 1) Wait until Sunday
20:35 talljoy       HA
20:35 ashimema      haha.. nice test plan
20:35 talljoy       is step 2) Drink copious amounts of Beer.
20:35 ashimema      think I have the same love/hate relationship with them that khall has now..
20:36 rangi         joubu and I did some work with the objects, they have some bugs, and i dont like them, but i dont hate them enough to block it
20:36 talljoy       3) say, "whatever" and pass it anyways
20:36 pianohacker   ashimema: my understanding from the docs was that convert_blessed only converted objects that had an explicit TO_JSON method, whereas allow_blessed would attempt to convert everything, using a TO_JSON if it existed
20:36 rangi         the autoload for creating accessors is broken
20:36 ashimema      dbic still offers us a massive amout which koha::objects obliterate in their current standings
20:36 cait          bug 13115 btw
20:36 huginn        04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=13115 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, gmcharlt, Signed Off , Holidays.t will fail some unit tests on Sundays
20:36 rangi         not really, they are still dbic under the hood, its not removing anything
20:37 ashimema      but with our basic hatred of using dbic properly I'm clucking at having object to allow us at least some of the niceities
20:37 rangi         its just providing a consistent interface
20:37 rangi         because not everything is in a db
20:37 rangi         logical representation of objects should not be tied to their storage representation
20:37 rangi         compsci 101
20:37 cait          :)
20:38 ashimema      indeed..
20:38 cait          so we can mix in yaml and stuff like that?
20:38 rangi         and conf
20:38 rangi         and stuff in cache
20:38 ashimema      agreed, i'm liking the consistency it would hopefully bring.. though of course the same consistency could be achieved with some rules..
20:38 rangi         and stuff from external sources
20:38 ashimema      ->get_columns for example is list when you use koha::objects
20:39 ashimema      and some other nice accessors dbic provides
20:39 rangi         yep
20:39 ashimema      indeed..
20:39 rangi         like i say, the objects have some major bugs
20:39 ashimema      my ill work does exactly that..
20:39 rangi         but they are an ok start and can be extended
20:40 ashimema      we have a config object with the same general accessor pattern that utilises yaml as the storage medium.. and an api object that similarly has the same general accessor pattern that obviosly queries an api
20:40 rangi         personally my inclination would be just to have Koha::Borrowers etc .. which is a class accessor base and uses koha::database and koha::cache
20:40 rangi         but in the interests of moving forward, i can live with Koha::Object
20:40 ashimema      so in our work we have db, api and congif files.. all feeling 'nice' to access in a standardised way..
20:41 rangi         yep
20:41 ashimema      think we basically agree rangi :). not the best approach.. but at least it's moving forward
20:42 rangi         yep
20:42 rangi         so we get to the point were we have a 3 line .pl
20:42 rangi         and the rest is in the templates, and the modules
20:42 rangi         thats where im hoping we get to :)
20:43 gmcharlt      wiki is happier now
20:43 ashimema      that's exactly where I'm aiming
20:43 ashimema      rangi.. you should play with pianohackers Service work.. that's really nice too..
20:43 rangi         yep, ive been keeping an eye on it
20:44 ashimema      leads to a prett nice abstraction exactly like that.. the svc/*.pl turn into tiny little 3 liners ;)
20:44 rangi         yup :)
20:44 ashimema      pianohacker.. I'm probably gonna mostly run with that like I did with shib btw.. attributing to you.. but really pushing it through if you end up slacking ;)
20:45 ashimema      I want angular in koha ;)
20:45 ashimema      and I now hav a beautiful example of it :)_
20:45 rangi         just make sure it passes the accessibility tests, and it'll go in fine ashimema
20:45 rangi         (we have quite a few blind librarians around the world using Koha now)
20:45 pianohacker   translation is another concern, no?
20:45 rangi         that too
20:45 rangi         but i think they are both solvable
20:45 pianohacker   That's one reason I've been putting off submitting it
20:46 pianohacker   ashimema: that's understandable, especially at the moment.
20:46 ashimema      yeah.. I'm still getting my head around accessability and translation with angular..
20:46 rangi         ashimema: we have a blind staff member who is our accessibility expert, helped write the nz govt guidelines, so we can get him to test stuff
20:47 ashimema      I'm pretty confident there are ways to make it nice.. but I've not delved far enough into that area yet..
20:47 ashimema      ooh.. cool
20:47 ashimema      might be asking for their help in testing when it comes to it ;)
20:47 rangi         on the fly translation, in the browser, is probably doable now with modern computers
20:48 rangi         there is angular-gettext
20:48 rangi         which can handle .po files
20:48 ashimema      well in the work i'm doing so far translation should be pretty trivial..
20:48 rangi         https://angular-gettext.rocketeer.be/
20:48 ashimema      it's the accessability i'm far less sure about.. I've not played enough into screen readers and the like yet.
20:48 cait          i have a library i can maybe ask to test something too - if it can run on a sandbox
20:48 rangi         if we do something like this, then the translators dont have to learn a new way to translate
20:49 ashimema      ooh.. cool.
20:49 ashimema      thanks for that heads up rangi :)
20:49 pianohacker   rangi: out of curiosity, what are the major reasons to do that as opposed to something like what we did for the .pref files?
20:49 * cait        loves to see conversations like that on #koha
20:49 cait          make it happen! :)
20:50 rangi         we use po stuff for the pref files too
20:50 ashimema      :)
20:51 ashimema      ngAria.. seems to be all about accessibility.. that's promising.
20:51 pianohacker   rangi: right, but then the usual process is applied to create translated .pref files as opposed to doing the translation at runtime, correct?
20:51 rangi         yep
20:51 * pianohacker hasn't touched that code in a few years, so apologies if he's off base
20:51 rangi         cos they are just .tt files
20:51 pianohacker   they're not still YAML?
20:51 rangi         but if we doing fancy stuff in angular, be kinda cool to just use the .po files and translate on the fly
20:52 rangi         hmm they might be actually
20:52 rangi         either way, they are static, and depend on you creating the templates
20:53 pianohacker   okay, just curious. Would we be splitting up .po's so the browser doesn't have to load the entire .po for a given language to translate a single page?
20:53 rangi         exactly
20:53 ashimema      I'm using similar for a yaml based config file for ILL ;)
20:53 pianohacker   okay, makes sense, thanks
20:53 ashimema      but that mostly due to having such a config file..
20:53 rangi         in theory anyway, id have to test it to see if it was useful
20:53 rangi         that would also make for easier contextual translating too .. in theory
20:53 ashimema      for other angular stuff I have no reason against using something at browser level
20:53 pianohacker   ooh, yeah.
20:53 rangi         next step
20:53 wahanui       i think next step is to send it to the patches mailing list
20:53 rangi         click on the word that is wrong, and submit a better translation .. in the browser :)
20:54 pianohacker   the main reason I ask is because rancor is loading about a MB of JSON for the framework, and that's a major pain point
20:54 pianohacker   but that  sounds really cool
20:55 ashimema      I've been wanting to hack the .po's into more managable chunks for a while..
20:55 ashimema      and yeah.. sending thme to the browser is a really good reason to do it.
20:55 ashimema      an MB of JSON for the frameworks..
20:55 ashimema      dang!
20:55 rangi         ashimema: talk to bgkriegel he has been doing lots of improvements
20:55 ashimema      :)
20:56 ashimema      I have to have somthing to show to the boss by the end of the week.. prototyping still..
20:56 pianohacker   yeah, it's a very simple-minded array of hashes for every single tag/subfield, so it could be optimized. I'm going to try gzipping it and see if that helps first though
20:56 ashimema      but after that the aim is to refine the code with all these things in mind
20:57 ashimema      mimify and gzip it.. thats certainly a start.. (and set a really long cache timeout)
20:57 ashimema      are you loading the whole set of frameworks in one hit.. or loading individual frameworks on the fly when needed?
20:58 pianohacker   ashimema: individual frameworks... it only supports the default framework atm, in fact
20:58 ashimema      what's driving rancor mate.. i don't remember seeing angular in there?
20:58 ashimema      damn.. 1MB for one framework.. that's huge!
20:58 ashimema      never would have guessed they were that large
20:58 pianohacker   ashimema: no, it's jQuery and lots of manual monkeying around. Really wish I had angular
20:59 ashimema      lol.. I can see why it's taking it's time then mate ;)
20:59 pianohacker   yeah...
20:59 ashimema      angular is lovely to work with.. has it's oddities.. but the ease with which it allows you to separate concerns is uber awesome.
20:59 pianohacker   that plus school/teaching/research/club/reddit
20:59 pianohacker   god yes
21:00 ashimema      you using require.js or anything.. or just loaidng the entire stack in one iht?
21:00 pianohacker   wait, is bag around?
21:00 pianohacker   *that plus school/teaching/research/club
21:00 pianohacker   ashimema: Definitely require.js, I've separated out as much as I can into modules
21:00 ashimema      cool, cool..
21:01 ashimema      that's the last piece of the puzzle I need to get my had around..
21:01 pianohacker   the UI is still one huge chunk though, as separating anything with translatable strings out is a pain with our current setup
21:01 ashimema      using require.js with angular
21:01 pianohacker   ^ would also be easier with angular
21:01 ashimema      so i've heard..
21:01 pianohacker   yeah, I whine about that a lot
21:01 ashimema      just not tried yet.. not really played with require at all..
21:02 ashimema      only angular dependency injection.. but that works very differently really.. still loads all at once.
21:02 pianohacker   yeah
21:04 ashimema      right.. I must go to bed.. got a long drive too early tommorrow morning..
21:04 ashimema      night peeps
21:04 pianohacker   night ashimema
22:03 eythian       hi
22:05 wizzyrea      hello
22:09 cait          hola eythian
22:14 eythian       hi there cait
22:14 cait          hi eythian
23:54 tcohen        hi
23:56 rangi         hey tcohen
23:59 tcohen        hi
23:59 wahanui       kia ora, tcohen