Time  Nick          Message
00:16 dcook         I can never remember which bugs bgkriegel opened for the marc framework updates...
00:16 dcook         bug 5858
00:16 huginn`       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=5858 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, bgkriegel, Pushed to Stable , Update default MARC21 framework to Update No. 16 (April 2013)
00:16 dcook         bug 9826
00:17 huginn`       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=9826 normal, P5 - low, ---, bgkriegel, Pushed to Stable , Missing fields in MARC21 authority framework
00:26 dcook         rangi: You about?
00:26 dcook         Actually, I'll ask this as an open question...
00:27 dcook         Is it possible to import "marc21_framework_DEFAULT.sql" into any framework or just into the default framework, when imported via the GUI?
00:27 dcook         Since the SQL itself is hardedcoded just for the default framework..
00:33 wizzyrea      if what you are trying to do is duplicate the default framework so you can do awful thigns to it, I might suggest exporting the default framework, then reimporting that export file
00:33 wizzyrea      onto another framework you've created
00:33 dcook         I'm thinking of importing the "marc21_framework_DEFAULT.sql" as another framework
00:33 wizzyrea      then yea, export -> import
00:34 * dcook       should've read your comment before replying, lol
00:34 wizzyrea      preferably from a default framework you haven't modified yet :)
00:34 dcook         Mmm, but my question is...how does it work?
00:35 dcook         If you're using an SQL file, it explicitly mentioned the framework code ''
00:35 wizzyrea      I haven't ever had a problem with importing one
00:35 dcook         Maybe when you export from the GUI, it uses columns and doesn't reference the frameworkcode at all then
00:35 dcook         That would make sense..
00:35 * dcook       takes a look at the export
00:36 wizzyrea      I haven't ever tried to do it from the included sql files, I always just export/import/modify
00:36 dcook         Huh...nope...it still has the frameworkcode ''..
00:36 dcook         What format do you use?
00:36 wizzyrea      sql usually
00:38 dcook         Whoa...fancy black magic...
00:38 jcamins       The time has come to make a half-batch of gluten-free dessert.
00:38 dcook         GF \p/
00:38 dcook         Errr \o/
00:38 jcamins       What variety?
00:39 dcook         Delicious?
00:39 jcamins       Hehe.
00:39 jcamins       Probably cookies.
00:39 jcamins       But that doesn't narrow it down much.
00:39 wizzyrea      almond coconut macaroons
00:39 dcook         You can tell I'm only the prep cook in our kitchen..
00:39 wizzyrea      with apricots.
00:39 wizzyrea      chocolate coated if you're feeling fancy
00:39 jcamins       Nah, macaroons I actually don't have to worry about.
00:39 jcamins       My guest is providing macaroons.
00:39 dcook         "_parseSQLLine" ftw
00:40 wizzyrea      macaroOns or macarons?
00:40 jcamins       macaroOns.
00:40 wahanui       macaroons are tasty, but slightly less than cohesive.
00:41 jcamins       Hey, I think I may have been the one who said that.
00:41 wizzyrea      :)
00:42 wizzyrea      http://www.yummly.com/recipe/Raw-vegan-coconut-macaroons-329371?columns=6&position=16%2F47 < vaguely what I'm thinking of
00:42 jcamins       I should probably do something very simple, since what I want is to figure out whether I like this flour mixture.
00:42 dcook         marc history?
00:42 dcook         marc status?
00:42 dcook         marc status is http://www.loc.gov/marc/status.html
00:43 dcook         Oh..
00:43 jcamins       What flour mixture you ask?
00:43 jcamins       This is a good question.
00:43 dcook         wizzyrea: Could you do that for me?
00:43 dcook         I always forget that link, but it's a handy one
00:43 jcamins       Once I work that out, though, I'll need to test it.
00:43 jcamins       marc status?
00:43 wahanui       marc status is http://www.loc.gov/marc/status.html
00:43 jcamins       ^^ it worked. wahanui remembers all
00:44 wizzyrea      he doesn't always answer when he learns something
00:44 dcook         Mmm
00:44 dcook         marc history is http://www.loc.gov/marc/status.html
00:44 dcook         marc history?
00:44 wahanui       marc history is, like, http://www.loc.gov/marc/status.html
00:44 dcook         sweeet
00:45 jcamins       How much sugar should I put in?
00:46 jcamins       Crowd-sourced gluten free cookies! Yay!
00:46 dcook         Ahhh, wizzyrea's already posted a new RDA framework up on the wiki
00:46 dcook         All the sugar!
00:46 wizzyrea      >.>
00:46 wizzyrea      <.<
00:46 wizzyrea      you'll want to check it though
00:46 dcook         Dinger, I was hoping to drop it there :p
00:47 wizzyrea      well yours might be better, who knows
00:47 dcook         Oh, I don't have one really
00:47 dcook         Well, maybe one or two, but I haven't used them in a while
00:47 * wizzyrea    just added the 264 + subfields
00:47 dcook         Ahhh
00:48 wizzyrea      on top of the 7xx ones that rangi added
00:48 dcook         In that case, I might have a better one somewhere..
00:48 dcook         I can't remember what else the RDA framework was missing but it was missing something other than the 264..
00:49 wizzyrea      i had a cursory look, I didn't see anything else that was obviously missing
00:49 jcamins       A good raison d'être?
00:49 wizzyrea      but omitting the 264 was a bit of an oversight
00:50 jcamins       Not nearly so much as failing to come up with a good reason for the new "framework" in the first place.
00:50 wizzyrea      but no biggie as things are meant to be iteratd
00:50 dcook         iteration! :D
00:50 * wizzyrea    only desires to make librarians not say "Koha doesn't support RDA" which would be a lie.
00:50 dcook         Agreed
00:51 dcook         Frameworks + XSLT. Done
00:51 dcook         Well...
00:51 jcamins       I don't know, iteration seems kind of pointless... after all, we don't need a purse made out of a sow's ear, no matter how well-shined it is. :P
00:51 wizzyrea      now displaying and doing stuff with those fields... that's different
00:51 dcook         We could possibly do more with indexing now...but...
00:51 dcook         wizzyrea: True.
00:51 * dcook       says imitating that wassup ad from the other day.
00:51 wizzyrea      I didn't say we had perfect support. But we can at least ingest and store RDA
00:52 dcook         jcamins: Sow's ear?
00:52 dcook         wizzyrea: No one offers perfect support though. Hence iterative design :)
00:52 jcamins       dcook: "you can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear."
00:52 wizzyrea      he's saying that we shouldn't have to support RDA at all because it's a stupid thing
00:53 wizzyrea      which I agree with, generally
00:53 dcook         Well...
00:54 wizzyrea      but at the risk of alienating our client base - it's rather better to at least appear to give a damn about their standards. Even while advocating for better ones.
00:54 dcook         I suppose that's the thing, eh?
00:54 dcook         It might be a silly standard, but it's a standard.
00:54 wizzyrea      tis a very fine line
00:54 dcook         So we need to support that standard, while advocating change.
00:55 dcook         It's like the IE thing.
00:55 dcook         I would never use IE, but the fact that lots of our clients are forced to makes me really want to support it.
00:55 wizzyrea      well what we really need, is for people who do data to be at the table with the cataloguers
00:55 dcook         Well...I might whinge about supporting it, but I see the necessity.
00:55 dcook         Who do data?
00:55 wizzyrea      because cataloguers do... cataloguing. Computer scientists do data.
00:56 dcook         I do wonder a bit who leads these debates
00:56 wizzyrea      people who wrangle data, people who create information storage schemas.
00:56 dcook         Are they cataloguers? Managers?
00:56 dcook         Directors?
00:56 wizzyrea      bureaucrats?
00:56 dcook         Probably
00:57 dcook         I haven't followed the listservs much
00:57 * dcook       glances at jcamins
00:57 dcook         I suppose at the end of the day you have to wonder what it's all for
00:57 dcook         Hypothetically, the user, right?
00:58 dcook         I suppose "the user" is a multiheaded beast though
00:58 dcook         Much like cataloguers really
00:58 dcook         Some just want to know the procedure for transcribing the data. Others want it "their way". Others want it "the right way".
00:58 * dcook       shrugs
01:00 wizzyrea      anyway it's stupid and ought to die
01:00 wizzyrea      but I fear we are stuck with it for now
01:01 rangi         in my defence 264 was only proposed at that point
01:02 wizzyrea      ^^ exactly
01:02 dcook         Fair enough :)
01:02 dcook         I think there are others missing in the 3xx fields and maybe some missing subfields
01:03 rangi         be rangi
01:03 wahanui       Send a patch!
01:03 rangi         :)
01:03 dcook         I'm going to upload one that one of our libraries (who has a great cataloguer) has been using
01:03 dcook         hehe
01:03 rangi         the main thing i came to realise is
01:03 rangi         'your cataloguing standards are bad, and you should feel bad'
01:03 rangi         which translates to
01:03 rangi         'friends don't let friends use RDA'
01:03 rangi         ie
01:04 dcook         lol
01:04 rangi         im incredibly unlikely to ever voluntarily do work on it
01:04 dcook         RDA is also your cataloguing standards are bad, and you should feel bad
01:04 wahanui       okay, dcook.
01:04 wizzyrea      @quote add rangi: The main thing I came to realise is -- 'Your cataloguing standards are bad, and you should feel bad' - which translates to - 'friends don't let friends use RDA'
01:04 huginn`       wizzyrea: The operation succeeded.  Quote #273 added.
01:04 dcook         I love that phrase...
01:05 dcook         I wonder how proposed the 264 field...
01:05 dcook         s/how/who/
01:05 dcook         Because iirc there probably isn't anything about it in RDA itself
01:06 dcook         But I probably wouldn't voluntarily do work on it either
01:07 dcook         Mostly because...I have no idea what needs to be done/what people want to be done
01:07 dcook         One of those take it as it comes sort of things
01:07 rangi         yeah
01:07 rangi         thats the major thing
01:07 wizzyrea      nobody, NOBODY has had a single idea about how to best use this new data we're collecting
01:07 rangi         ok, you are sticking this data in fields
01:08 rangi         now what
01:08 wahanui       now is good time with holidays coming up
01:08 rangi         oh thats right
01:08 rangi         NOTHING
01:08 wizzyrea      and the rest of it is "stop abbreviating things so that people who speak english can understand this"
01:08 rangi         don't mind me, ill be over here on the internet, you keep playing with your tape drives
01:08 * rangi       might be jaded
01:08 * dcook       crosses his fingers and hopes the upload works
01:09 rangi         wizzyrea: speaking of english, RDA has built in bias
01:09 wizzyrea      yay
01:09 rangi         ie, media types being words
01:09 rangi         you cant have that
01:09 rangi         thats just dump
01:09 rangi         dumb too
01:10 dcook         For several reasons
01:10 dcook         Maybe a little jaded :p
01:11 dcook         I like how the Gender field is repeatable and allows for transitions, but...that's not really for useres
01:11 dcook         users*
01:11 wizzyrea      You know what is for users? Showing things they care about.
01:11 wizzyrea      Showing them things that help them pick the right thing.
01:11 dcook         rangi: I imagine a lot of people didn't use the codes for media types either though.
01:12 rangi         yep
01:12 dcook         wizzyrea: True true
01:12 dcook         I suppose the idea of user-centered design is still pretty new
01:12 dcook         To libraries
01:12 wizzyrea      there are kind of two competing purposes for cataloguing - one is capturing everything there is to know about a manifestation of a work, the other is helping people find that work. Sometimes they overlap... sometimes they don't
01:12 dcook         I suppose it's not necessarily the whole focus either
01:13 dcook         From an academic/philosophical perspective, the idea is to fully describe the item
01:13 dcook         To capture all the data as accurately as possible
01:13 dcook         Which is quite another thing to displaying it
01:13 * dcook       really needs to read wizzyrea's words before typing himself :p
01:13 jcamins       Hmmm.
01:14 dcook         You're much more clear and concise than this guy :p
01:14 dcook         Actually, I think the purpose of cataloguing is probably the capture
01:14 wizzyrea      I doubt that
01:14 * dcook       tries to remember his lifecycle of the record
01:14 dcook         Access is really more in our jurisdiction
01:14 jcamins       I think this cookie dough needs more emulsifier.
01:14 dcook         Although we need to have good data to work with
01:14 wizzyrea      MOAR EGGS
01:15 wizzyrea      one thing that has always bugged me
01:15 wizzyrea      is how libraries think that borrowers need to see all of the data they know
01:15 wizzyrea      surprise, they don't!
01:15 jcamins       Is the fact that xanthan gum is hard to find?
01:16 dcook         Well, few ILSes show all the data in a record
01:16 dcook         But the data they do show is often laid out very strangely...
01:16 dcook         jcamins: Maybe it's difficult to get to Xanth?
01:16 dcook         I think a tornado works iirc
01:16 wizzyrea      it would be SO helpful to do user testing on what people need in varying types of institutions
01:16 jcamins       lol
01:17 dcook         wizzyrea: True true. More universities are doing that sort of testing as well, apparently.
01:17 dcook         The librarians are often called..."assessment librarians" or...
01:17 wizzyrea      uni is totally different from public though
01:17 dcook         Something else I can't remember
01:17 dcook         Indeed
01:17 wizzyrea      is different from a law library
01:17 wizzyrea      is different from a corporate library
01:17 * dcook       misses the law libraries...
01:18 dcook         Unis are the ones with the most resources for it though
01:18 wizzyrea      is different from a primary or secondary school library even.
01:18 dcook         The rest don't tend to have the time or resources for it
01:18 dcook         Which is a bit counter-intuitive in a way...
01:18 dcook         How do you not have resources to find out what your people want...
01:18 wizzyrea      they're spending too much on ILS licenses :P
01:18 dcook         YES!
01:18 wizzyrea      and the ILS companies aren't doing the user testing either
01:18 dcook         Couldn't agree more
01:19 wizzyrea      they depend on the libraries to tell them what to do
01:19 dcook         And the libraries tend to say "The system can only do X"
01:19 wizzyrea      or they demand software to solve their human problems with technology.
01:19 dcook         It's like I was saying the other day. Do we just accomodate libraries or do we try to guide them as well?
01:20 dcook         To a degree, we can try to do both, but do any of us have the ability to do comprehensive user testing?
01:20 dcook         Being all things to all people, we can't
01:20 dcook         Yeah, human problems with technology...those are my least favourite demands
01:20 wizzyrea      heh no. You'd have to get a partner in each constituency
01:20 dcook         This is why I think libraries need to be more ambitious
01:20 dcook         Stop wasting time over the capitalization of that word, and reach out to your users
01:21 dcook         Gather requirements, do user testing, figure out how to give the best service possible
01:25 wizzyrea      there is also a bit of fear of success.
01:27 dcook         How do you mean?
01:33 jcamins       Hmm.
01:34 jcamins       Not quite right.
01:39 mtompset      Greetings, #koha.
01:40 dcook         get mtompset
01:40 * dcook       ruminates on how to write unit tests
01:40 mtompset      Test::More is your friend.
01:40 dcook         Yeah, I'm taking a look at Galen's blog at the moment
01:41 mtompset      looking at simple tests already in Koha is helpful too.
01:41 dcook         I think this one is going to be somewhat complex though
01:41 dcook         I need to add an entry to the database, retrieve that entry, then query Koha's OAI-PMH server, insert a bunch of stuff into the database, and then...
01:42 mtompset      oh... scary unit test..
01:42 dcook         Probably retrieve that stuff as well
01:42 mtompset      haven't hit that level of complexity yet.
01:42 dcook         I told magnuse that I'd post my stuff up on Bugzilla but...
01:42 dcook         Without a test it won't be any good
01:43 * mtompset    nods, "The pains of development."
01:43 dcook         Perhaps the pains of learning as well
01:43 dcook         But growing pains aren't all bad
01:43 * dcook       enjoys being tall despite the nights of agony growing up :p
01:43 mtompset      Hey, it isn't like you could explain to me how the search results determine the number of items to return in the OPAC search, could you? ;)
01:44 dcook         O_o
01:44 mtompset      I'm trying to make sense of the number it is returning.
01:44 mtompset      If I count lost items, checked out items, and items available. I get something way higher than the number given.
01:45 dcook         Bad math? :p
01:45 dcook         No idea.
01:47 dcook         Hmm, jcamins's batch.t might lead the way...
01:47 dcook         For me that is
01:48 * dcook       stares at the test a bit
01:50 dcook         Hmm, I don't appear to have Test/WWW/Mechanize.pm...
01:51 * dcook       tries to install locally
01:51 * dcook       hopes nothing explodes
01:52 dcook         That's not a good sign...
01:53 dcook         Booo...
01:54 jcamins       You should know that Batch.t doesn't work on master.
01:54 dcook         That's also useful to know
01:55 dcook         Thanks :)
01:55 jcamins       The logging in doesn't work anymore.
01:55 * dcook       ponders this
01:55 dcook         I think all I need is an ability to send a HTTP request
01:56 dcook         I assume I need Test::WWW::Mechanize for that?
01:57 jcamins       In that case, it'll do fine.
01:57 jcamins       Yeah.
01:57 * dcook       starts up the VM
01:57 dcook         I suppose the way to do this would be to use...Test:::WWW::Mechanism to send the HTTP request and get the result...
01:58 mtompset      jcamins: I'm looking back at the facets search problem again after taking a break from it.
01:58 dcook         Then create the necessary tables, fill them up, then drop them after the test?
01:58 jcamins       mtompset: poor guy.
01:58 mtompset      Can I say curses? :)
01:58 jcamins       dcook: probably.
01:58 dcook         jcamins: Hmm. Thanks.
01:58 dcook         mtompset: Which problem is that?
01:59 mtompset      if an item is hidden, it is still counted, and the facets for it are displayed.
01:59 dcook         Ahh
02:00 dcook         That would impact the whole thing that cait and I are talking about as well
02:00 mtompset      what was that?
02:01 dcook         Basically that facets are always shown for all items for all bibs in the search results
02:01 dcook         So if you click "Location A" facet, you'll still see a "Location B" facet, because your search results contain a bib that has an item with "Location  B" even though it doesn't fit with the "Location A" limit
02:01 dcook         If you could solve that, that would be awesome ;)
02:02 dcook         Which reminds me...cait said I should talk to you, jcamins, about DOM indexing. But...I'm not going to bother you about it right now
02:02 mtompset      If I solve my problem. that would become a trivial thing
02:02 dcook         I'm sure the solution would cover both situmations
02:02 dcook         Yes, the m was intentional...:p
02:02 wizzyrea      is that a word I should look up?
02:03 dcook         Apparently urban dictionary has a result for it
02:04 dcook         I'm not sure I fully agree with it though
02:04 dcook         I know other languages have slang as well, but I still imagine it must be hell learning English...
02:06 dcook         Bleargh...to write a unit test now or sometime in the future...
02:06 dcook         Perhaps better to have a decent prototype first...
02:06 dcook         Yet, new knowledge...
02:07 jcamins       Write the unit test.
02:07 jcamins       It makes it faster.
02:07 dcook         That's what I'm thinking in theory
02:08 dcook         I imagine trying different data and database config would be way easier with a test
02:09 dcook         git++
02:09 dcook         ssh++
02:09 dcook         I guess now that I have my code on the VM, it's a good chance to try it all out..
02:14 dcook         Hmm...
02:19 dcook         All the things...
02:22 dcook         No Test::WWW::Mechanize on dev server...
02:22 dcook         But it is on the VM...
02:22 dcook         But now the VM can't find C4...even though I'm exporting the same variables that are set in apache..
02:25 dcook         Ok, so I'll run everything as root I guess..
02:27 jcamins       That seems like a bad idea.
02:27 dcook         Agreed
02:28 dcook         But I get permission denied errors whenever I try to run a cronjob on the VM, since every Perl module outside of Koha has a user and group of root
02:32 dcook         Hmm, this bidirectional clipboard doesn't seem to work..
02:33 dcook         Basically couldn't open the koha-conf.xml and permission denied at...XML/SAX/Expat.pm
02:33 dcook         Ah...
02:33 dcook         Because I'm an idiot
02:34 dcook         Although...
02:34 wahanui       although is, like, mine 2.3.2 or 2.3.3
02:34 dcook         So I have one user for my Git
02:34 dcook         One user for my dev site...
02:34 dcook         I have them linked with Gitify
02:35 jcamins       Oh, yeah, you're running it as the wrong user.
02:35 dcook         But if I'm my Koha user...I won't be able to run from my git
02:36 dcook         I suppose I could change the git group
02:36 jcamins       I'd just change the permissions on koha-conf.xml, probably.
02:36 jcamins       Your cron jobs should be running as the Koha user, though.
02:36 dcook         True, but this is just for development
02:36 dcook         Actually..
02:37 dcook         I imagine the cronjobs would be run as root
02:37 dcook         Ordinarily
02:37 dcook         Because root would be the only one with access to usr/share/koha, right?
02:37 jcamins       The cron jobs provided by the packages are run with koha-foreach.
02:38 jcamins       But if you're doing custom cron jobs that can't be managed, you would run them as the Koha user. Or, at least, I would.
02:38 jcamins       I don't know what you mean... everyone has access to /usr/share/koha. You're not editing the files from cron jobs.
02:38 jcamins       I hope.
02:39 dcook         O_o
02:39 dcook         I'm just working in the git at the moment
02:39 dcook         When I look in /usr/share/koha, everything is root owner and root group
02:39 dcook         I haven't touched it since I installed the packages
02:40 jcamins       I don't understand why that's a problem.
02:40 dcook         Probably because it's not
02:40 dcook         I'm just being silly
02:40 * dcook       realizes now
02:41 dcook         But now I'm trying to remember what my koha user's password is
02:41 jcamins       It doesn't have one.
02:41 jcamins       You've been using sudo. ;)
02:42 dcook         I haven't really been using this thing much at all to be honest
02:42 dcook         I've just changed branches in the git
02:42 dcook         If I tried to switch to my koha user, it prompts for a password and won't take no for an answer..
02:43 jcamins       sudo su - koha-koha
02:43 jcamins       Then you enter in your password.
02:43 jcamins       Or just use koha-shell.
02:44 dcook         But that's cheating :p
02:44 jcamins       Use koha-shell.
02:44 jcamins       I always forget that we have that now.
02:44 jcamins       No it's not.
02:44 jcamins       Your Koha user should not be able to log in at all.
02:44 jcamins       No password = no possibility of remote login.
02:44 dcook         It seems that they do have a password. We're just bypassing it by logging into it from root
02:44 dcook         Ahhh
02:44 dcook         Or is it *
02:45 dcook         Use koha-shell as root then?
02:45 dcook         And it will automatically switch to the koha user
02:45 jcamins       Right. sudo koha-shell myinstancename
02:46 dcook         Hmm, Debian didn't like that
02:47 dcook         Or maybe those are warnings rather than errors..
02:48 mtompset      jcamins: How many things should be listed per page?
02:49 jcamins       mtompset: however many the user asks for.
02:49 dcook         Cool. sudo koha-shell myinstance name....then use the git as the koha user...cool
02:49 jcamins       Or are configured.
02:49 mtompset      how do you know what is configured or asked for?
02:49 dcook         system preference, me thinks
02:50 jcamins       Look at the existing code to see how it figures it out?
02:50 mtompset      OPACnumSearchResults, I think.
02:58 mtompset      Ah, that's why I'm all confused... when there are hidden items on a block of 20, there aren't 20 items put out.
03:00 mtompset      okay... dumb question...
03:00 wahanui       somebody said dumb question... was koha-latest.tar.gz correct?
03:00 * mtompset    smirks.
03:01 mtompset      Shouldn't every page have the same number of records, regardless of what is hidden or not hidden (lost, suppressed, hidden, checked out, etc.)?
03:01 dcook         Ideally
03:01 jcamins       Yes it should.
03:02 jcamins       Unfortunately, doing that is non-trivial.
03:02 dcook         ^^
03:02 mtompset      Then non-trivial is what I'm going to do. This is annoying!
03:03 mtompset      I should get the search results, and then filter them, BEFORE returning the set back to some other routine.
03:03 jcamins       Yes, exactly, except that won't work.
03:03 mtompset      So that the pagination should be trivial, find the 20*x location, and go.
03:04 mtompset      okay, why won't it work? conceptually it does. :)
03:04 jcamins       Because I want to go to page 10.
03:05 mtompset      okay.
03:05 jcamins       Heck, even going to page 2 is a problem.
03:05 mtompset      right, because it isn't a simple go to position 20*x
03:06 mtompset      does the search intentionally paginate before returning the results?!
03:06 jcamins       Yes.
03:06 rangi         this will fix it
03:06 rangi         https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-m8IOD-wk9g
03:08 mtompset      Oh blast it.. I see what you are saying.
03:08 dcook         Indeed, computer games
03:08 dcook         hehe
03:11 dcook         Blearghh
03:13 mtompset      Wait... so the _ZOOM_event_loop() get all the results, not just a paginated subset?
03:13 mtompset      ^so^so does^
03:14 mtompset      Or is it really sadly, just a paginated subset?
03:15 mtompset      The built hashref is paginated, but I thought the results[] were everything.
03:16 jcamins       It fetches all results, but that's not the problem.
03:16 jcamins       If you want to see what the problem is, increase the number of records used for faceting, and do a search that returns thousands of results.
03:18 dcook         I'm silly...I don't actually need Test::WWW::Mechanize...
03:20 mtompset      Oh shoot! Building an array of items for the entire set to filter is going to be a horrendous performance hit.
03:20 mtompset      More thinking to do. :(
03:20 dcook         Hence the paginating me thinks
03:20 jcamins       Yes, exactly.
03:21 mtompset      Okay... next thought...
03:21 mtompset      Does it matter if page 1 listed 20 items, but items 19 and 20 from page 1 go onto page 2?
03:21 dcook         http://www.elasticsearch.org/guide/reference/api/search/facets/
03:22 dcook         I haven't actually read that, btw
03:22 mtompset      And now I get the OMGWTFBBQ! now. :)
03:23 jcamins       dcook: if we used ES we wouldn't really be having this problem, would we? :P
03:26 dcook         My suggestion was for mtompset to figure out a way to use Elasticsearch instead of Zebra :p
03:26 mtompset      I'm not going that far!
03:29 mtompset      I don't like the differing sized pages, but perhaps that is an acceptable trade off.
03:31 dcook         Blah unit tests...
03:31 dcook         I'm sure you'll be worth it, but you're killing me here
03:31 * mtompset    doesn't see any blood. ;)
03:32 dcook         It's internal bleeding :p
03:33 dcook         Maybe I'll cheat at first and work backwards...
03:33 dcook         I'm still not sure how I'm going to make any of this work..
03:34 mtompset      You're going to two-time on unit tests? ;)
03:34 dcook         Two-time?
03:34 dcook         Ahhh
03:34 dcook         Haven't heard that expression in a long time
03:34 dcook         Well, I'm going to use my current database
03:34 dcook         Get the whole thing working
03:35 dcook         THEN worry about emulating the database
03:35 dcook         Or creating and dropping tables and all that jazz
03:35 jcamins       Yeah, that's absolutely the way to do it.
03:35 jcamins       Baby steps.
03:35 mtompset      I was trying to make a bad pun on cheating (two-timing) and unit (single).
03:36 * jcamins     starts importing the thesaurus, 1965-1966, and 2009-2012 data files from ERIC.
03:36 dcook         Yeah, I'm thinking baby steps are the way to go, or I'll just feel overwhelmed.
03:36 dcook         Ah, nice one, mtompset :p
03:36 dcook         jcamins will one day possess all the ERIC
03:36 jcamins       Bwahahahaha!
03:37 mtompset      dcook: Not really, if I had to explain it. :P
03:37 jcamins       Actually, I have all the data files, but I'm not sure my import procedure actually works so it seems foolish to import all 68 years.
03:37 dcook         I can be a bit too literal and unfunny at times. Sometimes jokes fall flat with me :p.
03:37 dcook         jcamins: Makes sense
03:39 mtompset      Thanks for trying to save my face, dcook.
03:39 mtompset      dcook++
03:39 * jcamins     calls it a night, and leaves the import to run.
03:40 dcook         night jcamins
03:40 mtompset      Bye, jcamins.
03:40 dcook         Thanks for the help
03:42 dcook         Test::More says to look at Test::Simple...Test::Simple says to look at Test::Tutorial
03:42 dcook         Oh...
03:43 dcook         http://search.cpan.org/~rgarcia/perl-5.10.0/lib/Test/Tutorial.pod
03:43 dcook         http://search.cpan.org/~rgarcia/perl-5.10.0/lib/Test/Tutorial.pod
03:43 dcook         Ack
03:43 dcook         AHHHHHHH!!!! NOT TESTING! Anything but testing! Beat me, whip me, send me to Detroit, but don't make me write tests!
03:43 dcook         *sob*
03:43 dcook         Besides, I don't know how to write the damned things.
03:43 dcook         ^^
03:45 wizzyrea      http://kohadevreactions.tumblr.com/post/57782677571/no-really-you-should-write-unit-tests-first
03:46 dcook         hehe
03:46 dcook         I had forgotten about that one
03:46 dcook         No time like the present to learn
03:48 dcook         Digging this tutorial so far..
03:58 dcook         Think I might run into testing problems with some of the more complex methods though...
03:58 dcook         Mmm maybe not..
04:16 mtompset      dcook: are you sure you didn't mean bend me, shape me? ;) http://youtu.be/2CVJFQkPkCg
04:19 mtompset      Have a great day (24 hour period), #koha.
05:09 dcook         Test::More consumed...now onto trying to test...
05:16 dcook         Hmm Test::More doesn't seem to process "die" or "exit" within a test...
05:16 dcook         I mean...it does...but it doesn't report it as a failed test
05:17 dcook         I mean...it does...but it doesn't report it as a failed test
05:17 dcook         ..
05:17 dcook         Wrong window..
05:28 cait          rangi++
05:40 cait          kenza++
06:35 dcook         Writing tests is both easier and harder than I imagined...
06:37 * magnuse     waves
06:37 dcook         hey ya magnuse :)
06:37 magnuse       dcook: yeah, it's rather interesting, isn't it :-)
06:37 dcook         It is!
06:37 dcook         Especially db_dependent tests..
06:39 dcook         Ooooh....
06:39 dcook         I just remembered that I can use that rollback because I"m not using Test::WWW::Mechanize..
06:40 dcook         Hmm, maybe...
06:40 wahanui       i heard maybe was a momentaneous error
06:41 dcook         Well, only one way to find out ;)
06:42 reiveune      hello
06:42 dcook         salut reiveune :)
06:42 cait          hi reiveune
06:43 reiveune      \o/
06:43 cait          bbiab :)
06:50 dcook         "I know the synthesizer, why don't I use the synthesizer which is the sound of the future"
06:56 dcook         Interesting...
06:57 wahanui       interesting is probably sometimes good and sometimes bad
06:57 dcook         Even when you do $dbh->rollback();, your autoincrement still increases
07:06 gaetan_B      hello
07:07 dcook         Hmm...looks like dropping a table doesn't get rolled back either...
07:07 dcook         hey ya gaetan_B :)
07:08 dcook         Or maybe it failed before it could rollback..
07:08 dcook         Because my table is defo accidentally nuked
07:08 dcook         Good thing I backed up the create statement...
08:02 dcook         I am so confused...and totally shouldn't be at work on a Friday night...
08:06 dcook         Ahh, I'm blind
08:06 dcook         Really...really...blind
08:26 * magnuse     somehow doubts that
08:26 dcook         Well, perhaps not blind
08:26 drojf         your typing looks ok
08:26 dcook         I thought a file was in a different directory
08:26 drojf         :P
08:26 dcook         I know a few blind people who type quite well :p
08:27 drojf         heh i was going to write about that. sure, but you would not of you became blind all of a sudden ;)
08:27 dcook         I took poetry with a guy whose computer spoke to him unbelievably quickly. He was able to listen and type and still pay attention to everything. He was amazing.
08:27 dcook         I am a fairly decent touch typist...
08:27 dcook         :p
08:27 drojf         alright, you are blind then
08:27 drojf         if you insist
08:27 drojf         :D
08:27 dcook         Nah, just staring at a screen for 9.5+ hours
08:28 * dcook       is  more crazy than blind
08:28 dcook         I learned how to write unit tests today though, so that was good
08:28 * magnuse     thinks that sounds quite plausible ;-)
08:28 magnuse       dcook++
08:28 magnuse       bigtime!
08:29 dcook         Also learned that dropping a table during a transaction...not a good idea :p
08:30 magnuse       especially if you drop it on your toes ;-)
08:30 dcook         hehe
08:31 dcook         I've already hurt myself enough for one week
08:31 dcook         So yeah...if I'm lucky...maybe I can get an OK prototype on Bugzilla early next week
08:31 dcook         Well, running into issues with the last bit of the test...
08:31 dcook         But maybe I'm trying to do too much
08:37 dcook         Bloody croak...
08:50 kf            hi #koha
08:51 dcook         hey kf
08:52 magnuse       guten tag kf
08:53 kf            i forgot tolog into #koha
08:53 kf            that's.... worrysome
08:53 magnuse       yeah!
08:56 * dcook       thinks the unit test can only do so much...and then perhaps human intervention has to play a role...
08:56 dcook         On that note, I'm off!
08:56 dcook         have a good Friday/weekend everyone :)
08:56 dcook         yay unit tests!
08:56 kf            bye dcook
08:56 kf            have a nice weekend
08:56 dcook         They're way easier than I thought. I'm going to use them more going forward...
08:56 dcook         thanks, kf :)
08:57 kf            unit_tests++
09:05 magnuse       nice way to end the week :-)
09:11 kf            magnuse: hm? :)
09:12 magnuse       to discover that something is easier than you thought
09:13 kf            ah :)
09:48 magnuse       heh http://www.theonering.net/torwp/2013/08/29/77932-norway-couple-build-hobbit-house-in-dome/
09:52 kf            looks nice
09:52 kf            but I imaging building that was not cheap
09:54 magnuse       probably not
09:54 magnuse       i think they have done quite a lot of the tuff inside the dome themselves
11:45 kf            quiet friday :)
11:53 magnuse       kf: sshhh...
11:55 kf            lol
12:29 kf            hi drojf
12:33 oleonard      Hi #koha
12:36 Dyrcona       @later tell gmcharlt MARC::Charset 1.35 looks good to me. Do you plan to put it on CPAN, soon?
12:36 huginn`       Dyrcona: The operation succeeded.
12:38 Dyrcona       And by "looks good," I mean I tested it with a 19K bib import.
12:42 tcohen        morning #koha
12:50 kf            good morning tcohen
12:51 tcohen        hi kf
13:00 druthb        o/
13:06 tcohen        hi druthb
13:23 tcohen        license?
13:23 wahanui       license is probably GPLv3+.
13:23 tcohen        license text?
13:24 druthb        mornin', mtompset. :)
13:24 mtompset      Greetings, #koha druthb.
13:24 * mtompset    continues into the spiral that is C4::Search
13:24 mtompset      The scary thing is... it is becoming more and more clear.
13:25 mtompset      it?
13:25 wahanui       it is changing a default behaviour
13:25 mtompset      scary thing?
13:27 mtompset      Okay... question, if we are going to paginate less than perfectly (for speed purposes), can we get Zebra via Zoom to only return the poorly paginated data set? Do we need to return the full set for anything other than counts?
13:27 druthb        wahanui:  botsnack C4::Search
13:27 wahanui       :)
13:28 druthb        wahanui:  botsnack Tums      #you'll be wanting that later.
13:28 wahanui       :)
13:29 mtompset      Do facets have to be for the entire data set or just the current page?
13:29 tcohen        wahanui: license text is http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Coding_Guidelines#Licence
13:29 wahanui       OK, tcohen.
13:29 mtompset      You probably should leave the written address too.
13:31 druthb        Follow not the path of too-closely examining C4::Search, for chaos and madness await thee at its end.
13:31 druthb        hm.
13:32 druthb        wahanui:  C4::Search?
13:32 wahanui       https://i.chzbgr.com/maxW500/7044751872/hE32ABD60/
13:32 druthb        lol
13:34 jcamins       mtompset: facets haave to be computed according to the user's settings.
13:34 jcamins       *have
13:37 kf            tcohen: check the coding guidelines- i think it's there
13:37 mtompset      tcohen: tweaked the license section to have the snail mail address and be -w65 before "# "'s
13:37 mtompset      kf, it is. I think tcohen  was merely training wahanui.
13:37 mtompset      license text?
13:37 wahanui       license text is http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Coding_Guidelines#Licence
13:38 kf            mtompset: we want the whole result set.
13:38 kf            mtompset: not saying that is the default right now.
13:38 jcamins       kf: that's not going to be possible without rewriting the way Koha does faceting.
13:38 kf            jcamins: he asked what i want...
13:38 kf            well not me, but i thik that's the way users expect it to work
13:39 mtompset      Yes, it looks like a faceting re-write.
13:39 kf            looking at vufind and other interfaces with really strong facetting
13:39 druthb        Sinner, go not down this path!
13:39 druthb        jcamins got too deep into C4::Search, and you see what's become of him!
13:39 mtompset      "He who is without sin, cast the first stone." :P
13:40 mtompset      I made sure to quote, lest you feel slighted via the pronoun use. :)
13:40 druthb        :P
13:40 jcamins       mtompset: I don't think you understand the scope of the rewrite necessary in order to change faceting.
13:41 mtompset      sadly, I am becoming aware of it.
13:41 druthb        We're talking Pyramid of Giza here.
13:41 druthb        Big one.
13:41 jcamins       mtompset: I don't think you are. In order to facet the entire resultset, you have to remove all faceting from inside Koha.
13:42 mtompset      and put the faceting where in Zebra?
13:43 jcamins       Probably.
13:43 mtompset      (or whatever search engine the user has selected -- since solr is also coming up)
13:44 kf            mtompset: solr is also tied into the search rewrite
13:44 wahanui       okay, kf.
13:44 kf            so practically a bit stuck i guess
13:44 mtompset      good point, kf.
13:44 kf            the problem is finding funding for big architectural projects like this
13:44 kf            with laying the groundwork not being of so much use for libraries in the beginning
13:45 kf            i still hope that jcamins will be able to finish the rewrite some day
13:54 mtompset      *sigh* And that's enough head pain for the day... let's go on to an easier problem.
13:59 druthb        The coming war in Syria?  The global economy?  The Meaning of Life, the Universe and Everything?  Those are easier.
13:59 * druthb      is in a saucy mood today.
14:10 mtompset      The coming unjustifiable war in another country (Syria)? ;)
14:10 mtompset      No, I'm going back to documentation.
14:12 mtompset      alfredo sauce? ;)
14:12 * oleonard    votes pesto
14:12 mtompset      druthb is pesto saucy? Mmmm.... don't think so.
14:15 druthb        :P
14:15 druthb        Something…feisty.  With jalapenos in it, maybe.
14:18 tcohen        why shrink it mtompset?
14:19 mtompset      Because it looks ugly in my window? :P
14:19 mtompset      And 65 is a good number for making it look okay in all windows?
14:20 tcohen        80 is de default for *nix terminals
14:20 mtompset      Yes, but if you email it to someone, some mailers to weird wrappy things around 70.
14:21 mtompset      ^to^do^
14:21 * druthb      does weird wrappy things. She's in a silly mood.
14:22 mtompset      Perhaps a boneless BBQ chicken with pesto sauce wrap type thing? ;)
14:24 tcohen        mtompset
14:24 wahanui       mtompset is disliking finding bugs while testing.
14:24 tcohen        have a mission for u
14:24 tcohen        :-D
14:24 mtompset      perhaps...
14:25 tcohen        tab completion
14:25 wahanui       tab completion is sometimes unpredictable
14:25 tcohen        i'm testing building a package to see it gets installed
14:25 tcohen        after success, i'll post a preliminary patch
14:26 tcohen        you will enjoy testing
14:26 tcohen        (it covers a small subset of the koha-* commands)
14:26 * oleonard    also has a fence what needs whitewashin'
14:26 mtompset      no guarantees.
14:30 mtompset      Testing my instructions now.
14:33 tcohen        is eythian the only one QAing packages-related stuff?
14:34 kf            i have done smaller ones - but he can pass them yes
14:34 kf            i think he is back at work next week
14:34 kf            tcohen: it's basically i sometimes don't know how to test... but i can build packages. if there is something you want me to look at, maybe you can walk me through sometime
14:35 tcohen        thanks kf
14:35 tcohen        my tab completion work depends on a patch that adds --sip and --nosip to the koha-list command
14:35 tcohen        i can of course remove the tab completion for sip-related stuff
14:36 tcohen        but it would be a pity
14:36 tcohen        magnuse signed that patch already
14:42 kf            yeah, throwing away things woudl not be nice
14:42 kf            i am away for the weekend and next week will be pretty stressful
14:42 kf            so i won't be available for testign until the week after next
14:43 kf            or the weekend after this weekend
14:43 tcohen        bug 10003
14:43 huginn`       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10003 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, tomascohen, Needs Signoff , koha-* scripts (packages) should provide tab-completion in bash
14:45 tcohen        ok, i'm happy to finally send that patch
14:46 * tcohen      wants some friday cookies with mate
14:46 kf            :)
14:46 tcohen        mtompset, i'll test your instructions as soon as you attach the patch
14:48 mtompset      Thanks. I just don't want to do that until I have tested it and iron'd out any parts that require too much thinking.
14:54 kf            bye all
15:00 mtompset      in the source install instructions, should DEV or STANDARD be first?
15:01 tcohen        standard, of course
15:01 mtompset      standard = tarball.
15:01 mtompset      dev = git
15:01 mtompset      (for the most part)
15:01 tcohen        i think instructions fr developers should not be included actually
15:02 tcohen        I mean, i'd remove the whole git part
15:05 mtompset      but the document as a whole should be install agnostic, cutting out DEV (or STANDARD) would bust that concept.
15:06 tcohen        i'd target the instructions for people downloading the release tarball
15:07 tcohen        and include a (really small) comment on how to get the sources using git
15:07 tcohen        but i'd prefer just a link to the relevant wiki page
15:07 tcohen        because you will end up messing with branch selection instructions
15:08 tcohen        people trying to develop have other resources and capabilities
15:08 tcohen        that are far beyond a basic INSTALL file
15:09 mtompset      I'll contemplate this some more... back to testing.
15:16 mtompset      Do the installation instructions need to provide information on how to import records? or add interface languages?
15:18 tcohen        interface languages are relevan
15:18 tcohen        t
15:18 tcohen        because you need to install the language for being able to install default data on the needed language
15:21 tcohen        i mean it should be done before the webinstall step
15:21 tcohen        and it is really important
15:24 tcohen        @later tell rangi looks like bash-completion should work on zsh http://bit.ly/rBFKM8
15:24 huginn`       tcohen: The operation succeeded.
15:24 * tcohen      is in lobby-mode
15:31 mtompset      I added a link to the wiki as part of the steps, because the installing additional languages is an evolving process.
15:43 reiveune      bye
15:45 tcohen        au revoir
15:46 gaetan_B      bye !
15:52 vfernandes    hi
15:53 vfernandes    Patroncards PDF diacritics - how to solve it?
15:53 vfernandes    patroncards in koha 3.12 aren't working correctly
15:53 tcohen        is there a bug filled for that?
15:54 vfernandes    only for labels PDF
16:01 cait          vfernandes: yes multiple bugs
16:01 cait          and a possible solution that needs a bit more work
16:15 tcohen        liw, r u around?
16:32 oleonard-away dcook said he added another RDA framework to the wiki but I don't see it
16:33 oleonard      Oh, did he replace the one that rangi added?
16:33 oleonard      Okay, yeah he did.
16:34 oleonard      The more my catalogers learn about RDA the more they (and I) hate it.
16:35 oleonard      ...but if they want to be able to work with records others have cataloged with RDA then we have to have an updated framework to deal with it :(
16:45 mtompset      What if one cataloger's framework for RDA doesn't match another's framework?
16:45 mtompset      (actually, the question is broader than just RDA too)
16:46 oleonard      Then they view and edit records differently
16:46 jcamins       Then at least one of them has a framework that is objectively wrong.
16:46 mtompset      could they both be objectively wrong and a third one is actually the correct one?
16:46 oleonard      jcamins: It sounds like with RDA a lot of objectivity has been taken out of the picture
16:47 oleonard      mtompset: No it's the fourth one that is correct.
16:47 jcamins       oleonard: yeah, but not in terms of frameworks.
16:47 * mtompset    laughs, "You have a point, oleonard."
16:47 jcamins       In the Koha sense, there is a framework which is objectively correct, i.e. it has all the valid tags.
16:48 * oleonard    wonders if dcook's better approaches that ideal
16:48 jcamins       Presumably, since he added to rangi's.
17:16 liw           tcohen, you rang?
17:27 tcohen        liw
17:28 tcohen        i wanted to ask u for some advice on implementing the 'status' switch fr the koha-common init script
17:28 tcohen        i wrote a patch for 10624
17:28 tcohen        bug 10624
17:28 huginn`       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10624 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, koha-bugs, Needs Signoff , koha-common.init should implement the 'status' option switch
17:29 tcohen        it just prints the status of the relevant processes that *should* be running
17:35 liw           tcohen, that looks good to me
17:35 tcohen        ok
17:35 tcohen        thx
17:59 oleonard      Doesn't look like the idreambooks.com stuff is working anymore.
18:01 jcamins       oleonard: really?
18:01 wahanui       really is off now
18:01 jcamins       That's unfortunate.
18:01 oleonard      Not working for me anyway jcamins
18:02 jcamins       Works for me.
18:02 jcamins       Only about 1% of their data is actually available via API, apparently.
18:02 jcamins       [off] http://kohadev.cpbibliography.com/cgi-bin/koha/opac-detail.pl?biblionumber=85532
18:03 oleonard      Oh, duh, the request was being blocked.
18:05 jcamins       That would explain it.
18:06 drojf         evening #koha
18:08 drojf         [off] "I once again express my thanks to Mr. A.J. Tomson on behalf of  Koha community." <- ???
18:09 jcamins       [off] He was elected once, so he now gets to speak for the community.
18:09 drojf         [off] i see
18:09 jcamins       [off] And LiveDVD Manager is a much more august position than RM, obviously, since RMs can't speak for the community.
18:09 drojf         [off] makes sense
18:09 drojf         [off] he also speaks for academic libraries
18:13 oleonard      [off] "He had implemented Koha in 2000 itself." <-- The year 2000?
18:14 druthb        drojf!
18:15 drojf         hm
18:15 drojf         that bad karma kicks me out of irc thing again ^^
18:16 oleonard      drojf: If someone gives bad karma you get kicked out?
18:16 oleonard      drojf_getting_kicked_out_for_bad_karma--
18:16 drojf         if i talk bad about someone i get kicked out ;)
18:17 drojf         @karma vimal
18:17 huginn`       drojf: Karma for "vimal" has been increased 2 times and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 2.
18:17 drojf         vimal--
18:17 drojf         i hope that is the right one
18:20 drojf         i have a lot of bad mood to spare today if anyone needs some
18:22 cait          ew
18:22 cait          what happened?
18:22 * cait        hands drojf gluten free beer cookies
18:23 drojf         i don't know. broke my headphones again and the world is full of idiots and psychopaths
18:23 drojf         that sounds like the best kind of cookies :D
18:24 jcamins       I made gluten free cookies yesterday that came out okay.
18:24 drojf         the falafel cookies? ;)
18:24 jcamins       Hehe.
18:24 jcamins       Yes.
18:24 jcamins       They were a bit short on emulsifier.
18:25 jcamins       I'm going to try and buy xanthan or guar gum today.
18:25 jcamins       Otherwise I shall wing it.
18:25 jcamins       Actually, that's not entirely true.
18:25 jcamins       I'm winging it no matter what.
18:25 jcamins       Otherwise I won't even have that tenuous connection to best practices.
18:28 jcamins       What kind of cookies should I make for tomorrow?
18:29 drojf         maybe i should make cookies too. it looks like it's going to be christmas soon
18:30 tcohen        jcamins: should persmission to delete cover images be tied to CAN_user_tools_upload_local_cover_images permission?
18:30 drojf         hm. no butter
18:31 jcamins       tcohen: that makes sense to me.
18:31 jcamins       drojf: avocado?
18:31 jcamins       Sourcream?
18:32 jcamins       Bacon fat?
18:33 drojf         there might be lactose free sour cream i wanted to try. or i already did
18:33 drojf         vanilla icecream ;)
18:34 jcamins       Nah, that won't work so well.
18:34 jcamins       It'll all melt.
18:38 drojf         heh
18:39 jcamins       Wait... you don't have butter but you need lactose-free sour cream?
18:40 drojf         i don't understand the question :)
18:40 jcamins       You said you were not baking cookies because you don't have butter.
18:41 jcamins       You also said that you wanted to try the lactose-free sour cream, which implies that you should be avoiding lactose.
18:41 jcamins       So I'm trying to figure out why you would use butter in cookies.
18:43 * oleonard    wonders if some libraries pick the normal over the XSLT detail view in the OPAC so that they get the little author/subject pop-up menus
18:44 jcamins       I really like those author/subject pop-up menus.
18:44 jcamins       But since XSLT is otherwise so far superior, I do without.
18:44 oleonard      Too hard to implement them in XSLT, or just not a priority?
18:44 jcamins       Both.
18:45 jcamins       It wouldn't be easy, and it's just not enough of a priority for me to consider working on it.
18:48 drojf         [off] jcamins: lactose and i is a complicated thing. in general i use very little dairy products. but it turned out they work better for me after i stopped eating wheat/gluten. i think it's only in higher doses, like a sour cream based sauce for example. but sometimes there is no reaction at all. i don't think i have a problem with butter
18:49 oleonard      jcamins: I wonder if it wouldn't make just as much sense to have that pop-up menu be a modal window?
18:50 oleonard      jcamins: It's always the same items, right? Just with different checkboxes checked?
18:50 jcamins       That is correct.
18:50 jcamins       A modal makes sense to me.
18:51 oleonard      I just hate working with a different implementation of a menu-style thingy when there are "built-in" options
18:54 oleonard      Anyway... Something to tinker with after my Labor-free weekend
18:54 oleonard      See ya #koha
18:54 tcohen        api?
18:54 wahanui       api is expected to be flexible enough to let us add other search engines later
18:54 tcohen        svc api?
18:54 wahanui       svc api is http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Koha_/svc/_HTTP_API
18:54 tcohen        sweet :-D
19:24 Dyrcona       @later tell gmcharlt I see MARC::Charset 1.35 is on CPAN already. I didn't see it there two weeks ago when you messaged me about it.
19:24 huginn`       Dyrcona: The operation succeeded.
19:33 pastebot      "tcohen" at 172.16.248.213 pasted "jcamins:" (16 lines) at http://paste.koha-community.org/190
19:34 jcamins       Seems fine to me.
19:34 jcamins       Bonus points if you add a unit test. :)
19:34 tcohen        unit tests for a svc script?
19:35 cait          tcohen: if you happen to mock a cgi object i would be interested in stealing that :)
19:35 jcamins       tcohen: no, I meant for DelImage.
19:37 tcohen        jcamins, can I take control of bug 7813? didn't notice it was assigned to you
19:37 huginn`       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7813 enhancement, P3, ---, jcamins, NEW , Add ability to delete local cover images
19:37 cait          take control :P
19:37 cait          i like that
19:37 tcohen        i plan to do svc script returning  a JSON + ajax
19:37 jcamins       Please do.
19:38 jcamins       As I said on the bug, I'm not working on that.
19:38 tcohen        does it sound bad in english?
19:38 cait          not to me :)
19:38 jcamins       It would be better to say "a svc script returning JSON + AJAX"
19:38 tcohen        :-P
19:38 tcohen        was talking about "taking control"
19:39 jcamins       Oh.
19:39 jcamins       Then yes.
19:39 tcohen        it doesn't sound good?
19:40 jcamins       No, that sounds fine.
19:40 jcamins       The only thing that didn't was your placement of "a." :P
19:40 tcohen        oh
19:41 tcohen        glyphicon-remove overlay for removing?
19:41 jcamins       And that was perfectly understandable, I just thought you were having trouble figuring out why the sentence sounded a little odd. ;)
19:42 tcohen        oh, its too late!
19:42 tcohen        leaving now, bye #koha, nice weekend!
19:43 cait          bye tcohen :)
19:44 tcohen        i've pushed to my github just iun case anyone wants to check it
22:42 mtompset      @later tell drojf Actually, that was the wrong one, as far as I know.
22:42 huginn`       mtompset: The operation succeeded.
22:44 mtompset      Confusingly, there is VKV and VKM.