Time Nick Message 23:50 mtj gotcha, i couldnt rembz if it was, or not.. 23:50 rangi koha-disable instance 23:50 rangi unless you did 23:50 mtj ah, ok 23:49 rangi its enabled by default 23:49 mtj silly Q.. can anyone remember how to 'enable' zebra index cron, on koha+packages? 23:43 rangi no need to change the url tho 23:43 rangi its been bugzilla 4 for years 23:42 mtompset but it is really bugzilla 4.2.3 under the hood? 23:42 rangi yes it is 23:41 mtompset So the URL isn't the same now? 23:40 rangi upgraded, now running 4.2.3 23:38 mtompset And the reindexes every 5 minutes picked up the missing pieces. 23:37 mtompset Ran that script. 23:37 huginn 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=6566 enhancement, P3, ---, christophe.croullebois, Pushed to Master , Checking if DB records are properly indexed 23:37 mtompset bug 6566 solved my problems. 23:36 mtompset woo hoo! They are solved. 23:36 rangi just going to upgrade bugzilla 23:32 mtompset I think my zebra problems are solved. Just about to test. 23:31 mtompset Good morning, #koha 22:05 drojf look, that is us in research 22:05 drojf This is the IRC website for the Koha community. The channel is logged and searchable. Major topics include announcements, events, news, tips and tricks, and surveys. 22:04 drojf heh 22:03 jcamins_away [off] That's 'cause they're doing Official Research (TM) 22:03 drojf company even 22:03 drojf there sure are a lot of forky links on that website. i have not seen that comapany mentioned so often before. 21:54 rangi halcyonCorsair: ~/git/koha/ 21:53 rangi [off] http://opensource-ils.cci.utk.edu/content/koha-vendors 21:53 halcyonCorsair rangi: yo, what's the layout of your dev machine like? where do you keep the code, etc? 21:53 jcamins_away I was looking at the "other ILS" section. 21:53 rangi yeah that page is special :) 21:53 jcamins_away wtf? 21:52 rangi being in the US? 21:52 drojf i wonder how they chose the three "main vendors" over the rest 21:51 drojf we should probably ask them, they are the researchers ;) 21:50 jcamins_away [off] It's *research*. Too important for asking people like us. 21:49 rangi hm true, they never seemed to get involved or ask any questions 21:49 rangi yeah 21:49 drojf but i doubt that somehow 21:49 drojf i would if i'd think they would be interested at all 21:49 rangi gotta keep it nice and polite, but yeah its a bit a of a mess 21:49 rangi id encourage people to use the contact form to nicely point out the factual errors 21:47 drojf so i am not the only one less than impressed by that ils "research" website 21:41 rangi yep 21:41 rambutan chris_n is bouncing all over the place 21:13 rangi cool 21:12 wajasu i've got to go running. will look at 8211 and 8726 later 21:09 rangi yep thats why we use git 21:09 rangi i only have to care about the 3.8.x branch 21:09 wajasu not with git. but clearcase or pvcs, or others its a bear. 21:09 rangi and thats why we have release maintainers 21:08 rangi thats not many :) 21:08 wajasu 2 plus trunk/master. 21:07 wajasu you guys are managing alot of branches 21:07 rangi but that is a rare occurence 21:07 rangi occassionally we have to do a seperate patch for the stable branches 21:06 rangi then cherry-picked to 3.8.x or 3.6.x as required 21:06 wajasu ah. 21:06 rangi that's the pattern patches should take pushed to master 21:06 rangi then to stable 21:06 rangi you can see it went to master first 21:06 rangi http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_activity.cgi?id=7818 21:05 rangi if you click on the history link 21:04 wajasu i'm seeing that 8211 depends on 7818. 7818 is pushed to stable. (is master stable?) 20:57 wajasu i was starting to look at LDAP security stuff since i have that background and can work that stuff. 20:57 rangi they have good test plans also :) 20:57 wajasu ok 20:56 huginn 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8726 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, jcamins, Needs Signoff , Did you mean? plugin for broader/narrower/related terms 20:56 huginn 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8211 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, jcamins, Needs Signoff , Add "subject (broader)," "subject (narrower)," and "subject (related)" options for search 20:56 rangi bug 8211 and bug 8726 would be good ones to get signed off 20:47 rangi yep, as long as you can replicate on master 20:47 rangi cool nothing new to push 20:47 wajasu i was playing with adding athorities in master, and there was a popup, which you could search and save, but the cancel button did nothing. should i write up a bug? 20:46 wajasu i see 20:46 rangi its to do with authority merging/creating 20:45 rangi talk to jcamins first 20:45 wajasu i breifly did, but i wonder if there is some low level MARC violation that enforces indicators to be a certain way. i'm going to look at it. i'll probably learn something. 20:44 cait mveron++ for being awesome 20:44 rangi not me 20:44 nengard I hope so ? but not me :) 20:44 huginn 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8447 critical, P1 - high, ---, gmcharlt, NEW , can't save new records / indicator error 20:43 wajasu anyone looked int bug 8447 20:43 rangi yep 20:43 wizzyrea ;) 20:43 wizzyrea it's cyclical. 20:42 wajasu dejavu 20:42 wajasu didn't you guys have this same conversaion a year ago? 20:41 cait and something else 20:41 cait there is also bibliotheq I think 20:41 nengard already emailed them a brief email - but more from the rest of you would be awesome 20:41 cait french 20:41 rangi that one 20:41 cait pmb 20:41 rangi or is it french? 20:41 cait that german one? 20:41 rangi whats that german one? 20:41 cait senayan maybe 20:41 cait yeah 20:41 rangi there's a few now 20:41 rangi newgenlib 20:41 wizzyrea what's the one you're thinking of 20:41 wizzyrea openbiblio or... 20:40 rangi foss4lib is a much better effort 20:40 rangi its kinda stink it doesnt mention the other open source ils either 20:40 cait no, but it makes me sad 20:39 rangi its not like it's alone in that :) 20:39 rangi just one more pile of misinformation on the net 20:39 rangi ah well 20:39 rangi nope 20:39 rangi yeah its just a mess really 20:39 cait doesn't seem like they got the difference 20:39 cait hm and koha.org links at tech support :( 20:39 rangi stupid captchas 20:39 rangi then you can't 20:38 rangi except if you are blind 20:38 rangi http://opensource-ils.cci.utk.edu/content/contact-form 20:38 rangi you should email them corrections :) 20:38 wizzyrea you got your evergreen on my koha! No you got your koha on my evergreen~ 20:38 wahanui Of course! 20:38 wizzyrea really. 20:38 cait hm they got evergreen in the koha faq 20:38 wizzyrea i'm teasing. 20:38 rangi heh 20:37 wizzyrea A for going and fetching all of those logos though. 20:37 rangi yeah, you'd get a D for that research effort 20:36 wizzyrea 3 main vendors. jeez. 20:35 rangi yeah frames 20:35 cait I can't even give you the lin kit seems :( 20:35 cait koha - koha vendors 20:35 wahanui Of course! 20:35 cait really??? 20:35 rangi that's a given really 20:35 cait 3 main vendors 20:35 rangi well of course 20:35 cait and only us centric 20:34 rangi no the main list 20:34 wahanui koha-devel is probably the best list 20:34 wajasu koha-devel? 20:33 * rangi does so 20:33 rangi and ohh a spammer to bounce off the list 20:33 rangi thats a pretty lacklustre research effort im afraid (the recent mail to the koha list) 20:32 wajasu plus the test depended on prexisting biblio and items, which i added to the test. when i pull a fresh master, i don;t have pre-existing data (just webinstaller ) and i would have to go add biblios to pass the test. 20:31 rangi probably should fix the pod too 20:31 rangi right 20:29 wajasu but it still worked, but they weren't testing expdate and resdat. 20:29 wajasu now it doesn't 20:28 wajasu the metric date warning was showing though. 20:28 wajasu someone added two args in the middle 20:28 wajasu right, only rthe arguments were misaligned 20:28 rangi thats why no one picked it up 20:28 rangi i just got 4 oks 20:27 rangi yeah but the test wasnt failing 20:27 wajasu not the functionality, the test was broken. 20:27 rangi but not failing 20:27 wajasu thats been broke since 2009. from gitweb trace. 20:26 huginn 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8728 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, gmcharlt, Needs Signoff , t/db_dependent/Reserve.t test doesn't use resdate and expdate arguments for AddReserve 20:26 wajasu i got familiar with the test environent by working on bug 8728 20:26 rangi *sigh* 20:25 rangi yep 20:24 wajasu so i see why we need more tests, more integration tests, to flush them out early. 20:23 rangi git makes that easy 20:23 rangi up until the freeze there was time to fix those, if they werent fixed by freeze, its best to yank them out 20:23 rangi also, if i regression was caused, i would revert (paul does too) the feature that caused it 20:23 rangi gives it about a month to shake out any issues, but yes sign offers should be ready to leap into action if a blocker appears 20:22 rangi what i tried to do for 3.6 and 3.4 was a hard freeze, then only push bug fixes that are well tested 20:22 rangi wajasu: ideally it gets less hectic :) 20:21 wajasu i just wondered how hectic it gets before release time, and if stuff falls on the floor because of little bugs, then us signer offers need to be ready to retest/sign off again. etc. 20:21 magnuse rangi++ for the stats 20:20 wajasu ha 20:19 rangi https://twitter.com/libriotech/statuses/243707897345896448 20:19 rangi wajasu: thats what happens when you let a math major lose on your project info 20:19 wajasu golden info. thanks 20:19 rangi and i vote we follow magnuse suggestion 20:18 rangi http://blog.bigballofwax.co.nz/2012/08/14/how-does-a-patch-marked-enhancement-take-to-get-into-master/ 20:18 rangi http://blog.bigballofwax.co.nz/2012/08/12/how-long-does-a-patch-take-to-make-it-into-master/ 20:17 rangi and the rest of your question can be answered with how long is a piece of string 20:17 rangi so depends on if bug fixes or enhancements 20:17 rangi well the feature freeze is before oct 22nd 20:17 wajasu those helped 20:16 wajasu will things move pretty quick, by oct 22nd? or nov for 3.10? or will much of the signed off queue hang around until next year? 20:16 rangi those might help explain 20:16 rangi http://koha-community.org/about/release-schedule/ 20:14 rangi http://koha-community.org/roles-koha-3-10-0/ 20:14 wahanui somebody said the qa team was required 20:14 rangi the qa team 20:13 wajasu who takes things from signed off to passwd qa? 20:13 rangi needs signoff everyone should watch 20:13 rangi signed off is the queue the QA team should watch 20:13 rangi passed qa is the queue paul should watch 20:12 rangi back 20:12 wajasu signed iff query at bottom of bug page: http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/buglist.cgi?cmdtype=dorem&remaction=run&namedcmd=Signed%20Off&sharer_id=1&list_id=40415 20:12 cait not sure which queue you are looking at 20:12 cait paul pushes the passed qa patches, sometimes he sets passed qa too, but we have other people qaing too, the qam and his qaa (assistants) 20:11 wajasu so those 73 signed off patches are in his queue? 20:10 wajasu ii was trying to understand what paul said about pushing things next week. 20:10 cait I am not making sense today - i am starting to get used to it :) 20:10 wizzyrea or maybe not. 20:10 wizzyrea i think that's what he meant. 20:09 cait often passed qa next - without pushing it to a branch 20:09 cait not necessesarily pushed qa 20:09 wizzyrea yep 20:08 wajasu so after signoff comes "Pushed for QA", then another test cycle with a QA lead. QAM is a tough role to have when eveyone wants their patch in. 20:08 oleonard Maybe, I haven't really investigated well 20:07 cait only sticking with yui for now? 20:07 cait oleonard: what do you think, what options to we have? 20:07 cait wajasu++ 20:04 wajasu testing is the best way to learn about the codebase, 20:01 rangi Ok my stop bbiab 20:00 cait boo. 19:59 oleonard It seems to leave a lot of the heavy lifting up to the individual developer, lacking built-in handling for some essential features 19:59 rangi wajasu++ #good testing 19:58 oleonard The demo is minimal though: http://view.jqueryui.com/master/demos/menu/default.html 19:58 cait and here is something about ARIA there 19:58 cait doens't look too bad? 19:58 cait http://wiki.jqueryui.com/w/page/12137997/Menu 19:57 * oleonard has no idea why 19:57 oleonard YUI3 doesn't even have a standalone menu widget anymore! 19:56 cait and are theere maybe other plugins for jquery we could make use of? 19:56 cait how did it look? 19:56 oleonard cait: I confess I got so fed up the other day thinking about the jqueryui menu issue I even looked at YUI3 19:54 cait else I might have to change all the pull down menus into links for the library 19:54 oleonard Of course I don't really know, but it seems like the next release is coming soon 19:54 cait I had hoped it might be better accessible than yui 19:54 cait oh no :( 19:53 oleonard cait: At this point it looks like it must be heading for a release with minimal documentation, minimal features. If that's true, it's as useless to us as if it weren't released. 19:53 rangi Cool I'll write up what I learn 19:53 cait I would so love to see that in 3.10 - but guess it's not going to happen 19:53 rangi After watching the crap they have yo deal with to use websites it's the least I can do 19:53 oleonard Cool. I confess I know nothing about it, but I'd like to learn. 19:53 cait oleonard: is there news about jquery ui menu maybe? 19:52 cait :) 19:52 rangi Just learning how to do it best 19:52 rangi Oh I'll do it 19:52 oleonard Is that a wish list kind of thing or does that have some push behind it? 19:51 rangi And yes oleonard hence that bug 19:51 rangi But he is used to going to work so his sitter brings him in 19:50 rangi The dog is someone's who is traveling to countries that aren't friendly to guide dogs 19:50 rangi He just uses a cane 19:50 cait cool 19:50 rangi Nope not his dog 19:50 rangi No every Friday he sets aside an hour for anyone to talk to him 19:49 huginn 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8712 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, NEW , We should use WAI-ARIA guidelines to help with accessibility -OMNIBUS bug 19:49 oleonard Hence Bug 8712 rangi ? 19:49 cait is it julius' guide dog? 19:49 rangi Then visit the guide dog downstairs then beer o'clock 19:49 cait cornering him at beer o clock? 19:49 cait hm? :) 19:48 rangi Which means I get an hour of Julius time to talk about aria tags 19:48 rangi On the upside it's friday 19:44 rangi 43kmph gust to 80 apparently 19:43 huginn bag: hankbank was last seen in #koha 1 day, 23 hours, 47 minutes, and 19 seconds ago: <hankbank> working on presentation to Future of Libraries conference in SF about Koha at LG needed to talk about IRC as cultural phenom 19:43 bag @seen hankbank 19:40 rangi That doesn't mention the nice spring 'breeze' 19:38 huginn rangi: The current temperature in Wellington, New Zealand is 15.0°C (7:00 AM NZST on September 07, 2012). Conditions: Light Rain Showers. Humidity: 82%. Dew Point: 12.0°C. Pressure: 29.74 in 1007 hPa (Steady). 19:38 rangi @wunder nzwn 19:33 rangi Yep good idea 19:32 rangi I think everyone should be forced to attend owasp day :-) 19:32 wajasu perm checking might need to be something we double check in test scripts. 19:32 rangi Never ever trust the browser 19:32 wahanui what's up, wajasu 19:32 wajasu hi 19:32 oleonard Hi rangi 19:32 rangi Morning btw 19:32 rangi Ah yeah the perm checks should be done in the script 19:28 wajasu khall: just FYI. even though permissions are used to hide links, etc (no delete reserve perm). i was able to still delete a reserve by editing the url action at the top of the browser. 19:19 wajasu are you hoping 19:19 wajasu khall: are hoping for 3.10 version? 19:18 khall excellent! thanks! 19:18 wajasu ok. thats all i think i found. :) great work! 19:17 khall wajasu, put a note in bugzilla and I'll see what I can do about it. 19:16 wajasu khall: i can't add/delete reserves as a staff unless i have a manage_courses(add/edit/del) permission [can't navigate to courses. i can see superlibrarian/admin creating the courses, and others just managing reserves. 19:00 wajasu ahh restricted menus :) 18:59 wajasu thx 18:59 wajasu yup needed catalogue 18:58 cait but no guarentees :) 18:58 cait trying again: catalogue I think 18:58 wajasu circulate wasn't enough. trying more. 18:57 cait oleonard++ 18:57 cait sorry wajasu for misinformation 18:56 wajasu ok any one will open the door i guess. here goes. 18:56 cait should have looked at the interface :( 18:55 cait the other is permissons for staff? 18:55 cait oh right 18:55 oleonard Usually for circ staff you'd add circulate, catalogue, borrowers, reserveforothers 18:55 wajasu that seems to allow delegation of permission assignment 18:54 oleonard The "staffaccess" one is not the one you want 18:54 wajasu i see it 18:54 cait there is one staff access I think 18:54 cait read through them 18:53 wajasu circulate? 18:53 wajasu when i add a staff user, i can't login. no permission for the staff clinet home page. which permission do i need to enable? 18:48 mbalmer more time for sip 18:37 huginn 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8215 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, kyle, Needs Signoff , Add Course Reserves 18:37 eythian bug 8215 18:37 khall excellent! 18:37 wajasu khall: almost done testing 8215. checking out permissions. looks promising :) 18:21 wizzyrea my libraries have been pestering me for that ;) 18:21 wizzyrea i knew there was a reason I wasn't all over that. 18:20 wizzyrea er but I'd have to be using 3.8. So, yea no. 18:19 cait didn't test it 18:19 cait in theory yes 18:19 eythian replacementprice rather 18:18 eythian I should be able to use <<items.replacementcost>> in there 18:18 * wizzyrea sighs 18:18 wizzyrea speaking of which I need to put that into nexpress. 18:18 wizzyrea http://bywatersolutions.com/2012/09/04/add-saved-amount-to-checkout-receipt/ 18:18 * wizzyrea looks for the link 18:17 wizzyrea well bag did a thing to compute costs for receipts maybe a similar approach would work here? 18:17 cait <item>... </item> I think, so only in that notice 18:16 eythian that's what I thought 18:16 cait you can get all item fields in there 18:16 eythian cait: no, they really don't make sense 18:16 cait should be possible 18:16 cait we can try to explain th eothers to you too :P 18:16 eythian next thing is to determine if I can get the item replacement cost into there. 18:15 wizzyrea hehe 18:15 eythian (which is surprising as the rest of their questions didn't) 18:15 wizzyrea \o/ 18:15 eythian OK, now it makes sense. 18:15 eythian yes, that's what it is 18:15 cait yeah, so 3rd notice is: you didn't bring it back, we are going to make you pay for a replacement 18:15 wizzyrea you could make it so that the final notice 18:15 wizzyrea well 18:15 cait aah 18:14 * cait still feels like making not much sense today 18:14 eythian I think they've put it into the overdue rules 18:14 eythian ahh 18:14 cait after you searched your shelves and they had some time to find it? 18:14 cait I think maybe when an item is marked missing for x time, you would put it on lost after that and send them the invoice 18:14 wizzyrea no, I don't think you can currently use it 18:14 eythian They have created this, I'm attempting to see if they could use it from anywhere. 18:14 wizzyrea lol 18:13 cait like wizzyrea - it makes sense, but I am not sure koha can do something with it :) 18:13 eythian I'm trying to work out what the client was thinking 18:13 wahanui "What are you trying to do?" "What is the goal?" or "What problem are you experiencing?" 18:13 wizzyrea the first question? 18:13 wizzyrea also you'd want to be able to (eventually) designate whether you wanted all lost items for that patron for all time, paid or not, or just the ones currently outstanding. 18:13 cait whichmodule did they add it to? 18:13 cait I haven't heard about it 18:13 cait I am not sure it's an existing feature 18:13 eythian how does that work? 18:12 wizzyrea through fines 18:12 eythian but how would you access it? 18:12 wizzyrea I can certainly see the utility of that 18:12 eythian It doesn't seem to be referenced in the code 18:11 eythian is there somewhere that would allow you to use that. 18:11 eythian can someone tell me if it would make sense at any time to create a custom notice called 'INV' that is an invoice for lost items? 18:11 cait where we could put it 18:11 cait but I am not sur eif I have a good idea 18:11 cait yeah 18:11 wizzyrea it could be more prominent ;) 18:11 cait hm. 18:11 cait ah right 18:11 wizzyrea sorry "worldwide in libraries of all sizes" 18:10 wizzyrea under about "in use by libraries worldwide" 18:10 wizzyrea oh, actually it's already linked from there 18:10 wizzyrea well we could do it under About 18:09 cait was looking it up :) 18:09 cait http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Koha_Users_Worldwide 18:09 wizzyrea :) 18:09 wizzyrea if not it's cool I'll look it up 18:09 wizzyrea just thought you might have it handy 18:09 wizzyrea do you have the link? 18:09 * wizzyrea is impossibly lazy 18:09 cait but from where? hm 18:09 wizzyrea we could, sure 18:09 cait maybe we could? 18:09 cait hm 18:08 wizzyrea oh, the wiki page. no, we don't 18:08 cait ah 18:08 wizzyrea clearly not, since I don't know what that is. 18:08 cait people at the workshop didn't know about the page in the wiki 18:08 wizzyrea users list. 18:08 cait wizzyrea: do we link to the users list from the homepage somewhere? 18:08 wizzyrea hehe 18:08 eythian so really the point is now moot. 18:08 eythian I realised however that their request made no sense 18:07 eythian wizzyrea: yeah, I think that's it 18:07 cait <big hugs back> 18:07 cait aww 18:07 wizzyrea hi cait <big hugs> 18:07 cait hi wizzyrea :) 18:07 cait I thought he was, but he doesn't tell :P 18:06 wizzyrea is that what you are talking about? 18:06 wizzyrea oh wait - do you have the syspref on for "email librarian when hold is placed" 18:06 wizzyrea neither 18:06 cait I am not sure about those, we don't use them 18:05 cait hm you mean the holds that go to the library? 18:03 eythian under what circumstance is a hold email generated? Is it just when the hold is placed via the OPAC, or also when through the staff interface? 17:24 gaetan_B bye! 16:32 ago43 okay. I saw that bug, but didn't make the connection so filed a new one. Thanks! 16:32 eythian marked the bug as a dup because it probably is. 16:30 jcamins So you saved ago43 a romp through Bugzilla. :) 16:30 ago43 lemme check that. 16:30 eythian ah right 16:29 jcamins eythian: however, I didn't have the bug number, so "getting there" was actually going to involve me telling ago43 to look in Bugzilla to find a fix you did. 16:29 eythian heh OK 16:29 jcamins eythian: I was getting there. 16:28 jcamins ago43: you can confirm this by removing the punctuation and space at the end of one of the searches. 16:28 huginn 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8646 minor, P5 - low, ---, robin, Pushed to Stable , Certain search terms cause browser "script taking too long" error 16:28 eythian jcamins: bug 8646 16:27 huginn 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8736 normal, P5 - low, ---, gmcharlt, NEW , Series searching causes script error 16:27 jcamins ago43: bug 8736 is probably caused by the punctuation at the end of the series facets. 15:55 eythian yeah, I just read it. Looks busy :) 15:52 oleonard The patch is really shaping up thanks to khall's hard work 15:51 eythian thanks, we've had a client sitting on considering that for quite some time 15:50 oleonard It modifies the process for both operations 15:50 huginn 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7067 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, kyle.m.hall, Signed Off , allow patron self registration via the opac 15:50 oleonard Bug 7067 15:50 eythian or was it just updating their own details? 15:50 eythian did I see something about allowing borrowers to sign up from the OPAC? 15:48 eythian goodness, looks like we have a 3.6 -> 3.8 upgrade happening in a day's worth of work, including a staging deploy for testing. That's nice and smooth. 15:47 eythian how sordid. 15:46 drojf lol 15:45 * oleonard turns on Def Leppard and readies the sugar bowl 15:44 * drojf needs sugar 15:38 eythian they came crying back when no one was visiting them 15:37 drojf yes and then all turned back to normal pretty soon :D 15:37 eythian and google did kick them all out 15:37 drojf i think belgium 15:37 eythian there was somewhere else (france maybe?) that happened 15:37 drojf i hope they get ignored everywhere. google should not list them AT ALL, kick them out of their whole services. i think they did that before 15:35 wizzyrea poorly. 15:35 drojf because they are really oldschool, missed new technical opportunities and fight everything that is happening 15:35 wizzyrea that seems nuts, how are they going to enforce that. 15:35 wizzyrea maybe they should write the first paragraph in such a way that I'll be inclined to click on it to read it :P 15:34 wizzyrea well that is a legislative antifeature if I've ever seen one. 15:34 drojf you can link. but if you are eg. google and have something like a snippet of the news and the link, it's too much already i think. german publiushers are idiots and think they deserve money for that 15:33 wizzyrea so like you can't link to the NYtimes without paying them, for example? 15:33 drojf i would assume google news kicking out all of them 15:32 drojf it's really strange 15:32 drojf i think it only applies to content industry that wants to be compensated somehow. they excluded bloggers in the end 15:32 wizzyrea I suppose they should license their content appropriately in that case 15:32 drojf jcamins: it's called "leistungsschutzrecht" and it's complete bullsh…craziness 15:32 wizzyrea what if they don't want to be paid? 15:31 jcamins drojf: seriously? 15:31 wizzyrea O.o 15:31 drojf interesting service. would probably be DOA in germany due to our great new law forbidding internet companies the "stealing" (quoting) of snippets (and linking to the original page) without paying the source 15:30 * mtompset waves, "Off to dreamland. Hopefully waking up = mostly indexed." 15:29 wizzyrea it's a pretty new service 15:28 wizzyrea ^^ because no api when I was looking at it weeks and weeks ago 15:28 jcamins drojf: wizzyrea was just using a link. 15:27 jcamins No, the API already had ISBN. 15:27 wizzyrea but I'm glad they built that in. And I suppose it's possible that they built that in since last night :) 15:27 drojf jcamins: what do you mean by "only"? would that not be used for a implementation in koha? 15:27 wizzyrea oh right, yea, I knew that part - the way I was doing it wasn't through the api though (because it didn't exist when I was last looking at it) 15:26 jcamins drojf: that's API only. 15:26 wizzyrea woot! 15:25 drojf wizzyrea: the api page of idreambooks already has ISBN? "{keywords} in the above URI is the search query. It can be any of the following: Book Title and/or Author ISBN (10 or 13)" 15:25 libsysguy its hard to keep up with lol 15:25 libsysguy and I keep seeing if bracketing all over the place 15:24 libsysguy I am just reading files for writing unit tests 15:24 libsysguy right 15:24 eythian (but, do it as a separate patch) 15:24 jcamins If indentation is so screwed up it gets in the way of the development, fix whatever you have to, with the goal being as little as possible. 15:24 eythian libsysguy: I tend to perltidy the function I'm working on, if it's bad. 15:24 jcamins Perltidy one file at a time, in a patch that is nothing but perltidy. 15:24 libsysguy i try to 15:23 oleonard libsysguy: Fix indentation of lines you are otherwise changing 15:23 libsysguy ugh 15:23 jcamins Destroys history, limited value. 15:23 jcamins No. 15:23 jcamins libsysguy: already discussed. 15:23 libsysguy can we make a script do it 15:23 libsysguy has a vote for the next meeting, properly tabbing files 15:22 eythian just bring a tin of paint 15:22 * wizzyrea makes a note to stock up on sunscreen 15:20 oleonard And they should make a handy spray to make it go away 15:20 eythian it'll never catch on. 15:20 jcamins It has a nice ring. 15:20 * jcamins thinks we should call it an "ozone layer." 15:19 eythian It's like there's some kind of invisible protective shield in the sky 15:19 eythian I do like how I pretty much can't get sunburnt in this part of the world. 15:18 * wizzyrea nods knowingly 15:18 wizzyrea eythian++ 15:18 wahanui sunspots are what you get from staring at the sun for too long 15:18 wizzyrea sunspots. 15:18 wahanui OK, eythian. 15:18 eythian wahanui: sunspots are \what you get from staring at the sun for too long 15:18 wahanui eythian: wish i knew 15:18 eythian wahanui: sunspots are what you get from staring at the sun for too long 15:18 jcamins I'm going to have to go with static buildup. 15:18 trea the earth's magnetic pull is pretty strong today 15:17 wizzyrea sunspots. 15:17 wahanui jcamins: Daemons did it 15:17 jcamins excuse? 15:17 trea oh yea, i hadn't considered that. :P 15:17 eythian it could also be static buildup. 15:17 trea ^^ 15:17 wizzyrea ^^ this 15:17 wahanui eythian: static buildup 15:17 eythian wahanui: excuse? 15:17 jcamins Ooh, wait. It could also be a reverse proxy in front of the server. 15:17 wizzyrea and/or similar internal networks 15:16 trea right, makes sense 15:16 wizzyrea and what I'm trying to get at - is "do they have the same firewall setup at each branch" 15:16 wizzyrea all managed by the same IT department or multiple IT departments? 15:16 trea all good suggestions however 15:15 trea IP changes are definitely something i've witnessed before. this is happening to multiple branches connecting to the same server on different ISPs, so i doubt addressing is to blame 15:15 wizzyrea ^^ is probably the issue. 15:15 wizzyrea oo yea, dynamic addressing 15:14 jcamins IP changes. 15:14 wizzyrea time and date wrong on the computer 15:14 wizzyrea not keeping cookies 15:13 trea are there any other settings that would affect a session timeout besides the koha syspref? 15:13 eythian ah right, that's what I've been seeing then 15:13 wizzyrea eythian: http://irc.koha-community.org/irclog/koha/2012-09-05#i_1068318 15:12 jcamins Item type images on the search results page *kill* performance. 15:12 eythian I've seen that going through our internal systems a bit lately 15:12 * jcamins thinks that injecting the item type image URL directly into the record at indexing time would be a better option. 15:12 eythian wizzyrea: what's that about 942 itype images? 15:11 * jcamins considers. 15:11 * jcamins thinks that making item type images *always* bib-level on the search page might meet the users' needs, without painful modifications to the XSLT. 15:10 * wizzyrea bounces and squees 15:10 * wizzyrea is so proud 15:10 wizzyrea sounds like you guys had an epic and fruitful conversation with the idreambooks guy! 15:09 * wizzyrea just read the logs 15:09 wizzyrea oh and we've wanted that thing rangi was talking about re: 942 itype images for AGES. 15:09 kf bye all :) 15:06 mtompset Still prickly, rambutan? ;) 15:05 jcamins Hehe. 15:05 wizzyrea always too slow. 15:05 wizzyrea bye! 15:05 reiveune bye 15:05 wizzyrea I like how the IRC stat generator picked out my single pithy quote of the day yesterday. 15:02 wizzyrea I really ought to go read the logs eh 15:02 wizzyrea woot! 15:02 jcamins They'll be adding the ISBN access. 15:02 wizzyrea love. that. idea. 15:02 wizzyrea but I love the idea of real reviews from critics in the catalog. 15:01 wizzyrea if it's one they have though, it's always #1 15:01 wizzyrea best I was able to do in the short time I looked at it, was to get to the search results. 15:01 wizzyrea idreambooks doesn't let you query by isbn, so it's hard to get the exact book 14:59 wizzyrea sorry, it really had to be preserved for posterity 14:59 wizzyrea Curse you, Monty Python! 14:59 wizzyrea [09:56am] jcamins: 14:59 huginn wizzyrea: The operation succeeded. Quote #216 added. 14:59 wizzyrea @quote add <jcamins> I'm cataloging something by Horace Walpole, and I feel an *overwhelming* urge to A) have some cheese, and B) tell people that I am engaged in "Walpoling activities." 14:59 wizzyrea http://screencast.com/t/zjS98Iv39Gx 14:59 jcamins Curse you, Monty Python! 14:59 jcamins I'm cataloging something by Horace Walpole, and I feel an *overwhelming* urge to A) have some cheese, and B) tell people that I am engaged in "Walpoling activities." 14:58 wizzyrea what is terrible 14:58 wizzyrea terrible? 14:58 jcamins This is terrible. 14:57 jcamins You'd have to screen scrape. 14:57 jcamins Yeah, the readometer isn't available via API yet. 14:57 wizzyrea not the readometer tho 14:57 wizzyrea I think i did that 14:57 jcamins Yeah, I suggested using jQuery for a mockup. 14:56 wizzyrea lms if I can find it 14:56 wizzyrea that added just a link to their reviews 14:56 jcamins Also NYT reviews. 14:56 wizzyrea actually, I did a simple thing 14:55 wizzyrea that's what they told me too 14:55 jcamins I'm more interested in seeing the NYRB reviews from a year ago. 14:55 wizzyrea that's what I am hoping 14:55 jcamins And s/he said they were adding in more content, so maybe we'll see the archives fleshed out more? 14:55 wizzyrea and let's be honest here - do you really need a review of 1960 edition of hamlet? 14:54 wizzyrea but. new books become old books in time. 14:54 jcamins Yeah, definite downside. 14:54 wizzyrea their reviews are mostly collected for new books, which is really the only downside 14:53 jcamins I was pushing for them to include a link to the readometer in their API. 14:53 * jcamins too. 14:53 wizzyrea I really like the "readometer" 14:52 * oleonard grumps 14:52 jcamins Works for me. 14:52 wizzyrea ohhhhhh THAT is pretty wicked, actually 14:52 wizzyrea it opens in my libreoffice 14:52 wahanui jcamins: what? 14:52 jcamins wahanui: no surprise there! 14:51 wahanui Powerpoint is dying on me :( 14:51 jcamins Powerpoint? 14:51 * oleonard can't open the Powerpoint file attached to the bug in LibreOffice 14:50 mtompset Though, when I hear "development assistance" I sometimes think money. ;) 14:49 wizzyrea pretty cool that they took me up on it 14:49 jcamins wizzyrea: I know. I thought it was Greg, but s/he implicated you. :) 14:48 wizzyrea yea that was my doing, I contacted them 14:48 oleonard That's a good sign. 14:48 jcamins oleonard: I didn't read the bug. S/he was asking how to go about submitting a patch to Koha. 14:47 oleonard jcamins: "willing to provide development assistance" doesn't exactly sound like "We will submit a patch" 14:47 halfie websense is crap and it can't dissect SSH traffic over port 443 14:46 * mtompset laughs. 14:46 oleonard Glad to hear that ban is working out halfie ;) 14:46 mtompset Geography really wasn't the intent of the question. ;) 14:46 halfie IRC is banned at work , hence have to use another host for my IRC fix ;) 14:46 jcamins S/he filed a bug and is hoping to integrate their review stuff into Koha. 14:45 oleonard jcamins: I saw the bug report, that's pretty cool to get that kind of interest 14:45 wizzyrea ohhh coool 14:44 eythian mtompset: he's using an Amazon EC2 server as an IRC shell, and is based in the US I'd expect. 14:44 jcamins wizzyrea: someone from idreambooks came around yesterday evening. 14:44 halfie mtompset: i am using a amazon ec2 host :) 14:43 mtompset eythian++ # on the quick reply and find. :) 14:42 eythian use Digest::MD5 qw(md5_base64); 14:42 mtompset amazonaws.com? Where are you coming from, halfie? 14:42 eythian yeah, I think it uses base64_md5 or something along those lines 14:41 halfie eythian: cool, I will verify if it is md5, the data seems to be base64 14:41 eythian I have plans to replace it with salted bcrypt one day 14:40 eythian halfie: not sure, I think it's simple md5 at the moment. 14:40 halfie md5, how many rounds? 14:40 halfie eythian: which hashing algorithm is being used currently? 14:40 kf didn't knwo the word :) 14:40 kf sorry, 14:40 kf ah, crdentials 14:40 eythian kf: not credentials it doesn't 14:39 eythian and yes, hashed, albeit without salting which is something I want to fix 14:39 kf and patron_attributes if you use that functionality 14:39 eythian halfie: borrowers 14:38 halfie hi, in which table does koha store user credentials? (hashed I hope). 14:36 mtompset So, I may not have to leave instructions on how to skip 3.8.x ;) 14:36 mtompset I might be able to track this indexing mess down. 14:35 mtompset Yes, but you knew of it. 14:35 mtompset wizzyrea++ # thanks for the marc definitions. 14:35 mtompset jcamins++ # thanks for some bug report links. 14:35 eythian not me, I didn't write it :) 14:35 mtompset eythian++ # thanks for the script. 14:34 mtompset Well, this has been quite helpful. 14:32 mtompset It went down, but nothing below 150MB free. 14:32 mtompset It didn't dip. 14:32 mtompset I was watching it like a hawk. 14:32 wizzyrea but it would usually tell you if that was the case 14:31 wizzyrea out of memory maybe? 14:31 mtompset so at least more blocks should be reindexed next run. 14:31 mtompset Yes, this process will take more than the five minute trigger on the reindex call. 14:31 eythian do that anyway :) 14:31 eythian oh right. 14:30 eythian <eythian> I have had weird things where records wouldn't index, and then later they did. I never figured out what was happening there. 14:30 eythian that's why I said: <eythian> also, let that script go and reindex all it can, and then see what happens 14:30 mtompset Nevermind... the counter confused me. :) 14:30 mtompset That's weird... 19000 was indexed?! 14:29 eythian no 14:29 mtompset so does the koha-rebuild-zebra script use the sliced script? 14:28 wizzyrea (as long as it's 40) 14:27 wizzyrea so yes, should be ok :P 14:27 wizzyrea . Character positions that are not defined contain a blank (#). 14:27 mtompset I'm not going to count then. It probably is okay. 14:26 eythian not too likely to upset zebra, anyway 14:26 jcamins If that's exactly 40 characters, it's an okay gap. 14:26 wizzyrea are spaces valid for that? 14:25 wizzyrea right - the question is, is that an ok gap or a not ok gap? 14:25 eythian at least, not too unexpected 14:25 eythian 40 characters wide means that a big gap is OK 14:25 jcamins I'm not going to say it's "normal," but it's not surprising. 14:25 eythian actually, it is helpful :) 14:24 wizzyrea not helpful, huginn. 14:24 huginn wizzyrea: This field contains 40 character positions (00-39) that provide coded information about the record as a whole and about special bibliographic aspects of the item being cataloged. These coded data elements are potentially useful for retrieval and data management purposes. [] 14:24 wizzyrea @marc 008 14:24 eythian hmm, not sure. You'd have to look up the spec for that field 14:24 mtompset large gap. 14:23 mtompset <controlfield tag="008">050804s1957 001 0 eng d</controlfield> 14:23 eythian huh? 14:21 mtompset Is a large gap normal? 14:21 mtompset Hmmm.... where's the definition the 008? 14:20 eythian I'd try the reindexing again 14:20 mtompset Okay... no errors. 14:19 jcamins Don't use --valid 14:18 mtompset I don't see an option that is that clear. 14:17 mtompset not sure how to skip it. 14:16 jcamins You may want to do DTD checking eventually, but usually the problem is a lot more fundamental than that. 14:15 jcamins Skip DTD checking. 14:15 mtompset validation failed no DTD? 14:12 eythian libxml2-utils 14:12 eythian install it? 14:11 mtompset can't find it. 14:11 mtompset xmllint? 14:10 eythian I have had weird things where records wouldn't index, and then later they did. I never figured out what was happening there. 14:10 eythian also, let that script go and reindex all it can, and then see what happens 14:10 eythian mtompset: also check the ones above and around it, just in case 14:10 mtompset I'll check. 14:09 eythian mtompset: does xmllint see anything wrong? 14:09 eythian ...how? 14:09 rambutan yea 14:09 eythian my thesis? 14:09 mtompset I don't see anything wrong. 14:09 mtompset I did a "SELECT marcxml from biblioitems where biblionumber=#" 14:09 rambutan I was just reading 14:09 eythian I used them in my thesis 14:08 rambutan Skekel's Foxholes. I need to go back to school. 14:04 eythian don't use any abstraction when doing this, or you'll get mislead. 14:04 eythian that's what's being indexed, that's where the problem is likely to be 14:03 eythian have a look at the marcxml 14:03 mtompset I see 0,2,3,6 and 9. 14:03 mtompset The only thing strange is the number of tabs in the MARC view. 14:02 eythian yeah, it's usually something strange like a chopped-in-half record 14:02 jcamins eythian: and so far rebuild_zebra is being run with -x. 14:01 jcamins Usually you can *see* the problem, though. 14:01 eythian there's also marclint, but it's very picky 14:01 mtompset the marcxml field? 14:01 jcamins You could run it through xmllint to start. 14:00 mtompset So how do I tell what is bad about the record? 13:59 jcamins The 952 is generated on the fly when indexing. 13:59 jcamins Of course not. 13:59 mtompset There's no 952. 13:59 eythian in theory though, after a couple of runs of that script, you should end up with only the ones that are problematic not in the index 13:58 * mtompset nods. 13:58 eythian but check them both to be sure 13:57 eythian probably 18369 13:57 mtompset Does that mean there is an error on 18368 or 18369? 13:57 mtompset not indexed. 13:57 mtompset Okay... so here's the question: the first thing listed is 18369 as not listed. 13:56 eythian which would cause you to have a lot not indexed. 13:56 eythian after all, <eythian> mtompset: often things like that cause zebra to give up and not finish the reindex 13:56 eythian oh right 13:56 mtompset I suppose I should put that other option. 13:55 mtompset I just used -c 13:55 eythian and when it's settled down, run it again and see what got missed. 13:54 mtompset oh there's the whack load not indexed. 13:53 mtompset Running now. 13:53 mtompset magnuse++ 13:53 eythian yarp 13:52 magnuse if i'm not mistaken 13:51 magnuse /etc/koha/sites/x/koha-conf.xml where x is the name of the instance 13:51 mtompset what should KOHA_CONF be for packages? 13:51 magnuse ooh, bilbonumber 13:51 mtompset missing other variable. 13:50 mtompset so I set it. 13:50 mtompset my PERL5LIB was empty. 13:50 mtompset I'm having difficulties running the script on 3.8.4 13:49 jcamins Zee shell vee vant you to use? 13:49 eythian I don't know what the z stands for 13:48 slef eythian: zsh = zealot shell? 13:47 mtompset source is good. 13:47 mtompset if the source is bad. 13:47 jcamins When rebuilding, I believe so. 13:47 mtompset just checking data source. 13:47 jcamins mtompset: if the problem is with the data in 3.8.4, wouldn't it make more sense to run the script there first? 13:47 mtompset biblionumber order? 13:46 mtompset Does zebra index in bilibonumber order? 13:46 mtompset running the script on 3.6.3 13:44 jcamins eythian: nor do I. 13:42 eythian I don't know why that's written in ZSH, we have Perl... 13:41 huginn 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7286 enhancement, P2, ---, stephane.delaune, Pushed to Stable , Introduce rebuild_zebra_sliced.zsh to recursively rebuild zebra & be error proof 13:41 eythian jcamins: that's bug 7286 13:40 jcamins 6566 will also be useful. 13:40 jcamins Oh, I thought you meant rebuild_zebra_sliced.somethingweird. 13:39 huginn 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=6566 enhancement, P3, ---, christophe.croullebois, Pushed to Master , Checking if DB records are properly indexed 13:39 eythian Bug 6566 13:39 jcamins .somethingweird 13:39 mtompset About half indexed now. 13:39 jcamins rebuild_zebra_sliced. 13:39 eythian I'm trying to find it 13:39 mtompset what script are you talking about? 13:38 eythian the biblibre script will help 13:38 mtompset Methodology? 13:38 oleonard It's not hard if you try 13:38 mtompset I can believe we have a flakey record. 13:37 mtompset That's the problem. Pinning it down. 13:37 eythian although, if you have a flaky record, you'll still want to pin it down and fix it. 13:37 mtompset Might as well give that a shot. 13:36 huginn gmcharlt: Quote #117: "<druthb> basking ? You bask on the beach...one does not bask in the Potomac River basin...you melt or swelter or something, but you don't bask. :P" (added by jwagner at 01:17 PM, January 24, 2011) 13:36 gmcharlt @quote random 13:36 eythian mtompset: tried it with '-u'? 13:36 wahanui jcamins: non-redundant fan failure 13:36 jcamins excuse? 13:36 kf :D 13:36 mtompset Thanks. :) 13:36 wahanui kf: Daemons loose in system. 13:36 kf excuse? 13:36 kf ah TM... translation manager 13:36 mtompset What is TM? 13:36 * druthb perks. 13:36 wahanui i heard kf was cait or really, really sweet. or <reply>she gives me memory loss or a holds expert. 13:36 jcamins kf? 13:35 wahanui rumour has it druthb is wanting to be the TM for 3.12. Now we know she's crazy 13:35 kf druthb? 13:35 jcamins Okay, that looks correct. 13:35 mtompset and yes, a sudo to. 13:35 mtompset I also tried -b -a -f -v 13:34 mtompset For the packages. 13:34 mtompset koha-rebuild-zebra -f -v library 13:34 jcamins How did you reindex the 3.8.4 installation? 13:34 jcamins Yes, and not applicable to a package installation. 13:33 eythian err, have you *done* a full reindex, I meant 13:33 mtompset Ugly isn't it? :) 13:33 wahanui that is pulled from the fields 13:33 jcamins mtompset: what the heck is that? 13:33 mtompset We started with 512MB... This was the only way to get it to work. 13:32 eythian Also, have you don't a full reindex? 13:32 eythian what on earth are you doing with that crontab? 13:32 mtompset How would L2 Cache be the problem? 13:31 mtj no… seriosuly! 13:31 pastebot "mtompset" at 127.0.0.1 pasted "3.6.3 reindex" (13 lines) at http://paste.koha-community.org/155 13:31 eythian heh 13:31 mtj could this be a problem? 13:31 mtj can i just interject... how about L2 cache here? 13:30 wahanui paste is found at http://paste.koha-community.org 13:30 mtompset paste? 13:29 mtompset Let me grab the crontab script. 13:29 mtompset Okay. 13:29 jcamins Zebra works only with data out of biblioitems.marcxml and items.* 13:29 eythian (exactly) 13:29 eythian mtompset: what are you using to do a reindex? 13:29 jcamins It has nothing to do with MySQL. 13:28 mtompset That's why I was asking about 246$a and such... so I could query the MySQL directly to confirm. 13:28 eythian Oh, it's definitely a microelectronic Riemannian curved-space fault in write-only file system 13:28 mtompset But the results in 3.6.3 look correct. 13:27 eythian http://pages.cs.wisc.edu/~ballard/bofh/bofhserver.pl <-- this'll explain why 13:27 eythian oh, or sith lords. 13:26 eythian cosmic rays 13:26 oleonard mtompset: The influence of a Sith lord? 13:26 eythian it happens 13:26 jcamins I have no idea. 13:26 eythian have you noticed that the ones the new version returns tend to be the lower biblio numbers? 13:26 mtompset how could it be corrupted?! 13:26 jcamins Like, *very* corrupted data. 13:26 jcamins mtompset: sounds like you have corrupted data. 13:26 eythian mtompset: often things like that cause zebra to give up and not finish the reindex 13:26 jcamins oleonard: oooh. I don't think so. 13:25 mtompset [warn] d1: 1: Malformed tag 13:25 oleonard Like instead of explicitly listing choices in the .pref file, put <<borrower.category>> and have them automatically display 13:25 mtompset [warn] Couldn't read whole MARC record 13:25 jcamins oleonard: how do you mean? 13:24 wahanui irc logs are http://irc.koha-community.org/irclog/koha/ 13:24 mtompset irc logs? 13:24 mtompset Can't find in scroll back... 13:24 oleonard Is there a method in place for automatically displaying option in system preferences like patron category? Like placeholders in guided reports? 13:23 jcamins Which warnings? 13:23 mtompset Well, "warnings". 13:23 mtompset Another piece of information. While doing reindexing on the 3.8.4 I hit two types of errors. 13:23 mtompset Yes. 13:23 jcamins Kaizen: don't start over, start small. 13:23 libsysguy but I agree there is a lot of other stuff that needs to be fixed in the working Koha first lol 13:22 libsysguy i'll just end up starting over 13:22 libsysguy I haven't worked on my catalyst stuff in a long time 13:22 jcamins Do you find the records that aren't showing up in that search using other searches? 13:22 mtj libsysguy, i wouldnt bother yet… its a distraction 13:21 mtompset I chose "opposite" because it had such a small number of records in the 3.6.3 13:21 mtompset for other specific "title:word" searches, yes. But vastly different. 13:20 jcamins mtompset: odd. I can't really troubleshoot, being working on non-Koha things today, but are you seeing any results? 13:20 libsysguy if that would be ok? 13:20 libsysguy now that I have a better direction to work in 13:20 libsysguy I thought about seeing if I could integrate this into my catalyst work 13:19 mtj (but not ready for a github push yet) 13:19 mtompset but title:opposite isn't giving the same results. 13:19 mtj libsysguy, -> http://git.kohaaloha.com/?p=dev1/.git;a=summary 13:18 mtompset Both fully reindexed. 13:18 mtompset same data. 13:18 libsysguy we all do mtompset 13:18 mtompset Transplanting 3.6.3 tarball to 3.8.4 packages. 13:18 mtompset I'm having Zebra headaches. 13:18 libsysguy mtj did you post the sauce? 13:18 jcamins Nothing to do with the database. 13:18 jcamins Ah. 13:17 jcamins Koha would be a darn useless ILS if it didn't handle alternate access points. 13:17 mtompset But 3.8.4 isn't grabbing it for some reason. 13:17 libsysguy I didn't know if you were paying out the nose for bandwidth :p 13:17 mtj (i haven't worked on it since..) 13:17 libsysguy mtj I was afraid to ping it 13:17 jcamins 246 is alternate title. 13:17 jcamins mtompset: of course it does. 13:17 mtompset ^out^our^ 13:17 mtompset Because it seems like out 3.6.3 system searches 246$a 13:17 mtj libsysguy, my bootstrap thing is still up -> http://dev1.kohaaloha.com 13:16 oleonard and "Have you seen 'Keyword to MARC mapping yet?' 13:16 mtompset title:opposite 13:16 mtompset Explain why results showed up in my search. 13:15 wahanui "What are you trying to do?" "What is the goal?" or "What problem are you experiencing?" 13:15 jcamins first question? 13:15 jcamins I think you're asking the wrong question. 13:15 jcamins 245$b. 13:14 mtompset What's the title continuation one? 13:14 jcamins There's a patch relating to that. 13:14 jcamins 245$b, and not stored in the database. 13:13 mtompset So, where are the subtitles? 13:13 jcamins mtompset: and that is a good thing. 13:13 jcamins mtompset: there is not. 13:13 libsysguy yeah my poor head works like that too, only with less librarian :p 13:13 libsysguy remember how sekjal used to get going on a topic and before you know it he was talking about RDA or something 13:13 mtompset Can anyone tell me if there is a field in the koha db related to 246$a? 13:12 druthb he does that a lot. Youthful exuberance. 13:12 libsysguy I just fell down the rabbit hole 13:12 libsysguy oh there's not oleonard 13:12 mtompset Greetings, tcohen, mveron, mtj, jcamins, and anyone that I missed. :) 13:12 * mveron waves back :-) 13:11 * magnuse waves to tcohen and mveron and mtj 13:11 jcamins It pokes back, and refuses to work. 13:11 * jcamins pokes his NIC. 13:11 jcamins Speaking of pointy sticks... 13:11 mveron hi #koha 13:11 tcohen hi #koha 13:11 oleonard libsysguy: I think Bootstrap is interesting too but I don't see the connection between "how do we handle js and css assets sensibly" and "a css framework would help" 13:11 mtj im about... ;) 13:11 * druthb gets out the pointy stick. 13:11 libsysguy just like jcamins :p 13:11 libsysguy slacker 13:10 magnuse probably asleep 13:09 libsysguy mtj you around? 13:08 libsysguy I wonder how it is going 13:08 libsysguy I had seen that 13:07 oleonard mtj was working on a Bootstrap version of the OPAC 13:06 libsysguy oleonard: it seems like it might be a viable one 13:03 magnuse eythian: looks (very) good to me! 13:03 oleonard Bootstrap seems to be trying to become an alternative to jqueryUI 13:02 libsysguy or bootstrap ;) 13:02 libsysguy it would probably help to use a css framework as well 13:02 oleonard Rename to jquery-ui.css 13:02 oleonard jcamins: Grab the jquery-ui-*.css file from /css/smoothness/ 13:01 jcamins What about the CSS? 13:01 oleonard You're right it would really simplify handling assets like jqueryUI 13:01 libsysguy great minds think alike oleonard 13:00 oleonard As was I libsysguy, when I filed that bug in 2008 ;) 13:00 libsysguy I was thinking about the way drupal handles mult http requests 13:00 libsysguy heh 13:00 eythian http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Covers_from_multiple_sources_RFC#Work_To_Be_Done <-- magnuse, am I missing anything obvious? 12:59 huginn 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=1918 enhancement, P3, ---, dpavlin, In Discussion , Minify JavaScript and CSS 12:59 oleonard libsysguy: We can't because no one has finished Bug 1918 :P 12:59 libsysguy when I wanted to use dialog you have to move those over as well 12:59 libsysguy another issue I has was the images 12:59 oleonard Rename to jquery-ui.css 12:59 libsysguy instead of mashing them all into one can't we do on the fly minification 12:59 oleonard jcamins: And the jquery-ui-*.css file from /css/smoothness/ 12:58 wahanui i heard yeah that was fine as it is 12:58 libsysguy yeah that 12:58 oleonard Rename to jquery-ui.js 12:58 oleonard jcamins: The jquery-ui-*.js file from /js/ 12:58 jcamins :) 12:58 * jcamins has a *great* reason for sortable. 12:58 libsysguy actually if you wanted to do it that way oleonard why not load them as seperate minified files 12:57 jcamins (I mean, the files included) 12:57 oleonard libsysguy: No sense trying to use them all without good reasons 12:57 jcamins It looks completely different from what we have currently. 12:57 oleonard jcamins: Oh sorry 12:57 libsysguy well I think eventually it'd be nice to use them all 12:57 jcamins oleonard: no, that's not what I meant. I generated a custom ZIP with just those components, but it has a gazillion files. 12:57 oleonard No sense loading assets we don't use in Koha code. 12:57 oleonard libsysguy: I hoped to keep it as trim as possible 12:57 libsysguy heh 12:57 libsysguy well thats what I wanted 12:57 libsysguy oh 12:56 oleonard jcamins: Although currently they're ALL in there. :| Not what I wanted. 12:56 libsysguy why can't we just go ahead and load that whole jquery-ui.js file 12:56 oleonard The wiki lists them jcamins http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Coding_Guidelines#Using_jQueryUI_widgets 12:56 libsysguy serious question 12:55 jcamins oleonard: which files are needed from the custom jQueryUI zip? 12:55 kf magnuse: magic! 12:54 magnuse see, if you wish hard anough and wait long enough, jcamins appears! 12:54 libsysguy heh 12:54 jcamins Were you here two hours ago? I think not! 12:54 jcamins Hey, now. 12:54 magnuse \o 12:54 libsysguy about damn time jcamins 12:54 oleonard Hi passel of ByWaterians. And jcamins too! 12:53 * jcamins is here. 12:53 druthb o/ 12:49 pastebot "oleonard" at 127.0.0.1 pasted "Clean up your database for re-testing Bug 7067" (3 lines) at http://paste.koha-community.org/154 12:48 * oleonard is re-testing now 12:48 huginn 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7067 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, kyle.m.hall, Needs Signoff , allow patron self registration via the opac 12:48 magnuse hooray for all the work on Bug 7067! 12:33 magnuse heh 12:33 wahanui somebody said jcamins_away was probably not here, but you don't have to take my word for it! 12:33 magnuse jcamins_away? 12:33 magnuse hehe 12:32 kf red shoes needed? 12:32 kf hehe 12:32 magnuse if you wish hard enough... 12:32 kf don't trust his away messages 12:32 eythian This'll also be the incentive I need to build CHI 12:32 kf was trying to summon him 12:32 eythian I would, but he's away :) 12:32 kf eythian: maybe ask jcamins_away? :) 12:30 eythian Perhaps Fastmmap would do it 12:30 eythian ah well, I think it'll still be useful. 12:30 magnuse oh 12:29 eythian in a default, non-persistent/non-memcached setup, it would effectively do no caching I think 12:29 eythian actually, koha::cache doesn't choose how to cache things for the most part 12:28 * eythian grumps 12:28 eythian still should be documented. 12:28 eythian Oh, I see, it comes from the submodules 12:27 eythian although the docs for that don't say what 'cache_type' should be, just that it needs to be provided :< 12:27 magnuse ok 12:26 eythian yes 12:26 magnuse about caching: isn't using koha::cache (and letting that worry about where to cache) the way to go? 12:23 magnuse nice 12:22 eythian basically, a design for a "good enough" base that works and can be improved 12:22 magnuse ok, that's what i thought 12:22 eythian So I want to get a feel for exactly what needs to be done. 12:21 eythian magnuse: just putting together an estimate 12:21 eythian or send something through that CSS can recognise to render the "not found" text 12:21 magnuse eythian: sorry, what did you say you had funding for? hacking on this, or just for putting together a price estimate? 12:21 eythian but if we implement the iframe method, then we can do whatever we like 12:20 eythian Well, I'm trying to avoid javascript as this is from the point of view of the opac (mostly, exactly the same logic will apply to the staff client) 12:19 oleonard Javascript or CSS could both be solutions for providing an image instead of text if a library wants to customize. 12:19 eythian oleonard: that's a future option I'll ignore for now 12:18 oleonard That's why we currently use CSS-styled text 12:18 oleonard Providing a default "not found" image if nothing can be found is problematic because of translations 12:18 magnuse eythian: that looks excellent! 12:17 eythian not for what needs to be done 12:17 eythian well, my plan for how it will work 12:17 eythian http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Covers_from_multiple_sources_RFC#Proposed_Method <-- magnuse, my plan 12:16 oleonard Amazon returns a 1x1 gif if no cover image is found 12:13 magnuse yay! 12:13 eythian It's possible I'll change that as new images stuff will probably end up in Koha:: 12:12 eythian hmm OK 12:12 oleonard Hi #koha 12:12 magnuse lots of dicussions and i think jcamins got tired of it and showd it into C4 ;-) 12:11 magnuse yeah, there was a reason it didn't go in there 12:11 eythian C4::Images uses nothing in C4 aside from Context, it should be in Koha:: 12:11 magnuse open library has a 1x1 transparent gif or png 12:10 magnuse amazon has it's own kind of image for that 12:10 eythian ah right 12:10 magnuse there is no syspref or similar for that that i know of 12:10 eythian (i.e. "no cover found" image) 12:10 magnuse http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=blob;f=C4/Images.pm;hb=HEAD#l44 12:10 eythian if no service can provide a cover, do we have the option to say what cover to show? 12:09 magnuse not sure that is the kind of thing you are thinking about 12:09 eythian oh well, I'll add that as a future feature 12:09 eythian hmm 12:09 magnuse jcamins_away does it in his local images scripts 12:07 eythian I'm sorta sure I saw somewhere once where you could specify an image to show if none could be found, am I imagining things? 12:00 kf eythian++ 12:00 kf :) 11:56 eythian heh 11:55 magnuse hm, not sure i can wait that long ;-) 11:55 eythian I'm writing my ideas into the wiki now 11:55 eythian next hour, hour-and-a-half 11:54 magnuse eythian: any timeframe for you investigations? 11:50 magnuse yeah, it should be solvable! 11:50 magnuse yeah, that thought crossed my mind too, that's true 11:49 magnuse which is not a big deal, i guess 11:49 eythian you can do <iframe src="opac-cover.pl?type=html&biblionumber=x" /> in a template too 11:49 magnuse if you are getting html from the "unified covers script" you need to use ajax, i think 11:49 magnuse but as long as you only get an image back you can do <img src="opac-cover.pl?bibliotenumber=x"> in a template 11:48 magnuse yeah, my thinking too 11:47 eythian But, I think we can do that later. 11:47 eythian We'll burn that bridge when we get to it, I think. It's solvable. For example, instead of returning an image, it could provide HTML that we insert. 11:46 magnuse but then, i guess there are places where that is just not feasible 11:46 magnuse well, as soon as the source wants a link from the image back to them or something similar, it breaks down 11:45 eythian Why? 11:44 magnuse trouble is, there aren't that many sources that go well with this kind of approach, i think 11:43 magnuse hehe 11:43 magnuse ah, i'll continue using my little crutch for a while then, and see what happens 11:43 eythian (unless it turns out I can do it in an hour or so, which I doubt) 11:43 eythian they will hopefully approve that 11:43 eythian however, the time I have is really just to ascertain what will need to be done and get a time estimate for them. 11:42 magnuse yay 11:41 eythian That was the sort of approach I was thinking of 11:41 magnuse feel free to use it or ignore it completely :-) 11:40 magnuse eythian: i needed some kind of proof of concept of "unified covers" for my digital signs, so i came up with this: https://github.com/MagnusEnger/kohawork/blob/bug8628-digitalsigns/opac/opac-cover.pl 11:39 eythian The library wants covers from the NZ Nat Lib, but to add another source like that will require the multiple images to be fixed 11:39 * jcamins_away shan't have time this week either. 11:39 magnuse eythian: very cool! 11:38 * magnuse will not have time for it this week 11:38 eythian magnuse: so I think I'm going to spec up the easy way for now, and allowing ordering to be done can come later. 11:38 magnuse jcamins_away: i'm sure eythian wouldn't mind you testing his work 11:38 jcamins_away :D 11:38 * mtompset smirks. 11:38 eythian jcamins_away: I was working on those yesterday, got them rebased (untested) to current master 11:37 * jcamins_away wanders off. 11:37 jcamins_away No. 11:37 jcamins_away Oh. 11:37 * jcamins_away perks up his ears. Internationalized packages? 11:37 eythian so, I've got a small amount of funding to look into the images things 11:37 magnuse yup 11:35 eythian magnuse: y'about? 11:34 mtompset Software Freedom Day. Nice. :) 11:14 kf drojf: cool :) 10:44 mtompset going back to eating again. 10:44 mtompset So you already ran that step. 10:41 Jorgen says this: lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 37 Sep 6 20:00 /etc/init.d/koha-zebra-daemon -> /usr/share/koha/bin/koha-zebra-ctl.sh 10:40 mtompset ls -la /etc/init.d/koha-zebra-daemon and confirm it is pointing to the right place. 10:39 Jorgen and get this: ln: failed to create symbolic link `/etc/init.d/koha-zebra-daemon': File exists 10:38 Jorgen I also just wanted to make sure that zebra is starting up at boot so from the install i did this: sudo ln -s /usr/share/koha/bin/koha-zebra-ctl.sh /etc/init.d/koha-zebra-daemon 10:38 * mtompset is off to supper. 10:38 mtompset If you want to keep the weirdness that is fine, but you need /usr/share/koha/lib in there. 10:38 mtompset export PERL5LIB=/usr/share/koha/lib 10:38 mtompset export KOHA_CONF=/etc/koha/koha-conf.xml 10:37 magnuse that still looks weird 10:36 Jorgen this is the error: /home/kohatest/perl5/lib/perl5/i686-linux-gnu-thread-multi-64int:/home/kohatest/perl5/lib/perl5 10:36 Jorgen te 10:36 Jorgen did it pase 10:36 Jorgen woops - 10:36 magnuse Jorgen: and what does "echo $PERL5LIB" on the command line give you now? 10:36 magnuse oops 10:34 magnuse and what does "echo $PERL5LIB" on the command line give you now? 10:34 Jorgen Can't locate C4/Context.pm in @INC (@INC contains: /home/kohatest/perl5/lib/perl5/i686-linux-gnu-thread-multi-64int /home/kohatest/perl5/lib/perl5/i686-linux-gnu-thread-multi-64int /home/kohatest/perl5/lib/perl5 /etc/perl /usr/local/lib/perl/5.14.2 /usr/local/share/perl/5.14.2 /usr/lib/perl5 /usr/share/perl5 /usr/lib/perl/5.14 /usr/share/perl/5.14 /usr/local/ 10:33 Jorgen same error was this: 10:33 wahanui mtompset: I forgot same error 10:33 mtompset wahanui forget same error 10:33 wahanui same error is face earlier also 10:33 mtompset same error? 10:33 Jorgen Hi - still not getting koha-index-daemon to work. 10:30 drojf kf: the day we are in wildau is software freedom day :) http://www.softwarefreedomday.org/ 10:29 Jorgen ok, that file is empty, just added the lines and will log in and out. will report back to see how it went. 10:28 mtompset The bottom of your .bashrc, log out, log in... that should be good enough. :) 10:27 mtompset Since you did a tarball install. :) 10:27 mtompset export PERL5LIB=/usr/share/koha/lib 10:27 mtompset export KOHA_CONF=/etc/koha/koha-conf.xml 10:27 jcamins_away Jorgen: either option is fine. You need to set KOHA_CONF and PERL5LIB. 10:27 mtompset I'm not familiar with option 1. :) 10:26 mtompset I would be able to help you with option 2. :) 10:26 Jorgen Is option 2 better? 10:26 Jorgen so i followed the link - that leads you to install a few cpan modules. Towards the end of that link they then use the koha-index stuff. 10:25 mtompset Perhaps tcohen has. :) 10:25 mtompset Right... I would like to say, I haven't tested option 1. :) 10:25 Jorgen Do Either Option#1 [OPTION 1 is Highly RECOMMENDED for Koha version 3.06.02]or Option #2 DO NOT DO BOTH. Option #1: Use the Zebra Index Daemon to manage indexing. See http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Background_indexing_with_Zebra 10:24 wahanui koha-zebra-daemon is in init.d, linked to koha-zebra-ctl.sh in oleonard's koha bin directory 10:24 mtompset koha-zebra-daemon 10:23 mtompset There is no mention of koha-index-daemon in these instructions. 10:23 mtompset koha-index-daemon? 10:22 Jorgen I did the web installer - and that all seems fine - but this looks to me like I could have some issues.. 10:21 Jorgen the error starts off like: Can't locate C4/Context.pm in @INC (@INC contains: /etc/perl /usr/local/lib/perl/5.14.2 /usr/local/share/perl/5.14.2 /usr/lib/perl5 /usr/share/perl5 /usr/lib/perl/5.14 /usr/share/perl/5.14 /usr/local/lib/site_perl .) at /usr/local/share/perl/5.14.2/Koha/Contrib/Tamil/RecordReader.pm line 16. 10:21 mtompset that doesn't look right. 10:20 Jorgen i did the echo - /home/kohatest/perl5/lib/perl5/i686-linux-gnu-thread-multi-64int:/home/kohatest/perl5/lib/perl5 10:20 mtompset tarball is like snowball. :) 10:20 mtompset tarball refers to how the file is comprised. 10:19 Jorgen Sorry, what does tarball mean? 10:19 mtompset echo $PERL5LIB and you will know. 10:19 Jorgen I'm pretty sure I set it up - but will try again now. 10:19 mtompset you haven't set the environment variables. 10:18 Jorgen However, I followed its recommended Option 1 for the Zebra..and when I run koha-index-daemon i get an error that it couldnt find the C4 file. 10:18 rangi ah annoying 10:18 mtompset It does have a pointer at the top of the page suggesting the packages are easier. 10:18 rangi thats what that page should tell you to do 10:18 mtompset koha_on_ubuntu is a tarball instruction set. 10:18 mtompset Though, you did do it the hard way, Jorgen. 10:18 rangi so you installed using the packages? 10:17 * mtompset cheers. 10:17 Jorgen Hi all, I've just did an install of koha 3.8.4 on ubuntu 12.04 - and it seems successful. Used this guide: http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Koha_on_Ubuntu 10:05 drojf eythian: good idea. but i think something is seriously broken with instances not really disabled but removed and other weird things. plus maybe some borked path somewhere in a config file. i think i'll just start over with a fresh vm when i have more time. tried to rescue the one from edinburgh but don't have time to look at that now. 10:02 mib_1x1t28 what about the other marcxml data in there - 245, 690's etc - where is that used? 09:58 eythian However, I would not modify the XML directly, as then it gets out of sync with the ISO2709 MARC in the 'marc' field, and potentially any tables that track marc fields. 09:57 eythian mib_1x1t28: there should be no 952 in the marcxml, and if there is it will be ignored. Item details come from the items table specifically. 09:56 huginn 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8550 normal, P5 - low, ---, jcamins, Pushed to Stable , Z39.50 searches for ISBN/ISSN problematic 09:56 huginn 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8696 minor, P5 - low, ---, nengard, Pushed to Stable , Tools menu says export bibs still 09:56 huginn 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8261 minor, P5 - low, ---, fridolyn.somers, Pushed to Stable , Cannot search system preferences from Local Use tab 09:56 jenkins_koha * jcamins: Bug 8550: restore ISSN field to Z39.50 search 09:56 jenkins_koha * nengard: Bug 8696: Update Export bibs on Tool Menu 09:56 jenkins_koha * fridolyn.somers: Bug 8261: Cannot search system preferences from Local Use tab 09:56 jenkins_koha Project Koha_3.8.x build #163: SUCCESS in 1 hr 7 min: http://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_3.8.x/163/ 09:55 mib_1x1t28 Hello - would someone help explain what the marcxml field is used for in biblioitems? It doesn't seem to matter if I change data there (example 952 p - barcode) it doesn't reflect in Koha, instead "barcode" from the items table does!? 09:47 eythian drojf: in that case I run it in the foreground with verbose on to see what's making it die 09:43 * mtompset nods. 09:43 drojf i don't mind the occasional dead zebra, but of course search does not work that way. 09:42 drojf apparently it starts and then immediately dies again. "exited with 1 status" 09:42 drojf hm. i have a million dying zebras in my log 09:35 magnuse currently it only affects how links from subjects to searches for those subjects are constructed 09:35 mtompset That's what the comments say, so it was a long shot. 09:35 mtompset Right. 09:35 magnuse mtompset: UseICU does not affect how indexing is done, it just tells the rest of koha how indexing is being done 09:28 mtompset Hmmm.... 09:22 mtompset toggling doesn't change 3.8.4 search results. 09:21 mtompset ^tag^tab^ 09:21 mtompset Search tag settings identical except for new syspref, but it says it doesn't affect Zebra. 09:20 mtompset Interesting... ICU has a "UseICU" syspref. 09:19 mtompset Clicking searching tab. 09:18 mtompset As does 3.6.3 09:17 mtompset Okay. 3.8.4 has 3 results. All say show. 09:16 kf search the prefs 09:16 kf yes 09:16 mtompset Status is Lost. Is there a preference that affects that? 09:15 mtompset I typed "title: sex" 09:15 kf did you do a title or a keyword search? 09:15 mtompset "He's hot, she's hot : what to look for in the opposite sex." comes up in 3.6.3, but not 3.8.4 09:14 kf like fuzzy 09:14 kf or different settings for search 09:14 kf it might be a field is indexed differently 09:14 kf not necessarily 09:14 Joubu rangi: ok thanks 09:13 mtompset So something is not right with zebra. 09:13 mtompset different results. 09:13 mtompset I did "title: sex" search in catalogue under 3.6.3 and 3.8.4 09:13 mtompset I'm still stumped. 09:06 kf :) 09:04 rangi you can never have too many tests 09:04 rangi but if they could be made to work again, they would be 09:03 rangi no they aren't 09:03 Joubu Does someone know if unit tests in t/db_dependent/lib/KohaTest are still used ? 09:02 mtompset Greetings, Joubu. 08:56 Joubu hello 08:56 huginn mtompset: The current temperature in Manila, Philippines is 32.0°C (4:00 PM PHT on September 06, 2012). Conditions: Scattered Clouds. Humidity: 66%. Dew Point: 25.0°C. Pressure: 29.80 in 1009 hPa (Steady). 08:56 mtompset @wunder mnl 08:52 kf ah, I know that phenomenon 08:51 drojf it's getting really dark right now. because i want to leave the house ;) 08:51 huginn drojf: The current temperature in Prenzlauer Berg, Berlin, Germany is 16.2°C (10:43 AM CEST on September 06, 2012). Conditions: Partly Cloudy. Humidity: 48%. Dew Point: 5.0°C. Pressure: 30.24 in 1024 hPa (Steady). 08:51 drojf @wunder berlin, germany 08:50 kf pretty much all the same bad weather all over 08:50 kf hm 08:50 huginn rangi: The current temperature in Wellington, New Zealand is 14.0°C (8:00 PM NZST on September 06, 2012). Conditions: Scattered Clouds. Humidity: 67%. Dew Point: 8.0°C. Pressure: 29.89 in 1012 hPa (Falling). 08:50 mtompset I just want search for "old" in the new system and "old" in the old system to return the same number of results. 08:50 rangi @wunder nzwn 08:49 eythian not much better really... 08:49 huginn eythian: The current temperature in MeteOosterhout, Oosterhout Nb, Netherlands is 15.9°C (10:47 AM CEST on September 06, 2012). Conditions: Overcast. Humidity: 66%. Dew Point: 10.0°C. Pressure: 30.36 in 1028 hPa (Steady). 08:49 eythian @wunder oosterhout 08:49 mtompset I even have 207 candidates for the problem. 08:49 huginn kf: The current temperature in Taegerwilen, Taegerwilen, Germany is 15.5°C (10:45 AM CEST on September 06, 2012). Conditions: Mostly Cloudy. Humidity: 90%. Dew Point: 14.0°C. Pressure: 30.27 in 1025 hPa (Steady). 08:49 kf @wunder Konstanz 08:49 kf good mornign eythian 08:49 eythian hello. 08:49 mtompset Yes, I know I have bad data. 08:48 jenkins_koha Starting build #163 for job Koha_3.8.x (previous build: SUCCESS) 08:48 huginn 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8706 critical, P5 - low, ---, m.de.rooy, Pushed to Stable , Private lists can be accessed by anyone 08:48 jenkins_koha m.de.rooy: Bug 8706 - Private lists can be accessed by anyone 08:48 jenkins_koha Project Koha_3.8.x build #162: SUCCESS in 1 hr 7 min: http://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_3.8.x/162/ 08:48 kf you got a bad record 08:48 * kf agrees with rangi 08:47 rangi i think you are off on a total wild goose chase 08:47 mtompset Is there a syspref that is wrong? 08:47 mtompset Are the packages set to use GRS? 08:46 mtompset My hunt for the trigger has led me to zebra's mod-grs-marc.so file 08:46 mtompset okay... 07:53 mtompset kia ora, rangi. 07:52 magnuse kia ora rangi and #koha 07:52 kf evening rangi 07:52 rangi evening 07:41 jenkins_koha Starting build #162 for job Koha_3.8.x (previous build: SUCCESS) 07:37 mtompset bonjour, paul_p 07:36 paul_p 'morning #koha 07:36 kf morning paul_p 07:33 kf only for serach 07:33 kf yes, but that's not a problem for indexing 07:33 mtompset We have non latin characters, I believe. 07:32 kf but I am not sure it matters for your problem 07:32 kf mtompset: chr 07:31 kf hi drojf 07:30 drojf hi kf 07:30 mtompset MAybe my xml bug hunting code needs localization awareness? 07:29 mtompset is the packages compiled up with chr or icu? 07:29 mtompset Good morning, kf. 07:29 kf good morning #koha 07:28 mtompset is the packages compiled up with chr or icu? 07:28 mtompset e's with diacritics. 07:28 mtompset i think I found my bad "xml" problem. 07:27 mtompset Greetings, gaetan_B 07:24 gaetan_B hello 07:22 drojf good morning #koha 07:10 mtompset bonjour, francharb. Greetings, matts. 07:09 matts hi ! 07:06 francharb good morning #koha 06:57 magnuse hiya mtompset 06:57 alex_a bonjour mtompset 06:55 mtompset I think I found our bad xml... need to make my program not crash on the first bad case it finds. 06:54 reiveune hi mtompset 06:54 mtompset Greetings, magnuse. 06:54 mtompset bonjour, reiveune, alex_a julian_m. 06:49 * magnuse waves 06:45 wahanui hello, julian_m 06:45 julian_m hello 06:45 wahanui bonjour, alex_a 06:45 alex_a bonjour 06:39 wahanui bonjour, reiveune 06:39 reiveune hello 06:33 huginn 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8704 normal, P5 - low, ---, m.de.rooy, Pushed to Stable , Typo in etc/koha-conf.xml 06:33 huginn 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7613 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, ruth, Pushed to Stable , OCLC Connexion Gateway, including extension svc/import_bib 06:33 jenkins_koha * m.de.rooy: Bug 8704 - Typo in etc/koha-conf.xml 06:33 jenkins_koha * ruth: Bug 7613: OCLC Connexion web service and desktop client, followup patch 06:33 jenkins_koha Project Koha_3.8.x build #161: SUCCESS in 1 hr 7 min: http://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_3.8.x/161/ 06:25 mtompset going to work on hunting for bad xml. 06:25 mtompset I think I have a clean index now, but I don't see how. 06:25 mtompset true enough. 06:16 cait but the reindexing scripts won't help you with that 06:16 cait hunting for the bad xml is probably a good idea 06:15 mtompset I still think I'll hunt for the bad XML, which should show me the bad MARC. 06:15 mtompset Ah, I see. 06:14 wahanui mtompset: sorry... 06:14 mtompset Close, wahanui. :) 06:14 cait read the docs 06:14 wahanui -u is an option that you use to give the mysql username you want to log in as 06:14 mtompset -u? 06:14 cait -u -f -v 06:14 cait try -u 06:13 cait using other options 06:13 cait and because it indexes differently 06:13 cait probably becuse of the error 06:08 mtompset The problem is without the -b -a, I get "skipping biblios" 06:03 mtompset so that's the marcxml field in biblioitems? 06:02 cait I don't know 06:02 mtompset Is there some sort of validate xml script? 06:01 cait and the normal zebra rebuild uses the mrc 06:01 cait because according to documentation the packages index the xml by default 06:01 cait maybe something in the xml wrong 06:00 rangi You'll just have to look for xml that is incomplete then 06:00 cait I think it's a problematic record 06:00 mtompset [warn] Couldn't read whole MARC record 06:00 mtompset the second pass gives: 05:59 mtompset [warn] d1: 1: Malformed tag 05:59 mtompset true, but strangely... the first pass gives: 05:59 cait so it's not a bug if it double indexes 05:59 rangi Yeah 05:58 cait if you look at the wiki page 05:58 cait -a -b don#t seem to be options to be used with -f 05:58 mtompset koha-rebuild-zebra -b -a -f -v library 05:58 rangi You are using the koha-rebuild-zebra right? 05:58 mtompset What is that? Where is that? 05:57 rangi So it will be doing -x then 05:56 mtompset Yes. 05:56 rangi Are u using packages? 05:56 mtompset Yes. 05:55 rangi This is for indexing in zebra? 05:55 wahanui Any ideas are welcome :) 05:55 mtompset Any ideas? 05:55 mtompset So, how do I track down the MARC record in question? 05:54 huginn 04Bug 8253: blocker, P3, ---, kyle.m.hall, Failed QA , Fine doubling 05:54 Judit http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8253 05:54 mtompset [warn] Couldn't read whole MARC record 05:54 mtompset Oh, there it is. 05:53 mtompset Actually, the funny thing is, I didn't get the marc record warning/error in the second run. 05:53 Judit watch out for fines 05:52 mtompset I'm just trying to take out 3.6.3 data put it into 3.8.4 05:52 cait I am not sure, probably a bad marc recod 05:51 cait that it's short 05:51 cait well that doesn't have to be bad 05:51 mtompset What does the Malformed tag message mean? 05:50 mtompset very short output. 05:50 mtompset I tried just that. 05:50 cait so -f -v should work 05:49 mtompset Yes, I think it does. 05:49 cait because I woudl think -f translates to - a -b 05:49 mtompset Yes. 05:49 cait you tried? 05:49 mtompset Then it doesn't index. 05:49 cait maybe don't use -a -b? 05:48 cait ah right 05:48 mtompset http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Commands_provided_by_the_Debian_packages#koha-rebuild-zebra 05:47 mtompset full reindex. 05:47 mtompset [warn] d1: 1: Malformed tag 05:47 cait why are you using -f? 05:41 mtompset reattempting with apache turned off (it is a qa system after all). :) 05:37 mtompset I call it error, because I think it quit before the end. 05:36 mtompset Hmmm... not good... got another error on a reattempt. 05:28 mtompset It's like calling rebuild_zebra.pl with -b -b -a -a 05:28 mtompset koha-rebuild-zebra is a script wrapper for rebuild_zebra.pl 05:26 mtompset twice. 05:26 cait it reindexes authorities and biblios 05:26 mtompset koha-rebuild-zebra -b -a -f -v... does a double reindex. 05:26 jenkins_koha Starting build #161 for job Koha_3.8.x (previous build: FIXED) 05:25 mtompset Oh that's funny. 05:10 cait eythian got away from here just in time 05:10 cait only a little bit of sun late afternoon 05:10 cait I think we had the first day with fog yesterday 05:10 cait meh. 05:10 huginn cait: The current temperature in Konstanz, Germany is 16.0°C (7:00 AM CEST on September 06, 2012). Conditions: Mostly Cloudy. Humidity: 75%. Dew Point: 13.0°C. Pressure: 30.21 in 1023 hPa (Rising). 05:10 cait @wunder Konstanz 05:09 rangi hey cait 05:09 cait evening rangi 05:06 rangi cya wajasu 05:06 wajasu gnight yall 05:05 huginn 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8215 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, kyle, Needs Signoff , Add Course Reserves 05:05 wajasu will have to sleep to test the cominations of perms. iam close to signof on bug 8215 05:00 wajasu ok 05:00 cait it's staff permissions 05:00 cait wajasu: in the patron record under more in the toolbar 04:58 mtompset That would be my guess. 04:58 wajasu probably new for solr/zebra 04:57 mtompset Yes, I think that is two many colons... BUT the problem might be there is supposed to be something between the two set of ::. 04:56 wajasu on master i saw Search Engine config and clicked it and got => Software Error Koha::SearchEngine::::Config is not a module name (Too Many colons?) 04:53 wajasu a bug i'm testing for signing off said "Verify new permissions, top level coursereserves, with subpermissions add_reserves and delete_reserves."where are permisssions -> tools or admin? 04:51 wahanui irc logs are http://irc.koha-community.org/irclog/koha/ 04:51 mtompset irc logs? 04:49 wajasu whoa 04:48 mtompset " [warn] Couldn't read whole MARC record" what does this mean?! 04:20 cait hi mtompset 04:17 mtompset Greetings, cait 04:01 mtompset there it is. :) Reindexing my QA install of packages on Ubuntu. :) 03:55 * mtompset laughs, "Perhaps I'll try to hunt the wiki." 03:55 wahanui commands are the one that i posted above 03:55 mtompset commands? 03:54 wajasu rangi++ :) 03:54 mtj the good news is, we now have a set of programs to handle the conversion of those different file formats.. when that happens 03:53 rangi yes! 03:53 jenkins_koha Project Koha_3.8.x build #160: FIXED in 1 hr 7 min: http://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_3.8.x/160/ 03:53 jenkins_koha Yippie, build fixed! 03:53 mtj who, how, what , when that happens is yet to be discussed…. 03:52 mtompset True, and I know that tcohen and I would like to make sure the Ubuntu docs are shiny and new. :) 03:51 mtj mtompset, but at some stage, *someone* is going to have to decide what bits of what docs, becomes the shiny new ubuntu install doc... 03:50 wajasu then is find camel runs in OSGI container. and a perl project called OSGIish to manage things via shell. 03:49 wajasu i was playing with the idea of embedding/integrating Apache-Camel using stomp protocol to send messages. then we can configure routes to email,sms, EDI, file,webservices, search, ldap, message queues, etc without us writing that. 03:49 mtj mtompset, no one is running any transformation 'right now'... 03:47 mtompset And when I say cleanly, I mean without doing a CPAN install. 03:47 * mtompset laughs, "An RPM package? -- You know how much work it would take to get all the dependencies cleanly in place first?" 03:46 wajasu then maybe a koha-perl-lib-x64-3.x.rpm package. 03:46 mtompset Well, I meant that if someone ran the transformation right now, I'm worried information may or may not be lost. 03:45 wajasu i wish we could pull off using carton, and use local::lib. 03:44 mtj mtompset, identicalness is the ultimate goal, for this task 03:44 mtompset eleventy-billion?! Come on... It's bad, but not that bad. ;) 03:44 halcyonCorsair heh, the git clone takes long enough on its own :P (even when i do only depth 5) 03:43 rangi halcyonCorsair: yeah thats a good idea 03:43 wajasu oooh 03:43 mtj wajasu, the ll-koha repo has some carton code, ftw... 03:43 mtompset I'd like to make sure the Ubuntu wiki/INSTALL file are identical in content so we don't lose information when this transformation occurs. 03:43 halcyonCorsair mtompset: mmm, traffic isn't *too* bad, at least for me, but the roads aren't that great and worse there are a lot of intersections 03:42 mtj rangi, blame asciidoc for those /r's :) 03:42 halcyonCorsair rangi: one thing you could do to speed things up re: a dev box, is make take the vanilla ubuntu/debian base box and create a 'koha' one with the elevnty-billion perl dependencies, etc installed 03:42 wajasu halcyoncorsair; yup. i was looking at using Carton to gather manage module deps too. there is always somethings to mess with in kohaland 03:42 mtompset halcyonCorsair: That sounds like Manila traffic. 03:41 rangi halcyonCorsair: ahh that's less than optimal 03:41 mtj using mwlib, pandoc and asciidoc 03:41 halcyonCorsair rangi: not super great, kinda takes about 40m ride/waiting in traffic to get out of the city 03:41 mtompset So, does this look like what will happen with all the INSTALL.* files? 03:40 mtj mtompset, exactly :) 03:39 mtompset So you took wiki format and put it into various document formats? 03:39 rangi mtj: looking good, just gotta kill those \r :) 03:39 mtj mtompset -> http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Debian 03:39 rangi halcyonCorsair: wajasu: sounds like we might be able to put together a nice list of recipes 03:38 mtompset What was the source document? 03:38 mtj http://git.kohaaloha.com/?p=install-docs/.git;a=blob_plain;f=1/debian.html;h=f4cd8648753393e5cf290319eddeeda1cfd9b760;hb=HEAD 03:38 wajasu i have an automated debian preseed.cfg file and shell script that builds a VM with koha-common and mysql etc if you want to reference that. 03:38 * mtompset listens in on mtj's comment about install-doco stuff. 03:38 mtj http://git.kohaaloha.com/?p=install-docs/.git;a=tree;f=1 03:37 rangi halcyonCorsair: good riding near where you are? 03:37 rangi nice 03:37 mtj haay chris, ive made some pretty good progress on the install-doco stuff... 03:37 halcyonCorsair yeah will do tomorrow 03:37 halcyonCorsair rangi: https://gist.github.com/3644826 03:34 rangi see what ideas we can shake out of the woodwork 03:34 rangi then maybe fire off an email to koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org 03:34 rangi with links to your repo etc 03:34 rangi whack a page up at http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Main_Page 03:33 rangi what might be a good thing to do is 03:33 rangi *nod* 03:33 rangi also being able to do a one touch dev instance would be fantastic 03:33 halcyonCorsair rangi: well, i've already got the one-touch vm there, although a bunch of currently hardcoded bits as mentioned 03:33 Amit_Gupta heya bag 03:33 wahanui Amit_Gupta is probably from Nucsoft Osslabs 03:33 bag heya Amit_Gupta 03:33 halcyonCorsair ah yep 03:32 rangi hi Amit_Gupta 03:32 rangi those would also be great 03:32 Amit_Gupta heya chris 03:32 halcyonCorsair rangi: eg. one-touch fire up an ec2 koha, or one-touch koha-dev vm with vagrant/virtualbox, or? 03:32 rangi the obvious one would be a support company who had a bunch of koha servers they wanted to keep in sync 03:32 halcyonCorsair rangi: whats the most useful / common usecase for this chef stuff I'm playing around with? 03:27 mtompset wajasu: Well, it does seem that way, but I did get 7+ hours of sleep. 03:26 wajasu :) 03:26 * mtompset laughs, "Wahanui." 03:26 wahanui you are trying to do a variety of projects in less than three months! 03:26 mtompset Who me? 03:21 wajasu it seems like moments ago you went to sleep 02:53 mtompset Greetings, #koha. 02:46 jenkins_koha Starting build #160 for job Koha_3.8.x (previous build: STILL UNSTABLE -- last SUCCESS #156 14 hr ago) 02:46 jenkins_koha rangi: job koha_3.8.x build scheduled now 02:46 rangi !jenkins build koha_3.8.x now 02:46 rangi jenkins build koha_3.8.x now 02:41 druthb o/ 02:36 rangi darn 02:36 huginn 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=5327 major, P3, ---, bart.tj, Signed Off , Unit tests required for all C4 modules 02:36 huginn 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8478 minor, P5 - low, ---, tomascohen, Pushed to Stable , Update Ubuntu related files 02:36 huginn 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=6886 minor, P5 - low, ---, chris, Pushed to Stable , Single branch mode should disable showing the branch name in front of all callnumbers 02:36 jenkins_koha * Chris Cormack: Bug 5327 : Fixing a typo in the test that was causing a false fail 02:36 jenkins_koha * mtompset: Bug 8478 - Update Ubuntu related files (3.8.x) 02:36 jenkins_koha * Chris Cormack: Bug 6886 Follow up for NORMARC 02:36 jenkins_koha * Chris Cormack: Bug 6886 - Follow up for UNIMARC 02:36 jenkins_koha Project Koha_3.8.x build #159: STILL UNSTABLE in 1 hr 8 min: http://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_3.8.x/159/ 01:45 wahanui DeM KraZy NutZ!! 01:45 bag mtj? 01:28 rangi fingers crossed this one fixes it 01:28 jenkins_koha Starting build #159 for job Koha_3.8.x (previous build: STILL UNSTABLE -- last SUCCESS #156 12 hr ago) 01:28 huginn 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=6886 minor, P5 - low, ---, chris, Pushed to Stable , Single branch mode should disable showing the branch name in front of all callnumbers 01:28 jenkins_koha Chris Cormack: Bug 6886 - OPAC XSLT respecting single branch mode 01:28 jenkins_koha Project Koha_3.8.x build #158: STILL UNSTABLE in 1 hr 8 min: http://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_3.8.x/158/ 01:24 Guest5939 Hmm.. yes. I will try and build one again today and see. thanks anyway 01:22 * jcamins_away leaves for real this time. 01:22 jcamins_away I have very little experience with the livedvd, but the only thing I have heard about it has been complaints that it doesn't work right. 01:22 Guest5939 I did try (on another machine) to build it myself - but I could never get it to actually go for me. Hence for 3.8 i used Vimal Kumar's live dvd/cd for 3.8.2 01:21 Guest5939 Yes, from Vimal Kumar 01:20 jcamins_away (no, I'm really not here) 01:19 jcamins_away livedvd? 01:19 Guest5939 I can't add any rule at all. 01:18 Guest5939 I had the live dvd of koha 3.8.2 - then upgraded that to 3.8.3 and then upgraded that to 3.8.4 01:18 Judit and what isthe exact rule you are trying to add? 01:17 Guest5939 ok - I'll see what it says and what I can do. 01:17 Judit did you isntall koha 3.8.4, or did you upgrade an older koha to 3.8.4? 01:17 jcamins_away Oh, I see. I'm about to turn off the computer, but it sounds like a failed upgrade. You'll need to take a look at the logs to see what's going on. 01:16 Guest5939 Yeah, but I try to add some - and nothing happens - koha just ignores it when I click set. 01:15 Judit did you check your default circ rules, or the branch specific? 01:15 Guest5939 The only thing from what I've found from the web is that it could be related to the fact that I don't have any default circulation rules - and I can't make any .. 01:15 jcamins_away Perhaps you are missing a rule for ALL-ALL-ALL? 01:14 Guest5939 I checked my admin settings, and they are as lax as can be to allow virtually any hold to be placed for any patron. 01:14 Guest5939 secondly, it also tells me that these items aren't normally able to be placed on hold for patrons. 01:13 Guest5939 But generally it tells me that This patron has too many holds - but I am still able to place it. 01:13 Guest5939 To be honest with you - I am relativley new to koha so I haven't check the logs. 01:13 Judit what is the error when you are trying to place holds? 01:12 rangi what do you apache error logs tell you? 01:12 rangi hmm we havent had any reports of people unable to add rules 01:11 Guest5939 Hi - I hope it's ok to ask for some help/advice on koha here. I'm using koha 3.8.4 - but since 3.8 I've been unable to add any circulation rules and I think this is why I get errors on placing holds. 00:47 Judit schema is good 00:44 gml i leave, thx again 00:43 gml i didnt know schema pages 00:43 gml thx 00:42 rangi luckily the schema knows 00:42 rangi http://schema.koha-community.org/tables/special_holidays.html 00:42 rangi no idea 00:42 gml what is the purpose of "isexception" field from table special_holidays ? 00:42 rangi hi gml 00:41 gml hi everyone 00:33 rangi so it was a good thing :) 00:33 rangi which exposed the test as being wrong 00:33 rangi something mucked up the db, so that bibnumber and biblioitemnumber arent always the same 00:32 * rangi is gonna cheat and push that patch 00:31 rangi ah yep items one 00:31 wahanui i think unstable is sid 00:31 rangi hmm unstable 00:19 jenkins_koha Starting build #158 for job Koha_3.8.x (previous build: UNSTABLE -- last SUCCESS #156 11 hr ago) 00:19 huginn 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8594 normal, P5 - low, ---, robin, Pushed to Master , A report containing a subquery that has a 'limit' will have that limit stripped out 00:19 jenkins_koha robin: Bug 8594 - prevent the report system from breaking some subqueries 00:19 jenkins_koha Project Koha_3.8.x build #157: UNSTABLE in 1 hr 8 min: http://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_3.8.x/157/ 00:17 Judit good morning 00:13 jcamins Sounds like a good feature. 00:13 rangi sorry i explained badly 00:13 rangi cool 00:13 jcamins Now I understand. 00:13 jcamins Okay. 00:12 rangi and the icon that comes with that 00:12 rangi all im trying to do is get rid of the Type: Book; etc 00:12 rangi this wont affect this 00:12 jcamins It may be this is what you're planning, and the description was just too brief. 00:11 rangi yes 00:11 jcamins Right. But I think it should be possible to choose the icon using the item types configuration. 00:11 rangi thats what they want 00:11 rangi and be replaced with the itemtype icon from the biblio level 00:11 rangi needs to go away 00:10 rangi that whole line 00:10 rangi Type: Book; Format: print ; Literary form: not fiction 00:10 rangi i dont want both 00:10 rangi no i want to switch the type ones off 00:10 jcamins The bug says you're choosing between. 00:10 jcamins Right. So you need to *add* the option to display those icons. 00:10 rangi and lots of the time more right 00:10 rangi its no less wrong than the book or article icon showing now 00:09 rangi and have the biblio level itemtype there 00:09 rangi to go away 00:09 rangi they want Type: 00:09 rangi cos thats all they want 00:08 jcamins No, it doesn't work for circulating libraries. 00:08 rangi oh so this is already working? 00:08 jcamins They use biblio-level itemtypes, which is how the icon on the left is generated. 00:07 rangi l 00:07 jcamins http://ans.cplibraries.com/cgi-bin/koha/opac-search.pl?q=smith 00:07 rangi its only changing which itemtype you display at biblio leve 00:07 jcamins Right. 00:07 rangi then you get to the detail page and you see the item level itemtypes it wouldnt be changing those 00:07 jcamins Right. 00:07 rangi which in most libraries they dont match at all 00:07 rangi instead of what is in 942 00:06 rangi but generated from the marc control fields 00:06 rangi where we currently display the biblio level itemtype 00:06 rangi this is only for the search results page 00:06 rangi not following you 00:06 jcamins (at least in circulating libraries) 00:06 rangi hm? 00:05 jcamins We already support icons for itemtypes, we just can't display the biblio-level ones anymore. 00:05 jcamins It should be possible to display both. 00:05 jcamins rangi: I'm a bit iffy about choosing *between* the icons.