Time Nick Message 01:51 jenkins_koha Starting build #101 for job Koha_3.8.x (previous build: SUCCESS) 02:54 jenkins_koha Project Koha_3.8.x build #101: SUCCESS in 1 hr 3 min: http://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_3.8.x/101/ 02:54 jenkins_koha mtompset: Bug 8458 - $stemmed_operand in C4::Search _build_stemmed_operand is not initialized. Added =q{} to initialize it to the empty string at declaration time. 03:26 mtompset Greetings, #koha. 03:26 rangi hi mtompset 03:27 mtompset I have a question and perhaps you can give feedback, rangi. 03:27 mtompset Under Ubuntu, do we want to recommend using the koha-common packages? 03:27 mtompset (from Debian) 03:27 rangi from debian.koha-community.org you mean? 03:28 rangi (they aren't in debian proper) 03:28 mtompset yes. 03:28 rangi there's one patch that needs to be pushed, and then yes 03:28 rangi mysql in precise is a bit mental 03:28 mtompset Yes, the whole 'user'@'%' mess? 03:29 rangi the packages worked fine up until precise 03:29 rangi yep 03:29 rangi http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8162 03:29 rangi its passed QA 03:29 rangi hmm no hmm needs signoff 03:30 rangi but once that is in, it will work with precise again 03:31 mtompset But the @'%' was never suggested on http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Koha_on_Ubuntu 03:32 mtompset Should it have been? 03:32 mtompset (never = since I first saw it up until now) 03:34 rangi doesnt really matter for the instructions 03:35 mtompset Okay, seeing as I'm looking at the Ubuntu Instructions to make sure they are up to date. 03:35 rangi probably best to make one for localhost explicitly assuming that people who want to run the db on another server know enough to figure that out themselves 03:37 * mtompset nods. 03:38 mtompset also, what is the most current repository for debian.koha-community.org? Is it squeeze? 03:38 rangi squeeze is current stable 03:38 rangi so 3.8.x 03:38 rangi squeeze-dev is master 03:38 mtompset which one is 3.6.x? 03:38 rangi oldstable 03:40 mtompset So, when 3.10 comes out... oldstable = 3.8.x, and debian-codename = current stable = 3.10, debian-codename-dev = master (= 3.11)? 03:41 rangi yep 03:42 mtompset does the 3.6.x repository stay around somewhere? 03:42 rangi nope 03:43 mtompset Ah, okay. So, basically, a git install is really only available for old stable, current stable, and master? 03:45 rangi oh the git repository? 03:45 rangi yeah that stays around for ever 03:45 rangi i thought you meant the package repository 03:45 mtompset I was mixing terms. 03:45 mtompset Thanks for clarifying. 03:46 mtompset The tar.gz's stay around forever. A git downlaod is available as well. 03:46 rangi yep 03:47 mtompset However, in terms of a repository, (apt-get stuff), only old stable, current stable, and master exist. 03:48 rangi yep 03:49 rangi and unless someone setps up to maintain oldoldstable, you should try to be at least on oldstable 03:52 * mtompset nods. 03:53 muzu hi 03:53 wahanui bonjour, muzu 03:53 mtompset Thanks for the input. I'll be looking at http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8478 and helping tcohen clean up documentation for Ubuntu, and getting master patched with what I did for 3.6.7 04:18 mtompset Greetings, cait 04:18 mtompset Greetings, muzu. 04:19 cait hi mtompset 04:19 mtompset Next question. I know that LAMP includes PHP, which is not required for Koha, but would that not be the easiest option to suggest when installing Ubuntu? 04:20 rangi not really no 04:20 rangi well it is easy 04:20 rangi but it has the downside of now you have php 04:20 dcook_away Not a fan of php, rangi? :P 04:20 rangi not at all :) but thats not why its a problem for this 04:21 mtompset I suspect it isn't a matter of fan or not, but a matter of not installing what you don't need. 04:21 rangi the problem here is, now your apache threads start up with php 04:21 rangi drastically reducing how many concurrent threads you can have 04:21 rangi specially if you are mtompset and have 24meg of ram :-) 04:21 mtompset 204MB. 04:22 * rangi exaggerates for effect 04:22 mtompset free. 04:22 muzu hi mtompset 04:22 mtompset We've bumped up to 1GB total. 04:22 rangi yeah thats about 4 threads with php 04:22 rangi i think it runs in around 64MB a thread 04:22 muzu I am getting error while restoring db of 3.2 in 3.6 04:22 mtompset Actually, that is probably right. 04:23 rangi dcook_away: http://blog.r-wos.org/2012/php-explained 04:23 mtompset Roughly 300MB used with myql and apache. 04:24 mtompset But you would agree that the server version is preferred over the desktop version, rangi? 04:24 rangi definitely for the same reason, you dont want X and gdm etc all running 04:31 rangi muzu: what is the error? 04:32 muzu [Thu Dec 15 13:59:43 2011] updatedatabase.pl: DBD::mysql::db do failed: Duplicate column name 'privacy' at /usr/share/koha/intranet/cgi-bin/installer/data/mysql/updatedatabase.pl line 3997. 04:33 rangi ahh you can safely ignore that, it should continue on and do the rest 04:35 muzu even i have ignored,but gives error while checkin and checkout. 04:35 dcook_away rangi: interestingly enough, this is the third time in four days that people have commented to me about PHP's structure 04:35 rangi whats the error at checkin and checkout muzu ? 04:37 muzu Use of uninitialized value $biblioitem_subfield in string at /home/koha/kohaclone/C4/Biblio.pm line 3216. Tag "" is not a valid tag. at /home/koha/kohaclone/C4/Biblio.pm line 3216" 04:38 rangi when you upgraded you ran the upgrade script eh? 04:38 rangi misc/maintenance/remove_items_from_biblioitems.pl --run 04:38 rangi that one? 04:40 muzu i havent execute any script. 04:41 rangi how did you upgrade? 04:41 rangi you just loaded in a 3.2 db into a 3.6.7 install? 04:42 rangi you definitely want to run that script 04:42 rangi and do a full zebra reindex 04:42 rangi from the INSTALL file 04:42 rangi oha 3.4.x or later no longer stores items in biblio records. 04:42 rangi If you are upgrading from an older version ou will need to do the 04:42 rangi following two steps, they can take a long time (several hours) to 04:42 rangi complete for large databases 04:42 rangi 04:42 muzu i have taken the back up of 3.2 . i have newly istalled 3.6 and restored 3.2 db 04:42 rangi misc/maintenance/remove_items_from_biblioitems.pl --run 04:43 rangi misc/migration_tools/rebuild_zebra.pl -b -r 04:43 rangi right, after you have done the web installer, you need to run that script 04:43 muzu ok 04:43 muzu may i know what is the exact command to execute that script. 04:43 rangi it may not fix this checkin checkout problem, but not running it will create all sorts of other ones 04:44 muzu ok 05:30 dcook_away Does anyone know if the "Set library management parameters" permission actually do anything? 05:31 dcook_away Or to which lib management parameters the permission refers? 05:32 cait hm 05:32 cait I think administration area - but I am not sure right now 05:32 dcook_away I think that's the "Set Koha system parameters" permission 05:39 dcook_away It looks like the only thing it does is allow the user to change their library in the intranet... 05:40 cait hm that makes sense too i guess 05:40 dcook_away Now that I look at the name of the permission, I guess so, lol 05:47 mtompset If a user who is setting up Koha has the debian.k-c.org squeeze packages, would there be any reason for them to use CPAN? 05:49 cait hm I think the packages have all perl dependencies 05:49 cait so I guess not 05:49 cait using CPAN is not recommended 05:52 Sneha hi every one 05:52 Sneha any body send me Koha import file format? 05:52 Sneha please 05:53 mtompset I know CPAN is not recommended. :) 05:54 Sneha ?? 05:54 Sneha no body are there? 05:55 mtompset I believe the Koha Import format depends on what you set your Koha up as, right cait? MARC21 or UNIMARC. 05:55 mtompset I have no such files that I am allowed to share. 05:55 mtompset marc21? 05:55 wahanui hmmm... marc21 is at http://www.loc.gov/marc/bibliographic/ecbdlist.html , http://www.loc.gov/marc/authority/ecadlist.html 05:56 mtompset unimarc? 05:56 wahanui unimarc is http://www.ifla.org/en/publications/unimarc-formats-and-related-documentation 05:56 mtompset That is the best I can help, sorry. 05:56 cait mtompset: yes, you will have to import in the format koha is set up in 05:56 cait there is a patch to allow "crosswalking" formats for z39.50 - but sadly it's stuck at the moment 05:57 * mtompset goes back to working on documentation for Ubuntu installs. 05:59 Sneha i have import the book but not working properly 05:59 Sneha can u send me details with my mail id ? 05:59 Sneha hdohare@yahoo.co.in 06:02 cait sorry Sneha 06:02 cait we cantry helping you here 06:02 alex_a bonjour \o 06:02 cait or youcan ask your quesitons on the mailing list 06:02 cait but mailing you details apart from that is asking a bit too much 06:02 cait documentation? 06:02 wahanui documentation is at http://koha-community.org/documentation/ 06:03 Sneha i have this 06:03 Sneha but not understand 06:03 mtompset which part don't you understand? 06:05 * mtompset thinks Sneha may work with two people he interacted with over the weekend. *sigh* 06:05 mtompset Are you just trying to do data entry, Sneha? 06:05 mtompset I mean catalogueing? 06:05 Sneha yes 06:06 Sneha no i useing import the book but not 06:06 Sneha i have no format of this 06:06 Sneha so i got confused 06:07 mtompset cait, I'm not familiar with how to enter an item in Koha. Where's the docs for that? 06:07 cait it depends on how you are doing it 06:07 cait maybe z39.50 import? 06:07 cait I would recommend reading the cataloguing chapter 06:07 mtompset Probably not. 06:08 mtompset Let me guess, Sneha... you have 3.06.05 of Koha, right? 06:08 Sneha yes 06:08 cait http://manual.koha-community.org/3.8/en/cataloging.html#catbibs 06:09 mtompset As per cait's suggestion. Read the cataloging chapter. 06:09 mtompset http://manual.koha-community.org/3.6/en/cataloging.html 06:10 mtompset I think there is also confusion, cait, for non-library types. What's a bibliographic record vs. an item record vs. an authorities... 06:10 wahanui okay, mtompset. 06:10 mtompset think? 06:10 mtompset there? 06:10 wahanui there is no spoon. or something like the second with holes like the first... or a patch from jared soemwhere removing some of the nozebra code or confusion, cait, for non-library types. What's a bibliographic record vs. an item record vs. an authorities... 06:10 Sneha yes 06:10 mtompset wahanui, forget there 06:10 wahanui mtompset: I forgot there 06:10 Sneha i have xml file 06:11 cait I really think documentation is the best place to start here 06:11 Sneha then i do import 06:11 Sneha i need just format 06:11 cait is your file marcxml? 06:11 Sneha file format 06:11 cait what kind of xml? 06:11 mtompset marcxml? 06:11 wahanui marcxml is a representation of the usmarc in xml 06:11 cait you want MARC21 06:11 cait the spec is here 06:11 cait http://loc.gov/marc 06:11 mtompset marc21? 06:11 wahanui well, marc21 is at http://www.loc.gov/marc/bibliographic/ecbdlist.html , http://www.loc.gov/marc/authority/ecadlist.html 06:12 Sneha Onlt .XML 06:12 Sneha Only .XML 06:13 cait yes, xml is a format, but it depends how your data is structured within the xml 06:14 Sneha can in send u file format ? 06:14 mtompset irc logs? 06:14 wahanui irc logs are http://irc.koha-community.org/irclog/koha/ 06:14 Sneha can i send u file format ? 06:17 Sneha ?? 06:19 mtompset Sneha, please... go read the documentation. I think you will discover that what you are trying to do is more complex that we can describe on the channel here. 06:19 mtompset http://manual.koha-community.org/3.6/en/cataloging.html 06:19 mtompset items is library-speak for books. 06:20 * mtompset is surprised how much more enjoyable documentation writing is becoming. 06:38 reiveune hello 06:41 reiveune re 06:44 mtompset Greetings, reiveune. 07:00 francharb hello 07:00 mtompset Greetings, francharb 07:00 mtompset Greetings, matts 07:00 matts hi ! 07:00 mtompset Greetings, laurence 07:01 mtompset I'm working on documentation. What fun are you having today? :) 07:11 laurence hello mtompset 07:11 * mtompset grins. 07:11 mtompset Salut? (is that valid French?) 07:16 mtompset Ah, it must be morning in France. :) 07:16 julian_m hello 07:16 wahanui privet, julian_m 07:16 julian_m yes mtompset :) 07:16 mtompset Greetings, asaurat. Greetings, julian_m. 07:17 mtompset Well, I hope you all have productive days. I'm not sure how productive my writing documentation is. 07:21 rangi evening 07:22 mtompset Evening, rangi 07:33 magnuse morning #koha 07:34 dcook_away morning/evening everyone 07:36 mtompset Greetings, dcook 07:44 dcook Hey mtompset. Having a rough time of it? 07:44 mtompset Almost through the INSTALL.ubuntu file. 07:44 mtompset Editing is such a pain! 07:45 rangi try editing statutory declarations 07:46 mtompset Good thing I'm running through this. There are sections that say things without explaining them. 07:46 * rangi finished what is hopefully the last one i ever have to do today 07:46 mtompset $ zebraidx -c <prefix>/etc/zebradb/zebra-biblios.cfg -g iso2709 -d biblios init 07:47 mtompset There should be some sort of comment explaining what <prefix> is. 08:03 rangi heya eythian 08:03 wahanui somebody said eythian was in NZ. ;) or a good influence 08:03 eythian g'day 08:11 mtompset AT LAST! DONE! -- Bad news... I have to test it. 08:12 paul_p good morning #koha 08:13 mtompset Good day to you as well, paul_p. :) 08:18 dcook Bon matin, paul_p 08:19 dcook and congrats, mtompset. Sorry that there's the testing now :p 08:19 mtompset At least it should go well enough, if I've written the instructions well enough. 08:20 dcook Let's hope so :) 08:20 * mtompset switches off thinking and turns on "follow the words on the page only". 08:23 mtompset Hopefully, the test will be done in 2 hours. 08:23 kf hi #koha 08:23 dcook hi kf 08:23 mtompset Greetings, kf. 08:24 magnuse guten tag kf 08:24 kf :) 08:26 eythian hello kf 08:36 * dcook pokes rangi 08:37 eythian to see if he's done? 08:37 rangi heh 08:37 dcook How else will I know? :p 08:38 mtompset finger, meat thermometer, or trident? ;) 08:38 dcook USB? 08:38 dcook I'm hoping to download his Koha knowledge 08:39 * mtompset grins. 08:39 mtompset Low memory... Netbook grunting badly. 08:39 * mtompset decides to go to shut down. 08:39 * mtompset waves. 08:39 dcook 'night 08:41 kf morning eythian :) 08:51 jenkins_koha Starting build #102 for job Koha_3.8.x (previous build: SUCCESS) 08:51 * dcook calls it a night as well 08:51 rangi cya dcook 08:59 * eythian publishes the correct version of 3.8.3 packages... 09:09 kf yay :) 09:15 magnuse eythian++ 09:31 mtompset Greetings, #koha. 09:54 jenkins_koha Project Koha_3.8.x build #102: SUCCESS in 1 hr 4 min: http://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_3.8.x/102/ 09:54 jenkins_koha nengard: Bug 8453: Add spaces to inventory options 10:10 eythian > ALTER TABLE old_issues CHANGE date_due date_due datetime 10:11 eythian this takes a very long time to run on a 3.6->3.8 upgrade 10:11 rangi yup 10:11 eythian to the point of "gateway timeout" 10:14 eythian oh no, then it does: ALTER TABLE old_issues CHANGE returndate returndate datetime 10:14 eythian I wonder if it'd be faster if they were one statement 10:16 rangi probably, would only have to create the temporary table once 10:16 mtompset There would be no gateway timeout, if there was STDOUT dumped back to the browser. 10:17 mtompset Progress bars are nice things. 10:17 mtompset pain to implement well, but nice. 10:17 eythian Sounds like you're volunteering to ajaxify the upgrade process :) 10:17 mtompset Hey, I wouldn't go that far. :P 10:17 mtompset I'm sticking to things I can do right now, like documentation. 10:19 mtompset I'm doing a test run of my improvements to INSTALL.ubuntu for precise. 10:22 mtompset I've almost finished an Ubuntu 12.04 server install with NO selections. 10:23 mtompset Then I'll be doing something that will make jcamins very happy, I'll be using debian.k-c.org's repos. 10:24 eythian yeah, it has the extra modules in it 10:25 mtompset since I will be installing 3.8.3, it will likely be necessary. 10:25 mtompset And it is part of the isntructions. 10:25 mtompset instructions, even. 10:25 mtompset Though, I did note it wasn't necessary for 3.6.7 ;) 10:26 eythian oh no, then it does the same thing again for another column. 10:26 eythian yeah, dependencies change over time 10:37 * mtompset is off to test his auto-join command. 10:38 mtompset Greetings, #koha. Test is a success. YAY! Now if only this install would finish. :) 10:39 kf_lunch biblibre++ for fixing bugs .) 10:39 eythian oh wow, a 4th alter table :/ 10:40 eythian that _really_ should have been made one statement 10:40 * eythian goes to lunch while that runs 10:40 kf_lunch what are you looking at? 10:58 mtompset I think some update tables as part of an upgrade process. 11:18 eythian kf_lunch: it does 4 or so ALTER TABLE operations on old_issues when you go 3.6->3.8 11:19 jcamins Yeah, I noticed how painful it was. 11:19 eythian They take a very long time as it requires a table copy. My theory is that if they were done in one statement, it would only have one copy, not several 11:22 mtompset Greetings, jcamins. 11:22 mtompset I'm about to issue commands I don't like. :P 11:23 mtompset echo "deb http://debian.koha-community.org/koha squeeze main" > /etc/apt/sources.list.d/koha-community.list 11:24 jcamins Good idea. 11:25 mtompset I'm doing this for testing purposes. 11:25 mtompset Hmm... this next command didn't wiork. 11:25 mtompset wget -O- http://debian.koha-community.org/koha/gpg.asc | apt-key add - 11:26 jcamins | sudo apt-key add - 11:26 jcamins eythian: did someone tell you that the 3.8.3 package had 3.8.2 in it? 11:26 eythian jcamins: that's why there's a 3.8.3.1 package out 11:26 mtompset Oops... typo. Good thing the instructions are right. 11:26 jcamins eythian: I guess that'd be a yess. :) 11:26 jcamins *yes 11:26 eythian yep :) 11:28 mtompset I was running as root, so no need for sudo. 11:29 mtompset I typed apt-get instead of apt-key. 11:33 davidnind Good practice for linux server administration is to use sudo with a designated user account, rather than root (so I have been told) 11:33 mtompset echo "deb http://debian.koha-community.org/koha squeeze main" > /etc/apt/sources.list.d/koha-community.list 11:34 mtompset How would you do that with a sudo? 11:34 jcamins I'm not sure, actually. 11:34 jcamins I think probably sudo sh -e 'echo ...' 11:35 mtompset echo "deb http://debian.koha-community.org/koha squeeze main" | sudo cat - > /etc/apt/sources.list.d/koha-community.list 11:35 mtompset Can cat work that way? 11:35 eythian no 11:35 jcamins No, you're still using the shell to write the file. 11:37 mtompset because sudo sh -e is ugly. 11:38 rangi mtompset: tee not cat 11:38 mtompset And yes, davidnind, you are right. But I don't want to write ugly, complex instructions. 11:39 rangi and now im going to sleep 11:39 mtompset tee... that may do it. 11:39 eythian it will, that's what I use for that sort of thing 11:40 mtompset Well, there we go... cleaner instructions! 11:42 mtompset I'm working on INSTALL.ubuntu.12.04, jcamins. 11:42 mtompset The instructions. 11:42 wahanui the instructions are coming right now to the wiki near you 11:43 davidnind Depending on who your audience is for the instructions, encouraging good practice would be recommended, especially for people new to Linux and/or Koha :) 11:44 drojf1 hi #koha 11:45 mtompset I'm trying to update the INSTALL.ubuntu for 12.04 and make sure there are enough details that someone not quite familiar with linux should be able to follow it. 11:45 davidnind Writing clearer step by step install instructions is also encouraged mtompset++ 11:47 mtompset 1.2 Add koha repository to your apt sources 11:47 mtompset NOTE: This is not required for koha 3.6.7 under Ubuntu 12.04 11:47 mtompset if Zebra indexing (see step 5.2) is done via cron jobs. 11:47 mtompset Had to add that purist comment in there. :) 11:50 davidnind Will test for you if you like, probably over the next day or so though 11:51 mtompset just a second... 11:52 mtompset email or DCC SEND? 11:53 mtompset It's about 5K more than the old version. :) 11:53 mtompset I also tried to keep lines to 65 characters wide, except for command-lines and sample outputs. 11:53 jcamins mtompset: best to attach it to a bug, so that people other than davidnind can test it if they so choose. 11:54 mtompset true... 11:55 davidnind What jcamins said 11:59 mtompset http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8478 12:00 mtompset I'm hoping to obsolete tcohen's other attachment too, but it is getting late in the day. 12:01 mtompset Feel free to also give feedback on http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Koha_on_Ubuntu 12:04 davidnind Will look at both and provide some feedback 12:05 mtompset I should probably add the external repo evilness into the wiki version. 12:06 * jcamins scares everyone away with PQF. 12:07 mtompset Why does that kind of searching scare people? 12:07 davidnind PQF? 12:08 magnuse PQF is Prefix Query Format 12:08 magnuse PQF? 12:08 wahanui i guess PQF is Prefix Query Format 12:09 jcamins mtompset: The queries are horrifying to behold? 12:09 davidnind Still not any wiser 12:10 jcamins davidnind: pqf=@attr 3=1 @attr 5=102 @attr 2=3 @attr 1=9952 "branch|20120[67]" 12:10 * jcamins thinks that's pretty horrifying to behold. 12:10 * magnuse agrees 12:11 davidnind Is that like boolean seaching, only worse? 12:11 jcamins It's a particular query syntax. 12:11 davidnind Or something in the perl code 12:11 mtompset http://www.indexdata.com/zebra/doc/querymodel.html#querymodel-query-languages-pqf 12:12 jcamins It's a query syntax. Nothing to do with Perl. 12:12 jcamins It's used by Zebra. 12:12 * magnuse thinks it's time we threw old "library tech" on the dung heap of history and adopted tech solutions that are used by others too 12:12 mtompset http://www.indexdata.com/yaz/doc/tools.html#PQF 12:13 davidnind Am now wiser, but don't think it is something mere mortals like me would use 12:13 mtompset We are... solr is newer. :) 12:13 jcamins davidnind: right, that's my point. No one wants to use PQF. 12:14 drojf i do 12:14 jcamins Other than drojf. 12:14 jcamins :P 12:14 * drojf just wanted to say something 12:14 drojf :D 12:14 jcamins magnuse: yeah, but we have to support an equivalent. 12:15 drojf and i don't want to sit next to our patrons and do all their searches 12:16 jcamins (where equivalent = something that can do as much, not something that is as horrifying) 12:16 * mtompset goes, "AAAAAAWWWWWWW! Can't we get both?" 12:16 * mtompset grins. 12:17 jcamins mtompset: well, thanks to Z39.50 being entrenched for ILL, yeah, we do need both. 12:18 mtompset inter-library loan? 12:18 kf yes :) 12:18 * kf waves 12:18 mtompset ILL? 12:19 jcamins Yup. 12:19 mtompset wahanui doesn't know that? 12:19 wahanui mtompset: i don't know 12:19 jcamins ILL is Inter-Library Loan 12:19 mtompset ILL is Inter-Library Loan. 12:19 magnuse ill? 12:19 wahanui it has been said that ill is Inter-Library Loan 12:19 magnuse w00t 12:19 drojf and zebra is ill too 12:20 mtompset nah, zebra is sick and phat. ;) 12:21 magnuse kia ora paul_p 12:21 paul_p hello magnuse 12:22 magnuse is this a good time to show up for work, eh? ;-) 12:22 mtompset what's kia ora? I suppose ora means hour. 12:22 * magnuse scoffs 12:22 magnuse mtompset: a maori greeting ;-) 12:22 mtompset He was here around 8ish before. 12:23 mtompset well, Paris time that is. 12:23 magnuse http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kia_ora 12:24 magnuse mtompset: those of us who were lucky enough to go on the road trip in nz in 2010 were taught to shout it at the top of our voices at all times ;-) 12:25 mtompset Ah. 12:26 kf magnuse: *sigh* 12:26 mtompset BTW, could you decode your PQF query for us? pqf=@attr 3=1 @attr 5=102 @attr 2=3 @attr 1=9952 "branch|20120[67]" 12:27 jcamins mtompset: it's quite straightforward, really. "Find records with index 9952 matching the left-anchored regular expression 'branch|20120[67]'" 12:27 eythian magnuse: it's just how we speak 12:28 magnuse eythian: ;-) 12:30 jcamins mtompset: my point was, it's very unpleasant to try to come up with queries like that. 12:31 mtompset But what is index 9952? How does this relate to some table in some database? 12:31 jcamins It does not relate to the database at all. 12:31 jcamins That's an index I invented which consists of branch|acquisition-date 12:32 mtompset Then what are the 1, 102, and 3 parts? 12:33 jcamins Left-anchored, regular expression, and equals. 12:34 oleonard Hi all 12:34 mtompset that's an ugly way to have something more like: create index on branch+acquisition date tag BLAH; set order to BLAH; seek "branch201206" 12:34 jcamins mtompset: that was my point. 12:35 jcamins mtompset: you still haven't subscribed to the Koha mailing list, have you? 12:35 jcamins You really should. 12:35 mtompset I did. 12:35 mtompset I have decided to ignore a lot of it. :) 12:35 mtompset why? 12:36 jcamins I just sent an e-mail to it about how ugly that query was. 12:41 jcamins ... speaking of mailing lists. 12:47 mtompset I just read it. 12:47 mtompset I was working on Documentation all day. Avoided email. 12:48 mtompset Okay... dumb question... is koha-latest.tar.gz correct? 12:48 eythian try it and find out? 12:52 kf kohaversion.pl should tell you 12:52 mtompset okay, I'll just wait for the download first. 12:59 mtompset The directory name says 3.8.3 ... waiting for extraction... 12:59 tcohen hi mtompset 12:59 mtompset Greetings, tcohen. 13:00 mtompset I've attached my latest version to the bug report. 13:00 mtompset I'm in the midst of testing the instructions. 13:00 tcohen i ddidn't ahve the time to read it yet 13:00 tcohen did you rewrite them? 13:00 mtompset It's 5K longer than yours. :) 13:00 tcohen my english is not the best 13:01 mtompset I reformatted, changed a few things. 13:01 mtompset Don't worry, there weren't any glaring English problems. 13:01 mtompset I still have some tweaks. 13:02 * mtompset wonders if he posted the tee version. 13:02 * mtompset goes, "Whew! I did" 13:03 * tcohen thinks aptitude does not ship anymore with Ubuntu 13:03 mtompset It does. 13:03 tcohen out-of-the-box? 13:03 mtompset It does. 13:03 tcohen that's weird 13:04 tcohen as it breaks multiarch 13:04 eythian I don't think it does any more 13:04 tcohen maybe its been patched 13:04 eythian I have multiarch with aptitude 13:04 mtompset sounds like someone needs a apt-get update. ;) 13:05 mtompset apt-file, on the other hand, needs to be installed. 13:05 eythian yeah 13:05 mtompset Seems kind of dumb to me. 13:07 tcohen https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/aptitude/+bug/831768 13:08 mtompset Anyways, I'm on step 1.5.2 -- DOH! found some typos. 13:08 mtompset my fault, of course. :( 13:08 tcohen mtompset, I like the changes you've made 13:09 mtompset What I'd like to do to it next is restructure it so that the wiki and it line up more. 13:09 tcohen i must say that I thought of having a version of these files in the 3.6.x tree and this one in master/3.8.x 13:10 tcohen i mean, not a single file for all versions 13:11 tcohen and my main goal was that the preferred - default install 13:11 tcohen because the instructions where very confusing 13:11 eythian mtompset: only developers really use apt-file 13:12 mtompset Yes, but if you want to easily check for missing libraries, apt-file is useful. 13:12 tcohen When I first rewrote the wiki, I wanted to write something average users could copy and paste in their terminal 13:13 mtompset When I say wiki, I mean http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Koha_on_Ubuntu 13:13 mtompset When I say document, I mean INSTALL.ubuntu.12.04 (my attachment on your bug) 13:13 tcohen yes, I know 13:14 tcohen I'm not talking about something specific 13:14 tcohen i'm just pointing out where my efforts are directed 13:14 tcohen or have been 13:15 mtompset I have thought of 3.6 on 10.04 and 3.6 on 12.04 and 3.8 on 10.04 and 3.8 on 12.04, but that's FOUR documents. 13:16 mtompset The problems you encounter in 12.04 are likely to be similar regardless of Koha version. 13:16 mtompset Similarly for 10.04. 13:18 mtompset And the corruption begins... 13:20 mtompset well, I know the adding a repo worked. I saw it pull from the debian.k-c. org repo. 13:22 tcohen I added the repo so it pulls some .deb's that are there 13:23 mtompset I was tempted to cut out the koha_perl_deps.pl step, because logically if you have the repo, then you should get everything. 13:24 eythian no, you're assuming everyone will follow instructions 100%, which they won't. 13:24 eythian Keeping that in will at least provide a safety net in case they mess up somewhere. 13:25 mtompset typos, I get. 13:25 mtompset but not following the instructions?! 13:25 mveron Hi #koha 13:26 eythian mtompset: have you met people? 13:26 mtompset yes, but when you don't know what you are doing, you are supposed to follow the instructions. 13:27 eythian Indeed you are. 13:27 eythian That doesn't mean people will however 13:27 eythian Or that they'll do it correctly. 13:28 mtompset Well, that's true. I encountered a typo in my doing it: apt-get instead of apt-key. 13:29 drojf hi mveron 13:29 mveron hi drojf 13:30 kf is someone translating the KOCT plugin into German? 13:31 mveron hi kf :-) 13:31 mtompset I don't speak or write German. So, I don't know. 13:31 mveron I will have a lok at it this evening 13:31 mveron look 13:31 drojf mtompset: i thought you work for SIL, don't you people speak all languages? :P 13:32 * mtompset laughs. 13:32 mtompset Sorry, I only speak English. I dabble in Filipino. 13:33 drojf kf: mveron: i have not looked at it yet 13:33 kf wb paul_p 13:33 paul_p_ well, it's paul_p_ for now ;-) 13:35 drojf eythian: do i understand that correctly that you are suggesting to have 1) the option to use x-forward-for 2) the option to specify what you expect to be remote_addr (your proxy) and x-forward-for (user's ip) when using x-forward-for? 13:35 eythian drojf: well, I'm more just chucking out ideas. 13:36 eythian though, I'd probably merge 1 and 2. 13:36 drojf yes, i did that with "use ip address" too because i was afraid of paul_p_ coming after me for too many sysprefs ;) 13:37 eythian heh 13:38 * mtompset smirks, "wb -- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mPaed8I3V1A -- Welcome Back, Kotter" 13:38 drojf eythian: but that sounds like a good idea. i'll let this open a little, don't know when i have time to implement that. maybe others have more input on it 13:41 eythian drojf: sure, it's your patch, and doing it just based on apache is a good start. 13:42 mtompset what patch? where patch? 13:44 drojf mtompset: http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8492 13:46 * wizzyrea waves 13:46 drojf eythian: what about using Data::Validate::IP? it sounds like the perfect module for this. would i just say "alright, i use this", are dependencies discussed somewhere first or how does that work? 13:49 eythian drojf: In general, we don't change dependencies in a release unless it can't be helped, but otherwise it doesn't matter all that much. Just put it in the appropriate place. 13:49 eythian Though, it doesn't look like it handles ranges does it? 13:49 eythian so 192.168.0.1/24 or something wouldn't work? 13:49 drojf it does 13:49 eythian oh, so it does 13:49 eythian I just hadn't read far enough 13:49 eythian looks perfect really 13:50 drojf the network part is one that i would like to use actually, because i would be way too lazy to do that myself ;) 13:50 lime @seen jcamins_away 13:50 tcohen apache should be configured to use <VirtualHost *:80/8080> 13:50 eythian yeah, definitely. 13:50 tcohen no guessing 13:51 eythian lime: huginn appears to be missing. 13:51 eythian tcohen: ? 13:51 lime still sleeping? 13:51 eythian dunno 13:51 eythian vanished offline 13:51 tcohen ? 13:52 lime /etc/init.d/hugin restart 13:52 drojf ? 13:52 lime that didn't work :) 13:52 drojf heh 13:52 eythian no :) 13:52 eythian tcohen: I just don't know the context behind what you're saying about apache there 13:53 tcohen hehe I was discussing with a fellow about that 13:54 tcohen i just wrote in the wrong window 13:54 mtompset Ah. 13:54 eythian ah, good old wrongwindow.com 13:54 tcohen was talking about the default setup 13:54 eythian oh, that site used to exist :( 13:54 mtompset I was going to say if you are going to use named servers, you want them probably separate. 13:55 mtompset not to mention the OPAC and Intranet stuff point to different dirs. 13:55 tcohen name-based virtualhosts are what most people use 13:56 mtompset That way you only have one port open on your machine. :) 13:57 * mtompset grumbles about the pain of waiting for the dselect to finish. 13:57 tcohen Name-based virtual hosts handle different ports too 13:58 mtompset It looks like a late night, just to make sure this documentation is right. 13:58 tcohen it depends on your NameVirtualHost definitions 13:58 mtompset Yes, but if you are a paranoid security freak, you don't want to have many ports open. 13:59 mtompset Especially in countries that have higher piracy rates. :) 13:59 * mveron just (experimentally) managed to have a German translation with Swiss Orthography with ss instead of ß (Strasse / Straße) :-) 13:59 tcohen mtompset: we could encourage users to set ufw properly in Ubuntu 13:59 eythian mtompset: it's easier to firewall if you split things up by port. 14:00 mtompset Or you get behind a reverse proxy, and set that up right. :) 14:00 drojf good luck getting my patch to work for you then ;) 14:00 eythian yes, that's what I would do. 14:00 eythian heh 14:01 mtompset firewall settings is surely beyond the scope of instructions for installation. 14:02 eythian definitely 14:02 * tcohen thinks the apache stuff is still complicate for the average librarian 14:03 eythian tbh, I kinda wish instructions could be written such that it assumed you had knowledge of how a server worked: I don't think people who don't know that should be setting up servers. It's like driving when you can barely walk. 14:03 eythian That isn't how the world works, alas. 14:03 tcohen eythian, I agree 14:04 tcohen but... 14:04 tcohen here in Cordoba we help a lot of small community libraries 14:04 tcohen popular libraries, that just have a librarian 14:04 tcohen and managed to get koha installed in their 2003 dated desktop 14:05 tcohen maybe its beyond the scope of this docs, thou 14:05 tcohen (the use case I mean) 14:06 wizzyrea we could have a wiki page of "server set up best practices" and refer to it 14:07 tcohen wizzyrea: agree! 14:07 wizzyrea i.e. "need more help with this step? see this link" 14:07 wizzyrea it might be less annoying to maintain that (things that don't change often) separately from the documentation that *does* change pretty often. 14:08 wizzyrea things like the apache config, and firewall rules 14:08 mtompset Actually, installation instructions shouldn't change much, but the person needs to have some basics. 14:08 wizzyrea when I say "pretty often" i mean, it changes more often than "how do I configure a vhost in apache" 14:09 * mtompset nods 14:09 eythian The difficulty is that it starts depending on how their network is set up etc. etc. 14:09 wizzyrea yep 14:09 eythian and how you do things like add DNS entries 14:09 mtompset I was thinking of splitting the Koha_on_Ubuntu page. 14:09 eythian which is really difficult to explain sometimes :) 14:09 wizzyrea yes, it certainly is 14:10 * wizzyrea explains DNS to librarians all the time 14:10 wizzyrea (I really do, at least once a week) 14:10 mtompset how is editing a file hard to explain? 14:10 mtompset Or are we talking setting up something externally? 14:10 wizzyrea "what do I use to edit the file?" "how do I save it?" "do I have to do this on the command line?" 14:11 wizzyrea ^^ all questions we get pretty often 14:11 mtompset Oh the "I can't believe you have a computer to use" type questions. 14:11 wizzyrea and let's not even get into the editor holy words 14:11 wizzyrea holy wars* 14:11 mtompset you mean vi vs. emacs vs... nano? 14:12 wizzyrea yea, but as much as I'd like to say "go learn it and come back, nub" the truth is everyone starts somewhere 14:12 wizzyrea yesterday's nub is today's expert. 14:12 eythian Usually at the deep end though 14:12 mtompset true enough. 14:13 mtompset 3.2.0.27?! 14:13 wizzyrea some people do ok starting in the deep end. :) 14:13 mtompset When did .27 come out? 14:13 wizzyrea sometime after 3.2 14:13 mtompset ha ha. 14:13 wizzyrea ;) 14:13 eythian wizzyrea: yeah, but many, many don't 14:14 mtompset and then they teach others bad habits. :) 14:14 wizzyrea right, and those are the people who need assistance 14:14 mtompset sudo su - 14:14 mtompset and then do everything. ;) 14:14 wizzyrea at the very least, we need to find some good basic tutorials on best practice 14:14 drojf kf mveron that koct translation is tiny. i made it by accident while looking at the file :D 14:15 wizzyrea that we can refer people to 14:15 wizzyrea so if you know of some 14:19 paul_p_ entering "pushing bugs that passed QA" mode... 14:19 eythian fact for today: Cleopatra lived closer chronologically to the moon landing than to the building of the pyramids. 14:20 paul_p_ hey ! eythian ! you break a myth ! 14:20 paul_p_ ;-) 14:20 eythian which myth? 14:20 trea if you have an imported patron with an dateexpiry value, but the patron category they belonged to has an enrollment period, which is going to take precedence? 14:21 trea is it a "whichever expires first" kind of situation? 14:21 paul_p_ eythian well, not sure which one in fact 14:21 eythian trea: that's what I would expect, but I don't know for sure 14:21 wizzyrea what happens if a patron's expiry is beyond the hard date in the category? 14:21 wizzyrea do they expire with their category? 14:21 wizzyrea or on the date in their record? 14:21 * paul_p_ is not sure too 14:23 drojf if you set a date for the patron that should take precedence over the general category rule. no idea if that is the case though 14:23 mtompset Sounds like a call for a www::mechanized testing for this case. ;) 14:24 mtompset That reminds me... I found my library card from when I was in highschool. 14:24 mtompset They expire them every two years. :( 14:24 drojf hmm cannot test koct because the symbol goes in a toolbar that i have hidden in a way that i do not remember 14:25 eythian drojf: you can usually re-enable them from the menus 14:25 eythian or are you using pentadactyl? 14:25 drojf no, i made it differently. i think some userfile, because it kept reappearing 14:26 eythian if so: :set guioptions+=mT 14:26 eythian oh right 14:26 eythian I'd just create a new default profile 14:26 drojf ah yes that would be easy :) 14:27 mtompset No no... do it the hard way... it's more character building. ;) 14:31 drojf hm no, there is just no button 14:32 mtompset Oops... in my joy, I said "of course restart firefox." 14:32 mtompset There goes my chatzilla. 14:33 oleonard mtompset: http://chatzilla.rdmsoft.com/xulrunner/ 14:34 drojf lol mtompset 14:34 drojf but i did a restart of course, still nothing 14:36 mtompset Oh that's a cool idea! 14:36 mtompset No need to go through menus to check it and out. 14:37 mtompset and then mass upload when you have time. 14:38 * mtompset is still waiting for the dselect to finish. 14:38 mveron drojf ++ (for the koct translation) 14:42 kf mveron++ :) 14:42 kf oh and drojf++ :) 14:42 kf mveron: I think we will need a patch to Koha too - so that the language chooser works correctly 14:42 mveron kf: drojf did it! 14:43 kf mveron: I am not sure how we want to do it - having a pull down for different german dialects will look interesting :) 14:43 drojf where do we get the dialect translations from? 14:43 drojf is swiss german done? :) 14:43 kf mveron will do de-CH 14:44 mtompset Actually, the language choosing thing at the bottom is ugly. 14:44 drojf i call that thing now "Koha Offline-Verbuchung", nicht verbuchungswerkzeug or something like that, any objections (besides not meeting the koct acronym)? 14:44 mveron kf: We do first the German translation. Then I download the .po files, do a search/replace with tze sz stuff and some terms, then I rename the files to ch-DE and upload them on Pootle 14:44 kf nope sounds perfect to me 14:44 kf that's what we call tools like that here 14:44 kf Offline-Verbuchung 14:45 drojf ok fine 14:45 drojf there was one thing, wait 14:45 mtompset Can we get pretty flags? 14:45 kf mveron: yes, but when you install them, the language chooser will have a pull down for german, not a single link like now I think 14:45 drojf what is a branchcode in the german translation? Zweig-Code sounds weird 14:45 kf mveron: and the whole thing is based on some not so easy to understand database tables - so I think we need to teach it with a patch how to do that 14:46 kf drojf: depends, I normally use the database column names when the document refers to the database 14:46 kf else I would use Bibliothek 14:46 kf ah 14:46 kf Bibliothekscode? Bibliothekskürzel? 14:46 drojf i think i'll go with bibliothekscode 14:47 drojf kürzel looks better, but i think its more clear that they need the actual code if i name it that way 14:47 mtompset oh come on! jcamins, the koha repository failed me. 14:47 kf makes sense to me 14:48 mtompset I thought all the dependencies were supposed to be listed. 14:48 drojf The option "Apply directly" will directly apply your changes to Koha and should not be used usually. 14:48 drojf wat? 14:49 eythian mtompset: what are you missing? 14:49 mveron kf: If it would be a total other language, let's say Gryphnian, what would have to be done? 14:49 mtompset Template::Plugin... something... 14:50 kf hmmm what about klingon? 14:50 mveron Ok, klingon 14:50 mtompset Template::Plugin::HtmlToText 14:50 kf mveron: I am not sure really, I only know that we have to add the code to the database probably - but we can try it out easily, rename the files and try to install - if it shows up ok, all good :) 14:50 drojf lol @ gryphnian 14:50 eythian mtompset: that is in the repo 14:50 * kf votes for klingon 14:51 mtompset Okay, then it is NOT in the packages file. 14:51 eythian squeeze|main|i386: libtemplate-plugin-htmltotext-perl 0.03-1koha1 14:51 eythian it is 14:51 mtompset like I said... the packages file is missing it. 14:51 eythian oh wait, what packages file? 14:52 mtompset install_misc/ubuntu.packages 14:52 eythian right, that wasn't made with the koha repo in mind last I looked. 14:53 mtompset That's why I had that little script the other day I was working on. 14:53 mtompset I got the file cleaned up for 3.6.7 14:53 mtompset It doesn't quite cut it for 3.8.3 14:56 mtompset I assume Test::Strict is in there too? 14:56 eythian No 14:56 eythian Is it required? 14:56 eythian I didn't see it come up when I checked the deps yesterday 14:57 mtompset It's not required. 14:58 eythian ah 14:58 eythian maybe that's why it didn't come up 14:59 eythian oh wait, I thought you were talking about the repo 14:59 eythian I don't know if it's in the packages file or not 14:59 mtompset Sorry. The terminology is confusing. 14:59 mtompset Because the files I am complaining about are ubuntu.{version}.packages 15:00 mtompset (or at least they will be once I submit my patch to master) 15:00 mveron kf: Worked! I have now two "Deutsch" in the language menu, one Deutsch (de-DE) and one Deutsch (de-CH) 15:00 kf ah good 15:00 kf but de-DE looks a bit ugly :( 15:01 eythian Why does it have a language menu? Shouldn't it pick up the language settings from the browser? 15:01 kf eythian: we want to switch languages - so you need a language chooser 15:01 mveron KF: I think it is because I have now both Deutsch installed. 15:01 kf mveron: maybe, not sure it's so clever 15:02 eythian hmm, but it's a firefox plugin isn't it? 15:02 kf eythian: not KOCT - Koha :) 15:02 eythian ohh 15:02 eythian as you were then :) 15:02 mtompset Yes, but what if you want to use a language different than your browser? 15:02 mveron eythian: We are in a coutry with several languages, so we have to hae the possibility to switch independently from the browser's language 15:03 eythian that seems weird. Surely if you want to change the language for one thing, you want to change it for everything in the browser? 15:03 mtompset I still think Koha should have pretty flags, and then tooltip the codes. 15:03 mveron ...oh, same answer with other wording from different people... :-) 15:03 reiveune bye 15:03 eythian yeah, I'm also confusing plugins with sites 15:03 * mveron has to head to a shop before it closes... 15:03 kf mtompset: flags only work if one country = one language 15:03 eythian though, people should have their browser set with their preferred languages anyway :) 15:04 kf but for example spanish english and german are spoken in more than one 15:04 mtompset Yes, but that's why you tooltip the codes. 15:04 kf eythian: public computers 15:04 kf eythian: and switzerland has 3 official languages, I think norway has 2 15:04 eythian spose 15:04 mtompset put the german flag multiple times, different tool tips. 15:04 kf and english exchange students 15:04 kf we at least want german and english available to everyone everywhere 15:05 kf the language chooser is really an important element and browser detection not a good way to do it 15:05 eythian hmm. I think the better solution overall would be to make it easier to change in the browser, but that's outside the scope of Koha. 15:05 eythian The browser has a neat thing for this 15:05 kf right 15:06 kf but people don't know how to change language settings in browsers 15:06 kf and at the moment you can't deactivate english even if you wanted to 15:07 eythian e.g. my browser sends: Accept-Language nl,en-gb;q=0.8,en-nz;q=0.6,en;q=0.4,en-us;q=0.2 15:08 eythian although en-nz should be 2nd not 3rd... 15:08 kf yeah, but the library can't deactivate english 15:08 jcamins You can't deactivate English? 15:08 jcamins That's a problem. 15:08 eythian can you not untick it? 15:09 kf yeah, but it will still fall back to it I think 15:09 kf rangi was complaining about it 15:09 eythian ah right 15:09 kf I think one library wanted only maori 15:09 eythian yeah, that rings a bell actually 15:10 eythian although, I'd think it would only do that if the template file didn't exist. 15:10 kf not sure 15:10 kf I think it could overall work better 15:11 kf but it works - so please don't break it :) 15:11 eythian it doesn't work all that well 15:11 eythian if I switch to en-NZ things like news stop working 15:11 eythian as they only work with en. 15:11 drojf they do? 15:12 eythian yep. At least, they did in 3.6. 15:12 kf there is a bug for that 15:12 kf they work for German 15:12 eythian yeah 15:12 drojf heh i thought so 15:12 kf I think it's a problem for subdivided languages 15:12 eythian it is 15:12 kf so that's why I think we need to do some testng for de-CH :) 15:12 eythian you can only set the news for 'en', but it doesn't match that to 'en-NZ' 15:12 kf not against it at all - only have to be a little careful adding it maybe 15:13 kf like being a bit worried about display 15:13 kf mailing lists? 15:13 wahanui mailing lists are at http://koha-community.org/support/koha-mailing-lists/ 15:15 jcamins mtompset: the Template... package isn't required for 3.6. 15:15 mtompset I know, but it is for 3.8.3 15:15 jcamins The patch that adds it was rejected for 3.6.7 due to potential problems with dependencies. 15:15 kf documentation? 15:15 wahanui it has been said that documentation is at http://koha-community.org/documentation/ 15:15 jcamins And not having been tested. 15:16 jcamins I'd reeeeaaallllyyyyyyyy like to see it in 3.6.8, though. 15:16 * kf too 15:16 * jcamins looks at kf significantly 15:16 kf because then we can update transaltions again without manipulating template files 15:16 kf well, it's still only fixed for the cart 15:16 kf and we need the same fix for the lists :( 15:17 mtompset what potential problem with dependencies? 15:17 mtompset Is there a bug report somewhere? 15:17 jcamins mtompset: that when I embargoed 3.6.7 it hadn't been packaged yet. 15:17 kf search bugzilla for broken cart email I think 15:18 kf it shoudl be on that bug 15:18 jcamins The potential problem was the lack of libtemplate-plugin-htmltotext-perl. 15:18 mtompset But it does exist, if you add the repositories. 15:18 * mtompset cringes. 15:19 jcamins mtompset: *now* it does. 15:19 mtompset Ah. 15:19 jcamins 3.6.x has a one-month embargo. 15:19 mtompset where you can't add dependencies. 15:19 mtompset when 15:20 jcamins No, you can add dependencies, but they have to be added more than a month before the planned release. 15:20 mtompset Right. no adding dependencies at the last minute. 15:20 jcamins Exactly. 15:20 * jcamins is a bit paranoid about this. 15:23 * jcamins is a bit paranoid about a lot of things. 15:23 jcamins Which is why at some point he will adapt your script to be part of the release process. 15:23 mtompset Would you like the newest version? 15:23 mtompset I added some extra fixes. 15:23 jcamins I'll wait until you have it working on 3.8.x and master. 15:23 jcamins :) 15:24 jcamins It's also going to have to handle different versions of Ubuntu while running under Debian, which may be a challenge. 15:24 mtompset I don't think so. 15:24 mtompset I think the script is pretty non-OS specific. 15:25 jcamins Oh, *you* don't need it to. 15:25 jcamins But running under Debian, I want to be alerted about any potential problems with Lucid, or Precise. 15:25 mtompset "I don't think so" meant I don't think it would be a challenge. 15:25 jcamins Oh. Excellent! 15:26 mtompset I don't see anything in the script which would be OS specific to its running environment. 15:26 jcamins Well, apt-file will have to use different databases, I imagine. 15:27 mtompset Yes, but that is external to the script. 15:27 mtompset The script in its current state detects if apt-file is installed 15:27 mtompset AND 15:27 mtompset if you remembered to run apt-file update 15:27 mtompset (at least once) 15:28 mtompset 50% through the install instructions... no major glitches. 15:28 mtompset Just have to read, and pay attention. 15:29 jcamins Hehe. That's the hard part. 15:29 mtompset Some of my external Wiki links are important. 15:30 jcamins Oh, nice and easy. 15:30 jcamins Just use different sources.list files. 15:30 slef jcamins: ITYM sources.list.d files 15:31 eythian slef: ITYM sources.list.d directories 15:31 eythian (although probably not in this case, as it's for apt-file) 15:31 jcamins slef: apt-file has an argument for sources.list only. 15:32 mtompset --sources-list | -s sources.list 15:32 mtompset Sets the sources.list file to a different value 15:32 mtompset from its default /etc/apt/sources.list. 15:32 jcamins :) 15:32 jcamins Easy as pie. 15:33 slef sources.list.d files are usable as that I think 15:33 mtompset Does that mean it doesn't check sources.list.d files?> 15:33 jcamins mtompset: I think sources.list.d/* is included by sources.list? 15:33 jcamins No. 15:33 jcamins Hm. 15:34 jcamins Don't know what to make of that, then. 15:34 mtompset well, if I try to run my script on 3.8.3 15:34 mtompset it should barf on things only in the k-c repo. 15:35 mtompset well, say they are missing, not barf. 15:35 mtompset and if it does, then I probably should add a loop in there for adding the other repos. 15:36 jcamins The man page mentions sources.list.d, so maybe it does check that? 15:36 wizzyrea oleonard: your library is pretty awesome 15:36 oleonard Oh yeah, who says? 15:36 wizzyrea ME 15:36 wizzyrea :) 15:36 mtompset perhaps. 15:37 * wizzyrea just saw that you have a big truck filled with gadgets in your parking lot 15:37 jcamins mtompset: I just checked, and it uses sources.list.d, provided you don't specify -s 15:37 oleonard Hah, yeah. wizzyrea's spy satellites come through again. 15:37 jcamins o.O 15:37 * wizzyrea flexes 15:37 mtompset that's good. :) 15:37 wizzyrea actually, someone posted it on facebook :P 15:37 oleonard Facebook, spy satellites, same thing. 15:37 wizzyrea keke 15:38 * libsysguy goes to stalk oleonard on facebook 15:38 mtompset libsysguy? 15:38 wahanui libsysguy is probably Koha's hottest developer or partying with swedes on his deck 15:38 oleonard libsysguy: You'll have to stalk the Athens County Public Libraries to see what wizzyrea is seeing I think 15:38 libsysguy heh 15:38 * wizzyrea was following ACPL 15:38 mtompset Is oleonard swedish? ;) 15:38 libsysguy I don't think so 15:39 libsysguy omg oleonard you drive a Semi!?!?! 15:39 oleonard wizzyrea: I hope the "digital bookmobile" helps some patrons, but I have the same mixed feelings about it that I have about ebooks in general 15:39 wizzyrea yep, it's the same as how I feel about the statewide service here 15:40 libsysguy fwiw Anna gets really excited that she can checkout ebooks 15:40 magnuse hm, you'd think a *digital* bookmobile would look less physical, perhaps? ;-) 15:40 oleonard Overdrive sponsors the on-site training in order to encourage libraries to sign up, so it's all profit-driven 15:40 libsysguy book mobile on SL? 15:41 jcamins Hehe. 15:44 mtompset 53% through the installation document. 15:44 mtompset I am so skipping uninstalling and upgrading. :) 15:55 mtompset sudo make install 15:55 mtompset FINALLY! 15:57 eythian jcamins: do you think we should tell mtompset that there are packages that work on Ubuntu too? ;) 15:58 mtompset you mean the koha-common? 15:58 eythian Yeah :) 15:58 kf eythian: ah no, that would be mean after all his work :) 15:59 vfernandes hi guys 15:59 mtompset by the way, are those referenced in the wiki somewhere? 15:59 eythian yeah 15:59 drojf digital book mobile? i picture an access point on a radio controlled car and have drive-by downloads 15:59 eythian mtompset: see the top of the koha on ubuntu page. 15:59 wizzyrea haha I like that drojf 15:59 wizzyrea like the google street view of mobile downloads 16:00 eythian find open network shares on open wifi networks and uploads stuff to them as it goes past? 16:00 drojf or, well, it's 2012, maybe an ebook drone 16:00 wizzyrea yea pretty much ;) 16:00 vfernandes i'm having 1 problem... the system preference dontmerge is set to "Do" but when I change one authority, the data in the records don't change 16:00 wizzyrea an ebook drone would be cool too, except for the bombing innocents thing. 16:01 mtompset sorry, but Quick start loses me. 16:01 vfernandes i'm doing something wrong? 16:01 drojf bombing with knowledge! 16:02 eythian mtompset: it's easier in practice than what you're doing, I expect. 16:03 mtompset perhaps... except, how would that work behind a reverse proxy? 16:03 eythian very easily 16:03 eythian you just set it up exactly the way you normally would, perhaps with some internal names, and point the proxy to it 16:03 mtompset the domain name and everything would be the same? 16:03 jcamins vfernandes: I don't think authority merging works. 16:03 eythian well, you can always change them after installation 16:03 eythian just tweaking the apache config 16:04 eythian About half of my installations are behind a reverse proxy I think. 16:09 jcamins I don't see how there's any difference between going through all the installation manually and using the packages, except the first way takes a whole bunch of steps and manual work, and the second doesn't. 16:09 mtompset Well, there still are config steps. 16:09 jcamins If you have a reverse proxy, you have to edit the Apache config file no matter what. 16:09 mtompset It does reduce the number of steps. 16:09 jcamins Yes, but you will do the exact same config steps with both. 16:10 jcamins The difference is with the package the upgrade is more-or-less foolproof. 16:10 * paul_p_ hates failing QA on patches...(bug 5409 and bug 8163) 16:10 mtompset I'll be trying a koha-common install in the future. 16:11 * eythian goes home, later all 16:11 kf have anice evening 16:12 mtompset Perhaps INSTALL.ubuntu.via_packages? 16:13 mtompset INSTALL.ubuntu.manually? 16:13 jcamins mtompset: what about just one file, that says "if you're using packages, do this, and meet back up at step 30." 16:13 kf hm 16:14 kf is it wise to put the file in there in this case? 16:14 kf if you have downloaded and unpacked it, it might be too late? 16:14 kf hm no, perhaps not 16:14 kf ignore me :) 16:14 mtompset once I do a koha-common install, I'll have a better idea. 16:15 mtompset but that is probably a good idea. 16:15 drojf and then you wonder what you did all the manual stuff for :D 16:15 mtompset for testing and documenting history. :P 16:15 mtompset and for the glory of doing it yourself. 16:16 drojf funny question, but can i copy in git from one branch to another with some magick trick? 16:17 drojf more magic than switching branches manually and copy stuff at some temp place that is 16:17 mtompset oh. :( 16:18 drojf ah i could just do git merge in this case i guess 16:18 drojf or not. better read what it does first :D 16:19 kf drojf: git cherry-pick maybe? 16:19 drojf aaah that sounds more like it 16:20 kf I used it once to backport patches from a 3.y to a 3.x 16:20 kf worked nicely 16:22 drojf kf++ # that worked 16:23 jcamins drojf: I do git checkout branch -- file 16:23 jcamins Followed by git reset 16:23 jcamins (to unstage it) 16:23 kf :) 16:24 mtompset Shoot... found another bug in the docs. 16:24 jcamins drojf: what are you trying to do? 16:24 jcamins First question? 16:24 wahanui "What are you trying to do?" "What is the goal?" or "What problem are you experiencing?" 16:26 mtompset Shoot! I just learned about things missing in the crontab! 16:27 drojf jcamins: i sent a small patch that i would like to enhance at some point. but i also want to keep the state i have now so i can do followups on what i sent in, so i cherrypicked the commit to a new branch 16:27 mtompset the misc/cronjobs/crontab.example --- are all those things necessary? 16:27 jcamins mtompset: no, they are examples. 16:27 jcamins drojf: okay, so what exactly is the problem? 16:27 drojf notjing 16:28 drojf it worked with kf's help :) 16:28 jcamins Oh. Excellent. :) 16:28 drojf i just did not know how to do it, cherry pick was the answer 16:29 mtompset # OVERDUE NOTICES 16:29 mtompset 0 1 * * * $KOHA_CRON_PATH/overdue_notices.pl -t 16:29 mtompset some are good to have, like this one, right? 16:29 jcamins That's pretty critical if you want to send overdue notices. 16:30 jcamins Right. 16:31 JoeLib001 Hello. :-) Has anyone used the Koha Reports to create a "Barcode Slip". The Barcode Slip I need to create needs to be printable in a 3x5 format. I know all of the fields and have created a test report with the data I need. 16:32 jcamins JoeLib001: no, the reports module doesn't do barcode slips. You might have more luck with the label tool. 16:32 JoeLib001 I will look at that then. :-) Thanks. 16:32 mtompset Oh, another question, while I think of it... can you do a meaningful development install off of koha-common? 16:33 jcamins mtompset: no, one does development installs with git. 16:33 jcamins You can't do a useful development install from a tarball, either. 16:34 mtompset okay... and koha-common is purposefully suited to multiple-sites, but you only have to install one site? 16:34 jcamins Right. 16:34 mtompset Then it would seem that the tarball is best for "only one site ever". 16:35 jcamins Right. 16:35 jcamins And even then it's not a good idea, if you're on a deb-based system. 16:35 mtompset Correct. 16:36 mtompset So the method of installation is really a combination of what OS am I on and what will I be doing. 16:37 jcamins Right. If you're developing, you should use git. If you're not developing on a deb-based system, you should use packages. If you're not developing on a different flavour of Linux, you should use the tarball. 16:37 kf translatable koct a full success :) 16:37 jenkins_koha Starting build #790 for job Koha_master (previous build: STILL UNSTABLE -- last SUCCESS #773 20 days ago) 16:37 wizzyrea which install do I use is <reply> If you're developing, you should use git. If you're not developing on a deb-based system, you should use packages. If you're not developing on a different flavour of Linux, you should use the tarball. 16:38 jcamins which install do I use? 16:38 wizzyrea aw 16:38 jcamins which install do wizzyrea use? 16:38 * wizzyrea will try again 16:38 drojf bad bot 16:38 jcamins which install do wahanui use? 16:38 wizzyrea which install to use? 16:38 wahanui If you're developing, you should use git. If you're not developing on a deb-based system, you should use packages. If you're not developing on a different flavour of Linux, you should use the tarball. 16:38 wizzyrea there we go 16:38 jcamins :) 16:39 JoeLib001 I was reading the help on Labels and it says: "Currently all fields in the following tables are used: items, biblioitems, biblio, branches" Does that mean I can't use fields from aqorders and o? 16:39 jcamins That is correct. 16:40 jcamins I think. 16:40 JoeLib001 Can I make it? :-) 16:40 jcamins JoeLib001: I am sure it is possible. I have no idea how much work it would involve. 16:40 wizzyrea yep, and if you do, submit a patch 16:41 JoeLib001 Yeah, we'll see where the dark rabbit hole leads. It might not have a bottom or it might have spikes at the bottom. :-) 16:42 wizzyrea or it might be a portal to a magical land of happiness and wonder. 16:42 wizzyrea never know. 16:42 JoeLib001 Could be. Hehe. :-) 16:42 mtompset wizzyrea++ # yay for optimism! 16:42 wizzyrea could also be an alternate universe where the laws of physics are completely different from the ones we know here. 16:42 wizzyrea WE JUST DON'T KNOW :) :) 16:43 wizzyrea do let us know what you find though. 16:43 JoeLib001 I think the Alice computer game was probably more correct than the original movie. :-) 16:43 JoeLib001 Will do. 16:44 * wizzyrea played that game 16:44 wizzyrea had nightmares for weeks. 16:45 oleonard Alice computer game? 16:46 mtompset I was looking at INSTALL.debian. 16:46 drojf not in the debian packages it seems :P 16:46 drojf the alice game i mean 16:46 mtompset It's as bad as UBUNTU's! 16:47 wizzyrea fix it then :P 16:47 JoeLib001 Hehe. :-) 16:47 wizzyrea you should have seen it before we fixed it the last time. 16:47 drojf "Skype, together with Norton, Adobe and TomTom, is spreading the word about why it's important to keep your software in top condition" lol. a bunch of companies whose software's deinstallation would be the best update 16:47 mtompset It's 12:45am... I just barely made it to 5.2 in my modified instructions for Ubuntu. 16:54 paul_p_ nengard_lunch = pls look at http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8392#c11 16:54 paul_p_ @later tell nengard = pls look at http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8392#c11 16:55 jcamins paul_p_: no huginn. 16:55 drojf paul_p_: later does not work 16:55 jcamins :( 16:55 paul_p_ yep, that's what I understood. 16:55 kf bye all 16:55 drojf bye kf 16:56 paul_p_ OK, time to leave for me now. "passed QA" queue almost empty. Busy afternoon ! 17:29 limon_away I bought my TomTom specifically because it runs on Linux. Hate the Windows-only "My TomTom" interface for updates. 17:29 jcamins limon_away: well that's ironic. 17:29 jcamins At least it doesn't require DOS, I guess? 17:30 jcamins (though at least you could use FreeDOS, I suppose...) 17:32 JoeLib001 Hehe, I hacked my tomtom and added a mp3 player, a video player, and a linux boot image. ;-) 17:34 JoeLib001 Well, I use the term hacked loosely as I didn't do much work. :-) 17:36 JoeLib001 I can't add an "item" to the Batch Label Queue. I don't have an item associated with the record. Would that be my problem? 17:37 JoeLib001 I have a whole slew of errors in my error log too. 17:37 jcamins JoeLib001: probably you need an item, but I don't really know. 17:37 JoeLib001 Here is part of one of my errors. 17:37 JoeLib001 Cannot add or update a child row: a foreign key constraint fails (`koha`.`creator_batches`, CONSTRAINT `creator_batches_ibfk_3` FOREIGN KEY (`item_number`) REFERENCES `items` (`itemnumber`) ON DELETE CASCADE) at /usr/share/koha/lib/C4/Creators/Batch.pm line 72 17:39 jcamins That's a problem. 17:39 JoeLib001 Looks like I don't have a profile id either. Which is odd as there are profiles with profile IDs. 17:39 jcamins Sounds like you have a seriously screwed up database. 17:40 JoeLib001 I don't have any items in my database yet. 17:40 JoeLib001 All I have are records. 17:40 JoeLib001 I opted not to add items per Journal Subscription creation. 17:41 jenkins_koha Project Koha_master build #790: STILL UNSTABLE in 1 hr 3 min: http://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_master/790/ 17:41 jenkins_koha * fridolyn.somers: Bug 8476: Little bug in OPAC XSLT on OPACURLOpenInNewWindow 17:41 jenkins_koha * dpavlin: Bug 8439 - Printing basketgroup does not work on plack 17:41 jenkins_koha * kyle.m.hall: BugFix - ReturnToShelvingCart 17:41 jenkins_koha * dpavlin: Bug 8442 - labels creator fixes for plack 17:41 jenkins_koha * dcook: Bug 8448 - Holds Awaiting Pickup : Cancelling a hold on a waiting item with multiple holds displays a blank screen instead of a warning prompt 17:41 jenkins_koha * dcook: Bug 8414 - Intranet header toplinks display white rather than blue in < IE8 17:41 jenkins_koha * fridolyn.somers: Bug 8440: Dates does not appear in suggestions management 17:41 jenkins_koha * ruth: Bug 8392: Category age ranges not being enforced 17:41 jenkins_koha * f.demians: Bug 8392: Avoid having an untranslatable age range 17:41 jenkins_koha * m.de.rooy: 8062 Followup for HTML::FormatText 17:41 jenkins_koha * magnus: Bug 7367 - One "the" too many 17:41 jenkins_koha * dcook: Bug 8434 - Notice generation fails for Advanced Notices, Item Due, and Overdues when run in shell (due to error in Letters.pm) 17:41 jenkins_koha * julian.maurice: Bug 8376: New script to export borrowers misc/export_borrowers.pl 17:41 jcamins JoeLib001: well, maybe the label tool requires items. 17:42 JoeLib001 The labels are for our book acquisitions. So maybe, I need to work out how we are doing the Acquistions then. 17:42 JoeLib001 I have it so that it doesn't create the item until we "receive" the book. 17:43 JoeLib001 So, we probably need to add the item to the book as soon as we enter the order in Acquisitions? 17:44 qwerty how to change the opac background with our image file 17:45 jcamins qwerty: you can use CSS. 17:47 jcamins oleonard's blog 17:47 wahanui oleonard's blog is http://www.myacpl.org/koha 17:47 jcamins qwerty: you might look there for ideas. ^^ 17:47 qwerty in opacusercss .tell me the script 17:49 jcamins qwerty: it's the same way you would change the background for any other page. 17:49 qwerty i want to add out library building is in opac background on search bar 17:50 jcamins I think probably if you set the 'background' CSS property for the search bar, that would work. 17:52 qwerty yes am looking for changing background in search bar 17:52 jcamins You could also find another OPAC that does that, and take a look at the CSS they used. 17:54 JoeLib001 Yeah, once I add an item to one of the records everything works. 17:56 JoeLib001 I will have to look at our Acquisitions process and make sure we add an item when we create the record. 17:56 JoeLib001 Thanks for the help guys. :-) 17:56 jcamins Hey, you're the one who did all the figuring things out. :) 17:57 drojf unlike someone else 17:57 jcamins Heh. 17:57 jcamins drojf: I probably shouldn't have said anything. 17:58 drojf i really wonder if it is a language thing or a culture thing or a person thing. this way of interaction 17:59 jcamins If s/he had tried *at all* I would've explained how to do it. 18:00 jcamins Even pulled up a web browser to find the name of the element. 18:00 drojf also the way of using a new nick every time you come in. makes it seem like you know you should be hiding 18:00 jcamins I presume the theory is that we must be stupid since we're giving away our work, so maybe we won't make the connection. 18:01 drojf lol 18:16 drojf do i have to restart sshd after a new interface comes up? i can't connect via wifi, also not eth0 if i plug it in later (not at boot) 18:19 jcamins I'd never heard of that. 18:22 jcamins Oooh. 18:22 jcamins I could roll the truffles in coconut! 18:24 drojf :) 18:24 * jcamins has been on a no-bake dessert kick recently. 18:25 Morthland How can I set a default item type? 18:55 jcamins drojf: if you didn't figure it out yet, I realized what the problem probably is with sshd. 18:55 jcamins You have it set up to listen on a specific IP. 18:57 drojf jcamins: thanks, i stopped looking for it to write an email to duckduckgo that the relevancy of their search results has become horrible 18:57 drojf which annoyed me a lot when i searched fot he ssh thing 18:57 jcamins I thought ddg was supposed to have excellent relevancy? 18:57 drojf was 18:57 drojf no idea what is going on 18:58 drojf but i regoogle almost everything at the moment 19:00 drojf http://duck.co/topic/relavency-in-ddg-and-google-result#28469000001212063 seems like they know it already 19:04 wizzyrea well google just did a huuuuuuge push on relevancy 19:04 wizzyrea so it's possible that google just recently got a lot better. 19:04 drojf i almost never used google the last two years 19:04 drojf so that can't be it for me 19:04 wizzyrea right I"m talking in the last 2 months 19:05 drojf but yes, while ddg seemed sucky, google looked less sucky than before 19:05 wizzyrea google changed their ranking/relevancy algorithm 19:06 drojf i had the impression that a lot of the hits for people _selling_ stuff that i want to read _about_ (and not buy) have vanished. i like that 19:06 drojf and other junk 19:08 wizzyrea is batch patron mod new? 19:08 drojf also google sends me 2-3 people every day to look at my ikea lunch box raspberry pi case :D 19:09 jcamins wizzyrea: I think so. 19:09 jcamins Speaking of Google, I need to switch to Piwik. 19:10 drojf speaking of that, it's really scary what stuff i can see about people visiting my website, the hoster has urchin running for everybody, which i think is pre-google anayltics 19:11 drojf but you should switch to piwik :) 19:13 drojf and i should find out how to make them anonymize my logs. it took only two weeks to get them to reenable me to install mediawiki in my db, so a service they don't advertise can surely only take a few months (or a "no"). that's what you get for 2,50 a month 19:15 jcamins drojf: No wonder service is so problematic- that's absurdly inexpensive! 19:17 drojf yes indeed :D i wanted to get microhosting for that money, but those people did not really answer my emails, so i thought i'd just try this, how bad can it be for that price ;) i don't really have money to spend on such things at the moment 19:21 drojf nice, fast reply from ddg 19:30 rangi Morning 19:30 rangi And zomg 19:31 drojf hey rangi 19:31 * jcamins isn't quite sure what latter is in response to. 19:31 drojf and ? 19:32 rangi Items in 090 19:32 jcamins Heh. 19:32 jcamins Yeah. 19:33 rangi 0 chance that will work 19:33 jcamins Ya know, we could actually fix this, once the search rewrite was completed. 19:33 rangi Yep 19:34 jcamins Want to map something to somewhere dumb? 19:34 jcamins No problem. 19:34 drojf lol 19:34 jcamins (not that 090 is that dumb) 19:34 jcamins Also, we'd have to get rid of GRS-1, but that was always just an awful idea. 19:34 rangi Yep 19:35 rangi But for now changing mapping and hoping for the best is about it 19:35 jcamins Yup. 19:36 JoeLib001 drojf: You made a raspberry pi case from a lunchbox? 19:36 mib_vdxzbe hello 19:36 mib_vdxzbe Can anyone help me, this is the error i am getting, Unparsable version '' for prerequisite Test::Strict at Makefile.PL line 557. Warning: prerequisite CGI::Session::Driver::memcached 0.04 not found. Warning: prerequisite Template::Plugin::HtmlToText 0.03 not found. Warning: prerequisite Test::Strict 0 not found. ERROR from evaluation of /build/koha-3.08.03/pe 19:36 drojf JoeLib001: it had a good size ;) 19:36 JoeLib001 Hehe. :-) 19:36 jcamins JoeLib001: it saved the raspberry pi from dunking in soda. 19:36 JoeLib001 I made mine out of legos. :-) 19:37 jcamins mib_vdxzbe: those are just warnings. You should be able to ignore them. 19:37 drojf that was what i wanted to do :) 19:37 drojf but then these things were lying around 19:37 JoeLib001 Hehe. :-) Is it water tight? 19:37 mib_vdxzbe anybody? 19:37 wahanui hmmm... anybody is here 19:37 jcamins There is a patch to fix the first (but you can ignore it), and the others can be installed from the apt repo at debian.koha-community.org 19:38 mib_vdxzbe Ok 19:38 drojf it was tight enough for the bottle of water i poured over my desk shortly after i made the case :D 19:38 JoeLib001 Cool. :-) 19:38 mib_vdxzbe how do i add the apt repo? 19:38 JoeLib001 Yeah, my lego case would not protect it from water very well. Lots of open space around the connectors. 19:39 jcamins debian? 19:39 wahanui debian is what most people use and there are good manuals and even packages for that 19:39 drojf but it has holes for the cables of course, so it won't swim well. at least not without the raspi dying 19:39 mib_vdxzbe ubuntu 19:39 jcamins koha on debian? 19:39 wahanui koha on debian is http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Koha_3.8_on_Debian_Squeeze 19:39 jcamins That's what I was looking for ^^ 19:39 mib_vdxzbe oh 19:39 mib_vdxzbe ok 19:39 mib_vdxzbe so get that? 19:39 jcamins I didn't remember the URL, and I knew our bot had it somewhere in its memory. ;) 19:39 mib_vdxzbe haha 19:39 jcamins Step 1 or 2 on the page is how to add the apt repo. 19:39 drojf JoeLib001: installed koha on the raspberry pi already? :P 19:39 JoeLib001 Yeah. Would be an interesting project to see about making it water tight. Would need special connectors and such probably. 19:39 mib_vdxzbe thanks 19:40 JoeLib001 Hahahaha! No. 19:40 JoeLib001 :-) 19:40 drojf works well! 19:40 drojf kind of :) 19:40 JoeLib001 Really? 19:40 drojf yes 19:40 drojf i develop on it 19:40 JoeLib001 Yeah, figured the kind of. Probably would work well for a small collection though. 19:40 JoeLib001 Hmm...... 19:40 drojf with plack it runs ok 19:40 drojf without it's horribly slow 19:41 JoeLib001 What is plack? 19:41 wahanui plack is working quite nice. 19:41 drojf http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Plack 19:41 wahanui http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Plack is, like, probably good place to get started with latest development 19:41 jcamins wahanui: forget plack 19:41 wahanui jcamins: I forgot plack 19:42 jcamins Plack is <reply> Plack is a FastCGI thingy that works with Koha. See http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Plack for more information. 19:42 jcamins plack? 19:42 wahanui Plack is a FastCGI thingy that works with Koha. See http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Plack for more information. 19:43 mib_vdxzbe bob is <reply> Bob is an awsome dude 19:43 mib_vdxzbe bob? 19:43 wahanui i think bob is doing sys admins now 19:43 drojf yeah i just saw there is not much about what it actually is on that page :) it caches a lot of stuff and makes pages load faster 19:43 mib_vdxzbe aw :( 19:44 JoeLib001 Cool. :-) 19:44 drojf JoeLib001: http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Koha_on_a_Raspberry_Pi 19:44 jcamins raspberry pi? 19:44 wahanui raspberry pi is arm-based 19:44 jcamins forget raspberry pi 19:44 wahanui jcamins: I forgot raspberry pi 19:45 jcamins raspberry pi is <reply> Raspberry Pi embedded computers run Koha just fine. :) See http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Koha_on_a_Raspberry_Pi 19:45 jcamins raspberry pi? 19:45 wahanui Raspberry Pi embedded computers run Koha just fine. :) See http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Koha_on_a_Raspberry_Pi 19:45 drojf :) 19:45 JoeLib001 Sweet. :-) I like it. 19:47 mib_vdxzbe jcamins, i did what you said, still says Unparsable version '' for prerequisite Test::Strict at Makefile.PL line 557. ERROR from evaluation of /build/koha-3.08.03/perl-ldap-0.38/Makefile.PL: Can't locate Module/Install/Admin.pm in @INC (@INC contains: /build/koha-3.08.03 /etc/perl /usr/local/lib/perl/5.12.4 /usr/local/share/perl/5.12.4 /usr/lib/perl5 /usr/sha 19:47 JoeLib001 I've been thinking about creating a catalog of my own books, dvds, games, etc. That way when I see something I like and don't remember if I bought it yet. I can just search it. hehe. 19:48 jcamins Ah, I didn't see the last error. 19:48 wizzyrea JoeLib001: are you familiar with librarything? 19:48 jcamins The Unparsable version error can just be ignored. 19:48 drojf heh nice. i think about making koha my video library 19:48 mib_vdxzbe but it stops 19:48 jcamins The other one has nothing to do with Koha. 19:48 mib_vdxzbe oh 19:48 drojf unfortunately html5 does not play avi 19:48 wizzyrea (if you don't want to, say, run a koha instance) 19:48 JoeLib001 wizzyrea: Somewhat. Haven't looked into it. 19:48 mib_vdxzbe how do i fix it? 19:48 drojf but mp4 and mkv seems to work 19:49 jcamins mib_vdxzbe: no idea. Use the packages for whatever it is you're trying to install. 19:49 mib_vdxzbe trying to install koha 19:50 jcamins mib_vdxzbe: but you are currently installing perl-ldap 0.38? 19:50 mib_vdxzbe no 19:50 mib_vdxzbe i'm running the makefile.pl 19:50 jcamins You should try `sudo apt-get install libmodule-install-perl` to install Module::Install. 19:51 mib_vdxzbe ok 19:51 jcamins What is perl-ldap-0.38, though? 19:51 mib_vdxzbe no idea 19:51 jcamins It's on your system. 19:51 mib_vdxzbe oh, well i'm not sure what it is 19:52 jcamins You must have downloaded it manually? 19:52 JoeLib001 wizzyrea: Yeah, I don't much care to create another account. Not to mention I would be using their hosting and such. Google already has part of my soul. I don't need to give another part of it. hehe. ;-) 19:52 mib_vdxzbe maybe 19:52 jcamins The Koha tarballs don't include a directory called perl-ldap-0.38. 19:52 mib_vdxzbe oh 19:53 jcamins mib_vdxzbe: what instructions are you following? 19:53 jcamins koha on ubuntu? 19:53 wahanui it has been said that koha on ubuntu is http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Koha_on_Ubuntu 19:53 jcamins ^^ that page should have good, detailed instructions. 19:53 drojf heh 19:54 mib_vdxzbe ok ,well now it says, ERROR from evaluation of /build/koha-3.08.03/perl-ldap-0.38/Makefile.PL: Cannot find an extension with method 'Meta_ArrayKeys' at /usr/share/perl5/Module/Install/Admin.pm line 186. 19:54 jcamins You need to start over, I think. 19:54 jcamins perl-ldap-0.38 has nothing to do with Koha. 19:54 mib_vdxzbe oh 19:55 jcamins I would do the following: `mv /build/koha-3.08.03 /build/koha-3.08.03-old` 19:55 mib_vdxzbe i have been fallowing this http://www.blazingmoon.org/news/2008/12/install-koha-on-ubuntu-part-4-koha/ 19:55 jcamins `tar zxvf koha-3.08.03.tar.gz` 19:55 jcamins Oh my. 19:55 jcamins That's four years old. 19:55 jcamins That will not be helpful. :( 19:55 jcamins The instructions on the wiki are accurate. 19:55 mib_vdxzbe o 19:55 mib_vdxzbe k 19:55 * cait waves 19:56 JoeLib001 Where is the docs folder at in koha? 19:56 jcamins drojf: didn't you comment on that post to tell them that it was out of date? 19:56 rangi Ok my stop 19:56 rangi Bbiab 19:57 drojf jcamins: i think so, yes. but it does not seem to be there 19:57 jcamins Guess they didn't like losing traffic. 19:57 drojf yup :( 19:58 drojf "i get visitors" -- "my information is outdated" -- "but i get visitors" … 19:58 jcamins What about "okay, then, update your damn guide so that it doesn't result in broken systems." 19:59 JoeLib001 Hehe. ;-) 19:59 drojf "but i'm not interested in koha anymore" -- "but i get visitors" 19:59 jcamins lol 20:05 drojf he has an "about"-page, a "contact"-page that is the same "about"-page and we should contact him via his website. for somebody doing business of some kind it seems like a weird contacting philosophy to not even have an email address somewhere 20:05 Shane-S quick question on the admin login screen it defaults to "My Library" in the bottom drop down. Can I remove that so just the library(ies) we setup appear? 20:05 jcamins Shane-S: "My library" is a synonym for "the library that my user is attached to." 20:07 Shane-S okay, but is it something I can remove for my user who might not understand that? 20:07 jcamins Shane-S: I believe you can use intranetuserjs to do that. 20:07 oleonard Shane-S: If you remove it your user will always have to choose their library manually 20:07 oleonard Shane-S: I don't think that's easier. 20:07 jcamins Yes, but better to just tell them what "My library" means. 20:07 jcamins Good point, oleonard. 20:07 Shane-S ah okay, I will just say "ignore it" then :P 20:08 jcamins You'll have everyone checking things out from the wrong library by default. 20:08 oleonard Shane-S: You are running a multi-branch system? 20:08 Shane-S We only have 1 Library is why I asked 20:08 jcamins Right, so don't worry about that box. 20:08 oleonard Won't turning on singlebranchmode remove that box? 20:09 Shane-S I "may" add a small building lending library down the road 20:09 jcamins oleonard: yeah, but doesn't it break holds or something? 20:09 * oleonard doesn't know 20:09 Shane-S but for now it is just our main school library, then I will look into adding faculty books/videos to keep track of them 20:11 Shane-S well thanks very much for the help, I will be back often soon as I have to begin getting this system live 20:11 Shane-S I at least cut my install down from 1 day to 4 hours to 2 hours. Packages are lovely and knowing what to fix ahead of time helps :) 20:15 * drojf sent an email to the blog guy 20:16 drojf "I'll be away from work through Friday 7/27 and will be checking my work email only infrequently. Once I return to work I'll get back to you as soon as I'm able." 20:16 oleonard Did you tell him we were coming over there to rough him up? 20:16 rangi lol 20:17 drojf heh 20:17 rangi check this our 20:17 rangi out even 20:18 rangi http://jenkins.koha-community.org/cigame/? 20:18 oleonard What are the scores based on? 20:19 rangi each build gets a score allocated 20:19 rangi build 790 for master, got 3 points 20:19 rangi you get 1 point for each new test that passes 20:19 rangi -10 for breaking a build 20:19 jcamins Humbug. 20:19 jcamins I'll never get any points. 20:20 rangi -1 for every test that fails 20:20 rangi increasing testing coverage gets points 20:20 wizzyrea well 20:20 rangi so you should get points for that 20:20 wizzyrea what about 2 steps forward, one step back 20:20 wizzyrea :P 20:20 wizzyrea so +2 for a new test 20:20 wizzyrea -1 for breaking something 20:20 rangi yep 20:20 rangi the build would be worth 1 at that point 20:20 * wizzyrea likes forward momentum 20:21 rangi http://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_master/790/cigame/ 20:21 rangi tells you the score for each build 20:21 jcamins Okay, time to head home. 20:23 rangi just some silliness, but silliness makes life enjoyable :) 20:23 cait too true :) 20:23 cait why would a library want stop words? 20:24 cait I mean seriously 20:24 rangi habit 20:24 cait what is the point of having a list of words that is not searchable?? 20:24 rangi well stop words for sorting 20:24 rangi that makes sense 20:24 cait yes 20:24 cait but you do that with non filing characters normally 20:24 cait or with indicators 20:24 * rangi points stacy to the thread with brooke and jcamins 20:24 cait not with a list 20:25 drojf isn't she using ll anyway? 20:26 * oleonard wonders if Stacy reads the list when she's not posting to it 20:26 rangi yes, she is 20:26 rangi not by choice tho 20:26 cait hm 20:28 oleonard The real question is why she thinks having stopwords would help. Sounds like an unresolved searching problem. 20:28 rangi their system is broken 20:28 rangi we all know that 20:29 oleonard True. Did they mess up the searching as well? 20:29 rangi it's their MO 20:29 rangi it's what they do 20:29 rangi searching, circulation, virtual shelves, peoples lives 20:31 rangi [off] they are switching to solr, it was in the SCLS minutes i suspect she is trying to see if tht will actually fix anything or just compound the problem 20:32 drojf it probabyl won't fix anything if they do it the ll way 20:32 drojf probably even 20:37 wizzyrea stacy is from waldo though? 20:40 rangi yup 20:40 rangi but its to replace zebra ... they are koha 2009 stage still 20:41 drojf must be fun 20:41 drojf i know a blog that might fit their installation needs ;) 20:41 oleonard Just imagine how much more behind they'd be if they weren't so agile. 20:41 rangi (in terms of zebra/solr that is) 20:41 cait lol 20:42 cait hey, they are already at version 4 20:42 rangi 5 now 20:42 cait ! 20:42 cait since when? 20:43 drojf that reminds me, what about koha release names? we should really have this 20:43 rangi liblime academic koha 5.0 20:43 libsysguy [off] https://github.com/ctfliblime/LibLime-Koha 20:44 cjh rangi: shouldnt that be liblime academic KOHA 5.0? 20:44 rangi for major versions? 20:44 rangi we could do that 20:44 cjh koha 3.9.0 'awesome' 20:44 drojf koha 3.10 'fancy fried fudge' 20:44 cjh haha 20:45 * oleonard heads out 20:45 drojf lol i like how the last commit in docs is from rangi, 3 years ago @ link 20:45 oleonard see ya #koha 20:45 libsysguy well I guess animals are taken as well as deserts 20:45 wizzyrea bye oleonard 20:45 * wizzyrea appreciates that he waited 20:47 drojf libsysguy: boring stuff like icecream sandwhich is taken. if we come up with a cool recipe per version that would work i think 20:47 libsysguy a recibe 20:47 libsysguy like 3.10 Koha 'BBQ Ribs' 20:48 libsysguy on an unrelated note I kind of want to discuss changing the way Koha::Calendar works 20:48 libsysguy anybody up to pointing out some mistakes im about to make :p 20:48 * libsysguy thinks everyone should run away heh 20:50 rangi write the tests first 20:50 rangi then write the code to pass those tests 20:51 rangi and ill be happy 20:51 libsysguy haha 20:51 * libsysguy is here to make rangi happy 20:51 libsysguy if rangi ain't happy…aint nobody happy 20:51 libsysguy ^^ with the thickest southern drawl you can imagine 20:51 rangi but seriously starting with a test plan, and a unit test ... means we are way less likely to cause more issues than we fix 20:52 drojf oh we do it the other way around now? :P 20:53 libsysguy well I was going to start with a way to represent in in the database 20:53 libsysguy but you think a testing plan is still the way to go 20:53 rangi yes 20:54 rangi knowing what you want the data to do 20:54 rangi should influence representation 20:54 rangi not the other way round 20:54 libsysguy ok 20:54 rangi ie, if we know how we want it to work, we can build a data structure that enables it 20:54 libsysguy haha 20:55 rangi and its a pretty well contained, well defined area 20:55 cait it's only calendars cause headaches 20:55 rangi also, this must have been done before 20:55 libsysguy well after the foo bar that hourly was I suppose it does need to be started with tests :p 20:55 cait well to me at least :) 20:56 drojf was? 20:56 drojf is it fixed now? 20:56 libsysguy lol drojf it will never be fixed 20:56 rangi yeah calendars, closing and opening times, those are where the current issues occur 20:56 libsysguy im working on closing/opening times 20:57 libsysguy thats why im pestering atm lol 20:57 rangi but that should be easily testable 20:57 rangi also 20:57 rangi http://search.cpan.org/~dichi/DBD-Mock-1.43/lib/DBD/Mock.pm 20:57 libsysguy well that is handy 20:57 rangi we dont even need to populate a db with holidays or opening and closing times etc 20:57 rangi we can mock that up 20:58 rangi and test that we still get the correct due_dates, or fines leveled 20:58 libsysguy we don't use DBIx::Class do we 20:59 rangi indirectly yes 20:59 libsysguy but not in a way that I could write a Class for a DB object 20:59 libsysguy that is what I have been doing in catalyst 21:00 libsysguy so sometimes I get them mixed up 21:00 rangi you could 21:00 rangi the solr code uses moose 21:00 libsysguy oh moose 21:01 rangi frankly is still just prefer class::accessor 21:01 rangi but to each their own 21:01 libsysguy I want that to be an acrynom that comes out to the equivalent of "Every module under the sun" 21:01 rangi but by using moose, dbix::class is in there 21:01 rangi so its available to be used 21:02 libsysguy ok, im not sure how far I want to chase that :p 21:02 rangi you probably want to talk to jcamins tho, as RM in waiting 21:02 libsysguy I've pinged him some 21:03 libsysguy but not as in depth as I am here heh 21:03 rangi as long as its not slow, is well documented and tested, you coudl write it in swahili 21:03 rangi as far as i care 21:03 libsysguy heh 21:03 libsysguy chris_n seriously :p 21:09 rangi [off] can't deal with that mail, someone elses turn 21:10 drojf [off] 'With preference set to "do not use zebra",' …i'll pass 21:13 cait [off] oh, I read " do use zebra " 21:14 drojf cait: with that syspref you can never know 21:14 cait it's time to kill it 21:20 jcamins libsysguy is using DBD::Mock? 21:20 jcamins Woohoo! 21:20 jcamins libsysguy++ 21:22 jcamins Oh, no, but at least he's planning to write tests first. :) 21:23 libsysguy haha yeah I am working on the tests 21:23 libsysguy im trying to decide if I want to continue on the path of numbering off days/hours/minutes in an array :-/ 21:23 jcamins Uhhh... 21:24 jcamins Hm. 21:24 libsysguy I don't want an array of 60 in the db just hogging up rows 21:24 libsysguy so the perl part of the test is easy 21:25 libsysguy representing that data is hard 21:25 jcamins Right. 21:25 libsysguy so i am scouring the internet for a good calendar schema so I can have a way to model my data in perl 21:26 libsysguy too bad I can't just interface with google calendar p 21:27 jcamins Hehe. 21:27 libsysguy I mean…i could…there is a module for that 21:27 libsysguy but you need a google account 21:27 drojf no google in my koha 21:27 jcamins Actually, you might want to look at the data structure used by programs that interface with ICS. 21:28 libsysguy if I could just use the data structure that Date::Manip uses I think i'd be good 21:28 libsysguy but rangi might stroke 21:28 jcamins Why? 21:28 wizzyrea stroke what 21:28 libsysguy have you ever used date manip 21:28 jcamins wizzyrea: have one, I think. ;) 21:28 cait good night all :) 21:28 libsysguy looks at wizzyrea with "the look" 21:28 wizzyrea libsysguy? 21:28 wahanui libsysguy is Koha's hottest developer or partying with swedes on his deck 21:28 * wizzyrea nods 21:29 libsysguy hehe 21:29 wizzyrea :) 21:29 wizzyrea i love you guys. 21:29 libsysguy we love you back wizzyrea 21:31 jcamins Any French speakers around? 21:32 jcamins I believe the proper definite article for the French word The is "le" but it'd be nice to have confirmation without needing to get my French dictionary from the other room. 21:33 drojf le is male, la is female 21:33 drojf les is plural 21:33 drojf oh 21:33 drojf reading skills 21:33 drojf i lack them 21:33 drojf nevermind 21:33 rangi Date::Manip is big slow, and slow, also did i say slow, the author themself says dont use it 21:34 jcamins Sorry, I should have said that irssi is currently refusing Unicode input. 21:34 libsysguy haha yeah he is like…dude its slow 21:34 drojf jcamins: but it's le thé 21:34 libsysguy awesome…but slow 21:34 jcamins Woohoo! 21:34 jcamins Thanks. 21:35 trea hi koha - question about the AllowHoldDateInFuture syspref - at that point to future hold requests enter into the holds queue? 21:36 trea that should read "at what point in the future do hold requests" 21:37 rangi as soon as the futuredate is less than now 21:37 trea got it thx 21:37 trea rangi++ 22:01 rangi http://fullfathomcollections.blogspot.co.nz/2012/06/keys-catalog-how-to-libx-plugin.html <-- quite cool 22:01 jcamins [off] Guess I ought to respond to Paul. 22:06 rangi i guess i ought to get coffee 22:06 rangi :) 22:06 rangi brb 22:06 * jcamins goes to get his veggies. 22:11 rangi jcamins++ # good reply 22:11 rangi lucky wahanui tracks karma too 22:11 rangi karma for jcamins 22:11 wahanui jcamins has karma of 327 23:00 jcamins_away karma for rangi 23:00 wahanui rangi has karma of 381 23:00 jcamins_away Hehe... much better chance of catchin up to people. 23:00 jcamins_away karma for huginn 23:00 wahanui huginn has karma of 4 23:00 jcamins_away karma for wahanui 23:00 wahanui wahanui has karma of 12 23:32 dcook Morning #koha 23:32 rangi morning dcook 23:33 dcook By chance, rangi, do you recall what that script is to handle the de-952ing of records from 3.2? 23:34 jcamins misc/remove_items_from_biblioitems.pl 23:34 rangi thats it 23:34 rangi unless you are using package 23:34 rangi s 23:34 dcook Excellent. Merci, beaucoup 23:34 dcook Nope. No packages 23:36 dcook Whoa, comma splice... 23:36 * dcook shudders