Time Nick Message 12:09 eiro i want to create an INSTALL.macports directory in the koha root with all required files. any objection ? 12:10 gmcharlt eiro: none from me 12:11 eiro so i do 12:11 gmcharlt eiro++ 12:12 eiro :) 13:26 slef I don't like the INSTALL.freds-pet-OS proliferation 13:26 slef INSTALL should cover the basic principles with some "install as much as possible from packages and here's some ways to find them" section 13:27 slef but maybe I'm a lone voice 13:59 elwell IMHO it should be INSTALL.os and within that differences between versions (case in point - deb4/5 should be same file with notes about whats provided as std by vendor) 15:08 eiro slef, i agreed ... i just do as the others 15:09 eiro i don't try to change the abits of koha people 15:09 eiro just using it 15:09 gmcharlt one thing to keep in mind is a lot of newbie sysadmins try to install Koha 15:09 gmcharlt until a one-stop package is available for a particular platform 15:09 gmcharlt the INSTALL.foo have value IMO 15:11 eiro gmcharlt, i think it would never be like this with macports because you have to install mysql and apache as seraparated process 15:12 eiro the best we can do is use Module::Build to make a cpan Koha::Bundle and create a p5-koha-bundle port 15:13 gmcharlt eiro: there is a Bundle::Koha, but it hasn't been updated for nearly a year 15:14 gmcharlt Bundle::KohaSupport, rather 15:15 eiro gmcharlt, it's easier for me to create a new one than to hijack the old 15:16 eiro gmcharlt, the old one is using MakeMaker, afaik 15:16 gmcharlt eiro: go for it, then, though Mike probably should get a courtesy email 15:16 eiro this is the old way to build modules and i'm not confortable with it 15:24 slef gmcharlt: variously, they'll look at INSTALL if there's no INSTALL.my-pet-os and newbie sysadmins maybe should be a little scared 15:25 slef eiro: is Module::Build better than MakeMaker in this situation? Didn't look like it gave much benefit when I looked a few years ago. 15:25 slef except M::B reduced portability very slightly IIRC 16:41 joetho I'm talkin but I ain't hearin. 16:42 joetho <---whoops, wrong channel. Excuse my dumbness. 16:44 slef huh? 19:46 pianohacker gmcharlt: What's the story behind chris's signoffs on your add warnings patches? One-time request for review? 19:49 gmcharlt pianohacker: yes 19:49 pianohacker ok 20:07 chris eiro you should talk to mike, who did koha::bundlesupport, and discuss your plans 20:07 chris i hate dupiclated work 20:07 chris sorry bundle::kohasupport 20:07 chris he updated it with the 3.0.0 release, im sure he would be happy to work with you 20:13 gmcharlt elwell: how would you know if the backup system silently stops working? 20:14 elwell gmcharlt: same as now - I only check the status once in a blue moon and then have to wade through mails. I cast an eye over the bacula client on wifes windows machine once in a while when I'm using it (handy systray icon) but the debian box that is the headless server rareley gets logged into 20:15 elwell (this is at home, not a production site) 20:15 gmcharlt could be just as important if you lose your wife's photos ;) 20:16 elwell meh, all the good ones are on flickr and my laptop :-) 20:17 elwell 'lost - one sipura voip adapter' I can see the LEDs blinking but can't remmber its IP. nmap time... 20:17 pianohacker elwell: http://bash.org/?5273 20:18 elwell that the ping but can 20:18 elwell t find it one? 20:29 pianohacker yup 20:29 elwell Product Information 20:29 elwell Product Name: SPA-3102 20:30 elwell :-) success 20:37 chris kahu just picked up the phone and 'called' his daycare and said "kahu not coming today, staying to watch dinosaurus rex with daddy" 20:38 wizzyrea chris: omg... too funny 20:38 chris 1/ he is going, and 2/ even if he wasnt, i have no idea where to find a tyrannosaurus rex in wellington anywyay 20:38 pianohacker dinosaurus rex! 20:40 wizzyrea well there's always the library, right? 20:40 wizzyrea probably plenty of tyrannosaurs there... 20:40 chris yeah, but they use TLC and i cant make their catalogue work 20:40 chris :) 20:40 wizzyrea HA 20:40 wizzyrea touché 20:41 wizzyrea LOL 20:41 gmcharlt chris++ 20:41 wizzyrea devious, I like it 20:41 wizzyrea chris++ 20:41 pianohacker Just sic the billing manager on 'im, he'll get his fill of tyrannosaurs 20:41 chris hehe 20:42 wizzyrea that's tyrants... oh never mind 20:42 wizzyrea this is my favorite time of day in #koha 20:43 chris end of the day for you? 20:46 elwell chris: age of koha? 20:46 wizzyrea yea, end of day for n. americans, beginning of the day for NZ, everyone has the promise of the rest of the day ahead of them 20:46 chris koha or kahu? 20:47 chris wizzyrea: heh yep, and i dont have to go to work either :) 20:47 elwell kahu sorry, I'm waiting for the 'my daddy is <something embarrasing>' when asked to say about home life. :-) 20:47 wizzyrea a little sad that the french folks are mostly asleep 20:47 chris elwell: 2 years and 7 months 20:48 wizzyrea chris: nice! 20:48 chris he is really dawdling on eating his toast 20:48 elwell ... we then moved :-) 20:48 chris delaying tactics 20:48 chris heheh thats mean 20:50 elwell chris: enjoy it while you can -- the days of being able to bribe them to do X with some smarties have long evolved into more expensive things. curses at apple for creating the ipod. 20:51 chris i can still bribe him with stories 20:51 chris long may it last 20:51 chris :) 20:51 elwell aye 21:04 chris gmcharlt: did you see we passed 10,000 ? 21:05 pianohacker $ git log --oneline | wc -l 21:05 pianohacker 10004 <- Yay! 21:06 chris :) 21:06 chris and thats just in master, so thats pretty neat 21:07 chris ill add that to the history doc, and ill leave it for gmcharlt to blog about :) 21:25 gmcharlt celebrating_arbitrary_numbers++ ;) 21:25 gmcharlt s/arbitrary/symbolic/ 21:27 wizzyrea I think I"ll get excited when we hit 12345 patches 21:27 wizzyrea 12:34 is my favorite time of day 21:27 wizzyrea 11:23 is a close second 21:27 pianohacker gmcharlt: Would it be possible to take the old newlogbot logs, grep for '++|--', and feed them into munin, for total karma? 21:28 pianohacker Hehe, 12:34 is fun (12:34, too, if you're a night owl) 21:28 pianohacker *12:34 AM 21:28 gmcharlt wizzyrea: better get cracking then 21:28 wizzyrea man, I bet you do 1k patches a month... I'm not sure if/when you sleep 21:28 gmcharlt pianohacker: let's make a deal - I'll give you a text file of all log entries with ++ or --, and you give me a python script to feed it into munin's database 21:29 pianohacker Hmm. Sounds like a plan :) 21:29 wizzyrea ooh, it's a geek challenge! 21:29 gmcharlt a clever disguise for my plan to make pianohacker do most of the work 21:30 pianohacker Bah, I need a distraction from my Japanese kanji flashcards anyway 21:33 wizzyrea not such a clever disguise now that you've admitted it! 21:34 gmcharlt doh! 21:37 pianohacker Hello, owen 21:38 owen Hi pianohacker 21:38 pianohacker How're the kids treating you? 21:41 owen Sorry, I'd have answered sooner but they all started yelling at once ;) 21:41 pianohacker That's actually a fairly good answer :P 21:43 owen Hopping onto #koha when I'm at home usually is their cue to become needy 21:43 pianohacker Young children do have, if nothing else, a sense of timing 21:45 gmcharlt pianohacker: I just emailed you the data file for karma 21:46 pianohacker Ok, thanks 21:53 pianohacker There are not _nearly_ enough IE--'s in here 21:53 gmcharlt no stuffing the ballot box! 21:54 pianohacker Bah, I'll just have diebold write the script for me 21:54 gmcharlt considering Diebold used MS Access in their voting machines, I'd watch out for lots of IE++ 21:55 pianohacker heh 22:22 gmcharlt pianohacker: are you anywhere near the Rangeview Library District? http://www.rangeviewld.org/rangeview-library-district-%E2%80%9Cbreaking-dewey%E2%80%9D 22:23 pianohacker Hmm, about two hours away 22:23 pianohacker I need to organize a road trip with some colleagues from my library 22:23 pianohacker thanks 22:30 chris 3back 22:30 chris -3 22:44 chris and now away again 22:54 pianohacker Okay, data sent back 22:56 pianohacker Bah, gmcharlt: 23:01 pianohacker gmcharlt: Logging off for day, let me know if the import succeeds 23:01 pianohacker Bye, all 23:02 chris that dudes a legend 23:02 chris pianohacker++ 23:06 gmcharlt @karma 23:06 munin gmcharlt: Highest karma: "paul_p" (50), "hdl_laptop" (39), and "chris" (28). Lowest karma: "savannah" (-3), "encoding" (-3), and "ie" (-2). You (gmcharlt) are ranked 6 out of 221. 23:07 gmcharlt pianohacker++ 23:07 gmcharlt @later tell pianohacker karma imported successfully 23:07 munin gmcharlt: The operation succeeded. 23:08 gmcharlt @karma koha 23:08 munin gmcharlt: Karma for "koha" has been increased 4 times and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 4. 23:08 gmcharlt @karma git 23:08 munin gmcharlt: Karma for "git" has been increased 3 times and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 3. 23:34 ryan uh, git++ ? 23:34 chris heh 23:35 chris @karma git 23:35 munin chris: Karma for "git" has been increased 3 times and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 3. 23:35 chris @karma uh, git 23:35 munin chris: git: 3. uh, has neutral karma. 23:35 chris @karma uh, git? 23:35 munin chris: I didn't know the karma for any of those things. 23:35 chris i wonder where that karma went :) 23:35 chris git++ 23:36 gmcharlt @karma git 23:36 munin gmcharlt: Karma for "git" has been increased 4 times and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 4. 23:36 chris i think the uh, must have confused it? 23:36 chris or maybe the ? 23:36 ryan i guess it doesn't count such noncommittal kudos :) 23:37 chris hehe 23:37 gmcharlt or is it the spaces git++ 23:37 ryan git++ !!! 23:37 gmcharlt @karma git 23:37 munin gmcharlt: Karma for "git" has been increased 4 times and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 4. 23:37 ryan dang 23:37 gmcharlt git++ ? 23:37 gmcharlt @karma git 23:37 munin gmcharlt: Karma for "git" has been increased 4 times and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 4. 23:37 chris yeah seems nothing can trail the ++ 23:37 gmcharlt we'll see about that 23:41 gmcharlt @reload Karma 23:41 munin gmcharlt: The operation succeeded. 23:41 gmcharlt git++ # smarter, now? 23:41 gmcharlt @karma git 23:41 munin gmcharlt: Karma for "git" has been increased 4 times and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 4. 23:42 gmcharlt git++ # smarter, now? 23:42 gmcharlt @karma git 23:42 munin gmcharlt: Karma for "git" has been increased 4 times and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 4. 23:43 gmcharlt @reload Karma 23:43 munin gmcharlt: The operation succeeded. 23:43 gmcharlt git++ # smarter, now? 23:43 chris he's mocking you 23:43 gmcharlt @karma git 23:43 munin gmcharlt: Karma for "git" has been increased 4 times and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 4. 23:44 gmcharlt space git++ 23:44 gmcharlt @karma git 23:44 munin gmcharlt: Karma for "git" has been increased 4 times and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 4. 23:44 gmcharlt @karma space git 23:44 munin gmcharlt: git: 4. space has neutral karma. 23:46 gmcharlt git++ # work, damn you! 23:46 gmcharlt @karma git 23:46 munin gmcharlt: Karma for "git" has been increased 4 times and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 4. 23:46 gmcharlt git++ 23:46 gmcharlt @karma 23:46 munin gmcharlt: Highest karma: "paul_p" (50), "hdl_laptop" (39), and "chris" (28). Lowest karma: "savannah" (-3), "encoding" (-3), and "ie" (-2). You (gmcharlt) are ranked 6 out of 224. 23:46 gmcharlt @karma git 23:47 munin gmcharlt: Karma for "git" has been increased 5 times and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 5. 23:47 gmcharlt fine, be that way for now 23:51 chris hehe 23:53 gmcharlt git++ # work, damn you! 23:53 gmcharlt @karma git 23:53 munin gmcharlt: Karma for "git" has been increased 6 times and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 6. 23:53 gmcharlt success! 23:56 chris hehe 23:56 chris gmcharlt++ 01:14 LBA Hi Chris, thought you should know I made it in. Thanks! 01:15 chris excellent :) 01:15 bignose-work howdy all 01:16 bignose-work I'm hoping to figure out why LDAP authentication isn't working, as per my message to the mailing list yesterday 01:16 chris ahh you have missed gmcharlt and atz, who know the most about it 01:16 bignose-work missed them? they're gone for the day? sheesh, bloomin' early knock-off kiwis :-) 01:17 chris they are americans 01:17 bignose-work ah. well then I wonder why they didn't respond to my message yesterday? 01:17 chris i only just saw it on the mailing list this morning 01:17 chris it may have got held up 01:18 bignose-work right. I made sure to send it last night so that a USA business day would elapse with that message in their face :-) 01:19 chris yep, they are pretty busy people, and have a bunch of clients they have to look after, so i suspect they just got busy 01:19 bignose-work understood. 01:19 bignose-work what can I do to troubleshoot further? 01:19 chris no idea, LDAP isnt used by any of the people i do Koha work for im afraid 01:20 bignose-work is it possible to see more detail of what Koha is doing when I try to authenticate? 01:20 chris you could put some warns in the code 01:20 bignose-work is there a logging level parameter I can tweak? 01:21 chris some scripts have a $DEBUG switch you can set to on, not sure about the LDAP module 01:22 bignose-work hmm. no configuration-file parameter for logging level? 01:22 chris there is one in system preferences 01:30 bignose-work hold on, what exactly does the “Unauthorized user� message mean? 01:30 bignose-work it is displayed from the ‘auth.tmpl’ template if ‘nopermission’ is set 01:31 bignose-work but that doesn't mean the *authentication* failed, does it? 01:31 bignose-work Could it be that I've actually succeeded in logging in, but the account has no authorization? 01:31 chris could well be 01:31 chris what permissions does the user have? 01:32 bignose-work I've no idea. 01:32 bignose-work I'm not a Koha user, I'm setting it up for a client, so I'm very new at how it works. 01:32 bignose-work how can I tell whether a user is known to Koha and what permissions they have? 01:32 chris if you go to the librarian interface, and search for that user, then you can check the permissions 01:33 bignose-work the librarian interface, is that what I get when I log in as the administrator of the Koha database? 01:33 bignose-work or do I need to visit a different page for that? 01:33 chris as long as your arent going to the opac thats right 01:33 bignose-work okay, I searched for the user by name and got no results. 01:35 bignose-work but if I succssfully authenticate, and the config has ‘<replicate>1</replicate>’ in the ‘<ldapserver>’ section, that should mean the user is replicated when they first log in. right? 01:36 chris i think so, as i said, i have never used the LDAP part of koha 01:39 bignose-work okay. which database table should I be querying to know whether the user is in it? 01:39 bignose-work the ‘user_permissions’ table has no records. 01:40 chris borrowers 01:40 bignose-work also empty. 01:40 chris doesnt look like it made the user then 01:41 bignose-work thanks. can you think of any further diagnosis I can do, before sending another message for our friends across the pond? 01:41 chris not apart from putting some warns in the code and seeing where its getting stuck 01:42 bignose-work I'd like to leave the code untouched since I'm not prepared to root around fixing it if I mess it up :-) 01:42 bignose-work thanks for your help 01:42 chris fair enough, good luck :) 02:51 chris hmm can anyone get to http://koha.org ? 02:52 Jo hi Chris. 02:52 Jo hows the family? 02:53 chris pretty good, kahu is at daycare and atarau is chilling on the couch with me 02:53 Jo lovely :) 03:50 chris wow koha.org is totally dead 06:00 thd chris: at least we know that the problem is not that NZ lost internet access as in times in the past :) 06:09 kf good morning #koha 06:09 thd good morning kf 06:31 eiro chris, i read your lines: i will (if i work on it) 06:50 chris thd: nope, im getting proxy error? looks like the plone instance is down 06:50 chris eiro: excellent :-) 06:51 thd chris: yes scripts to ensure your Zope instance keeps running are important 06:59 paul_p hi chris & thd & anyone else 06:59 chris hi there paul_p 06:59 thd hello paul_p 07:00 eiro hi paul_p 07:07 chris hi Kivutar 07:07 Kivutar hello all :) 07:07 chris i noticed with your patches, that you might need to run git-config 07:08 chris to set your email address 07:08 Kivutar it's strange, I ran it to set my name and email, but it doesn't seem to work 07:08 chris ahh did you do the --global option? 07:09 Kivutar and I checked my .gitconfig too 07:09 chris weird 07:09 Kivutar yeah I did 07:09 Kivutar this is my .gitconfig : 07:09 Kivutar [user] 07:09 Kivutar name = Jean-André Santoni 07:09 Kivutar email = jeanandre.santoni@biblibre.com 07:10 chris odd, not sure what happened ... unless they are old commits? 07:10 Kivutar no they aren't 07:10 Kivutar ahhh maybe! 07:11 Kivutar yeah, you're right, I commited before setting these options 07:13 Kivutar thanks 07:17 nahuel gmcharlt, hi 07:17 nahuel gmcharlt, my patch about diacritics in categorycodes, it's because diacritics are allowed in the code 07:17 nahuel gmcharlt, It's logical diacritics should not be allowed in "codes", but well, some installation already have diacritics. 07:20 chris i think he might still be asleep 07:23 chris right, getting kahu ready for bed, bbiab 07:23 nicomo_laptop hi all 07:23 nahuel chris, hmmm 07:23 nahuel chris, hi ! 07:23 nahuel :) 07:23 nahuel munin, tell gmcharlt my patch about diacritics in categorycodes, it's because diacritics are allowed in the code 07:23 nahuel munin, tell gmcharlt It's logical diacritics should not be allowed in "codes", but well, some installation already have diacritics. 07:24 nahuel hehe 07:31 chris you can do this nahuel 07:34 chris @later tell gmcharlt something :) 07:34 munin chris: The operation succeeded. 07:34 chris but it works on login i think 07:34 chris @help later 07:34 munin chris: Error: There is no command "later". 07:34 nahuel ok 07:35 nahuel well i'll retell him when he'll be alive 07:35 chris so it only works for people who have logged out :) 07:35 chris paul_p: did you see this? 07:35 chris @karma 07:35 munin chris: Highest karma: "paul_p" (50), "hdl_laptop" (39), and "chris" (28). Lowest karma: "savannah" (-3), "encoding" (-3), and "ie" (-2). You (chris) are ranked 3 out of 224. 07:36 chris you can do 50 bad things now :-) 07:36 paul_p hehe... I'm quite surprised, as I am quite silent here ;-) 07:42 chris @later tell nicomo_laptop stick around a bit longer this time :) 07:42 munin chris: The operation succeeded. 07:42 kf hi there, I have a question about Koha and nonfiling characters and sorting - I found that sortbynonfiling (Sort search results by MARC nonfiling characters) is deprecated - so Koha cant sort according to nonfiling characters? 07:43 kf speaking of MARC21 07:43 chris ahh, i dont know im afraid 07:44 kf my tests say Koha cant - but dont wanted to say something like that without asking 07:45 kf http://lists.koha.org/pipermail/koha-devel/2006-February/005805.html < Koha was able to do it 07:46 chris interesting, i think you might need to ask gmcharlt 07:46 kf cant find out, why its deprecated in bugzilla @bug 1960 :( 07:46 munin 04Bug http://bugs.koha.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=1960 normal, PATCH-Sent, ---, paul.poulain@biblibre.com, ASSIGNED, sortbynonfiling deprecated 07:49 kf ok, thx chris 07:54 chris hmm maybe paul_p knows 07:57 kf I think its handled differently in UNIMARC, with nonfiling characters, marc21 uses second indicator 07:58 chris @wunder lyno 07:58 munin chris: I suck 07:58 chris @wunder lyon 07:58 munin chris: downloading the Perl source 07:58 chris @wunder lyon, france 07:58 munin chris: downloading the Perl source 07:58 chris gah 07:58 hdl_laptop Kf it depends on the ILS. 07:58 paul_p kf: yep, it's handled differentsly in UNIMARC 07:59 hdl_laptop kf: with MARC21 indicator, it could be managed with dom-config for MARC21.xml 08:00 kf for sorting or for search? 08:01 hdl_laptop for sorting, at leaset, and if you want for search 08:01 kf dont know what can be done with MARC21.xml and to make it more complicate we are using Zebra with ICU 08:01 kf ok, will have to ask my colleague to look into this 08:02 hdl_laptop we have done some testing on dom config and icu, and it worked out quite well, But I couldnot send the configuration and integrate it well into the project. 08:04 kf will ICU be part of Koha soon? We are using a file, I found on the mailing list 08:04 kf and you cant use fuzzy search with ICU 08:05 chris what are the benefits of ICU kf? 08:06 kf you cant search for hebrew without it 08:07 kf as far as I understand, without you can only index up to 256 characters 08:07 kf when searching for hebrew before using icu, you always got all hebrew titles back 08:08 kf in results 08:11 chris ahh 08:11 chris in that case its probably needed for lots of other languages 08:25 kf and ICU has some awesome features for transliteration 08:25 chris is there an RFC for it on the wiki? 08:28 kf no 08:29 chris i think we should write one up, would you be able to start one? 08:29 chris feel free to say no, if you dont have time 08:30 kf I cant do it, perhaps we can share the file we use 08:30 kf but all we did so far came from snippets on the mailing list 08:30 kf Im searching for one particular mail to show you atm 08:31 kf http://spedr.com/5j29b 08:32 chris i will try to talk to galen about it 08:33 kf Marc Nürnberger is German - found out last week 08:33 chris i see that other people have been trying to do it, (someone from thailand) 08:33 kf they have Chinese, Japanese and Korean titles 08:34 chris so definitely it is wanted 08:34 chris ohh cool 08:34 kf perhaps we can put something together 08:34 chris that would be awesome 08:35 kf dont know if hes here *looking around* but writing an email is on my list 08:35 chris :) 08:46 chris kf++ 08:49 hdl_laptop chris: we already have one which is getting better and better for french 08:50 chris ohh, cool, so maybe we need a place like the sql page, where we can put all the files for people to use? or maybe a directory in git we can store them? 08:50 kf hi hdl, sorry, I did not remember you working on ICU :( 08:53 hdl_laptop chris: directory in git rather. 08:54 hdl_laptop hehe Kf I think it is I who sent first icu.xml ;) 08:54 chris yep that would be good, easier to track 08:54 kf uh 08:54 hdl_laptop or rather nahuel 08:54 kf I did not remember and when searching for the mail, I thought it was Galen - im sorry, again 08:55 hdl_laptop no problem 08:55 kf hdl++ (for the file :) ) 09:09 chris paul_p: are you going to watch the game this weekend? 09:14 chris hmm what is SIGB? 09:16 hdl_laptop ILS 09:20 chris ahh ta 09:50 paul_p chris : SIGB is ILS in french : Système Intégré de Gestion de Bibliothèques 09:50 chris right nicomo's tweet makes sense now 09:50 paul_p Système = système. Intégré = integrated, bibliothèque = libary 09:50 paul_p Gestion = management 11:46 Gaurav Hi chris 11:46 Gaurav I am from osslabs.biz 11:46 gmcharlt hi Gaurav 11:47 Gaurav hi gmcharlt 11:47 gmcharlt clay is looking at the koha.org issue 11:53 Gaurav chris: koha staff hindi translation has been completed 100% 11:53 Gaurav see this : http://translate.koha.org/hi/ 11:54 gmcharlt yay 11:54 Gaurav see also : http://kohav3demo.osslabs.biz:8080/ 11:55 Gaurav kohaadmin/kohapassword 11:55 Gaurav click on Hindi 11:56 elwell Q - koha.org/showcase -- there's none in Europe showing. Shurely shome mishtake mr bond. 11:59 Gaurav gmcharlt : hey Galen..have u seen that hindi translation? 11:59 |Lupin| hello everybody