Time  Nick       Message
12:41 kados      paul: you around?
12:42 paul       yes.
12:42 paul       hello kados.
12:42 kados      hi :-)
12:42 toins      hi kados
12:42 kados      I continue to get requests about the z39.50 client
12:42 kados      (one on koha-lobby just now)
12:42 kados      chris mentioned installer probs? do you know about those?
12:42 Anarka     yes please :)'
12:43 kados      hehe, hi Anarka :-)
12:43 paul       hdl founded a new bug, on authorities when char encoding=utf8 & marcflavour=Unimarc.
12:43 paul       it's fixed, if I don't mind.
12:43 kados      cool
12:44 paul       I don't remember seing anything about installer (except package dep missing, and already updated on cvs)
12:44 kados      maybe thats all chris meant
12:44 kados      ok ... great!
12:44 paul       this morning I was at SANOP showing Koha to the 100 users !
12:45 paul       they were very enthusiastic...
12:45 kados      great!
12:45 kados      paul: do you have special templates? or do you use prog?
12:45 paul       prog + css
12:45 kados      cool
12:45 kados      rch and I have been playing ith rel_3_0 (mostly rch)
12:45 paul       prog templates are very "useables"
12:46 rch        hi paul
12:46 kados      do you have an example with nice css?
12:46 Lea        hi all
12:46 paul       rch : Ryan ?? Higgins
12:46 kados      paul: yes :-)
12:46 rch        yes
12:46 toins      hi rch
12:46 paul       C = ??
12:46 rch        middle name - Corrado
12:46 paul       http://i18.bureau.paulpoulain.com/cgi-bin/koha/mainpage.pl login test/test
12:47 paul       with french 1st translation.
12:47 kados      cool
12:47 kados      opac?
12:47 dewey      hmmm... opac is 2.2.5
12:47 paul       you can see there is a problem with shortcuts.
12:47 paul       o18...
12:47 kados      where is the problem?>
12:47 paul       i've 20 vhost : iXX and oXX, i for librarians & o for opac
12:47 kados      ok
12:47 paul       look at iss*u*es.
12:47 paul       it's prĂȘt*u*es
12:48 paul       but in french, it should just be prĂȘts !
12:48 rch        toins: hi!
12:48 kados      ahh
12:48 paul       SRecherche is wrong too, should be Recherche.
12:48 kados      rch: http://o18.bureau.paulpoulain.com/cgi-bin/koha/opac-main.pl
12:48 paul       I think i'll have to work on tmpl_process to find shortcuts & deal with them correctly
12:48 kados      paul: so it's a problem with the translation script?
12:48 paul       (without the CSS)
12:48 kados      paul: or maybe just the font?
12:49 paul       yes & no...
12:49 kados      (I have seen cases where the font corrupted the character)
12:49 kados      (changing the font fixed it)
12:50 Lea        does anyone know how bulkmarcimport recognises multiple copies of the same biblio? It should be by ISBN no?
12:50 kados      Lea: it doesn't ...
12:50 Lea        oh no...
12:50 kados      Lea: that function is built into the cataloging interface, but not bulkmarcimport
12:50 rch        paul: I am having some issues with customizablility in prog opac tmpl...
12:50 kados      Lea: you could take a look at the find duplicate stuff in Biblio.pm
12:50 Lea        is it easy to normalise the data afterwards?
12:51 kados      Lea: probably easier to do it pre-migration
12:51 rch        paul: I'd like to add many more divs, and pull some elements outside of others
12:51 Lea        kados: what do you suggest? Working out the number of copies and adding some sort of marc tag?
12:51 kados      Lea: chris from katipo has done some of that in the past ... might be worth pinging him when he's on in a few hours
12:51 paul       rch : a sample of what you would like to do ?
12:52 rch        paul: e.g. the auth form is inside a search div,
12:52 Lea        ok, thanks
12:52 rch        paul: the opac nav is  a list element inside the hardcoded nav
12:52 rch        which are both inside the masthead.
12:53 Lea        kados: I rewrote my mapper class yesterday and reduced my "cleaned" MARC data by 30%"
12:53 rch        paul: generally, I'd like to add a named dif around every functional element so it can be more easily css'ed
12:54 rch        (div, even)
12:54 paul       rch : a named div around every functionnal element => im' 100% OK for this, as it's what was planned.
12:54 paul       "we" make a heavy use of <fieldset> instead of <div> but i'm not sure it's a good thing.
12:55 rch        yes, I think css is cleaner with divs.
12:56 paul       fieldsets are useful, but i think they should not replace <div> & sometimes are useless
12:57 rch        paul: I have some other questions about where you are with rel_3_0
12:58 rch        We have a client who wishes itemtypes at items level.
12:58 rch        i.e. not just special issuing rule per item
12:58 paul       hehe... kados spoke of this previously...
12:59 paul       is it "wishes" or "want" ?
12:59 rch        ummm..  needs, I guess :)
12:59 kados      paul: it's a requirement, unfortunately
13:00 kados      paul: I also discovered that NPL used to have this functiaonlity too
13:00 kados      paul: but they lost i when upgrading to Koha
13:00 rch        So simplest would be to add items.itype, and allow that field to override biblioitems.itemtype if exists ?
13:00 paul       we have 2 ways to do such thing :
13:01 paul       - move itemtype to items level, for everybody. Probably easier to code, but harder to migrate existing libraries & too bad for libraries happy with itemtype at bilbio level
13:01 paul       - add a items.itemtype field, with default value being biblioitems.itemtype, and activated (& modified) by the library where needed. harder to code, but better for other libraries.
13:02 paul       what's the timeline for you ?
13:02 rch        tomorrow :)
13:02 paul       i was afraid it could be yesterday...
13:02 paul       lol
13:02 kados      it was, but we moved it to tomorrow ;-)
13:03 rch        :)
13:03 paul       without kidding, do you need this really ASAP, or can it wait for, say, februrary ?
13:03 paul       (/me thikn he know the answer)
13:03 kados      definitely not feb
13:03 kados      maybe a week or so at the most
13:03 paul       wow...
13:04 paul       I prefer a week to a month, i'll explain why :
13:04 kados      esp if we use the second way
13:04 paul       SANOP will start on jan, 3rd with rel_3_0, so such a DB modif has to be checked a lot.
13:04 kados      (we can just add some small code rather than re-write existing stuff)
13:05 kados      paul: it's only one column added to the items table ... it's harmless
13:05 paul       and if you code it for next week, we will have enough time to debug it.
13:05 paul       kados, let me give you an example :
13:05 paul       the SANOP server went fine until yesterday 4PM.
13:05 paul       btoumi wanted to do something harmless on the system for koha : installing webmin.
13:05 paul       he updated, and ...
13:06 kados      hehe
13:06 paul       ... apache could not restart anymore for some dependancy problem.
13:06 kados      right
13:06 paul       12 hours before a major demo.
13:06 kados      (one of our clients did something similar a few monts back :-))
13:06 paul       so, ok for such modifs in a week (= 6 weeks to check it for SANOP)
13:06 kados      paul: we have already made the modif
13:06 paul       but definetly nok for such modifs in december, 10th !!!
13:06 kados      paul: to the table
13:07 rch        paul: 10 dec?
13:07 kados      paul: (right ... I understand)
13:07 kados      SAN goes live in Jan right?
13:07 paul       yep.
13:07 paul       jan 3rd
13:08 kados      paul: so we want to add this new table def to CVS ... what's the best approach?
13:08 kados      add to koha.sql? updatedatabase?
13:08 paul       new table ? or new column ?
13:08 paul       updatedatabase, definetly
13:08 kados      just a new column
13:08 rch        just column in items.
13:09 paul       koha.sql being created from a dump of a working 3.0 install (when it will be stabilised)
13:09 kados      ok
13:10 kados      paul: we'll commit this immediately
13:11 paul       cool... i'll investigate what it means & point the commit to sanop
13:20 rch        paul: updatedabase: just add to %fielddefinitions ?
13:20 paul       yep, iirc
13:36 rch        paul: is marc_biblio still used for anything?
13:36 paul       nope
13:37 rch        shall we remove from tabledefitinit?
13:37 rch        table definition, even
13:38 Anarka     i'm not happy with the install of koha... the IT guy loves windows but doesn't want to install using the package, and doesnt want to use apache, so basically it's just copy paste of files after an error in hope it will work
13:38 Anarka     i just want to scream :P
13:38 paul       rch : yep.
13:39 paul       & marc_subfield_table & marc_word as well.
13:39 paul       and auth_subfield_table & auth_word too...
13:39 paul       Arnaka : good luck.
13:40 paul       Anarka: good luck
13:40 Anarka     it would be better if it failed miserably but... it is starting to work
13:40 kados      paul: what's the best way to remove those fields ?
13:41 kados      paul: from updatedatabase?
13:41 kados      paul: (they might be needed for migration, eh?)
13:41 paul       yes. that's why I did not add them to updatedatabase. I don't know what's the best way to do this. it's probably manually for 2.2 libraries
13:42 paul       and remove the tables from koha.sql & updatedatabase for new libraries.
13:42 kados      hehe
13:42 kados      fun :-)
13:43 paul       they are in french, so I won't transmit it to you...
13:43 kados      paul: good news for rel_3_0 ... rch and I have decided to start working on it
13:43 paul       great !!!
13:43 toins      kados, great !
13:43 paul       really
13:43 kados      paul: all future zebra clients will be in rel_3_0
13:43 kados      so dev_week is now deprecated :-)
13:44 paul       don't you have any clients to setup in the next days/weeks ?
13:44 kados      of course ... :-)
13:44 kados      so it will be a busy few weeks :-)
13:44 kados      (but they don't go live until Jan )
13:44 paul       kados = supercoder & rch = spidercoder ...
13:44 kados      ( so some bugs are OK )
13:45 paul       ok, I prefer this (for you)
13:45 kados      but we feel it's better to have all of us on the same codebase
13:45 paul       were you interested by a translated list of all improvements toins is working on?
13:45 paul       s/were/are/
13:46 kados      sure, if it's not too much trouble to translate
13:46 paul       37 lines
13:46 kados      (maybe just run it through google translate ... probably close enough to understand)
13:46 kados      btw: rch has committed updatedatabase change
13:46 toins      i'm happy that synching is now finished...
13:46 kados      toins: :-)
13:47 paul       toins will translate in english the list & send it to you.
13:47 toins      roger....
13:47 kados      woot
13:48 paul       just to explain : there is a "priority" list : Haut=High Moyen=Medium Bas=Low
13:48 paul       same for "difficulty" column.
13:48 paul       the "status" contains "Fait"=done when it's done.
13:48 kados      k
13:48 paul       a column also contains who do what (HDL/PP/AF)
13:48 kados      can we add them to bugzilla?
13:48 paul       he will let the french column description & add an english one.
13:49 kados      maybe easier to track that way?
13:49 paul       would be interesting to add them 1 by 1, but would be quite long to enter.
13:49 kados      paul: don't you have a small child for such things? ;-)
13:49 paul       nope
13:50 paul       (my wife being crying highly at one of my child atm...)
13:50 kados      hehe
13:50 paul       (I think its because the 2nd one stayed at one of his friends/neighbour without permission)
13:57 rch        hey can anyone briefly explain the notifys table and "FU" ?
13:59 kados      hdl: maybe?
13:59 dewey      maybe is listed as HEAD in my CVS Entry file.
13:59 kados      dewey: forget maybe
13:59 dewey      kados: I forgot maybe
14:00 toins      dewey, toins ?
14:00 dewey      you are trying to commit on gna.org with svn since this morning.
14:00 toins      hehe
14:05 kados      toins: do you know the answer to rch's question?
14:06 paul       kados : I bet it's a sanop addition.
14:06 paul       you should ask btoumi I think
14:06 kados      ok
14:06 toins      i don'tknow kados
14:06 paul       they have developped a feature to notify overdues, on a 3level basis.
14:07 paul       you can notify by e-mail, snailmail (with some OOo document), or forget the notify iirc
20:30 thd        kados: are you there?
23:07 iceninesyd hello
23:07 chris      hi
23:07 dewey      privet, chris
23:07 iceninesyd i am testing irc with irma
23:08 iceninesyd is that chris cormack ?!??!?!
23:08 chris      cool, looks like its all working
23:08 iceninesyd the famous cc ?
23:08 chris      heh yep
23:08 iceninesyd irma jus sent you an email
23:08 iceninesyd r u in NZ?
23:08 chris      cool, ill be waiting for it
23:08 chris      yep
23:08 iceninesyd i loike koha so far
23:08 iceninesyd although i know little of it!
23:08 iceninesyd we'll be installing on a madriva system
23:09 iceninesyd NE idea if that causes troubles?
23:09 chris      nope it should be fine
23:09 iceninesyd good
23:09 chris      paul poulain, uses mandriva
23:09 iceninesyd excellent!
23:09 chris      and he is the 2.2.x release manager
23:09 iceninesyd we'll try for 2.2.6
23:09 chris      cool
23:09 iceninesyd tell me, is 2.2.5 a beta? (a la linux numbering)
23:10 chris      the middle number is the one to watch
23:10 iceninesyd i.e. odds are beta evens are release
23:10 iceninesyd ah!
23:10 chris      2.2.whatever = release
23:10 chris      2.3.x unstable
23:10 iceninesyd good good
23:10 chris      etc
23:10 iceninesyd now to figure out how to get the wireless working on the mandriva laptop!
23:10 iceninesyd not that I epect you guys to answer that one :)
23:10 chris      :)
23:11 iceninesyd erd question
23:11 iceninesyd is there a digram of the E-R for koha?
23:11 chris      not a recent one
23:11 iceninesyd ah ah
23:11 chris      wiki.koha.org and www.kohadocs.org
23:11 chris      are the places to look
23:11 iceninesyd will have a squizz
23:11 iceninesyd 10Q
23:12 iceninesyd (my wierd abbrev for thankyou)
23:13 iceninesyd just got back from 3 months on the road (iceland, irelkand, germany) and irma snapped me up
23:13 iceninesyd nice to be into cyber space again
23:13 chris      :-)
23:13 iceninesyd 3 months in wetspace is a bit much
23:13 iceninesyd methinks there will be a long learning curve in actually understanding all the ins and outs of koha
23:14 iceninesyd well, the techie side will be easy but the librarian side is all new to me
23:14 iceninesyd cc: do you have a library background?
23:14 chris      nope
23:14 iceninesyd techy?
23:14 chris      i suggest you read the newbie guide on www.kohadocs.org
23:14 chris      yeah, compsci degree
23:15 iceninesyd will read the guide
23:15 chris      that gives a good intro to using koha
23:15 iceninesyd i don't think I'll have any trouble with the LAMP side of things
23:15 iceninesyd (i've been FOSSing for years)
23:15 chris      excellent
23:15 iceninesyd but once we get into data import then the fun begins
23:15 chris      yep
23:15 iceninesyd any plans to port this thing to java ?
23:15 iceninesyd hahahahahahahah!
23:16 iceninesyd serously ... perhaps other languages like python?
23:16 iceninesyd (java sux imho)
23:16 chris      nope
23:16 iceninesyd i havebn't loolked a the perl code yet
23:16 iceninesyd is it very O-O written? or a more procedural apporach?
23:16 chris      a bit of both
23:17 iceninesyd BTW: perl6 is on the horizon ... maybe some porting will be in the offing?
23:17 iceninesyd i am of course here to help irm with her current client
23:17 iceninesyd but also, if there are any technical areas of KOHA that need work (maybe some DB analysis for example)
23:17 iceninesyd i'd love to know
23:17 iceninesyd more than willing to pitch in and offer a hand, since I have the time and inclination these days
23:17 iceninesyd (I want to kickstart my brain again!)
23:17 chris      you might want to look into the upcoming 3.0 release
23:18 chris      and the work with zebra
23:18 iceninesyd zebra?
23:18 dewey      somebody said zebra was #1 for me
23:18 chris      yep
23:21 iceninesyd is release 3.0 occupying a lot of your time?
23:21 iceninesyd also: is 3.0 next? ... perhaps I should snoop around and read up on it :)
23:21 chris      not mine, but a lot of the french developers time
23:22 chris      id have a read of the developers list mailing archive
23:22 iceninesyd ah yes, KohaRoadMap 3.0 ... i'll shutup now!
23:22 iceninesyd okay .. i'm on the user's mailing list
23:22 iceninesyd perhpas I'll lurk on developers for awhile
23:22 chris      good idea
23:22 iceninesyd it looks like 1.2, then 2.2 and now 3.0
23:23 chris      1.0 ->1.1 -> 1.2  1.2->1.3->2.0 (quite a lot of changes) 2.0->2.1->2.2
23:23 iceninesyd i presume the dev list is the place to offer to work on some of the outsnading issues lissted in the roadmap
23:23 chris      yep
23:24 chris      to find out what is still left too
23:24 iceninesyd and 2.2 -> 3.0 implies a major bunch of changes
23:24 chris      yeah, most namely zebra
23:24 iceninesyd the 'contextual' db ... which is new to me
05:20 js         hello
05:20 dewey      what's up, js
10:41 owen       kados, rch, you guys awake?
10:42 paul       hello owen.
10:42 owen       Hi paul
10:42 paul       frenchies are, at least ;-)
10:47 paul       owen : if you want to do some searches, i17.bureau.paulpoulain.com (test/test) is running, with a partial SANOP setup
10:47 paul       (searching potter is fine)
10:52 owen       paul, that login/password doesn't work for me
10:55 paul       lol
10:57 Lea        evening
10:57 Lea        er...afternoon even...
10:58 rch        Lea: morning!
10:59 Lea        feels like it! :)
10:59 Lea        guys, I'm getting great feedback from my boss about Koha :)
10:59 Lea        although he thinks the default html/css is ..err.... "unique" ;)