Time Nick Message 11:55 kados :-) 11:55 tumer kados:it tries to read every file and sometimes goes crazy saying they dont have id's so best to have marc records only 11:54 kados ahh ... tumer is probably right, i have not tested this extensively 11:54 kados only files with an excension of .iso2709 will be noticed 11:54 tumer[A] sometimes does not ignore them 11:54 tumer[A] only with marc records 11:54 kados but they will be ignored 11:53 kados it can contain other things 11:53 paul the /path/to/record being a directory with only this file, or can contains other things ? 11:53 kados and put in /path/to/records 11:53 kados file must be named *.iso2709 11:53 tumer[A] paul one big chunck 11:53 kados all in one file 11:52 paul so we have to export all of them in 1 big file (using export/export.pl) or 1 for each biblio ? 11:52 paul zebraidx -g iso2709 -c /koha/etc/zebra-biblios.cfg -d kohaplugin update /path/to/records => /path/to/records is the path to all records, right ? 11:51 dewey kados is probably becoming a true Perl Monger... 11:51 paul kados ? 11:42 thd kados: OK I have to go now in any case 11:41 thd kados: tumer has it by not needing repeated fields just repeated holdings records 11:40 kados thd: but don't have the time today to discuss deeply 11:40 kados thd: and I think we're very close 11:40 kados thd: I really want to resolve the standard holdings issues 11:40 kados thd: sorry, got a lot on my plate right now 11:39 thd kados: why was it so difficult to think of the simplest most efficient solution for standard holdings? 11:36 thd monopolies in action 11:35 thd paul: I will have optical fibre or a hole in a foundation wall before the telephone company will replace a circuit box from the 60s. 11:33 thd paul: I have cheap dial-up because my building has the wrong too old equipment for cheaper DSL and the telephone company will not replace it. 11:32 paul i've DSL at ToinS home. I may be able to have a dial up, but it's very expensive 11:31 thd ? 11:31 thd paul: do you have dial-up 11:31 paul my move is done. but still no DSL 11:31 kados thd: no time for a meeting today 11:30 thd paul: you are still moving? 11:30 paul i'm at ToinS home, so I will not be here everytime 11:30 kados paul: :-) 11:30 kados paul: and don't expect searching to work except at opac-zoomsearch.pl 11:30 thd no 11:30 thd welcome back paul 11:30 paul i'm not back thd 11:30 kados paul: only npl are tested 11:30 thd now that paul is back 11:30 thd kados: will there be a meeting today? 11:29 paul kados/tumer/thd : which templates are OK for dev_week ? npl ? 11:29 kados thd: I'll take a look 11:29 thd kados: in his case he found that an attempt to add an authorised heading was filling 690 instead of 700 after a repeatable field had been added 11:27 thd kados: tumer reports that if you add a repeated field the authorised heading fills the wrong field 11:26 thd s/field/record/ 11:26 thd kados: although, tumer has spotted an editor bug for filling a field from an authority field 11:25 kados so the regular MARC editor would be used 11:25 thd kados: the fields are all there it is just a question of unhiding them 11:25 kados right 11:25 kados ahh ... 11:24 thd kados: a holdings framework would in the case of MARC 21 be a very trimmed down bibliographic framework 11:23 thd kados: that would give the librarian access to whatever is needed 11:22 thd kados: would you not use the MARC editor to load a holdings record? 11:21 thd kados: only 952 is defined in tab 10 11:21 kados even in the current scheme 11:20 kados thd: if they are defined in tab 10 they will show up I think 11:20 kados like biblio.pm, if there was anything in there 11:20 kados there are a few that need to be manually merged 11:20 thd kados: cataloguing would need 852 or 856, and sometimes 863-868 11:20 kados mainly dev_week and rel_2_2 are merged 11:19 dewey i already had it that way, thd. 11:19 thd kados: acquisitions would need 541, 583, and 876 that is just 3 fields with 877-8 for very special cases 11:18 thd kados: or 3 at a time 11:18 kados thd: tell me 11:18 kados thd: no 11:18 thd kados: did you see my message about how there are only about 3 fields for the librarian to worry about in standard MARC 21 holdings? 11:17 thd kados: he is not using it in production yet? 11:17 ToinS kados ah ok 11:17 kados ToinS: I did it yesterday 11:17 kados thd: it will be in head as soon as tumer deems it stabler :-) 11:16 ToinS paul : updatedatabase has not been merged between rel_2_2 & head 11:16 kados thd: yes, and I approved it 11:11 thd hello paul 11:11 paul hello thd. 11:11 thd ? 11:11 thd kados: did you understand from reading the logs what tumer had done for holdings 11:10 paul forget this, my copy was wrong. i had updated from something locally modified, so I got some cvs errors. restarting from a fresh copy 11:07 kados paul: in rel22 it should work 10:46 paul because export/export.pl is buggy (compilation failure) 10:45 paul kados : how do you export your datas ? 10:37 paul bon appetit ! 10:36 paul of course. 10:35 kados (use a test db first of course) 10:35 kados so you can probably convert to utf8 before mysqldump 10:35 kados :) 10:35 paul that's what is nice with a language that uses accents : any problem is easy to find ;-) 10:34 paul if yes, then all my libraries are ok ! 10:34 kados sounds like it 10:34 paul but you said that I could not be sure of my real encoding. So, if mysql = latin1, meta=latin1 and the pages are OK, then I have real latin1 datas ? 10:33 kados so if your encoding is 8859, and your db is 8859, and your meta tag is 8859, it's all good 10:33 paul yep 10:33 kados isn't 8859 eq latin1? 10:32 paul but when you put it on a web page, if it's not 8859, the page should be wrong in the browser isn't it ? 10:32 kados but to get them out you must trick mysql 10:32 kados so you may have correctly encoded values 10:31 kados except when you try to mysqldump or convert to another encoding 10:31 kados it doesn't care what you put in 10:31 kados mysql will let you store any encoding 10:30 kados that's just the best part 10:30 kados hehe 10:30 paul (with proper accented chars) 10:30 paul if the datas where not iso8859, how is it possible to have correct MARCdetail ? 10:30 paul another question : 10:30 paul my problem is that I think I alway had iso8859 datas, but I was probably wrong, and I'll discover it soon 10:30 kados (we of course, didn't say it, it was a sin of omission :-)) 10:29 paul mmm... I never said that... but I agree that I never checked ;-) 10:29 kados and not 'make sure you are running mysql 4.1 with encoding set to the same as your data' 10:29 kados because we said 'koha can run perfectly on any version of mysql with any settings' 10:28 kados yes 10:28 paul do you know how we created it ? 10:28 kados it's a problem we created ourselves :-) 10:28 kados but it's also unreleated to zebra :-) 10:28 kados it's a really big problem, unfortunately, maybe too big a job for updatedatabase :( 10:27 kados on another server 10:27 kados so you can set up a test environment 10:27 kados without touching the encoding 10:27 kados mysqlhotcopy will take a snapshot of the db 10:26 kados some tests will need to be done 10:26 kados well ... even that could change it 10:26 paul ah, I understand now why you don't have your long hairs anymore... 10:26 kados you need to export to a file 10:26 kados no hex in mysql 10:26 kados very frustrating 10:26 kados because I didn't know that mysql thought it had latin1, not utf-8 10:26 kados is because with WIPO, I was losing hair trying to get mysqldump to export utf-8 data to their db 10:25 paul but we don't have any hex in mysql 10:25 kados the reason I know all of this 10:25 kados you can examine the hex :-) 10:25 paul really nice... 10:24 kados unless you know beforehand :-) 10:24 kados there is no way to know 10:24 kados hehe 10:24 paul how do you do to know what is the real encoding ? 10:24 kados I don't know about iconv 10:24 kados you can transform within mysql itself 10:24 paul to transform from one to another encoding, is iconv enough (on the dump) ? 10:23 kados who have many non-ascii characters 10:23 kados esp for french libraries 10:23 kados yep :-) 10:23 paul to rewrite it : depending on what you really have and what mysql think you have, you will be in a big pain ;-) 10:23 kados paul: and that all their data is in utf8 before importing 10:22 kados paul: a library must simply make sure that mysql 4.1 is set up with the correct encoding 10:22 paul yes partially make sense now. 10:22 kados paul: for a new install it's much simpler 10:22 kados paul: make better sense? 10:21 kados and the type of MARC 10:21 kados depending on the mysql version and encoding defaults they are using 10:21 kados but every Koha migration will be different 10:20 kados and in the case of the MARC data, we need to update all the leaders 10:20 kados then we need to tell mysql that the tables are utf8 10:20 kados now we need to convert everything to utf8 10:19 kados (again) 10:19 kados so now we can run mysqldump without mangling the data 10:19 kados (so now mysql doesn't know the encoding because the data is of type blob, etc.) 10:18 kados (as was common when moving from 3.23 to 4.0 (which started having some character set support)) 10:18 kados (mangled means the characters have been re-encoded) 10:18 kados (so now mysql doesn't know the encoding) 10:18 kados alter the mysql tables and convert to binary or blob 10:18 paul what does 'mangled' means ? 10:18 kados to upgrade, NPL must: 10:17 kados but actually has marc8, mangled once in a conversion 10:17 kados so now NPL has a database that thinks it has latin1 data 10:17 kados all of the data was mangled by mylsql 10:17 kados when NPL migrated from 1.9 to 2.0 using mysqldump 10:16 kados so ... 10:16 kados the database was set up for latin1 defaults 10:16 kados they imported them into a mysql 3.23 db 10:16 kados before Koha NPL had MARC_8 encoded records 10:16 paul ok, listening 10:16 paul yes, i've read, but that's not enough for me 10:16 kados I will give you NPL as an example 10:16 kados ok 10:16 kados http://wiki.koha.org/doku.php?id=encodingscratchpad 10:15 paul and mysql alter table know where it comes from isn't it ? 10:15 kados yes, but you need to convert it to utf-8 _and_ tell mysql that it is utf-8 10:15 paul but everybody & everything will be in utf8 in 3.0 10:15 kados if 4.1, make sure the mysqldump is from 4.1 or stop immediately 10:14 paul so, in updater, if mysql 4.0 => stop immediatly, if 4.1 => continue 10:14 kados what encoding they started on, what they want to end up with, etc. 10:14 kados there are so many cases 10:14 kados I doubt it 10:14 paul and we could check this in updater. 10:14 kados but that is a complicated process 10:14 kados yes 10:14 paul before upgrading. 10:14 kados but most libraries are running 2.2 on mysql 4.0 10:14 paul se a library migrating from Koha 2.2 will have to deal with mysql upgrade if needed. 10:13 kados 4.1 _is_ required for 2.4 and 3.0 10:13 kados yes 10:13 paul but I thought we have said previously that 4.1 will be required for Koha 3 10:13 kados if you migrate from 4.0 you must do special things to preserve your character sets 10:12 kados but most libraries will be migrating from 4.0 10:12 kados 4.1 is required for dev_week 10:12 paul add a test or require 4.1 ? 10:12 kados you'd have to test the mysqldump to see if the data was coming from 4.0 or 4.1 10:12 paul I can't what ? 10:12 kados you can't 10:12 paul so we should add a test to check for 4.1 when starting updatedatabase ? 10:11 kados for new installs the procedure is different 10:11 kados I speak of migration 10:11 kados but you table and database definitions are probably set to latin1 10:11 paul right. but we require 4.1 isn't it ? 10:11 kados there is no character set support 10:11 kados if you are running rel_2_2 on 4.0 10:11 kados because depending on the version of mysql you are migrating from, converting to utf-8 could mangle all your data 10:10 kados the wiki is not up to date with my latest tests 10:10 paul why ? 10:10 kados utf-8 conversion should not be in updatedatabase 10:10 paul things that are already in udpatedabatase (like utf-8 conversion) 10:10 tumer ahhh 10:09 kados biblio_framework.sql is what alters biblio and moves the frameworkcode as well as adding some columns 10:09 tumer it merely adds more field definitions to what we already have and which we will not use 10:09 kados it's poorly named 10:09 kados yes 10:09 tumer biblio_framework update is not an essential part of this upgrade is it? 10:09 kados thx 10:09 paul ok, i take care of it & update the wiki 10:09 kados eventually I would have put it in but didn't get to it 10:08 kados everything should be in dev_week updatabase 10:08 kados yes 10:08 paul - biblio_framework.sql, phrase_log.sql are already partially in updatedatabase. Is it OK if I put everything there ? 10:08 tumer paul i dont think you need it and infact should not otherwise you will loose your mappings 10:07 owen Hi paul 10:07 paul (hello owen) 10:07 paul means "update to marc21 from thomas" ?if yes what is interesting for me to know for unimarc ? 10:06 paul - update to the latest bib framework 10:06 paul kados : you've missed some of my questions it seems : 10:05 paul it's really a lot 10:05 paul right tumer 10:04 tumer but should be 0 10:04 paul 10 for a 14000 biblio DB 10:03 kados ahh...good for me :-) 10:03 paul oups, no, I have a few. 10:03 kados excellent 10:03 paul the good news being that i don't have any missing 090 10:02 paul - run missing090.pl 10:02 paul - run updater/updatedatabase 10:02 paul - copy rel_2_2 DB 10:02 paul so, I have to run it from dev_week 100% : 10:01 paul and if I try with PERL5LIB pointing to dev_week, it fails, because the KOHA_CONF is not xml, but the old .conf file 10:00 paul in rel_2_2, the parameter must be a bibid. 10:00 paul it calls MARCgetbiblio with a biblionumber as parameter. 10:00 paul kados : I can't get missing090.pl work correctly. 10:00 tumer i write $record->as_xml_record() and still get <colection> wrapper 09:58 tumer yep 09:58 kados is it the newest from SF? 09:58 kados what new M:F:X? 09:58 kados weird 09:49 tumer i did not understand why 09:49 tumer btw it was not zebra problem zebra was crashing cuase this new M:F:X was not giving me xml_as_record 09:48 tumer then i will commit 09:47 tumer i am currently working on it hope to get it fully functional by this weekend and put it to production 09:43 kados (so it won't change anything :-)) 09:43 kados (note that HEAD is already completely broken) 09:43 kados tumer: and tell you if I don't like something :-) 09:43 kados tumer: if you commit it I will take a look immediately 09:42 tumer i think thats the only way to actually get good clean code 09:42 kados tumer: ok 09:41 paul you plan to break everything ? sounds cool to me :D 09:41 tumer so what i will do is submit new biblio which will break all record handling ok? 09:40 paul (in Attic directory) 09:40 kados yes, you can't actually delete them 09:40 paul tumer: yes 09:40 tumer does that put them in archive? 09:39 kados cvs delete file.pl 09:39 kados you can also do: 09:39 kados that would allow this 09:39 kados I wonder if savannah supports subversion yet 09:39 kados good question 09:39 tumer how can i delete from head 09:39 tumer ok but head has lots of junk old script in it, i have cleaned mine 09:38 kados tumer: what you are doing is closest to my vision of it 09:38 kados tumer: there is no official HEAD api yet 09:38 kados tumer: that's the point 09:38 tumer kados:it will break everything itsa a complete new api 09:37 kados tumer: please proceed with your plan and feel free to commit to HEAD 09:37 kados paul: (because sometimes there are still missing 090 fields and zebra indexing will crash if they are missing) 09:36 kados paul: then you must run it again when you have the MARC data 09:36 kados paul: you run missing090 in the database before you mysqldump it 09:36 kados paul: not quite 09:36 kados y 09:36 kados tumer: I read your conversation with thd yesterda 09:36 paul ah, ok , it means you must have 2 DB during migrations. 09:35 tumer hi kados 09:35 kados hi tumer 09:35 kados paul: and you are using rel_2_2 bases when running missing090 09:35 tumer biblio also has frameworkcode 09:35 tumer no biblioitems 09:35 kados paul: just make sure you have two conf files 09:35 tumer items has itemnumber,biblionumber,marc,barcode 09:34 tumer biblio table has only marc,biblionumber and itemtype 09:34 tumer here is what i have changed: 09:34 tumer i'll ask it there 09:34 paul but I think it must be asked to koha & koha-devel ml 09:33 paul note that we could have itemtype at item level & still have the same behaviour as previously, the library just would have the same itemtype for each item. 09:32 tumer well may be we should change library policy tehn 09:31 tumer but they are in sme biblio 09:31 tumer and sometimes separately 09:31 tumer a book with a cd causing us problems-- CD gets loaned out for shorrter 09:31 paul otherwise, we could, for example, put all books from the same author in the same biblio. 09:30 paul no you can't, because it's a different intellectual object. 09:30 tumer so you cannot hve a CD version of a book under same biblio 09:30 paul (and maybe with marc21 as well) 09:30 paul the best being to have something like FRBR, that is incompatible with unimarc. 09:29 paul mmm... this question should be asked to koha-devel. In UNIMARC, itemtype is a biblio level information. 09:29 tumer do you think we shouldmanage itemtype at biblio level or item level? 09:28 tumer paul i am almost finishing a complete new api for record handling. 1 question? 09:28 paul did you hear of this scandal in cyprus as well ? 09:28 paul and in 2 or 3 days, their joy will end with the justice decision, probably. 09:28 paul not all italians : our priest was happy, but only half happy. 09:27 tumer not if you ask italians 09:27 paul so it also means nothing to loose with penalties ;-) 09:27 paul in fact, this end was the worst possible, but also the best possible : it means nothing to win with penalties. 09:26 paul the priest of my church is italian, so we all had a very large problem on sunday : could we have been happy with a victory from anyone. 09:25 tumer hi paul sorry about france 09:25 paul hello tumer/ 09:25 paul same for phrase_log.sql 09:25 paul kados : another one : biblio_framework.sql is partially already in updatedatabase. Are you OK if I put everything in this script ? (should be easy) 09:22 paul kados : another problem/question : i try to run missing090field.pl, but it fails, as it requires zebra working. are you OK if I move this part AFTER Starting zebra ? 09:15 paul other question : I think convert_to_utf8.pl is redundant with updater/updatedatabase (see updatedatabase line 1404+ : it's the same alter table) 09:13 paul if yes, what is specific with them (as I can't do it for unimarc) 09:12 paul kados : what do you mean by "update to the latest bib framework"? do you mean "update to the latest marc21 frameworks from thomas" ? 08:50 kados cool, thanks 08:49 paul if you have the MARC record, MARCmarc2koha sub in Biblio.pm will create the Koha field easily 08:44 kados so maybe each MARC record in the result set must be processed to split it into Koha fields and MARC fields for display 08:44 kados (in fact, we don't get the whole set of bibids at all ... that is kept in zebra) 08:43 kados not bibids 08:43 kados because with zebra, we get back full MARC records 08:43 kados the only tricky part is how to integrate the results 08:42 kados :-) 08:42 kados paul: the CCL style of searching is very similar to the old API 08:42 paul good news... 08:41 kados paul: changes only to the routines in SearchMarc.pm 08:41 kados paul: I just investigated whether it would be possible to keep the rel_2_2 style API for searching, and I think it could be done with some minor changes 08:06 paul2 ok kados, i'll investigate in the next minutes, i'll let you know if I have another problem 08:03 kados paul: it also keeps track of problem records and saves them in XML and iso2709 form in separate dump files 08:02 kados paul: for MARC21 only 08:02 kados paul: there is a sample of a preprocess script that only converts to UTF-8 08:02 kados paul: http://liblime.com/public/roundtrip.pl 08:01 kados paul: been very lonely in #koha in the morning for me :-) 08:00 kados paul: it's good to have you back :-) 07:59 mason cheers paul 07:59 paul great mason, we will wait for them then 07:59 mason tis only 1am :) 07:59 mason i have some acqui. changes done in that last couple of weeks that ill commit to head in the next hour, too 07:58 kados paul: I hear your new home is very beautiful 07:58 kados mason: kinda late, eh? :-) 07:58 kados hey mason 07:58 kados excellent 07:58 mason hiya guys 07:58 paul ToinS will start code cleaning on head in the afternoon 07:57 kados (welcome back :-)) 07:57 kados and I have submitted bug reports for each confirmed bug 07:57 kados a client has explained the bugs 07:57 kados http://wiki.liblime.com/doku.php?id=koha226bugs 07:57 kados paul: also, we spoke briefly about acquisitions bugs before 07:56 paul I'll run & let you know if there is the problem 07:56 kados you may be surprised :-) 07:56 kados have you run missing090.pl before? :-) 07:56 paul wow ! strange, I never had this problem in France ! 07:55 kados NPL has several thousand!! missing 090 fields 07:55 kados also, somewhere in rel_2_2 code, 090 fields are being deleted or are never added for some records 07:55 paul on transfers, right ? 07:55 kados when items are updated, MARC isn't 07:54 kados what it means is that somewhere in rel_2_2 code 07:54 kados well ... 07:54 paul because I can accept that " so it's necessary to query items table to get the right values for items fields" but I don't know what it means exactly & what to code to fix this !!! 07:53 kados I'm afraid it won't be useful to you 07:53 kados right ... but MARC21 is quite different than UNIMARC 07:53 paul yes, but that would be nice to have a starter ;-) 07:53 kados paul: and every client has different needs 07:53 kados paul: it's not completely written yet 07:52 paul kados: is there a script that does all of this for you somewhere ? 07:52 ToinS ok 07:52 paul try 'XX' => "$variable" 07:52 paul yes ToinS : you have a 'XX' => $variable and $variable is probably empty. 07:52 ToinS have someone ever seen this error : HTML::Template->param() : You gave me an odd number of parameters to param()! ??? 07:51 kados all of that is covered under preprocessing 07:51 kados so it's necessary to query items table to get the right values for items fields 07:51 kados koha 2.x doesn't export items properly 07:51 kados plus ... 07:50 kados (used for searching by date and format/content/audience) 07:50 kados add all of the fixed fields 07:50 dewey paul: excuse me? 07:50 paul dewey : do back to bed please. It's time to sleep in new zealand... 07:50 kados other steps are to add a new leader 07:49 dewey kados: that doesn't look right 07:49 kados change encoding is just one step 07:49 kados so all of those marc records must be preprocessed 07:49 kados every previous version of Koha produced improper MARC records 07:49 kados well ... preprocess includes many things 07:48 paul (+ learn what you mean by "preprocess routine to convert to utf-8 ? don't you have one already ?) 07:48 kados they are in the zebraplugin dir 07:48 kados http://cvs.savannah.nongnu.org/viewcvs/koha/zebraplugin/?root=koha&only_with_tag=R_2-3-0 07:48 paul I just want to know what does those scripts ;-) 07:47 paul I haven't done anything yet 07:47 kados have you done those steps? or don't understand how? 07:47 paul i have completed this page & will continue as well, when I encounter something I don't understand well 07:46 kados except it should say from dev_week :-) 07:46 paul rebuild non marc is OK I think 07:46 paul double-check again for missing 090 fields (very critical) 07:46 paul 7. 07:46 paul run them through a preprocess routine to convert to utf-8 07:46 paul 6. 07:46 paul export your MARC records 07:46 paul 5. 07:46 paul run phrase_log.sql from within the mysql monitor (from dev-week) 07:46 paul # 07:45 paul run biblio_framework.sql from within the mysql monitor (from dev-week) 07:45 paul # 07:45 paul run missing090field.pl (from dev-week) 07:45 paul # 07:45 paul - run rebuild-nonmarc from rel_2_2 if your framework has changed 07:45 paul I'm not sure to understand : 07:45 kados hey ToinS 07:45 ToinS hi kados 07:45 paul http://wiki.koha.org/doku.php?id=installingzebraplugin226 07:45 kados sure 07:45 paul do you have a few seconds for some questions ? 07:44 paul (working from ToinS home, because I still don't have any connexion at my new home :( ) 07:44 paul good morning to you 07:44 paul hello kados 07:43 kados hi paul 04:53 chris yes its really good 04:52 paul did you look at ToinS code cleaning on suggestions ? 04:52 chris so it probably needs some cleaning :) 04:52 chris cool, we merged all our fixes in the acquistion module in head a few weeks ago 04:51 chris yep 04:51 paul yep. it's a dev_week snapshot I bet ? 04:51 paul ToinS will start cleaning acquistion module this afternoon 04:51 chris did you see there is a 2.3.0 ? 04:51 chris excellent 04:51 paul to investigage zoom & unimarc things... 04:50 chris yeah 04:50 paul I had 6Mb previously, but my main concern is the up bandwidth 04:50 chris on a cable modem 04:50 chris i have 2mb dn, 2mb up 04:49 chris cool, thats not bad at all 04:49 paul s/B/b/ 04:49 paul something like 4MB dn / 800KB up 04:49 paul adsl 04:49 chris will you get cable or adsl in your office paul? 04:43 chris i think hill is right ... its a big hill though :) 04:43 paul just on the other side of the hill (not sure of the word hill) 04:42 chris ohh cool 04:42 paul my new home being close to ND 04:42 chris there must be a great view for Antoine's home 04:42 paul yep 04:42 chris up near the Notre Dame de la Guarde ? 04:41 paul so works from Antoine home !!! 04:41 chris oh no 04:40 chris hi paul 04:40 paul hello world 04:39 chris hehe 04:38 btoumi ;=) 04:37 btoumi need one week for sleep 04:37 chris ahh ok 04:37 btoumi chris: ok for fines.pm i have some probleme with my repository because call to calfine is ok in fines.pm 04:36 alaurin hi Toins 04:33 ToinS hello arnaud 04:32 alaurin fine, i'm near of my holidays, so , I feel good !!!!! 04:27 chris arnaud: im good thanks, and you? 04:27 btoumi yes i do it 04:27 chris ahh, it should be, can you fix that? 04:26 btoumi calcfines was not called in export 04:26 alaurin hi, how are u .???? 04:26 chris hi arnaud 04:25 chris yep? 04:25 btoumi another probleme with fines 04:22 chris no problem 04:21 btoumi ty 04:21 btoumi perahps i have another question for u but not for the moment 04:19 chris :) 04:18 btoumi i'm happy to help u ;=) 04:16 chris i edited that file just a while ago and didnt even notice that :-) 04:16 chris damn 04:15 chris there we go 04:14 chris but issuingrules replaced that 04:14 chris back before issuingrules existed, the issuing rules where in a table called categoryitem (borrower categories, plus itemtypes = categoryitem) 04:13 btoumi that why i ask u 04:13 btoumi i do it in my repository but i wasn't sure 04:12 chris 2 mintues ill fix that sql up 04:12 btoumi yes 04:12 chris that should be issuingrules 04:12 chris categoryitem 04:12 chris ahh yes i see it 04:11 btoumi line 161 in fines.pm 04:10 btoumi yes i work only in head 04:10 chris ah ha 04:10 btoumi not fines2.pl but fines.pm because in fines2.pl u use fines.pm 04:10 chris in head? 04:09 btoumi i confirm 04:08 chris :-) 04:08 btoumi ;=) 04:08 btoumi just one minute i think i make confuse with file i think i must sleep now 04:06 chris is it misc/fines2.pl ? 04:06 chris maybe im looking at the wrong file 04:04 chris hm which table does it use? 04:04 btoumi ok thanks 04:04 chris ill update it 04:04 chris ahh 2 seconds 04:03 btoumi it uses a table whio not exist 04:03 btoumi yes 04:03 chris fines2.pl ? 04:03 chris and Circulation/Fines.pm 04:03 btoumi i find a lot of problem with this file 04:02 chris and Accounts2.pm 04:02 chris yes 04:02 btoumi but now the calcul of fines is do by fines2.pl ? 04:01 chris right 04:01 btoumi because for my library we must manage fines 04:00 chris all the C ones are credits 03:59 btoumi now i learn more about the fines functionnement 03:59 chris you can add more if you need more tho 03:59 chris no, they arent configurable 03:58 btoumi can u configure them or not? 03:58 chris CS, CB, CW, CF and CL 03:58 chris plus the 03:57 btoumi ok 03:57 chris are the ones i know 03:57 chris L, F, Rep, F, FU, A, Pay 03:56 chris as well as those ones 03:56 btoumi i find fu o f m lr lc status but not all 03:55 chris there is Pay 03:55 chris right 03:54 btoumi but i can't see all value for accounttype can u help me? 03:53 btoumi i work on fines 03:50 ToinS chris: ok ! 03:47 chris sure btoumi 03:47 chris i think they do different things, so i think keep using GetItemTypes for now 03:47 btoumi can I? 03:46 btoumi chris i have a question for u 03:46 chris toins: i just noticed the FIXME but im not sure who wrote that 03:46 chris hi btoumi 03:45 btoumi hi chris 03:45 btoumi hi toins: 03:45 ToinS hi btoumi 03:45 btoumi hi all 03:45 chris ahh ok 03:45 ToinS so i don't knw 03:45 ToinS i've just meet getitemtypes in a script and renamed it 03:44 ToinS i've not really worked on koha.pm 03:44 chris or keep using GetItemTypes ? 03:43 chris toins: with the work you are doing with C4::Koha ... are you planning to use get_itemtypeinfos_of instead of GetItemTypes ? 02:40 ToinS hello chris 02:40 chris hi toins 02:39 ToinS hello world 23:16 thd kados: are you still awake? 22:15 chris cya later 22:14 russ catch you later 22:14 Burgundavia I will get my work IRC client on this channel as well 22:14 russ it is mainly the green and the purple 22:14 Burgundavia anyway, I have to run 22:14 Burgundavia the blue and green on the website are not bad 22:14 Burgundavia ok 22:14 russ ahh not really 22:13 Burgundavia heh 22:13 chris you dont want me doing anything to do with design :-) 22:12 chris hmm ill defer to russ on that one 22:12 Burgundavia yep 22:12 chris koha the project? 22:12 Burgundavia does koha have a palette? (aside from purple) 22:11 chris yeah that would be ideal 22:11 Burgundavia ideally you wanat something you can co-brand: liblime/katipo/koha-fr and koha 22:11 chris excellent :) 22:11 chris but there is no really general koha ones 22:10 Burgundavia let me get this edubuntu case study out the door and the OPAC UI critique and I will see if I can take stock of what is available 22:10 chris and i think liblime has some 22:10 Burgundavia ah 22:10 chris some brochure stuff etc, that we (katipo) have used at ALIA online, and lianza 22:09 chris we have some printed material 22:09 Burgundavia http://ubuntu.ca/Edubuntu-casestudy.png 22:09 chris right 22:09 Burgundavia hence the edubuntu case study 22:08 chris m 22:08 chris but suffer from the same only so many hours in the day proble 22:08 Burgundavia most oss projects are bad on this 22:08 chris we'd love printed material 22:08 chris thats pretty much what we have 22:08 Burgundavia yep I have dug through 22:08 chris have you looked at wiki.koha.org ... and www.kohadocs.org ? 22:07 russ lol 22:07 chris hehe 22:07 chris and at www.kohadocs.org 22:07 chris in the wiki 22:07 chris we have lots in html 22:07 chris in printed, nope 22:07 Burgundavia nor a product guide 22:07 Burgundavia but you have no Koha case studies, in printed form 22:07 chris paul in france does the same 22:06 chris liblime does the same 22:06 chris katipo markets its services ... which semi markets koha 22:06 Burgundavia hmm 22:06 chris no one :) 22:06 Burgundavia who does Koha marketing? 22:06 chris thats old too, theres lots more than that now 22:05 Burgundavia ok, that is an amazing map 22:05 chris we try to get the libraries to give us the permission for that 22:05 russ i guess we have steered clear of that in the past 22:05 Burgundavia I have noticed libraries hate being pathfinders on technology 22:05 chris http://old.koha.org/about/map/index.html <-- old map 22:04 Burgundavia X library has migrated from Y to Koha 22:04 Burgundavia a little news piece on the main website 22:04 chris on the old website ... and we need something like that again 22:04 chris we used to have a map 22:04 chris but its hard to show that in a nice way 22:04 chris yeah, its more like a 200 library trick 22:04 Burgundavia count, that is 22:03 Burgundavia well, two, if you county athen county 22:03 chris yep, we are working with the libraries to get them to do some publicity 22:03 Burgundavia the koha website gives the impression that it is a one library trick 22:03 Burgundavia it is important to publicize any libraries that do migrate 22:03 chris the ones who migrated really had no choice, migrate or upgrade 22:02 chris yeah 22:02 Burgundavia they said that getting support for classic has basically been impossible since the merger 22:02 chris 2 libraries in nz have migrated from old dynix to koha in the last year 22:02 russ oooh that would cripple a public library in our region 22:02 Burgundavia not too mention the headache of the migration itself 22:01 chris yikes thats a lot to lose 22:01 chris roll up roll up, get locked in to our solution, ull never escape 22:01 Burgundavia library I know is migrating Dynix Classic --> Sirsi Unicorn. Loosing 900k in fines, due to Unicorn not understanding that fines should persist after the book/thing has been removed from the collection 22:01 chris im picking that will be the angle they will take 22:00 russ http://www.lianza.org.nz/events/conference2006/programme.html 22:00 Burgundavia "how libraries can spend more money on us" 22:00 chris and then chairing a panel 22:00 Burgundavia ah 22:00 chris the keynote address 21:59 Burgundavia interesting. What with? 21:59 chris interestingly enough sirsidynix are taking up the first 2 hours of the first day of lianza (the nz equiv of the ala conference) here this year 21:59 chris yeah 21:59 Burgundavia yep 21:59 Burgundavia had a laugh at SirsiDynix claiming to built on "open standards" 21:58 chris i think liblime was sharing with index data? 21:58 chris right 21:58 Burgundavia our booth = Userful's 21:58 chris :-) 21:58 Burgundavia a big, giant Windows world, with a few beacons of hope: our booth and Index Data's 21:57 chris it sounded big 21:57 Burgundavia big 21:57 chris how was ALA? 21:57 chris ahh yes 21:57 Burgundavia I was supposed to be at the Paris development conference, but it clashed with ALA in New Orleans, sadly 21:57 Burgundavia ah yes 21:57 chris i met mark at linuxconf.au this year 21:56 chris yep 21:56 Burgundavia ubuntu is everywhere 21:55 chris planet ubuntu 21:55 chris that'll be it 21:55 chris ahh 21:55 Burgundavia I am co-author on the Official Ubuntu Book? 21:55 chris trying to remember where ive seen it 21:54 Burgundavia cool 21:54 chris im Chris Cormack, i work for Katipo Communications in the day .. and some of the night too, and Koha all over the place 21:54 Burgundavia nothing bad I hope :) 21:54 chris ahhh ive seen your name around :) 21:54 Burgundavia chris: just to introduce myself, I am Corey Burger. I work for Userful in the day and volunteer with Ubuntu/Edubuntu at night 21:53 chris which we should do some news about 21:53 Burgundavia somewhere in there I also need to finish that edubuntu case study 21:53 chris but there are few new libraries running koha 21:53 kados heh 21:52 Burgundavia too many projects, so little time 21:52 chris yep its true, more publicity would be good, but id hate to have ppl see it, and then try it out and say it sucks because they cant install it :-) 21:52 Burgundavia ok 21:52 kados Burgundavia: well, when you get to that email, I'm all eyes :-) 21:51 kados so folks can try it out with real data 21:51 kados also I want to get some public demos going 21:51 kados already spotted some probs 21:51 Burgundavia just don't want to miss an opportunity to get us talked about 21:51 kados I'll do 2.3.1 tomorrow afternoon 21:50 kados yep 21:50 chris when we are at 2.3.2 ish 21:50 Burgundavia ok 21:50 kados yea 21:50 chris maybe in a week or so 21:50 kados Burgundavia: only tumer and I have got it going so far :-) 21:50 chris its a tricky one 21:50 Burgundavia heh 21:50 kados Burgundavia: not really, because the core developers don't even know how to install it :-) 21:50 chris its hard to get them excited without them asking where is it, can i have it 21:50 kados yea, bleeding edge is key 21:50 chris there even 21:50 Burgundavia no, but you do want people to be excited about it existing 21:49 chris cos their will be blood everywhere :-) 21:49 chris but for now 2.3 is so bleeding edge we dont really want too many people trying it 21:49 kados so 2.3.0 is basically where we've said "ok, stuff is actually working ... now lets test and bugfix, etc. and in a month or so, we'll have a stable product" 21:49 Burgundavia yep 21:49 chris when 2.4 comes out there will be tons of fanfare on koha.org .. and on the main koha-devel list 21:48 kados yea 21:47 chris work leading up to 2.4 and 3.0 has been going on since 2.2.0 was released 21:47 kados right 21:47 Burgundavia see, that is not how (as an outsider), interpreted your email 21:47 kados yea 21:47 Burgundavia 2.3? 21:47 kados we've been working on this release for about two years now :-) 21:47 chris yep 21:47 kados but it's really the tail end of the dev cycle 21:46 kados yep 21:46 Burgundavia gets people all excited, reminds them the project is not dead 21:46 kados the liblime team has enough trouble keeping our marketing website up to date :-) 21:46 Burgundavia the start of a major new development cycle is pretty good news, I think 21:46 chris pretty much anything thats interesting or new, and someone tells us about can go up 21:46 kados plus, koha.org is really just the project page ... 21:46 kados and news and stuff is loose as well 21:46 Burgundavia indeed 21:45 kados so we basically know what's going on :-) 21:45 kados there are not that many core developers 21:45 kados the project is really loosely defined 21:45 kados or someone 21:45 kados well basically if someone has time to write something they submit it to russ 21:45 chris yep, ppl have to tell us news, then we'll put it there 21:44 kados right 21:44 Burgundavia nothing new, that is 21:44 Burgundavia the website, in the little news box which has nothing in it 21:44 kados if you have something you need announced you can generally send it to russ or someone 21:44 kados muhahaha 21:44 kados so I can basically do anything :-) 21:44 kados well I'm the release manager 21:44 kados do you mean to savannah? or koha-devel? or on the website koha.org? 21:43 Burgundavia the new development announcement 21:43 Burgundavia yep 21:43 kados announcements? 21:43 kados posting what? 21:43 Burgundavia what is policy on posting stuff to koha.org? 21:43 kados so now would be a really great time to have the ideas/mockup 21:43 Burgundavia I just saw that annoucement 21:42 kados I'll be working pretty much all week on 2.3.x 21:42 kados can't wait to read it 21:42 kados excellent 21:42 Burgundavia it is mostly written, just missing the mockup 21:42 kados cool 21:42 kados I hear you 21:42 Burgundavia I am about to run out to the local LUG meeting 21:42 kados :-) 21:41 Burgundavia kados: it is stuck in the loop of no time 21:41 kados Burgundavia: I'll hold you to your purpose :-) 21:41 kados Burgundavia: still waiting for that email :-) 20:50 thd tumer: be careful not to be kicked from behind by your zebra 20:49 tumer i have to check this zebra which is refusing to start 20:49 tumer i will look into it 20:48 thd tumer: http://www.loc.gov/marc/authority/ecadlink.html#mrca750 20:47 thd tumer: an example is 750 #0$aSummer resorts$0(DLC)sh#85130430#$wna 20:46 thd tumer: $0 is used for linking from the authority record to the original record although you should also preserve the original record control number in 035 20:45 tumer as i say i know zilch about authorities 20:44 tumer or a specific field? 20:44 thd tumer: $8 is also for linking within the record 20:44 tumer which subfield should it be 8? 20:43 thd $6 is for linking fields within the same record 20:42 thd tumer: you have done it precisely correctly as long as you are not still using $6 to link outside the record 20:41 thd chris: authority records are found in Latin America even if under used but they are largely absent even in some relatively rich countries like Italy 20:39 thd chris: although most counties lack authority records 20:39 thd chris: national libraries usually do that or some really large university library 20:38 thd tumer: that is standard 20:37 tumer but thats not standart i know 20:36 tumer i even linked them so searching in one language brings the other as well 20:36 tumer i give it in 750 20:35 chris ahh good idea 20:34 thd tumer chris: preserve the original LC record you may be translating into Turkish or Maori by giving the original heading in a 7XX linking field in the authority record 20:34 chris maybe thats something the future foundation could do, help hold/build authority records for other languages 20:33 chris immersion even 20:33 chris which would be needed if the total emmersion schools were to use them 20:32 chris im betting there are none for maori too 20:32 chris right 20:32 thd chris: although tumer says there are none yet for Turkish so he must create them 20:31 thd yes it is very easy 20:31 chris is there authorities for other languages thd? 20:31 tumer i am in more clear now 20:30 thd tumer: LC only has circa 125,000 authorised subject headings which can be used to build all the others. 20:29 thd tumer: subject authority files would be millions of authorised forms if they had to be complete subject strings with all the subdivisions in one record 20:27 tumer thats a relief, I thought i was going to have them all like that in millions 20:27 thd tumer: BnF bends the UNMARC rule that specifies $3 as not repeatable for subject subdivisions 20:26 thd 13% of subject bibliographic strings I mean 20:26 thd tumer: LC subject authority records only comprise about 13% of subject authority strings 20:25 tumer BnF do dont they? 20:24 thd for subject 20:24 thd tumer: decades ago LC stopped creating authority records with all the subdivisions in the authorised form 20:24 tumer currently its hybrid. LC subject headings beung translated but no actual records 20:23 tumer but i dont even know whether we actually fill $x $y $z from differnt authorities or one record that has all fields in it 20:23 thd tumer: your library is translating LC authority files, is it not? 20:22 thd tumer: repeatable $9 should allow for freely ordering the subfields 20:22 tumer thd:ok 20:21 thd tumer: I suspect that having repeated $9 in the same way that BnF has repeated $3 for subject subdivisions is the only way to have a manageable authority file. 20:20 tumer thd i am so far away from the subject, also they have to be freely ordered 20:19 thd tumer: subdivided subjects will seem to need repeated $9s for most free floating subdivision $z $x $y $v 20:19 tumer we are creating 90% of our records 20:19 tumer well its not good for me 20:17 thd tumer: they comply if they comply by using already compliant records. 20:17 thd tumer: those libraries are all using UNIMARC 20:17 tumer whats the use of creating authorities that you do not comply with? 20:16 tumer its not obvious untill you use subfield cloning -- the bug i mean 20:15 thd tumer: unfortunately, the only Koha libraries actually using authorities merely use the script designed to fill existing values in the bibliographic records into the database. 20:13 tumer i reported a bug but in vain 20:13 thd tumer: ooooh that is bad 20:13 tumer all the java script messing it all up 20:13 tumer you try filling 700 it fills 690 20:12 tumer no 20:12 thd tumer: do you mean with encoding? 20:12 tumer yes but try to add a authors name to a bibliographic record from authorities. Its now a mess 20:11 thd tumer: the authorities editor code needs to be copied from the bibliographic editor code 20:11 tumer i know 20:10 thd tumer: the editor code was never fixed for authorities 20:10 tumer the editor does not work with them either 20:09 tumer now we have thd producing some things i did some other all non complimenting each other 20:09 tumer all linking of authorities etc i have to study it a bit more 20:08 thd tumer: what specifically is not working about authorities? 20:08 thd tumer: specifically is not working? 20:08 tumer thats my intention 20:08 thd tumer: what about them is not working? 20:07 thd tumer: It may be a little painful in the short run but you will be much happier if they interoperate well with other systems 20:07 tumer thd: i have to redesign authorities, the way they are now is not working 20:06 thd tumer: I would like to persuade you to proceed with authorities in a standards compliant manner 20:05 thd tumer: that is perfectly in conformance with the standard which is the only important obstacle 20:04 tumer well thanks i dont know whether correct but thats how i designed it 20:04 thd tumer: that is brilliant to have done it the way that is both easiest and most efficient 20:00 thd kados: are you there? 20:00 thd tumer: and there I was thinking about how to do it the most difficult way 20:00 tumer s/starin/strain 19:59 tumer easier on indexing releases the starin on zebra 19:59 thd tumer: yes that is very evident 19:59 tumer its easeier to manage them this way 19:59 thd tumer: you do not attempt to make use of the repeatable fields so that you have for example 852 $t1 and 852 $t2 for the first and second copies? 19:58 thd tumer: you do not attempt to make use of the repeatable fields so that you have for example 852 $t1 and 852 $t for the first and second copies? 19:58 tumer yes but all call numbers end with c1 c2 etc so they are different and unique 19:57 thd tumer: do you have multiple copies of the same biblio in your library? 19:57 tumer yes because even a second copy is a different entity which has copy 2 in it 19:55 thd tumer: do you mean you are creating a separate holdings record for each item even if you have duplicate items for the same biblio? 19:55 tumer except issues and borrowers and subscript ofcourse 19:55 tumer there is nothing in sql any more only blobs of marc records 19:54 tumer i already have biblionumber in 001 in biblios itemnumber 001 in holdings 19:54 thd tumer: are you no longer using SQL code for tracking the items? 19:53 tumer i hope to get a full koha intranet working on this model by weekend 19:53 thd tumer: that would be the place for storing the 001 from the bibliographic record 19:53 tumer great thanks 19:52 thd tumer: well the standard place for the link number is 004 - CONTROL NUMBER FOR RELATED BIBLIOGRAPHIC RECORD 19:52 tumer separate holdings,bibblios and authorities records you do not require fields with letters there is abundance of fields 19:51 tumer i used to now i stick with standard LC nummbers 19:50 thd tumer: well if you are doing something non-standard for Koha I like some field with a letter in it like 90k but I realise that may require some code change 19:50 tumer if kados spares same space i will commit the whole lot to the cvs 19:49 tumer well within reason 19:49 tumer no restrictions 19:49 tumer any field to put anything in 19:48 tumer a complete marc record 19:48 tumer they have their own 001 005 007 852- to 999 all 19:47 thd tumer: and do these separate holdings records use more than one of the holdings fields? 19:47 tumer thd: which field is best to hold the biblionumber in holdings record? 19:46 tumer yes i have separate marc record for holdings niw 19:46 thd tumer: and it works? 19:46 dewey really are quite different 19:46 thd tumer: really? 19:46 tumer yep 19:45 thd for 3.0 19:45 tumer i already did 19:45 thd tumer: kados had said that you were intending to eliminate the dependence that Koha had on using one and only one MARC field for holdings. 19:44 tumer yep awake and zebraing 19:44 thd tumer: is that really you? 19:43 thd kados: cataloguing would need 852 or 856, and sometimes 863-868 19:39 thd kados: acquisitions would need 541, 583, and 876 that is just 3 fields with 877-8 for very special cases 19:36 thd kados: I can present a simplified case for the only users that you can obtain now in any case 19:34 thd kados: you would not need to link specifically to 841 but the shiny forest in SQL would be much more efficient to parse for the scary cases. 19:14 thd kados: 866-868 are not scary for humans, they are merely scary for computers. 19:13 thd kados: the only scary ones are 853-855 and 863-868 19:09 kados we need to link all of those? 19:09 kados hmmm 19:08 thd linking to items.itemnumber ? 19:07 kados enough for what? 19:06 thd kados: do you think that would be enough? 19:05 thd 878 - ITEM INFORMATION--INDEXES (R) 19:05 thd 877 - ITEM INFORMATION--SUPPLEMENTARY MATERIAL (R) 19:05 thd 876 - ITEM INFORMATION--BASIC BIBLIOGRAPHIC UNIT (R) 19:05 thd 868 - TEXTUAL HOLDINGS--INDEXES (R) 19:05 thd 867 - TEXTUAL HOLDINGS--SUPPLEMENTARY MATERIAL (R) 19:05 thd 866 - TEXTUAL HOLDINGS--BASIC BIBLIOGRAPHIC UNIT (R) 19:05 thd 865 - ENUMERATION AND CHRONOLOGY--INDEXES (R) 19:05 thd 864 - ENUMERATION AND CHRONOLOGY--SUPPLEMENTARY MATERIAL (R) 19:05 thd 863 - ENUMERATION AND CHRONOLOGY--BASIC BIBLIOGRAPHIC UNIT (R) 19:05 thd 856 - ELECTRONIC LOCATION AND ACCESS (R) 19:05 thd 855 - CAPTIONS AND PATTERN--INDEXES (R) 19:05 thd 854 - CAPTIONS AND PATTERN--SUPPLEMENTARY MATERIAL (R) 19:04 thd 853 - CAPTIONS AND PATTERN--BASIC BIBLIOGRAPHIC UNIT (R) 19:04 thd 852 - LOCATION (R) 19:04 thd 850 - HOLDING INSTITUTION (R) 19:04 thd 845 - TERMS GOVERNING USE AND REPRODUCTION NOTE (R) 19:04 thd 844 - NAME OF UNIT (NR) 19:04 thd 843 - REPRODUCTION NOTE (R) 19:04 thd 842 - TEXTUAL PHYSICAL FORM DESIGNATOR (NR) 19:04 thd 841 - HOLDINGS CODED DATA VALUES (NR) 19:04 thd 583 - ACTION NOTE (R) 19:04 thd 563 - BINDING INFORMATION (R) 19:04 thd 562 - COPY AND VERSION IDENTIFICATION NOTE (R) 19:04 thd 561 - OWNERSHIP AND CUSTODIAL HISTORY (R) 19:04 thd 541 - IMMEDIATE SOURCE OF ACQUISITION NOTE (R) 19:04 thd kados ... 19:04 thd kados: perhaps about 25 fields 18:50 thd kados: some are more important than others 18:46 thd kados: quite a few fields 18:45 kados correct 18:44 thd ? 18:44 thd kados: do you mean full MARC holdings file not full MARC authorities file 18:44 kados of course, display is not a problem either 18:44 kados in terms of searching we have no problem 18:44 kados with zebra I don't think it matters 18:43 thd kados: changing the code to use a link would be more MARC like but may not be the most efficient 18:43 kados ie, link the itemnumber field to a field elsewhere in the record 18:43 kados and could we acomplish the same thing with a link? 18:42 kados how many fields would need to contain itemnumber? 18:42 kados 852, etc. 18:42 kados with MARC holdings 18:42 kados if we created a full MARC authorities file 18:41 thd yes 18:41 kados thd: so ... question 18:41 thd kados: do you think they observe the rules they establish for everyone internally? 18:40 thd kados: although WIPO might care very much about that 18:39 thd kados: the only thing that I remember having put in 952 that is not most likely to be useful is article '952', 's', 'Copyright article-fee code (similar to 018 $a, 852 $s)' 18:35 thd s/classification/organisation/ 18:35 thd kados: does LC do vanity classification codes for a special fee? :) 18:34 kados thd: that's it ... pretty cool, eh? 18:34 kados thd: 'ONe' :-) 18:34 thd kados: do you not have the code list bookmarked 18:34 kados thd: it's 'ONe' :-) 18:34 thd kados: no but classification codes in MARC 21 are all lower case 18:33 kados thd: do you know NPL's MARC ORG code? 18:33 kados :-) 18:33 kados ok so I'll call it NPL v1 18:32 thd kados: it allows classification searches to use information in the records to do an intelligent search 18:32 thd kados: no of course not but you have the system do it for them 18:32 kados and it doesn't really serve any purpose 18:31 kados they aren't really up to doing that :-) 18:31 thd kados: NPL's private scheme may not have a standard classification code but they can pretend if there is not one for generic local scheme 18:30 kados :-) 18:30 thd kados: kados has not seen nearly enough correctly encoded records 18:29 thd kados: the classification code and version number 18:29 kados the name of it? 18:29 kados specify what about it? 18:29 thd kados: anything that uses some other classification is supposed to specify the classification in $2 18:28 thd kados: indicators are used to specify if the call number is LCC, DDC, NLM. or SUDOC, not that Koha is providing access to the 952 indicator currently. 18:27 kados (btw: items.wthdrawn not items.withdrawn ... a minor misspelling in the framework due to a poorly named column name) 18:26 kados how so? 18:26 thd kados: it is necessary for designating the call number for fiction in the case of NPL. 18:26 kados some of these seem like they won't ever be used 18:25 kados is that really necessary? 18:25 kados INSERT INTO `marc_subfield_structure` VALUES ('952', '2', 'Source of classification or shelving scheme (similar to 852 $2)', 'Source of classification or shelving scheme', 0, 0, '', 10, '', '', '', NULL, 0, '', '', ''); 18:25 kados thd: got some questions 18:25 kados thd: looking at the framework right now 18:22 thd kados: if using multiple holdings fields is discovered to be too much work for 2.4 do you know of any problems using punctuation for subfields all in one items field? 18:20 thd kados: pierrick had also been working on that but he is no longer participating :( 18:19 kados :-) 18:19 thd kados: russ had been cleaning the whole thing so that you would not have made the mistake in the first place. 18:18 kados yep 18:18 thd kados: That way Pascal or whomever can make a French translation under /fr/ instead of /en/ 18:18 kados yea, russ is gonna fix that for me :-) 18:17 thd kados: the new namespace from devweek has en for English 18:16 thd kados: also, I have noticed that you have been using the old WIKI namespace 18:16 kados they do 18:16 thd kados: looking at http://wiki.koha.org/doku.php?id=zebrasearchingdefinitions#organization_of_materials. Does NPL not have full call numbers in 952 $k? 18:07 russ :-) 18:07 russ oops wrong channel 18:06 thd russ: I do not see philip logged in? 18:06 russ philip you there? 18:04 thd kados: no, having the national library of Turkey using Koha should be all to the good as long as the records can be shared without problems. 18:03 kados that wouldn't bode well for Koha :-) 18:02 kados :-) 18:01 thd kados: nothing like a new national authority file complete with encoding problems :) 18:00 thd kados: I think tumer has many records that he needs to find before his records including the problem ones become canonical for Turkey 17:58 kados yes, given enough time to troubleshoot 17:58 thd kados: really, would it also work for Afognak double encoding, and other similar problems that you have seen? 17:57 kados thd: it just needs to be updated a bit to deal with these specific probs 17:57 kados thd: I've got one 17:55 thd kados: If you had a script that searched for encoding problems you could concentrate on upgrading those records. 17:54 kados right 17:54 thd kados: so you did not worry about the issue for NPL because NPL had relatively little MARC 8 data? 17:54 kados thd: because they had marc-8 data that was interpreted as latin1 data and I think it's been completely mangled in some cases :-) 17:53 kados thd: for NPL it's hopeless 17:53 kados thd: it's more a 'how to migrate from mysql 4.0 to 4.1' problem 17:53 kados thd: not yet 17:53 thd kados: have you solved the problem of migrating a rel_2_2 installation with UTF-8 data? 17:41 chris :-) 17:40 kados even if I know it's not a stable release :-) 17:40 kados nothing like a release to make you feel like you've acomplished something in a day :-) 17:37 kados yea 17:37 chris yep i figure ppl will be asking questions sooner or later 17:37 kados that need to be moved to the config file 17:37 kados and there are some hard-coded things still 17:37 chris :) 17:37 kados it's no walk in the park :-) 17:37 kados yep 17:37 chris so i have an understanding, then ill try out the automatic way 17:36 kados cool 17:36 chris ill have a go by hand first 17:36 kados yea 17:36 chris but if i follow your docs on the wiki it should work eh? 17:36 kados chris: but I can send you a tarbal of my migration stuff 17:36 kados chris: I haven't touched the installation scripts yet 17:36 kados russ: be my guest :-) 17:36 chris ill have a go with 2.3 after work, on my koha at home 17:36 kados russ: sure 17:35 russ kados - can we move those wiki notes into the en section? 17:35 kados yea I agree 17:35 chris i think linking to the file and having good text around the link is the way to go 17:35 kados yea :-) 17:35 chris but then you also have to click 54 times to actually download the file 17:34 chris yep 17:34 kados names and such like on sourceforge 17:34 kados too bad you can't put text in the list 17:33 chris probably the best bet 17:33 kados ie, not the file list? 17:33 russ two minutes 17:33 kados can't we just link directly to the download ? 17:33 chris and grab it cos its newer 17:33 chris and see 2.3.0 sitting there 17:33 kados yea ... 2.2.5 is still good I think 17:32 chris otherwise they will click on the 2.2.5 link 17:32 kados so I'm not sure just how much news we want to generate :-) 17:32 kados but I plan on doing 2.3.1 in a day or two 17:32 kados definitely 17:32 chris to make sure ppl know that 2.3.0 is unstable 17:32 chris http://koha.org/download/ <-- should we write something here 17:32 kados russ: probably not newsworthy in a general sense 17:32 chris on savannah 17:31 russ news item ? where? 17:31 kados http://download.savannah.nongnu.org/releases/koha/ 17:31 chris excellent 17:31 kados and I did a news item on it 17:31 kados yea, it's uploaded 17:27 chris is half an hour up yet? :-) 16:37 chris :) 16:30 kados k, I can handle that 16:30 chris so we need a gpg key 16:30 chris https://savannah.gnu.org/faq/?group_id=5802&question=Download_Area_-_How_do_I_add_files.txt 16:28 kados that's pretty simple 16:28 kados I've done news before 16:28 kados yea 16:28 chris for on that page 16:28 chris https://savannah.nongnu.org/projects/koha/ 16:28 chris then write some release notes for the news bit 16:28 kados ahh 16:27 kados their searches suck 16:27 chris i think you just have to stick it in here, somehow 16:27 chris http://download.savannah.nongnu.org/releases/koha/ 16:27 chris hmm maybe not 16:25 chris but it should be similair to sourceforge 16:25 chris i havent done a savannah one before 16:25 chris hmm lemme look 16:24 chris you will have to go to savannah and do the release thingy 16:24 kados :-) 16:24 chris its not that cool :-) 16:24 chris no 16:24 chris sweet 16:24 kados is it also on savannah? 16:24 kados ok, the tarbal is in my dir now 16:24 kados yea, I browsed some books at B&N last week about ruby 16:24 kados cool 16:23 chris kados: that blog is my first real play with ruby on rails 16:23 kados well here it comes :-) 16:23 chris yes 16:23 kados I'm guessing Y 16:23 kados Would you like to tag the CVS repository? 16:23 chris so its really good writing new big chunks of code 16:22 chris and you get a list of variables you have already used 16:22 chris plus you type $ 16:22 kados sweet 16:22 chris {} etc 16:22 chris ie you type " and it does the matching " 16:22 kados cool 16:22 chris make it pretty cool 16:22 chris the syntax highlighting, and completion ... plus cvs integration 16:21 kados will do 16:21 chris id encourage you to take a look at eclipse sometime .. with the epic plugin 16:21 kados nice new website chris :-) 16:21 kados neat 16:20 chris http://www.bigballofwax.co.nz/blog/articles/2006/07/11/eclipse-ide 16:20 chris hmm interesting synchronicity 16:19 kados k 16:19 chris but is probably safest 16:19 chris doesnt have to be 16:19 kados chris: should it be a fresh check out? 16:18 chris (making sure you are in the dev week checkout of course :-)) 16:18 chris so if you are in the base .. then the guess will be right 16:18 chris it makes a good guess 16:18 chris it should ask you 16:18 kados ok 16:18 kados yea 16:18 kados perl misc/buildrelease 16:18 chris perl misc/buildrelease 16:17 chris sorry prolly need 16:17 chris in= ie 16:17 chris in ./misc/buildrelease 16:17 chris id run it from the base 16:16 kados chris: and from a specific directory? 16:16 kados chris: any specific way I should run it? 16:14 kados I'll give it a shot then 16:14 chris misc/buildrelease 16:14 kados sweet 16:14 chris looks like its all set up for savannah yep 16:12 chris lemme check 16:12 chris hmm did i commit my fixes to the script to dev_week? 16:11 kados cool 16:11 chris if you tell it to 16:11 kados so when I run the script will it show up on savannah? 16:11 kados ok 16:11 kados no sense making it more complicated 16:11 chris thats what id do, and use the script to tag the files as 2.3.0 16:11 kados ok, I"ll just do that then 16:10 kados poorly named, but fine 16:10 chris yep 16:10 kados I suppose I can just use dev_week for that 16:10 kados is to have a branch that will become 2.4.0 16:10 kados what I think I want 16:10 kados well ... 16:09 chris depends on what you want to do 16:09 chris so at any point you can check out those files using that that tag 16:09 chris tags up the files when you make a release 16:09 kados hmmm 16:09 chris thats what the script taht creates the tarball does 16:09 chris not branch .. but then youd still be working in the dev_week branch 16:08 chris you could just tag it 16:08 kados k 16:08 chris doesnt hurt kados 16:08 chris nothing, thats pretty much the point of version control 16:08 thd chris: what can be deleted in CVS? 16:08 chris you'll just be branching a new branch at that point 16:07 kados ahh 16:07 chris nope, you cant delete tags 16:07 kados can I then delete dev_week tag? 16:07 chris then cvs tag -b branchname 16:06 thd kados chris: at the time I switched to testing I could net get the updated applications I needed from backports. I should have been more patient. 16:05 kados thd: yes 16:05 thd kados: what is 2.3 as distinct from 2.4? Isa it the unstable version of 2.4? 16:04 chris do a clean checkout of dev_week 16:04 dewey easiest way is to try 16:04 chris easiest way 16:04 chris its pretty easy 16:04 kados chris: if that's possible and you have time to show me how :-) 16:04 kados chris: and I'd like to re-tag dev_week as rel_2_4 16:03 kados chris: I'm ready to do a 2.3.0 release 16:03 chris morning 16:03 kados hey chris 16:03 kados thd: backports.org 16:03 kados thd: yes 16:03 thd chris: is there a backport of MySQL for upgrading that library? 16:02 chris thats what backports are for :) 16:02 thd kados: it was issues like that which drove me to switch to Debian testing much to my later regret. 16:01 thd kados: Debian stable may be at a special disadvantage with the out of date MySQL libraries that do not understand UTF-8. 16:01 thd kados: obviously, many uses of Encode::decode are needed for encoding where that can work. 16:01 thd kados: other problems like encoding rely on external software libraries that you cannot have time to rewrite yourself if they do not work. 16:00 thd kados: some problems are amazingly simple to solve if you look at them closely. 15:48 kados :-) 15:48 kados thd: maybe 15:47 thd kados: you had said that tumer was going to do that for 3.0 does tumer have an idea? 15:47 kados thd: no 15:45 thd kados: do you have a good concept of how much work that would be to fix on top of encoding? 15:44 kados it's hard to decide what is best in this case 15:43 kados thd: I didn't understand the issues fully 15:41 thd kados: well you were proposing to do that for 3.0 not 2.4 a few minutes ago. 15:40 kados thd: so I suppose we should create holdings based on more than one field 15:39 thd for standard MARC 21. 15:39 thd kados: yes exactly but if acquisitions cost is associated with an item and not only in SQL then you need it stored in MARC which means that you need more than one field. 15:38 kados thd: we are no longer limited to searching/seeing data in the koha tables 15:37 kados thd: with zebra we can still see that data 15:37 thd kados: do you not want to know what your items cost? 15:37 kados I see no reason to map cost to items at all 15:36 thd kados: nothing about acquisitions is in 852 15:36 kados but we aren't limited to using the items table now 15:36 thd kados: but Koha has them both in the items table 15:36 kados in standard MARC 15:36 kados ahh, but they aren't in 852 15:36 kados cost and replacementcost 15:36 kados Koha does too 15:35 thd kados: Koha also needs to distinguish different types of cost which MARC stores yet again in other locations acquisitions cost from replacement cost 15:35 kados I see 15:33 thd kados: you need to be able to distinguish between 852 $c shelving location and 876 $c cost 15:32 thd kados: because standard MARC needs 852 and 876-8 not just 852. 15:30 kados hmmm 15:29 thd s/biblioitems/items/ 15:29 thd kados: wherever there is code that falls down when biblioitems.itemnumber is linked to multiple fields. 15:27 kados thd: what code is needed? 15:27 kados thd: code meaning the editor? 15:27 thd kados: you have a fully defined framework but you do not have code allowing the use of more than one field for holdings. 15:25 kados other than a fully defined framework 15:25 kados I'm not sure what is preventing us now from being completely compliant with MARC Holdings 15:25 kados thd: I don't think it matters if they are all mapped to 852 15:23 thd by subfield names I mean $a $b etc. 15:23 thd kados: 952 as I defined it is basically 852 combined with 876-8 with a few minor additions and omissions. Obviously, the subfield names cannot match perfectly so I wrote the verbose librarian text to keep everything straight. 15:17 thd kados: 852 has a very few things which I did not map to 952 such as the address of the library 15:14 thd kados: those are all mapped to existing Koha items columns and are not in 852 15:13 thd kados: 876 has some additional medium or long term status indications, where purchased, for how much, replacement price etc. 15:11 kados right 15:11 kados tumer is removing that limitation for 3.0 15:11 thd kados: which is why it had filled all th letters and numbers when you looked 15:10 kados hmmm 15:10 thd kados: the problem is that they map to 852, 876-8 and a few others including one or two that are no part of standard MARC. 15:08 thd kados: the best I have then is what I recommended for 85k in the framework comments with the addition of punctuation symbols for status etc. 15:08 kados thd: you mean that not all koha item fields map to standard 852? 15:07 kados thd: too many components rely on aA equivilence 15:07 thd kados: otherwise you would need to remove standard subfields from MARC 21 to use 852 15:07 kados thd: no 15:06 thd kados: would you change the data type as needed to allow capital letters for the subfields for 2.4. ? 15:04 thd kados: so 3.0 could work with the needed code changes but there is not enough room in 852 for everything needed unless you can use capital letters for the subfields 15:02 kados thd: for 3.0 I mean a really standard one with multiple fields for holdings 15:02 kados thd: well ... for 2.4 I mean just 852 15:02 thd kados: do you mean with multiple fields for the holdings instead of everything in one field? 15:01 thd kados: oh you mean really standard 15:00 kados thd: and link holdings records to bib records 15:00 kados thd: I think we could create a holdings framework 14:59 thd kados: my recommendation is just like what I had specified for 952 except that their is a greater alignment between MARC 21 subfield names and what I specified. 14:58 thd kados: It cannot be really standard unless you change all the code that needs one and only one MARC field defined for holdings. 14:56 kados thd: does it include call number goodness? 14:56 kados thd: add the onloan stuff 14:56 kados thd: perhaps I'll just pull that out then 14:56 kados ahh 14:56 thd kados: I did write a more standard MARC holdings framework in the recommendations comment within the standard MARC 21 framework 14:55 kados thd: to make it easier for customization (ie, a smaller file) 14:55 kados thd: from the standard MARC framework 14:55 kados thd: I've been thinking it might be useful to separate the holdings definitions 14:54 thd kados: there are not enough lowercase letters and numbers and punctuation to hold all the predefined or reserved 852 subfields in addition to things that are not in 852 such as the things in 876-878 14:54 kados thd: have you considered writing a 'standaard MARC holdings' framework? 14:54 kados thd: how many items do we need to track? 14:50 kados capital letters-- 14:50 thd kados: 852 $A $B etc. 14:50 kados capital letters-- 14:49 thd kados: another reason would be that you do not have enough subfields for everything that you need to track in one field unless you use capital letters. 14:48 kados thd: given a proper framework 14:48 kados thd: rebuildnonmarc can fix that up 14:48 thd kados: well one reason for continuing to use a Koha specific items field is that you have the data in the wrong locations in existing records 14:47 kados thd: with zebra? 14:47 kados thd: but why do we need to parse it at all? 14:46 thd kados: I already have most of the code for parsing that neatly written for you n Perl 14:46 kados it occurs to me to ask why we're trying to map 852 to 952 14:45 kados that's a lot to parse 14:45 kados hmmm 14:44 thd kados: 952 $t would come from 852 $t only from previous records of the same library. 14:43 thd kados: 952 $m is seldom used but would come from 852 $m only from previous records of the same library. 14:42 thd kados: 952 $i would come from either 082 $b, 092, 055 $b, or 852 $i depending on what was filled except that libraries may have their own preferred cuttering scheme and the supplied item part of the number may not be unique in the library's own collection. 14:38 thd kados: 055 and 852 should be tested for having the correct indicators or the correct number type when indicators were not set. 14:37 thd kados: 952 $h would come from either 082 $a, 092, 055 $a, or 852 $h depending on what was filled. 14:34 thd kados: so 952 $o could be filled from the values contained in 942 $c for NPL. 14:32 thd kados: in the current MARC 21 framework that is 952 $o $h $i $t 14:30 thd kados: spine labels should be 852 $k $h $i $m with the addition of c. $t where $t > 1 . 14:28 thd kados: the 852 $h $i tend to be more standard than 852 $k and $m which depends on how the library wants to organise its collection 14:27 kados right ... any suggestions on that? 14:26 thd kados: and then there is the need to economise the space on the small spine label. 14:26 kados :-) 14:25 thd kados: yet English language usage provides FIC more usually as opposed to FICT, REF as opposed to REFE, etc. 14:24 thd kados: oh you were saying it was not consistent. Each library has to apply the basic intent to its own needs. 14:22 thd kados: amazing how far a little cultural conformism will go to address the same problem in the same manner 14:21 kados which turns out not to be very consistant :-) 14:21 thd kados: material types have multiple standards 14:21 thd kados: no just common practise 14:20 kados is there a standard that defines them somewhere? 14:20 kados right 14:19 thd kados: those are item types of some sort but not a true material type 14:18 thd kados: 852 $k is usually something like JUV, REF, FIC, etc. at most libraries 14:17 thd kados: yes but that is way in which NPL is using the itemtypes that it has defined 14:16 kados from fields in the MARc 14:16 kados but they do generate spine labels 14:16 kados they aren't 14:16 thd kados: I thought that NPL was not yet using Koha for spine labels 14:16 kados not the call number 14:16 kados but that's the itemtype 14:15 thd kados: so you should fill 852 $o in the current standard MARC 21 framework with the contents of 942 $c 14:15 kados afaik the spine labels are coming from a value mapped to callnumber 14:15 kados but 942 $c is not where the spine labels are printed from 14:15 kados yep 14:14 thd s/our/your/ 14:13 thd kados: all our libraries do the same as far as I know 14:13 kados right 14:13 thd owen kados: NPL uses biblioitems.itemtype stored in 942 $c as the equivalent of 852 $k 14:11 owen biblioitems.itemtype 14:11 kados right 14:10 thd kados: you were correct originally you should revert to the previous version in the wiki 14:10 owen Yes 14:09 thd owen: do the item type codes that you use appear on the spine labels? 14:08 thd kados: I think that you had it correct previously it was 942 $c 14:07 owen Our current production database doesn't store anything in items.location. 14:06 thd owen: the MARC location defined in the framework used originally by NPL to store the contents of `items.location` 14:04 thd kados: then they are using that for 852 $k 14:04 owen Sorry, what? What's 952 $c? 14:04 kados owen: right? 14:04 kados yes 14:01 thd kados: do they have the values in 952 $c on their spine labels? 13:58 kados fixed 13:57 kados thd: it should read 952$c 13:57 kados thd: that is my mistake 13:56 thd kados: it seems as if they are using 942$c for the equivalent of $852 $k call number prefix 13:52 kados thd: I could use some expansion on what I've written to more accurately describe the components of collection organization 13:52 kados thd: the 'organization of materials' section is most relevant 13:51 kados thd: I think it would also be useful in this case 13:51 kados thd: this is a document I wrote for NPL to help them clearly define their cataloging practices 13:51 thd kados: I provided all those in 952 in the framework 13:51 kados thd: http://wiki.koha.org/doku.php?id=zebrasearchingdefinitions 13:50 thd kados: MARC has provided 852 $k $h $i $m 13:48 thd kados: it does not need to be in the SQL tables 13:47 kados (or inventory) 13:47 kados thd: the only reason for it to be in the koha tables with zebra is if it is used by the system in managing the collection somehow (like circ rules) 13:46 thd kados: call numbers are numbers of which the classification element is only one part 13:46 kados thd: because with zebra, we don't need it to be in the koha tables to search or display it 13:46 kados thd: fill it with values coming from the MARC? 13:46 thd kados: the objective is to fill the call number by the library's preference 13:45 kados do we need to distinguish between call numbers and classification? 13:45 kados to search and display call numbers correctly right? 13:45 thd kados: you could define the standard locations in advance but they are multiple 13:45 kados so what is our objective? 13:44 kados hmmm 13:44 thd kados: the bibliographic framework should not be the place to define whether the library prefers DDC, UDC, LCC, etc. should it. 13:44 kados thd: what I mean is that each library will have to define that part of their framework 13:43 thd kados: the type of classification that a library is using is up to the library and cannot be defined for all libraries 13:42 kados thd: ie, the mappings would define it for us 13:41 thd kados: we could add a column to the framework to specify which locations are good for identifying particular parts of a call number. 13:41 kados thd: define the type of classification being used 13:40 thd kados: define what in the framework? 13:39 kados couldn't we just define it in the framework instead of a preference? 13:39 thd kados: mere classification is unknown because there are many different classifications and MARC never has one and only one place to hide a given classification. 13:39 kados hmmm 13:37 thd kados: to remind you we need a preference for call number type LCC, DDC, UDC, etc. and a preference for cutter type and rule and a preference for secondary classification defined by an exception list such as material type specifying fiction. 13:35 kados and define local call number as either classification or call number depending on whether it's fiction or non-fiction 13:34 kados and local call number 13:34 kados if we distinguish between classification and call number 13:34 kados it can be achieved with minimal coding 13:34 kados well ... not necessarily 13:32 thd kados: however, there is no code for what we had discussed previously for the case where NPL needs a couple of system preferences for treating fiction differently etc. 13:31 thd yes 13:30 kados in perl? 13:30 thd kados: I have code for filling the various call number parts for use in labels etc. 13:28 kados perhaps :-) 13:26 thd kados: I think that had been your request at one time 13:26 kados thd: it's set to mandatory in the framework I believe 13:25 thd kados: I never set it to mandatory except by request 13:25 kados thd: but I agree we need a method to alert if a field hasn't been filled in but let the cataloger proceed 13:25 kados thd: also, barcode should not be a mandatory field 13:25 thd kados: do you think that we might run out of punctuation symbols? 13:24 kados yes, I understand that 13:24 kados :-) 13:24 thd kados: the descriptions were written to not confuse me :) 13:23 kados another status 13:23 kados paidfor 13:23 thd kados: those are already mapped except for binding 13:23 kados thd: so that a librarian is not confused :-) 13:23 kados thd: we also need to clean up the descriptive language of the item labels 13:22 kados notforloan, itemlost, wthdrawn,binding I think 13:22 thd kados: how many are they? 13:22 thd kados: what are all of the statuses? 13:22 kados because then we can search on it 13:22 kados the more we can store in zebra the better 13:22 kados datelastseen, etc. 13:21 kados things like datelastborrowed would be useful too 13:21 kados thd: all of the statuses need to be mapped 13:21 kados thd: that may include adding a column to items (fine by me) 13:21 kados thd: we need to come up with a scheme for call number 13:20 kados thd: items fields mainly 13:20 kados well ... 13:20 thd kados: what do you want to map in a good mapping scheme? 13:19 thd kados: I thought you added date because things were not working. Not that they worked afterwards. 13:18 kados date is in issues, not in items 13:18 thd kados: did you not need another for date? 13:18 kados thd: I could use your advice on a good mapping scheme 13:18 kados yes, that's the only one 13:17 kados ahh 13:16 thd kados: items.onloan etc linked to 952 $X? 13:15 kados linking? 13:15 thd ? 13:15 thd kados: did you link only 2 yesterday 13:15 kados ? 13:14 thd kados: what Koha SQL columns need linking to the bibliographic framework for 2.2.4? 13:13 thd kados: I would need to have much more time than I have to fix my local mail system again to solve that quota problem 13:11 kados ahh 13:10 thd kados: I had to avoid overfilling an email quota with commits so I do not see them in real time. 13:10 kados thd: didn't you see the 40+ commits this morning? :-) 13:09 kados thd: dev-week is now completely in sync with rel_2_2 except without the MARC editor bugs :-) 13:09 kados thd: yes 13:09 thd kados: you have updated devel-week since it was not working yesterday? 13:08 kados thd: dev-week for sure 13:08 kados thd: it is now working in dev-week and rel_2_2 afaik 13:07 thd kados: only on the Liblime server? 13:06 thd kados: where is the working editor code if it is not in devel-week? 13:06 kados thd: great! 13:06 thd kados: works nicely now 12:59 thd goody 12:59 kados thd: and it's commited 12:59 kados thd: afognak has the fix 12:59 thd kados: is the fix committed or where can I test the fix 12:58 kados thd: 1106 is fixed 12:54 kados (not that interesting to you :-) 12:53 kados but if not I'll certainly have a look 12:53 kados I think that's fixed in devweek 12:53 kados yea 12:52 owen Did you see the issues with "you did not specify any search criteria" with sorted search results? 12:41 kados marc8->latin1->latin1->latin1 :) 12:40 kados I suspect these are triple or even quadrupal encoded 12:40 kados http://zoomopac.liblime.com/cgi-bin/koha/opac-MARCdetail.pl?bib=49201 12:35 kados let me know if you need more 12:34 kados ok, well now you've got access to the koha-tmpl dir 12:34 owen I don't know 12:34 kados (to upload changes? 12:34 kados (do you need write access to more than just the template files? 12:33 kados cuz that's what's up on zoomopac 12:33 kados as far as maintenance goes, are you using a fresh copy of the dev-week code? 12:33 kados so ... 12:32 owen Just have to resize the form field a little 12:31 kados owen: which I assume is win98 or 2000 12:31 kados owen: it looked the same way on the circ computer at the plains 12:31 kados owen: that _is_ firefox :-) 12:30 owen Wow, kados, that's remarkably different than Firefox's rendering. 12:28 owen I think yes to skipping the faceted searches, in the interests of time 12:26 kados owen: check your inbox 12:24 kados I'll send you a screenshot 12:23 owen Only the simple search is a little squeezed, but that's just the big form field. 12:23 owen Both look okay to me 12:23 kados the search form I think 12:23 owen Was that issue with the search form or the results? 12:23 kados the faceted searches we're going to skip I think, right? 12:23 kados anything else? 12:22 kados the 800 x 600 thing 12:22 kados so as far as the OPAC goes ... 12:22 kados right 12:21 owen Yesterday as far as we got was, "needs to fit 800x600" monitor 12:20 kados so ... where shall we start? 12:19 kados owen: ok, I'm back :-) 12:19 kados phone ringing off the hook 12:19 kados sheesh