Time Nick Message 11:44 kados bye even :-) 11:44 kados mye paul 11:43 paul bye bye world 11:39 paul yes, but not for instance, as I must leave now (7PM soon) 11:39 kados after changing to 8859-15 in TemplateEncoding var? 11:39 paul but the only diff between them is the ¤ symbol 11:38 kados could you try latest rel_2_2 marc edits of existing data in emn fo r instance? 11:38 paul 8859-1 has been transformed to -15 when EU switches to ¤ 11:38 kados I thought it was 8859-1 11:38 kados maybe it already works perfectly 11:38 kados ahh, well that would explain something 11:37 paul but the only diff is the ¤ 11:37 paul except it's iso8859-15 and not -1 11:37 paul yes. 11:36 kados s /if utfU// 11:36 kados if utf? 11:35 kados ie, if 8859-1, only 8859-1 11:35 kados and will not permit mixed encoding 11:35 kados it will only allow storage of utf-8 and iso-8859 11:35 kados paul: do we agree that Koha will support handling MARC-8, iso-8859, utf-8 11:34 kados paul: so re: encoding 11:31 kados great! 11:31 paul waiting for confirmation 11:31 paul ok, opencataloger registered at gna.org 11:29 kados paul: sounds good 11:29 paul ok, so let's start with opencataloger then 11:29 kados paul: whereas I own opencataloger.org/com 11:29 paul opencat seems to be something for google 11:29 kados paul: opencat.org is taken 11:28 kados paul: wait 11:28 kados paul: ok, lets use it then 11:28 paul I don't think so 11:28 kados paul: is OpenCat taken? 11:27 paul kados: do we call our project OpenCat, OpenCataloger or OpenCataloguer ? 11:10 kados but we want to avoid Encode completely I think 11:09 kados I'll check 11:09 paul perldoc Encode don't give you a hint here ? 11:07 kados but I"m not sure how to do this yet 11:07 kados so I need need to tell Perl that the data in the $xml variable /is not utf8/ 11:07 kados /Perl/ thinks is utf-8. In other words, perl is mangling the data going into the parser, possibly turning it into valid, correct UTF8, but the parser has been told that this is /not/ in fact UTF8, but ISO 11:06 kados is that Perl is handing the XML parser 11:06 kados what I think is happening 11:06 kados paul: I'll give you an update 11:06 kados paul: (before you leave) 11:06 kados paul: about encoding probs 11:05 kados pierrick: have a great weekend :-) 11:05 pierrick I'm leaving office now, I'll continue my headache on zebra on tuesday :-) 11:04 kados and compaare 11:04 kados then do the above 11:04 kados then install zebra plugin 11:04 kados select count(*) from biblio; 11:04 kados but it would be very interesting to do 11:04 kados which looks at least in the 'ballpark' :-) 11:04 kados <commonInfo><dateAdded>20060401200734</dateAdded><dateChanged>20060402182248</dateChanged><languageCode>EN</languageCode></commonInfo><accessInfo><unitSystems><string>ISO</string></unitSystems><attributeSetIds><oid>1.2.840.10003.3.5</oid><oid>1.2.840.10003.3.1</oid></attributeSetIds></accessInfo><name>kohaplugin</name><userFee>0</userFee><available>1</available><recordCount><recordCountActual>148636</recordCountActual></recordCount><zebraInfo><recordBytes>133463477</ 11:03 kados <explain><databaseInfo>DatabaseInfo 11:03 kados [IR-Explain-1]Record type: XML 11:03 kados Records: 1 11:03 kados Sent presentRequest (1+1). 11:03 kados I get: 11:03 paul a phpYazAdmin would be something useful ;-) 11:02 kados cool 11:02 paul (my question & sebastian hammer answer) 11:02 paul You can also ask for targetInfo, AttributeSetInfo (per database, as before), and possibly other things.. 11:02 paul The contents should be self-explanatory. 11:02 paul Z> f @and @attr exp1 1=1 databaseInfo @attr exp1 1=3 myDatabaseName 11:02 paul You can retrieve information about a specific database name like this: 11:02 paul The XML representation of Explain records is private to Zebra, but much easier to handle than the more standard alternatives. 11:02 paul etc. 11:02 paul Z> show 1 11:02 paul Z> form xml 11:02 paul Z> find @attr exp1 1=1 databaseInfo 11:02 paul % yaz-client host:port/IR-Explain-1 11:02 paul You can get some info like that out of Zebra by searching the Explain database... Using the YAZ client: 11:02 paul > something like the number of record in the DB, and other related infos ? 11:02 paul > Is there a tool to have some infos on a zebra DB. 11:02 paul > 11:02 paul > Hi, 11:02 paul Paul POULAIN wrote: 11:02 paul jan,9th 11:00 paul it was something strange & long 11:00 paul iirc, I asked indexdata ml, and got an answer. 11:00 kados I'm interested too :-) 10:59 kados maybe ask koha-zebra? 10:59 kados not sure 10:59 pierrick kados, how do I "select count(*) from zebra" ? 10:58 pierrick I have 10K biblio 10:57 pierrick if it did, we would have a big problem for Koha 3.0 conversion to utf8 10:56 pierrick no that doesn't 10:56 kados sorry :-) 10:56 kados but that doesn't make sense 10:56 kados I mean do the select count(*) before converting to utf8 10:56 kados it just exports it :-) 10:56 kados no, it shouldn't 10:56 pierrick did the export deleted my biblio ???? 10:55 pierrick I didn't 10:55 pierrick what is a normal weight for a isoXXX export ? 10:55 kados before and after? 10:55 kados pierrick: did you do 'select count(*) from biblio' 10:55 kados weird 10:54 pierrick no, I reversed and my export is still 0.2MB :-/ I really don't understand all this thing :-/ 10:54 kados pierrick: export.pl in 2.2 I think 10:52 pierrick wait... I made a mistake in the utf8 conversion procedure 10:47 pierrick should I use export.pl in 2.2 or HEAD ? 10:45 kados that can't be good 10:45 pierrick (it was 6MB before and now it's 0.2MB) 10:44 pierrick I've converted my marc_subfield_table to utf8 and now my export is very small 10:44 kados ahh 10:43 pierrick OK, in fact my problem seems to be my export 10:42 kados which deletes everything 10:42 kados zebraidx init 10:42 kados you have to go: 10:42 kados drop doesn't work in zebra 10:42 pierrick I had encoding problem in what was displayed 10:41 pierrick drop/create 10:41 kados recreation? 10:41 pierrick kados, it seem I can't update my zebra database after recreation 10:38 kados pierrick: could you explain? 10:14 slef never mind hosting services, you have your own webspace, you have git/cogito, host it yourself 10:13 pierrick kados, zebra has worked but I should not have tried to solve the encoding problems... nothing work anymore 09:51 kados bug report created 09:50 kados paul: email was: Apr 12 Joshua Ferraro ( 23) [Koha-devel] Bug in MARC sync in rel_2_2 09:49 kados paul: I will file a bug report and mark it as blocker 09:49 kados paul: it seems that Koha never deletes old holdings entries from marc_word 09:48 paul kados: not yet 09:48 kados paul: on koha-devel 09:48 thd kados: freedom is better than openness any day 09:48 pierrick it took less than a day to register PEM on gna.org 09:48 kados paul: did you see my mention of a bug in syncing between koha tables and marc tables? 09:47 kados you can decide 09:46 kados I'm ok with whatever 09:46 kados the nerv! 09:46 kados but requested I change the name to freencip :-) 09:46 paul ok, then maybe another OSS platform ? 09:46 kados a month later they accepted openncip 09:46 kados eventually I gave up and went to sourceforge 09:46 kados I tried to register openncip there 09:46 kados I'll warn you that savannah takes forever to register a project 09:45 kados yep 09:45 paul x2 ? 09:45 kados paul: sure 09:45 paul maybe it could be a good idea to play with subvestion with openCat ? 09:44 paul do we create a openCat project on savannah ? 09:44 kados great! 09:44 paul he seems confident with XUL now ! 09:44 paul ToinS is writing a document to explain what he will work on, and how. 09:44 kados paul: sure 09:43 pierrick so, do I add something to Makefile.PL? (on rel_2_2) 09:43 paul kados: a quick question about openCataloger 09:42 kados yea 09:42 pierrick so my sentence is useless, just to say I think "we are playing with fire" 09:41 kados right, but MARC::* isn't like Koha, their HEAD almost always works 09:41 pierrick kados, it seems we have no choice if we want zebra working 09:41 pierrick using the HEAD CVS is dangerous 09:41 kados how so? 09:41 pierrick MARC::* 09:41 kados what's unstable? 09:40 kados slef: and a MARC::File::XML that hasn't been written yet :-) 09:39 kados slef: but 2.4 does require very latest MARC::* 09:39 pierrick oups 09:39 kados pierrick: but it does need yaz 09:39 kados slef: otherwise, it doesn't need the very latest 09:39 slef standard 2.4 09:39 kados slef: if you use zebra, it needs the very latest 09:39 pierrick standard 2.4 doesn't need zebra 09:39 kados slef: depends on if you use the zebra plugin or not 09:38 slef how about 2.4? what libyaz does that need? 09:38 kados slef: similar but different to the ones we discussed today 09:38 kados slef: we still have major encoding troubles 09:38 paul as there are still some major bugs. 09:38 kados slef: well, not quite 09:38 kados paul: good :-0 I was beginning to worry :-) 09:38 slef as in, does it work today? ;-) 09:38 kados slef: yep 09:38 paul kados : no, of course. 09:38 slef could I just set everything to today's versions? 09:37 kados paul: still aiming for the 18th for release date? 09:37 kados hi paul 09:37 kados thx 09:37 pierrick OK 09:36 kados pierrick: could you do it? 09:36 kados I don't have time to track everything down 09:36 slef it really would help me get the installer working 09:36 slef can you add them to koha/Makefile.PL in CVS instead then, please? 09:36 pierrick kados, the latest version of zebra available on indexdata site is 1.3.34 09:36 kados esp with all the work being done on MARC::* 09:36 kados on like a weekly basis 09:36 kados well, it keeps changing 09:35 kados yep 09:35 slef can you add the versions needed to http://www.kohadocs.org/Installing_Koha_on_Debian_sarge.html please? 09:35 pierrick 2.1.16 09:35 kados the very latest :-) 09:35 slef what do we need? 09:35 slef libyaz-dev 2.1.8 09:34 slef I'd upload libperl-marc-* if someone has time to build them, or you can wait for me to remember how perl debs work. 09:34 kados yea, but libyaz-dev what version? 09:34 slef libyaz-dev seems to be there 09:33 kados completely unmaintained to my knowledge 09:32 slef what's the current state of koha support modules debian packages? 09:30 kados k ... thanks :-) 09:30 slef bah, I'm going to have to leave this and get back to work 09:29 kados slef: yea, on the sourceforge page you can nab it 09:29 kados pierrick: I'll tell stephen to add it 09:28 slef uh, isn't there a tarball of marcpm? 09:28 kados pierrick: it's not there? 09:28 pierrick kados, could you add the instruction "run # zebrasrv localhost:2100/kohaplugin" in your documentation ? 09:28 kados no kidding 09:27 slef this installation sucks atm 09:26 kados slef: cvs listed there 09:26 kados slef: http://www.kohadocs.org/Installing_Koha_on_Debian_sarge.html 09:25 kados slef: to work with unicode with MARC::* you need to grab the sourceforge versions 09:25 kados slef: unfortunately, the cpan version of MARC::* don't support unicode 09:25 kados use Encode qw /WARN_ON_ERR/ 09:25 kados at one point I tried 09:24 kados if (Encode::decode_utf8($marcrecord)) { 09:24 kados I did: 09:24 kados utf8 "\xEC" does not map to Unicode at /usr/local/lib/perl/5.8.4/Encode.pm line 167, <INFILE> line 171. 09:22 slef if that still works, I'll write something 09:22 kados k 09:22 slef may need to use Encode 'decode_utf8'; too - I forget. 09:21 slef if (decode_utf8($marcrecord)) 09:21 kados utf8 "\xEC" does not map to Unicode at /usr/local/lib/perl/5.8.4/Encode.pm line 167, <INFILE> line 171. 09:21 slef replace the eval with 09:21 kados slef: so line 171 has a non-mapping character in it 09:20 kados same end result 09:20 kados line 09:20 kados yea, but I've tried with and without that lie 09:20 kados utf8 "\xEC" does not map to Unicode 09:20 slef MARC::Charset->assume_unicode(1); 09:20 kados record 171 throws: 09:20 slef as you say 09:20 kados slef: if you comment out the first eval 09:20 slef $record = MARC::File::USMARC->decode($marcrecord); # or warn "not this record\n"; 09:20 slef I think you need to test and encode before 09:19 kados grrr 09:19 kados it seems to be working now 09:18 kados I think i was wrong about that reading problem 09:18 kados hmm 09:18 slef or at least not MARC/File/XML 09:18 kados ahh 09:18 slef no, I commented all the MARC stuff as the ramfs box hasn't got MARC::* installed 09:18 kados hmmm 09:18 kados maybe not though 09:18 kados slef: that's probably because of the eval 09:18 kados slef: meaning you get all the way through the file? 09:17 slef kados: the data reading part works OK here. 09:17 kados slef: sure 09:17 slef kados: ok, ready for an annoying thing? 09:17 kados pierrick: great! 09:17 pierrick kados, zebra plugin is working on my 2.2 :-) 09:17 kados thd: sorry about that 09:17 kados thd: no, I was incorrect about that record 09:17 thd kados: are you certain about the title? 09:15 kados I only get 398 09:15 kados rather than 479 records 09:15 kados but then when I try to bulkmarcimport 09:15 kados the rest seem to go in ok 09:15 kados in eval 09:15 kados records 170 and 308 throw errors 09:14 kados in this version of the script I've got the whole operation wrapped in 'eval' 09:14 kados 171 actually 09:14 kados thd: it's number 170 or something 09:14 thd kados: which record is it for you? 09:13 kados thd: sorry, it's not the first record 09:13 kados where the 'all.mrc' is the output 09:13 thd kados: you did not say last night that you had problems with the first captured record. 09:13 kados ./afognak2koha.pl alaska_mrc_extra_val.csv all.mrc alldump.txt 09:13 kados slef: I typically run it like this: 09:13 thd s/second captured/first captured/ 09:12 kados http://kados.org/alaska_mrc_extra_val.csv 09:12 kados http://kados.org/afognak2koha.pl 09:11 slef I'll take a look on the ramfs here 09:10 kados yep 09:10 slef kados: sounds like something is ignoring you. Can you publish script and test data? 09:10 kados slef: I just tried 'raw' with the same results 09:09 kados slef: whether I open as utf-8 or not it dies with the same error 09:09 slef kados: well, you're asserting that it's utf8 when it isn't. Could you just open() it and read it in and *then* test it? 09:08 thd kados: That is the second captured record. The second captured record had no problem for me. 09:07 thd kados: maybe the issue for that record could be an em dash if "440 0 $a --For dummies", had an em dash. However it seems to have two hyphens. 09:06 kados I'd be fine with it just warning and mangling a single character in that record 09:06 kados the thing that gets my goat is that it just dies 09:04 slef hrm, I guess you get to play "guess the encoding" if this is a one-off 09:02 kados yea, but I could probably do a re-read 09:02 kados still dies on the first record 09:02 slef Have you read man perlunicode? 09:02 kados I'll try that 09:01 slef you can try <:raw instead, but you may end up outputting gibberish if you can't fix the encoding 09:01 kados ../alaska_mrc.mrc: data 09:01 kados file ../alaska_mrc.mrc # 09:01 kados k 09:01 slef file yourbatchfile # on the command line 09:00 kados hmmm ... not sure how to do that 09:00 slef 8859-which? Can file figure it out? 09:00 kados slef: with a few hundred wide chars thrown in 08:59 kados slef: but I'm assuming either mostly 8859 or marc-8 08:59 kados slef: it seems to be a combo of encodings :-) 08:59 kados slef: it's one of the problems with a batch file of marc records - they can lie about their encoding ... claiming to be marc-8 but actually some other encoding 08:59 slef what encoding is $infile? 08:58 kados slef: the reason is because there are some wide chars in the file 08:58 kados slef: either way I get the error 08:58 slef kados: why are you trying to open a non-utf8 $infile with :utf8? 08:56 kados thd: I have no idea, there must be something going on somewhere in that yaz or php stuff 08:56 thd kados: well if that is the record how could there be any non-ASCII characters? 08:56 kados open(INFILE, "<:utf8",$infile); 08:56 kados where INFILE is: 08:55 kados slef: while (my $line = <INFILE>) { 08:55 slef what's afognak2koha.pl line 25 ? 08:55 kados thd: but line 1 is : InDesign CS2 for dummies 08:54 kados it's possible 08:54 thd kados: what about the possibility that the MARC::Charset mapping or Unicode is incomplete for native Alaskan languages? 08:53 kados slef: is there any way to get Encode to just warn rather than die on that error? 08:53 kados slef: utf8 "\xEB" does not map to Unicode at ./afognak2koha.pl line 25, <INFILE> line 1. 08:53 kados slef: you've dealt with encoding issues in perl, right? 08:52 kados hey slef 08:52 kados thd: but sourceforge version has some untested functions that need to be tested before being put in CPAN 08:52 kados thd: yes, I do have access to MARC::File::XML finally 08:51 thd kados: I thought that you were updating CPAN to avoid this problem 08:51 kados thd: involving some people at follett 08:51 kados thd: CPAN: it's a long story 08:51 thd kados: Why is CPAN behind? 08:50 thd kados: I cannot import any record at the moment so I cannot determine encoding problems even for my old ASCII only records :0 08:49 thd kados: I think the only encoding problems were some native Alaskan names. 08:48 kados (out of curiosity) 08:48 kados thd: do those MARC records have the same encoding probs as the first batch? 08:46 thd s/615/no hits from 615/ 08:46 thd kados: I have succeeded slowly in capturing more MARC records by gradually adding targets and searching the correct form of serial titles. I am a little less than half way through the 615 records. 08:41 kados thd: the CPAN versions aren't up to date 08:41 kados thd: as with MARC::Charset 08:41 kados thd: MARC::Record needs to be installed from Sourceforge 08:40 thd kados: MARC::Charset and MARC::Record are up to date 08:40 kados thd: my 'installing on debian' document has details 08:40 kados thd: check kohadocs.org for instructions on installing the latest sourceforge versions 08:40 kados thd: did you install MARC::Charset? 08:39 thd kados: yes I was using the CPAN version 08:39 kados thd: the cpan version has a make test error? 08:38 kados thd: you must use the sourceforge version of MARC::File::XML 08:38 kados pierrick: no, no kohaplugin user 08:38 thd kados: rel_2_2 is now so broken for me that I cannot import even one record :( 08:37 thd kados: I last updated MARC::XML a few weeks ago but the current CPAN version has a make test error. 08:34 thd kados: what causes this error from bulkmarcimport.pl on any MARC record: Can't locate object method "as_xml" via package "MARC::Record" ? 08:31 pierrick kados, you created a "kohaplugin" user on your system? 08:30 pierrick thx 08:30 pierrick OK 08:30 kados pierrick: no they can be the same 08:29 pierrick :-/ 08:29 kados lemme look quickly 08:29 kados I think so 08:29 pierrick (should there be differences?) 08:29 kados well, yes 08:29 pierrick are there difference between the two files? 08:26 kados pierrick: yep :-) 08:26 pierrick should I suppose unimarc zebra configuration file is not up to date at all? 08:25 pierrick 65 ./usmarc/zebra.cfg 08:25 pierrick 31 ./unimarc/zebra.cfg 08:25 pierrick pierrick@plegall:~/dev/koha/head/misc/zebra$ wc -l ./unimarc/zebra.cfg ./usmarc/zebra.cfg 08:25 kados paul_away: are you here? 08:18 kados thx 08:18 pierrick done 08:16 kados yep 08:16 pierrick if you want 08:16 pierrick I you want 08:16 kados could you commit it to rel_2_2? 08:16 kados right 08:16 kados hmmm 08:15 pierrick (and it should not be, I suppose) 08:15 pierrick mis/missing090field.pl is not in rel_2_2 but in HEAD 08:15 kados cool 08:15 pierrick I'm testing the zebra plugin (still installing it) 08:14 kados pierrick: am now 07:50 pierrick kados, are you around? 06:34 slef thd++ 05:52 thd slef: at least the FSF mail system is not any worse than I have experienced on Sourceforge. All Koha devel messages are at least appearing in the log without loss eventually :) 05:48 thd slef: well yes that was a point of significant discussion and a special presentation at the FSF members meeting. 05:44 slef http://www.fsf.org/blogs/sysadmin/lists 05:42 thd pierrick: FSF is buying new servers for the mail system and improving the routing so the mail queue may not be an endless disc thrashing session in a few months. They know the delay of the mail queue is a very important issue. 05:42 slef thd: je rigole 05:40 pierrick but I had hoped you wouldn't answer 05:40 thd slef: I understand what that would mean but that leaves me even more uncertain of your message. 05:40 pierrick didn't received yet 05:39 slef yep 05:39 pierrick slef, you answered to my mail about forum Vs mailing-list? 05:38 slef thd: it's obtaining possession of the football by kicking the player in the back of the leg 05:37 thd pierrick: the term may generally mean to impolitely kick another in the trousers for obtaining attention severely. 05:36 thd pierrick: Savannah hardware is not fast enough for me to see exactly what slef means yet. 05:34 pierrick slef, what does "puts the boot" means? 05:31 thd what is this error: Can't locate object method "as_xml" via package "MARC::Record" ? 05:29 thd pierrick: and volume 2 http://www.amazon.fr/exec/obidos/ASIN/2765408246 05:29 slef ;-) 05:24 thd pierrick: http://www.amazon.fr/exec/obidos/ASIN/2765405514 05:24 thd pierrick: the Chan book is most likely excellent but it may be helpful to consult also a book on French UNIMARC practise. 05:16 pierrick thanks a lot thd, I don't need a translation, the majority of my technical books are in english 05:14 thd pierrick: I do not know what might be a French equivalent, but would be pleased to know 05:12 thd pierrick: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0070105065 05:10 thd pierrick: There is a generally well respected book by Chan, although, I unfortunately do not have a copy. 04:57 thd pierrick: you should look at a library science textbook to understand the concepts behind what goes into MARC well. 04:56 thd s/paradym/paradym/ 04:55 thd pierrick: full marks!! see my brief paragraphs about the alternative to the search paridym at http://www.agogme.com 04:53 pierrick thd, not very far. I think I understand the tag/subfields structure. I don't bind description to each tag/subfield depending on the MARC flavour 04:52 pierrick after this discussion, I would answer Genji that I would like to have other navigation mode in the OPAC, not only the search mode 04:51 thd pierrick: How is your study of MARC going? 04:51 thd pierrick: I would like to see such a feature implemented in a MARC compliant manner even if it would inevitably lead to breaking the ISO 2709 record size barrier requiring XML. 04:49 thd s./form/from/ 04:49 thd pierrick: yes there will always be the issue of the librarian needing to protect the library institution form users who may see public tagging as a forum for causing mischief :) 04:48 pierrick I know an online service blogmarks.net that let each user have public and private tags on their bookmarks 04:47 thd pierrick: I favour standard thesauri but I also like the idea of giving users freedom to contribute to the library in any way that is comfortable to the user. 04:46 pierrick thd, of course, it could mandatory that a librarian validate tags before making them public 04:45 thd pierrick: the user can have filters to protect himself from the mess potential. 04:44 thd paul: well one could have both a standard tag thesaurus and free form tagging. One need not exclude the other. 04:43 paul oups, I must leave NOW 04:43 paul in fact, i'm not sure there would be so many ppl entering tags. so having them worldwide could improve a lot their interest 04:43 pierrick paul, don't you think it would become a real mess if all libraries share their tags? 04:42 pierrick thd, PhpWebGallery 04:42 thd pierrick: what is PWG? 04:42 paul I thought such system where without any available tag list, and the user could enter what he wants. 04:41 pierrick thd, in PWG there are several mode of navigation, not only the search one. 04:41 thd pierrick: It would not need to be centralised if every library was free to add individual fields and subfields from records at any other library automatically in a distributed network. 04:41 paul pierrick: why do you want an available tag list ? 04:41 pierrick thd, my experience is 5 years of photo gallery development, and IMO managing biblio is not that different from managing photographs 04:41 paul (login test/test) 04:41 paul http://i20.bureau.paulpoulain.com/cgi-bin/koha/members/members-home.pl 04:40 paul you can check what it does at : 04:40 paul it works correctly for me, I think i've commited everything. Could someone check that an update of CVS + updater/updatedatabase make the feature working ? 04:39 pierrick paul, that would mean the set of avilable tags is centralized 04:39 paul OK guys, I've just commited many many things for borrowers improvements. 04:39 thd pierrick: that is a very important concept. Blank search forms are a very limited concept. 04:39 paul when a library from Koha network get a tag, it is send to a central server, that can distribute it to all libraries during the night. 04:38 pierrick search mode, tag mod, category mode, chronology mode, best rated, most read, etc. 04:38 paul pierrick: the best would be to have a world-wide tag system, based on ISBN 04:38 thd pierrick: I had asked hdl some time ago why that was not already a feature extension to the virtual bookshelves. 04:38 pierrick I think the current OPAC is only a search form while we could provide other navigation modes 04:37 pierrick having a navigation mode based on chronology would be interesting too 04:35 pierrick (through metadata in reality) 04:35 pierrick thd, yes. The admin of the gallery has added the tags manually 04:35 thd pierrick: such tags seem like user added subject headings. 04:35 pierrick if users can participate, it can be interesting but not mandatory 04:34 pierrick the origin is a question, but IMO the most important is the navigation 04:34 thd pierrick: yes records need as many access points and as much content as can be provided. 04:33 pierrick from users, from librarians... 04:33 pierrick I mean I don't really mind were tags come from 04:33 thd pierrick: what do you mean by why not using it? 04:33 pierrick what I mean is having this kind of navigation : http://www.modusoptimus.com/bsf/tags.php 04:32 pierrick thd, why not using it 04:32 thd pierrick: well the cataloguer can already add notes if that is what you mean by tagging. 04:31 pierrick The idea is the new navigation way it creates 04:31 pierrick but maybe having only "tagging" and not "user tagging" would be enough 04:30 pierrick thd, yes some kind of 04:30 thd pierrick: you mean user added notes fields. 04:29 pierrick thd, an example: you're connected to the OPAC, you can add some tag to a biblio 04:29 thd pierrick: I have had a few interesting ideas before you were born :) 04:29 Genji hmmm.. users tag.. as in add subjects to their own books? 04:28 pierrick "Tagging" is a very common features nowadays in applications managing items (any kind of items). 04:28 thd pierrick: How would you describe tagging biblios from users? I know hat the individual words mean but not the concept that you are attempting to describe. 04:27 pierrick I wanted to see if you already had the idea before me, and yes. But it does not seem to have been implemented 04:26 pierrick http://lists.nongnu.org/archive/html/koha-devel/2005-10/msg00011.html 04:26 thd paul: I hope it is even an interesting idea if you are wrong :) 04:25 Genji whats tagging biblios? 04:25 paul but if i'm right, it's an interesting idea ;-) 04:25 paul yes, I think I know what pierrick is speaking of, and i'm waiting for it's explanations. 04:25 thd paul: if you understand what is it? 04:24 paul tagging biblios is a very interesting idea, if I understand what it is ;-) 04:23 thd pierrick: what is tagging biblios from users? 04:22 thd paul: you need some special potions to keep the bugs from returning from the dead 04:22 paul ok, I missed it 04:21 pierrick paul, I've written a specific mail for BSP 04:20 paul (i should be here, with my tank, 2 fighters, 1 cruiser and at least 5 companies. I'll also get my +5 sword of the paladin and my shield of the deadbug) 04:18 paul pierrick: 1st bug squashing meeting => 18th, april, but which time ? 04:18 thd paul: that would be the most interchangeable general term for institution, company, etc. 04:17 thd paul: try organisation 04:16 thd paul: Yes that is perfect French:) 04:16 paul "collectivité" 04:16 paul because i'm afraid it's a frenchism 04:16 paul (an institution, a company...) 04:15 paul is "collectivity" a correct word so speak of an professional organisation 04:15 pierrick Genji, I have no "pet idea/bug" for the moment. Maybe I'm interested in tagging biblio from users and presenting something like a tag cloud and related tags 04:15 thd yes paul 04:15 paul thd : a quick english question 04:15 thd pierrick: So what are you specially interested in pursing in or for Koha? 04:14 pierrick thd, thank you for precision 04:14 pierrick thd, I'm back 04:09 thd pierrick: are you there? 04:08 thd pierrick: a bug in this context is something that keeps motivating you to pursue something. 04:07 thd pierrick: I think Genji was trying to ask what special idea were you interested in pursuing or implementing in Koha. 04:03 thd pierrick: It seems that Genji missed answering your English question. Pet something is favourite something, usually a personal favourite. 03:04 ToinS hello 03:00 pierrick hello Paul 03:00 paul hello all 02:57 pierrick s/englush/english 02:57 pierrick Genji, sorry, I'm not native englush speaker :-/ what do you mean "pet bug/idea"? 02:53 Genji pierrick: whats your pet bug/idea for koha? 02:47 pierrick hi Genji 02:44 Genji hiya all 01:48 Genji ok.. back again... on and off doing dishes.... 01:02 thd kados: I suppose that any characters in MARC 8 would necessarily exist in Unicode. I assume MARC::Charset includes every native american language in MARC 8. 00:56 thd kados: that record is actually a bad match. OCLC does not have what the record ought to be. That goes with the unfindable shareholder guides to a native corporation. 00:39 kados yep, investigating now 00:39 thd kados: there is a similar issue for cost, purchase price. 00:33 kados thd: fixed 00:32 kados thd: fixing that now 00:27 thd kados: from that record it seems that you created 690 subfields even when the values for the 690 subfields were empty 00:27 si ack, wrong # 00:26 si http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7278397109952382318&q=tom+limoncelli&pl=true 00:26 si russ, you might find this useful 00:21 thd kados: sometimes the same record appears in the source both with and without an ISBN 00:21 kados http://library.afognak.org/cgi-bin/koha/opac-detail.pl?bib=26 00:21 kados thd: multiple items are now working 00:21 kados thd: right ... 00:19 thd kados: the source file had many duplicates 00:15 kados hehe 00:14 si no worries 00:14 kados thx 00:14 kados woot 00:14 si /mode #koha +o kados 00:14 si or indeed 00:13 kados go /set +o kados 00:13 kados si: you too :-) 00:13 kados si: can you oper me? 00:13 si happy easter, joshua 00:10 kados cool 00:10 kados k 00:10 kados hehe 00:10 kados the CPAN versions won't cut it 00:10 kados to the latest sourceforge versions 00:10 kados you need to upgrade MARC::Record, MARC::File::XML and MARC::Charset 00:10 kados ahh ... before that 00:09 kados look in addbiblio.pl 00:09 kados so ... once you've done that 00:09 kados (in marc21 there are only two valid encodings: marc8 and utf8) 00:09 kados (if it's unimarc that is) 00:09 kados iso-8859 00:08 kados it should probably be 00:08 kados so if you're running an old Koha 00:08 kados set that to the desired encoding 00:08 kados TemplateEncoding 00:08 kados there's a new syspref 00:08 kados and you updatedatabase 00:08 kados if you use CVS rel_2_2 00:08 kados well, it's complicated 00:07 Genji so... perl is converting the characters before the script has the chance to convert them? 00:06 kados yep 00:06 Genji special characters like accented e's etc? 00:04 kados but I haven't been successful in tracking down exactly where it's happening 00:04 kados I think it's perl's fault 00:04 kados the special characters get mangled 00:04 kados when you edit existing records 00:03 kados and you upgrade to rel_2_2 00:03 kados if you use a Koha that has iso-8859 encoding in the db 00:03 kados in rel_2_2 00:03 kados related to encoding 00:03 kados I've been struggling with a bug 00:02 kados in the form of MARC::File::XML 00:02 kados we have that already 00:02 kados not quite 00:02 kados hmmm 00:01 kados in head 00:01 kados there's plenty of work to do on zebra 00:01 kados have you tried out the new zebra plugin? 00:01 kados that's just first on my mind 00:01 kados there's other stuff 00:01 kados well ... 00:00 kados we need Koha to be able to handle any encoding we hand it 00:00 kados iso-8859-1 vs utf-8 vs marc-8, etc. 00:00 Genji utf8? 00:00 kados character encoding 00:00 kados we're currently really hurting in the encoding area 00:00 Genji hmm.... not really. what sort of encoding? 00:00 kados know much about encoding? 23:59 kados great news! 23:59 Genji kados: good enuf. Im looking at doing some koha devel... have any particular bug / feature enhancement you think I could tackle on my first day back? 23:58 kados Genji: barely :-) 23:58 Genji kados: you awake? 23:55 kados and I don't see any with more than one copy 23:51 kados thd: seems like quite a few duplicates in there 23:51 kados thd: a search on 'and' pulls up 298 of them 23:50 kados thd: http://library.afognak.org 23:50 kados thd: got 398 records in 23:39 thd kados: after moving the setting of $rawRec for saving before $rec for display, I still have the XML/parser error on the 11th record. 22:44 thd kados: koha has many loop errors in the templates at least. 22:42 thd kados: that is a loop error unless 17 is an unlucky number 22:42 kados yep 22:42 thd did it die on 17 again? 22:42 kados same error 22:42 thd and? 22:42 kados i did 22:41 thd kados: delete records 10-25 again 22:40 kados in this case, it dies on record 17 even if I delete records 10-25 22:40 thd kados: what is strange? 22:40 kados wow, this is strange 22:37 kados but it might be 22:37 kados agreed 22:37 thd and it should not be important :) 22:36 thd kados: order that the variables were set had not seemed important 22:36 thd kados: maybe I should be setting the value of $rawRec first in $rawRec = yaz_record($id[$i],$p,"raw"); 22:34 kados or something 22:34 kados it might set the charset in yaz-record 22:34 kados hmmm 22:34 thd kados: I do a character conversion for display from a separate variable. Maybe a PHP bug creates an upstream problem. $rec is used for display only. $rec = yaz_record($id[$i],$p,"render; charset=marc8,utf-8"); 22:15 kados I'm going to just have to manually skip the problem records 22:03 thd at least as long as the remaining records are at least one 22:01 thd kados:that sound like an excellent plan 22:00 kados thd: I'm going to try eliminating all problematic records from the write 22:00 thd :) 21:59 kados my counting is notoriously off by one :-) 21:59 kados well, give or take one :-) 21:59 kados yep 21:59 thd kados: that is the 171st record imported? 21:59 kados I was mistaken that they all imported if they were not re-encoded 21:59 kados ok, so whether or not I convert to utf-8 it crashes on number 171 21:58 thd s/the/if the/ 21:58 thd kados: the content is ASCII the conversion presumably does nothing but change the indicated encoding in the leader 21:36 thd kados: are all records affected or only 15? 21:33 thd s/running/running the LWP and PHP script/ 21:30 thd kados: Do you want to try running against the sample 29 records on your system? 21:28 thd kados: I think I built PHP/YAZ for PHP5 because the Debian package is only for PHP4, and rather old. 21:24 thd kados: I have YAZ version 2.1.8-4 21:20 thd yes, written directly to filehandle 21:19 kados huh ... what version of yaz are you running on that box? 21:19 kados then presumably you write that $rawRec to a filehandle? 21:18 kados huh 21:18 thd kados: raw is raw 21:18 thd kados: $rawRec = yaz_record($id[$i],$p,"raw"); 21:15 kados is that a possible cause of the problem? 21:15 kados sometimes if you don't specify a binary transfer it doesn't do a binary transfer 21:15 kados so how did you acomplish the download? 21:15 thd s/there/they/ 21:15 kados very strange 21:15 kados hmmm 21:14 thd kados: there were direct raw MARC so that we would not have this problem? 21:14 kados were they downloaded directly in binary marc or were they scraped off an html page? 21:13 kados they must have been re-encoded by php or something 21:13 kados is that the records weren't saved correctly 21:12 kados basically the real problem 21:12 kados utf-8 even 21:12 kados then, I tried converting everything to utf-89 21:12 kados thd: first I tried doing nothing with encoding 21:05 thd kados: so in Perl you made some character conversion? 21:04 kados thd: it dies on record 171 if I try to import from marc only 21:04 thd kados: What workaround did you use for the 11th record? 21:04 thd kados: what happens if you try to import the records from the MARC only file? 21:02 thd kados: as long as that is a well formed end of file then that is fine. 21:01 kados thd: well, there is the end of file that every marc has 21:00 thd kados: yes of course but was there any strange character just before the newline? 20:59 kados I was able to chomp() that line to remove it 20:59 kados you wouldn't have \n as the last char 20:58 kados in a true marc file 20:58 kados but I was able to correct that 20:58 kados yes that is also a problem 20:58 thd ? 20:58 thd kados: I was uncertain about how I added the newline separating the rows but do you see a problem there for . "\n" 20:58 kados and at least 15 records appear mangled 20:57 kados I can import all but 3 or so 20:57 kados so if I leave everything as marc-8 20:57 kados because of the encoding probs 20:57 kados well, I can't seem to convert the marc-8 to utf-8 20:56 thd kados: but what problem do you actually see aside from 15 records? 20:56 kados I don't even know where to begin looking for the problem 20:56 thd \kados: what is the problem except for 15 records? 20:55 kados hmmm 20:55 thd kados: I can send you the scripts and we can rerun everything form your speedy system after we find the problem. 20:55 kados how can we salvage this? 20:54 thd kados: what are the more problems? 20:54 kados hmmm 20:54 kados I don't know what to say 20:53 kados hmmm 20:53 thd yes PHP :( 20:53 kados thd: I have even more probs 20:53 thd kados: I assume that you would have the same problems if you tried importing the MARC records from the MARC records only file. 20:53 kados thd: so this is php? 20:50 thd kados: no Perl uses join for join not implode :) 20:49 kados thd: is this perl? 20:49 thd } 20:49 thd fclose($fh); 20:49 thd fwrite($fh, $extraValuesRow); 20:49 thd $fh = fopen($marcExtraValuesFile, 'a') or die("can't open file"); 20:49 thd $extraValuesRow = implode("\t", $extraValues) . "\n"; 20:49 thd $purchased_price, $quantity, $rawRec); 20:49 thd $l_subject, $l_subject_subdivision, 20:49 thd $publication, $pub_place, $pub_year, 20:49 thd $search_fields, $isbn, $author, $title, 20:49 thd $recQuality, $recYearMatch, $hostSpec, 20:49 thd $extraValues = array($progress, $version, 20:49 thd $extraValues[] = ""; 20:49 thd fclose($fh); 20:49 thd fwrite($fh, $rawRec); 20:49 thd $fh = fopen($marcCaptureFile, 'a') or die("can't open file"); 20:49 thd if (!empty($save_best) && !empty($recQuality) && $bestRec == 1) { 20:49 kados nope, I'm wrong about even that 20:47 kados thd: so that file has mixed encoding 20:47 kados thd: I think the problem with this whole thing is that you saved binary marc files with all different encodings into a file without specifying or controling the encoding 20:46 thd or rather author title which are also suspect matches 20:46 kados thd: explain to me how the records are saved in the file with the tabs 20:42 thd kados: the MARC record looks like the bad title only match for "Am salmon" 20:40 thd kados: look at the bad record more importantly entirely different record in the MARC view from the detail view for http://library.afognak.org/cgi-bin/koha/opac-detail.pl?bib=12 20:36 thd which would not have been 11.html because there were gaps. 20:35 thd kados: what happened to record 11? 20:34 kados I bet everything but those 15 is ok 20:34 kados 15 to be exact 20:34 kados 407 EncodingMARC-8 20:34 kados 393 EncodingMARC-8 20:34 kados 334 EncodingMARC-8 20:34 kados 333 EncodingMARC-8 20:34 kados 332 EncodingMARC-8 20:34 kados 331 EncodingMARC-8 20:34 kados 330 EncodingMARC-8 20:34 kados 326 EncodingMARC-8 20:34 kados 302 EncodingMARC-8 20:34 kados 299 EncodingMARC-8 20:34 kados 219 EncodingMARC-8 20:34 kados 175 EncodingMARC-8 20:34 kados 128 EncodingMARC-8 20:34 kados 13 EncodingMARC-8 20:34 kados 12 EncodingMARC-8 20:34 kados some of the records didn't conver to to utf-8 20:34 kados maybe we only have a few encoding probs 20:33 thd kados: that is very pretty, are they all like that? 20:32 kados for instance 20:32 kados http://library.afognak.org/cgi-bin/koha/opac-detail.pl?bib=12 20:32 kados and we've got major encoding probs 20:31 kados must be a flaw in my script 20:31 kados hmmm, some have 0 count 20:31 thd kados: ok more is better, maybe my script miscounted. 20:31 kados http://library.afognak.org/ 20:30 kados importing them into Koha now 20:30 kados I have 479 :-) 20:30 thd kados: I think there should be 456 records in the file. 20:30 kados thd: it's impossible to know where 20:30 kados thd: in several of the records 20:29 thd kados: where was the bad encoding? 20:28 kados thd: bad encoding 20:28 thd kados: what was the problem? 20:27 kados thd: 479 records in the file? 20:27 kados thd: i found a workaround finally 20:15 thd kados: raw is as raw as YAZ provided. If there are encoding problems those existed in the original record. Would Columbia University Library really inflict encoding problems on an unsuspecting world? :) 20:13 thd kados: I specifically avoided passing the raw record over LWP to avoid any possible encoding problems. 20:12 thd kados: PHP wrote to the raw records but did not alter their content except for later in the code where htmlspecialchars() is used for encoding to post the record in a form for manual record saving only after LWP directed automated saving has already happened. The htmlspecialchars() encoding is removed at the time of manual saving after parsing the post information. 20:03 thd kados: does YAZ itself have some encoding bugs? 20:01 thd kados: These records should not have encoding issues except for maybe some native Alaskan language characters which I had not noticed in any records. 20:00 Genji offline for chores 20:00 thd kados: what is the offending character? 19:59 thd ? 19:59 thd kados: why does Perl want to complain about characters that should all be ASCII. 19:58 kados thd: it's the encoding of a char that's the prob 19:58 kados thd: no, not sure what that would tell me anyway 19:57 kados however, it's perl that's complaining in this case 19:57 thd kados: look at 11.html . Do you see anything wrong? 19:57 kados at least it claims to be marc-8 19:57 kados LDR 01467cam 2200361 i 4500 19:57 kados NUMBER 11 => 19:57 kados LDR 00450cam 2200157 4500 19:57 kados NUMBER 10 => 19:57 kados no 19:56 thd kados: Is record 11 Unicode and not MARC 8? 19:55 thd kados: they were raw and I mostly had no problems but I did nothing to encode the raw data. The raw data was the raw data except for display. 19:54 kados on record #11 19:54 kados utf8 "\xEC" does not map to Unicode at /usr/lib/perl/5.8/Encode.pm line 164, <INFILE> line 171. 19:54 kados the script i wrote dies with: 19:54 thd Genji: the media type is a very amorphous term. MARC generally uses media types contained in standard cataloguing rules but spreads the information all over the record while the leader contains the most important information in positions 06 and 07. 19:54 kados thd: (and were they downloaded in raw format?) 19:53 kados thd: (did php or perl write them to file?) 19:53 kados thd: did you write binmode utf8 when you wrote them to file? 19:53 kados thd: mostlikely because of the way they were saved 19:53 kados thd: these records have some major problems with encoding 19:52 kados thd: remember that error you were having when attempting to import record #11? 19:50 Genji new tables... media type table, itemtype table, itemsubtype table... one linked to the other. for instance... CNFB means Children nonfiction books... ahh.. copying cataloged records.. right. haven't got that far. 19:50 thd Genji: kados and I were discussing reading some media type information from the leader, etc. for copy catalogued records. 19:48 thd Genji: how did you determine media type in your code? 19:47 thd kados: obviously parts of my code are missing something as I stopped part way through but those issues can be easily fixed. Some variables certainly need a larger scope or some different treatment. 19:46 Genji ah... maybe mediatype is different.. but my implementation, which is in cvs, is mediatype -> itemtype-> itemsubtype 19:45 Genji okay... 19:44 Genji the root of koha module has been trimmed extremely.... 19:43 Genji hmm... checking if its still in the cvs... 19:42 thd Genji: what was your idea? 19:41 Genji kados: media type codes? like my idea i implemented last year? 19:38 thd kados: you should have the message now 19:32 thd kados: more than two 19:31 kados thd: leader position6 only has two values, right? 19:30 kados k 19:30 thd kados: media type quickly becomes complex after leader but leader code is sufficient for what we need today. 19:29 thd kados: my code starts with the leader but you have to use both leader positions 06 and 07. 19:28 kados thd: do they all rely on the leader? 19:28 thd kados: I will send my code in two minutes. 19:27 thd kados: you may be missing something for books. 19:27 thd kados: I have more media type code than you could determine from that page. 19:25 kados thd: but I can actually insert the files as they are so you can look at them 19:25 kados thd: just have to add a few more things and I'll be done 19:24 kados thd: the script works like a charm 19:24 kados thd: unless they go above and beyone that list 19:24 kados thd: http://www.itsmarc.com/crs/Bib0443.htm 19:24 kados thd: already got the media type codes 19:24 kados thd: the script's 90% done 19:24 thd kados: yes I am sending you some media type code 19:22 kados thd: you around? 19:14 slef doesn't mean much unless they accept them 19:14 slef bugzilla assigns them automatically 19:04 Genji how is it that all bugs are assigned to people, even though its status is NEW? 18:39 chris NPL do genji .. and i think liblime's clients use variants of it but im not sure 18:39 chris probably be back later 18:38 chris ok im gonna go out for a bit and enjoy some sun 18:38 Genji what libs use NPL templates? 18:34 slef that was, what, 12 years ago now 18:34 chris hehe 18:33 slef went to uni in Norwich and got distracted on the way back 18:33 slef chris: I'm from near Northampton and spend some time near Bristol. 18:32 chris heh 18:32 slef (~70 miles by road) 18:32 chris anything there you are welcome to have a go at 18:32 slef .uk sites don't like concave coastlines - I search for cinema showings and get results for "Skegness, 22 miles North" 18:32 chris bugs.koha.org 18:32 chris yep we do 18:32 Genji we dont have a bugzilla anymore? 18:31 chris im not sure why, but i had it my head you were way more to the west 18:31 slef forgot I had that map bookmarked 18:31 chris right, i have a much better idea now 18:31 slef next political capital upwards is Norwich, 45 miles E 18:30 chris ahh 18:30 slef next large place is peterborough, 33 miles WSW 18:30 chris genji: might be a good idea to drop a mail to koha-devel that way lots of eyes willl see it 18:29 slef http://uk2.multimap.com/clients/browse.cgi?X=562000&Y=320500&gride=562078&gridn=320484&width=700&height=400&client=M6&db=ap&scale=10000&scale=4000000 18:29 chris thats not that helpful :) 18:29 chris heh 18:29 slef biiig black rectangle 18:29 slef heh, maps.google.com is a night view here 18:28 chris and north is porirua 18:28 slef http://tx.mb21.co.uk/gallery/worlebury-hill.asp but it only has a picture of Crook Peak on the other side of the valley (picture with the Hutton label) 18:28 chris across the harbour to the northeast is huttcity, and upper hutt 18:28 chris wellington city is at teh southern end of the harbour 18:27 chris http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&q=wellington+nz&t=k&ll=-41.279998,174.779998&spn=0.282259,0.839767 18:27 Genji when is kados most active? 18:26 chris centre of the city even :) 18:26 chris well it includes those other 3 cities .. but from the city of the centre to the outlying cities, furthest one would be 30 mins in a car 18:25 chris hmmm, kados might be the best one to answer that genji 18:25 slef is the region much bigger? 18:24 chris 423k in wellington region 18:24 chris 2001 census 163k in wellington city 18:24 chris ah ha 18:22 Genji okay.. im going to be doing chores but can someone please inform me of the current bugs and feature requests on Koha? want to get back into it. 18:22 chris heh 18:22 slef apart from the wooded hill, which reminds me of Worlebury (small, don't ask) 18:22 slef look of it reminds me of Toronto somehow 18:22 chris im not sure how many in wellington proper 18:21 chris 3 are 4 cities .. wellington itself, porirua, hutt city, and upper hutt ... i think combined its around 600k 18:21 chris hmm good question 18:21 slef how many in Wellington? 18:20 slef hello Genji 18:19 slef and more factories... it's just generally a bit wrong 18:19 Genji hello all. 18:19 slef so it has more shops and stuff than a town of 10k usually would 18:19 slef most of the stuff until those places to the south and west looks like the pictures from the bridge 18:18 chris right, its reasonably sized compared to a lot of places in nz too 18:18 slef I think it's a very small town, but it's the biggest place for 35 miles by land 18:17 slef yes and no 18:17 chris ahh right 18:17 slef (there are four or so villages inside the bypass, slowing running into the town) 18:17 chris right, so quite small in the scheme of things 18:16 slef 10k in the main town, 40k inside the bypass 18:16 chris how many people live there? 18:15 chris http://photos.bigballofwax.co.nz/gallery2/v/2003/wellington/wellington.jpg.html 18:15 slef there are buildings you see really clearly from Ferry Square that I don't usually notice 18:15 slef I can't identify everything 18:15 chris thats cool 18:14 chris oohh tricky 18:14 slef on lynnwide that is 18:14 slef btw, if you mouseover bits of the image, the titles tell you what's what 18:13 chris ahh ok 18:12 slef well, near 18:12 slef but I'll probably move there soon 18:12 slef Bristol is about 4hrs train or full-speed driving away 18:11 chris and kados said hi, thats about it 18:11 chris i just congratulated kyle on the template he committed 18:11 chris nothing really 18:11 slef what did I miss? 18:10 chris ahh cool 18:10 slef *** The server says: ERROR :Closing Link: 50-30-55-213.adsl.realpoptel.net 18:10 slef <chris> i have friends who I went to uni with, who are pharmacists in bristol 18:10 slef across the river 18:10 slef <slef> http://mjr.towers.org.uk/photos/lynn/lynnwide is the town, as seen from 18:10 slef <slef> no, it's not all like that here (despite what some morons tell you) 18:10 slef <slef> yes, it is really that flat 18:10 slef outside town 18:10 slef <slef> http://mjr.towers.org.uk/blog/2006/cyclynn has some pictures of just 18:10 slef at least to .uk 18:09 slef Someone buy .nz a new link to the world, please. 18:05 kados hey kyle 18:05 chris nice work on the template, very snazzy 18:05 chris hi kyle 17:53 chris i have friends who I went to uni with, who are pharmacists in bristol 17:53 chris i forget where in the UK are u slef? 17:52 slef for sure 17:52 chris IMO there isnt actually anymore drinking going on by 18,19 year olds, its just they can do it in the open now 17:52 slef I think only the Nordics have a worse reputation... and they had even tighter alcohol restrictions! 17:52 slef I just hope the English figure out drinking before we drag the rest of Europe down with us 17:52 slef as ever, some people are slower learners than others ;-) 17:52 slef personally, I think if you're old enough to get it, you're old enough to drink it... sooner you start, sooner you learn when to stop 17:52 slef and you can legally drink younger than that in some situations which I forget 17:52 chris so they are proposing to raise the drinking age again .. which i suspect wont do a damn thing except hide the problem again 17:51 chris mainly young kids 17:50 chris yeah, binge drinking is still a problem in nz 17:50 chris ahh same as here then 17:49 slef 18 17:49 slef England has binge drinking trouble as we adapt to the idea that alcohol is always available 17:49 chris whats the drinking age 20? 17:49 chris :) 17:49 slef given most the bars in this town, that's probably correct, though :-/ 17:49 slef as far as I can tell 17:48 slef still the police object to pretty much all applications for longer hours 17:48 chris right 17:48 slef s/deregulated/derestricted/ 17:48 chris ahh yes i remember seeing that on the news slef 17:48 slef shops have been 24 hours for a while 17:48 chris does mail come on sunday in the US joshua? 17:48 slef we've only just got deregulated opening times for bars 17:47 chris i dont think there is a set time anymore, there are bars that seem to never be closed :) 17:47 chris it got changed to 10 oclock closing 17:47 chris 1967 17:46 chris i forget when 6 oclock closing ended 17:45 chris in nz 17:45 chris and there was no advertising on tv on sundays 17:45 slef although in the village I grew up, it closed pretty much every weekend 17:45 chris 20 years ago .. shops didnt open on sundays 17:45 chris :-) 17:44 slef chris: it's like Eng 20 years ago... 17:44 chris (the 25th) 17:44 chris then we have anzac day next tuesday .. lots of public holidays in april 17:43 kados hehe 17:42 chris that opens and gets fined every year 17:42 chris oh and there is a rogue garden store chain 17:42 chris so only gas stations, movie theatres and restaurants generally 17:42 chris i think its double time .. might be time and a half 17:42 chris and you have to pay your staff double time 17:42 kados heh 17:41 chris easter and christmas nz pretty much shuts down ... you have to get permission to trade 17:41 chris ahh, ill ask next time i see him slef 17:40 kados slef: no idea, I don't do holidays :-) 17:39 slef kados: what? The US doesn't celebrate Easter Monday? 17:39 slef chris: mostly curious. Nothing in partic unless you can make si /mode #koha -t ;-) 17:20 chris yep its a holiday, im around for the next 20 mins or so tho if you need something slef? 16:57 kados monday for us 16:57 kados i think it's holiday until tuesday 16:40 slef Are the .nz working today or is it a holiday there now? 16:39 slef hello osmoze 16:04 osmoze hello 15:08 kados owen: not sure why it was wrapped in that to begin with 15:08 kados owen: re: amacon change, sure 15:07 kados owen: having to do with db updating, installer, etc. 15:07 kados owen: I've send a mail to mason with a list of remaining tasks 15:07 kados owen: it's all yours 15:06 kados owen: ok, cvs is updated as far as placement and links go 15:06 kados owen: all the -home stuff should go in the root dir 14:54 owen kados: why doesn't labels-home.pl belong in /barcodes ? 14:34 owen Hmmm... looks like I can. 14:32 owen Can I just move the 'AmazonContent => C4::Context->preference("AmazonContent"),' outside of that unless? 14:32 owen Right now it's inside "unless ($in->{'type'} eq "intranet") {" 14:32 kados owen: then you can beautify it :-) 14:31 kados owen: get it working first 14:31 kados owen: I'll hack on the barcodes stuff 14:31 kados owen: no, just haven't merged that stuff again 14:31 owen Is there any reason why the AmazonContent system pref shouldn't apply to OPAC and Intranet both? 14:30 owen Say, while you're here... 14:30 owen It was just cleanup, though. Easy to do again. *sigh* 14:30 kados hehe 14:29 owen I /did/ work on it. Then I overwrote it with a CVS update. :( 14:28 kados owen: I was gonna work on it a bit but wanted to avoid merge conflicts 14:28 kados owen: if so, could you commit what you've got? 14:27 kados owen: have you worked at all on the barcodes stuff? 12:56 thd kados: I try to avoid being incomplete in explanation :) 12:55 kados thd: thanks 12:55 kados thd: in the email 12:55 kados thd: very useful explaination 12:53 thd kados: the useful file content is not very large but the HTML log files contained even unused records :) 12:51 kados thd: I'll take a look asap 12:51 kados thd: thanks 12:51 thd kados: I just sent you the bzipped file. Sending had failed to work this morning because the gzipped file had exceeded my quota for attachment size.