Time Nick Message
11:16 owen Yes, it works great. Thank you!
11:16 hdl ?
11:16 hdl owen : have you tried my fix.
11:02 kados paul: yes please :-)
11:01 paul do youwant a complete french DB ?
11:01 ToinS Bye all ...
11:01 kados ok
11:01 paul don't forget to mail me if you find something interesting even if you don't catch the solution
11:01 kados ok, I"ll do my best
11:01 paul otherwise, i'll investigate too.
11:01 paul OK, 6PM, I hope i'll have a fix for this problem in koha-cvs tomorrow morning ;-)
11:00 kados yea :-)
11:00 paul yep. it's the kind of goodies we could add to Koha (like pictures of the core team)
11:00 kados It think there are some others as well
11:00 kados it's quite funny :-)
10:59 ToinS yes !
10:59 paul yes
10:59 kados paul: did ToinS discover that? :-)
10:59 kados paul: :-)
10:59 paul really LOL !
10:59 paul kados : did you tried to search /pancakes on team42 interface ?
10:56 kados paul: I'll install unimarc koha and troubleshoot this
10:55 kados in fact, I find addbiblio quite confusing
10:55 paul not well-formed (invalid token) at line 15, column 34, byte 635...
10:54 paul internal server error when saving !
10:54 kados ahh
10:53 paul (although i'm not sure there is no side effect !)
10:52 paul just comment line 532, and everything is better !
10:52 paul and line 527/532 => read it again, but FROM XML !
10:52 paul line 423, if we are in a mod = read biblio from MARCgetbibio
10:51 paul OK, you were wrong ;-)
10:51 paul something strange is probably done on line 527+/-
10:48 kados the page must be build differently for edits than for new records
10:47 kados agreed, quite strange
10:47 kados I'm checking
10:47 paul that's really strange !
10:47 paul why has the previous page wrong labels ?
10:47 paul 1st question then :
10:47 kados esp if we agree to only deal with two encodings
10:46 kados the encoding probs are easier to fix IMO
10:46 paul html2marc or html2xml ?
10:46 kados and not have a marc editor incapable of producing valid marc
10:46 paul which one(s) ?
10:44 paul :-(((
10:43 paul [Wed Apr 05 17:43:17 2006] [error] [client 213.41.184.186] not well-formed (invalid token) at line 11, column 19, byte 480 at /usr/lib/perl5/vendor_perl/5.8.6/i386-linux/XML/Parser.pm line 187, referer: http://i8.bureau.paulpoulain.com/cgi-bin/koha/acqui.simple/addbiblio.pl
10:43 paul and get :
10:43 hdl owen recommited.
10:42 osmoze bye all
10:42 kados each record does not have it's own copy of a label
10:42 kados but labels are stored in the same place, right?
10:42 kados wow, that is strange
10:41 paul (& it works perfectly when you look at a biblio or create a new one)
10:41 paul yep.
10:41 kados are you sure you did not convert mysql to have utf-8 in the tables on this test box?
10:40 paul you'll get correct labels & wrong (very strange !) datas
10:40 paul hint : on the previous link, force "encoding utf8" in firefox
10:40 kados in previous version of Koha?
10:39 kados was char_encode used to dynamically transform descriptions in the editor?
10:39 kados hmmm ...
10:39 kados not me
10:39 paul who transformed descriptions ???
10:38 paul If you add a new biblio, you'll get empty data, of cours, but VALID labels !
10:38 paul diacritics are gone for TAG labels as well as datas !
10:38 kados ahh ... this is not in the _data_ but in the descriptions!
10:38 paul so :
10:38 paul L'autorité
10:37 paul 200$a should be
10:37 paul should be Numéro
10:37 paul 020 tag :
10:37 kados ok, I'm there
10:37 paul (test/test should work)
10:37 paul http://i8.bureau.paulpoulain.com/cgi-bin/koha/acqui.simple/addbiblio.pl?oldbiblionumber=50109&frameworkcode=Default&op=
10:37 paul so, go to
10:36 kados finished
10:36 kados hehe
10:36 paul (let me know when the history if finished)
10:36 kados it converts the html form submission into MARCxml
10:36 kados so i wrote a new method that was easier to read
10:35 kados and was very difficult to read
10:35 kados it lost data for instance
10:35 kados MARChtml2marc was very buggy
10:35 kados ok ... here's the history
10:35 paul ??? I don't understand, sorry
10:34 kados only MARChtml2xml uses XML
10:34 kados MARCgetbiblio is xml independant
10:34 kados if you edit or add one with addbiblio, it is utf-8
10:34 paul yep
10:34 kados is that because you are editing one you already edited?
10:33 paul Biblio.pm just call MARCgetbiblio, that is xml independant, right ?
10:33 paul but... when I reach addbiblio, I immediatly get a problem. html2xml has not be called !
10:33 kados so the user will never know it was in utf-8
10:33 kados then, after MARChtml2xml, convert back to 8859-1
10:33 kados convert to utf-8 in MARChtml2xml at the beginning
10:33 paul (ok, let's say we have only 2 encodings, that's OK for me !)
10:32 kados if 8859-1
10:32 kados check TemplateEncoding var
10:32 kados our solution could be quite simple
10:31 kados so if we assume we only must deal with two encodings in 2.4
10:30 kados because it probably does not exist in UNICODE :-)
10:30 kados I suspect that MARC-8 was never supported in Koha
10:30 kados but in fact, Koha already was broken for them with regards to encodings
10:29 kados no, I must fix this problem
10:29 kados but I suspect it's a problem Koha has had for some time
10:29 paul so the new MARC editor don't work for them ?
10:29 kados no, they still use 8859
10:29 paul are they in UTF8 ?
10:28 paul as they have some biblios with diacritics iirc.
10:28 kados for encoding?
10:28 paul what do you did for NPL ?
10:27 kados as it would be hard to confirm it was correct with 50K records
10:27 kados I am scared to guess the encoding :-)
10:26 paul scares ?
10:26 kados I read that as well, it scares me :-)
10:22 kados (if the record is outside of ascii range?)
10:21 kados (in 2.2.5)
10:21 kados so what if a record is not 8859, does it currently display incorrectly when editing?
10:21 paul yep
10:21 kados since your templates are 8859?
10:21 kados so everything is edited as 8859 with your clients?
10:20 kados right
10:20 paul for Instance, I just want to solve : editing a record coming from Koha !
10:20 kados 4. record coming from KOha (previously edited/added in Koha)
10:20 kados 3. record coming from Koha (imported with bulkimport)
10:19 kados 2. record coming from resevoir
10:19 kados 1. record coming from Z3950
10:19 kados paul: we have several cases:
10:19 kados paul: and for MARC::Record and MARC::File::XML and MARC::Charset :-)
10:19 kados paul: and with xml parsers for not supporting other encodings
10:18 kados paul: me too!
10:18 paul I will really become mad with utf8 & Perl !
10:18 slef by the way folks, msg me if I seem to be away and I'll see it later
10:17 hdl hey I'm not dead yet !
10:17 slef kados: I guess we start with utf-8 in the xml bit and then try to expand it outwards to cover all koha internals.
10:17 paul kados : 1/2/3 : do you mean we will have to do 1 AND 2 AND 3 everytime ?
10:17 kados hehe
10:17 paul hdl : you just loose your commemorative plaque !
10:16 owen Global symbol "$branchname" requires explicit package name at /home/oleonard/koha/intranet/modules//C4/Auth.pm line 429.
10:16 owen Global symbol "$branchname" requires explicit package name at /home/oleonard/koha/intranet/modules//C4/Auth.pm line 418.
10:16 owen Global symbol "$branchname" requires explicit package name at /home/oleonard/koha/intranet/modules//C4/Auth.pm line 414.
10:16 owen Global symbol "$branchname" requires explicit package name at /home/oleonard/koha/intranet/modules//C4/Auth.pm line 409.
10:16 owen also:
10:16 paul so you had better do a left join to get branchname, as it will be called on every page !
10:15 paul hdl : about your previous commit : left join is faster than where.
10:14 paul ... thinking...
10:14 kados paul: do you have any ideas?
10:13 kados I dont' think any xml parsers recognize marc-8 or some of the other strange encodings in library records
10:12 kados because MARChtml2xml (which replaces the very buggy MARChtml2marc) requires utf-8
10:12 kados 3. convert back to old encoding after MARChtml2xml
10:12 kados 2. preserve encoding before running MARChtml2xml
10:11 kados 1. check encoding of all records going into editor
10:11 kados paul: so we could :
10:09 kados slef: could use some of your input on this as well
10:09 kados I can reintroduce char_encode, or I can try to build a better method
10:08 kados so I'm quite puzzled about how to proceed
10:08 kados right
10:08 paul (just below "sub create_input")
10:08 kados ok
10:08 paul there is one, but it's commented
10:08 kados paul: and see if modif works
10:08 kados paul: if there, try removing it
10:07 kados paul: check addbiblio.pl for an 'encode' line
10:07 kados right
10:07 hdl commited in 2.2 branch
10:07 paul (I did not saw it on add, just on modif !)
10:06 paul kados : you're right, we have a major problem in MARC editor on default !!!
09:59 kados heh
09:57 shedges in French?
09:55 owen No, but we'll put up a commemorative plaque for hdl ;)
09:54 shedges ...and I won't be there to get any credit for the improvement :-(
09:53 owen Thanks, that's going to be a REALLY BIG help for our librarians
09:52 hdl I do it and commit.
09:52 hdl I read.
09:51 hdl owen yes.
09:51 kados if not, should be fairly painless to add it to userenv
09:50 kados isn't it just 'branchname'?
09:50 owen Okay, for whomever: Is there a simple way to pull the branch name at the same time, rather than just the branch code?
09:49 paul owen : ask hdl, he wrote userenv.
09:49 owen Paul, I have a question for you about C4::Context->userenv->{branch}
09:49 kados slef: if you want to bail us out of our encoding probs, please do
09:48 slef kados: you sure? Even some of our organic flour is drugged already.
09:48 kados slef: no drugs :-)
09:48 kados slef: I eat organic flour
09:48 owen slef: that's why we're all so happy over here
09:48 slef kados: I thought all flour in the US was drugged already?
09:48 kados slef: we're drowning in encoding problems
09:47 kados slef++
09:47 kados perhaps the solution is to re-encode in the original encoding after using xml
09:47 kados the problem is that xml must be in utf-8
09:46 kados but didn't hear anything :-)
09:46 kados I posted a warning in cvs notes when committing this code
09:46 kados so yes, even for default I'm afraid
09:45 kados it's in the MARChtml2xml routine in Biblio.pm
09:45 paul you mean even for default templates ?
09:45 kados and then save the record as utf-8
09:45 kados it may attempt to convert any other char encoding to utf-8 when editing a record
09:44 kados the character encoding of the new MARC editor is utf-8 by default
09:44 kados as it relates to the new MARC editor
09:44 kados which you will want to know about
09:43 kados this would solve problem #2
09:43 kados on import
09:43 kados one idea I had was to encode the entire collection as utf-8
09:43 paul I think it's the best way to do it.
09:43 paul you could try to play with Encode module !
09:42 paul this char_decode causes a lot of problems.
09:42 kados I'm not even sure how to begin troubleshooting
09:42 paul yep.
09:42 kados that are incorrect
09:42 kados in fact, there are many characters
09:42 kados is char_decode for MARC-8 data?
09:42 paul it should be über or Über
09:41 paul mmm... I bet it's char_decode that is wrong on this specific german char.
09:41 kados (as wipo is set to 8859)
09:41 kados or else 8859 is not the proper encoding to display them
09:41 kados but I believe they are ruined on import
09:41 kados in 245 $a (title), there are several special characters
09:40 kados ahh, good idea
09:40 paul a suggestion (for wipoopac) : the footer would be better with 2 links I think : 1 for koha.org & 1 for liblime.com
09:40 kados in 245 $a (title)
09:40 kados http://wipoopac.liblime.com/cgi-bin/koha/opac-MARCdetail.pl?bib=17996
09:40 kados observe this record:
09:40 kados but before we discuss that
09:39 kados for instance, with the marc editor
09:39 kados we still have some problems in 2.4 related to encoding
09:39 kados well, wait
09:39 kados I've got
09:39 kados another problem
09:39 paul as it's what existing libraries have.
09:39 kados absolutely
09:39 paul but defaulting it to iso8859-1 !
09:39 kados ok, thanks
09:38 paul but ok for this patch.
09:38 paul I've seen that you have it in npl, but it's not in default or css
09:38 paul (I mean, at least in default templates)
09:38 paul utf8 is NOT the default for me in 2.4
09:38 paul back
09:33 kados hehe
09:33 paul (on phone again !)
09:33 kados paul: ?
09:33 kados for default
09:33 kados it only takes about 5 mintes to add the template code
09:33 kados if you want I will commit to 2.4 immediately
09:33 kados and it works perfectly
09:32 kados in fact, I've already done this
09:32 kados <!-- /TMPL_IF -->
09:32 kados <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8" />
09:32 kados <!-- TMPL_ELSE -->
09:32 kados <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=<!-- TMPL_VAR NAME='TemplateEncoding' -->" />
09:32 kados <!-- TMPL_IF NAME="TemplateEncoding" -->
09:32 kados then, in templates, put:
09:32 kados so why not just have a template syspref called 'TemplateEncoding'
09:31 kados utf-8 => 8859-1, etc.
09:31 kados they must edit all template headers to change the value
09:31 kados but it's a real problem if a library has some other encoding
09:31 kados in templates
09:31 kados right now, in 2.4, utf-8 is default
09:31 kados encoding:
09:27 paul explain what you're speaking of with Encoding ;-)
09:27 paul kados : i'm back
08:45 paul (still on phone)
08:45 paul yep
08:43 kados do they like 'subfield reordering' too?
08:42 kados great! :-)
08:42 paul IPT thanks a LOT the guy who wrote CloneTag & CloneSubfield !!!
08:42 kados paul: as they won't need to edit the template directly
08:42 kados paul: i think utf-8 catalogs will appreciate it
08:41 kados paul: it took me about 5 minutes to add a TemplateEncoding variable to Auth.pm, and the templates ... I will add it to CVS and to default templates if you ask me too
08:40 kados paul: well, rel24 now :-)
08:40 kados paul: in rel22 and head
08:40 kados paul: also, we must discuss encoding probs when you are available
08:17 kados paul: that allows the librarian to specify the encoding scheme to be used in intranet and opac templates?
08:16 kados paul: what do you think about a syspref for 'encoding'
08:16 kados paul: quick questions when you're off phone
07:59 paul how many do you charge for this feature ?
07:57 kados and we can't afford to do it for free :-)
07:57 kados because we have found everyone wants their Koha tweaked in some way
07:57 kados if they complain, we drop it :-)
07:57 paul (because if I don't propose, they don't ask !)
07:57 kados it's a required item
07:56 paul they want it, or you propose ?
07:56 kados yes, most customers have custom css for at least color, some for layout as well
07:56 paul (/me happy to see that it's wipo ;-) )
07:54 paul you write a specific css for every customer ?
07:53 kados which I can view fine in dumpmarc.pl
07:53 kados ology a commercial success;
07:52 kados rming your own company; 8. Financing the business start up; 9. Making your techn
07:52 kados intellectual property; 5. Developing your ideas; 6. The licensing option; 7. Fo
07:52 kados s commercialisation of your technology; 4. The difficult problem of valuation of
07:52 kados o market; 2. So do you really have something of value? 3. The first steps toward
07:52 kados roftHouse, Surrey, UK; Recd 11/12/98; Contents : 1. Bringing your technology t
07:52 kados 856 _aPrice : <9C> 36.00; Inv.# CSI102254; Date 30/11/98; Supplier : C
07:52 kados 856 contained:
07:52 kados http://wipoopac.liblime.com/cgi-bin/koha/opac-MARCdetail.pl?bib=24436
07:52 kados but the data in 856 was discarded by bulkmarcimport
07:52 kados the record imported fine
07:51 kados encoded
07:51 kados and claims to be MARC-8
07:51 kados yes
07:50 paul was it iso2790 ?
07:49 kados :-)
07:49 paul so, the answer is no ;-)
07:49 kados just wondering if you had seen it before
07:49 kados yep, could be
07:46 paul (thus my idea)
07:45 paul ("mapping" is sometihng MARC::charset does)
07:45 paul could it be a MARC::charset problem ?
07:45 paul I never saw this before.
07:45 paul "no mapping found at position 8".
07:45 paul hi kados.
07:41 kados no mapping found at position 8 in Price : ~\ 36.00; Inv.# CSI102254; Date 30/11/98; Supplier : CroftHouse, Surrey, UK; Recd 11/12/98; Contents : 1. Bringing your technology to market; 2. So do you really have something of value? 3. The first steps towards commercialisation of your technology; 4. The difficult problem of valuation of intellectual property; 5. Developing your ideas; 6. The licensing option; 7. Forming your own company; 8. Financing the busines
07:41 kados I get the following error in the log several hundred times:
07:41 kados paul: with bulkmarcimport
07:41 kados paul: I'm importing some records and I'm afraid they are truncating
07:40 kados paul: do you have a quick second?
07:40 kados morning all
07:17 hdl salut
07:13 osmoze hdl ?
04:43 osmoze (enfin désolé ^^)
04:42 osmoze non c edst bon paul merci :)
04:42 paul yep
04:42 paul ye
04:41 osmoze paul> ?
04:40 osmoze hdl> ?
03:29 pierrick un gros client d'INEO
03:28 paul "chez le fameux client" ?
03:28 pierrick non, pas un journée, je te rassure, de toute façon, je vais chez le fameux client dans une heure
03:25 paul mais ne passe pas 1 journée là dessus ;-)
03:25 paul bref, je ne suis pas trop sûr.
03:25 paul les mots vides sont à mettre dans un fichier à part. Peut être que l'on génèrera ce fichier à partir de la table stopwords.
03:24 paul quoi que finalement :
03:24 paul qui utilise d'autres mécanismes.
03:24 paul vu que la recherche srea gérée par zebra !
03:24 paul ne perd pas de temps là dessus. Les mots vides seront inutiles dans Koha 3.0 probablement
03:24 paul quoi que : STOP
03:24 paul OK.
03:24 pierrick en partant du principe que les stopwords sont courts et qu'on peut faire peut d'opération dessus. Tu me diras ce que tu en penses. (initialement c'était juste pour ajouter la barre de pagination)
03:23 pierrick OK, je suis en train de reprendre la page de gestion des stopwords
03:22 paul ca doit faire une 50aine de mots
03:22 paul (dans la plupart des cas, j'ai ce qui est mis par défaut à l'install.
03:22 paul plusieurs.
03:22 paul ca dépend de la base.
03:17 pierrick paul, tu as combien de stopwords dans ta base de dev HEAD?
03:17 paul mais j'y pense jamais !
03:17 paul pierrick: ah, c'est vrai, KSirc aussi
03:16 pierrick s/chanel/channel/
03:16 pierrick parce que irssi ou Xchat font l'autocomplétion des nicks présent sur le chanel.
03:16 pierrick tu utilises quoi comme client IRC ?
03:16 paul (et ton login apparait chez moi en vert pale, du coup le _ est difficile à voir. donc faut que je fasse attention si je veux te "bipper"
03:15 paul je sais je sais. Ca m'amuse juste ;-)
03:15 pierrick désolé, problemes de connexion internet chez INEO
03:14 paul bonne question...
03:14 paul a t'il l'utilité d'un _ ou pas ?
03:14 paul pierrick hésite beaucoup ce matin encore...
02:42 osmoze (en fait, j ai fais l install avec phpmyadmin et au final pb de perl :()
02:41 osmoze j avais commencer mais pas terminé...Tiens, tu me choppes au reveille, j ai rien prevu ce matin, j attaque :)
02:41 paul bonjour d'abord, bonne remarque !
02:41 osmoze bonjour
02:41 paul est-ce que tu as eu le temps de tester l'install windows ?
02:40 paul osmoze ?
02:40 paul plein de français ce matin encore...
02:26 pierrick hi hdl & paul
02:25 hdl hi pierrick
22:51 chris now in koha?
22:51 russ cos the other channel is too busy
16:47 owen chris, you around?
16:46 owen Charming
16:46 slef Jet2 - I can't believe it's an airline.
16:46 slef http://www.jet2.com/News.aspx?id=65 "Jet2.com [...] calls for lazy frogs to get back to work!"