IRC Logs

Time Nick Message
06:32 magnuse \o/
06:33 reiveune hello
06:50 * magnuse wonders about bug 17015
06:50 huginn` 04Bug https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=17015 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, maryse.simard, Failed QA , New Koha Calendar
06:51 paulderscheid[m] Morning #koha
06:52 tcohen hola #koha o/
07:02 tcohen mtj around?
07:02 tcohen we need to know what is the latest toolset you're using for building the packages
07:02 tcohen https://gitlab.com/mjames/koha-build-pkg
07:03 tcohen the last commit there is 1 year old so probably not accounting for the translations packaging step?
07:32 magnuse tcohen++
08:03 krimsonkharne[m] good morning #koha
08:05 mtj hi folks
08:05 mtj tcohen: hiya, am about now
08:08 tcohen we are not succeeding on making koha-dpkg-docker work
08:08 tcohen everytime we think it is fixes, something else breaks it :-D
08:08 tcohen we need to make it work, so we can either have you fix it, or show us all the secquence you're running
08:09 tcohen and we try to replicate that inside
08:09 tcohen for instance, we don't yet have the koha-l10n build step in there
08:15 mtj hiya tcohen
08:16 mtj will upload build script for koha-l10n in 10 mins
08:17 tcohen can you try the koha-dpkg-docker image with master and tell me what you see
08:17 tcohen I mean, it might be obvious for you what we're doing wrong
08:17 tcohen alex the API docs are back up
08:18 mtj tcohen: yep, will doo ^
08:18 alex tcohen++
08:22 thd tcohen: "everytime we think it is fixes, something else breaks it" There is a similar problem with Postfix. If Postfix is configured to receive mail via SMTPS Port 465 everything works fine for relay use to another server with SMTPS port 465 but requires encryption settings which break the possibility of non-relay delivery to SMTP port 25 servers accepting mail without expecting encryption.
08:25 thd tcohen: I try to work around the Postfix problem with port 587 instead of port 465. Port 587 may require STARTTLS eliptic curve certificates for some clients.
08:30 thd tcohen: Relays are still fine with port 465 but sender dependent configuration should give everything including the possibility of direct delivery to any SMTP server with port 25 without every final destination needing to expect encryption.
08:50 magnuse i can sense a disturbance in the [m]
09:25 MitchellHarris[m] Hi
09:26 MitchellHarris[m] I'm wondering if someone could help me find a way to install Koha for my church. I have a few different options but am hitting brick walls with all of them so far.
09:30 MitchellHarris[m] I have 2 public servers I could use. Both have cPanel. One is locked down and doesn't have SSH access but it hosts and uses the domain I want to attach a subdomain to. My other server I have full control of but it has other client sites on and it runs on MySQL 8 instead of MariaDB.
09:31 MitchellHarris[m] Other solutions I've tried include hosting it myself from home in a wsl instance but I have a dynamic IP and that is complicating it. Another idea is using Docker but I don't know how to use that.
09:31 MitchellHarris[m] Would anyone here have any thoughts on this?
09:34 MitchellHarris[m] Hello?
09:38 davidnind Mitchell Harris: It's a bit quiet here at the moment - many of the developers and contributors to Koha are at a week-long "Hackfest" improving Koha in Marseille, France
09:38 MitchellHarris[m] Oh I see. Thanks for responding Davindnind.
09:39 MitchellHarris[m] I was thinking I wasn't seeing anyone's messages.
09:39 thd MitchellHarris[m]: SSH access is important for installation and running maintenance scripts.
09:39 MitchellHarris[m] Thanks thd. That's what I was thinking. So I've pretty much crossed that one off my list.
09:40 davidnind I don't think I would recommend installing Koha on a server running other things - mainly as there are a lot of moving parts such as the web server (Apache), Perl, the database, and Zebra for the search (or Elasticsearch/Opensearch)
09:40 MitchellHarris[m] The other server has AlmaLinux on it too which complicates it as well.
09:40 MitchellHarris[m] Oh ok.
09:41 MitchellHarris[m] Would it be better to run a local instance of it on a dedicated machine? Like a laptop or something?
09:42 davidnind Using either Debian or Ubuntu is strongly recommended - mainly as all the components are packaged together nicely (it can be problematic getting all the Perl modules and specific versions working on a non Debian based system)
09:44 davidnind If running locally, then anything with a reasonable amount of memory should be fine (depending on usage)
09:44 MitchellHarris[m] Yeah. I found that. I installed an Ubuntu OS on an old laptop and set it up on there however I was finding it ran quite slow and I couldn't run it permanently for others to use out of Church time.
09:45 thd MitchellHarris[m]: You need a need an additional VPS or try experimenting on your home system first. Koha is tested on Debian GNU/Linux based systems which may include derivatives such as Ubuntu. Frequently, dependency packages may be one Debian version behind the current stable version which would be the long term stable version.
09:45 MitchellHarris[m] So would around 8GB ram be ok?
09:45 davidnind I'm not sure if you can use cPanel or not, but then having another virtual server would add to your organisation's costs
09:45 davidnind 8GB should be fine, depends on how many items you have and the usage
09:46 MitchellHarris[m] Thanks thd. The one I have full control of is a VPS but its the one running AlmaLinux and cPanel/WHM.
09:46 davidnind See system requirements here: https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/System_requirements_and_recommendations
09:47 MitchellHarris[m] I might have to see if I can get a budget for a little cheap server.
09:47 MitchellHarris[m] Thanks Davidnind.
09:47 MitchellHarris[m] Our library is probably around 2000 books.
09:48 davidnind I'm not a server administrator, so don't feel qualified enough to offer any advice that you should take seriously 8-)
09:48 thd MitchellHarris[m]: I saw that we are running some services on what may be the cheapest hosting in the world.
09:48 davidnind So I'm assuming a reasonably light load
09:48 thd MitchellHarris[m]: Let me check for the name.
09:48 MitchellHarris[m] Hahahaha. No worries davidinind.
09:48 MitchellHarris[m] Ok. Thanks thd.
09:49 MitchellHarris[m] One of my friends just suggested vultr.com.
09:49 MitchellHarris[m] Is that the same one?
09:50 thd They may be another option. This one is based in Germany and the name may start with an O.
09:50 davidnind Depending on what country you are in, there may be organisations offering Koha hosting - but I guess it would come down to the costs (but having someone who takes care of updates, security, backups, system administration, etc., can be a great advantage)
09:50 MitchellHarris[m] I'm in Australia.
09:51 thd They have data centres in a few around the world.
09:51 MitchellHarris[m] Oh ok. Great. I hope you can remember it.
09:52 thd tcohen uses them.
09:52 davidnind Often people suggest Digital Ocean or Linode
09:53 MitchellHarris[m] Ok. I've heard of them.
09:53 MitchellHarris[m] My friend said suggested Hetzner but it doesn't start with an O.
09:54 thd Conatabo in Germany ends with an O.
09:54 thd Vultr may be cheaper.
09:54 MitchellHarris[m] Ah ok. Hahaha.
09:54 MitchellHarris[m] I'll take a look anyway.
09:55 davidnind Catalyst It in Australia/New Zealand (https://www.catalyst.net.nz/) and Proscient in Australia (https://www.prosentient.com.au/) support Koha, offer hosting, and are active in the community - but you may not have the budget for their services
09:56 MitchellHarris[m] Great. Thanks. I'll take a look at these too.
09:56 thd The thing which I noticed was not the absolute price but twice the RAM and storage for the same price of a minimal VPS instance at Linode or Digital Ocean.
09:57 MitchellHarris[m] Well that's not bad at all.
09:58 MitchellHarris[m] I see Conatabo VPS' start at 6Gb RAM would that be suitable?
09:59 thd Contabo supposedly owns their own data centres as distinct from renting space in some larger data centre which lowers costs. Probably more than fine for 2000 volumes.
09:59 MitchellHarris[m] How big does the database get as well?
10:00 MitchellHarris[m] Great. Thanks, thd.
10:00 thd 2000 volumes and some library members is not much but remember to configure automated backups.
10:01 MitchellHarris[m] Ok. Yep. Will do.
10:02 thd Definitely look at Vultr or any VPS service which does not overallocate resources killing performance.
10:02 MitchellHarris[m] Are the cover images stored in the database?
10:02 MitchellHarris[m] Thanks thd.
10:03 thd Not certain but cover images are probably usually retrieved in real time using an Amazon API key.
10:03 MitchellHarris[m] Oh, that would be good.
10:04 MitchellHarris[m] I assume you'd be able to add any that are missing. We have some pretty old books there. Might have to get rid of some of them though.
10:05 thd Cover images are not very high resolution and would not take terribly much space but do not compress as well as the text data for everything else.
10:05 MitchellHarris[m] Fair enough.
10:05 MitchellHarris[m] Is Koha a more processor or memory intensive application?
10:06 MitchellHarris[m] Like what would you suggest for a basic setup for low traffic but around 2000 books?
10:06 MitchellHarris[m] * a basic VPS setup for
10:07 thd Amazon terms of service may allow caching cover images, so I am not certain whether they are stored. Ordinary Amazon terms of service prohibit caching price information but prices are not a Koha service.
10:07 MitchellHarris[m] Oh ok.
10:07 MitchellHarris[m] I guess that's something I'll find out once it's up and running.
10:10 thd I am the wrong person to ask about running a real world system even for a small library. I only run a test system. However, indexing using ElasticSearch would be the most CPU and RAM intensive task commonly done in Koha. Running without ElasticSearch should save resources but for 2000 items there may not be much of an issue.
10:11 MitchellHarris[m] Oh ok. Is ElasticSearch the better option of search engine?
10:11 MitchellHarris[m] I think I've just been setting it up with Zebra as the default.
10:11 MitchellHarris[m] Or am I getting things mixed up?
10:13 thd ElasticSearch is potentially the most full featured option for full text search and Zebra based indexing is the older library centric indexing system.
10:13 MitchellHarris[m] Ok. So are they separate components?
10:14 MitchellHarris[m] Or do you choose one of them?
10:14 thd Zebra indexing has problems for multilingual character set indexing.
10:14 MitchellHarris[m] Oh ok.
10:14 MitchellHarris[m] So ElasticSearch would be best overall?
10:15 thd You select indexing in the preferences.
10:15 MitchellHarris[m] Ok.
10:15 mtj tcohen: https://gitlab.com/mjames/koha-build-l10n
10:16 thd ElasticSearch is the best if the bugs are low. Everything has bugs whether we know what they are or not.
10:16 MitchellHarris[m] Hahaha. Yeah, fair enough.
10:16 MitchellHarris[m] Hi mtj. What's this?
10:22 thd davidnind: I have a remedy for lack of DKIM signing when sending mail from the wiki which had left some users unable to receive email confirmation message. A relay server can sign the message. I have working test configurations but I am trying to improve the configuration for using port 587 which should make the system more flexible.
10:22 oleonard Hi #koha
10:22 thd Hello
10:23 MitchellHarris[m] I'm only quite new to Koha, library systems and I'm still learning gradually about servers too. In Koha, how do I go about setting up categories and such for the books? My research has led me to understand that there are shelving systems (LCC and Dewey) and subjects (which are like tags?). My local library seems to have the categories set up as a Authorised value or something.
10:23 MitchellHarris[m] Hi oleonard.
10:24 thd oleonard: Did you have 100% darkness yesterday afternoon?
10:24 oleonard thd: We drove about two hours west so that we could catch it
10:25 * thd likes the dark.
10:25 mtj MitchellHarris[m]: its a script to build koha language packages, fo debian
10:27 oleonard thd: :D It was very cool
10:27 MitchellHarris[m] mtj: Oh ok. Cool. Sorry, I'm sure there was more context before I joined. I'm only new.
10:27 thd MitchellHarris[m]: Eclipse darkness.
10:28 MitchellHarris[m] thd: Yeah. I heard about that. We're not getting any of that down our way this time unfortunately.
10:28 MitchellHarris[m] Exciting.
10:29 mtj MitchellHarris[m]: no probs... twas a msg for tcohen ^
10:29 thd MitchellHarris[m]: You can always add your own classification to the records in 6XX fields.
10:29 MitchellHarris[m] mtj: Ah ok. I was wondering who they were talking about. I had no idea who that was.
10:30 MitchellHarris[m] thd: Oh, how do I go about doing that? (I don't have a functioning Koha instance in front of me)
10:31 thd You add a field in the record editor.
10:31 MitchellHarris[m] Ok. I'll have to have a better look when I get it running again.
10:32 mtj tcohen,Joubu: i added the step to build koha-l10n pkg here https://gitlab.com/mjames/koha-build-pkg/-/commit/9a1180ebac38e9f0a75b95351b8dcf433ef72c72
10:34 oleonard MitchellHarris[m]: For things like 6XX fields you'll have to check MARC documentation. All of that is not Koha-specific and you'll find plenty of resources
10:36 MitchellHarris[m] Ah ok. Thanks oleonard. So that's the 6XX fields in MARC. I get you now. The other issue I've got is that, being a church, most of our books are in only a handful of categories so the Dewey system doesn't really seem very suitable. I was considering still using it as a secondary but using Icons and colours to help identify and separate the categories and sub-categories for our patrons. Is this kind of thing possible?
10:40 oleonard Yes, check out collection codes in the Koha manual. It's only one dimension (no sub-categories) but it might suffice.
10:40 oleonard There are also Item Types, which can be tied in to circulation rules as well.
10:40 MitchellHarris[m] oleonard: Ok. I'll take a look.
10:41 MitchellHarris[m] oleonard: Yeah, I saw that actually and was going to use them but was told to just use that for the likes of Book, Magazine, DVD etc.
10:41 oleonard MitchellHarris[m]: Note that subject headings will get picked up by Koha's keyword search so they're worth having if you have folks searching the catalog
10:42 MitchellHarris[m] So is there no specifically right or wrong way to do this kind of thing?
10:42 MitchellHarris[m] oleonard: Ah, yes. That would be useful to have.
10:42 MitchellHarris[m] So subject headings are the ones like Tags?
10:42 MitchellHarris[m] many to many relationship?
10:44 MitchellHarris[m] Or have I confused you?
10:44 oleonard MitchellHarris[m]: I don't really think about MARC in database terms
10:45 oleonard But yes they're like tags, but with structure defined by the Library of Congress (in USA anyway)
10:45 MitchellHarris[m] Ok. No worries. MARC is all a bit confusing to me.
10:45 oleonard Of course it is! It's a confusing format!
10:46 MitchellHarris[m] Oh ok.
10:46 MitchellHarris[m] Hahahaha.
10:46 oleonard MitchellHarris[m]: Have you used Z39.50 import?
10:47 MitchellHarris[m] Yes, I have now. It's very useful. When the books are available of course.
10:47 MitchellHarris[m] I've added a few sources to it but since some of our books are not as widely circulated they aren't in some of the bigger library systems.
10:48 oleonard Z39.50 the best way to get MARC records and "official" subject headings (although you are free to add your own or change the ones you get)
10:48 oleonard MitchellHarris[m]: Are you on the Koha mailing list?
10:49 MitchellHarris[m] I'm not sure. I think I might have added myself to it but I haven't seen anything of it.
10:49 oleonard It's not high traffic. I ask because you could query the mailing list about possible good Z39.50 sources for your library type
10:50 MitchellHarris[m] I tried to join the community a few months ago to get some help but my emails didn't get much response.
10:50 MitchellHarris[m] Oh ok. Good idea.
10:51 MitchellHarris[m] I've tried adding a few of our church's university libraries which has helped. I think some of the books are even too old or rare for them though.
10:51 MitchellHarris[m] I'm probably getting about 90% of the books.
10:51 MitchellHarris[m] I've only done about 70 books so far though.
10:53 MitchellHarris[m] I don't understand the categories system well enough yet and I'd prefer to be able to add the books at the same time as the MARC records. I don't know if that's the best way to do it though.
10:53 MitchellHarris[m] I haven't made any labels yet either.
10:56 MitchellHarris[m] Thanks everyone for your great help. I really appreciate it. I'm going to head off now. Have a great day and enjoy the eclipse if you get the chance. :)
10:56 MitchellHarris[m] s/:)/😄/
11:28 ShivamMoradia[m] hello
11:29 ShivamMoradia[m] My self-Shivam Moradia, If Possible, for all developer to develop mobile application so it is very easy to circulation of books and resources....
12:58 davewood_ is there a reason this line is called twice in a row? -> https://github.com/Koha-Community/Koha/blob/master/catalogue/search.pl#L644
13:30 magnuse davewood_: not sure, but it sure looks weird
13:36 oleonard Looks like tag approval is broken
13:44 domm[m] hi red room!
13:45 domm[m] ```
13:45 domm[m] say "Hello Koha!"
13:45 domm[m] ```
13:46 domm[m] * `say "Hello Koha!"`
13:47 domm[m] hm, can't work out how paste codtr from the mobile
14:08 krimsonkharne[m] hi domm
14:15 domm[m] so, here's a code snipped in matrix/element:
14:15 domm[m] ```
14:16 domm[m] * so, here's a code snipped in matrix/element:... (full message at <https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v3/download/matrix.org/PJZDJYWbvjxQJhYLLHkYlGRZ>)
14:42 oleonard Anyone else having trouble with git-bz?
14:58 tiagosimoes[m] Hi, I'm trying to upgrade the Koha version from 18.05 directly to 22.11 but when I do sudo apt-get upgrade, it throws out the following error message:... (full message at <https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v3/download/matrix.org/vEtoYNOFsYvIHiebWGNCOxNr>)
14:59 tiagosimoes[m] * Hi, I'm trying to upgrade the Koha version from 18.05 directly to 22.11 but when I do sudo apt-get upgrade, it throws out the following error message:... (full message at <https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v3/download/matrix.org/SjTXqoVNVvulaIFCfOMyIGEr>)
15:02 reiveune bye
15:02 tiagosimoes[m] * Hi, I'm trying to upgrade the Koha version from 18.05 directly to 22.11 but when I do sudo apt-get upgrade, it throws out the following error message:... (full message at <https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v3/download/matrix.org/cjUszaUtEoUJfGzRGAdTTmTx>)
15:03 tiagosimoes[m] * Hi, I'm trying to upgrade the Koha version from 18.05 directly to 22.11 but when I do sudo apt-get upgrade, it throws out the following error message:... (full message at <https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v3/download/matrix.org/PbFUxebtMISsKVeMqAOVwgCV>)
17:30 dolf Hi. I upgraded from Koha 22.05 to 22.11 today (slowly catching up on all those missed releases). In Koha 22.05, I was using exactly this config for cover images: https://bywatersolutions.com/education/koha-question-of-the-week-where-do-cover-images-come-from-in-koha After the upgrade to 22.11, the cover images are missing. Any ideas how I could debug this or what I should check for? Example: https://library.refstudycentre.com/cgi-bin/koh
17:30 dolf a/opac-search.pl?idx=&q=commentary&weight_search=1
17:59 oleonard I see cover images dolf
17:59 oleonard https://library.refstudycentre.com/cgi-bin/koha/opac-search.pl?&limit=mc-itype%2Cphr%3ABOOK&offset=20&sort_by=relevance&count=20
18:18 JasonGreene[m] I have an idea and would like to know if it is possible...... (full message at <https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v3/download/matrix.org/AJiILQlGooGpXVROQrWNUVcv>)
18:18 dolf Thanks for checking it out oleonard. Not sure what I missed there, haha. But now I'm still wondering: Why is there sometimes no cover, and sometimes a little block that says "no cover image available" ...
18:20 dolf JasonGreene: This is totally possible. I have done it recently. In fact, this is something you should practice regularly, because a backup is only worth something if you can restore it to new infrastructure when the old infrastructure inevitable breaks.
18:21 dolf Depending on how you installed Koha, and on which operating system you are running, somewhere should be a few scripts to help with this, like `koha-dump` (to make the backup) and `koha-restore` to create a Koha instance from a backup.
18:23 dolf Source code: https://github.com/Koha-Community/Koha/tree/master/debian/scripts Docs: https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Commands_provided_by_the_Debian_packages
18:33 oleonard dolf: The "No cover image..." things represent a difference in how the individual cover image services were developed.
18:38 dolf OK, thanks :)
19:17 JasonGreene[m] <dolf> "Thanks for checking it out..." <- Thanks. I'll look at those pages
19:25 ssgans hi
19:26 ssgans Good Day to you
19:26 ssgans am new for koha
19:26 ssgans want to know the SIP2 in the Koha software
19:33 ssgans hi dolf
19:33 ssgans want to know the details of SIP2 in the Koha software
19:49 Ruth_NHCL How do I export a list of patron email addresses?
20:25 davidnind @later tell Ruth_NHCL: I would use a report, something like 'select * from borrowers', then download as CSV (you could also limit it to the columns you want as well)
20:25 huginn` davidnind: The operation succeeded.
20:33 davidnind @later tell ssgans: What were you wanting to know about SIP? How it works, how to set it up, configuration, .... The manual and wiki have some information (https://koha-community.org/manual/latest/en/html/apis_protocols.html#sip2 and https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Koha_SIP2_server_setup
20:33 huginn` davidnind: The operation succeeded.
23:07 dcook .