Time  Nick                    Message
06:34 liliputech_asu          hi koha
07:36 reiveune                hello
07:57 alex_a                  Bonjour
07:57 wahanui                 hola, alex_a
08:19 andreashm               Salut!
08:27 pizzaguy                bon jour!
08:30 andreashm               hi pizza-magnuse!
08:35 magnuse                 tjänare andreashm
08:38 * andreashm             waves a miniature Norwegian flag
08:40 magnuse                 yay!
08:40 magnuse                 🇸🇪
08:48 ashimema                mornin'
08:50 magnuse                 kia ora ashimema
09:55 sev_q                   Bonjour Koha !
10:54 lilipute1h_asu          sev_q: salut :)
10:54 sev_q                   salut liliputech_asu !
11:15 liliputech_asu          bon appétit!
12:35 oleonard                Hi #koha
12:37 calire                  hi oleonard
12:37 wahanui                 hi oleopard
13:21 magnuse                 hm, if plack is running and you restart the server, plack should start up again automatically, shouldn't it?
13:22 ashimema                anyone on QA fancy picking up bug 23765
13:22 huginn                  Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=23765 major, P5 - low, ---, jonathan.druart, Signed Off , After TranslateNotices is set to 'Don't allow', email settings still show multiple languages
13:23 oleonard                Complaining: Why can't we add to a patron list or do batch patron modification by borrowernumber?
13:35 magnuse                 because no one implemented it yet?
13:36 Joubu                   IIRC "borrowernumber is an internal id, librarians do not use it and do not need it"
13:37 Joubu                   but, well, yes, same for biblionumber and itemnumber ;)
13:37 oleonard                Librarians might find themselves needing to batch update patron records without card numbers
13:52 huginn                  News from kohagit: Bug 24002: One more occurrence of datecancellationprinted <http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=commitdiff;h=150361c0e58e9a049b03693ce4859b9035d5c558>
13:52 huginn                  News from kohagit: Bug 24002: Incorrect DATE value: '' in C4/Acquisition.pm <http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=commitdiff;h=a70320077c7bb9878762e42d39211ab4de8e19dd>
13:52 huginn                  News from kohagit: Bug 24002: Incorrect DATE value: '0000-00-00' in C4/Acquisition.pm <http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=commitdiff;h=b16c7c0615f41dde587370ba32ca5711ae8127dd>
13:52 huginn                  News from kohagit: Bug 24002: Incorrect DATE value: '00-00-0000' in C4/Serials.pm <http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=commitdiff;h=3d3336ed6607d80b72502075ebf9567cf48e1709>
13:52 huginn                  News from kohagit: Bug 24002: Incorrect DATE value: '0000-00-00' in C4/Serials.pm <http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=commitdiff;h=5e5c47ea300b7eb34cbcd3e71ff4a1ac9a3eaa38>
13:52 huginn                  News from kohagit: Bug 24002: Incorrect DATE value: '' in C4/Bookseller.pm <http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=commitdiff;h=508a5addf15170d32dea0f21e3acf569596db228>
13:52 huginn                  News from kohagit: Bug 24002: Incorrect DATE value: '00-00-0000' in NewsChannels.pm <http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=commitdiff;h=7e602c275b3687460c55f3f103781f2a44bdbee8>
13:58 caroline_catlady        good morning!
14:02 oleonard                Hi caroline_catlady
14:22 oleonard                -
14:24 oleonard                ^ oleonard cleaning his keyboard with some reckless cursor focus
14:24 caroline_catlady        oleonard: still trying hypens?
14:24 caroline_catlady        hehe!
14:24 oleonard                I like your explanation better caroline_catlady
14:35 koha-jenkins            Project Koha_Master_U18 build #468: UNSTABLE in 40 min: https://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_Master_U18/468/
14:35 koha-jenkins            Project Koha_Master_D9 build #999: SUCCESS in 41 min: https://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_Master_D9/999/
14:37 koha-jenkins            Project Koha_Master_D8 build #531: STILL UNSTABLE in 44 min: https://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_Master_D8/531/
14:38 Joubu                   we should teach wahanui to insult koha-jenkins
14:39 oleonard                Joubu: It's not koha-jenkins' fault!
14:40 Joubu                   it's failing randomly, it's its fault
14:42 ashimema                grr.. I really don't understand why those fail on jenkins
14:42 ashimema                I can't replicate them at all here
14:48 wizzyrea                timezone, race condition, incorrect time, tests run in different order
14:49 ashimema                ruled timezone and incorrect time out..
14:50 Joubu                   nope it looks like a network issue
14:53 sev_q                   Bye Koha !
15:19 koha-jenkins            Project Koha_Master_D9_My8 build #11: NOW UNSTABLE in 43 min: https://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_Master_D9_My8/11/
15:23 ashimema                Nearly there on m8 😀
15:23 ashimema                Thanks for all your hard work on that Joubu
15:24 Joubu                   Joonas around?
15:25 ashimema                kohaputti
15:25 kohaputti               Joubu, yup
15:25 ashimema                😀
15:27 kohaputti               Joubu, your last comment on squashing that you just sent: I disagree since RM or QA can make a mistake so no one is reviewing that step then
15:28 Joubu                   mistake a squash?
15:28 Joubu                   kohaputti: I am the author of this guideline, so I am aware of it
15:29 Joubu                   When I fail QA a patch I prefer to see the diff of the requested changes instead of a new patch. So I think others prefer as well
15:29 kohaputti               Joubu, sure, the QA/RM person can squash to non-related commits accidentally
15:29 Joubu                   review is much easier as it
15:29 kohaputti               two non-related*
15:30 kohaputti               okay, I prefer to have one patch fully working that I can review so I don't have to keep up like "oh but this is fixed in the later follow-up".
15:30 ashimema                I tend to agree.. I like to see followups so I can see the individual bits are done
15:30 Joubu                   unless you reviewed it maybe?
15:31 kohaputti               Joubu, my brain can't process too many follow-ups
15:31 Joubu                   when I was RM I used to squash follow-up when history was not needed
15:31 ashimema                I must admit, I don't often squash as RM.. I probably should more but I actually find it good to have the commits to see the thought process
15:31 Joubu                   and I am confident with QA and RM to squash when needed
15:32 ashimema                I nearly always check out such a branch and look at the set as a whole in other tools
15:33 Joubu                   kohaputti: also, if you need a squashed view, you can still squash and git log, when squashed you cannot undo
15:33 Joubu                   basically what ashimema just said... too slow...
15:35 kohaputti               okay, if you want to proceed with this then I think those commits that the author wants to squash should be marked explicitly so
15:35 kohaputti               like adding (squashme) (the same way we use (follow-up)).. Or maybe the RM/QA can check if the (follow-up) commits are from the same author
15:36 * ashimema              is in school run, brb
15:38 kohaputti               In other projects I have worked we also submit a v2, v3, etc. and it has worked really well. In the v2, v3 etc. of the patch set we attach a cover letter describing the changes since last revision
15:38 kohaputti               e.g. linux kernel
15:45 ashimema                For larger sets in also more than happy for people to just link to a GitHub/gitlab URL.. I find those very helpful for such cases.. a quick bug comment in bugzilla when there's a change is all that's needed.
15:45 * ashimema              is generally pretty pragmatic about these things...
15:49 Joubu                   tcohen: docker-compose.mariadb9.yml means default MariaDB version for D9?
15:52 ashimema                correct
15:52 ashimema                we could change the names to reflect the actual db server version instead..
15:53 koha-jenkins            Project Koha_Master_U18 build #469: STILL UNSTABLE in 1 hr 0 min: https://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_Master_U18/469/
15:53 qalbaqali               Hi guys :) I am setting up koha on an ubuntu server. Looking at https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Koha_on_ubuntu_-_packages#Initial_Configuration I want to have the URL to the library on 'library.com' and the admin panel to be on 'admin.library.com' for example. How would I set my koha-sites.conf variables to make this happen?
15:53 ashimema                I wasn't sure which way to jump on that one.. at the time I was thinking we'd try to support the default db server versions for each os version we supported.. but I think we're better off looking ahead and at more db versions in general now..
15:59 Joubu                   wizzyrea++ # race condition
16:00 ashimema                ?
16:00 eythian                 itym "wiz+zyre+a"
16:01 Joubu                   ashimema: bug 24022
16:01 huginn                  Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=24022 major, P5 - low, ---, chris, NEW , Z3950Responder tests are failing on D8 and U18
16:02 ashimema                oh nice.. well spotted
16:02 Joubu                   ha, no
16:02 Joubu                   it's actually the order
16:03 Joubu                   or both :)
16:09 Joubu                   well, maybe a cache issue actually
16:16 vfernandes              it's possible to get a Koha systempreferences in some custom Javascript?
16:17 oleonard                vfernandes: I proposed something like that for the OPAC but it is still undeveloped
16:17 qalbaqali               Getting this error on a fresh install on Ubuntu 16, Mysql v14.14 - [Tue Nov 12 08:16:23 2019] install.pl: DBD::mysql::st execute failed: BLOB, TEXT, GEOMETRY or JSON column 'changed_fields' can't have a default value at /usr/share/perl5/DBIx/RunSQL.pm line 273.
16:17 oleonard                Bug 17498
16:17 huginn                  Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=17498 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, NEW , Expose system preference values to JavaScript in the OPAC
16:18 qalbaqali               Is this a known issue?
16:18 Joubu                   qalbaqali: bug 23579
16:18 huginn                  Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=23579 blocker, P5 - low, ---, jonathan.druart, Pushed to stable , error during web install: 'changed_fields' can't have a default value
16:18 Joubu                   Try with MariaDB instead of MySQL
16:18 ashimema                mysql14..
16:18 vfernandes              thanks oleonard
16:19 oleonard                vfernandes: Is it the OPAC you're asking about?
16:19 qalbaqali               do I need to re install koha again? Or is there somewhere to change the db configs?
16:19 Joubu                   install mariadb-server, then restart koha-common, and try again
16:19 qalbaqali               alright thanks :)
16:19 Joubu                   install mariadb-server, then restart koha-common, cross fingers, and try again
16:20 qalbaqali               Joubu: is koha-common a process that I need to restart?
16:21 Joubu                   `service koha-common restart`
16:21 vfernandes              oleanard any systempreference (opac or intranet related)
16:22 vfernandes              for example: get the value of CircControl
16:24 qalbaqali               Joubu: Failed to restart koha-common.service: The name org.freedesktop.PolicyKit1 was not provided by any .service files See system logs and 'systemctl status koha-common.service' for details.
16:24 vfernandes              something like KOHA.preferences.CircControl
16:24 qalbaqali               ● koha-common.service - LSB: Start required services for each Koha instance    Loaded: loaded (/etc/init.d/koha-common; bad; vendor preset: enabled)    Active: active (exited) since Tue 2019-11-12 07:54:31 PST; 30min ago      Docs: man:systemd-sysv-generator(8)  Nov 12 07:54:31 ubuntu systemd[1]: Starting LSB: Start required services for each Koha instance... Nov 12 07:54:31 ubuntu koha-common[61414]: WARNING: koha-plack requires so
16:25 qalbaqali               Nov 12 07:54:31 ubuntu koha-common[61414]: You can install them with: Nov 12 07:54:31 ubuntu koha-common[61414]:     sudo a2enmod headers proxy_http Nov 12 07:54:31 ubuntu koha-common[61414]: Error: you must provide at least one instance name Nov 12 07:54:31 ubuntu systemd[1]: Started LSB: Start required services for each Koha instance.
16:25 Joubu                   vfernandes: define it in the .tt: var your_pref_value = '[% Koha.Preference('your_pref') %]'; then access it in the .js, using the JS variable
16:27 Joubu                   qalbaqali: follow this guide https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Koha_on_ubuntu_-_packages at the end pick MariaDB instead of MySQL (section "MariaDB or MySQL")
16:28 qalbaqali               alright thank you Joubu :) Ill give it a try tomorrow
16:28 qalbaqali               appreciate the help
16:28 vfernandes              I will go with that solution Joubu
16:28 qalbaqali               The mysql fix is on the unstable?
16:29 Joubu                   the MySQL fix (from 23579) is not released yet
16:37 ashimema                @later tell sev_q any chance you could take another look at bug 23767, I've added a followup to hopefully deal with the total available column now
16:37 huginn                  ashimema: The operation succeeded.
16:45 * oleonard              waves to talljoy
17:04 reiveune                bye
18:23 caroline_crazycatlady   anyone from PTFS-E around?
18:23 caroline_crazycatlady   it's a bit late...
18:51 caroline_crazycatlady   any non-english-speaking library is using the freeform ill backend right now?
18:51 caroline_crazycatlady   trying to figure out how to translate the interface...
19:05 * caroline_crazycatlady jumps on cait
19:05 caroline_crazycatlady   ah! cait! do you use the ill module?
19:12 cait                    hehe
19:12 cait                    i hope one day we will
19:12 cait                    but we still need to build our own backend
19:12 cait                    i have tested a bit a while ago, if it's something generic... maybe i can help
19:12 * cait                  tries to get out from under caroline_crazycatlady
19:13 caroline_crazycatlady   I'm just trying to figure out how to translate the interface
19:15 caroline_crazycatlady   ugh, also, when I create a request, it doesn't appear in the list
19:22 cait                    hm
19:22 cait                    i think i have bad news about translation
19:22 cait                    they didn't make that possible
19:23 rangi                   oh yeah i  remember you pointing that out
19:23 cait                    a lot of strings come from the perl code of the module even...
19:23 caroline_crazycatlady   hm, that sucks
19:23 cait                    and so all you can do is change your backend
19:23 cait                    yep
19:23 cait                    and I will be happy to have other people point that out for a change
19:23 cait                    because usually it's me
19:23 caroline_crazycatlady   oh hi rangi!
19:23 rangi                   thanks for the submissions caroline_crazycatlady !
19:23 cait                    and I am getting very tired of being the bad guy
19:23 cait                    let's be a team of bad guys... maybe get motorcycles
19:23 rangi                   :0
19:24 caroline_crazycatlady   rangi: hopefully, it will get me a trip to nz hehe!!
19:24 caroline_crazycatlady   if I give a talk, Eric will have to send me ;)
19:24 rangi                   :-)
19:24 caroline_crazycatlady   we could have badass librarian jackets
19:25 cait                    oh yep
19:26 rangi                   you could just have translation is important, and then translate it into tons of languages on your jacket :)
19:29 cait                    :)
19:30 caroline_crazycatlady   blou is telling me we are going to change the backend so that it is translatable and submit it on the git... hopefully PTFS-E will accept the change
19:30 cait                    caroline_crazycatlady: that sounds great
19:30 rangi                   yay :)
19:30 cait                    i have been wondering if we could put at least what tcohen figured out on the wiki for the plugins *coughs*
19:31 cait                    because it hink they found a way to do ti for the planned paypal plugin
19:31 cait                    (moving it out of core code)
19:31 cait                    so other plugin writers could adopt it
19:33 caroline_crazycatlady   I think the freeform ILL should be core to Koha and then the other more specific ones as plugins
19:33 caroline_crazycatlady   it makes no sense to me that I have to do all kinds of technical stuff in the conf file to get a basic feature
19:33 oleonard                cait: What do you mean, "what tcohen figured out on the wiki for the plugins" ?
19:36 caroline_crazycatlady   I think she meant to write on the wiki what he figured out about the plugins
19:38 cait                    yep
19:38 cait                    i hoped his ears (or irc client) would be ringing :)
19:38 * cait                  waves at kathryn
19:38 kathryn                 hi cait :)
19:44 oleonard                See y'all later
19:45 magnuse                 cait++ for being the bad guy
19:46 cait                    magnuse: join our gang an dyou might get a cool jacket ;)
19:47 rangi                   has magnuse submitted a talk yet? I dont think so!
19:48 * magnuse               needs a warm jacket
19:48 rangi                   its warm in nz
19:48 rangi                   hint hint
19:48 rangi                   :)
19:49 magnuse                 no talk submitted, but i might go anyway
19:49 magnuse                 hehe
19:50 rangi                   :)
19:52 rangi                   we are thinking for sponsorhip ideas for this year, companies who send someone get an automatic listing as sponsored, so it could be librotech+2 if you and petter, bywater solutions+3 etc .. we'd rather have people come than spend money on sponsoring (both is cool too though hehe)
19:52 magnuse                 nice
19:52 magnuse                 anyone tried unattended-upgrades on a koha server?
19:53 rangi                   yep
19:53 rangi                   but koha-common is blacklisted
19:53 rangi                   on our production machines that is
19:53 magnuse                 yeah, that was what i was thinking of
19:53 rangi                   it works well
19:54 magnuse                 kewl!
19:54 magnuse                 on debian, right?
19:54 rangi                   yup
19:54 rangi                   next thing is bring our servers up to buster
19:54 rangi                   over the next few months
19:55 magnuse                 and buster is... 10?
19:55 rangi                   yup
19:56 rangi                   we have most on 9 (stretch) but still a couple of jessie ones too
19:56 magnuse                 sometimes there is a package that updates a configfile that has been edited manually, and when you run apt-get update you get a question to display the diff, keep the old or replace with the new. how does unattended-upgrades handle that?
19:57 * magnuse               has some servers on jessie too
19:58 rangi                   you can specify it's behaviour
19:58 rangi                   with Dpkg::Options
19:58 rangi                   https://raphaelhertzog.com/2010/09/21/debian-conffile-configuration-file-managed-by-dpkg/
19:58 rangi                   you can put these in your 50-unattended-upgrades file
19:59 rangi                   like
19:59 rangi                   Dpkg::Options { "--force-confdef"; "--force-confold";
19:59 rangi                   }
19:59 rangi                   we have our config under puppet
19:59 rangi                   so we let unattend-upgrades change and puppet puts it back
20:00 magnuse                 cool
20:00 magnuse                 i use ansible
20:00 magnuse                 are you then notified about the changes to the configile? so you can adjust what puppet puts in place?
20:01 magnuse                 i'll read the article :-)
20:01 rangi                   :)
20:27 ashimema                Hi
20:27 wahanui                 bidet, ashimema
20:28 cait                    hello
20:28 wahanui                 bidet, cait
20:29 ashimema                Freeform should certainly be a core thing.. it goes t split out way bad during the original QA cycle if I remember correctly
20:29 ashimema                Yes, translations are high on the agenda but no-one has stepped forward to fund them and the code was significantly more complex to add at the time of original submission
20:29 cait                    we shouldn't do that anymore
20:29 ashimema                More than happy for people to jump on board though.. would love to see ILL flourish
20:29 cait                    it has always been a great pain to add translation afterwards for people
20:30 cait                    for new devs... let's not accept stuff without being translatable anymore please
20:30 magnuse                 +1
20:30 ashimema                Generic send and freeform backend should be merged and put in core
20:30 cait                    i guess we are hurt more than ohters
20:30 ashimema                Well.. we simply wouldn't have been able to submit the code with translation code in it
20:30 cait                    i can cheat someties for German/English... but with the many languages we use now for the Goethe Institute libraires I stand no chance
20:30 ashimema                We already self funding 90% of the development
20:31 cait                    too late for ILL - just for the future
20:32 ashimema                Anywho.. let's not argue that.. it's been in core for a long time now and we're happy to work on adding translatability
20:32 ashimema                As for plugins and backends..
20:34 ashimema                I'm working with tcohen to help move those forward.. we've already added the koha2koha backend into the gitlab repo and he's done some work to port it to working as a plugin.  I intend to write a mail soon to promote that we were going to 'donate' our code as the foundation for a community supported effort for that and the freeform backends as they seem to fit well.. we will of course continue to contribute to them.. included translations
20:34 ashimema                Still working out how to do that right now
20:36 ashimema                So.. yes, we will certainly accept merge requests
20:38 * ashimema              can only fight battles on so many fronts at a time I'm afraid..
20:53 magnuse                 ashimema++
20:56 * ashimema              hopes he didn't sound too grumpy there.. a tad tired
20:59 caroline_crazycatlady   you did sound grumpy, but it's understandable
20:59 caroline_crazycatlady   :)
22:13 alexbuckley             hi everyone!
22:13 caroline_crazycatlady   hi alexbuckley!
22:14 alexbuckley             how are you going caroline_crazycatlady ?
22:14 caroline_crazycatlady   not too bad, and you?
22:14 alexbuckley             yeah I am good thanks, looking forward to summer :)
22:15 caroline_crazycatlady   heh! just got our first snowstorm here :)
22:16 alexbuckley             ooo hopefully it carries on so you get a lovely white christmas :)
22:17 alexbuckley             I have a question you know in the 'Manage numbering patterns' page in the Serials module, you have three different 'columns' x,y, and z does that mean you are restricted to only 3 different peices of data in a numbering pattern? e.g. I can add issue number, vol number, year but what if I wanted to add another value
22:18 alexbuckley             if you're not sure all good, just interested if you can add to the number of data values in a numbering pattern
22:18 caroline_crazycatlady   you have to add it manually when you receive the item
22:18 caroline_crazycatlady   I've had some serials like Vol. 31, No 4 March 2019
22:19 caroline_crazycatlady   Volume is X, No is Y, month is Z and I tell librarians to add 2019 manually upon receipt
22:20 alexbuckley             ahh very interesting, thank you so much for that Caroline that's very helpful! :)
22:24 caroline_crazycatlady   numbering patterns are already so complicated, when I tell them they have to add something manually, they're like "oh ok! that's easy"
22:33 cait                    caroline_crazycatlady++
22:47 alexbuckley             caroline_crazycatlady++ yes they sure are complicated :)
22:47 alexbuckley             hi cait :)
22:48 cait                    hi alexbuckley :)
22:59 caroline_crazycatlady   anyone care to test or qa bug 23983? *grins*
22:59 huginn                  Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=23983 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, koha-bugs, Signed Off , Contextualization of "Order" (verb) vs "Order" (noun)
23:05 caroline_crazycatlady   I should probably ask when it's daytime in France... anyway, too late now with the String freeze starting tomorrow
23:05 caroline_crazycatlady   on that note, good night everyone!