Time Nick Message 05:44 pianohacker mtj++ thanks :) 06:32 reiveune hello 06:55 * andreashm waves 07:27 gaetan_B hello 07:39 huginn` GERMS!!!! 07:39 wahanui Germs originated in Germany, before rapidly spreading throughout the rest of the world. 07:52 cait Documentation Sprint starting soon! 07:52 cait 2 hours :) 08:00 * mirkh waves 08:18 * cait waves back 11:15 cait Documentation Sprint! 11:15 cait waiting for all the merge requests (or questions) :) 11:26 eythian @seen drojf 11:26 huginn` eythian: drojf was last seen in #koha 5 weeks, 0 days, 20 hours, 50 minutes, and 34 seconds ago: <drojf> ping Joubu 12:03 cait eythian: i recommend emailing him :) 12:07 gandaro I wanted to contribute to Koha, but I realized many libraries use Twitter and the likes to communicate with patrons, so I looked at Twitter alternatives and now I am translating Mastodon to German. 12:08 gandaro The Internet is distracting 12:13 marcelr hi #koha 12:13 kidclamp hi marcelr 12:13 marcelr o/ 12:15 cait gandaro: heh 12:21 tcohen morning 13:02 oleonard Anyone here have experience with defining libraries in Koha which aren't real libraries? Are we limited to using jQuery to hide these from menus in the OPAC? 13:06 kidclamp afaik that is the case oleonard, I am assuming you mean things like an 'eresources' branch or 'cataloging' branch 13:06 oleonard Yeah I'm being asked to define an "outreach" branch for tracking circulations from outreach services 13:07 kidclamp does it have to be a branch? could it be patron types? all depends on your process I suppose 13:08 oleonard Yeah I'm still working it through in my head. I'm trying hard to come up with something which doesn't require a new branch 13:08 oleonard The sticking point is: What if an outreach-type patron visits an actual library branch? Then the stats are thrown off. 13:20 kidclamp hmmm...not if your reports take patron type into account 13:28 oleonard I don't think I understand you kidclamp 13:28 oleonard I mean about that last statement, not in general. We don't have time for that. 13:28 kidclamp :-b 13:29 kidclamp I mean, you control what ends up in your stats, you can write circ reports that count an outreach patron depending on where they checkout, or however you want 13:29 kidclamp assuming you use custom reports for stats and not the wizards 13:30 oleonard right, so how do you differentiate the times when an outreach-patron checks something out during a home visit rather than in the library? 13:31 kidclamp oh, hmm 13:34 kidclamp it made sense to me before, but you win, I was thinking a diff branch, but that's what we are trying to avoid - you could change item type when distributing to patrons, or give them two accounts - an outreach account guaranteed by their regular account so they can see all checkouts 13:35 kidclamp bug 14576 would help, move them to outreach before checkout 13:35 huginn` 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=14576 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, nick, Signed Off , Allow arbitrary automatic update of location on checkin 13:37 kidclamp technically you could use a single staff account for outreach checkouts, and use the action logs to see how many checkouts were performed by that staff 13:38 oleonard Yeah I think that's getting into some pretty convoluted territory. 13:38 oleonard Thanks for helping me think it out though kidclamp 13:39 kidclamp thanks for letting me play :-) 13:40 cait oleonard: it's documentation sprint day! :) do you want to rephrase that browser recommendation paragraph? :) 13:40 kidclamp house bound may be useful too but I haven't investigated that 13:42 oleonard cait: How did I fall into this trap?! 13:43 cait I dunno... i am just making a friendly suggestion 13:43 cait guess i got the recruiting hat on... 13:56 oleonard Hello to lots of people joining 13:57 eythian what about those of us who can never leave, huh? 13:58 mveron Hi #koha 13:58 oleonard Get back in the box eythian or you get the hose 13:58 eythian again?!‽ 13:59 oleonard Whoops I just messed up on being friendly to new people. 13:59 kidclamp O meeting time 14:00 oleonard whut 14:01 oleonard I would love to be able to subscribe to a calendar feed for Koha IRC meetings because I'm bad at meetings. 14:01 kidclamp https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/General_IRC_meeting_4_October_2017 14:01 * oleonard did not just volunteer for anything 14:01 kidclamp #action oleonard will fix all the things 14:02 kidclamp #startmeeting General IRC meeting 4 October 2017 14:02 huginn` Meeting started Wed Oct 4 14:02:24 2017 UTC. The chair is kidclamp. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 14:02 huginn` Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. 14:02 huginn` The meeting name has been set to 'general_irc_meeting_4_october_2017' 14:02 kidclamp #topci Introductions 14:02 kidclamp #topic Introductions 14:02 wahanui #info wahanui, a bot that has become sentient 14:02 pastebot "tcohen" at 172.16.248.212 pasted "Joubu, khall, lari" (32 lines) at http://paste.koha-community.org/11 14:02 kidclamp #info Nick Clemens, ByWater Solutions 14:02 oleonard #info Owen Leonard, Athens County Public Libraries, USA 14:02 marcelr #info Marcel de Rooy, Netherlands 14:02 Joubu #info Jonathan Druart 14:02 tcohen #info Tomas Cohen Arazi 14:03 NateC #info Nate Curulla, ByWater 14:03 mveron #info Marc Véron, Switzerland 14:03 d_antonakis #info Dimitris Antonakis, Greece 14:04 khall #info Kyle M Hall, ByWater Solutions 14:04 AdamB #info Adam Brooks, ByWater Solutions 14:04 lisettelatah #info Lisette Scheer, Latah County Library District 14:04 georgewilliams #info George Williams, Northeast Kansas Library System 14:05 rangi #info Chris Cormack (only sorta here actually at a conference in Baltimore) 14:05 indradg #info Indranil Das Gupta 14:06 kidclamp #topic Announcements 14:06 kidclamp #info Today is documentation sprint day! 14:06 kidclamp #info Next wednesday is GBSD! 14:06 kidclamp anyone else? 14:06 tcohen QA day? 14:07 kidclamp are we doing each friday until release? 14:07 Joubu or just do a bit of QA when you have time? 14:07 kidclamp or both? 14:07 wahanui both is, like, best :) 14:08 kidclamp everyday is QA day :-D 14:08 Joubu Basically there are no QA outside of the QA sprint days 14:08 Joubu so I do not think they are a good idea 14:08 marcelr ?? 14:09 kidclamp I think they seem to work for QAers though, a dedicated chunk of time, is easy to schedule, but maybe is a topic for a dev meeting? 14:09 tcohen I think it is a good idea 14:09 tcohen having a QA day a week 14:09 rangi i do feel (and I might be wrong) that since we havent had cait as QA manager a lot less QA is being done. This is no reflection on anyone, or meant to be rude, but I do feel like we now are seeing just how much work she put in. 14:10 marcelr dont forget Joubu 14:10 oleonard cait++ 14:10 mveron cait++ Joubu++ 14:10 tcohen absolutely, she was better than Joubu kicking our butts :-P 14:10 tcohen Joubu++ 14:10 tcohen cait++ 14:10 kidclamp cait++ 14:10 kidclamp Joubu++ 14:10 khall rangi++ 14:11 kidclamp rangi++ 14:11 mveron QAers++ 14:11 tcohen rangi++ 14:11 tcohen I think we should announce it, and communicate to all QAers they need to schedule a day, it will be easier for everyone 14:12 kidclamp +1 14:12 Joubu we communicated about them 14:13 mveron ...and we all know that we should pay attention to bug messages on such days, to fix things... (If we have time...) 14:13 Joubu what you just said is exactly what I did for the last 2 ones 14:13 cait huh? what did i do? 14:13 tcohen Joubu: humans are very weird creatures, don't try to understand 14:14 cait #info Katrin Fischer, BSZ, Germany 14:14 cait sorry, almost missed the meeting 14:15 cait #info Documentation Sprint Day is now and until 4 October had ended everywhere 14:16 cait Joubu++ 14:18 kidclamp I think the QA discussion should continue in email so we can keep this meeting general 14:18 Joubu definitely 14:18 kidclamp #topic Update on releases 14:19 kidclamp cait? 14:19 wahanui cait is the best friend you could ever have. 14:19 cait wow today... 14:19 wahanui today is probably bug-squashing day 14:19 kidclamp wahanui botsnack 14:19 wahanui thanks kidclamp :) 14:19 cait #info 16.11.13 is on schedule for release around 22 October 14:20 cait #info Release managers are trying to coordinate so packages are available on release day 14:20 cait hm 14:20 cait release mainteiners... 14:21 kidclamp fridolin? 14:21 wahanui fridolin is busy at the moment, I asked him to backport the bug fix 14:22 kidclamp Joubu? 14:22 wahanui Joubu is not sure how to fix that correctly 14:22 fridolin kidclamp: yep ? 14:22 wahanui yep. 14:22 kidclamp ah, update on 17.05? 14:22 kidclamp fridolin ^ 14:22 fridolin i'looking at my skedule 14:23 BobB #info Bob Birchall, Calyx, Australia 14:23 Joubu #info if you need update about the RM, read dev meetings minutes or last "what's on in koha-devel" on the koha website 14:23 BobB hi all, just woke up, so here I am :) 14:23 Joubu sorry I cannot repeat myself every week 14:23 kidclamp np Joubu 14:23 fridolin #info Fridolin Somers, Biblibre, France 14:24 fridolin 17.05.05 release after 23 oct i'd say 14:24 Joubu let's move on kidclamp 14:25 kidclamp #topic KohaCon 18 14:25 oleonard #link https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/KohaCon18_Proposals 14:25 kidclamp there is a proposal to vote on new deadline for submissions as the last was not published 14:27 cait that's from me 14:27 cait we agreed on a date, but I didn't see it on the mailing list or bidding page, so I think we should reschedule and announce properly 14:27 oleonard +1 14:27 mveron +1 14:28 kidclamp do you think 2 weeks is sufficient? don't want to push back decision too far 14:28 cait better safe than sorry :) 14:28 tcohen there's only one bid 14:28 tcohen for september 14:28 cait yah, but in case somene says later they wanted to add a bid too 14:29 cait could we extend the bid until the next meeting? 14:29 tcohen one or two weeks won't hurt 14:29 kidclamp next meeting makes sense to me, do we want to vote then? so make the dealine midnight day before 14:29 tcohen +1 14:30 cait sounds good 14:30 georgewilliams +1 14:30 khall +1 14:30 mveron +1 14:30 lisettelatah +1 14:31 kidclamp any dissenters? 14:31 cait if there is only one vote we can announce, if another is added we need to make a survey i think 14:31 cait to stick with procedure 14:31 kidclamp ah, okay 14:32 kidclamp #agreed Dealine for KohaCon 18 submissions extended to end of the day 17 October 2017 14:32 kidclamp you want to send that out cait? 14:33 cait super busy, can someone else do it plz? 14:33 oleonard I'll do it 14:34 kidclamp oleonard++ 14:34 cait oleonard++ 14:34 kidclamp magnuse about? 14:34 tcohen oleonard++ 14:34 kidclamp next topic is his unless anyone else can explain for help files 14:35 cait hm maybe i can help out 14:35 cait sec, looking at the agenda 14:35 cait the basic problem is that the help files included in Koha are copies of the text in the manual 14:35 kidclamp #topic Alternatives for help files 14:36 cait that is not a good way of doing things - it means Nicole manually copied text into each file and submitted patches 14:36 cait and if things get outdated, you have to maintain 2 files 14:36 cait translators have to translate twice 14:36 cait another separate problem: local changes to help files get overwritten on update 14:36 cait the main difference between help files and manual now is that they don't include links and are translated with Koha 14:37 cait I think we need to find a way that pulls things from the manual or maybe even link to it directly 14:37 cait but possibly can only do that once translation for the manula is sorted 14:37 cait there have been several bugs filed aruond the issue that magnuse put on a wiki page: 14:37 cait https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Alternatives_for_help_files 14:38 cait we coud have a script pull the text maybe, but difficult to avoid double work for translators 14:38 cait we could deliver Koha with the manual and link to it 14:38 cait but I guess there is size to consider here 14:39 cait one bug suggests using a wiki... but we just switched to sphinx and I don't think having doubled up docs is feasable 14:39 cait etc. 14:39 cait ideas and such welcome :) 14:39 BobB good explanation cait, thank you 14:39 mveron Bug 18483 allows to have your own local help text. It can exist together with other help systems (managed by a syspref) 14:39 huginn` 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=18483 enhancement, P4, ---, veron, Signed Off , Customised help: Enhance staff client with news based, easily editable help system 14:40 Joubu we could try to generate the help files from the manual, automatically 14:40 cait reading back: not include screenshots, the help files have links, but no pictures 14:40 marcelr is there a way to check if we are not overwriting updated online help ? 14:40 kidclamp #info in a nutshell the issue is that help files duplicate the manual, require doulbe translations, and are overwritten on updates 14:41 kidclamp #link https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Alternatives_for_help_files Current bugs/options for dealing with help files 14:41 cait Joubu: yeah, but how to handle translations? 14:41 Joubu missed that line 14:41 cait kidclamp: nice summary .) 14:42 cait there is actually a lot more interest in translating the manual than I woudl have thought 14:43 cait maybe there is a way to script things to work all together, translate onces, use those translations for help files and a full manual? 14:43 Joubu yes... just highlight the stuffs that are pulled to make them a priority for translators 14:43 cait and have a separte feature to store local additions 14:43 cait it's the same tex 14:43 cait i think we should really try to avoid double translation 14:43 cait it#s super painful 14:43 mveron +1 14:44 cait if the strings are the same, coudl we not take what was translated for the manual and have that in the po file for the help file somehow? 14:47 Joubu I will need to take a closer look, but it sounds tricky 14:47 Joubu do we want offline help? 14:47 kidclamp yes 14:47 Joubu otherwise we could imagine a webservice 14:47 mveron yes 14:48 mveron ..for offline help 14:48 cait I think it might be a requirement in some contexts 14:48 Joubu yes 14:48 Joubu so it sounds tricky :) 14:48 cait a local copy with a configurable url might be an option? 14:49 cait but probably woudl be hard for some to do 14:50 Joubu the easiest would be to point to the manual directly yes, instead of recreating something else based on the manual 14:50 cait not sure, shoudl we get some opinions on that? 14:51 Joubu syspref which points to the k-c.org/manual, but people could clone the manual and modify the pref? 14:51 cait a configurable url would be good anyway, so you can decide which language manual to link to 14:51 cait something like that 14:51 Joubu and we remove all the help/* files from the koha codebase 14:52 cait hm, not sure how mveron's feature would work 14:52 mveron Did you test it? - It works nicely 14:52 cait didn't test, but worried removing the help files would hurt it 14:52 mveron See my comment #21 on 18483 14:53 mveron No. Just some small changes necessary. 14:53 cait Joubu: if we remove help files, where do we store the link to themanual? 14:53 mveron Could be anaged by the syspref i introduced. 14:53 mveron managed (Sorry bad eyes today) 14:53 Joubu we will need a mapping koha page<=>manual 14:53 cait yep 14:54 cait maybeTT plugin and a mapping file? 14:54 cait maybe move the technical discussion out of the meeting 14:54 cait is this solution agreeable to people present? 14:54 kidclamp I+1 14:54 kidclamp +1 14:55 marcelr maybe first present it to the dev list ? 14:55 mveron +1 14:55 cait maybe translators too? 14:55 cait and i think we can't make the move before it's possible again to translate the manual 14:56 mveron Yes, translating the manual is a must 14:56 magnuse #info Magnus Enger, Libriotech, Norway 14:56 rangi i havent caught up with bernardo yet sorry 14:57 kidclamp #info proposal is a syspref/mapping to local files and other wise pointing to the manual on the web 14:57 cait hm ok, let's send the proposal once we have checked with bernardo 14:57 kidclamp #info email will be sent to devs/translators once manual translation is sorted again 14:57 cait you can action item me for that 14:58 kidclamp #action cait will check with bernardo and send proposal 14:58 kidclamp magnuse: once you catch up on scrollback let us know if you have additions 14:58 kidclamp your topic was hijacked :-) 14:58 cait I had talked to him about it before, so I hope it was ok :) 14:59 mveron Did anybody try out Bug 18483? 14:59 huginn` 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=18483 enhancement, P4, ---, veron, Signed Off , Customised help: Enhance staff client with news based, easily editable help system 14:59 * magnuse wanted to spark a discussion and seems to have succeeded :-) 14:59 reiveune bye 15:00 magnuse Nothing special to add, I think 15:00 kidclamp we are at an hour - next meeting 18 October 2017, 21 UTC? 15:01 kidclamp or maybe 19 UTC? later is better for NZ I think, but earlier sometimes nets more people? I am open 15:03 oleonard Neither are great for me, but 21UTC is better, FWIW 15:03 cait daylight savings soon now, so things are moving around a bit 15:03 cait late here, but not impossible :) 15:04 kidclamp yeah, 21 is 5 here so is workable 15:04 kidclamp #topic Next meeting 15:04 kidclamp #info next meeting: 18 October 2017, 21 UTC 15:05 kidclamp last chance everyone ;-b 15:06 kidclamp #endmeeting 15:06 huginn` Meeting ended Wed Oct 4 15:06:03 2017 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) 15:06 huginn` Minutes: http://meetings.koha-community.org/2017/general_irc_meeting_4_october_2017.2017-10-04-14.02.html 15:06 huginn` Minutes (text): http://meetings.koha-community.org/2017/general_irc_meeting_4_october_2017.2017-10-04-14.02.txt 15:06 huginn` Log: http://meetings.koha-community.org/2017/general_irc_meeting_4_october_2017.2017-10-04-14.02.log.html 15:06 cait kidclamp++ 15:06 mveron kidclamp++ 15:06 kidclamp thanks all! 15:06 oleonard kidclamp++ 15:06 lisettelatah kidclamp++ 15:09 fridolin kidclamp++ 15:12 rangi ok i better go find what room im sposta be in, cyas later 15:15 tcohen bye rangi! 15:24 cait oleonard++ first Documentation Spritn contributor! 15:25 oleonard First documentation contribution ever for me, I think. Only took me 15 years or so. 15:25 cait even more awesome 15:25 cait did the instructions work ok for you? 15:26 oleonard As a gitlab user, perfectly. 15:27 cait please feel free to improve them, I am still in an early beginner's stage 15:27 cait also anyone, if you have ideas/todos or want to grab a task: https://annuel2.framapad.org/p/KohaManualTodo 15:28 cait for example checking the authorised values documented for missing ones is an easy one to do 16:07 Joubu oleonard: I contacted wizzyrea about the Koha [meetings] agenda, I really like the idea 16:07 Joubu we could have a shared agenda (several people could add stuffs to it) and then display the date on the website 16:07 Joubu and people could add it to their own agenda. Awesome, right? ) 16:08 Joubu nobody will miss the meetings 16:14 Joubu @later tell cait could you push 19391 and double check 18794 (marked as pushed but not in 16.11.x), it will turn jenkins green (hopefully) 16:14 huginn` Joubu: The operation succeeded. 16:30 huginn` New commit(s) kohagit: Bug 19122: (bug 18098 follow-up) Fix IncludeSeeFromInSearches behaviour <http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=commitdiff;h=10b5e1ee049605ae6a0614214a7dab76e20e0ca5> 17:13 jenkins Project Koha_Master_D8 build #277: UNSTABLE in 50 min: https://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_Master_D8/277/ 17:13 jenkins Jonathan Druart: Bug 19122: (bug 18098 follow-up) Fix IncludeSeeFromInSearches behaviour 17:13 huginn` 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=19122 major, P5 - low, ---, jonathan.druart, Pushed to Master , IncludeSeeFromInSearches is broken 17:13 huginn` 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=18098 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, tomascohen, RESOLVED FIXED, Add an index with the count of not onloan items 17:14 Joubu can someone ban this stupid bot from this channel? 17:41 pastebot "tcohen" at 172.16.248.212 pasted "{ "match": { "name": "_match"," (36 lines) at http://paste.koha-community.org/12 18:05 eythian http://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/radical-reference-collective interesting 19:32 * cait waves 19:35 alexbuckley_ hi cait 19:42 cait hi alexbuckley_ :) 19:46 cait Joubu++ thx! (images) 19:46 Joubu PR is coming soon ;) 19:55 cait @later tell tcohen 19:55 huginn` cait: (later tell <nick> <text>) -- Tells <nick> <text> the next time <nick> is in seen. <nick> can contain wildcard characters, and the first matching nick will be given the note. 20:15 wizzyrea Joubu, i got your mail 20:15 wizzyrea you are going to have to more explicitly tell me your requirements :) 20:16 Joubu I'd like to have a meetings agenda (to start), to share with other people 20:16 Joubu the /agenda url on the k-c.org website looks like what I want 20:16 wizzyrea easy thing 20:16 Joubu but I guess we need to link it with a public agenda (like google?) 20:16 wizzyrea will require research 20:16 wizzyrea (but not a lot of it) 20:17 wizzyrea do you have an example of the public agenda you are trying to integrate with? 20:17 Joubu nope :) 20:17 wizzyrea hehe 20:17 wizzyrea ok! 20:17 * LeeJ waves 20:17 LeeJ hi #koha 20:18 wizzyrea we are currently putting these on the wiki right? 20:18 wizzyrea or are you saying 20:18 wizzyrea that you want koha-community.org/agenda 20:18 wizzyrea to redirect to the wiki? 20:18 wizzyrea which is an easy enough thing to do 20:18 wizzyrea I think 20:18 Prisila Manage libraries by venues 20:20 Prisila How to group libraries by headquarters, thank you very much 20:21 Joubu wizzyrea: I want people able to add an agenda to their own agenda 20:21 Joubu We (...I) will add the meeting dates to this agenda 20:21 * wizzyrea ponders 20:21 Joubu I have created one public google agenda, I have trouble to find a link to share with you... 20:21 wizzyrea hey links are good 20:22 Joubu https://calendar.google.com/calendar/embed?src=9favfolvgbh721ar2uusnbddlo%40group.calendar.google.com&ctz=America/Argentina/Buenos_Aires 20:22 Joubu I guess it is the one 20:23 wizzyrea oh 20:23 Joubu hum, tz may be wrong :) 20:23 wizzyrea so you just want a calendar entry? 20:23 wizzyrea that's fine, it's easy 20:23 Joubu it seems that the plugin used by the website can do that 20:23 wizzyrea yep 20:23 Joubu just make it adds events from this agenda to the one on the website 20:23 wizzyrea I thought you were asking for something more complicated than that :) 20:24 wizzyrea naw, i can give you rights to add events there, unless there is some reason why you'd rather use google? 20:24 wizzyrea there = the koha community website 20:24 wizzyrea I think the community calendar lets you do ical things 20:24 wizzyrea but I'll check 20:25 Joubu I think it is easier to have a google agenda, shared with several guys from the community, than add accounts to the website 20:25 wizzyrea most of the people doing it already have accounts 20:28 wizzyrea there was some reason why we turned off the calendar on the website 20:28 wizzyrea I'm trying to remember what it was 20:52 cait kidclamp++ another documentation contributor! 20:52 kidclamp cait++ 20:52 cait if you want to try it out, i can find a small task to do, just let me know! 20:54 cait wizzyrea maybe? :) 21:01 Joubu @later tell oleonard Is there a good reason not to update jquery libs for the opac? 21:01 huginn` Joubu: The operation succeeded. 21:13 wizzyrea wait what 21:13 wahanui is Godot coming? 21:13 wizzyrea best response