Time  Nick             Message
21:31 cait             night drojf
21:31 cait             night drotsk
21:31 drojf            and good night #koha
21:31 drojf            hi wizzyrea
21:28 cait             hi wizzyrea
21:25 wizzyrea         hi'
21:18 drojf            that's my style :D
21:17 cait             believe what you want
21:17 drojf            cait: never!
21:16 cait             weren't you there?
21:16 cait             drojf: ?
21:11 drojf            who would set 7 UTC as a meeting time? :/
20:56 tcohen           later #koha
20:49 huginn           rangi: The operation succeeded.
20:49 rangi            @later tell joubu cherry-picked the commit over, thanks
20:44 tcohen           anyway, things to talk later I guess
20:44 tcohen           i really like it
20:44 tcohen           maintainable
20:44 tcohen           but the way it introduces permissions on the swagger file is really handy
20:43 tcohen           i'm not a swagger expert as others might be here
20:43 tcohen           i have doubts about several things
20:43 cait             cool :)
20:43 tcohen           i started today
20:42 cait             qa it? :)
20:42 cait             heh
20:42 * tcohen         really likes that patchset
20:41 tcohen           if he doesn't backport 14868 I'd vote to just revert the patches
20:40 huginn           04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=16815 critical, P5 - low, ---, julian.maurice, ASSIGNED , API routes to list, create, update, delete holds need permissions
20:40 cait             bug 16815
20:39 tcohen           otherwise we need patches for 16815
20:39 tcohen           sure, I asked fredericd if he would backport it
20:39 drojf            next month :)
20:38 huginn           04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=14868 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, larit, Needs Signoff , REST API: Swagger2-driven permission checking
20:38 tcohen           it is fixed by bug 14868, which needs to go the QA process
20:37 tcohen           it's a pity
20:36 drojf            yes i have the same window open ;)
20:36 tcohen           that's from the 16.05.x branch
20:36 tcohen           https://snag.gy/HXFwPJ.jpg
20:36 drojf            hm ok i think i will leave them out then for this one
20:36 tcohen           this:
20:35 wahanui          the next one is from you: 4373
20:35 tcohen           and the next one
20:34 drojf            or are more commits relevant?
20:34 tcohen           exactly
20:34 drojf            tcohen: ithe problem is only http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=commit;h=0f706677bd4016816f903c740a8ac0e361aa9f78 right?
20:30 rangi            heh
20:29 tcohen           rangi: it seems tonight I'll be using my PS3 overnight until some dev meeting he
20:29 rangi            heya tcohen
20:29 tcohen           hi rangi
20:27 huginn           rangi: The operation succeeded.
20:26 rangi            @later tell Joubu ahh yep thanks, ill fix that in the template for the next release
20:22 huginn           tcohen: ashimema was last seen in #koha 1 week, 5 days, 6 hours, 56 minutes, and 0 seconds ago: <ashimema> took me a while to get down there ;)
20:22 tcohen           @seen ashimema
20:21 cait             kidclamp++
20:20 cait             trying not to burn things
20:12 cait             ah sorry, got distracted (cooking dinner)
20:06 Chris_           Thanks let me check
20:05 kidclamp         it looks like a bug that is fixed in the next release
20:04 huginn           04Bug 16670: normal, P5 - low, ---, jonathan.druart, Pushed to Stable , CGI->param used in list context
20:04 kidclamp         Chris_ : https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=16670
19:56 Chris_           Staff members are not allowed to discharge borrowers, nor borrowers to request a discharge.
19:55 cait             what does it say?
19:54 Chris_           yes
19:54 cait             what happens when you checkout? a message is shown?
19:53 Chris_           3.22.08.00
19:53 cait             which version are you using?
19:50 Chris_           this happens when I try to checkout aything
19:49 Chris_           Staff members are not allowed to discharge borrowers, nor borrowers to request a discharge.
19:49 kidclamp         what's the issue Chris_?
19:49 Chris_           Good day.  Can anyone assist with an issue I aM having with my koha?
19:18 cait             ... reading today's mailing list mails
19:18 cait             Joubu++
17:54 huginn           04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=17173 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, jonathan.druart, ASSIGNED , Quick edit a subfield in frameworks
17:54 Joubu            I did on bug 17173...
17:50 Joubu            Can we deliberate add hidden features?
17:37 cait             i am not sure, i have never treid it - maybe it falls back to a keyword search, but that's not usually waht you wnt
17:36 vbman213         can search index be blank?
17:34 vbman213         trying again
17:33 vbman213         I added a search field for 949i
17:30 vbman213         is it possible to add fields to the index?
17:28 cait             for search
17:28 cait             949 is probably not indexed
17:28 cait             vbman213: in order to match there needs to be an index on the field
17:22 drojf            try score 2
17:17 vbman213         I have a match rule with a threshold of 1, and one match point 949$i with a score of 1
17:17 vbman213         greetings! I have a quick question concerning match rules and importing. I'm trying to migrate my school's old LibSoft MARC records into Koha. LibSoft includes the barcode as a 949$i field. I am having a hard time matching incoming records against current records by comparing the 949$i value
17:06 kidclamp         that was a nice solution to that bug
17:05 kidclamp_webinar Joubu++
16:17 cait             ok
16:16 huginn           04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=17135 blocker, P5 - low, ---, koha-bugs, NEW , Fine for the previous overdue may get overwritten by the next one
16:16 fredericd        Since when bug 17135 is there.
16:15 fredericd        A mid-term 16.05.03 could be released in a week if necessary
16:14 cait             i am still trying to understand it actually, i have added a few question to tomorrow's dev meeting actually
16:14 cait             because the rest api is automatically activated I was told
16:14 cait             hm isn't it a security leak?
16:14 fredericd        cait: Yes, you're correct about Tomas demand, but it's not that bad, from my perspective, since it isn't a regression. It's just about REST API
16:13 cait             oh, i just relaized there is already a 16.05.03 - too late?
16:13 cait             I think tomas also sent an email about something related to the API
16:12 cait             I think we might need another day to figure things out as t looks like
16:12 huginn           04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=15675 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, kyle, RESOLVED FIXED, Add issue_id column to accountlines and use it for updating fines
16:12 cait             bug 15675
16:12 cait             caused by 15675
16:11 cait             yes
16:11 fredericd        So it's a regression on 17.05 (bug 17135), which is bad
16:10 cait             a problem that has been introduced more recently than the other bug
16:09 huginn           04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=17135 blocker, P5 - low, ---, koha-bugs, NEW , Fine for the previous overdue may get overwritten by the next one
16:09 cait             what we are trying to do is fix bug 17135 there
16:08 cait             sec
16:08 cait             the bug description is misleading
16:08 cait             not sure if we can make it work
16:08 cait             more to get it into this maintenance release maybe
16:06 fredericd        Ok. Do you mean you would like to get this patch into stable branch before it is pushed into master branch?
16:03 huginn           04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=14390 major, P5 - low, ---, kyle, Signed Off , Fine not updated from 'FU' to 'F' on renewal
16:03 cait             it's bug 14390
16:03 cait             that i was hoping we could get into the maint release
16:03 cait             there is a patch for fixing broken fine calculation
16:02 fredericd        cait: yes
15:48 drojf            bye #koha
15:43 gaetan_B         bye
15:33 kidclamp         bye LibraryClaire
15:33 LibraryClaire    laters #koha
15:33 drojf            maybe we can crowdsource it. and send them one by one
15:31 Joubu            drojf: I decided to dedicate my time to something useful indeed :)
15:31 drojf            Joubu: do it! :D
15:29 morgane          bye #koha
15:23 Joubu            I wanted to list them, but... it could have scared him a bit
15:22 drojf            hm ok. 3.8.24 is only 26 months old. how many security fixes can we have had in that time
15:13 tcohen           ha
15:11 drojf            koha 3.8 with mysql 5.7
15:10 francharb        ;)
15:10 francharb        the demo was good
15:09 drojf            it makes him special
15:09 drojf            so that he has something to talk about
15:09 drojf            he only likes ancient koha i guess
15:09 drojf            he is a mysql hipster
15:09 drojf            or… find somebody that takes him seriously
15:09 oleonard         I wonder if he subscribes to other software-related mailing lists so that he can tell people not to upgrade there too?
15:09 drojf            less chance to do damage
15:09 drojf            ok, better than on the main list. i guess
15:08 oleonard         So that he can post messages like that, of course.
15:08 drojf            why is the other paul on the dev list in the first place? :/
15:08 drojf            Joubu++
15:03 LibraryClaire    hah
15:03 eythian          Joubu: now you see the need to escape!
15:03 LibraryClaire    light...
15:03 Joubu            Amstel light...
15:02 eythian          sometimes, yes
15:02 eythian          http://www.stag-amsterdam.com/images/katakt/Beer_bus(1).jpg
15:02 drojf            or, tasty
15:02 Joubu            sounds scary
15:02 Joubu            :D
15:02 drojf            are they on bikes?
15:02 drojf            followed by beers
15:02 drojf            great picture in my head
15:01 LibraryClaire    eythian: sounds nice
15:00 eythian          LibraryClaire: yeah, I have plans to go biking a bit around the west part of the city followed by beers.
14:59 marcelr          oh i see what you mean :)
14:59 marcelr          careful Joubu
14:58 * Joubu          fell into the trap
14:54 huginn           04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=14390 major, P5 - low, ---, kyle, Needs Signoff , Fine not updated from 'FU' to 'F' on renewal
14:54 marcelr          khall: please look at bug 14390 (again) thx
14:50 LibraryClaire    mind you, bed would also be nice
14:48 huginn           oleonard: The current temperature in Heatherstone, Athens, Ohio is 24.6°C (10:48 AM EDT on August 23, 2016). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 57%. Dew Point: 16.0°C. Pressure: 30.32 in 1027 hPa (Steady).
14:48 oleonard         @wunder 45701
14:47 LibraryClaire    45 mins til I go find pimms
14:47 huginn           LibraryClaire: The current temperature in London City, United Kingdom is 30.0°C (3:20 PM BST on August 23, 2016). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 37%. Dew Point: 14.0°C. Pressure: 30.15 in 1021 hPa (Steady).
14:47 LibraryClaire    @wunder LCY
14:46 eythian          why am I still inside?
14:46 huginn           eythian: The current temperature in Schiphol, Badhoevedorp, Netherlands is 27.2°C (4:37 PM CEST on August 23, 2016). Conditions: Partly Cloudy. Humidity: 51%. Dew Point: 16.0°C. Pressure: 30.24 in 1024 hPa (Falling).
14:46 eythian          @wunder ams
14:07 oleonard         But the padding might need to be adujsted
14:07 oleonard         Thanks. In this revision all errors are displayed in an unordered list which use icons as bullets. It looks a little odd when there is only one list item.
14:07 Joubu            oleonard: I think it's the same for other messages as well
13:59 Joubu            oleonard: The selected template (id=11) does not exist or no action is defined.
13:58 oleonard         Joubu: What is the text of the error message which is displaying incorrectly?
13:56 cait             fredericd: around?
13:47 huginn           New commit(s) kohagit: Bug 17050: (QA followup) Use Mojo::Transaction to get the remote address <http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=commitdiff;h=adbcaa99f4f1a0dc3c739cb15b4d3039d2a79c9e> / Bug 17050: Do not kick the session out when accessing the REST API <http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=commitdiff;h=b5fc3d29373d2b6eecd9f3d26c798d603dae7d84>
13:46 Joubu            ;)
13:45 tcohen           i just did a qa followup
13:45 Joubu            you are author, and you qaed
13:45 tcohen           i don't think so
13:44 Joubu            tcohen: you are cheating
13:43 oleonard         No I'll look right now
13:42 Joubu            oleonard: do you want me to let a comment?
13:42 oleonard         Okay Joubu I will take another look
13:41 Joubu            it's text-align: left; padding-left: 25%;
13:41 Joubu            oleonard: there is something weird. If I select a template without action, I get the warning in the msg box, but not centered
13:41 huginn           04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=16918 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, jweaver, Needs Signoff , opacmain.pl is not running under plack
13:41 kidclamp         bug 16918 would be a nice thing to get in to master
13:38 drojf            oleonard: and "open source did not do whatever" is a cheap excuse to do proprietary junk
13:38 oleonard         I thought that would allow the display to be more compact.
13:38 oleonard         The type was being used to change the style of the dialog. In my update the type is used to display a different icon instead
13:37 Joubu            great :)
13:37 oleonard         I understand Joubu
13:37 Joubu            1sec
13:37 Joubu            for instance ....
13:37 Joubu            oleonard: on 17147 why did you decide to remove the "type" of message to display?
13:23 oleonard         He must not have /really/ thought open source was going to change things if he never got involved.
13:23 oleonard         Some people would prefer to develop and sell a competing product rather than contribute to something.
13:22 drojf            oleonard: patches welcome
13:19 tcohen           Joubu: I agree on setting it to whatever the session timeout pref is set
13:18 oleonard         I guess I shouldn't expect otherwise.
13:18 oleonard         Disappointing to hear Tim Spalding bad-mouth Koha and Evergreen. http://libux.co/038-tim-spalding/ (around 20:00).
13:15 marcelr          Joubu: pick the minimum of timeout pref and 24 hours
13:14 Joubu            oleonard: I will PQA it, and see if we should remove the other check on another bug report.
13:08 Joubu            oleonard: let me check again the code of the discharges
13:05 Joubu            (too many discussions for a number)
13:05 Joubu            so maybe the best would be to set it to the value of timeout pref
13:05 Joubu            I think 8 is too low, because of the use case I described on the bug (comment 3,4 or something)
13:04 Joubu            marcelr suggested to decrease it to 8 hours
13:04 Joubu            MaxAge will invalidate token. the default is 7 days, which is too high
13:03 marcelr          tcohen understands everything, i heard
13:02 marcelr          but could send a patch :_
13:02 tcohen           Joubu: I don't understand the problemd domain :-DD
13:02 marcelr          no sorry i reduce this locally
13:01 Joubu            I thought you sent a patch to reduce the default value
13:00 marcelr          or test if the pref is smaller than 7 days LOL
12:59 marcelr          Joubu: the default is very high, and you could extend 7 days to 4 months
12:57 Joubu            s/use/us
12:57 Joubu            tcohen: could you have a look at 17110 and tell use if you agree to set maxAge => pref('timeoutsomething')
12:56 marcelr          very good
12:56 Joubu            I'd like to make sure we agree first :)
12:55 marcelr          ok
12:55 Joubu            not necessarily, I can write it
12:55 marcelr          for the csrf expiry only, i mean
12:55 marcelr          do you expect me to send a follow-up ?
12:55 Joubu            it's a bit related
12:55 marcelr          heh
12:55 Joubu            and why not to use the same value?
12:54 marcelr          i reduced it to 4 hours
12:54 marcelr          just something similar is the very high value of the timeout pref
12:54 Joubu            if you agree it's fine by me
12:53 marcelr          well 24 hours then?
12:53 Joubu            marcelr: I agree it's hard to know what would be the best for the most common uses
12:52 marcelr          Joubu: of course we can
12:52 huginn           04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=17110 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, m.de.rooy, Signed Off , Lower CSRF expiry in Koha::Token
12:52 Joubu            marcelr: hi! I understand the security (bug 17110), but don't you think you should not extend it a bit to cover the use case I described?
12:52 marcelr          wahanui is a monster
12:50 LibraryClaire    >:)
12:49 wahanui          ouch!
12:49 * LibraryClaire  pokes wahanui
12:49 oleonard         Scary.
12:49 wahanui          i heard LibraryClaire was the monster under my bed
12:49 tcohen           hey LibraryClaire
12:49 LibraryClaire    and hi tcohen
12:49 marcelr          hello LibraryClaire
12:49 LibraryClaire    hi marcelr
12:47 marcelr          coffee!
12:46 tcohen           vagrant up & get a coffee
12:46 marcelr          hola tcohen
12:46 tcohen           hi cait nengard marcelr
12:46 marcelr          :)
12:46 * nengard        waves
12:45 * cait           waves
12:45 marcelr          hi #koha
12:45 huginn           nengard: The current temperature in North Acres, Austin, Texas is 25.7°C (7:43 AM CDT on August 23, 2016). Conditions: Mostly Cloudy. Humidity: 89%. Dew Point: 24.0°C. Pressure: 30.14 in 1020 hPa (Falling).
12:45 nengard          @wunder 78754
12:43 huginn           tcohen: The current temperature in Cordoba, Argentina is 10.0°C (9:00 AM ART on August 23, 2016). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 54%. Dew Point: 1.0°C. Pressure: 30.09 in 1019 hPa (Rising).
12:43 tcohen           @wunder cordoba, argentina
12:43 tcohen           bonjour
12:37 huginn           drojf: The current temperature in Berlin Tegel, Germany is 23.0°C (2:20 PM CEST on August 23, 2016). Conditions: Mostly Cloudy. Humidity: 65%. Dew Point: 16.0°C. Pressure: 30.30 in 1026 hPa (Steady).
12:37 drojf            @wunder berlin, germany
12:37 huginn           LibraryClaire: The current temperature in London City, United Kingdom is 29.0°C (1:20 PM BST on August 23, 2016). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 40%. Dew Point: 14.0°C. Pressure: 30.18 in 1022 hPa (Falling).
12:37 LibraryClaire    @wunder LCY
12:36 nengard          Koha needs it!!!!!
12:36 nengard          don't let it die
12:36 nengard          someone has to pick it up
12:35 nengard          no no no no no
12:35 * oleonard       fears Rancor will be abandoned now that pianohacker isn't around to maintain it
12:34 cait             i think we'd use it too... but we are missing the authority linking
12:34 cait             :)
12:34 oleonard         The catalogers here just tried Rancor for the first time and are very excited
12:27 huginn           akawa: I'll give you the answer as soon as RDA is ready
12:27 akawa            @drojf You're right. The question is: Is is possible after a newly created book, to add some data of it in an RFID tag within koha?
12:24 eythian          sheer madness
12:23 huginn           eythian: The current temperature in Schiphol, Badhoevedorp, Netherlands is 26.3°C (2:22 PM CEST on August 23, 2016). Conditions: Partly Cloudy. Humidity: 57%. Dew Point: 17.0°C. Pressure: 30.29 in 1026 hPa (Falling).
12:23 eythian          @wunder ams
12:13 huginn           Joubu: The operation succeeded.
12:13 Joubu            @later tell fredericd from the release notes of 16.5.3 "The branch for this version of Koha and future bugfixes in this release line is 16.05.x. The last Koha release was 3.22.8, which was released on June 24, 2016."
12:12 Joubu            hum, same for 16.5
12:12 huginn           Joubu: The operation succeeded.
12:12 Joubu            @later tell rangi from the release notes of 3.20.14 : "The branch for this version of Koha and future bugfixes in this release  line is 3.20.x. The last Koha release was 3.16.9, which was released on  March 29, 2015"
12:09 LibraryClaire    pics or it didn't happen
12:09 oleonard         My official Koha patching outfit
12:08 LibraryClaire    yes!
12:07 cait             with hoodie and ears?
12:07 cait             lol
12:07 LibraryClaire    onesie
12:07 cait             you shoud get you a leopard print outfit for marseille :)
12:06 oleonard         Soon I will be more leopard than man.
12:05 LibraryClaire    :D
12:00 cait             oh leopard...
11:59 * cait           will never see oleonard the same way again
11:53 LibraryClaire    hi oleonard :)
11:48 oleonard         Hi #koha
11:12 LibraryClaire    :D
11:12 * cait           promises to bake more another time
11:12 cait             and hi drojf
11:12 LibraryClaire    :'(
11:12 cait             LibraryClaire: sorry, all gone in minutes yesterday
11:02 drojf            akawa: your chance to get an answer might be better if you just ask a question
10:46 akawa            anyone has experience with koha-rfid? Id like to ask a few questions.
08:51 eythian          yep, same here
08:51 huginn           eythian: The current temperature in Schiphol, Badhoevedorp, Netherlands is 22.4°C (10:47 AM CEST on August 23, 2016). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 77%. Dew Point: 18.0°C. Pressure: 30.30 in 1026 hPa (Steady).
08:51 LibraryClaire    slowly creeping up
08:51 eythian          @wunder ams
08:51 huginn           LibraryClaire: The current temperature in London City, United Kingdom is 22.0°C (9:20 AM BST on August 23, 2016). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 50%. Dew Point: 11.0°C. Pressure: 30.24 in 1024 hPa (Steady).
08:51 LibraryClaire    @wunder LCY
08:49 huginn           drojf: The current temperature in Rue du Capitaine Jean Maridor, Berlin, Germany is 20.6°C (10:41 AM CEST on August 23, 2016). Conditions: Light Rain. Humidity: 79%. Dew Point: 17.0°C. Pressure: 30.30 in 1026 hPa (Steady).
08:49 drojf            @wunder txl
08:49 drojf            "heatwave"
08:49 huginn           drojf: The current temperature in Berlin Tegel, Germany is 19.0°C (10:20 AM CEST on August 23, 2016). Conditions: Light Rain. Humidity: 78%. Dew Point: 15.0°C. Pressure: 30.30 in 1026 hPa (Steady).
08:49 drojf            @wunder berlin, germany
08:28 * LibraryClaire  wonders if cait has any muffins left...
08:07 eythian          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3KszJHdraSY <-- this is hilarious
08:07 LibraryClaire    and for tomorrow
08:07 LibraryClaire    same here
08:02 eythian          forecast for 30 today o.O
08:01 huginn           eythian: The current temperature in Schiphol, Badhoevedorp, Netherlands is 20.6°C (10:00 AM CEST on August 23, 2016). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 81%. Dew Point: 17.0°C. Pressure: 30.30 in 1026 hPa (Steady).
08:01 eythian          @wunder ams
08:01 eythian          hi also reiveune, gaetan_B
08:01 LibraryClaire    hi eythian
08:01 eythian          hi LibraryClaire, cait, drojf, huginn
07:58 * LibraryClaire  waits for the heat to begin
07:58 huginn           LibraryClaire: The current temperature in London City, United Kingdom is 20.0°C (8:50 AM BST on August 23, 2016). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 64%. Dew Point: 13.0°C. Pressure: 30.24 in 1024 hPa (Falling).
07:58 LibraryClaire    @wunder LCY
07:48 LibraryClaire    hi cait, hi drojf :)
07:48 drojf            guten morgen LibraryClaire und cait
07:47 cait             morning LibraryClaire, #koha
07:47 LibraryClaire    morning #koha
07:24 gaetan_B         hello
07:15 reiveune         hello
07:01 fridolin         hie
06:48 morgane          hi #koha
06:29 huginn           drojf: The current temperature in Berlin Tegel, Germany is 19.0°C (8:20 AM CEST on August 23, 2016). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 78%. Dew Point: 15.0°C. Pressure: 30.27 in 1025 hPa (Steady).
06:29 drojf            @wunder berlin, germany
06:28 drojf            morning #koha
04:54 Oak              :)
04:54 papa             oh hi :)
04:54 Oak              hello wizzyrea !
04:53 * Oak            waves
04:53 Oak              papa++
04:53 wizzyrea         papa++ because he's awesome
00:04 jcamins          I suppose I could also save space if I had some sort of loop that I attached to the wall to run the cables through. Then at least I could have the cables behind my desk when the tablets aren't there, and when they are, stack them in the corner.
00:01 wizzyrea         magazine racks might also work
00:01 jcamins          Also, I need to find one that doesn't require drilling a hole in the wall, since the preferred location is directly over my ethernet run.
00:00 wizzyrea         that was our challenge