Time  Nick        Message
23:49 huginn`     cdickinson: The current temperature in Wellington, New Zealand is 10.0°C (11:30 AM NZST on July 07, 2015). Conditions: Mostly Cloudy. Humidity: 66%. Dew Point: 4.0°C. Pressure: 29.56 in 1001 hPa (Rising).
23:49 cdickinson  @wunder nzwn
23:47 rangi       Computer Programming as an Art
23:46 eythian     rangi: it's in the shelf beside you
23:46 eythian     hello papa
23:46 rangi       in his i think 2nd book
23:46 rangi       donald knuth
23:46 cait        where is that quote from?
23:44 rangi       "The real problem is that programmers have spent far too much time worrying about efficiency in the wrong places and at the wrong times; premature optimization is the root of all evil (or at least most of it) in programming. " :)
23:44 rangi       i feel like it's massively overengineered
23:43 wizzyrea    I suspect not many.
23:43 * wizzyrea  wonders how many devs they've got going on that at one time.
23:42 rangi       you're a uni, you should understand sample size ... a sample size of 1 .. ... not the best
23:41 wizzyrea    these are excellent points.
23:41 rangi       *nod*
23:41 eythian     also, if they're the third library in the world to implement it, I don't see how they could possibly expect it to not be buggy.
23:40 rangi       done even
23:40 rangi       when all you have down is implement one FOSS system
23:40 rangi       i dont think you can say this Large-scale open-source implementation is challenging. FOSS requires a trade-off of convenience for control.
23:40 eythian     bloody ell
23:40 eythian     > By go-live, we had an optimum server specification that didn’t crash with concurrent users: 8-cores, 64GB RAM, and two hard-drive partitions of 32GB for boot and 128GB for the application. Crucially we also increased the RAM allocated to Java for running Tomcat: from 3GB to 16GB.
23:39 rangi       i think there conclusions are wrong
23:39 eythian     that sure does sound enterprise alright
23:39 eythian     > After Chicago went live, they were restarting the application regularly during the working day because it kept crashing.
23:38 eythian     http://www.ariadne.ac.uk/sites/default/files/issue74/barron/figure2.png <-- especially with that picture
23:38 eythian     it sounds enterprisey
23:37 cait        [off] interesting read about one of the first Kuali OLE implementations - http://www.ariadne.ac.uk/issue74/barron
23:36 cait        it feels warmer than that. can't sleep
23:36 huginn`     eythian: The current temperature in Wellington, New Zealand is 9.0°C (11:00 AM NZST on July 07, 2015). Conditions: Light Rain. Humidity: 71%. Dew Point: 4.0°C. Pressure: 29.53 in 1000 hPa (Falling).
23:36 eythian     @wunder nzwn
23:35 eythian     snow is forecast for here today, which is a very different thing from 23.1°
23:35 eythian     hi cait
23:32 huginn`     cait: The current temperature in Bodensee Konstanz City, Konstanz, Germany is 23.1°C (1:31 AM CEST on July 07, 2015). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 83%. Dew Point: 20.0°C. Pressure: 30.06 in 1018 hPa (Falling).
23:32 cait        @wunder Konstanz
21:37 pianohacker glad to hear you agree, though. Thanks for the feedback, cait :)
21:37 pianohacker which matches its general motto of offering the cataloger control, but...
21:36 pianohacker There's very tricky programming issues behind synchronizing information between hidden and non-hidden subfields on the same field, so at present Rancor shows everything
21:35 pianohacker Exactly, yeah. And rancor ignores that completely at present (including the 999, which can't actually be corrupted but which I'd like to hide)
21:35 cait        yeah i think it makes sense to me how you do it now - i have no better idea :)
21:35 cait        because visible currently means something different... that it's available at all
21:34 cait        you'd just wnat a few defaults, but not necessarily all visible in the framework
21:34 pianohacker yeah
21:34 cait        and using the current configuration for the new editor i can't imagine would work well
21:34 pianohacker yeah, that's the issue. The frameworks are necessary, but rancor uses them very very differently
21:33 cait        i mean... that's what we currently have, but they work differently
21:33 cait        although it would be cool to build templates
21:32 cait        i think you make sense :)
21:32 cait        hm
21:32 cait        so then there i'd expect the default values
21:32 pianohacker on the, well, horizon :)
21:32 pianohacker yeah, record templates are something that have been requested
21:32 cait        i know in horizon you coudl kinda build a framework
21:31 cait        hmm then it makes sense
21:31 pianohacker since you can type in whatever tags wherever you want :)
21:31 pianohacker cait: on a new record, yes
21:31 cait        which fields show up in the editor by default - only mandatory?
21:30 cait        hm i get the idea i think
21:30 huginn`     04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=11559 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, jweaver, Needs Signoff , Professional cataloger's interface
21:30 pianohacker cait: just responded to bug 11559, not sure if I explained myself well :)
21:24 wizzyrea    yay new developers, a chance to check (again) that the auto-updater for the website works!
20:42 rangi       probably need to update the history
20:42 rangi       i think there may have been stefan weil too
20:41 rangi       nice
20:29 cait        swedish and argentinian
20:29 rangi       Eivin Giske Skaaren and Samanta Tello
20:28 rangi       oh a couple of new devs
20:23 cait        hola nengard
20:23 nengard     hola #koha
20:18 cait        morning
20:15 wahanui     afternoon is good
20:15 Dyrcona     afternoon
20:13 rangi       morning
17:06 gaetan_B    bye
16:53 huginn`     04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=14495 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, gmcharlt, NEW , WebDriver/WebTester Factory for easy generation of Web testing UserAgents.
16:53 kivilahtio  related to Bug 14495
16:44 kivilahtio  https://docs.google.com/drawings/d/1k_y1YZi72UFxlVEDpqINT68TGQBEy-f2ZkTGLpMcTJU/edit?usp=sharing
16:44 kivilahtio  ashimema: akafred: Made a page object pattern specification
15:26 reiveune    bye
14:38 barton      ... it's definitely a direction that I think that a lot of the koha developers are interested in going (not necessarily the command line utilities per se, but definitely moving as much functionality into libraries as possible)... but it's going to take time.
14:37 misilot     :)
14:36 barton      misilot: in an ideal world all of Koha's functionality would be encapsulated in APIs, so that the controller layer was a very think wrapper, and the same API calls could be used to drive command line utilities. ashimema pointed me toward some of the mojolicious command line utlities, which IIRC leverage mojo's routing into command line options, but I haven't played with it yet.
14:28 misilot     woohooo everything checked in :)
14:23 misilot     now it's the fun part, inventory what's left (catalog what's not already catalog but we kept) and delete the rest
14:23 misilot     when doing mass weeding of collections
14:23 misilot     and/or use what's checked out to mass delete
14:23 barton      aha. that makes a certain amount of sense.
14:22 misilot     from being deleted
14:22 misilot     it's how we used to protect items
14:22 barton      wow.
14:22 misilot     with a good portion of these probably that have been inventoried
14:22 misilot     i have a *user* with 963 check outs
14:21 barton      hmm.
14:21 misilot     barton: it times out (i think it might be because I had so many items that I am trying to inventory currently checked out)
14:20 barton      regarding command line interface for the inventory tool: I don't think that there is, but you can import a spreadsheet...
14:19 barton      fwiw, I have a second ticket open for the same issue, so you may have killed more than one bird with that stone.
14:18 misilot     barton: it was one of those ah ha moments when I found a date difference calculator and it had the option to not count weekends
14:17 barton      misilot thanks for *solving* your overdue notice issue ;-) ;-) ;-)
14:16 misilot     thanks barton for looking into my overdue notice issue :)
13:54 misilot     is there a command line interface to the inventory tool? :)
13:08 cait        that's also a patron privacy issue for me - spreading that data there
13:08 cait        keeping the item data clean of borrower information
13:07 cait        i am still wondering if we can do a trick to speed it up a bit
13:06 khall       ok. thanks! The issue you had with the first version was basically that we already had the data, so why store it twice? We now have an answer to that question ; )
13:05 cait        khall: i have seen it, but not sure what's best - i will try to take a closer look
12:59 mario       morning
12:59 khall       that's ok, it shouldn't take you more than a minute or two when you get to it. Thanks!
12:58 cait        i hope to do some tomorrow or later tonight - but i have to leave in a few minutes
12:58 cait        khall: sorry i haven't gotten too much recently :(
12:58 huginn`     04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=9011 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, kyle, Signed Off , Add the ability to store the last patron to return an item
12:58 khall       cait can you weight in on bug 9011?
12:58 khall       morning!
12:49 cait        not too bad
12:47 huginn`     cait: The current temperature in Bodensee Konstanz City, Konstanz, Germany is 29.5°C (2:47 PM CEST on July 06, 2015). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 55%. Dew Point: 20.0°C. Pressure: 30.15 in 1021 hPa (Falling).
12:47 cait        @wunder Konstanz
12:47 * cait      waves
12:47 * cait      waces
10:57 drojf       later #koha
10:41 drojf       kivilahtio: nice try :D quiet here on irc, still busy in the home office. probably no koha playtime before friday
10:31 kivilahtio  drojf: not necessarily one of mine, but I am sure you can find one :)
10:31 kivilahtio  drojf: maybe you can sign off a bug then?
10:29 drojf       kivilahtio: i meant in here ;)
10:01 kivilahtio  not for me :)
09:12 drojf       a quiet morning
08:32 kivilahtio  morning
08:07 drojf       morning
07:15 wahanui     salut, gaetan_B
07:15 gaetan_B    hello
07:08 AmitG       heya alex_a
07:02 alex_a      bonjour
06:42 marcelr     hi #koha reiveune
06:42 wahanui     hola, reiveune
06:42 reiveune    hello
05:10 AmitG       indradg
05:10 AmitG       hi
05:01 indradg     good morning #koha
04:47 dcook       yep
04:47 eythian     yeah
04:46 wizzyrea    also, making ajax anything that shows "processing" makes people think "this is slow"
04:43 eythian     _so_many_things_ are using SimpleSearch just to see if something exists, which involves moving all the results from the search engine to Koha, and then dropping them. What a waste of CPU.
04:28 dcook       :o
04:21 eythian     ^-- "foreign key", sure...
04:21 eythian     >     'fk' => \$fk_off,
03:54 dcook       "Weeding tool, we call this the SuperWeeder because it includes all sorts of data to help in decision making"
03:54 dcook       SuperWeeder
03:54 dcook       Ahh
03:53 dcook       Hmm, I'm not seeing it on the wiki?
03:53 dcook       Ahh, cool :)
03:52 wizzyrea    well I was just using that as an example of things people might care about on an inventory
03:52 dcook       I had thought about writing a report, but I do like the idea of using the inventory directly
03:52 dcook       Nopes
03:52 wizzyrea    dcook: have you looked at the "super weeder" report from the wiki?
03:30 dcook       Download the list, filter based on that field..
03:30 dcook       That could make for faster weeding...
03:30 dcook       *I did that one on purpose
03:30 dcook       Would folk find it useful to know "Date last borrowered"* during the inventory?
03:25 * dcook     shakes his head a bit
03:25 dcook       Oh man... I wrote "datelastborrowered" again in the code...
03:24 wizzyrea    *snerk*
03:20 wahanui     the only good morning is a dead one
03:20 AmitG       Good morning
03:20 AmitG       hi all
03:20 * dcook     eyes his second monitor with suspicion
03:19 * dcook     is pretty sure there isn't a "datelastborrowered" column
03:19 dcook       datelastborrowed*
03:19 eythian     ah
03:19 dcook       It's Monday?
03:19 eythian     borrowered?
03:18 dcook       Shows me
03:18 dcook       Huh... I didn't recall there being a "datelastborrowered" column
03:00 eythian     ^-- good work sirsi
03:00 eythian     > .USER_LOCATION.   |aON-LOAN
01:56 * dcook     thinks perhaps the universe pities him today
01:55 dcook       Couldn't find the bug I wanted to find so I opened up the data file for the #koha scrollback and it happened to be written in the first line of the file!
01:55 dcook       Chances*
01:55 dcook       changes*
01:55 wahanui     the changes are written to the database, but Koha doesn't seem to pick it up...
01:55 dcook       Oh wow... what are the changes
00:05 wizzyrea    < too crafty for you
00:05 eythian     it was a stage whisper, you're not supposed to listen. geez!
00:03 wizzyrea    <3
00:03 wizzyrea    pst, it's not a secret WHEN YOU TELL ME.