Time  Nick         Message
00:06 eythian      jcamins: if debugging is the process of removing bugs, clearly programming is the process of putting them in.
00:06 wizzyrea     @quote add eythian: if debugging is the process of removing bugs, clearly programming is the process of putting them in.
00:06 wizzyrea     daw no huginn.
00:06 wizzyrea     wrong and irritating
00:09 dcook        Where is our thought bot today?
00:11 wizzyrea     gone awee
00:11 wizzyrea     ping gmcharlt
00:11 wizzyrea     we miss huginn please :)
00:11 wizzyrea     i can't even @later him!
00:11 wizzyrea     *sob*
00:12 dcook        Poor wizz :(
00:13 dcook        Chocolate?
00:13 wahanui      reiveune ate them all
00:13 dcook        That is a problem..
00:39 Jurgens      Hi all. Can someone please give me some advice as to why my advanced messaging isn't working anymore - nothing has changed and has worked in the past months. I use this code in a terminal: sudo koha-foreach --enabled --email /usr/share/koha/bin/cronjobs/advance_notices.pl  -itemscontent title,author,barcode -c
00:40 Jurgens      About 5 or so messages was sent when I used it but no more go - there should be about 60 going out I believe. I use koha 3.12
01:00 wizzyrea     maybe because there isn't an = between itemscontent and title?
01:00 wizzyrea     and you may need two dashes before itemscontent
01:01 wizzyrea     sudo koha-foreach --enabled --email /usr/share/koha/bin/cronjobs/advance_notices.pl  --itemscontent=title,author,barcode -c
01:01 wizzyrea     jurgens ^
01:08 Jurgens      Thanks Wizzy, I tried your command, but still nothing.
01:10 wizzyrea     do you have email enabled?
01:11 wizzyrea     if you do a koha-list --email is your instance listed?
01:11 wizzyrea     one thing that got me - was I did a koha-disable <instance>, then a koha-enable <instance>
01:11 wizzyrea     but email didn't come back
01:11 wizzyrea     (by design)
01:11 wizzyrea     so you have to koha-email-enable <instance> to make that go again
01:12 eythian      wizzyrea: actually, email will come back if you do that
01:12 eythian      however if a failure deletes /var, email won't come back after that :)
01:12 wizzyrea     oh right that was a different thing
01:12 wizzyrea     anyway, make sure it's enabled :P
01:14 Jurgens      Yes, its enalbed. I'm sending overdue messages just fine.
01:14 Jurgens      I am also making sure I'm running the process message queue as well.
01:14 wahanui      okay, Jurgens.
01:15 wizzyrea     do you actually have things coming due/advanced due? dates are correct and such?
01:17 Jurgens      Yeah, I have about 600 or so items due on Saturday, so I'm trying to send an advanced digest email. I've done this for the past two months with no issues. But now its like these messages are just ignored. On my mail client, it lists all the emails sent - so I can see if it was sent or not, the overdues are sent, but not the advanced ones.
01:18 Jurgens      By default all patrons have a 7 day digest email for advanced notices - is there an arguement I can use in the terminal to maybe change the day? Perhaps make it 5 or 4 days just to test.
01:19 wizzyrea     not that I'm aware of no.
01:22 wizzyrea     do you have the messages generated in the message queue?
01:22 wizzyrea     are they actually there?
01:23 Jurgens      In my mailq there is nothing.
01:24 wizzyrea     not the mail queue - the table message_queue in the koha database
01:25 jenkins_koha Starting build #124 for job Koha_3.10.x (previous build: SUCCESS)
01:26 wizzyrea     ok, do all of the patrons *actually* have a 7 day digest for advanced notices, or did you set that in the patron categories and not apply it to the borrowers
01:27 wizzyrea     because if you didn't apply the defaults to existing borrowers, only new borrowers will have the defaults.
01:28 Jurgens      no messages in message queue. and yes all patrons have been set and updated to 7 day default using terminal.
01:29 wizzyrea     don't know then, I haven't heard of this problem sorry
02:06 jenkins_koha Project Koha_3.10.x build #124: SUCCESS in 41 min: http://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_3.10.x/124/
02:06 jenkins_koha * Mathieu Saby: Bug 10186: Fix a typo in subscription-add.tt : 2/years should be 2/year
02:06 jenkins_koha * Mathieu Saby: Bug 10191: Close 2 option tags in unimarc_field_115a.tt and unimarc_field_116.tt
02:07 jenkins_koha Starting build #125 for job Koha_3.10.x (previous build: SUCCESS)
02:52 jenkins_koha Project Koha_3.10.x build #125: SUCCESS in 44 min: http://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_3.10.x/125/
02:52 jenkins_koha Bernardo Gonzalez Kriegel: Bug 10178 - Typos in plugins for 006 and 008 in MARC21
02:53 jcamins      I was trying to show Shari examples of "discovery interfaces."
02:53 jcamins      And how they were trying to do some of what Biblionarrator does, and not succeeding.
02:53 * dcook      is intrigued
02:53 jcamins      You know what? It turns out most of them just gave up entirely.
02:53 wizzyrea     and you found one that works? oh. guess not.
02:53 jcamins      Making authority data useful?
02:53 jcamins      Bwahahahahaha
02:53 jcamins      ^^ sorry, but that's clearly nuts
02:54 wizzyrea     clearly
02:54 jcamins      http://yufind.library.yale.edu/yufind/Author/Home?author=Shakespeare%2C%20William%2C%201564-1616. <-- the best it gets
02:54 wizzyrea     vufind :)
02:54 wizzyrea     naturally.
02:56 jcamins      I'd heard that Blacklight is better, but...
02:56 jcamins      There is certainly no evidence of that.
02:56 wizzyrea     blacklight has to be configured and stuff
02:57 wizzyrea     to be good.
02:57 wizzyrea     discovery layers aren't really for adding value
02:57 wizzyrea     they are for finding things across many sources
02:57 jcamins      [off] When the original authors of the system can't configure it to not be crap, I think I can safely call it "crap." :P
02:57 jcamins      Sure, if you offer some sort of federated search.
02:58 jcamins      If you don't offer federated search, but call it an "improved discovery experience," I expect to see improvement.
02:58 * wizzyrea   has never seen one that didn't have to do with a library wanting a zillion different sources of records pulled together into one interfacve
02:58 jcamins      Really?
02:58 wahanui      Really is off now
02:58 wizzyrea     and having them show up in one result set. But that's kind of the problem with a term like "discovery layer"
02:58 jcamins      One moment.
02:59 wizzyrea     it's highly dependent on your definition of discovery.
02:59 jcamins      [off] http://bobcat.library.nyu.edu/primo_library/libweb/action/search.do?dscnt=1&dstmp=1369709953928&vid=NYU&fromLogin=true
02:59 wizzyrea     it's not a real term, it's a marketing term
02:59 jcamins      I know.
02:59 wizzyrea     and an irritating one, at that.
02:59 eythian      just start calling them "invisibility cloaks" then
02:59 wizzyrea     ^
02:59 eythian      it's kinda the opposite thing...
03:00 jcamins      I'm actually not interested in discovery layers per se, but at least in principle some of them offer the possibility of making use of authority records, etc.
03:00 wizzyrea     ...you're kind of proving my thesis here.
03:00 jcamins      Which is that discovery layers are all crap?
03:00 jcamins      I think that's derivative from my thesis that discovery layers are all crap. :P
03:01 dcook        I think that's the dominate opinion
03:01 wizzyrea     no, that this discovery layer thing doesn't have anything to do with discovering anything about materials except "where to get it"
03:01 * dcook      would love to see authority records used to their potential.
03:01 jcamins      dcook: there does seem to be a remarkable lack of people finding value in discovery layers, doesn't there?
03:01 dcook        I was doing a course on taxonomies and I was rather sad at how the taxonomy that authorities represent is woefully underused
03:02 wizzyrea     and yet - we encourage user taxonomies in the form of tags
03:02 dcook        [off] rangi: Yet, Bibliocommons seemed pretty confident about how much they were needed, eh?
03:03 dcook        wizzyrea: What would you like to see in terms of discovery?
03:03 jcamins      [off] In fairness to Bibliocommons, I don't think they claim to be anything other than an OPAC, do they?
03:03 dcook        As for user taxonomies...I really wish I remembered the readings I did about them last year :p. While I think they can be useful to a degree, I'm not sure how useful they actually are
03:04 wizzyrea     the sorts of things like amazon does - people who read this author also read this other author/subject
03:04 dcook        Well, depending...some websites do it well, but I'm not sure about libraries
03:04 wizzyrea     a cataloger thinks this subject is related
03:04 wizzyrea     you might too
03:04 wizzyrea     sort of thing
03:04 wizzyrea     koha does quite a few of those things
03:04 wizzyrea     now if it could do it across several sources
03:04 wizzyrea     we'd be golden.
03:04 dcook        Mmm, that could be nice
03:04 jcamins      Once we jettisoned MARC.
03:04 dcook        Several sources?
03:05 wizzyrea     ebsco, gale
03:05 wizzyrea     for instance
03:05 wizzyrea     articles
03:05 wizzyrea     ebook suppliers
03:05 wizzyrea     overdrive
03:05 wahanui      overdrive is, like, going to expire that book
03:05 wizzyrea     forget overdrive
03:05 wahanui      wizzyrea: I forgot overdrive
03:05 dcook        I haven't looked into that too much at this point, but I think that gets tougher
03:05 wizzyrea     i wish I could forget overdrive
03:05 jcamins      [off] Shouldn't that be "Overdrive is evil"?
03:05 wizzyrea     overdrive is evil.
03:05 wizzyrea     overdrive?
03:05 wahanui      hmmm... overdrive is evil.
03:05 wizzyrea     there, that seems right.
03:06 dcook        Well put, wahanui
03:06 wahanui      dcook: excuse me?
03:06 * dcook      scowls
03:06 wizzyrea     well all of that more or less depends on good, linkable metadata eh?
03:06 dcook        I think access to the metadata becomes an issue
03:06 dcook        Mmm yeah
03:06 dcook        I'm not sure how keen publishers are on that either
03:07 wizzyrea     i think if they want people to find their stuff, they should be super keen.
03:07 dcook        When I worked in law, it seemed like every publisher was extremely reluctant to give you any data
03:07 dcook        It was "use our portal or nothing!"
03:07 wizzyrea     otherwise... how will people find it
03:07 wizzyrea     oh god the law databases are EEEEVIL.
03:07 dcook        Depends on the publisher
03:07 dcook        In some cases, they know they have the market share
03:07 wizzyrea     law in general.
03:07 dcook        hehe
03:07 dcook        I quite liked law :p
03:07 wizzyrea     especially - oh what's the one... jjj something
03:07 dcook        I thought about doing my JD/LLB
03:07 wizzyrea     jstor?
03:08 dcook        j?
03:08 wizzyrea     Lexis Nexis! that does not begin with a J
03:08 dcook        That might be more America specific
03:08 dcook        Mmm
03:08 wizzyrea     but that.
03:08 wizzyrea     yes, it's probably americacentric
03:08 dcook        Yeah, LexisNexis was a bit...
03:08 jcamins      lol No, no 'j'.
03:08 dcook        Their Halsbury's database wasn't too bad
03:08 dcook        Quicklaw
03:08 dcook        Quicklaw was all right
03:08 * jcamins    calls it a night.
03:08 jcamins      Good night, #koha.
03:08 dcook        night, jcamins!
03:08 eythian      but it's not
03:08 wizzyrea     later :0
03:09 eythian      it's the afternoon
03:09 dcook        Wait...yeah!
03:09 eythian      you can't call the afternoon a night, weirdo
03:09 dcook        It's only 1pm!
03:09 wizzyrea     a very cold night.
03:09 wizzyrea     afternoon.
03:09 dcook        The thing was though...if Quicklaw and Westlaw had solid APIs, it would be so much easier to access their content
03:10 wizzyrea     ebsco is supposed to be doing an open API?
03:10 wizzyrea     because they were getting sued by someone...
03:10 wizzyrea     Ex Libris, I think.
03:10 dcook        I'm intrigued
03:10 wizzyrea     dunno, we have peeps at a meeting about it.
03:10 wizzyrea     <watch this space>
03:10 dcook        No doubt. That would be great
03:11 dcook        Much better than periodic MARC dumps
03:11 wizzyrea     *nod*
03:11 wizzyrea     I do like about getit.library.nyu.edu is the "send/share" area
03:11 wizzyrea     koha should put it that way
03:11 wizzyrea     i don't mean the function, koha does that.
03:11 wizzyrea     i mean the terminology
03:12 wizzyrea     it's not "export"
03:12 wizzyrea     or "download"
03:12 dcook        Hmm, not sure I'm seeing that on the website
03:12 dcook        But I get your point
03:12 dcook        Terminology definitely matters
03:12 wizzyrea     https://getit.library.nyu.edu/go/7674801
03:13 wizzyrea     on the right
03:13 wizzyrea     and LOOK at that minimal display.
03:13 wizzyrea     no physical description - nobody gives a crap about that but cataloguers
03:14 dcook        Hmm
03:15 wizzyrea     https://github.com/team-umlaut/umlaut
03:15 dcook        Yeah, I just opened that up
03:15 dcook        I keep meaning to look at Ruby...
03:15 dcook        Looks like it's especially made for Primo though?
03:15 dcook        Or maybe just has a Primo add-on..
03:15 wizzyrea     blacklight is ruby also
03:16 dcook        Vufind is PHP?
03:16 wizzyrea     yea
03:16 dcook        I already know PHP so I might end up looking at that first, but good to know..
03:17 eythian      keep in mind that PHP causes brain damage if taken in more than miniscule doses.
03:17 dcook        When it comes to the display...it would be nice if libraries were able to handle more of their own config
03:17 eythian      It's pretty much a gateway to PCP and meth and stuff.
03:17 wizzyrea     this NYU interface has some stupidities.
03:17 dcook        Librarians do care about physical description, but there should be an easy way of defining a public interface with just the essentials
03:17 wizzyrea     we have librarians mucking about with xslt
03:17 dcook        Right, but that's not so easy
03:17 wizzyrea     unfortunately they put in MORE not LESS
03:17 dcook        Mmm, I could see that
03:18 dcook        That's the trend here as well
03:18 wizzyrea     see ALL THE THINGS
03:18 dcook        I think library schools need a few more "user experience" courses...
03:18 dcook        eythian: :p
03:18 dcook        I suppose I'm torn between wanting to give librarians nice UIs and making them get their hands dirty
03:18 dcook        As a librarian, I like getting my hands dirty
03:18 dcook        But I know many who don't..
03:19 dcook        Mind you, perhaps they need to get with the times if they are going to keep the profession relevant
03:19 dcook        I wonder what users really want though...
03:19 dcook        I mean...I'm a library user
03:19 dcook        Err...I used to be
03:19 dcook        What did I want?
03:20 wizzyrea     to find the thing
03:20 dcook        Usually a known quantity?
03:20 wizzyrea     maybe to find things like the thing.
03:20 dcook        Usually I look for books that I know I want
03:20 dcook        Maybe
03:20 dcook        Or is that something better handled by a thing like Goodreads
03:20 dcook        Too bad about the Amazon sale..
03:20 wizzyrea     I trust my local library to keep that data safer than a commercial entity.
03:21 dcook        Mmm, true that
03:21 wizzyrea     haha I just mistyped librains
03:21 dcook        Although like rangi was saying the other day, it would be nice to have a centralized repository
03:21 dcook        hehe
03:21 wizzyrea     yes, extremely that
03:21 wizzyrea     would love to figure out a way to fund that.
03:21 dcook        I would love to store my reading lists and such on a Koha repo
03:21 dcook        Mmm, agreed
03:22 dcook        As it is, I'm already juggling developing 3 different systems
03:22 dcook        And I probably put in some of the least amount of time out of the active developers
03:22 dcook        You know...just including work hours and a few after-work hours here and there
03:23 dcook        I don't know where other people find the time
03:23 dcook        (or money)
03:26 dcook        Lovin' Libreoffice's command-line PDFing tools!
03:28 wizzyrea     why is the intranet result xslt so... weird.
03:28 dcook        ?
03:28 wizzyrea     it's squashed
03:35 dcook        The display or the file?
03:37 wizzyrea     the display
03:37 wahanui      i think the display is even a little nicer with the CSS.
03:38 dcook        What he said?
03:38 wizzyrea     it only takes up about 2/3 of the space available to it?
03:38 wizzyrea     width wise?
03:43 dcook        Do you have a link?
03:44 eythian      alas, Koha doesn't support 774 for analytics.
03:45 dcook        *sadface*
03:47 dcook        eythian: While I know it's the fashion to bash PHP, what language(s) would you support?
03:48 dcook        Also, recently I've been thinking about whitespace discrepancies that come up in Koha from time to time...would that be brutal for Python programs?
03:48 eythian      dcook: it's not so much the fashion, it's just that it's actually an objectively bad language in almost all ways.
03:48 eythian      dcook: no, because in python programs those problems would be bugs, and so wouldn't (ideally) have got in there in the first place.
03:48 dcook        Lots of things are objectively bad, but they're not necessarily invoked with as much passion as anti-PHP sentiments
03:48 dcook        Not that I'm defending it
03:48 dcook        I just use it
03:49 dcook        I'm pretty language agnostic
03:49 dcook        eythian: Interesting. Seems like that would be a barrier to newbs though.
03:49 eythian      why?
03:50 eythian      I mean, the whitespace is part of the syntax
03:50 dcook        If they kept introducing bugs without knowing why
03:50 eythian      it's like saying that { } is a barrier
03:50 dcook        Except that different editors handle whitespace differently
03:50 dcook        Not so much with curly brackets
03:50 eythian      dcook: not when doing python they don't
03:50 wizzyrea     popcorn?
03:50 wahanui      popcorn is a vital part of any work day.
03:50 wizzyrea     get the popcorn?
03:50 wahanui      http://i.imgur.com/p3cHE.gif
03:50 dcook        O_o
03:50 eythian      because if they did, they'd be a bad python editor :)
03:51 dcook        lol
03:51 wizzyrea     more popcorn?
03:51 dcook        But I repeat the question, what languages are you a fan of, eythian?
03:52 eythian      I'm mostly happy with Perl. I should properly learn Python one day. LISP is fun for what it's good for. Smalltalk is easy and it sucks it's not popular.
03:52 eythian      That's a very broad question really
03:53 dcook        Hmm, that's true
03:53 dcook        I guess preferences become a bit irrelevant in some (if not many) cases anyway
03:54 dcook        In the work context, I use whatever language I have to use to develop the system I'm being paid to develop
03:54 dcook        At home, well, I don't have time for that at the moment..
05:26 dac          Ahh, PDFing magic. I love when things work out.
05:42 * dac        waves to cait
05:43 dac          Howdy
05:49 cait         hi dac
05:49 cait         hi #koha
05:50 dcook        That's better :)
06:08 cait         somehow i suspected it was you
06:09 dcook        I do seem to always be around when you arrive
06:09 dcook        Coincidence, I assure you
06:10 cait         and i am supposed to believe that?
06:10 cait         :)
06:12 dcook        Yep ^_^
06:12 dcook        Mostly because of the cute caret eyes
06:14 cait         lol
06:14 cait         i will consider it
06:14 dcook        I hate when things don't work when you just want the thing to function, but they work perfectly when you're looking for edge cases that you know exist..
06:22 dcook        Daft punk is in the head and I can't get it ouuuuut
06:39 drojf        good morning #koha
06:40 cait         good morning drojf :)
06:40 drojf        hi cait
06:41 dcook        hey drojf
06:41 dcook        There was something I was going to say to you or ask you...but I can't remember what...
06:41 alex_a_      bonjour
06:41 wahanui      kai ora, alex_a_
06:41 dcook        salut alex_a_
06:42 drojf        hi dcook
06:42 alex_a       salut dcook
06:42 drojf        if it was important you will remember ;)
06:42 drojf        hi alex_a
06:42 alex_a       hello drojf
06:44 reiveune     hello
06:44 wahanui      hello, reiveune
06:46 christophe_c hello #koha
06:52 mtj          oooh, interesting article on marc21 -> http://journal.code4lib.org/articles/5468
06:54 mtj          "The MARC21 standard is represented only by an online text, something that is rather astonishing if you think about it. Anyone wishing to develop applications for MARC21 must create their own usable version. My own database still lacks definitions and descriptions, and those will probably need to be added by screen-scraping hundreds of screens from the LC web site."
07:00 asaurat      hi
07:08 mtj          hiya adrien
07:12 dcook        drojf: Bollard!
07:12 * dcook      had to go look through his browser history
07:13 dcook        I had never heard of the word until you mentioned it
07:13 dcook        Then I was reading a book the next day and that word came up on the first page
07:13 dcook        Thanks for expanding my vocabulary ^_^
07:19 drojf        dcook: heh. i got another word for you: baader-meinhof phenomenon. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baader-Meinhof_phenomenon#Frequency_illusion
07:20 dcook        rangi++ for explaining do-while loops to me ages ago
07:20 dcook        drojf: hehe
07:21 dcook        salut gaetan_B
07:21 gaetan_B     salut dcook :) ça va ?
07:22 dcook        ouais, assez bien, et toi?
07:42 dcook        Eeep. Almost late for pizza.
07:42 dcook        Night all!
07:42 wahanui      goodnight dcook. You'll be back.
07:43 kf           good morning koha
07:47 sophie_m     hello #koha
07:49 kf           h sophie_m :)
07:49 sophie_m     hi kf :-)
08:32 kf           @wunder Konstanz
08:42 BobB         hi all
08:43 BobB         Is anyone about who is deeply familiar with self checkout?
09:10 kf           hi BobB
09:10 kf           do you mean the web based one or over sip?
09:10 BobB         hi kf, the web based one
09:10 BobB         I can't see how to return an item?
09:11 BobB         Borrow: tick, Renew: tick, Return: huh?
09:11 kf           hm have you activated returns?
09:11 BobB         and the manual and help page do not document it, as far as I can see
09:11 kf           i think there is a separate switch to activate that
09:12 kf           which version are you looking at?
09:12 BobB         The sys pref?  Yes.
09:12 BobB           3.10
09:12 BobB         sorry, 3.10.4
09:12 kf           hm
09:12 kf           our libraries are not using it
09:12 BobB         That's what I said.
09:12 kf           but i am trying to come up with some ideas
09:12 BobB         :)
09:13 kf           let me take a look
09:13 kf           ok, so AllowSelfCheckReturns is turned on?
09:14 kf           have you treid to turn it on and off again? (i had cases that helped to reset the database column to the right value)
09:17 kf           hm in my tests i can't check out anything
09:17 BobB         I expected an extra button with that sys pref on, but don't see it.
09:17 BobB         Let me confirm.
09:18 kf           BobB: you are right, there is no reutn button :(
09:19 BobB         yeah, I turned the sys pref off and on again, refreshed the page, and still no return facility.
09:20 BobB         Bug perhaps.
09:20 kf           i tried both settingsnow
09:20 kf           no change
09:20 kf           yeah
09:20 kf           i was going to look at the template to see where weshould see it
09:20 BobB         cool, ok
09:21 kf           http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=blob;f=koha-tmpl/opac-tmpl/prog/en/modules/sco/sco-main.tt;h=bfd71a2bb2cc39b640db7f96b0e008f5311465b6;hb=37234811a518f4446a5564e954df2aa34d606633#l152
09:21 kf           i think probably something with the if check is wrong
09:23 BobB         interesting
09:23 wahanui      hmmm... interesting is sometimes good and sometimes bad
09:23 BobB         not so good this time wahanui :)
09:24 BobB         kf I think I'll open a bug?
09:24 BobB         But I'll do it after dinner - fading quickly just now
09:25 kf           hope it's something easy
09:25 kf           <fieldset><legend> Check out[% IF ( AllowSelfCheckReturns ) %], return[% END %] or renew an item: </legend> < this shows rght for me saying return
09:26 BobB         I'll open a bug and get mtj to look at it later.  Thanks kf!
09:26 kf           ok :)
09:27 BobB         ok, some dinner now...
09:27 kf           enjoy your dinner
10:52 jcamins      Seriously? Someone added "Koha LiveDVD support discussion" to the agenda for the meeting?
10:55 jcamins      Fortunately the only reason I looked at the agenda was to add my apologies.
11:15 BobB         kf: back
11:15 BobB         http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10358
11:17 kf           BobB++ :)
11:18 BobB         Thanks kf
11:42 samueld      hi everybody
12:25 oleonard     Hi #koha
12:25 oleonard     Did y'all get lots done without the Americans yesterday?
12:26 jcamins      oleonard: yeah! I spent so much time working...
12:26 oleonard     We'll resume distracting you now jcamins
12:27 jcamins      As an aside, there's something profoundly depressing about trying to match a bad site design.
12:28 kf           hi oleonard :)
12:28 kf           oleonard: i filed lots of bugs!
12:32 jcamins      I need to make some breakfast.
12:32 * oleonard   will have some too, thanks jcamins
12:32 jcamins      I'm not quite sure what.
12:33 jcamins      Here's a question... why isn't Facebook fully responsive?
12:34 oleonard     Probably because they want to drive people to their mobile app which gives them more opportunities to slurp up personal data.
12:34 jcamins      Hmmm... fair enough.
12:35 oleonard     What site of that scale is responsive?
12:36 jcamins      None that I know of, but it seems like they should be.
12:58 tcohen       morning #koha
13:02 tcohen       does anyone remember where was some docs of the DBIx class work by libsysgt?
13:04 jcamins      tcohen: there wasn't any documentation.
13:04 tcohen       ok jcamins !
13:04 tcohen       and the work itself?
13:04 jcamins      It's on a bug.
13:04 tcohen       is there a brnach somewherE?
13:04 tcohen       oh,  got it
13:04 jcamins      @query dbix
13:05 jcamins      Noooooooooooo!!!! huginn!!!!!!!!!
13:05 druthb       lulz
13:06 tcohen       what should i aply it to jcamins ? master?
13:07 jcamins      Well, that's what it needs to be rebased against.
13:07 jcamins      I don't know exactly where master was when it was written.
13:08 tcohen       where those class files generated?
13:08 tcohen       (I mean automatically)
13:08 jcamins      Yeah, instructions are on the bug, I imagine.
13:08 oleonard     huginn is sleeping off a Memorial Day weekend bender
13:08 jcamins      I mostly ignored the work, since it had no short-term impact.
13:08 tcohen       no rebase needed
13:09 kf           gmcharlt: can you wake up huginn please? :)
13:10 tcohen       hi kf
13:10 kf           hi tcohen :)
13:13 tcohen       bug 8309
13:14 jcamins      tcohen: I think that one uses Moose, which is more problematic.
13:14 tcohen       ok
13:14 jcamins      Baby steps.
13:15 kf           please no moose
13:15 kf           we should use more marc
13:15 wahanui      http://02varvara.files.wordpress.com/2011/04/01-how-about-no-bear.jpg?w=800
13:15 jcamins      Hmmm...
13:16 jcamins      We need an image that combines that image with this one: http://www.quickmeme.com/Vindictive-Canadian-Moose-Overlord/?upcoming
13:17 jcamins      :)
13:17 druthb       lulz
13:17 druthb       I fear our m00shish overlords!
13:18 tcohen       heh
13:19 tcohen       i think Moose is not a problem itself, but running Koha as CGI is
13:19 jcamins      Right.
13:20 tcohen       of course if there's stuff like Moo or Mouse why use Moose
13:20 * druthb     knows a few of the folks who have contributed to Moose, including the current CPAN owner.  Proof that good people sometimes have questionable ideas.
13:21 jcamins      Aww. This is so cute!
13:21 jcamins      Myshkin is lying on the floor.
13:21 druthb       uhm...
13:21 oleonard     :D
13:22 jcamins      Every time I walk by he stares at me, with his head going further and further back until he flops over.
13:22 jcamins      Then he does it again when I walk by in the other direction.
13:22 druthb       awr!
13:22 tcohen       :-D
13:22 oleonard     jcamins: Imagine how productive you would be if we were all on vacation and we took Myshkin with us
13:25 jcamins      lol
13:25 kf           can myshkin come to kohacon? pleeazze?
13:25 jcamins      kf: probably not, sorry.
13:26 kf           so unfair.
13:28 tcohen       should memcached be enabled globally or per-instance with packages?
13:28 kf           btw tcohen++
13:29 jcamins      Per-instance.
13:29 tcohen       I'll provide koha-*-memcached scripts then
13:30 jcamins      tcohen++
13:31 druthb       tcohen++
13:31 druthb       kf:  I'd bring Pixel, but he'd have a hissy fit.
13:34 tcohen       Florencio wouldn't make it to the embassy for a VISA, he's too lazy on winter
13:35 kf           tcohen: lol
13:35 druthb       I saw the picture the other day, with Florencio in your lap.  Nice to know another person owned by a cat. :D
13:35 kf           druthb: and you are shared property? :)
13:36 druthb       I am currently chief-of-staff for two cats, yes.  But Captain Midnight will be moving out when Lindsey does.
13:36 kf           oh
13:37 tcohen       he sits on my chest/back at around 5AM everyday and knocks my head until i go show him where his food was
13:37 druthb       Besides, couldn't bring Captain anyway—his purring would disrupt the speakers.
13:37 druthb       heheh.
13:37 druthb       My two have taken to trying to stare me awake.  They've discovered the un-wisdom of anything more interactive.
13:41 druthb       Pixel has developed a very adorable habit.  If I'm laying still in bed, and happen to have an arm sticking out from under the covers, he'll root around to get under my hand, and lay down and start purring.
13:41 jcamins      Aww.
13:41 jcamins      Cute!
13:42 druthb       I've been trying to spend more time with him, and a little less with Cap, since Lindsey's announcement.
13:46 druthb       tcohen:  bgkriegel will probably be checking in with you about access to Jacinto, and the translation server; I'm working on handing all that off to him, so go ahead whenever he asks.
13:47 druthb       Please don't revoke mine just yet; still working on documentation.  ;-)
13:49 tcohen       ok, i have is ssh keys from the es.koha-community.org server
13:50 kf           :)
13:50 kf           hope we can get pootle updated without it making problems
13:50 kf           it would be nice
13:50 tcohen       i'll just add them, as he's been elected
13:51 kf           bgkriegel++
13:51 druthb       bgkriegel++
14:04 tcohen       bgkriegel has the power
14:08 tcohen       i mean, SSH access
14:11 tcohen       koha-memcached --enable|--disable vs. koha-memcached-enable|-disable ? any thoughts?
14:17 gmcharlt     tcohen: seems OK to me (although even better, IMO, would be seeing if we can agree to just use memcached as a required dependency)
14:17 gmcharlt     @quote random
14:17 gmcharlt     ah
14:17 tcohen       hi gmcharlt
14:18 tcohen       we should agree i guess
14:18 oleonard     gmcharlt: Did you bring huginn with you?
14:18 gmcharlt     @quote random
14:18 jcamins      Whew.
14:18 huginn       gmcharlt: Quote #233: "<oleonard> How about Now that she's three my daughter has terrible authority control" (added by gmcharlt at 05:06 PM, February 14, 2013)
14:18 wahanui      i already had it that way, huginn.
14:42 druthb       @quote random
14:42 huginn       druthb: Quote #193: "<libsysguy> I don't always reterminate....but when I do the terminator is near a stud // * wizzyrea considers if this is a real statement or something to do with the movie." (added by slef at 02:56 PM, March 22, 2012)
14:43 * druthb     would say she misses libsysguy…but she doesn't; he stops by her office from time to time.
14:47 tcohen       @wunder buenos aires, argentina
14:47 huginn       tcohen: The current temperature in Buenos Aires, Argentina is 15.0°C (11:35 AM ART on May 28, 2013). Conditions: Thunderstorms and Rain. Humidity: 94%. Dew Point: 14.0°C. Pressure: 29.53 in 1000 hPa (Falling).
14:48 tcohen       cr*p
14:49 druthb       @under 77098
14:49 huginn       druthb: I've exhausted my database of quotes
14:49 druthb       @wunder 77098
14:49 huginn       druthb: The current temperature in Greenway Plaza, Houston, Texas is 27.8°C (9:48 AM CDT on May 28, 2013). Conditions: Partly Cloudy. Humidity: 66%. Dew Point: 21.0°C. Pressure: 29.90 in 1012 hPa (Falling).
14:49 kf           gmcharlt: hm not sure it should be mandatory to be used
14:49 gmcharlt     kf: why not?
14:49 kf           gmcharlt: memcache - there are problems with that because you have to wit to see changes
14:50 kf           like when you edit a bibliographic framework
14:50 kf           things don't take effect
14:50 kf           one of the reasons we don't use it.
14:50 huginn       New commit(s) kohagit: Bug 7368: Correct three typos in history.txt <http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=commitdiff;h=342463b5796825e8dd941e575694e8e4be6aa274> / Bug 9424: Move JavaScript out of header include <http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=commitdiff;h=25e6c2885d1547fd4ed28c29fd8462e33dc8b4f1> / Bug 10284: Add missing spaces between label and content in XSLT view (780/785) <http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb
14:51 kf           gmcharlt: i tried running my dev install with memcached for a while, but it drove me nuts :(
14:51 kf           maybe it's better now
14:54 gmcharlt     there's been a lot of work recently, but I agree in general that the cache should be getting refreshed whenever things like bib frameworks and sysprefs get updated
14:54 gmcharlt     something to duoble-check
14:54 gmcharlt     but if/when that's been resolved, I think the advantages of having a guarantee that caching is available are significant
14:55 * tcohen     remembers he forgot to work on that cache::memcached ideas for cache invalidator declaration
14:55 kf           gmcharlt: i will love caching once that is resolved :)
14:55 kf           tcohen++ again :)
14:55 kf           even if he ignored my pm :)
14:55 jenkins_koha Starting build #1203 for job Koha_master (previous build: SUCCESS)
14:56 kf           @wunder Konstanz
14:56 huginn       kf: The current temperature in Taegerwilen, Taegerwilen, Germany is 20.3°C (4:55 PM CEST on May 28, 2013). Conditions: Scattered Clouds. Humidity: 45%. Dew Point: 8.0°C. Pressure: 29.53 in 1000 hPa (Falling).
14:56 kf           ah and gmcharlt++ :)
15:01 huginn       New commit(s) kohagit: Bug 10193 - Copies should be holdings as label for items on MARC view <http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=commitdiff;h=492a1a19f99c27ccbb94cab2fa4318379076bc6f>
15:02 rhcl         @wunder 64507
15:02 huginn       rhcl: The current temperature in Wyatt Park, St Joseph, Missouri is 26.5°C (10:02 AM CDT on May 28, 2013). Conditions: Partly Cloudy. Humidity: 78%. Dew Point: 22.0°C. Pressure: 29.67 in 1005 hPa (Falling).  Flash Flood Watch in effect through Wednesday morning... 
15:04 pianohacker  mornin'
15:06 adam_m       Hello, I'm looking to get some sort of a USB keyboard wedge barcode scanner for Koha, does anyone have any suggestions as to a good one to use?
15:06 jcamins      adam_m: any will work.
15:07 kf           adam_m: basically what jcamins said, there are no Koha specifics when buying scanners
15:08 kf           if you can scan into a text file it's going to work with koha
15:08 kf           and now i am leaving .)
15:08 kf           bye all!
15:12 huginn       New commit(s) kohagit: Bug 10218 - In OPAC XSLT search results, add class to 'online access' <http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=commitdiff;h=45168efeb9a2c6e3268e2f002ca31af8e5e6afc8> / Bug 10184 - Circulation History reverses sort order <http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=commitdiff;h=3285261d0150113e597d48a5a78aee5fdc1ebd94> / Bug 9286 - Add script to add a bib to the zebra queue from the command line <http://git
15:13 jcamins      oleonard's blog?
15:13 wahanui      oleonard's blog is, like, http://www.myacpl.org/koha
15:16 jcamins      oleonard: didn't you do a diagram showing the various user-editable regions on the OPAC?
15:16 tcohen       for 3.2 if i remember
15:16 oleonard     Yes, and it's out of date now I think
15:17 jcamins      Oh, I know, but I'm trying to explain that Koha really is _that_ customizable.
15:17 oleonard     http://www.myacpl.org/koha/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/opac-customizable-regions.gif
15:17 jcamins      Thanks.
15:18 oleonard     I wonder if I saved that as a Photoshop file or something...
15:20 tcohen       http://grooveshark.com/s/Weekend+Wars/4xZXxf?src=5
15:32 huginn       New commit(s) kohagit: Bug 10262 - fine calculation at checkin not respecting CircControl <http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=commitdiff;h=040eb4016f4b01d44f87ab6aca515c6917f73479>
15:36 adam_m       Is there any way to have all the information be added simply by providing koha with only the ISBN or UPC code
15:36 jcamins      Not automatically.
15:36 jcamins      You can use Z39.50 to try and download records from other libraries, though.
15:36 reiveune     bye
15:37 adam_m       ok, what would be the best way, slash best library to do that from
15:37 pianohacker  adam_m: There's a pretty good set that comes with koha
15:38 pianohacker  adam_m: you might also consider asking some large local libraries you're in contact with for their Z39.50 info
15:38 pianohacker  Library of Congress's records exist for just about anything but can be a bit sparse
15:38 adam_m       where is that set that comes with koha?
15:39 jcamins      Well, LC has records for most of the books that a school or public library in the US would use. If you are outside the US, you may find it a lot less useful.
15:39 jcamins      adam_m: they're included in the sample data that it gave you the option to install when you ran the installer.
15:42 adam_m       perhaps, perhaps not, I'm in Canada, so they could be all the same, though I am unsure haha, I don't know a whole lot about this to be honest all of my background is in programming, I was asked to set up some sort of library system however so this is where In find myself, so sory if my questions seem silly.
15:43 JoeLib001    Debian Wheezy is out and my System Admin wants to know, if or when Koha will support it. I have installed Debian Wheezy, installed tinymce2, added the koha-squeeze main repo and everything installed on a VM. Though, that's not quite what he wants, I think. ;-)
15:43 jcamins      JoeLib001: that's all there is to it.
15:44 JoeLib001    Will there be an "official" koha wheezy repo any time soon?
15:44 jcamins      I don't know if there are any plans to change "squeeze" to "wheezy" since "squeeze" does not mean anything in the context of Koha.
15:44 JoeLib001    Ah, ok.
15:44 jcamins      So... maybe, if the packaging manager thinks there should be?
15:46 JoeLib001    tinymce2 just isn't in Wheezy is the only real problem then?
15:46 jcamins      Right.
15:46 jcamins      At least, so far as I know.
15:46 JoeLib001    Hehe. ;-)
15:47 JoeLib001    I will see what he says then. XD
15:55 oleonard     Just had a good suggestion from my staff for a new notice: Advance notice of account expiration
15:56 JoeLib001    That topic was just discussed on the Mailing list for our ILS. ;-)
15:56 JoeLib001    I give them 6 months to a year, if they ever get it implemeneted. XD
15:57 JoeLib001    We currently use Koha for Periodicals/Acquisitions. ;-)
15:58 gmcharlt     oleonard: JoeLib001: must be a confluence -- there's been some chatter on the Evergreen mailing lists about a similar thing
15:58 JoeLib001    It's a good idea.
15:58 oleonard     It's becoming a big issue now that more patrons are using the library exclusively for digital services (ebooks, downloads, etc)
15:59 oleonard     They never come in to the library to get prompted to renew their account in person.
15:59 JoeLib001    It probably was just a matter of time considering the push towards more electronic content.
16:07 jenkins_koha Project Koha_master build #1203: UNSTABLE in 1 hr 11 min: http://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_master/1203/
16:07 jenkins_koha * Katrin Fischer: Bug 10284: Add missing spaces between label and content in XSLT view (780/785)
16:07 jenkins_koha * Owen Leonard: Bug 9424: Move JavaScript out of header include
16:07 jenkins_koha * Connor Fraser: Bug 7368: Correct three typos in history.txt
16:07 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10284 minor, P5 - low, ---, katrin.fischer, Pushed to Master , Missing spaces between label and content in XSLT view for 785/780
16:07 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=9424 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, Pushed to Master , Move JavaScript out of header include
16:07 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7368 trivial, P5 - low, ---, m.de.rooy, ASSIGNED , General staff client typo omnibus
16:08 jenkins_koha Starting build #1204 for job Koha_master (previous build: UNSTABLE -- last SUCCESS #1202 3 days 21 hr ago)
16:12 gaetan_B     bye !
16:50 cait         bug 6173
16:50 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=6173 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, henridamien, NEW , Cronjob to send account expiry notices
16:50 druthb       wahanui:  cait?
16:50 wahanui      cait is qam, not your secretary
16:50 druthb       :P
16:51 cait         i was peeking in the message logs
16:51 adam_m       Hello, so I've set up a connection to the National library in Canada, I'm sort of assuming that I can now just search for whatever books that i do have on there and then just import all the information that i need from there
16:51 druthb       wahanui:  botsnack cookie
16:51 wahanui      :)
16:55 cait         didn't someone ask for account renewal mailsß
16:55 cait         ?
16:57 cait         oh well :)
16:57 * cait       disappears again to work on her distance study course
17:15 jcamins      adam_m: you should always ask questions on the main board, as as a matter of principle most people do not respond to private messages.
17:16 adam_m       sorry
17:19 jcamins      The most likely issue if you're having problems placing holds is that you either A) do not have an item attached to the record in question, or B) do not have a circulation rule set up.
17:23 jenkins_koha Yippie, build fixed!
17:23 jenkins_koha Project Koha_master build #1204: FIXED in 1 hr 14 min: http://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_master/1204/
17:23 jenkins_koha * Owen Leonard: Bug 10193 - Copies should be holdings as label for items on MARC view
17:23 jenkins_koha * Kyle M Hall: Bug 9286 - Add script to add a bib to the zebra queue from the command line
17:23 jenkins_koha * Colin Campbell: Bug 10184 - Circulation History reverses sort order
17:23 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10193 trivial, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, Pushed to Master , Copies should be holdings as label for items on MARC view
17:23 jenkins_koha * Owen Leonard: Bug 10218 - In OPAC XSLT search results, add class to 'online access'
17:23 jenkins_koha * Kyle M Hall: Bug 10262 - fine calculation at checkin not respecting CircControl
17:23 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=9286 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, kyle, Pushed to Master , Add script to add a bib to the zebra queue from the command line
17:23 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10184 trivial, P5 - low, ---, colin.campbell, Pushed to Master , Circulation History reverses sort order
17:23 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10218 minor, P5 - low, ---, mathieu.saby, ASSIGNED , In OPAC XSLT search results, add class to 'online access'
17:23 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10262 critical, P5 - low, ---, kyle.m.hall, Pushed to Master , fine calculation at checkin not respecting CircControl
17:25 jenkins_koha Starting build #1205 for job Koha_master (previous build: FIXED)
17:34 drojf        good evenin g#koha
17:38 pianohacker  debugging an indexdata product: read errors/logfiles, fail to understand them; read documentation, fail to find specifics; read source code, fail to understand how it compiles
17:41 jcamins      pianohacker: sounds about right.
17:53 jcamins      And those are just the highlights!
17:54 jcamins      pianohacker: out of curiosity, which are you debugging?
18:04 pianohacker  jcamins: Trying to figure out a pazpar2 configuration issue
18:04 jcamins      pianohacker: fun!
18:05 pianohacker  always. these guys write powerful, speedy code, but man...
18:10 jcamins      [off] I thought about using their documentation practices as a model... if anyone wants to use your software you're pretty much guaranteed a consulting contract, but it turns out that if you don't write anything down you can't remember what anything does. :P
18:11 pianohacker  that's almost too darkly true to be funny...
18:16 druthb       two caits!  WOOO HOO
18:16 * druthb     will cait-nap one, when she comes over for KohaCon
18:18 cait1        only got one plane tix :)
18:18 drojf        you only need one for the return flight…
18:19 druthb       right…the other one can stay behind and hack on Koha for BSZ.  The other one gets a nice long break, can hack on Koha as she pleases.
18:20 * druthb     wonders if drojf is planning on KohaCon, toooo
18:20 * druthb     would welcome an invasion of Germans.
18:21 jcamins      druthb: there's a problem with kidnapping drojf and making him stay in the States, though. No one would be able to pronounce his name. :P
18:21 druthb       Big deal, jcamins.  I have that problem already.
18:23 druthb       I had a friend who was a Dutch Indonesian..as a small child, he hid from Japanese soldiers in the jungle, during WW2; his family emigrated to the US after the war.  His last name was "De Vlugt"…but if you read it on a sign, and asked him how to pronounce it, he would say "Smith!" with a maniacal cackle.
18:23 drojf        druthb: unfortunately no
18:24 jcamins      lol
18:24 drojf        unless cait is willing to carry me in her luggage
18:24 druthb       (Then he'd tell it right:  de-FLOO'kt)
18:26 * druthb     will send cait a bigger suitcase.
18:26 drojf        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tyQvjKqXA0Y
18:26 cait1        drojf: you think you could hunger down to 23kg?
18:26 drojf        i can try
18:26 drojf        no, i can't
18:26 drojf        :D
18:27 cait1        yeah i think it's probably not a good idea
18:28 drojf        i would be really grumpy ;)
18:35 druthb       https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IhJQp-q1Y1s
18:37 jenkins_koha Project Koha_master build #1205: SUCCESS in 1 hr 13 min: http://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_master/1205/
18:50 pastebot     "jcamins" at pasted "cait: You can make portions of strings translatable like this, right?" (1 line) at http://paste.koha-community.org/27
18:52 jcamins      cait1: actually, that question was for you.
18:54 jcamins      oleonard: don't suppose you have any idea how to remove a cookie using JS/jQuery?
18:55 jcamins      oleonard: let me rephrase that... I don't suppose you have any idea how I should do it in the Koha codebase?
18:58 jcamins      Figured it out.
18:58 jcamins      I set the expiration to negative.
18:58 jcamins      Apparently that's the only way to do it.
18:58 pianohacker  jcamins: Yeah, that's the method I know
18:59 jcamins      pianohacker: we're using jquery.cookie, which talks about a removeCookie method, but I can't find any evidence of it or anything other than simply expiring the cookie anywhere.
18:59 jcamins      Hey, I like this.
19:00 * jcamins    just did cookie-based merging for authorities, and it's very convenient.
19:01 smeagol      Wondering why I'm getting this error on a dev install when trying to access web installer? "Can't call method "config" on unblessed reference at /kohaclone/C4/Context.pm line 791" Has anyone seen this? thanks.
19:01 jcamins      It is perfect for my inner slacker, which says "I don't want to move my mouse."
19:01 cait1        which question?
19:01 jcamins      smeagol: it sounds like you don't have the KOHA_CONF environment variable set.
19:02 jcamins      cait1: the one in the pastebin.
19:02 jcamins      I have two translatable strings and a bunch of HTML, and I would prefer to only ask people to translate the English.
19:06 cait1        looksgood
19:06 jcamins      \o/
19:07 smeagol      jcamins: i did export koha_conf=/root/koha-dev/etc/koha-conf.xml..???
19:08 jcamins      smeagol: it has to be exported to your web browser.
19:08 jcamins      Not browser.
19:08 jcamins      Server.
19:08 jcamins      Sorry.
19:08 mtompset     Greetings, #koha.
19:08 mtompset     *sigh* I'm having indexing issues, it would seem. :(
19:09 jcamins      And I think you might have the wrong path. /root doesn't seem like a very probable place to have your koha-dev.
19:09 rangi        smeagol: and case matters its KOHA_CONF
19:09 jcamins      Also that.
19:09 wahanui      it has been said that also that is a giant undertaking
19:14 rangi        new developer!
19:14 jcamins      \o/
19:14 cait1        oh where?
19:14 drojf        woah i am #7 in the signoffs list for may. and i have been a really lazy bum. everybody should do more signoffs…
19:15 rangi        212
19:15 rangi        connor fraser
19:15 rangi        http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=summary
19:15 rangi        peter was teaching them how to contribute on the weekned
19:16 * jcamins    is on vacation until June 1.
19:16 cait1        nice .)
19:16 cait1        drojf++
19:16 rangi        http://bugs.koha-community.org/BAM/index.php?s=Koha&p=Koha&c=
19:16 rangi        needs signoff is trending the wrong way, we
19:16 rangi        will have to fix that :)
19:24 cait1        go rangi go :)
19:28 jcamins      oleonard: you can give a style tag an id, right?
19:28 oleonard     I suppose so
19:28 rangi        cait1: ive been doing qa stuff
19:29 rangi        but ill do some more sign offs soon and others can qa them
19:29 cait1        jcamins: i can check if you want?
19:29 cait1        rangi: sounds good to me :)
19:29 rangi        cait1: there are only 5  in passed qa, we have to keep that full or gmcharlt will get bored ;-)
19:29 jcamins      cait1: check what?
19:30 cait1        if you can or not :)
19:30 jcamins      Oh.
19:30 jcamins      I can check.
19:30 jcamins      I'll give a style tag an ID, and see if I can use it.
19:30 jcamins      If I can, WIN!
19:30 cait1        it can
19:30 jcamins      WIN!
19:31 pianohacker  I guess the only real question is if getElementById works for things outside the body
19:32 jcamins      pianohacker: ooh, good point.
19:33 jcamins      Looks like you can.
19:33 jcamins      http://stackoverflow.com/questions/13357515/how-to-dynamically-change-the-style-tag-using-javascript
19:34 oleonard     Or you could change the class of the body tag and apply different rules that way, or something similar.
19:34 jcamins      oleonard: the challenge is that I want to rewrite opacusercss with javascript.
19:35 oleonard     Oh, then just create a new system preference: opacusercssoverride :P
19:35 jcamins      No, that wouldn't work.
19:36 oleonard     Right, because you'd have to add a new one: opacusercssoverrideoverride just in case
19:36 pianohacker  jcamins: what are you doing?
19:36 jcamins      The point is I want to test things using Javascript without actually saving the changes.
19:36 jcamins      pianohacker: embedded style preview.
19:36 pianohacker  ooooh
19:36 pianohacker  that sounds fancy as all get-out
19:36 jcamins      Well, right now I'm making merging authorities from the reservoir work.
19:36 jcamins      But I can't think about one thing at a time.
19:37 jcamins      Apparently.
19:37 rangi        heh
20:34 jeff         thinking on cross-ils APIs again, is koha more/less expressive than "ready for pickup" and "total" with regard to holds, or with regard to circs/checkouts, does out/claims-returned/long-overdue/overdue/lost/total logically map to koha?
20:34 jeff         (talking in terms of a summary of a patron account)
20:40 jcamins      jeff: Koha does not currently have claims-returned support, really.
20:41 jeff         got it. well, in that case then it would always be absent / zero, i suppose!
20:41 jcamins      As for holds, you can look at a list of what items a patron has on hold.
20:42 tweetbot     [off] twitter: @Tredok: "a encore choisi à l'arrache les patchs à signer jeudi ^^ #KohaILS"
20:44 jeff         jcamins: this is the context of my inquiry -- my most recent example of fetching a user summary via LibraryREST from Evergreen: https://gist.github.com/jeff/0b26193dc32c5397c2de
20:45 jeff         (at some point a better term than LibraryREST may be desired, but that's what's sticking for now)
20:48 jcamins      Nifty!
20:55 wizzyrea     well you can set a lost authorised value for claims returned
20:55 wizzyrea     it doesn't do anything though
20:55 wizzyrea     and good morning
20:55 jeff         good morning!
21:10 rangi        back
21:43 mtompset     okay... I really have a search problem.
21:43 mtompset     I did a fresh git install.
21:43 mtompset     and I loaded my data from our live system into it.
21:44 mtompset     when I do a search, I get nothing.
21:44 mtompset     I did a full reindex.
21:44 mtompset     I restarted zebra.
21:44 wizzyrea     indexes owned by the correct user?
21:44 mtompset     any other suggestions?
21:44 wahanui      any other suggestions are welcome
21:44 rangi        permissions is most likely the problem
21:45 mtompset     everything in my home directory is owned by me.
21:46 mtompset     except the koha error logs.
21:46 mtompset     and I know those are fine, because they are registering the silent errors.
21:46 wizzyrea     zebra is running as you?
21:47 mtompset     Yes.
21:48 mtompset     I'll have to try later. Running late now.
21:48 mtompset     Have a great day, everyone.
22:11 bag          mtompset marc21?
22:11 bag          oh missed him by a lot :P
22:12 cait1        hi bag
22:12 bag          hey cait1
22:13 cait         and good night :)
22:14 drojf        buy humble bundle, sign off on koha patches instead of playing. leisure time, i'm doing it right.
22:14 wizzyrea     @quote add <drojf> buy humble bundle, sign off on koha patches instead of playing. leisure time, i'm doing it right.
22:14 huginn       wizzyrea: Error: You must be registered to use this command. If you are already registered, you must either identify (using the identify command) or add a hostmask matching your current hostmask (using the "hostmask add" command).
22:14 wizzyrea     Nooooo
22:15 drojf        heh
22:15 wizzyrea     @quote add <drojf> buy humble bundle, sign off on koha patches instead of playing. leisure time, i'm doing it right.
22:15 huginn       wizzyrea: The operation succeeded.  Quote #253 added.
22:15 wizzyrea     take that
22:15 wizzyrea     @quote get 252
22:15 huginn       wizzyrea: Quote #252: "<@jcamins> Really the issues is that Anglo-American libraries have settled on a profoundly stupid format that utterly fails to express anything that patrons care about, while going on at great length about things patrons don't care about." (added by chris at 10:42 PM, May 26, 2013)
22:15 wahanui      i already had it that way, huginn.
22:15 * wizzyrea   nods
22:16 wizzyrea     @quote get 251
22:16 huginn       wizzyrea: Quote #251: "<zebran00b> I'm thinking there's a regular expression for this" (added by wizzyrea at 04:56 AM, May 24, 2013)
22:16 drojf        lol
22:25 pianohacker  I'm beginning to get this feeling that jcamins passionately hates MARC21/AACR
22:27 rhcl         we need a new format: anti-marc
22:28 eythian      hi
22:29 pianohacker  yo
22:30 drojf        hi eythian
22:30 drojf        rhcl: let's call it ɔɹɐɯ
22:30 rhcl         how did you do that?
22:32 eythian      you turn your keyboard around
22:33 rhcl         well, that's easier than standing on one's head I suppose
22:33 rhcl         I'm thinking escape codes in the chat client?
22:34 eythian      nah, just UTF-8
22:34 rhcl         diff subject: Anyone know if any of Douglas County's (Colorado, USA) Libraries are using Koha or EG?
22:34 eythian      http://www.fliptext.org/ <-- or use this
22:35 rhcl         For those that don't follow it, that library system is a (USA) pioneer on self-hosting ebooks. I was wondering how they might have integrated them into their ILS.
22:35 eythian      might be worth looking in libwebcats
22:36 pianohacker  for future reference, if you are configuring targets in pazpar2 completely through the webservice, you have to set the pz:name setting
22:36 rhcl         My state (Missouri) is apparently ready to follow in their footsteps, and set up a state-wide "owned" ebook solution.
22:36 pianohacker  nothing else seems to be required, but that's a very important undocumented requirement...
22:37 wizzyrea     ugh why rhcl - Yay, government DRM! seems legit.
22:38 eythian      pianohacker: you should document it
22:38 wizzyrea     you still own nothing
22:38 rangi        its cheaper nothing
22:38 rangi        thats the only win i see
22:38 rhcl         Well, no. Both Douglas County and (apparently) MO are emphasizing the problem of licensing, and the desire to serve DRM-free content.
22:39 wizzyrea     yea, afaict they haven't actually gotten that.
22:39 pianohacker  eythian: fingers crossed, it will in the form of code comments :)
22:39 eythian      that works too :)
22:39 pianohacker  rhcl: Doesn't douglas county use overdrive? Their site points at that
22:39 rhcl         and they do "own" the titles, although with the licensing restrictions in place. This really does "replace" Overdrive
22:40 rhcl         I can forward an email with links if anyone is interested.
22:40 rangi        they no more own them than they did with overdrive
22:40 rangi        the licensing agreements say that
22:40 rangi        they are renting
22:40 rangi        just from publishers instead of overdrive
22:40 rangi        cutting out overdrive is a win
22:40 wizzyrea     ^
22:40 rangi        but its not revolutionary or a great leap forward, its cheaper rentl
22:40 rangi        als
22:40 rangi        which is cool and all
22:40 rhcl         With overdrive they were clearly term-limited and licensed. With the "owned" instances the books never expire, they sit firmly on your servers.
22:41 rangi        yeah just like 1984 sat firmly on peoples kindles
22:41 rhcl         Realize I hate DRM as much as anyone, but this is somewhat better than Overdrive, which I truly dislike
22:41 rangi        *nod*
22:41 rangi        i repeat
22:41 wizzyrea     lesser of two evils is still evil :P
22:41 rangi        but its not revolutionary or a great leap forward, its cheaper rentals :)
22:41 rhcl         agreed
22:41 rangi        its better than it was
22:42 rangi        id love to see a library go, you know what
22:42 rangi        tor, they offer drm free
22:42 rangi        im gonna buy their entire catalogue
22:42 rangi        and screw the rest of your douchebags
22:42 rangi        unlikely i know
22:42 rangi        but that id cheer about :)
22:42 rangi        hell id sign up as a member to them :)
22:43 wizzyrea     the only libraries i know of in colorado that use koha, to answer your original question, ar CLIC, and they run the thing that masquerades as Koha but isn't
22:43 rhcl         wizzyrea: do you know Monique? I've met her a few times, and she's visited here too. The director there really does have an open-source interest.
22:44 rangi        back to your question
22:44 wizzyrea     monique doesn't sound familiar
22:44 rangi        they run horizon
22:44 pianohacker  wizzyrea: Me raises a tiny, insignificant flag for a small library in Florence, CO ;)
22:44 wizzyrea     oh right I forgot about yours :)
22:44 rangi        oh yeah :)
22:44 pianohacker  rangi: Yeah, I got the same from libwebcats
22:44 rangi        http://www.librarytechnology.org/lwc-displaylibrary.pl?RC=1463
22:44 rhcl         she was tech director or something at Johnson County libraries until moving to Douglas
22:44 drojf        rhcl: it's a function in duckduckgo but there are aseveral other sites as eythian pointed out https://duckduckgo.com/?kl=wt-wt&ks=s&kr=-1&ke=-1&kp=-1&kf=-1&q=flip+marc
22:44 wizzyrea     but you're not in douglas county eh?
22:45 pianohacker  nope, jefferson county
22:45 wizzyrea     so funny those are all the same counties that were in NEKLS - it's so confusing :)
22:45 * jcamins    waits impatiently for the flatbread to be done.
22:45 jcamins      I'm making mozzarella-cashew flatbread.
22:45 pianohacker  looks like douglas county has a lot of money/programmers, as the OPAC looks completely custom
22:45 * drojf      waits impatiently to find the enery to go to bed
22:46 pianohacker  jcamins: I love all three of those things, at least on their own :)
22:46 rhcl         yep, they have a growing area, good revenue stream
22:46 eythian      rangi: start with China Miéville. His books are annoyingly un-put-downable, and are on tor as DRM free.
22:46 drojf        energy even
22:47 jcamins      pianohacker: vufind with some serious added content, I think.
22:47 rhcl         "...forging agreements9 with independent publishers such as SmashWords, Akashic, Untreed, Poisoned Pen, and the Colorado Independent Publishers Association..."
22:47 pianohacker  jcamins: vufind would make sense
22:47 rangi        eythian: noted ;)
22:48 eythian      http://www.panmacmillan.com/book/chinamieville/railsea <-- also, that one is on sale until the end of the month or so
22:48 rhcl         http://publiclibrariesonline.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/51n1fig3.jpg
22:48 eythian      (the summary makes it sound odder than it really is :)
22:49 pianohacker  huh, jefferson county runs iii. don't see a lot of them
22:49 rhcl         they have a mysql server to serve the very significant amount of non-DRM titles
22:49 jcamins      iii? You don't see a lot of iii?
22:49 jcamins      Millennium is one of the market leaders!
22:49 jcamins      Which is sad.
22:50 pianohacker  not as common here in Colorado, at least.
22:50 jcamins      Lucky. ;)
22:52 pianohacker  haha, yeah. as painful as migrating our ~15000 bib/1500 patron collection from old Horizon was, apparently that was on the low end of the pain/numbers spectrum :)
22:52 pianohacker  massive amounts of data munging in perl to get borrowers into 2.2.9
22:52 jcamins      Close, but not quite done.
22:53 * jcamins    continues being impatient.
22:54 jcamins      Gosh that looks and smells good (and done!:D).
22:56 eythian      are there likely to be any bad effects from zapping the sessions table (aside from logging everyone out?)
22:57 gmcharlt     eythian: disappointed data miners, perhaps
22:57 eythian      gmcharlt: that sounds like a plus :)
22:57 gmcharlt     heh
22:57 eythian      this is just for a test system anyway
22:58 wizzyrea     doesn't the cleanup script zap it every night anyway?
22:58 jcamins      eythian: nope. No bad effects.
22:58 gmcharlt     wizzyrea: why do you think the data miners have been disapoointed for years at this point? ;)
22:58 wizzyrea     :D
22:58 eythian      it does, though I think it only deletes ones that are a couple of days old (not sure of the specifics)
22:59 jcamins      Wow. That is some pretty damn tasty flatbread.
22:59 wizzyrea     you must send me the recipe please
22:59 jcamins      eythian: it's supposed to be > a couple days old.
22:59 eythian      yeah, that's what I thought
23:00 jcamins      wizzyrea: it's the semolina recipe in Artisan Bread in Five Minutes a Day, rolled out flat, rubbed with basil olive oil, sprinkled with rosemary, mozzarella, and broken cashews.
23:00 wizzyrea     ohh
23:01 jcamins      I'm trying to reduce the amount of time I spend on baking while increasing the amount of deliciousness.
23:01 jcamins      Therefore I am giving Artisan Bread in Five Minutes a Day a serious try.
23:06 jcamins      And the dough is from...
23:06 jcamins      Saturdayish.
23:06 jcamins      Or maybe Fridayish.
23:07 jcamins      The 24th.
23:08 jcamins      Friday.
23:31 jcamins      There are some challenges to putting the finishing touches on an application that uses app cache.
23:32 jcamins      Change the code... nothing happens... shift-refresh... no change... alt-refresh... nothing... shift-alt-refresh... no... oh yeah! app cache... log out... log back in... get told to refresh the page... code has changed.
23:32 wahanui      jcamins: that doesn't look right
23:32 rangi        heh
23:40 pianohacker  all right, off for the day. 'night #koha :)
23:40 eythian      later
23:47 * jeff       yawns
23:48 wizzyrea     you know I really missed pianohacker :)
23:48 wizzyrea     i'm glad he's back
23:48 * wizzyrea   thinks that pianohacker and cjh would be great friends.
23:49 eythian      They're the same person. Ever seen them in the same room together? See.
23:49 wizzyrea     omg.
23:49 cjh          and now that you all know...
23:49 cjh          I can't let this get out.
23:49 wizzyrea     i thought you were going to bed :P
23:51 cjh          get the popcorn?
23:51 wahanui      http://i.imgur.com/p3cHE.gif
23:55 rangi        i cant .. even .. find .. the ... words
23:55 wizzyrea     yea just don'
23:55 wizzyrea     don't bother
23:55 rangi        the problem is
23:55 * wizzyrea   puts away the popcorn
23:55 rangi        threads end up
23:55 jcamins      Huh?
23:55 rangi        with his complete bullshit mis information as the last workd
23:55 rangi        -k
23:55 cjh          jcamins: memcached discussion in koha-devel
23:55 jcamins      Oh.
23:55 * jcamins    does a happy dance.
23:56 jcamins      The filter worked!
23:56 cjh          heh
23:56 jcamins      Winwinwinwinwinwinwinwinwinwinwin!!!!!
23:56 wizzyrea     loool
23:56 wizzyrea     get the popcorn?
23:56 wahanui      http://i.imgur.com/p3cHE.gif
23:56 * cjh        feels like replying with 'no'
23:56 rangi        that seems appropriate
23:57 eythian      jcamins: it's OK, you'll see his content in my reply in 5 .. 4 ... 3 ...
23:57 rangi        lol
23:57 jcamins      eythian: haven't I told you before about not removing headers?
23:58 eythian      I actually CC'ed you.
23:58 eythian      (disclaimer: that may be a lie)
23:58 jcamins      lol