Time  Nick         Message
23:36 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10030 major, P5 - low, ---, kyle.m.hall, Passed QA , MaxFines checks against amount, not amount outstanding
23:36 jcamins      Well, other than bug 10030 which I'll look at shortly.
23:36 jcamins      I think you should be safe from me saying "didn't I just push a fix?" for a while now.
23:34 trea         i suppose it's time to test again, innit.
23:34 jcamins      That's why I asked.
23:34 jcamins      Right, but I pushed it today.
23:33 trea         i haven't tested today in master to be fair
23:33 wizzyrea     it was broken as of yesterday in master
23:33 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10108 major, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, Pushed to Master , can't print more than one page of overdues
23:33 wizzyrea     10108
23:33 jcamins      Bug 10108.
23:32 jcamins      I just pushed a patch to fix the printing of tables under FF.
23:32 wahanui      which patch are we talking about?
23:32 trea         which patch?
23:32 jcamins      trea: it's not fixed by the patch that I just pushed?
23:13 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10225 normal, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, Pushed to Stable , If an item isn't editable, don't show the onclick Edit/Delete menu
23:13 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=9591 blocker, P3, ---, chris, Pushed to Stable , Set Library changes after viewing Holds Queue >> reserves item
23:13 jenkins_koha * Owen Leonard: Bug 10225 - If an item isn't editable, don't show the onclick Edit/Delete menu
23:13 jenkins_koha * Chris Cormack: Bug 9591 : Set Library changes after viewing Holds Queue >> reserves item
23:13 jenkins_koha Project Koha_3.8.x build #316: SUCCESS in 38 min: http://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_3.8.x/316/
23:05 pianohac1er  I'm done for the day, good night all
22:37 bgkriegel    Bye all
22:37 bgkriegel    ok, to the kitchen. I have to make dinner :)
22:36 bgkriegel    yeap, i'll try with that first
22:35 cjh          if you want to practise with remotes you could make a fake github upstream
22:35 jenkins_koha Starting build #316 for job Koha_3.8.x (previous build: SUCCESS)
22:35 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10225 normal, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, Pushed to Stable , If an item isn't editable, don't show the onclick Edit/Delete menu
22:35 jenkins_koha Owen Leonard: Bug 10225 - If an item isn't editable, don't show the onclick Edit/Delete menu
22:35 jenkins_koha Project Koha_3.10.x build #121: SUCCESS in 40 min: http://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_3.10.x/121/
22:34 rangi        :)
22:34 bgkriegel    rangi: thank you very much. Now we need to practice a lot :)
22:33 tcohen       ok, bye #koha, leaving
22:32 wahanui      That'll be $1 for the awesome jar, cjh
22:32 cjh          awesome.
22:32 rangi        cjh: no, no -f
22:32 tcohen       putting several patches together in a branch before pushing
22:32 tcohen       oh, that workflow i'm not used to
22:31 cjh          yeah, that could be problematic :)
22:31 jcamins      The problem is when your local testing branch contains things that you are eventually going to decide you don't want to push.
22:31 cjh          rangi: I presume we dont have rewrite permissions?
22:31 jcamins      And it is.
22:31 cjh          although if it isnt a clean fast forward it *should* be rejected :)
22:30 cjh          jcamins: yeah if you have a local ref of the same name as the foreign but they contain different things, it could be bad.
22:30 cjh          I was worried about git.push.default settings, but since you are specifying a ref it isnt dangerous :)
22:30 tcohen       (both the remote and local branches where called the same)
22:29 tcohen       yes, my example also contained some stuff implicit
22:29 jcamins      The reason I don't do that is because I had a 3.6/testing branch, and I couldn't push to that without the explicit name.
22:29 cjh          git push repo src:dst, and dst will default to src if omitted.
22:29 jcamins      Oh, I know what it is.
22:28 jcamins      cjh: are you sure?
22:28 cjh          hmmm 'git push repo ref' means pushing your local ref to the same named ref on the repo, so git push settings dont seem to matter \o/
22:27 tcohen       ok, thanks rangi for the explanation, we'll be in touch for further questions
22:24 cjh          it also somewhat depends on your git settings, so be careful :)
22:24 jcamins      Right.
22:24 tcohen       so its a matter of confidence on the implicit stuff
22:23 jcamins      ^^ that's what I use.
22:23 tcohen       i use: git push github 3.10.x:3.10.x
22:23 rangi        however i always do :)
22:23 rangi        heres one specially for you https://soundcloud.com/latinaotearoa/fuego-en-mi-corazon
22:23 jcamins      I never _ever_ use that syntax.
22:22 jcamins      That pushes the local branch 3.10.x to whatever is mapped to on the remote.
22:22 jcamins      No.
22:22 tcohen       this pushes the current (local) branch into the remote's 3.10.x ?
22:22 tcohen       git push gitmaster@git.koha-community.org:koha.git 3.10.x
22:22 tcohen       last question (sorry)
22:21 rangi        heh
22:21 tcohen       guess will start with that, until we get our own lists
22:20 rangi        http://grooveshark.com/#!/playlist/I+See+Bugs+And+All+I+Wanna+Do+Is+Bang+Bang+Bang+And+Take+Their+Money/57969319
22:20 rangi        and this is a good one for testing
22:19 rangi        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9gEy2FJ_AiA
22:19 rangi        also
22:17 tcohen       i hope it lasts :-D
22:17 rangi        etc
22:17 rangi        http://blog.bigballofwax.co.nz/2012/07/31/yes-you-should-rewrite-it-no-not-like-that/
22:17 rangi        and
22:17 rangi        http://blog.bigballofwax.co.nz/2011/07/21/halfway-to-3-6-0-and-a-brief-explanation-of-the-release-process/
22:17 tcohen       ok rangi, jcamins: i'm happy to do this
22:16 rangi        but i just use my own blog now
22:16 * jcamins    thinks that's a great idea. Go for it!
22:16 tcohen       :-P
22:16 rangi        i used to
22:16 rangi        mine is in this log
22:16 tcohen       I think people doing RM and RMaint should have a blog where they share their thoughts on the subject :-P
22:15 jcamins      All my documentation -- I think -- is in release-tools the release-tools repo on git.k-c.org and my home-bin repo on git.cpbibliography.com.
22:15 bgkriegel    there is a little about cherry-pick (http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Using_Git_Cherry_Pick)
22:15 jcamins      I think it'd be a great idea.
22:15 rangi        or things people find useful
22:15 rangi        but writing up some best practices wouldnt hurt
22:15 jcamins      ^^ exactly
22:15 rangi        you get to choose your workflow
22:14 rangi        if you are crazy enough to want to be rmaint or rm
22:14 rangi        well you can pretty much do it however you want
22:14 cjh          tcohen++
22:14 tcohen       we should have RMaint guidelines in the wiki
22:13 rangi        id imaging 3.14 would go to 5.14
22:13 jcamins      Right.
22:12 rangi        as in, everything should work in 5.10 up
22:12 eythian      tcohen: packages don't yet cleanly work on wheezy, I hope to get that sorted soon.
22:12 rangi        for 3.10.x and 3.8.x .. jcamins 5.10 for 3.12.x too eh?
22:12 jcamins      I've been RMing on 12.04, but I do some testing on Squeeze.
22:12 rangi        5.10 is still currently our base
22:11 rangi        jenkins will upgrade at some point i imagine, (its a biblibre machine so I would have to check with them)
22:11 rangi        yep
22:11 tcohen       I mostly use 12.04 and faced troubles with perl 5.14 vs 5.10 in jenkins
22:11 rangi        but for now squeeze is still a cood one
22:10 rangi        so will be moving the packages to that i would imagine
22:10 rangi        well wheezy is out
22:10 tcohen       should we stick to debian squeeze VPS for the testing phase?
22:10 rangi        however its usually fine, if its been pushed to master
22:10 tcohen       also: that debian thing :-D
22:09 rangi        i test it
22:09 rangi        tcohen: if its something that needs a release asap release it asap
22:09 tcohen       leave it to eythian?
22:09 tcohen       should we test packaging stuff?
22:09 tcohen       the other question regards the rmaint infrastructure
22:08 rangi        yep
22:08 tcohen       as rmaint you'd hurry to get a new version out, right?
22:08 rangi        ah yep ive done one or 2 of those
22:08 cjh          the more questions you ask, the less I have to :)
22:08 tcohen       what do u think of security releases?
22:08 tcohen       have a few more questions
22:08 bgkriegel    hehe
22:08 cjh          heh
22:07 rangi        its easier that way
22:07 rangi        ive been doing it nz time, you can do it argentinian time :)
22:07 tcohen       of course rangi
22:07 rangi        tcohen: yeah 15th for string feeze 22nd for release
22:07 rangi        but i can show you that closer to the release if you want
22:06 rangi        to do the creating the tarballs and release notes
22:06 tcohen       is it of any use for rmaint? or just for gmcharlt ?
22:06 rangi        yeah thats what i use to do the release
22:06 tcohen       what about release-tools git repo?
22:05 tcohen       rangi: i guess we'll stick to the current schedule for the releases
22:04 cjh          bye :)
22:04 eythian      bye cait
22:04 cait         bye all :)
22:04 cait         hi eythian
22:04 cjh          morning eythian
22:04 eythian      hi
22:03 * cjh        goes to read over rangi's notes
22:03 tcohen       ok rangi, i'll be practicing a bit
22:02 bgkriegel    of course
22:02 rangi        if you want
22:02 rangi        you can practice on local branches of course
22:01 rangi        nz time
22:01 rangi        ill set that up tonight
22:01 rangi        got your key thanks tcohen
22:01 rangi        yup
22:01 cait         time to get off that koha
22:01 cjh          I think it is very cool having multiple stable branches supported, takes a bit of pressure off around upgrading.
22:00 cait         true
22:00 rangi        its hit its 18 months tho and is dead
22:00 rangi        3.6. had a couple of releases
22:00 rangi        we had 3 this time
22:00 cjh          sounds good to me
22:00 cait         so we are going to have 3 releases in maintenance? wow
22:00 rangi        i think 18 months is a good life for a stable branch
22:00 rangi        to hit its 18 month mark
22:00 rangi        its got probably 5 more
21:59 rangi        13 releases ;)
21:59 cait         but you got 1 month then to figure it all out :)
21:59 cjh          wow 3.8.13, that is a big number
21:59 rangi        and thats when im stopping
21:59 rangi        come out on 22 may
21:59 rangi        basically 3.10.6 and 3.8.13
21:59 cjh          *gulp*
21:59 rangi        hehe
21:59 rangi        you take over the very next day!
21:58 rangi        yep
21:58 cjh          so we are sworn into office when 3.12 is released?
21:57 tcohen       ?
21:57 tcohen       chris@bigballofwax
21:57 cjh          yeah.
21:57 cjh          I will just make one for rmaint and share it across machines :)
21:57 rangi        just for this
21:57 rangi        it might be worth making one
21:57 rangi        you can, but its just a bit messier to set up
21:57 rangi        id rather you didnt :)
21:56 cjh          are we allowed to have multiple public keys?
21:56 rangi        ill add that
21:56 rangi        that you want to use
21:56 rangi        so if you can email me your public key
21:56 rangi        so i can add you to being able to push to your branches
21:55 cait         same here :)
21:55 rangi        is your ssh keys
21:55 cjh          I find it really helpful when it says "pushed to 3.12.x will be in 3.12.1", especially later when I go digging :)
21:55 rangi        what i need from all 3 rmaints
21:55 cait         tcohen++ bgkriegel++ cjh++ :)
21:55 rangi        but i think this is enough for now?
21:55 rangi        when we get closer to your first release i can show you how to create the release notes and roll the tarball etc
21:54 * rangi      hopes this is useful
21:54 jenkins_koha Starting build #121 for job Koha_3.10.x (previous build: SUCCESS)
21:54 rangi        thats a good example of one with a conflict i didnt want to fix myself
21:54 huginn       04Bug 7228: major, P5 - low, ---, christophe.croullebois, Pushed to Stable , can't order more than 1 when importing all from staged file
21:54 rangi        http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7228#c19
21:53 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7228 major, P5 - low, ---, christophe.croullebois, Pushed to Stable , can't order more than 1 when importing all from staged file
21:53 rangi        bug 7228
21:53 rangi        and only look for things like this
21:53 rangi        i just watch the commits
21:53 rangi        but mostly
21:52 rangi        3.8.x just looks for any that have a "Pushed to 3.10.x" comment
21:52 rangi        3.10.x watches for pushed to stable
21:52 rangi        basically rm maint 3.12.x watches for pushed for master
21:51 rangi        we had separate when jared was rmaint with me
21:51 rangi        not really
21:51 tcohen       (now that we are separate individuals pushing to stable branches)
21:51 tcohen       don't we need more "Pushed to" flags?
21:51 rangi        (im just doing 2 branches at once)
21:50 rangi        and then the next one pushed to 3.10.x will be in 3.10.7 etc
21:50 rangi        pushed to 3.12.x will be in 3.12.1
21:50 rangi        so youd be
21:50 huginn       04Bug 10225: normal, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, Pushed to Stable , If an item isn't editable, don't show the onclick Edit/Delete menu
21:50 rangi        http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10225#c5
21:49 wahanui      a comment is enough?
21:49 rangi        and a comment
21:49 rangi        switching it to pushed to stable
21:49 rangi        and i update the bug
21:49 rangi        git push gitmaster@git.koha-community.org:koha.git 3.8.x
21:48 rangi        so i can push that up to 3.8.x
21:48 rangi        right thats working
21:48 rangi        otherwise we would get the same conflict and have to fix it again
21:47 rangi        git cherry-pick -x 0394a8f8ce88b6883cd2a14d57971713f98be346
21:47 rangi        exactly
21:47 wizzyrea     webchat.oftc.net
21:47 wizzyrea     or use that link I just posted
21:47 tcohen       you cherry pick from 3.10 rangi?
21:47 martian523   ok, thanks!
21:47 rangi        test again
21:47 rangi        it applies clean (cos i fixed it already)
21:46 cait         martian523: i would think maybe too many users from mibbit or oftc blocking mibbit for some reason - wrong only because it's mibbit. if you install an irc client it's probably working better
21:46 rangi        then cherry-pick the commit i just made (ie the one we have already fixed the conflict in)
21:46 rangi        date even
21:46 rangi        make sure its up to day
21:45 martian523   so is there something wrong with the irc chat link?
21:45 rangi        so what i will do is checkout 3.8.x
21:45 martian523   thanks
21:45 rangi        so i think we should cherry-pick this back
21:45 tcohen       we'll be very carefull because there are some bits we might not be familiar with (yet)
21:44 * tcohen     agrees
21:44 rangi        this one is pretty safe, but yes in general that is a good rule
21:43 cait         martian523: well for notices, 880 will show on detail pages and result lists wth xslt turned on
21:43 tcohen       because it might have side effects of course
21:43 cait         martian523: i think right now that is true
21:43 rangi        yep, thats the first thing to chceck
21:43 cait         which one are you looking at?
21:43 martian523   i see. so there's really no way to show the original characters unless i move them to 245
21:42 tcohen       i think we need to check the bug is present in 3.8
21:42 bgkriegel    thinking
21:42 bgkriegel    no rangi :)
21:42 bgkriegel    i'll try, is small change
21:42 rangi        bgkriegel: tcohen ... did i lose you?
21:42 cait         martian523: notices are build using the information from items, bilbio and biblioitems, there is no access to the marc currently and you can't really map 880
21:41 * rangi      pauses
21:41 wizzyrea     https://webchat.oftc.net/
21:41 cait         martian523: 245$a should show - but not the 880
21:41 bag          I like cherries :P
21:41 martian523   anyways, i want to ask if there's a way for koha to get marc field 245 and marc field 880 to show up when sending out notices to patrons
21:40 * rangi      hopes i havent totally confusd people
21:40 rangi        now, what do you think .. shall i also cherry pick this down to 3.8.x ?
21:40 rangi        technically we should be in string freeze and that was a template change, but i havent called string freeze yet, will do later today :)
21:39 wizzyrea     mibbit and oftc must be having a disagreement
21:39 rangi        and jenkins will start testing it
21:39 rangi        and its now pushed up
21:39 rangi        git push gitmaster@git.koha-community.org:koha.git 3.10.x
21:39 cait         hi martian523
21:39 martian523   i kept getting this message : Closing Link: ircip4.mibbit.com (Banned)
21:38 rangi        then i run
21:38 martian523   hi, it took me a long time to log in to this chatrrom
21:38 * cait       watches them all scribbling down notes
21:38 rangi        git commit --amend -s
21:38 rangi        so i sign off
21:38 rangi        im gonna push this
21:38 rangi        so im happy
21:38 rangi        so im pretty confident, im more testing i didnt mess up in my conflict fix
21:37 rangi        i also know that katrin and jared and nicole have all tested this too
21:37 rangi        right its working for me
21:37 rangi        and luckily i have more than one branch set up :)
21:36 rangi        it has a good test plan so thats easy
21:36 * rangi      quickly does that
21:36 rangi        then ill test it on a running koha
21:36 rangi        perl xt/author/valid_templates.t
21:35 rangi        perl xt/tt_valid.t
21:35 rangi        for this i want to run some xt tests
21:35 rangi        but for this change not needed, we dont change any perl, just a template
21:34 rangi        just cos thats habbit
21:34 rangi        id start with a prove t
21:34 rangi        now i get to test, i have to test a bit more cos i fixed a conflict
21:33 rangi        which helps if we ever have to track anything down to with this
21:33 rangi        Conflicts: koha-tmpl/intranet-tmpl/prog/en/modules/cataloguing/additem.tt
21:33 rangi        (cherry picked from commit 1a8db0ba7d62a70cd6b49ee705a5db9b11ad7672)
21:33 rangi        this adds 2 lines to the commit message
21:33 rangi        git commit
21:33 rangi        git add file
21:33 rangi        edit
21:32 rangi        so ill fix this
21:31 rangi        'This does not apply cleanly to 3.10.x please submit one formatted for 3.10.x'
21:31 rangi        i would write on teh bug
21:31 rangi        but if i was unsure at all
21:31 rangi        because its a very simple conflict
21:31 rangi        and then i would fix this
21:30 rangi        and check that what i think the fix would be is right
21:30 rangi        to see what the original commmit did
21:30 rangi        (with git show usually)
21:30 rangi        so i look at http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=commitdiff;h=1a8db0ba7d62a70cd6b49ee705a5db9b11ad7672;hp=0218769607c25029bbee9eb8ddcc71ddc37cc12e
21:30 rangi        now i think i could fix this
21:29 pastebot     "rangi" at 127.0.0.1 pasted "index 46d99b5,1043965..0000000" (24 lines) at http://paste.koha-community.org/11
21:28 rangi        hint: after resolving the conflicts, mark the corrected paths
21:28 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10225 normal, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, Pushed to Master , If an item isn't editable, don't show the onclick Edit/Delete menu
21:28 rangi        error: could not apply 1a8db0b... Bug 10225 - If an item isn't editable, don't show the onclick Edit/Delete menu
21:28 * wizzyrea   googles -x
21:28 rangi        it doesnt apply clean
21:28 rangi        git cherry-pick -x 1a8db0ba7d62a70cd6b49ee705a5db9b11ad7672
21:28 rangi        then i do
21:27 rangi        http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=commit;h=1a8db0ba7d62a70cd6b49ee705a5db9b11ad7672
21:27 rangi        so i look here
21:27 rangi        i cherry-pick
21:27 tcohen       is git bz the right tool for fetching and merging?
21:26 tcohen       excelent
21:26 rangi        there are links for atom and rss feeds
21:26 rangi        scroll to the bottom
21:26 rangi        http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=shortlog;h=refs/heads/3.12.x
21:26 rangi        yep
21:26 rangi        fetch and merge
21:26 tcohen       teacher, do we have some feed to follow for the latest commits? (:-P)
21:25 rangi        so i check out my 3.10.x branch
21:25 rangi        so the first thing i would do is check it applys
21:25 cait         ;)
21:25 cait         QAM agrees
21:25 bgkriegel    yes
21:25 tcohen       yes
21:24 rangi        it reads to me like its something we should fix in stable
21:23 tcohen       QAed
21:23 rangi        what do you reckon about that one?
21:23 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10225 normal, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, Pushed to Master , If an item isn't editable, don't show the onclick Edit/Delete menu
21:23 rangi        bug 10225
21:23 rangi        and then i just move on
21:23 rangi        so i did a comment like that
21:22 huginn       04Bug 10134: normal, P5 - low, ---, mtj, Pushed to Master , set XSLT usage ON as default, for new Koha installs
21:22 rangi        http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10134#c6
21:22 bgkriegel    yeap :)
21:22 rangi        if they arent in one of those states, its not time for us maintainers yet :)
21:22 rangi        but you really only have to care about things that are either pushed to master, pushed to stable or passed qa
21:22 bgkriegel    ok
21:21 rangi        and skim read almost all the bug mail
21:21 rangi        (i have filters set up)
21:21 rangi        so you do need to keep an eye on the bugs list
21:21 gaetan_B     bye !
21:21 rangi        bgkriegel: yeah, thats a pretty good rule of thumb, sometimes however there is a patch for a bug that is only present in an older version
21:20 rangi        like that
21:20 bgkriegel    Q: not for 3.10.x if not in 3.12.x?
21:20 rangi        but what i will do, is not on the bug that im not doing that, so i remember
21:20 tcohen       it is changing a default behaviour
21:19 rangi        so i would not cherry-pick it
21:19 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10043 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, amit.gupta, Needs Signoff , Clear notforloan on receipt
21:19 cait         i am almost certain bug 10043 is a duplicate, but I can't find it. grr.
21:19 rangi        now in my opinion that is not a change we should put in a stable branch
21:18 rangi        so i pull that up in bugzilla and have a quick read
21:18 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10134 normal, P5 - low, ---, mtj, Pushed to Master , set XSLT usage ON as default, for new Koha installs
21:18 rangi        so the next bug in my queue is bug 10134
21:17 rangi        etc
21:17 rangi        ie, 3.12.x watches master, 3.10.x watches 3.12.x
21:17 rangi        so essentially you have to watch the branch ahead of you
21:17 bgkriegel    ok :)
21:17 rangi        (ive let it build up a few days so I have something to show you)
21:16 rangi        that is where i am up to in the queue
21:16 rangi        and find 9679
21:16 rangi        http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=shortlog;h=refs/heads/3.12.x
21:16 rangi        and if you look here
21:16 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=9679 major, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, Pushed to Stable , can't place hold from cart in CCSR
21:16 rangi        now if you look at the 3.10.x you will see near the top is bug 9679
21:15 rangi        http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=shortlog;h=refs/heads/3.8.x
21:15 rangi        http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=shortlog;h=refs/heads/3.10.x
21:15 rangi        heres the 2 branches i look after
21:15 rangi        http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=shortlog;h=refs/heads/3.12.x
21:15 rangi        but now since we are close to 3.12 i have been watching
21:15 rangi        (master)
21:15 rangi        normally i watch that url
21:14 rangi        http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=shortlog
21:14 pianohacker  it's outpatient, I'll just look like I fought a very small bear for a few weeks
21:14 rangi        ok, so here's how i do it
21:14 tcohen       ready to go rangi
21:14 pianohacker  elective; I've been pretty deaf in my right ear for a decade, and this is to put in a bone-implanted hearing aid that will bring it back
21:13 wizzyrea     ! minor surgery I hope
21:13 pianohacker  wizzyrea: fantastic, just started work with bywater, and have surgery for auditory implant on monday
21:13 bgkriegel    yes
21:12 rangi        not yet
21:12 pianohacker  is too low
21:12 rangi        right, ready to go?
21:12 huginn       pianohacker: Karma for "coffee" has been increased 5 times and decreased 1 time for a total karma of 4.
21:12 pianohacker  @karma coffee
21:12 wizzyrea     not yet tcohen
21:12 pianohacker  see, given the crazy schedules we all keep, ...
21:12 wizzyrea     and you?
21:12 tcohen       is Chris Hall around?
21:12 wizzyrea     i'm well!
21:12 pianohacker  hey wizzy :) how are you doing?
21:11 tcohen       (too much coffee at work time today)
21:11 tcohen       hmm, ceylon here
21:11 wahanui      well, pianohacker is younger, I think.
21:11 wizzyrea     pianohacker!
21:11 pianohacker  coffee++
21:09 rangi        i just have to grab a coffee then we can start
21:09 rangi        then others can read the log too
21:09 rangi        here is better :)
21:09 tcohen       hi rangi, we could connect through talk maybe?
21:05 pianohacker  yo
21:05 bgkriegel    hi rangi
21:04 rangi        hi there :)
20:59 bgkriegel    hi tcohen
20:59 tcohen       hi rangi, bgkriegel
20:55 * jcamins    calls it a day.
20:54 cait         right... and that's what i tested... it's getting late!
20:53 * jcamins    gazes blearily at this poster.
20:52 * magnuse    really is off now
20:52 magnuse      cait: the problem was with adding a new patron category...
20:51 * cait       confirms that adding a patron form the german interface is no problem
20:50 jcamins      Not sure.
20:50 jcamins      I think the pull requests are pretty easy.
20:50 magnuse      unless it's a lot of work for you or druthb_away
20:50 magnuse      sounds like a good plan to me
20:49 jcamins      Sunday.
20:49 jcamins      Hm, maybe I should ask the TM to do up a pull request now, and release another RC, then a final pull request on Saturday/
20:49 magnuse      it is!
20:49 cait         it's getting late
20:49 magnuse      i'm being stupid again
20:49 cait         druthb said something about saturday morning earlier on
20:49 magnuse      sure, no problem
20:48 jcamins      magnuse: yeah, I don't have a pull request for 3.12 yet. The release will have the translations.
20:48 magnuse      perhaps i did not reload properly
20:48 magnuse      i thought i tested that and got the same error
20:48 magnuse      gah
20:48 magnuse      and now it works for norwegian too
20:48 magnuse      but then i got the 3.12 ones from pootle
20:48 magnuse      i had the 3.10 files
20:48 jcamins      That was my suspicion.
20:48 wahanui      magnuse: I forgot it
20:48 magnuse      um, forget it
20:47 cait         but let me test
20:47 cait         i copied over the completed german files
20:46 jcamins      Because it occurs to me that if you had the 3.12 po files and magnuse had only the included po files (from 3.10), it might end up weird.
20:46 cait         let me recheck
20:46 cait         i wanted to know if the messages would get translated
20:46 jcamins      I mean, po files.
20:46 cait         i think so
20:46 cait         yes
20:46 jcamins      cait: did you update your translations?
20:45 cait         it worked for me, i got the error messages and it looked fine with german
20:45 cait         magnuse: did you ctrl reload or something?
20:45 cait         actually...
20:45 cait         acutally i did
20:42 magnuse      oops, gotta run, have fun #koha
20:39 * magnuse    wonders if cait tested that with the german translation
20:38 magnuse      ah, sounds plausible
20:38 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=6329 normal, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, Pushed to Master , patron categories should show which fields are required
20:38 jcamins      Bug 6329.
20:38 jcamins      I just pushed it, though.
20:37 jcamins      I don't remember.
20:37 magnuse      which one would that be?
20:34 jcamins      Okay, probably a result of that patch I just pushed.
20:33 magnuse      i have not seen it before
20:33 jcamins      Right.
20:33 magnuse      what, the error?
20:33 jcamins      magnuse: is it new?
20:32 magnuse      no missing js files, as far as i can see
20:31 magnuse      found a problem, perhaps: when i use the norwegian translation in the staff client and try to add a patron category, nothing happens when i click on "save". firebug tells me "ReferenceError: Check is not defined". works as normal when i switch to english
20:29 magnuse      rc is now installed
20:29 magnuse      jcamins: good :-)
20:29 jcamins      magnuse: they won't share a version after the 3.12 release.
20:28 jcamins      magnuse: I recommend the RC.
20:27 magnuse      koha-translate++ very convenient!
20:26 * magnuse    breathes a sigh of relief...
20:26 magnuse      that looks much better, yes
20:24 magnuse      jcamins++
20:24 * magnuse    should not let himself get in arrears with the lists
20:23 cait         magnuse: that looks right
20:22 magnuse      tcohen: i will, i think :-)
20:22 tcohen       BTW, I proposed to change the packages naming to avoid this situation, vote for it :-P
20:22 magnuse      koha-common_3.12.00-rc1_all.deb ?
20:22 tcohen       http://download.koha-community.org
20:22 magnuse      so to get beta3, i have to... find a package jcamins uloaded somewhere?
20:21 magnuse      um, that might be a tad confusing? ;-)
20:21 tcohen       yes, they share the DB version number
20:20 magnuse      the about page says 3.11.00.300
20:20 jcamins      magnuse: that's 3.14.
20:19 cait         I didn't see that happen on our installation, but we are beta3 i think
20:19 tcohen       doesn't squeeze-dev differ from 3.12?
20:19 cait         oh ouch?
20:19 magnuse      http://demo.test312.bibkat.no/
20:19 magnuse      whut?? i upgraded my 3.12 test install to the latest squeeze-dev package, and now all the "norwegian wovels" display wrong??
20:16 cait         hnm don't we have a page on aobut how to file bugs?
20:15 rangi        and now im gone for a bit
20:14 rangi        https://www.google.co.nz/search?q=site:bugs.koha-community.org  <-- getting there without killing my linode
20:13 rangi        the start of it it anyway
20:13 magnuse      in spanish? cool!
20:12 rangi        magnuse: did you see http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Koha_3.x_en_Debian_Squeeze
20:08 * rangi      will talk more after hes taken kids to school and gone to work
20:08 rangi        heya pianohacker good to see you again
20:05 magnuse      packages++
20:05 pianohacker  hey rangi
20:02 cait         nope i don't think he did
20:02 rangi        its a bit mean, but im sure fridolyn doesnt mean it to be
20:02 cait         but working on something else right now and it's getting late :(
20:02 cait         i will try
20:02 rangi        at bit more freindly/explaining
20:02 cait         *sigh*
20:02 cait         oh i see
20:02 huginn       04Bug 4173: normal, P3, ---, oleonard, Pushed to Stable , Statuses not appearing in the OPAC
20:02 rangi        http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=4173#c27
20:01 rangi        when im at my desk
20:01 cait         bit nicer?
20:01 rangi        if not I will in a couple of hours
20:01 rangi        could some one help them with a bit nicer instructions
20:01 huginn       04Bug 4173: normal, P3, ---, oleonard, Pushed to Stable , Statuses not appearing in the OPAC
20:01 rangi        http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=4173#c26
20:00 rangi        a new developer has submitted a patch there
20:00 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=4173 normal, P3, ---, oleonard, Pushed to Stable , Statuses not appearing in the OPAC
20:00 rangi        bug 4173
20:00 rangi        anyone got some time?
19:58 jcamins      But it's written in Ruby.
19:58 tcohen       :-P
19:58 jcamins      lol
19:58 tcohen       they have a sexy gal on their front page
19:57 jcamins      tcohen: also supposed to be good, but I liked LESS better. :P
19:57 tcohen       what about Sass?
19:56 jcamins      http://lesscss.org/#usage
19:56 jcamins      pianohacker: right.
19:56 pianohacker  jcamins: To confirm, developers would be using some kind of JS converter shim to use LESS on the fly, or how would that work?
19:55 jcamins      You can also do sets of rules.
19:55 jcamins      One of the benefits of LESS.
19:55 jcamins      Right.
19:55 jcamins      cait: it allows you to abstract out repeated declarations.
19:55 magnuse      so define a color once in a variable and then use that variable wherever you want to use the color?
19:55 jcamins      Just the RM.
19:55 jcamins      oleonard: no, other users of git don't have to run LESS.
19:54 magnuse      you can have variables in css, i think?
19:53 cait         i mean why do we want to use it?
19:53 cait         what is the big win of LESS again?
19:52 cait         hm not sure I can follow
19:52 * oleonard   retracts that non-sequitor
19:51 oleonard     ...and anyone who runs Koha off git, although those people are more qualified than anyone else to learn a new tool.
19:50 jcamins      Developers can simply use the LESS directly, and it is encumbant (sp?) on the RM to update the CSS.
19:50 jcamins      Not necessarily.
19:49 oleonard     It will require people to add a tool to their workflow
19:49 jcamins      I don't think it'll make it any harder.
19:44 oleonard     I worry about that too
19:44 cait         not sure how hard it will make it for people to do changes
19:43 cait         fail qa?
19:43 oleonard     If we start using LESS, I wonder how that affects tracking changes... What if a patch directly modifies the CSS file instead of the LESS file?
18:49 jcamins      And if you can limit the total concurrent logins to 1, you don't need authentication, really.
18:49 mtompset     And that would prevent multiple users, which defeats the purpose.
18:48 jcamins      You can't store environment variables in memcached because that would force you to have only one session open at a time.
18:48 mtompset     Hmmm... okay, that's an idea.
18:48 jcamins      Unfortunately, I don't have an answer beyond "CGI::Session takes care of it in Perl."
18:47 jcamins      What you wanted to ask was "how do I work with sessions?"
18:47 jcamins      I see. Memcached has nothing to do with that.
18:47 mtompset     Yes, I probably should try to write the SP in perl, so I don't have the simplesamlphp mess in the middle.
18:46 mtompset     opac login screen has a link to simplesamlphp...?as=OpenIdP... triggers OpenIdP authentication and redirects back to simplesamlphp... which then needs to redirect back to OPAC and have an environment variable set.
18:45 wahanui      "What are you trying to do?" or "What is the goal?"
18:45 jcamins      first question?
18:45 mtompset     I'm probably doing this all wrong, but I figure I'll try anyways.
18:44 mtompset     Right, but the environment variables for a perl script aren't going to be identical for the PHP script.
18:44 jcamins      So you'll still need your script to read in environment variables.
18:43 jcamins      I mean, you configure it with environment variables, but that's a Koha thing, not a memcached thing.
18:43 jcamins      A memcached server does not have anything to do with environment variables.
18:42 jcamins      Definitely not.
18:42 jcamins      No.
18:41 mtompset     I figured a memcache server would be the way to do that.
18:41 mtompset     But... well, environment variables need to get pushed and pulled nicely across.
18:41 mtompset     I successfully got simplesamlphp to authenticate, and I'm pretty sure now I can get it to redirect back to my opac interface.
18:40 mtompset     This is related to my experimentation with the shibboleth patch from biblibre.
18:40 jcamins      Where are you running into trouble?
18:39 mtompset     anyone familiar with setting up a memcache server? :)
18:35 jcamins      gmcharlt++
18:23 pianohacker  sweet
18:23 druthb       going okay, pianohacker. :D
18:23 druthb       :P  Just pulling your chain, mtompset.
18:23 pianohacker  druthb! how's it going?
18:23 mtompset     Oops... sorry, druthb. I didn't scroll back.
18:23 * druthb     feels missed by mtompset
18:23 mtompset     That always will be true.
18:22 pianohacker  I have sympathy for you and we've only just met
18:22 wahanui      i heard mtompset was disliking the silent warnings flooding his error logs.
18:22 pianohacker  and mtompset
18:22 pianohacker  hi, gmcharlt :)
18:21 cait         hi mtompset and gmcharlt :)
18:21 mtompset     Oops... missed it. Greetings, cait oleonard pianohacker and gmcharlt. Hopefully didn't miss anyone. :)
18:21 gmcharlt     yay!
18:21 wahanui      it has been said that pianohacker is younger, I think.
18:21 gmcharlt     pianohacker!
18:15 pianohacker  hi cait
18:15 jcamins      For people who liked the Hobbit: http://www.chisholm-poster.com/cgi-local/search.cgi?section=&search=CL53627
18:11 cait         welcome back pianohacker
18:11 * cait       waves
17:57 pianohacker  oleonard: excellent, glad to be back
17:56 oleonard     Very well, and you?
17:56 pianohacker  oleonard: how have you been?
17:53 pianohacker  oleonard: for another 8 minutes :)
17:51 oleonard     Hey pianohacker, is it morning where you are?
17:50 pianohacker  Good morning, #koha
17:34 cait         more a fast trainer - lots to practice and explain probably
17:34 drojf        it's also the fastest library
17:34 cait         oh too late
17:28 nengard      Hi #koha - say hi to our newest Koha Library here in Las Vegas
17:12 drojf        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1PJix23IeF8 :)
17:06 drojf        also reminds me of monty python's albatross
17:06 jcamins      An albatross around the neck: a comedy. :D
17:05 drojf        i will try to use that in a conversation as soon as possible :D
17:05 jcamins      drojf: ooh, I like that better.
17:04 drojf        haha i like »an albatross around the neck«
17:04 jcamins      Metaphorically it is a heavy burden that drags you down.
17:04 jcamins      Literally it's a ball and chain.
17:04 jcamins      Yes.
17:04 drojf        did you get it?
17:04 drojf        so sorry :D
17:03 jcamins      drojf: where were you earlier when I was trying to understand Klotz am Bein? I missed you terribly! :P
17:03 huginn       drojf: The current temperature in Prenzlauer Berg, Berlin, Germany is 24.8°C (6:43 PM CEST on May 15, 2013). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 25%. Dew Point: 3.0°C. Pressure: 29.59 in 1002 hPa (Steady).
17:03 drojf        @wunder berlin, germany
17:03 drojf        and hi #koha
17:03 drojf        hi mtompset
17:02 mtompset     Greetings, drojf. :)
16:11 mtompset     don't you mean git blames melia. ;)
16:04 melia        lol
16:04 * druthb     blames melia.
16:03 jcamins      Hehe.
16:01 tweetbot     [off] twitter: @27point7: "shut up, jenkins! #KohaILS"
15:52 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10094 normal, P5 - low, ---, koha-bugs, Pushed to Master , koha-list should have an --disabled option
15:52 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10146 normal, P5 - low, ---, tomascohen, Pushed to Master , koha-stop-zebra error handling
15:52 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10157 normal, P5 - low, ---, tomascohen, Pushed to Master , koha-email-enable error handling
15:52 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10159 normal, P5 - low, ---, tomascohen, Pushed to Master , koha-rebuild-zebra error handling
15:52 jenkins_koha * Tomas Cohen Arazi: Bug 10094 - koha-list should have a --disabled option switch
15:52 jenkins_koha * Tomas Cohen Arazi: Bug 10146 - koha-stop-zebra error handling
15:52 jenkins_koha * Tomas Cohen Arazi: Bug 10157 - koha-email-enable error handling
15:52 jenkins_koha * Tomas Cohen Arazi: Bug 10159 - koha-rebuild-zebra error handling
15:52 jenkins_koha Project Koha_master build #1174: STILL UNSTABLE in 1 hr 12 min: http://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_master/1174/
15:37 jcamins      tcohen: nope.
15:33 tcohen       (and that koha-translate --update es-ES worked too :-P)
15:32 tcohen       ok, updated our 38 testing instances to rc1, its a relief not to see broken chars
15:28 kf           bye all
15:20 mtompset     jwagner++
15:20 mtompset     Thanks for the information, jwagner.
15:20 dever23b     Thanks everyone.  I guess I'll just keep checking in.
15:20 dever23b     mtompset: Likewise.
15:18 mtompset     dever23b: Not a problem. Just glad we could communicate to the point of clarification.
15:17 dever23b     jwagner: I noticed that too
15:17 dever23b     mtompset: lol.  forgive me.  syntax error ;)
15:17 jwagner      But the problem is definitely on their end
15:16 jwagner      what's odd is that it works from their own gateway at http://www.loc.gov/z3950/gateway.html#lc -- just not from any external client
15:16 mtompset     I would have used a ;) not a :) for sarcasm. :P
15:16 mtompset     I don't see how it is funny not to be able to get the answer to your (and my) question.
15:16 dever23b     Lol.  Apparently both of you missed the sarcastic humor in that.  I wasn't actually suggesting that you do that.  I'm sorry.
15:15 jwagner      I don't threaten LC -- some of my best friends work there...
15:15 mtompset     See how long before LoC stops talking to jwagner and company.
15:15 dever23b     Yeah probably, but it'd be kinda funny.
15:15 mtompset     No, that more then likely would backfire.
15:15 dever23b     Maybe you should get his direct contact information plastered over the interwebs, and see how long it takes for them to make public a status page :)
15:14 dever23b     Even better lol
15:13 jwagner      We just have to wait until it starts working again, sigh
15:13 jwagner      I asked and he said they didn't have a publicly accessible status page, just for internal staff
15:13 mtompset     Thanks for the information, jwagner. :)
15:13 dever23b     jwagner: thank you very much.  I tried searching around for awhile and came up with nothing; is there some kind of place where I can check on the status of LC or do you just have to know somebody there?
15:12 jwagner      dever23b, LC hasn't been working all week. I just talked to someone there, and he said the systems staff have been testing and working on something
15:09 reiveune     bye
15:07 dever23b     Fabulous!  Lol no problem, thanks.
15:07 mtompset     When it comes to z39.50, I know as little as you. Sorry.
15:06 dever23b     mtompset: Thanks for the information.  Forgive me, I recently took over for our Koha administration and I'm still learning how all this works.  Is there anything you'd recommend I investigate to determine whether it's a problem on my server or externally?
15:01 mtompset     Greetings, kf.
15:01 mtompset     I haven't tried to figure out the problem yet.
15:00 dever23b     Thank you!  Hmm.
14:59 mtompset     dever23b: my librarian colleague told me to look up 0830822186 on LOC, and he said he got a result and then no results.
14:55 kf           hi paul_p :)
14:51 dever23b     Anyone else able to confirm query issues with Z39.50 searches from the Library of Congress (z3950.loc.gov:7090 or lx2.loc.gov:210)?
14:50 dever23b     Back
14:49 mtompset     Greetings, #koha.
14:47 dever23b     brb
14:45 huginn       dever23b: I've exhausted my database of quotes
14:45 dever23b     @Johnny will do
14:44 Johnny       Dever23b.. Let me know .. Gotta run..
14:43 dever23b     Elapsed: 0.032942
14:43 dever23b     [1] Permanent system error -- v2 addinfo 'search failed at opac rc=1'
14:43 dever23b     Diagnostic message(s) from database:
14:43 dever23b     records returned: 0
14:43 dever23b     Result Set Status: none
14:43 dever23b     Number of hits: 0
14:43 dever23b     Search was a bloomin' failure.
14:43 dever23b     Received SearchResponse.
14:43 dever23b     Sent searchRequest.
14:43 dever23b     Z> find (ti=great gatsby)
14:43 dever23b     Z> querytype ccl2rpn
14:43 dever23b     Elapsed: 1.236377
14:43 dever23b     Options: search present
14:43 dever23b     Version: 2007.2.0/1.2.1.1
14:43 dever23b     Name   : Voyager LMS - Z39.50 Server (YAZ Proxy)
14:43 dever23b     ID     : 34
14:43 dever23b     Connection accepted by v3 target.
14:43 dever23b     Sent initrequest.
14:43 dever23b     Connecting...OK.
14:43 dever23b     Z> open z3950.loc.gov:7090/Voyager
14:43 dever23b     I don't get any "errors" from Koha; it simply always returns 0 records.  So, I equipped my good friend SSH and tried doing some Z queries with yaz-client and that's when I developed the failures
14:42 dever23b     I have not made any changes in the past 9+ months and we haven't had any reported issues until now.  During intial investigation, I came across the news from 1/2013 regarding the new hostname and attempted using that to no avail.
14:41 dever23b     Same
14:41 Johnny       It has worked for most of the year.. Just within last 48-72 hours
14:40 kf           did it work for you in the past?
14:40 Johnny       Can anyone eles confirm LOC is having an issue with Z searches?
14:40 kf           i am not sure tho
14:40 jenkins_koha Starting build #1174 for job Koha_master (previous build: STILL UNSTABLE -- last SUCCESS #1164 9 days 0 hr ago)
14:39 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10094 normal, P5 - low, ---, koha-bugs, Pushed to Master , koha-list should have an --disabled option
14:39 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10146 normal, P5 - low, ---, tomascohen, Pushed to Master , koha-stop-zebra error handling
14:39 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10157 normal, P5 - low, ---, tomascohen, Pushed to Master , koha-email-enable error handling
14:39 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10159 normal, P5 - low, ---, tomascohen, Pushed to Master , koha-rebuild-zebra error handling
14:39 jenkins_koha * Tomas Cohen Arazi: Bug 10094 - koha-list should have a --disabled option switch
14:39 jenkins_koha * Tomas Cohen Arazi: Bug 10146 - koha-stop-zebra error handling
14:39 jenkins_koha * Tomas Cohen Arazi: Bug 10157 - koha-email-enable error handling
14:39 jenkins_koha * Tomas Cohen Arazi: Bug 10159 - koha-rebuild-zebra error handling
14:39 jenkins_koha Project Koha_3.12.x build #33: SUCCESS in 39 min: http://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_3.12.x/33/
14:39 dever23b     Oh really?  Wonderful!
14:39 Johnny       and/or z3950.loc.gov
14:39 dever23b     I've tried the "old" hostname (z3950.loc.gov:70990) and the "new" (lx2.loc.gov:210) ... same results
14:39 Johnny       lx2.loc.gov:210
14:38 kf           i think someone said it was down?
14:38 Johnny       Yeah, me too
14:38 dever23b     Hello -- is anyone experiencing issues with Z39.50 searches to Library of Congress?  I've tried manual queries and I always get "search failed at opac rc=1"
14:37 kf           and hey druthb :)
14:37 kf           so probably not - but in final release then :)
14:37 druthb       The pull req will happen Saturday morning, US time.
14:37 kf           i woudl guess they are not, butnot sure
14:37 druthb       It has not.
14:37 kf           tcohen: not sure if the pull request has happened yet
14:37 Johnny       Yo
14:35 tcohen       jcamins: did the ccsr .po files get included in the rc?
14:31 kf           jcamins++ :)
14:29 tcohen       jcamins++
14:23 jcamins      RC1 is announced, and I am running late.
14:23 * druthb     chuckles.
14:22 huginn       gmcharlt: Quote #233: "<oleonard> How about Now that she's three my daughter has terrible authority control" (added by gmcharlt at 05:06 PM, February 14, 2013)
14:22 gmcharlt     @quote random
14:21 kf           marcelr++
14:11 oleonard     Okay, thanks sophie_m
14:09 sophie_m     oleonard: I think it could be closed
14:09 * jcamins    heads into the city.
14:08 jcamins      Okay, the RC is not going to be done in the next five minutes.
14:08 jcamins      Oh. Heh. I don't read that.
14:08 maximep      that's where the interesting stuff is
14:08 maximep      raw output
14:08 jcamins      I only see two failures. The Acq failure and daily quotes.
14:07 jcamins      maximep: huh? Where's that from?
14:07 maximep      "Table 'koha.ratings' doesn't exist". Is there some migrations that wasn't applied on the jenkins server ?
14:07 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7776 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, NEW , Inconsistency between check in and check out display
14:07 oleonard     sophie_m: Is Bug 7776 still a problem? I don't understand the bug report.
14:06 jcamins      maximep: there's only one actual failure there.
14:06 maximep      oh man, it's failing all over the place :/
14:04 jcamins      Ugh. I'm not sure why jenkins is failing.
13:59 jenkins_koha Starting build #33 for job Koha_3.12.x (previous build: SUCCESS)
13:59 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=6329 normal, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, Pushed to Master , patron categories should show which fields are required
13:59 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10214 normal, P5 - low, ---, frederic, Pushed to Master , malformed syspref.po file
13:59 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10108 major, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, Pushed to Master , can't print more than one page of overdues
13:59 jenkins_koha * Owen Leonard: Bug 6329 - patron categories should show which fields are required
13:59 jenkins_koha * Frédéric Demians: Bug 10214 Add header to syspref po files
13:59 jenkins_koha * Owen Leonard: Bug 10108 - can't print more than one page of overdues
13:59 jenkins_koha Project Koha_master build #1173: STILL UNSTABLE in 1 hr 11 min: http://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_master/1173/
13:59 kf           druthb: i am helping him!
13:58 * magnuse    wanders off
13:55 magnuse      yay
13:55 * druthb     offers magnuse and kf cookies, so they won't bicker.
13:51 * magnuse    intends to leave his desk in 10 minutes and come back to it tonight. so there!
13:50 * kf         glares at magnuse and points at his desk
13:42 magnuse      nah, never heard of it...
13:42 kf           magnuse: don't get distracted... i think you have something to work on?
13:40 magnuse      oooh, shiny...
13:40 oleonard     We have a tendency to add shiny new things to Koha before they're really finished.
13:38 kf           only bit grumpy so many things crept in again :)
13:38 huginn       New commit(s) kohagit: Merge branch 'deb_scripts_312_rc1' into 3.14-master <http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=commitdiff;h=771e91fdcdc2fbf59324e9038e30fb3da0d92508> / Bug 10094 - koha-list should have a --disabled option switch <http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=commitdiff;h=de275ec128d3b26e953c35778e6a37e5b85273f5> / Bug 10146 - koha-stop-zebra error handling <http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=c
13:38 kf           it is
13:36 oleonard     Hi kf. I didn't look closely at that bug but I'm sure it's much like other translation bugs we've had.
13:29 kf           ah i was too slow
13:29 kf           hi Joh
13:25 JohnnyAce    hello
13:22 kf           jcamins++
13:07 kf           oleonard: about the translation bug I filed earlier - i realized later that _("") works too... but not working on a patch right now
13:06 kf           hi oleonard :)
12:48 jenkins_koha Starting build #1173 for job Koha_master (previous build: STILL UNSTABLE -- last SUCCESS #1164 8 days 23 hr ago)
12:48 druthb       :)  Hi, oleonard!
12:48 oleonard     Hi druthb
12:48 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=6329 normal, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, Pushed to Master , patron categories should show which fields are required
12:48 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10214 normal, P5 - low, ---, frederic, Pushed to Master , malformed syspref.po file
12:48 huginn       04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10108 major, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, Pushed to Master , can't print more than one page of overdues
12:48 jenkins_koha * Owen Leonard: Bug 6329 - patron categories should show which fields are required
12:48 jenkins_koha * Frédéric Demians: Bug 10214 Add header to syspref po files
12:48 jenkins_koha * Owen Leonard: Bug 10108 - can't print more than one page of overdues
12:48 jenkins_koha Project Koha_3.12.x build #32: SUCCESS in 39 min: http://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_3.12.x/32/
12:48 druthb       o/
12:16 oleonard     Hi #koha
12:16 huginn       New commit(s) kohagit: Merge branch 'bug_6329' into 3.14-master <http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=commitdiff;h=89972675e7ee46d82317c4c0ebf1e64d8964416c> / Bug 6329 - patron categories should show which fields are required <http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=commitdiff;h=85fd38e5969c083692fe0a5227c792c2ff07134d> / Merge branch 'bug_10214' into 3.14-master <http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=commitd
12:08 jenkins_koha Starting build #32 for job Koha_3.12.x (previous build: SUCCESS)
11:19 magnuse      yay
11:06 jcamins      Cool, my e-mail did something! Czech strings have been uploaded.
09:44 kf           trying
09:43 magnuse      kf: gotta wish harder
09:42 wahanui      i think oleonard is still here, if you just wish hard enough. or Koha's master UI designer
09:42 kf           oleonard?
09:42 * kf         wishes hard for oleonard to appear
09:36 magnuse      possibly - i don't quite remember the details of what we talked about...
09:33 kf           going to use the restful api?
09:33 kf           interesting :)
09:33 magnuse      the library buys a book, the central catalogue (Libris) is notified and the MARC record is "sent" to Koha via pubsubhubbub
09:33 kf           ah :)
09:32 magnuse      well, it's what the central catalogue wants to use, really
09:32 kf           oh
09:32 magnuse      it's a system Viktor wants to use to pull records into koha from a central catalogue
09:32 magnuse      kf: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PubSubHubbub
09:29 * kf         wonders what that ...hubbub is
09:29 kf           bye Viktor
09:28 tweetbot     [off] twitter: @pierrevdk: "Working on the french translation of #Kohails 3.12, not far from the end"
09:28 Viktor       Well: always glad to see you kf magnuse. I'll hop off to go for lunch and meetings.
09:27 Viktor       (but they have no hub yet to test on so I have been holding off on that)
09:27 Viktor       And a third of that is geared towards Pubsubhubbub.
09:26 Viktor       Some is to pay the people working in the project, some is to create documentation and so forth. But a sizable amount is for development.
09:25 Viktor       kj We do have a bit of funds for 2013-2014.
09:25 huginn       magnuse: The operation succeeded.
09:25 magnuse      @later tell jcamins: the nb-NO translation is "done" - everything except 1. help files and 2. marc21/unimarc specific stuff is translated. hope nb-NO can make it into the list of translated languages! :-)
09:25 kf           but you got money - sounds like something will happen :)
09:24 Viktor       We have funds from the national library to create patches needed for use in Sweden for both academic libraries and "folkbibliotek". But they themselves will hardly want to become vendors.
09:23 magnuse      yay!
09:22 Viktor       I'll suggest that :)
09:22 Viktor       :D
09:22 magnuse      mandatory freedom!
09:22 magnuse      nah, just force everyone to use it ;-)
09:22 Viktor       Or at least available for those who want it I should say.
09:21 magnuse      w00t!
09:21 Viktor       The thought is to have them check for stuff that academic libraries need so we can build a free national infrastructure.
09:21 magnuse      convince them to use Koha! :-)
09:21 Viktor       Thanks magnuse
09:21 kf           :)
09:21 magnuse      Viktor: good luck with that
09:20 Viktor       I'll make some offline noise. Have a meeting about the academic library's participation in the Koha-project.
09:19 kf           we got a few blockers...
09:18 kf           let's make some last minute sign-offs? ;)
09:18 kf           :)
09:18 huginn       magnuse: The current temperature in Bodo, Norway is 5.0°C (10:50 AM CEST on May 15, 2013). Conditions: Light Rain. Humidity: 87%. Dew Point: 3.0°C. Windchill: -2.0°C. Pressure: 29.56 in 1001 hPa (Steady).
09:18 magnuse      @wunder boo
09:18 magnuse      let's make some noise!
09:18 Viktor       Drifted off to write a progress report. And now lunch. kf
09:18 Viktor       A bit.
09:04 kf           hm quiet today
08:24 Viktor       kf Great! :)
08:02 kf           Viktor_away: it's just the file ending, rename it and you are good
07:59 Viktor       I'll ask on the translate list and see if anyone knows. It doesn't seem to cause any trouble, but some caution might be good :)
07:58 Viktor       Thanks for the help kf
07:58 Viktor       But opens fine in poedit.
07:57 Viktor       That too saves as .po.txt.
07:57 Viktor       Im trying the same download with armeninan now.
07:55 kf           hm yeah, it offers me to save as .txt too
07:54 kf           i think it's probably a browser thing then or something like that
07:54 Viktor       No - grabbed it from http://translate.koha-community.org/sv/312/edit.html
07:53 kf           did you use the zip file download on the review tab?
07:53 kf           hm
07:53 wahanui      weird is normal after a while :)
07:53 Viktor       Weird...
07:53 Viktor       Poedit on OS X seems fine with it. And when I download from Pootle it looks like .po on the platform but saves as .po.txt on OS X.
07:52 Viktor       kf thanks.
07:52 kf           it shoudl be just .po
07:52 kf           maybe it happened when youcleaned it up and saved
07:52 kf           no
07:51 Viktor       Cleaned up the sv-translation a bit and handed to the translators. But noticed file ending .po.txt. Is this correct?
07:50 Viktor       Hi! Hope all is well.
07:27 magnuse      :-)
07:27 kf           hi magnuse
07:23 gaetan_B     'morgen magnuse :)
07:22 magnuse      guten morgen kf and gaetan_B
07:21 kf           hi again cjh :)
07:20 cjh          evening kf :)
07:20 kf           good morning #koha
07:20 wahanui      Germs originated in Germany, before rapidly spreading throughout the rest of the world.
07:20 huginn       GERMS!!!!
07:18 magnuse      cjh: thanks :-)
07:17 cjh          magnuse: *fingers crossed*
07:14 wahanui      salut, gaetan_B
07:14 gaetan_B     hello
07:14 * magnuse    hopes to get some funding for a project to work on linked data next year
07:12 dcook        night cjh :)
07:12 dcook        So night all!
07:11 dcook        I still wonder a bit about URIs in linked data, but...I have to head off
07:11 dcook        I think the only way to download authorities at the moment is as RDF
07:11 dcook        LoC looks like it's offering up a lot of its data as RDF though
07:11 dcook        I looked a bit at SPARQL a couple years ago, but I still haven't done much with RDF
07:10 dcook        magnuse++
07:10 dcook        cjh: Cool beans!
07:06 cjh          evening :)
07:06 christophe_c hello #koha
07:03 cjh          dcook: have you seen http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Linked_Data_RFC ?
07:02 dcook        Hmm semantic HTML would be great...
06:55 dcook        My favourite part of getting groceries delivered is the fresh loaf of sourdough on my steps every Tuesday morning
06:55 dcook        hehe
06:55 cjh          I mean no!
06:55 cjh          mmmmhhhhmm
06:55 dcook        Unsliced sourdough? Sooo good
06:55 cjh          blasphemers!
06:54 dcook        Admittedly, I do love unsliced bread more...
06:54 dcook        Touché
06:54 * alex_a     doesn't like sliced bread ...
06:51 dcook        I love working on a project that I can be proud to promote ^_^
06:51 * dcook      might've just written a novel to someone explaining why Koha is the best thing since sliced bread...
06:46 reiveune     salut dcook
06:46 dcook        hey ya alex_a :)
06:46 cait         hi all :) and brb
06:46 alex_a       hello !
06:46 dcook        allo trea :)
06:46 dcook        hey ya reiveune :)
06:45 wahanui      niihau, reiveune
06:45 reiveune     hello
05:09 dcook        Thanks, mtj :)
05:09 dcook        Hmm, just glanced at pandoc, sounds promising
05:09 mtj          so, you could have some success with both of those tools
05:08 mtj          … and also outputs to asciidoc :)
05:06 mtj          and pandoc reads html
05:05 mtj          dcook, fwiw, pandoc and asciidoc both output pdf
04:48 dcook        Must not have much JS..
04:48 dcook        Hmm, tcpdf didn't do a terrible job on one page...
04:47 mtj          more info… -> http://wiki.docbook.org/DocBookTools
04:46 mtj          yep, good to know, tho :)
04:45 dcook        Convenient
04:44 mtj          ah, no - its just html->pdf
04:44 * dcook      shrugs
04:43 mtj          although, wkhtmltopdf might do a good job, too...
04:42 dcook        Cool beans :)
04:41 mtj          dcook, there are better docbook specific tools to gen pdf from the manual.xml file
04:38 wizzyrea     I just went there :)
04:38 wizzyrea     http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/arts/visualarts/article3761376.ece neat, wellington museum of city and sea is on there
04:33 dcook        Well, I might try to talk the boss into trying it out, so I'll let you know how it goes down the line ;)
04:30 wizzyrea     dk, don't have a moment to look right this second. :)
04:30 wizzyrea     maybe
04:29 dcook        wizzyrea: Maybe try https://github.com/antialize/wkhtmltopdf for PDFing the Koha manual?
04:25 wizzyrea     morning cait
04:25 cait         hi cjh and dcook
04:25 dcook        hey ya cait
04:25 cjh          afternoon/morning cait
04:23 dcook        Using pdfutil at the moment to extract text from pdfs, which sometimes works. I think the times it doesn't might relate to encryption, but haven't really looked into it.
04:22 dcook        Depending on the quality needed, I could try tossing out the Javascript, but that's easier said than done as well.
04:22 cjh          html with js is harder.
04:21 cjh          oh I read it as the other way, thought you were going pdf to html
04:21 dcook        And I think that's possibly what's causing the issues
04:21 dcook        The pages I'm looking at are loaded down with a fair bit of JS and CSS
04:20 dcook        Hmm, the Koha manual could be quite easy...
04:20 dcook        cjh: The imagemagick folk suggest not using imagemagick for html -> pdf conversion :/
04:19 wizzyrea     but great tip, ibeardslee
04:19 * wizzyrea   was thinking of the Koha manual, actually
04:19 dcook        Mmm, I gotcha. No worries.
04:19 ibeardslee   dcook: probably more aimed at wizzyrea .. didn't follow through with reading the scrollback before leaping in. EEC are a catalyst client.
04:17 dcook        cjh: I'll look into that! Thanks!
04:17 dcook        ibreadsless: EEC?
04:16 * ibeardslee comes in late to the conversation
04:16 ibeardslee   could be worth talking to the EEC team here, I think they do a bunch of stuff like that.
04:16 wizzyrea     that was like, ages and ages ago
04:16 wizzyrea     neat - that's probably why, the first time I tried to use it, i wanted to shoot myself in the face because it wouldn't install
04:15 cjh          yeah, imagemagick is overpowered (although you probably also need ghostscript to handle pdf)
04:15 wizzyrea     does it work the other way too?
04:14 wizzyrea     that's pretty awesome
04:14 cjh          it seems to spit out 1 html page per pdf page
04:14 wizzyrea     dah really?
04:14 cjh          (although it will often create a foo-0.html)
04:14 cjh          if you install imagemagick you can just 'convert foo.pdf foo.html' and it will 'just work'
04:11 dcook        I think the idea is that it uses Webkit to render the webpage, and then pdfs it using the same method that modern browsers use
04:11 dcook        I think wkhtmltopdf might be a better idea
04:09 dcook        Totes
04:09 trea         sounds ugly
04:09 trea         ah
04:09 dcook        Asking me to set the action attribute or some such...
04:09 dcook        It's not Koha related, but I'm trying to turn webpages into PDFs and when I'm testing...I take out a single image element and then it spits out an error O_o
04:08 trea         what's up with tcpdf dcook?
04:06 dcook        tcpdf...you make me want to...grrr
03:18 mtompset     Have a great day, everyone.
03:18 mtompset     interesting link... I should get to bed.
03:17 rangi        and the like
03:17 rangi        we could have fun with that for gbsd
03:17 wizzyrea     ooOOOOOooo
03:15 rangi        http://questhub.io/about
02:54 wizzyrea     and willfully so, it's not even laziness.
02:50 dcook        But there are so many organizations who seem to be running outdated MS programs
02:49 dcook        Not to say that there aren't good Windows sysadmins
02:49 dcook        At least statistically
02:49 dcook        And as for real world implementations, I imagine people running Linux are more likely than their Windows counterparts to be on the ball
02:49 dcook        eythian: the more I think about it, the more I think you're probably right
02:49 eythian      I think bugs in windows and linux are publicised about the same.
02:48 dcook        But yeah, like you were saying liz, the same thing could happen with Windows
02:48 dcook        Overall, I believe that having more eyes on the code is definitely a good thing.
02:48 dcook        Intriguing..
02:45 cjh          linus' law :)
02:45 dcook        Right
02:45 dcook        So that they might be eliminated sooner
02:45 wizzyrea     the code for linux is open, anyone can look at it.
02:45 dcook        Although I imagine the flaws in Linux are probably publicized more
02:44 dcook        Hmm, I suppose that's true
02:44 wizzyrea     that's no different for windows
02:44 dcook        Well, maybe I'm not sure, but I imagine
02:43 dcook        If you had staff that were running an  unpatched system, and you had a student that kept on top of things...I'm sure they could learn a few exploits
02:43 wizzyrea     as privilege separation is somewhat better enforced.
02:43 dcook        So long as the staff are capable, I would think
02:43 wizzyrea     and probably a bit more secure.
02:42 cjh          I am sure it comes up, but the stuff running it are very competent. Running Linux is no less secure than windows ;)
02:42 dcook        As it was, being a slightly above average Windows user, I was able to find things that should've  been hidden..
02:42 wizzyrea     :/
02:42 wizzyrea     i would think that if they were running windows they'd have more problem with that :
02:42 dcook        In retrospect, if I had been more capable when I was in middle school/high school, I wonder if I would've gotten up to no good
02:42 dcook        Sweet. Do they ever run into issues with students trying to hack the system?
02:41 cjh          our school IT services primarily run windows, but my faculty do their own IT and run linux :)
02:41 dcook        But probably a very low percentage
02:41 dcook        Well, that's probably not true
02:40 dcook        I think only 1% of my past faculties had heard of linux/unix :p
02:39 cjh          my faculty at university is 99% linux/unix :)
02:39 dcook        I suppose that near 7 years of full-time (humanities and social science) uni straight was a bit of a barrier..
02:38 dcook        I don't know why I didn't start using Linux years ago
02:38 dcook        I like it!
02:38 dcook        hehe
02:38 cjh          I have a .vim git repo and symlink my ~/.vimrc to ~/.vim/vimrc, and then have a collection of plugins and crazyness inside there :)
02:37 dcook        But once I sort out that audio issue...it's onto installing Koha with the deb packages!
02:37 dcook        Trying to edit things atm in Debian is...well...very different
02:36 dcook        It is the default that came with the suse vim, so I imagine there might be some sort of conflicts if I try using this, but it's worth a shot
02:36 dcook        (You too jcamins)
02:36 dcook        Thanks cjh :)
02:35 dcook        Yes, that's 100% it
02:34 dcook        I think it is the etc/vimrc
02:34 dcook        I think...
02:34 dcook        And I see now...
02:34 dcook        Yeah, it does
02:33 cjh          afaik git does something similar, it uses all your config files but the 'closer' one takes priority.
02:33 cjh          > List all sourced script names, in the order they were                               first sourced.
02:33 cjh          :help scriptnames
02:32 dcook        Where it tries to find one in your home directory, then tries the git repo, then tries the system files?
02:32 dcook        Wouldn't it do something like git?
02:32 dcook        Surely not...that's quite a few!
02:32 cjh          all of them are being read
02:32 cjh          define using?
02:31 dcook        I'd like to know which one I'm actually using though :/
02:31 dcook        Hmm, that might be enough...
02:27 cjh          goodluck :)
02:27 cjh          (although your new system may have additional rules in the rc files)
02:27 cjh          that will export all the settings across your rc files, so should be enough to save that and migrate to your new system
02:26 dcook        cjh: That looks like the ticket
02:26 dcook        I'll ask you more about "all any" next time ;)
02:26 trea         night jcamins. and thanks again.
02:26 dcook        night, jcamins.
02:26 eythian      later jcamins
02:25 cjh          night
02:25 * jcamins    calls it a night.
02:25 jcamins      cjh: ooh, nifty! I didn't know that one!
02:25 cjh          you could also use :mkvimrc to write your current settings to a file
02:25 dcook        /etc/vimrc and lots of /usr/share/ scripts
02:24 jcamins      http://stackoverflow.com/questions/10921441/where-is-my-vimrc-file
02:24 jcamins      dcook: :scriptnames
02:23 dcook        It's the one that comes with the suse packaged vim
02:22 dcook        That might be it..
02:22 dcook        Hmm, there's one in usr/share
02:22 eythian      but maybe your system-wide config does that for you.
02:22 eythian      though that might have to be referenced from .vimrc
02:22 eythian      also .vim/
02:21 wizzyrea     no might.
02:21 dcook        Tried that too wizzyrea :/
02:21 wizzyrea     well it *will* be hidden
02:21 wizzyrea     it'll be a .dotfile, might be hidden try ls -lah ?
02:21 cjh          the default is usually /etc/vim/vimrc but if you are making changes as your user it should be ~/.vimrc
02:21 dcook        I don't see one there :S
02:20 wizzyrea     the one in your homedir?
02:20 jcamins      dcook: ~/.vimrc
02:20 dcook        I'm seeing lots and none to obviously be mine
02:20 dcook        I'm not sure where it lives :/
02:20 cjh          eythian: shift-k for me looks for perldoc, but it isnt smart enough to try and find it so it is really just running 'perldoc <word-under-cursor>' :(
02:20 cjh          dcook: copy ~/.vimrc over?
02:19 eythian      ...that
02:19 eythian      just rsy
02:19 jcamins      Done.
02:19 jcamins      dcook: scp workserver:.vimrc ~/.vimrc
02:19 dcook        I really liike my vim config at work but not (overly) looking forward to trying to get vim on the Debian box to be similar..
02:18 dcook        Makes sense
02:18 eythian      Probably part of the perl plugin I have installed that I've never really studied.
02:18 eythian      If I press shift-K it gives me the perldoc for the word under the cursor.
02:17 cjh          heh, was it something awesome?
02:17 dcook        new feature?
02:17 eythian      I just made a typo in vim and discovered a new feature. I like when that happens.
02:17 dcook        Plus, as has been noted, the time and money just aren't there :/
02:17 dcook        I think jcamins has sufficiently warned me off even attempting that ;)
02:16 cjh          eythian: you need to work on your evil laugh...
02:16 jcamins      Yeah! Do it!
02:16 eythian      heh
02:16 dcook        lol
02:16 * wizzyrea   wishes that eythian had busted out the evil laugh
02:15 eythian      dcook: you should also rewrite search.pm while you're there.
02:15 * dcook      really likes knowing how things work
02:15 dcook        Hope I helped and didn't overwhelm. The more I delve into z39.50 and Zebra, the more I'm intrigued.
02:14 dcook        hehe
02:14 trea         yeah, i'm going to stop while i'm ahead
02:14 trea         dcook++
02:14 trea         jcamins++
02:14 trea         okay, thanks for the elucidation.
02:14 jcamins      And I recommend you not ask about the repeated years when they were using 2-digit numbers. The knowledge that they differentiated the years by starting at a higher serial number is enough to give anyone a headache.
02:13 trea         sorry, right. 010
02:12 jcamins        010
02:12 trea         and finally, the control number field is the 001?
02:11 jcamins      http://www.loc.gov/marc/lccn_structure.html#prefix
02:11 jcamins      Take my word, there are a lot.
02:11 jcamins      I'm not keying all these options in.
02:10 jcamins      Wait, wrong table.
02:10 jcamins      Ah. n/nb/nr/no/sh/sj/sp
02:10 jcamins      Aaaand... something several letters long.
02:09 jcamins      No, 'n's and sometimes... 's's?
02:09 wizzyrea     ^.^
02:09 dcook        hehe
02:09 trea         <- committed
02:09 dcook        Really? Xs and such?
02:09 * wizzyrea   looks towards trea - i'm dang good at it too.
02:08 jcamins      dcook: and sometimes letters.
02:08 wahanui      wizzyrea is a fan of selecting hunks for committing.
02:08 dcook        wizzyrea!
02:08 * dcook      used to catalogue a lot of old(ish) books. Yes, that (ish) qualification is for you jcamins :p
02:08 dcook        The really old ones might only be 7 digits...in which case you need to add a 0...I think at the start
02:08 dcook        Although usually they're just 8 digit numbers which may or may not be separated by a space or hyphen
02:08 dcook        Some books have them published on the back of the title page
02:07 dcook        The LCCN is an internal number that LoC uses, and which others can use to find books in the LoC catalogue
02:07 wizzyrea     patch for the manual!
02:07 dcook        The call number is for storing/retrieving physical items on shelves
02:06 trea         okay, that at least helps to clarify some of these fields
02:05 dcook        Which is not the same as the LC call number
02:05 dcook        LCCN = Library of Congress Control Number
02:05 dcook        Ack
02:05 dcook        trea: nope
02:05 dcook        (Which get less scary the more you look at them...which in itself is a different type of fear)
02:05 trea         LCCN = Library of Congress Control Number ?
02:05 dcook        (Although for Koha, you'll need to look at the Zebra config docs...)
02:04 dcook        You can then use a site like (http://www.loc.gov/z3950/agency/bib1.html) to figure out which MARC tags are included in that
02:04 jcamins      Library of Congress Control Number.
02:04 dcook        Generally speaking, if you look at the sub Z39.50search in Breeding.pm, you will see the mapping between the z39.50 search form and the bib-1 attributes
02:04 trea         okay, jcamins. you mentioned LCCN. There is a field called "LC call number" is this the same as LCCN?
02:03 jcamins      *it
02:03 jcamins      That's where you'd _really_ need iy.
02:03 dcook        Oooo
02:03 jcamins      Oh! Score numbers.
02:03 trea         okay, that helps
02:03 jcamins        035.
02:03 jcamins      So, ISBN, ISSN, CODEN, LCCN, etc.
02:02 trea         what does "ID" mean in this instance.
02:02 jcamins      trea: in principle that includes most standard IDs.
02:01 jcamins      No, no, don't thank me.
02:01 jcamins      Well... unless you have a remote that includes less in 1016 than in other fields.
02:01 trea         now, how about the "standard id" field?
02:00 dcook        :)
02:00 trea         that's what i was looking for
02:00 dcook        imho ;)
01:59 dcook        So there's the value
01:59 dcook        Raw (any) gets you more records with less precision. But...you can count on it getting you something.
01:59 dcook        nix relevant
01:59 dcook        Wait, it's precision v. recall
01:59 dcook        While less precise than other fields, it has the potential to capture more relevant records
01:58 dcook        Because chances are it's always going to be supported
01:58 dcook        trea: In my opinion, using raw (any) is a really good idea
01:57 dcook        For the big z3950 targets, they publish the lists of the Bib-1 attributes they support (although these aren't always accurate/comprehensive)
01:57 trea         and shockingly, since it doesn't seem to be covered in the manual, i was just trying to find an answer
01:57 jcamins      The FIVE MILLION messages about the Z39.50 server at LC might actually have been useful.
01:57 eythian      there was someone asking about that on the list wasn't there?
01:57 trea         honestly, no. a librarian asked why she should use these fields
01:56 dcook        trea: According to LoC, they certainly have it set up: http://www.loc.gov/z3950/lcserver.html
01:56 jcamins      ... huh.
01:56 * wizzyrea   tried one earlier and it didn't work and wondered why
01:56 wizzyrea     AHA
01:56 jcamins      Head's up: they might be down, if you're trying to troubleshoot searches failing.
01:55 trea         okay, so in the case of LOC for instance
01:55 dcook        Searching remote Z39.50 targets is dependent on how they've indexed their data
01:55 dcook        But as bag was saying, this only relates to searching Koha
01:55 dcook        What he said ;)
01:55 dcook        trea: Should be all good
01:55 jcamins      trea: any, yes, all, no.
01:54 trea         at the expense of being obtuse...i can or cannot use this field if i have dom indexing enabled.
01:54 jcamins      The ccl prefixes are actually *another* set of orthogonal mappings.
01:54 dcook        Yeah, I saw the "all" directive here: http://www.indexdata.com/zebra/doc/grs-conf.html
01:54 dcook        hehe
01:54 jcamins      "I can do this," you say. "all any is the key. I can just use that index..." then it goes down-hill.
01:53 jcamins      You start off feeling pretty good.
01:53 dcook        Ahh, yeah, there were some frustrated Bib-1 moments last week I believe
01:53 * jcamins    has been there ^^
01:52 dcook        Wait, that doesn't make sense
01:52 jcamins      dcook: you may have said that. I just skimmed through the backlog, and your explanation of "all any" made it sound like "all any" was the command, which could lead to you getting confused and ultimately entering a downard spiral of depression and horror as you contemplate the Bib-1 standard.
01:52 dcook        jcamins: So that "any", it that the ccl "any"?
01:52 dcook        I believe
01:52 dcook        trea: "Any" is still defined in the DOM XSL -> biblio-zebra-indexdefs.xsl
01:52 trea         welcome to my world
01:51 * cjh        suddenly feels like he is the only human surrounded by martians
01:51 jcamins      Actually, GRS-1 just isn't case-sensitive.
01:51 dcook        Well "Any" is Bib-1, I guess "any" is still GRS-1
01:51 dcook        "Any" is Bib-1, but All is GRS-1
01:51 trea         so, in the case of a dom indexed site, it shouldn't be used.
01:51 dcook        Or thought I was saying, lol
01:51 dcook        Yeah, that's what I was saying
01:51 jcamins      Right.
01:50 trea         but again, this is only applicable if you use grs1.
01:50 jcamins      It's not part of the Bib-1 spec at all.
01:49 jcamins      It is actually orthogonal to AACR2/RDA access points.
01:49 jcamins      The "all" command in GRS-1 includes all previously indexed data in the specified index.
01:49 dcook        What did I miss?
01:49 dcook        I was wondering if you were lurking for that one ;)
01:48 trea         heh
01:48 dcook        Darn!
01:48 jcamins      dcook: you were close, but not quite there with all any. :)
01:47 dcook        Which was quite straightforward
01:47 dcook        Admittedly, I responded to trea's question, but that's because I've been doing a lot with z39.50 lately and I did say I was only around depending on the question :p
01:46 mtompset     That would be an example of an unrealistic expectation, rangi.
01:46 dcook        rangi: true as
01:46 trea         D:
01:46 eythian      Ooh, this is awkward
01:46 eythian      trea: you didn't get your card?
01:45 rangi        i do think a lot of users think we get paid to be here or something
01:45 trea         :P
01:45 * trea       is still waiting for his private club card.
01:45 mtompset     well, not take things personally.
01:45 rangi        realistic expectations of what a bunch of volunteers who may or may not actually be at the computers can offer you
01:45 rangi        not so much a thick skin
01:44 mtompset     Yes, you have to have a thick skin sometimes. ;)
01:44 rangi        i guess we are more used to irc is the problem
01:44 trea         i never took it personally
01:44 trea         i've asked plenty of questions in #koha, and been met with only crickets.
01:43 mtompset     and the other two times, well, others came along asked a question, and it looked like his was ignored.
01:43 wahanui      OK, eythian.
01:43 eythian      wahanui: mean is <reply>http://media.tumblr.com/d81c251e7bdc71ef9304f707ca669378/tumblr_mmo7n6iHxW1r0tcyxo2_250.gif
01:43 mtompset     druthb answered part of his mibbit issues.
01:43 mtompset     Well, he did ask 3 times over 3-4 hours.
01:36 dcook        Nor do I feel obligated to pry out a question from someone who asks a vague question and then disappears before the ragequit
01:35 rangi        that
01:35 rangi        or actually i dont understand the question
01:35 dcook        I don't even really understand the question
01:35 rangi        i still dont know the answer
01:35 dcook        Tcpdf errors and all..
01:35 dcook        In hindsight, I did see the question, but was a bit too busy at that moment to engage
01:34 rangi        that may be our first ragequit
01:34 cjh          either way, getting angry isn't going to solve the problem.
01:34 dcook        rangi: Indeed
01:33 talljoy      between when california drops off and NZ kicks in
01:33 rangi        entitlement much?
01:33 cjh          heh
01:33 talljoy      i think he asked at the witching hour between 'koha shifts'  :-)
01:33 rangi        yeah
01:33 dcook        <gml> hi, anyone could help me with a zebra and authorities issue plz?
01:33 rangi        yeah
01:33 cjh          I only saw his most recent question, that makes more sense.
01:33 dcook        Huh, I think that was before I got there
01:33 rangi        ahh, didnt even see that
01:32 eythian      <gml> After testing authorities query (auth_finder.pl), there are some entries which cannot be found in web GUI. how can I correct this?
01:32 cjh             42
01:32 rangi        ah yeah he didnt actually ask a question
01:32 wahanui      the question is "What is the meaning of life, the universe and everything?"
01:32 cjh          or the question.
01:32 rangi        oh
01:31 eythian      Probably because no one knew the answer.
01:31 eythian      no one was answering his question I think.
01:31 rangi        wtf was that about?
01:31 dcook        O_o
01:30 gml          since when you people became so arrogant? is this now a private club?
01:30 mtompset     Wow is right. Is it doctored?
01:26 eythian      it is a bit
01:26 dcook        eythian: That's really quite amazing
01:23 talljoy      how's life in houston?
01:23 druthb       hi, talljoy! :D
01:22 talljoy      hi druthb!!!
01:22 dcook        eythian: Whoa...
01:22 druthb       hi, mtompset! :)
01:21 dcook        hey ya mtompset
01:21 talljoy      hi mtompset
01:20 tcohen       hi mtompset
01:20 mtompset     Greetings, dcook druthb talljoy bag tcohen trea eythian and whoever else I missed. :)
01:19 eythian      http://youtu.be/0EyfEDKWscg <-- wow
01:17 * druthb     waves to dcook
01:17 * dcook      waves to druthb
01:16 dcook        My debugging messages were causing TCPDF to fail...durr
01:16 dcook        obvious*
01:16 dcook        So obviouis
01:16 dcook        AHHH
01:15 * dcook      listens to more space music and tries to figure out why tcpdf's examples only work if you clear the output buffer first...
01:14 dcook        Hmm. Cool.
01:13 dcook        Reading LoC's bib-1 spec again...the grs-1 method isn't that bizarre. The idea is that "Any" should be important fields, whereas "Anywhere" should be absolutely every element in a record
01:12 dcook        But, again, with remote targets...it really depends on how they index things.
01:11 dcook        So every element
01:11 dcook        Whereas with Dom indexing, "any" literally includes every text node from the record
01:11 dcook        Rather, just every indexed element
01:11 dcook        So for grs-1, "any" doesn't include every element from the record
01:11 dcook        Well, all the other word indexes
01:11 dcook        In Koha, "all any" seems to basically be a word (rather than phrase) index that includes all the other indexes
01:10 dcook        explains*
01:10 dcook        bag: The following link exlains "all any" in records.abs http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Understanding_Zebra_indexing
01:02 talljoy      ha!
01:02 bag          yeah I saw it talljoy and liked it :)  and shared it with Sonja
01:02 bag          yeah I like my lame def dcook :)
01:02 talljoy      he was awesome.  check out the picture on facebook
01:01 bag          how was Pythagoras talljoy
01:01 dcook        But whether access points is a generic term or is a aacr2/rda term isn't entirely clear..
01:01 dcook        According to this bib-1 spec, it seems possible that only access points would be indexed in Any
01:01 talljoy      thanks bag.
01:01 tcohen       any spanish speaker around?
01:01 bag          welcome back talljoy
01:00 bag          yeah I wrote that for trea _lunching's benefit :P
01:00 dcook        But it's not 100% certain what that is
01:00 dcook        Yup
01:00 bag          so ANY basically is anything that that Z3950 site is indexing into the ANY index - will return in the raw (any) field
00:59 dcook        substitute that attribute.
00:59 dcook        selected if the target were to
00:59 dcook        that the record would be
00:59 dcook        appropriate - see note 1) such
00:59 dcook        target supports (and considers
00:59 dcook        exists a Use attribute that the
00:59 dcook        The record is selected if there
00:58 dcook        http://www.loc.gov/z3950/agency/bib1.html provides more detail
00:58 bag          anything that is indexed in any we appear here
00:58 dcook        Yeah, that site is pretty good.
00:58 bag          alright so basically that's our broad broad keyword search
00:58 bag          http://www.loc.gov/z3950/agency/defns/bib1.html
00:58 bag          damn same here :P
00:57 dcook        :p
00:57 dcook        "all any"
00:57 dcook        I do have that handy
00:57 bag          do you have that handy
00:57 * dcook      has turned z3950.search inside and out
00:57 bag          ok what's the 1016 attribute in record.abs?
00:57 dcook        Yeah, raw (any) is totally 1016
00:57 dcook        Ah
00:57 dcook        ?
00:57 bag          my 6 key is sticky for some reason
00:56 bag          not 101 1016
00:56 dcook        As for remote z3950 targets...yeah...it's always going to depend on how they index
00:56 bag          raw (any) sounds like it should be search 101 attribute number
00:56 dcook        Mmm, I thought the question was about searching Koha
00:55 bag          http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=blob;f=cataloguing/z3950_search.pl;h=a80120990e95f5470f56a2016012e21e283171c4;hb=HEAD
00:55 bag          the words on this page….   z3950_search.pl
00:55 bag          yeah but remember these are search terms in the z3950 to search other sites - not your own koha
00:42 dcook        trea: Does that clarify things at all? lol. I can try to explain further if it doesn't
00:42 dcook        Any yeah, in ccl.properties (around lines 60-61), you'll see that "Any" and "kw" are linked with 1=1016 (the bib-1 attribute)
00:41 dcook        I haven't done much with DOM indexing, but it looks like every text node goes into the Any index
00:40 dcook        biblio-zebra-indexdefs.xsl references the Any index
00:39 dcook        biblio-koha-indexdefs.xml looks like records.abs equivalent
00:35 dcook        Just on the phone :)
00:35 dcook        I'll be back with you in a sec
00:35 dcook        Not sure
00:31 trea         so for dom it doesn't apply
00:31 dcook        Although only for GRS-1 indexing, I think
00:31 * dcook      takes a quick peek
00:31 dcook        In terms of the marc fields included in this Any index...records.abs might say...
00:30 dcook        So 1016 is the Bib-1 attribute (found in bib1.attr), which is linked up with the label "Any" in ccl.properties, I believe
00:30 trea         where's deep thought when i need him
00:30 dcook        Fair enough. I'm trying to think of how to rephrase it
00:29 * trea       doesn't understand the answer.
00:29 dcook        1=1016
00:29 trea         raw (any) - what does this refer to in the search window?
00:29 dcook        trea: Possibly. Depends on the question :p
00:28 trea         anyone around to answer questions about z39.50 search fields?
00:12 gml          hi, anyone could help me with a zebra and authorities issue plz?
00:00 dcook        I might not be that welcome in that case :p
00:00 dcook        Hmm. Knew it was a big party, but didn't know it was particularly in regards to Québecois nationalism...